DC Implosion II: DC Comics in 2020 and Beyond

As a brief update for the uninitiated: AT&T acquired Time Warner in mid-2018 and promptly showed itself to be somewhere between cool and actively hostile to DC Comics as anything more than a bottomless IP well for use by DC Entertainment.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/robsalkowitz/2019/07/31/where-does-dc-fit-in-atts-vision-for-warnermedia/#7d38e6e379b7

AT&T proceeded to badly fuck up launching HBO Max and, as of this writing, is in the midst of goof-proof restructuring/re-siloing its ridiculously sprawling holdings - including Warner Brothers Studio, all the Turner networks (CNN, TCM, TNT, Cartoon Network) and HBO - into parcels of territory it thinks it can more ably control. The general industry take seems to be that AT&T is at a loss as to why they are in a dying pamphlet publishing industry and, as no one ever got around to figuring out how to properly monetize digital, they a)want out or b)are happy to deprioritize DC Comics indefinitely.
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/at-t-loses-streaming-pay-tv-subscribers-warnermedia-earnings-drop-1274002
https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/03/04/is-att-getting-ready-to-kill-dc-comics.aspx

In August of 2020, following the layoffs of thousands of people in their direct-to-consumer stores, AT&T fired hundreds of staff people at Warner Brothers and DC including much of the latter's senior staff and editorial.
https://www.comicsbeat.com/dc-layoffs-reportedly-a-bloodbath/
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/dcs-jim-lee-companys-future-we-are-still-business-publishing-comics-1307413

DC Comics is currently canceling somewhere between a third and half of its currently active books before the end of the year.
https://www.gamesradar.com/dc-cancels-teen-titans-young-justice-suicide-squad-hawkman-and-more/

COVID, of course, isn't helping and neither is the life-support system status of the direct market or DC's recent break with Diamond as exclusive distributors.
http://www.tcj.com/diamond-comics-to-end-weekly-comics-delivery-starting-april-1st-until-further-notice/
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/comic-stores-diamond-distributors-clash-as-industry-reopens-1301472
https://screenrant.com/dc-comics-break-with-diamond-a-major-success/

In the midst of all this tumult, DC launched a previously-to-the-layoffs-announced first-time virtual "Fandome" convention this past weekend. What exciting DC Comics info could you learn about at Fandome? Well there was an announcement for a new HBO Batman series, a new Captain Mar - er - SHAZAM movie, more info on The Rock's Black Adam movie, a trailer for yet another Batman movie reboot, the cast for the new Suicide Squad movie, a preview for a Flash movie, news about another new Batman video game (based on a specific comic book run, does that count?), a trailer for the "Snyder Cut" of the three year old Justice League movie, some promise that Sandman on Netflix is still in production... and then waaaaaaaaaaaaay down at the bottom, two very vague bits of information about actual comics at this comic convention: screenwriter John Ridley announcing he's writing a four-issue series about Batman in 2021 that MIGHT have a Black protagonist ("it's probably a little better than a 47% chance," wake the kids and tell them racism is over!) and a planned reboot of the predominantly Black written/drawn/cast Milestone imprint in 2021... on Black History Month... with two one-shot books... in digital format. Maybe put the kids back to bed?
https://www.theverge.com/2020/8/22/21397238/fandome-dc-zack-snyder-justice-league-batman-robert-pattinson-black-adam-gotham-knights

All in all, a company and a publishing legacy that seems ripe for shuttering or sale. It's a fucking shame considering that the company has been publishing something more than a handful of very good books as recently as the past twelve months: a wacky meta-Jimmy Olsen book by Matt Fraction and Steve Lieber, Grant Morrison's space-procedural take on Green Lantern, an excellent reboot of Hellblazer by Simon Spurrier, NK Jemisin's stellar Green Lantern Corp spin-off Far Sector, Mark Russell's admirably kooky and cohesively-structured take on the Wonder Twins, Gene Luen Yang's better-in-concept-than-execution but still completely laudable Superman Smashes the Klan, Greg Rucka and Mike Perkin's loopy Ms Tree-influenced Lois Lane miniseries... heck, if you're of the right mindset, the Bendisverse and Tom King's multiple books have been worth keeping up with too! But it's hard to imagine any extended new work of merit blossoming in 2021 from either established or new creators when your grand vision exists only on a month-to-month basis.

