The Bug - Pressure

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What does anyone else think of this, K.Martin's CD of dancehall menace using (I think) mostly untried British MCs. Some of the rhythms are well tough but in a way it's the creepier, bad-dreamier spoken tracks that work best, making for a most unpleasant atmosphere. But that's also the problem with the album - KM's been doing this take-a-music strip-out-the-pleasure-centers trick for his whole career ("isolationism", Techno-Animal), this is easily his best record but isn't the whole idea a bit tired?

― Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 11:36 (twenty-two years ago)

i like it fine but don't see it having anything to do with dancehall at all. play this at a dancehall rave and the floor would clear faster than you can say Stone Love. Therefore, while i still like it, I have huge reservations as to whether there's really any point.

― Dave Stelfox (Dave Stelfox), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 11:54 (twenty-two years ago)

Well it's clearly inspired by dancehall but it's not a 'dancehall record' - which is fine and dandy, why crawl up to 'authenticity' all the time? Also I can imagine clubs where dancehall and this would be played, only they aren't 'dancehall raves'. The reservation I have is how he's used dancehall - just applying a somewhat simplistic "this music is tough and menacing, I will make it more so by slathering on my cosy old industrial noises" method to things.

― Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 12:04 (twenty-two years ago)

Well, yeah, it's not dancehall per se, but there's a hell of a lot of dancehall elements in it. I think it's pretty fine on the whole, and probably the best thing he's done since Technoanimal's Re-entry. The injection of the dancehall stuff works so much better than the plain unpleasant attempts at hip hop of a couple of years ago.

I'm not sure agree with the exclusion of pleasure thing either. It's not a happy-happy-joy-joy record but there's more emotional drive to it than the bludgeoning mess of the last record.

― RickyT (RickyT), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 12:10 (twenty-two years ago)

i agree entirely and i find that approach a little troublesome, it's not cosying up to authenticity, it's just removing all context and function from its inspiration, rendering the result pretty one-dimensional and not providing a very good environment for the deejays to flourish in. in the best dancehall voice and rhythm are equally forgrounded, working together in a counter-intuitive way whereas martin drowns out his vocals under layers of noise etc... therefore the bug = not as good as lenky...

― Dave Stelfox (Dave Stelfox), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 12:14 (twenty-two years ago)

Tico... we're basically agreeing... plus the most important thing abt dancehall is that it functions in the conest of the dance, so to me this has nothing to do with dancehall other than being inspired by it. in reality it's very good noisy electronic music but very bad dancehall...

― Dave Stelfox (Dave Stelfox), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 12:29 (twenty-two years ago)

Admittedly I've only played this once myself and then heard it on a friend's car stereo on the way back from Glastonbury and I didn't like it at all. I thought it smacked of a record boy trying too hard. I don't think cold electronica and dancehall make a particularly good pairing, at least not in this instance. They manage to suck out everything that is good about the other and the result is - meh (dismissive noise).

― Anna (Anna), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 13:18 (twenty-two years ago)

I really like this disc. Agree that it's the best Martin-related release since Re-Entry, or maybe Ice's Under The Skin. I can't stand most dancehall anyway—even though lately I'm obsessed with reggeton (Spanish-language dancehall). Martin's approach is fine with me, but I'm not an electronic music guy; I'm a metal guy.

― Phil Freeman (Phil Freeman), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 14:16 (twenty-two years ago)

i agree with anna. sadly i guess k-mart would be pretty chuffed to be called the new bill laswell

― Chip Morningstar (bob), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 14:34 (twenty-two years ago)

Jess H. reviewed this and hailed it in the Village Voice for its PIL-like use of dub which is what Martin has been using for years though there seems to be a bit(only a small bit) of dancehall influence. Simon Reynolds similarly praised it on his blog. But I think they both didn't clearly explain how the disc varies from song to song with some cuts sounding slightly more rootsy dub while others clang and bang. I personally like it when it's at its most Jamaican feeling, but when Martin gets all industrial it sounds as cliched to me as an old Wax Trax release.

