https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indie_rock#Landfill_indie
It's currently the most recent historical period of indie-rock to have its own sub-section on the Wikipedia page
― jmm, Wednesday, 17 May 2023 23:03 (one year ago) link
only people who spend lots of time on ILM understand, IMO
i think it's fairly well know in the UK way beyond ILM people.
― stirmonster, Wednesday, 17 May 2023 23:06 (one year ago) link
Someonè I used to know used to call the bands she was going to see Indie schmindie which I assume covers the same type. Continual 2nd on the bill NEVER destined to rise above the morass because non descript. Lacking the vital spark of originality that would lift them to the next level. Playing out of habit. Possibly a good thing to drink to.
But then I'm reminded that Galway used to only let cover bands play in a lot of pubs or that is a lot of pubs in Galway would only let cover bands play.because originality distracted from drinking.
Would hope that one played in a band trying to find something like how to write a good song and express oneself not just to create audio wallpaper and continually rewrite to formula etc.
― Stevo, Wednesday, 17 May 2023 23:12 (one year ago) link
The old joke used to go:
"There are only two styles of music I don't like, and they are Country AND Western"
― Do I look like I know what a jpeg is? (dog latin), Thursday, 18 May 2023 00:28 (one year ago) link
And yeah, maybe it's different in the US but over here I often hear people say Country is the worst music ever
― Do I look like I know what a jpeg is? (dog latin), Thursday, 18 May 2023 00:29 (one year ago) link
Just had a horrible thought, what if Basement Jaxx are the progenitors of electro swing
― Random Restaurateur (Jordan), Thursday, 18 May 2023 00:32 (one year ago) link
Not such a horrible thought
― Do I look like I know what a jpeg is? (dog latin), Thursday, 18 May 2023 00:52 (one year ago) link
Always enjoy some good landfill chat, but I don't see how it's a legit option when it's not a thing the artist was setting out to make.
― maf you one two (maffew12), Thursday, 18 May 2023 00:53 (one year ago) link
What were these bands setting out to make I wonder
― Do I look like I know what a jpeg is? (dog latin), Thursday, 18 May 2023 01:52 (one year ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7l_5nW0SUNw
― a man often referred to in the news media as the Duke of Saxony (tipsy mothra), Thursday, 18 May 2023 02:02 (one year ago) link
a mix between The Stone Roses and Primal Scream with the swagger of Oasis
― john cooper mellencamp (Matt #2), Thursday, 18 May 2023 03:25 (one year ago) link
kinda think psy-trance isn't so bad maybe but maybe i've not heard enough.
― omar little
I can totally understand why it’s hated - it’s too fast, the tracks are all 7+ minutes, it has no swing at all, it’s maximalist to the point of inducing headaches, and the (over)use of “trippy” effects isn’t helping either.
Plus, the fanbase is a combination of drugged up crusty cyberhippies and Russian software developers.
I’m probably one of the biggest psytrance fans in ILM but I can’t really listen to more than an hour of this stuff before it does my head in.
― Siegbran, Thursday, 18 May 2023 07:52 (one year ago) link
Always wondered if psytrance and Goa trance (which I vaguely remember reading about in the '90s but can't recall hearing much) were the same thing - according to Wikipedia the former evolved out of the latter.
― Gavin, Leeds, Thursday, 18 May 2023 08:14 (one year ago) link
Yeah, goa as the specific 93-96 sound, psytrance as the umbrella genre.
― Siegbran, Thursday, 18 May 2023 08:22 (one year ago) link
I would bet good money that it is FAR more common for people to say that in the US, as they are much more likely to be exposed to it without wanting to and plus there's all the socio-political culture war baggage.
― Daniel_Rf, Thursday, 18 May 2023 08:42 (one year ago) link
otm, it's a bit like calling one of the options "shitty funk" or something. Fans of electro-swing or psytrane wouldn't be offended if you refered to the genres by their name.
― Daniel_Rf, Thursday, 18 May 2023 08:45 (one year ago) link
Psytrance I mean. Psytrane also wouldn't offend tho.
― Daniel_Rf, Thursday, 18 May 2023 08:46 (one year ago) link
For people who don't like Opera I would point you to Kagel's Staatstheater (1970). It's written up as an anti-opera. It's been along time since I listened to it but iirc it goes out of its way to be different.
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 18 May 2023 08:54 (one year ago) link
Is nu-metal like Linkin Park?
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 18 May 2023 08:55 (one year ago) link
(xp) Does it have operatic singing though?
― Maggot Bairn (Tom D.), Thursday, 18 May 2023 09:11 (one year ago) link
xp yes altho they are probably the lightest shade of it
― nashwan, Thursday, 18 May 2023 09:24 (one year ago) link
For truly execrable music choices you really should check out Country & Irish or whatever you want to call the material made over here to the wrong blueprint. Maudlin cliched shite apparently from the heart that appeals to OAPs etc. There at least used to be what appeared to be a large scene creating it.