Here's a thread to discuss the corporate and creative future of DC Comics and why/if we should care.

Thread title reference btw: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DC_Implosion

I literally just yesterday finished reading this:

https://twomorrows.com/images/large/books/Implosion_LRG.jpg

Recommended. Good reminder that DC has been punching itself in the face/been punched in the face by its corporate overlords for decades.

Also worth noting that the original programming on the DC Universe streaming service (which kicked off less than two years ago) are being moved over to HBO Max, in a move that all but guarantees that the service itself will be shuttered in the near future.

I think they've already talked about moving the comics to a service like Marvel Unlimited.

Great recap, ulysses! Thanks for pointing all those great books that DC actually did publish this past year, too. Love Jimmy Olsen and Lois Lane was really solid, sort of a throwback to Gotham Central. Plan to read the rest of those, too; been collecting Far Sector for a good sit.

One I would add to the "great if it's your kind of thing" is the Tom Taylor DCeased books. Yeah, I know, it's like, Marvel Zombies did this already, but I love Taylor's fun pulp since his epic Injustice run (also see his current Suicide Squad series which hopefully isn't cancelled already).

Picking up a bit on the Bendis talk earlier, I must give praise to Batman: Universe, fun tale with great art by Nick Derington. Part of a character swap he did with Tom King (doing Superman: Up in the Sky, not quite so good but interesting) for what was originally a Walmart-exclusive book.

Re: Marvel Unlimited - It's already been built, more or less, for DC Universe streaming, wasn't it? I didn't have any experience with it though, and it seemed under-advertised.

Yeah. It's just that with the shows all moving to HBO Max they'll rebrand it as a standalone thing

I agree that the DCeased stuff is compulsive, pulpy stuff, good toilet reading for sure and it absolutely beats the FOR TEENZ ONLY silliness of the Heavy Metal books.

Batman: Universe WAS good and you're totally correct that Deringer's art is the strongest component there. He hits a sweet spot between Jim Aparo and Darwyn Cooke that really works for me.

I subscribed to Marvel Unlimited for a few years until I got frustrated with the many many technical issues and library restrictions and slow load times. I would honestly pay three times what MU is charging if they would only make the functionality anywhere near the same as torrenting! Can anyone speak to how well the DCU streaming comic platform works? A quick glance suggests the library is anything but comprehensive.

for reference: https://www.dcuniverse.com/browse/comics

I know it doesn't speak well to my moral character but this is all popcorn.gif to me based on personal history

Great summation btw

FWIW, I imagine someone at Disney is probably arguing that they should drastically overpay for the whole shbang with deferred inheritance of the properties for television/movies? Maybe four times what they paid for Star Wars would get AT&T's attention?

sure do wish i could find ZS's Bat-Sicnal.jpeg

I gambled on the stupid fucking Three Jokers premium variants and it's annoying that it seems to be an actual hit. At least we won't lose money but this will encourage them.

DC solicits point to them juicing their numbers with incentive variants heavily over the next few months - since Rebirth they'd barely done any but there are 1:25 and 1:100 everywhere. Positively Marvel-esque.

Actually as much as I hate DC right now, they're still much less embarrassing than Marvel on the variant front

if it's a hit, why is that annoying? (and yeah, every single damn DC title has variants now)

The variant shit is legit annoying. Catering to the pogs crowd imo.

xp - I don't like them being rewarded for pushing retailers hard into ordering 450 covers of 9 "premium variants" that sell for cover. It's bad for shops and the industry in the long run.

also tbh I may be jumping the gun in calling it a hit, we'll see what happens with the last set of five covers in three months.

Based on presold bundles etc. we will at least not lose money so I can't be mad mad I just don't like it

ah, ok. i didn't understand that the pre-order minimums were so high for those

Yep, 50 per premium variant x 9 covers, plus the A & B - which were a PITA to order because of the commitment to 150 premiums.

A brief on the past ten years of abuse of power in comics that is about 45% DC focused
http://www.tcj.com/the-2020-report-day-seven-finale/

Wish that could've been stuck to being an informative piece without so much tortured prose and opinion... but yeah, it's good to know

TCJ house style

TCJ house style being pretty much the entire reason I eventually stopped buying TCJ but I digress.