― Steve Kiviat (Steve K), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 15:48 (twenty-two years ago)

Heh Chip this thread was going to be called "Is K Martin The New Bill Laswell" except I realised I couldn't remember anything about any of his other records. (i.e. "Yes")

― Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 16:12 (twenty-two years ago)

tom, you hurt me in my fucking heart, and i'm actually a bit surprised you bothered picking this up.

anyway, yeah, i don't think it's a perfect record by any means and certainly not even a top 10 release this year (maybe 2 or 3 months ago it might have been, when there were just fewer records period.) but i think everyone is wrong about it being "bad dancehall" becuz it's NOT REAL DANCEHALL. (didn't you yrself thomas use the "does PiL get slammed for not being real dub, then?" argument on ilm not too long ago?) it's an art-rock appropriation of "third-world rhythms", plain and simple, and should be judged accordingly. i think it succeeds pretty well on those merits, while never hitting the heighs of metal box or remain in light or whatever "classic" you want to throw around. (oddly enuff the spoken tracks with roger robinson remind me oddly of the last 1/3 of remain in light.) certain a damn sight better than kid606's latest "cut ups".

― jess (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 16:52 (twenty-two years ago)

also, the scud record is better but then i would think that

― jess (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 16:54 (twenty-two years ago)

broklyn beats better still, sound murderer EVEN BETTER

― jess (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 16:54 (twenty-two years ago)

Jess said it better than I could re: the intent. Though I suppose it's a matter of the lens that you're using to look through it -- still, I'm bemused that Tico and Jess, who I think have extremely similar tastes, would split so clearly on it.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 16:59 (twenty-two years ago)

tom and are very different in some areas, and i think this is one of them: i have far, far more time for "noisy electronic music" than he ever will (even though i eventually come to realize i am indifferent to 95% of it. it's a kind of masochism left over from my metal and hardcore ridden youth.)

― jess (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 17:00 (twenty-two years ago)

I think the trick with said noisy music is to ignore whatever seriousness the creators are putting into it and treat it as aggressive new age. Then it's very soothing.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 17:02 (twenty-two years ago)

oh come on! it is dancehall - some of the elephant man and ward 21 rhythms are equally as industrial. i play the (very) odd dancehall set and 'killer' fits in like a dream and usually gets the biggest cheer.

― stirmonster, Tuesday, 15 July 2003 18:49 (twenty-two years ago)

i think it's a bit rubbish, really - it certainly doesn't work as a dancehall record (as others have noted), and for me it doesn't work a s a dark experimental (or whatever) record either.

certain a damn sight better than kid606's latest "cut ups"

that's saying absolutely nothing though!

― toby (tsg20), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 18:59 (twenty-two years ago)

dancehall isn't programmed with that level of mid-frequency distortion thought; it's all tops and lows. so in that sense it's not "real" dancehall.

sure it is toby: it's saying that in the race for art-rock (i am avoiding using racial terms here, tho i don't know why since obv it's right out there) circa 2003's use of "third-world rhythms", one practtioner is better than another. anyone who bigs up PiL or The Slits or the Contortions or The Pop Group and then gets down on any modern vision/version of same automatically is using some pretty selective logic.

― jess (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 20:05 (twenty-two years ago)

no one compares the pop group to issac hayes outright because it doesn't make any fucking sense, even if both have walking basslines and shuffling hi-hats. you're getting something different out of y than you are hot buttered soul, ostensibly. (ot for a more accurate comparison, maybe, ju-ju music and remain in light or sex machine and buy.) sasha frere-jones' review of the certain ratio reissue is one of the few pieces i've seen which makes stabs at overcoming this lack of language to discuss this type of art-school appropriation stuff without immediately lapsing into comparisons with "funkier" or "realer" versions of same. ("timbales ain't nothin to fuck with.")

― jess (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 20:13 (twenty-two years ago)

fair enough jess. i guess i am somewhat knee-jerk about this one; i can't help seeing this record in the same was as this:

PLASTICMAN - the safest entry into UKG for IDM geeks?