― Stevo, Thursday, 18 May 2023 09:25 (one year ago) link
I feel like 'landfill indie' is a distinct genre though, even if its practitioners might not use that term themselves, it means something more specific than just 'indie that isn't very good'
― he thinks it's chinese money (soref), Thursday, 18 May 2023 09:26 (one year ago) link
this did actually happen. when i was in high school in the late 00s i knew people who loved the wombats & the kooks etc. but nothing hippersure but presumably they weren't saying they loved it because of how insipid and disposable it sounded
― nashwan, Thursday, 18 May 2023 09:27 (one year ago) link
I can see why people would dislike Gabba / Jump Up D&B / Happy Hardcore / Tech House & Psytrance without experiencing them in the correct (huge rig / party treats) environment. The peril of niche genres with low digital sales but decent money for club sets is that end up with producers making landfill music to attract DJ bookings. So you find (in D&B as an example) when someone comes up with a truly new sound or take on things and then everyone piles on and rinses that idea (often terribly) into the ground for 12 months.I remember last time I went digging for D&B there were maybe 800 individual tracks released digitally that month, and maybe 50 stood out, and 10 ended up in my box. A good 500 were basically the same Splice samples and serum bass presets, a creative desert.But at least the decent tracks sounded truly original and brought fresh noises to my ears. Landfill indie is 10000x worse as not only has it all been done before, and better - there luddite guitars only aspect of it all kills the hope of any new sounds or ideas.Obvs Electro Swing can also fuck off, mainly for the people not necessarily the music Tldr; disposable club music gets a bye because at least people experiment with sound
― Agnes, Agatha, Germaine and Jack (Willl), Thursday, 18 May 2023 09:29 (one year ago) link
― Maggot Bairn (Tom D.), Thursday, 18 May 2023 bookmarkflaglink
Ha! Kind of...I will re-listen.
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 18 May 2023 09:30 (one year ago) link
shrieked Maoist invective over a single horn drone
― imago, Thursday, 18 May 2023 09:32 (one year ago) link
Artists getting labelled as being X or y when they didn't set out to make X or y happens (far) more often than not. Artists don't tend to invent genre classifications.
― Maggot Bairn (Tom D.), Thursday, 18 May 2023 09:35 (one year ago) link
There was a british music rag called Stool at one point. Seems like a really shit name. It was so called i think because it was acoustic singer songwriters playing seated. I do hope there was some humour in the naming though cos would be bad if they were unaware. Not sure how long it was used.BUt naming a scene is frequently done from outside and once it happens people get the feeling that the scene has been somehow encapsulated. Can help people find new ways of expression and new influences to avoid being a generic scene name representative I guess.
― Stevo, Thursday, 18 May 2023 09:43 (one year ago) link
sorry that was supposed to read there was a scene called Stool invented by the British music press at one point. I skipped a couple of words.
― Stevo, Thursday, 18 May 2023 09:47 (one year ago) link
― imago, Thursday, 18 May 2023 bookmarkflaglink
That's me shouting at your bad posts.
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 18 May 2023 10:03 (one year ago) link
My actual answer would be Christian Rock or Ska(punk - as opposed to actual Ska)
― nashwan, Thursday, 18 May 2023 10:11 (one year ago) link
No reason why Christian Rock can't be good.
https://f4.bcbits.com/img/a0465734609_10.jpg
― Maggot Bairn (Tom D.), Thursday, 18 May 2023 10:15 (one year ago) link
3rd wave ska and electro-swing have this common issue where it seems like they're made exclusively by people who look smirky in press photos
https://arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-bostonglobe.s3.amazonaws.com/public/CWNIEBRNQAI6DOW3GI7EGIENZI.jpg
https://www.music8agency.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/Electro-Swing.jpg
― he thinks it's chinese money (soref), Thursday, 18 May 2023 10:25 (one year ago) link
how do people feel about electro-swing subgenres such as 'dark electro-swing'?
https://i.scdn.co/image/ab67706c0000da8486c737cc6c2336ea7c490516
― he thinks it's chinese money (soref), Thursday, 18 May 2023 10:29 (one year ago) link
o no
― Daniel_Rf, Thursday, 18 May 2023 10:41 (one year ago) link
please share some dark electro-swing with us
― ufo, Thursday, 18 May 2023 10:42 (one year ago) link
Does it mean more than "indie that isn't very good from these specific years", though?