I wish Abhay had toned down his tumblr's house style about 70% for the series, but I don't think anyone else has ever written for the Journal in its 44-year-history like him (and iirc his only previous credit was the 2015 Spectacufuck, although his drop-ins on Tucker's blog posts were always entertaining) - certainly not in reportage / feature writing, and I'd class this more alongside Groth's '80s op-eds than the factual, asking-questions-on-the-phone news reporting that used to be a hallmark of the periodical version.

Also, all variant covers are an evil in the marketplace, although to a lesser degree on Love & Rockets or Henry & Glenn Forever or Bone.

my suggestion there was that TCJ house style is "tortured prose and opinion."

i will always cherish my glenn ganges chromefoil variant

TBF, my POV on TCJ is based on when I was still subscribing like...what, almost twenty years ago now? Fffffuuuuuuck, I'm old... But yes, interviews/main features were almost always solid.

I still think that clarity of prose was a hallmark of TCJ golden age writers (aside from Ken Smith, whose column was solidly ignored by anyone except Groth - iirc the oral history has at least one editor say they didn't even bother to read it when laying out an issue?). Opinions are what you buy a magazine of criticism, columns, editorials and interviews for, but despite clearly ~knowing some words~, the greatest strength of writers like Fiore and Thompson and Macdonald and Spurgeon was an ability to be clear, personable and funny while conveying their opinions.



too scared to search "glenn ganges chromefoil variant"

like...what, almost twenty years ago

*searches to see when Ann3 El!zabeth M00re's brief tenure as editor was*

looks like mid-2001 to early 2002

Yeah, that would've been almost exactly the time I let my sub lapse iirc.

ganges chromefoil was just sicbait, don't fear the variant

current TCJ online writing is kinda all over the place in terms of writing quality; this bizarre hitpiece on Urasawa is the latest headscratcher
http://www.tcj.com/reviews/mujirushi-the-sign-of-dreams/

That said, they're one of the few places I still read regularly for comic info and the weekly link wrap up is very necessary.

Got a couple of paragraphs in... *sigh* ok, yeah. This is why I am not a fan of TCJ in general. No thanks.

They're still posting good stuff!
Try this: http://www.tcj.com/bd-is-my-beat-a-long-hard-squint-at-manchette-and-tardi/

As a DC enthuiasiast, Nhex might enjoy Tom Kaczynski's or Tegan O'Neill's recent essay series on their universes more than a single link to something deliberately pointed to as being bad and incomprehensible

well i wasn't trying to win him over with the Urasawa link!
I found that Crisis piece pretty overwrought tbh.

I know, just an observation!

Maybe a bit overwrought but it's enjoying the playful wallow in nerdy nostalgia, and the building thesis about The Event is both fun and meta. Each mention is like another appearance by The Monitor and Lyla!

Tegan's recent-years comics writing has often been too ~personal essay~ for me to fully enjoy the commentary, but re-evaluating the Morrison/Case Doom Patrol in a post-transition perspective is obviously a rich and relevant vein

This Tegan one on Stan Lee was good: http://www.tcj.com/what-he-taught-me/

I liked their Doom Patrol piece too.
http://www.tcj.com/the-wreckage-part-one/

*searches to see when Ann3 El!zabeth M00re's brief tenure as editor was*

looks like mid-2001 to early 2002

That was the worst incarnation of the print TCJ, wasn't it? The number of columns and reviews dwindled significantly and M00re seemed determined to turn it into her own personal zine (there were two Ghost World fumettis starring her which served no purpose).

the greatest strength of writers like Fiore and Thompson and Macdonald and Spurgeon was an ability to be clear, personable and funny while conveying their opinions.

I wish Fiore still wrote for TCJ instead of just hanging out on the Greil Marcus site.

And what happened to classic.tcj.com? It disappeared without a trace. They have always been half assed with preserving their online legacy.

Oy, that Urasawa piece is overlong, overwrought and a pretty terrible reading t'boot

The fumetti would have been great if they were funny or representative of any greater push to bring weird and playful material back to the magazine. As it was they just made her look disconnected from the aims of the publication and its other contributors.

Kinda delighted to hear that Fiore has an old-man message baord to hang out on!