― toby (tsg20), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 20:17 (twenty-two years ago)

obviously (or maybe not so obviously) i realize you weren't dismissing the concept out of hand, just saying that martin didn't pull it off well, and i think he did so we're going to have to agree to disagree. i think, like steve, i like the record best when it approaches a kind of uneasy calm (those same roger robinson guested tracks). more dub than dancehall. which is martin playing to his strengths, yeah, but if you got it flaunt it, etc.

ha ha the bill laswell comparisons are probably wholly accurate, but martin only releases a record every two years rather than 35 every six months, so his batting average his higher.

― jess (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 20:21 (twenty-two years ago)

The Jazz Satellites comp he put together was really good. Otherwise... I didn't think even Macro Dub Infection was so hot.

For me it's a tone problem: it all just comes across as very, very humorless.

― Ben Williams, Tuesday, 15 July 2003 20:36 (twenty-two years ago)

dancehall isn't programmed with that level of mid-frequency distortion thought; it's all tops and lows. so in that sense it's not "real" dancehall.

hmmmm. what is real?

that's akin to saying that any techno with compression on the 909 (ie any techno made outside detroit) isn't "real" techno. i totally disagree, to me it is still dancehall. listen to some of lenky's productions - he has loads of that mid-frequency distortion.

― stirmonster, Tuesday, 15 July 2003 20:39 (twenty-two years ago)

i thought the poetry was bad and the singing weak. the chat is fine: i like fuck yrself. but i'm not craving to hear the disc again. funny, chuck seems to like it too...

― gaz (gaz), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 21:16 (twenty-two years ago)

Macro Dub 1 wasn't great, but Macro Dub 2 was. And I don't know how much involved he is/was with the Electric Ladyland comps, but those (particularly vol. 6, the last one before they went clickhop) were pretty solid, too.

― Phil Freeman (Phil Freeman), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 22:18 (twenty-two years ago)

macro dub 1 was hella important to teenage jess but i feel no urge to revist these days

ben is jazz sattelites worth tracking down?

― jess (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 22:23 (twenty-two years ago)

it is jess. i don't know you'd like it though...

― gaz (gaz), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 22:26 (twenty-two years ago)

...and i'm not ben

― gaz (gaz), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 22:26 (twenty-two years ago)

it's one of those records that's been on "the list" for ages, but i've pretty much given up every hope of finding it

also ambient 4: isolationism!

― jess (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 22:27 (twenty-two years ago)

those two cd virgin things were a great intro. i have robots, spacemen etc too. if you ever get round to sending me something i might dig out jazz sats for you.

― gaz (gaz), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 22:31 (twenty-two years ago)

hah speaking of which i just mailed you (just got paid...it's friday night...got some cd-rs...feelin right)

― jess (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 22:42 (twenty-two years ago)

I could probably burn it for you, if you catch me in a good mood.

It's mostly early 70s fusion, mixed up with a bit of 23 Skidoo, early Kraftwerk (when they were The Organization), Pop Group etc. I wouldn't necessarily say that every track is "good," but it has a lot of cool obscure stuff and the general sound hasn't really been recycled yet... even tho it does have all the hip names. I dunno, haven't listened to it in ages, but I always liked it. It's out there.

― Ben Williams, Tuesday, 15 July 2003 22:44 (twenty-two years ago)

Actually, it probably has all been recycled by every laptop electronica guy who ever listened to Bitches Brew, but the original stuff was so much messier that it doesn't sound like just an influence on something contemporary... it still sounds weirdly other.

― Ben Williams, Tuesday, 15 July 2003 22:50 (twenty-two years ago)

sorry jess, that was mean. i know it wasn't your fault.

bens right. the thing i didn't like about jazz sats was the seemingly incongruous more recent stuff martin worked in.