― Daniel_Rf, Thursday, 18 May 2023 10:43 (one year ago) link
ok "dark electro-swing" appears to be trip-hop with edm drums? lol
― ufo, Thursday, 18 May 2023 10:46 (one year ago) link
That sounds good to me
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 18 May 2023 10:47 (one year ago) link
it's an improvement over light electro-swing
― ufo, Thursday, 18 May 2023 10:48 (one year ago) link
I like hard trance and a lot of Goa, it is lovely for doing repetitive and boring tasks as well as getting absolutely delirious in the club setting. Agreed with the reasons behind why many of the electronic genres get a pass from me— there is considerable and constant innovation, whereas four blokes passably playing songs and whinging on is about as boring as one can get. Also xyzzz otm, love that opera! I wonder whether people might like David Lang’s The Little Matchgirl Passion, which retells the Hans Christian Andersen story via opera— it is quite accessible and beautiful
― Goose Bigelow, Fowl Gigolo (the table is the table), Thursday, 18 May 2023 10:53 (one year ago) link
Someonè I used to know used to call the bands she was going to see Indie schmindie which I assume covers the same type
Probably not a rigorous critical demarcation, but I think I used to hear indie schmindie refer to quite tame twee noughties indie pop, with glockenspiels and handclaps and ukuleles and such, before it had been fully domesticated into music for adverts - Noah and the Whale and stuff like that. Feels meaningfully distinct from the laddish landfill, but maybe also a maligned genre contender in its own right.
― lazy rascals, spending their substance, and more, in riotous living (Merdeyeux), Thursday, 18 May 2023 11:01 (one year ago) link
Do I look like I know what a jpeg is? (dog latin) at 1:28 18 May 23The old joke used to go:"There are only two styles of music I don't like, and they are Country AND Western"
― the world is your octopus (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Thursday, 18 May 2023 11:10 (one year ago) link
xp I was thinking it was just another term for continual also rans. So presumably npt 100% down with what the exact dimensions of the genre are. THought it was just that bill filler time passing stuff. But there have presumably been different forms of that dependant on what teh prevailing trends are. Bands filled with 'Sleeper blokes' then?
Has been running through my head that in the introductory talk prior to University starting 20+ years back a lecturer talked about the 20% essential to 80% negligible that one had to work out which bits were actually necessary in any summary. & that what one really needed was to remember the 20%. THough I think the 80% may be somewhat necessary contextualisation that needed to be understood as including some of the whys and wherefores of. But if one was going to think in terms of that 20% needs to be kept bit any form of landfill would be the other 80% and presumably the worst aspects of that.& in thinking of that too seems to reflect the big pharma idea of the active ingredient which removes the herbalist idea of working out the balance for the individual metabolism. Or the idea of a scene being the creative context as Lenny Kaye talks about in Lightning Strikes. & maybe the also rans also playing a vital part. JUst hoping that people aren't simply going through the motions etc.
― Stevo, Thursday, 18 May 2023 11:15 (one year ago) link
I picked up a book called teh Selling Sound a couple of years ago taht I really need to read. Tracing how Country music was shaped by commerical interests. Bought it in a big sale by the imprint in the first year of the pandemic. https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2008392.The_Selling_Sound?from_search=true&from_srp=true&qid=YGdTlVaZwJ&rank=2
THought it looked pretty necessary when i got it but its still in a pile soemwhere
― Stevo, Thursday, 18 May 2023 11:19 (one year ago) link
Yes but they don't normally come with a built-in assessment of quality.
it's a bit like calling one of the options "shitty funk" or something.
I think this is the argument you'd need to make. And you could. But if we're trying to say,well, it's all the indie after the Strokes that we didn't vote into year end polls, this falls apart pretty fast.
used to call the bands she was going to see Indie schmindie
Oh Cindy!
― maf you one two (maffew12), Thursday, 18 May 2023 11:29 (one year ago) link
That seems to be the tension in articles like this one, where landfill is basically defined by its averageness - like, is averageness a judgment of quality or does it reflect some deep aspect of a certain British generational experience which is indelibly tied to this movement?
https://www.vice.com/en/article/bv8a8w/the-top-50-greatest-landfill-indie-songs-of-all-time
It also wouldn't be the first time that a derogatory description turns into a genre name. On the other hand, I doubt many bands are ever going to embrace the landfill label.
― jmm, Thursday, 18 May 2023 13:12 (one year ago) link
landfill does only have the connotation of worthless refuse doesn't it? I mean that is the sole automatic response to the phrase, that it's recognisedly worthless and not even great ersatz soil.It's not even there to be upcycled, it's just disposed of. Like.
― Stevo, Thursday, 18 May 2023 13:22 (one year ago) link
They unpaved the MOR, put up a landfill lot
― nashwan, Thursday, 18 May 2023 13:24 (one year ago) link