Yeah, there's never been the institutional will or funding to have a coherent online strategy - dates and times have disappeared off the comments on the current (a decade or so?) version, and Tucker is aggressive about not wanting to repair them. Even when people try and point out it damages the historical record, makes it impossible to track conversations in eg. the long thread where Dave Sim makes Kim pitch him on the reprint rights for Cerebus. Still, that's a step up from the days when they had to periodically delete every single post on the message board bcz they had such a small hosting plan that it took up room needed to add new books to the shop.

Didn't know these guys started up their podcast again.
https://www.factualopinion.com/the_factual_opinion/graphic_novel/
McCulloch is my favorite guy who isn't Gary Groth.

lol at the DC comics thread turning into a Comics Journal thread

Robert, yeah, both that and Travis Bickle On The Riviera are weekly now, presumably due to lockdown

Interesting that there's been a bunch of reports on Geoff Johns as an abusive boss - well, Ray Fisher's and Abhay's anyway. I wonder if they've been timed to drop now for a specific reason.

In other news, who would've seen it coming that a comics dude with a penchant for writing about limb disfigurement and for remaking every IP in DC Comics history in his own image (even Alan Moore's!) could've been an abusive, narcissistic person to work for

An engaging essay from the proprietors of an Edmonton comic shop about how DC's withdrawing from Diamond has been a stressful net positive for them: https://www.comicsbeat.com/the-coronavirus-journal-dc-comics-distribution-change-aftermath/

As it stands, every single graphic novel product I can get through other vendors comes into the store faster that Diamond can turn around, in better condition, and at a better price point.

I can only conclude that his was a small store on a lower discount tier or this is a Canadian issue. (This is the case with a ton of people's attitudes - the retail side of the comic industry is about a half dozen different kinds of specialty retail. Some shops survive entirely on back issues, some are in college/artsy areas and can basically be curated book stores catering to a GN crowd, some are 50/50 comics/games)(currently I'm at 33% games/single issue comics/GNs and I don't do back issues as they're usually done).

Penguin Random House offers free shipping for a $150 minimum order but their discount is 7% lower than my Diamond tier was or my DC initial order tier is (I can't restock GNs from my comic distributor, one of the A+ things about this new arrangement) - shipping does not make up that 7% difference. Their ordering system is also hot fuckin' garbage, from week to week it hasn't worked on one browser or another because of back end issues with security certificates or something. One week I had to find an old version of Internet Explorer to install on an old laptop to place my order.)

Hachette (Marvel, etc.) is even worse - 16% lower until one threshold then 6%.

I find his argument regarding Diamond's shutdown a bit squirrelly - retailers were begging for publishers and Diamond to stop shipping, because they weren't open. Books that you can't sell but have to pay for - I don't think that math works very well. (If you could even get them - my drop point was closed for a month.)

Yeah, "for them" is key there, and the amount of changes they had to do to get to being happier now is significant.

Already having in-city delivery set up was a fascinating wrinkle.

Very strange article to read. Probably the only one I've read praising DC for their actions. I mean, it's clear they're pushing to get DC to have their own Canadian distributor, and stop shipping issues from Canada to the US back to Canada, quite openly.

As milo just quoted, and as someone who has struggled to reliably order GNs from my locals, this rung with me:

As it stands, every single graphic novel product I can get through other vendors comes into the store faster that Diamond can turn around, in better condition, and at a better price point. This was even the case pre-COVID. They became, through their own complacency, the worst place to order graphic novels from, and they are in no condition to make that pivot today.

Penguin does have a quick turnaround - order on Wed/Thu, arrive on Tues most of the time. They're the least painful part of the DC debacle in many ways.

Diamond always had that option with direct shipping but most shops didn't want to pay the cost (because it could eat up margin) - otherwise you were looking at a roughly two week turnaround if you timed your order right. (Diamond has now gone to all restocks (such as special orders, etc.) being direct shipped.) It got real real bad after reopening but their main restock shipping warehouse in Mississippi was apparently a COVID nightmare in terms of finding people to work. For the last couple of weeks, Wed. restocks have arrived by the following Tues/Wed for us.

I made my peace with the time frame years ago - for gotta have it situations, it's impossible to compete with Amazon Prime so you're basically just banking on the kind-heartedness of customers and trying to keep as much important stuff in stock as you can at all time.

Caught up on Strange Adventures, the maxi-series by Tom King. Very intriguing so far. The artwork and storytelling is really excellent, visually - Gerads on the present mystery, Shaner on the likely-false past legends of Strange, it's all superbly drawn and colored. I always like to see the underused modern incarnation of Mr. Terrific.