― gaz (gaz), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 22:56 (twenty-two years ago)

http://www.spaced-out.org.uk/images/stargal/nick/mike.gif

― Chip Morningstar (bob), Tuesday, 15 July 2003 23:56 (twenty-two years ago)

I was actually supremely disappointed w/ Pressure. In my mind, sure it's an indie/art-school take on Dancehall, but fails utterly. I agree with Anna, draining everything from the genre, adding nothing with industrial/noise.

Some of the slow jams just sound like b-sides from Mezzanine, but not as good...

― Michael Dieter, Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:08 (twenty-two years ago)

Jess I think you're getting me confused w/someone else on this thread! My write-up above was supposed to be on-the-fence not hostile and I'm agreeing with big chunks of what the pro-Bug people are saying - "Some of the rhythms are well tough"; "in a way it's the creepier, bad-dreamier spoken tracks that work best, making for a most unpleasant atmosphere"; "Well it's clearly inspired by dancehall but it's not a 'dancehall record' - which is fine and dandy, why crawl up to 'authenticity' all the time?".

I think you're right in that maybe I'm just bored with 'electronic noise' and you're not! It's not a bad record, better than I expected, but I think Anna's inference is right and there's something drearily macho about it - more so even than 'proper' dancehall which is the most ridiculously hypermacho music there is most of the time.

― Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 07:24 (twenty-two years ago)

well i still reckon it's got nothing to do with dancehall but i'm going to judge it alongside that genre coz it martin sets himself up for this. as for "selective logic", isn't that what musical opinion/critcism is all about. i see this like i see a lot of digidub - pallid, white, blokey and a bit rubbish - and if it's the first exposure some of its listeners are getting to dancehall, then that's a shocking state of affairs. so just for the sake of this thread i'm revising my earlier opinion and saying it's actually pretty shite (i don't really think this btw, but i really feel i should). i can appreciate it in and of itself, as i said earlier, but think that in the context of its influences, then it's pretty misguided and dull and i'd rather be listening to vybz cartel

― Dave Stelfox (Dave Stelfox), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 09:02 (twenty-two years ago)

when i saw him live it was pretty annoying because he just drowned out all the vocalists, who were there alongside him, out in loads of treble-y scree and that bloody siren noise he seems to use in all his projects (well, techno animal at least), the exact same one, and then there would just be a period of high freq. mess, with everything else cut out, riddim, bass etc.

so, it was sort of good, but not that good really.

havent heard the record though yet.

i don't like the idea of him though (for most of the reasons mentioned upthread). whatever that means. that makes me not like it and dismiss it out of hand. good idea, huh.

― ambrose (ambrose), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 10:35 (twenty-two years ago)

Fancy a bunch of rock critics saying this record is "too macho, production too one-dimentional", as they proceed to re-bury their heads back up dizee rascal's one syllable rhymin', handclappin' ass. You're all a buncha proto-trendoids.

― another opinion, Thursday, 17 July 2003 06:17 (twenty-two years ago)

Um but the people here who like the Bug most (Jess, Dave S) also like the Dizzee album most.

― Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Thursday, 17 July 2003 07:26 (twenty-two years ago)

proto-trendoids! cool!

if martin thought to use a handclap just once it would be more significant than all his entire recorded output to date

― Chip Morningstar (bob), Thursday, 17 July 2003 11:10 (twenty-two years ago)

if i'm one of the ones who likes him most here, then it doesn't really say much for the popularity of this record as i'm not a huge fan of it! it's ok...

― Dave Stelfox (Dave Stelfox), Thursday, 17 July 2003 11:54 (twenty-two years ago)

i'm an enormous fan of the album, as well as the split single with /rupture. and i love the dizzee album, on fairly different terms, but yes, what i probably dig about both is the severity. i'm not as concerned with questions of authenticity. i'm not going to go too deeply into it at the moment but i don't have a problem with martin's approach -- he's listening to dancehall, thinking "yes but what if it sounded like death metal" (ok, so that's a bit glib) and pulling out and emphasizing those particular threads. not so different from what mu-ziq does concerning jungle and now UKG, playing with a particular generic trope, but applying a bit of willful/wishful revisionism.

and i can't be a proto-trendoid, because i'm always behind the curve.