We're five of 12 issues in, so there's every chance this could turn into another Heroes in Crisis, but I'm crossing my fingers this is more of an Omega Men. Main problem so far is that it seems far too obvious who the killer in #1 is, though we're not much closer to discovering what exactly the main character did on Rann that was horrific (or not horrific, but covered up anyway). Praying there's less political speechifying in later issues.

Here's some predictions: Clearly the wife is the murderer, right? Unless they're leading with it so obviously it's gotta be something else?
Strange himself seems genuinely innocent, but as this series is about THE HORRORS OF WAR I'm guessing he did it and was mindwiped or something. Maybe willingly. Hopefully it wasn't straight-up genocide as seems to be implied under the overarching white colonialism theme, but nobody really cares about this character, so maybe they'd let King do it?
Another theory: there's gonna be some weird shit like his daughter IS actually his wife in the present through horrific super-science shenanigans or something and she's masterminding this whole cover-up. All this talk about Rann being hyper-advanced beyond Earth tech, which seems unclear in the flashbacks, is bound to be leading to some plot point. Hope it's something truly bonkers.
If he just ended up sacrificing his daughter "for the greater good" I'm gonna be super disappointed.

I guess I'll see in 7 months...

Those have very pretty covers.

My son said today that in the 10 years approaching DC's 100th anniversary, its heroes should gradually start retiring, one by one -- leaving only one left at the anniversary, at which point they stop publishing altogether. I asked who should that be, Superman? He said no, Batman -- "an old and wrinkly Batman. And then he just says goodbye, and disappears."

He then said that after a 20 year break, DC should start publishing again -- with the former sidekicks of the heroes taking on the main heroes' identities. Little does he know that he's not gonna win any originality awards with these ideas...

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/94/BatmanYear100.jpg

One new distributor down

DC adding $125/week order minimums, too, while cancelling ongoing TPB collected series and slashing their ongoing titles again. (And apparently skipping ongoings altogther in the first two months of the new policies?) (!!?)

What I heard (and believe) is that Midtown pulled out but DC asked to delay and make it look like their decision. Midtown was losing money on distribution and they were in dire straits earlier this year overall when NYC was shut down.

The order minimum will catch a few shops doing new comics as a sideline to other things (which is bad) but mostly I think that's aimed at and will catch individuals pretending to be shops (which is good).

What individuals are pretending to be shops?

I see them in collectors groups every so often - get a DBA, buy for yourself and a couple of buddies. Or just buy when they want to speculate on a variant or something. Diamond has new account rules about brick and mortar premises to avoid the bedroom buyers' clubs but it's hard to enforce.

The reason I think it's aimed at them is that, seeing how they pack, Lunar has to put in almost as much labor on our $1200-2000/week order as on someone ordering 15 comics, which completely wipes out what little margin there is in distributing. I imagine DC wanted to sweeten the pot just to make sure both distributors didn't bail.

Ah, gotcha. Didn't know that racket existed

It's pretty silly, the minimum discount is only 40% these days. You can get 30% ordering from Midtown or DCBS without having to do extra taxes for your sole proprietorship. I think people are hyped to think they're getting one over by doing it.

Javins appointed EIC, in a startling win for competence.

Some polite shade in this long, excellent Stuart Immonen interview at TCJ, re leaving a long-term gig writing & drawing Superman:

If there was opposition from higher up at DC, I never knew about it, but maybe it just stopped at the editor. I think there was a fair amount of latitude as long as sales didn't nose dive, and being a cartoonist himself, Joey Cavalieri in particular had an appetite for a broad range of comic-making approaches. When Eddie Berganza succeeded him, and brought in Joe Kelly and Jeph Loeb and so on, I felt like my time on the Superman titles was drawing to a close.

Javins does seem like a savvy appointment, but she's inherited such a mess of a comics company I'm not sure any one person could turn it around.

I'm not entirely convinced that the intention is to turn it around. They just need someone to competently drive it fully off the cliff.

ha

Laid off more people 14 hours after announcing Javins.

Incredible that a conglomerate with $100bn in debt is going to retire it by replacing an $80k per year marketing guy with a $40k per year marketing guy.