― philip sherburne (philip sherburne), Thursday, 17 July 2003 12:23 (twenty-two years ago)

i am also triumphantly uncool!

― Dave Stelfox (Dave Stelfox), Thursday, 17 July 2003 12:30 (twenty-two years ago)

i dont think martin's stuff is esp severe, it's just habitual bedroom moshing. which is prob to do with authenticity, yes, considering what dizz does is also so much bedroom angst...

― Chip Morningstar (bob), Thursday, 17 July 2003 12:38 (twenty-two years ago)

maybe it just comes down to the fact that phil and i both love metal.

― jess (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 17 July 2003 15:01 (twenty-two years ago)

thank you jess. was that a pre-NW passion? i've wondered if my metal yearnings come from growing up in portland.

btw, like i blogged yesterday, anyone who loves doomy sludge must own the toadliquor CD on southern lord, reprising their 1994 record. oh my.

― philip sherburne (philip sherburne), Thursday, 17 July 2003 23:32 (twenty-two years ago)

metal-core ruined my life

― jess (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 17 July 2003 23:37 (twenty-two years ago)

three months pass...

i'm finally hearing this for the first time and it's blowing me away like say nice up the dance never could, but maybe that comparison isn't a proper one. i really enjoy the way the micro-elements contrast against the general boomtastic-ness and pressure is indeed the perfect title for this record. crystalline. what other records are there like this?

― disco stu (disco stu), Sunday, 26 October 2003 18:58 (twenty-two years ago)

I didn't like the album at all, but saw The Bug live last week (w/Luomo the same night & venue, of whom I don't have nothing new to say that wasn't said by Manuel on the Luomo live thread few weeks ago) and... it was fantastic!!!

I didn't expect to enjoy myself but I did, his schtick makes so much more sense boomin' live. He also played a DJ set for the warm up, incl. Fuck U Sign, Pass That Dutch and Flat Beat! I danced my ass (and a coupla other things too) off, and if you get the chance to catch him live I say definitely go for it. Even if ur a hater, like I was.

― Mind Taker, Sunday, 26 October 2003 19:07 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, i bet this would be rather physical played loud on a good system.

man if there were handclaps on this...nice nice nice

― disco stu (disco stu), Sunday, 26 October 2003 19:17 (twenty-two years ago)

that cutty ranks collabo is fiiiiiiiiiiiierce

― mohammed abba (dubplatestyle), Sunday, 26 October 2003 22:09 (twenty-two years ago)

album is Ok, but played live, Pressure sounds like a fucking best thing in the planet!

― quadro, Sunday, 26 October 2003 22:12 (twenty-two years ago)

five years pass...

is there a thread on the new album? ive heard bits and pieces and it sounds amazing.

― Michael B, Monday, 3 November 2008 10:50 (seventeen years ago)

Trust me - nothing begins at home.

― Nothing has transpired (Noodle Vague), Monday, 3 November 2008 10:54 (seventeen years ago)

I almost started a thread and then didn't. The album is awesome.

― HOOS HOOS HOOS on the autosteen (BIG HOOS aka the steendriver), Monday, 3 November 2008 14:18 (seventeen years ago)

worse worse worse
shotta in your face make you send fi di nurse
nurse nurse nurse
doctor cyan't fix yuh send fi di hearse
hearse hearse hearse

― lex pretend, Monday, 3 November 2008 14:26 (seventeen years ago)

TOP SHOTTA!
tell dem idiot bwoy the warrior queen a TOP SHOTTA!

― lex pretend, Monday, 3 November 2008 14:49 (seventeen years ago)

Did Tom ever get anything right?

― Do they mean us? They surely do! It's Ray Conniff! (Marcello Carlin), Monday, 3 November 2008 15:16 (seventeen years ago)

i didn't think pressure was particularly amazing at the time, i loved the bug singles (esp w/warrior queen) but it seemed a bit monotonous over a whole album. might dig it out to listen w/new ears, but i'm pretty sure that in terms of the album format (if not nec the bug's skillz), london zoo (which i've started rinsing again w/the advent of freezing weather) is a gigantic and awesome leap fwd.

― lex pretend, Monday, 3 November 2008 15:22 (seventeen years ago)

warrior queen remains one of the most thrilling live MCs i have ever seen btw. fierce and righteous and never less than 100% captivating

― lex pretend, Monday, 3 November 2008 15:24 (seventeen years ago)

oh god i just remembered where i first saw her! NYE 04/05, house party where she and the bug were playing, i got v drunk and babbled to her for ages afterwards about how great she was :(

― lex pretend, Monday, 3 November 2008 15:25 (seventeen years ago)

TO ALL THEM FUCKING PEOPLE WHO THINK THAT CHARITY BEGINS AT HOME, LOOK PON THE STATE OF YOUR HOME.

The album is immense. The argument at the top of this thread seems kind of quaint now as London Zoo slots in perfectly alongside grime and dubstep. I actually wish there was more grime that sounded as DEEP as the Flo Dan tracks on here. I'm glad he found a new home for his verse on Bounce as well.

― Matt DC, Monday, 3 November 2008 15:26 (seventeen years ago)

matt have u heard plastician/skepta 'intensive snare'??? u absolutely must!

― lex pretend, Monday, 3 November 2008 15:27 (seventeen years ago)

that's akin to saying that any techno with compression on the 909 (ie any techno made outside detroit) isn't "real" techno.

― stirmonster, Tuesday, 15 July 2003 20:39 (5 years ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Thank goodness no-one on ILM would be that dumb

― The Slash My Father Wrote (DJ Mencap), Monday, 3 November 2008 15:28 (seventeen years ago)

ARE YOU STUPID IN THE NOSE, BASSLINE IN THE NOSTRIL

― lex pretend, Monday, 3 November 2008 15:29 (seventeen years ago)

boy better know this
my name's joseph
my name's skepta
my name's junior
see in school i used to hit boys with a ruler
the english teacher tried to make me hoover
but i'm a bad boy from nigeria
not st lucia
joseph junior adenuga
big lips african hooter
go on then go on then!!

― lex pretend, Monday, 3 November 2008 15:30 (seventeen years ago)

"mostly untried British MCs"

Oh Tom.

― Alex in SF, Monday, 3 November 2008 15:52 (seventeen years ago)

He did put an '(I think)' just before that, dude.

― Matt DC, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:02 (seventeen years ago)

Yeah you're right. Back in the days before the internet it would have been hard to check that sort of thing.

― Alex in SF, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:59 (seventeen years ago)

two weeks pass...

£10 Bag

Joined: 06 Mar 2007
Posts: 2480
Location: Cornwall Posted: Wed Mar 19, 2008 1:51 pm Post subject:

something something something, a would i kick ya in ya face a would i rob ya?
blah blah blah
phenaminmaminan ONE!
this one dedicated to all badman
something about manchester, all i done
blah blah blah
4/4, you na wanna see the 4/4
five! something something something, na stay alive
blah blah blah
we na really care if its early or late, badman really wanna fake
strip!
phenaminaminan six, blah blah blah
phenaminaminan seven, blah blah blah
phenaminaminan eight, blah gunshot blah blah
papa in a suit and mama in a frock

SKENG! SKENG! SKENG! MI KILL A MAN RELOAD THE BIG SKENG! SKENG! SKENG!

EVIL, EVIL, EVIL etc
NURSE, NURSE, NURSE etc
doctor can't fix you send fi di hearse
HEARSE, HEARSE, HEARSE etc

blah blah blah

― BIG HOOS aka the someduder (The Reverend), Tuesday, 18 November 2008 02:18 (seventeen years ago)

ah, dubstepforum.

― what U cry 4 (jim), Tuesday, 18 November 2008 02:32 (seventeen years ago)

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