Fired basically the entire direct sales department; looking all the more likely that they stop periodical publishing altogether in the new year. They could hire 875 $80,000 marketing guys for the cost of one Justice League Snyder Cut, though.

With their current creators, I can't think of a single DC title I would miss if it disappeared

Fraction's Jimmy Olsen should've got more attention though

So good! Just got released in trade, too

They've recently cancelled the few titles I was still buying (except for GM's GL, which I guess he just quit writing). I've still been getting like the series of '80s Batman collections they've been putting out the last few years but it sounds like those could be on the scrapheap soon, as well. DC has been increasingly aggressive about their disdain for my money over the past decade.

The combination of making their terms much worse for creators, at the same time as encouraging and protecting serial sexual assaulters, made it even easier to not pay attention to their deteriorated output over the past decade.

It's not just the entire retail infrastructure of an American-originated medium that's been imperiled by AT&T restructures, in the face of HBO Max's weak launch, as of yesterday though: the Friends reunion special has been rescheduled for a second time to March 2021. Maybe comic shops will still exist by then too.

Jog on Johns:
http://www.tcj.com/momentism-revisited-three-jokers/

Hibbs estimating the implosion:

I can’t see any path that doesn’t cripple DC with these changes to distribution and staffing for the DM – sales are absolutely off on the “bread and butter” of DC’s line in a way that is largely disguised by “Joker War”, “Death Metal” and “Three Jokers” all hitting at the exact same time – and I am 100% certain that these hits were substantially smaller hits than they could have been had DC not tried to force retailers to buy from their largest competitors. But those hits were long-gestating, and are unlikely to be repeated into 2021 based upon what we know of DC’s plans. The first launch of ’21, “Future State”, appears from the outside to be pure commercial death, and DC seems to be suggesting that they’re consciously moving away from continuity this year – the thing that’s actually the “secret sauce” that keeps their production ticking along.

Much like Heroes World and Marvel in 1995, it’s nearly impossible to see how this plan could tick along for more than two years or so, and the hollowing out of staff and services at DC would seem to me to guarantee that DC will be nothing but weaker at the end of this inning. My firmest expectation is that DC will no longer personally be selling comics by January of 2022, and instead will move to licensing them out to another publisher.

https://www.comicsbeat.com/tilting-at-windmills-282-the-end-days-of-dc-comics/

seems right

increasingly, my guess is that AT&T sells the entire IP to Disney for more than 10% of a trillion dollars and Marvel rebrands the DC universe as a line, which merges the big two into one and saves the superhero comic pamphlet industry for about three more years while the DC vs Marvel movies get made

When will the "Marvel vs. DC" movie happen

They've been announcing creative teams for the series debuting in March
https://www.polygon.com/comics/2020/12/6/22150302/batman-detective-comics-dc-mariko-tamaki

I liked the concept of Future State but as usual hate how it was split up in a billion series

The Future of DC Films: Two Batman Stories, Six Movies Per Year Split Between Theaters and HBO Max

To make all the story lines work, DC Films will introduce movie audiences to a comics concept known as the multiverse: parallel worlds where different versions of the same character exist simultaneously. Coming up, for instance, Warner Bros. will have two different film sagas involving Batman — played by two different actors — running at the same time.

So on the one hand this is finally an implicit admission that they have no idea how to build an MCU-style universe. But on the other hand...four theatrically-released DC movies every year. So ahead and strap on those wings again, there, Icarus! Should be fine!

Serious question: is the TV division considered a success? I mean, even Gotham somehow made it to 100 episodes.

I guess so? It comprises something like 80% of the CW's schedule at this point.

Talk about burying the lead!

“‘The Flash,’ a film set for release in theaters in 2022, will link the two universes and feature two Batmans, with Mr. Affleck returning as one and Michael Keaton returning as the other. Mr. Keaton played Batman in 1989 and 1992.”

The Flash film has been in development since 2004, at one point was meant to launch the DC movie universe by spinning off of George Miller's Justice League, and was re-announced in 2014 for a 2018 release. Since then, they've signed and parted with Lord & Miller (as writers, the pair declining to direct), Abe Lincoln: Vampire Hunter author Seth Grahame-Smith (as writer/director), Dope writer/director Rick Famiyuwa (as director and maybe not writer?), King Arthur: Legend Of The Sword co-writer Joby Harold as writer, pursued Zemeckis, Raimi, Marc Webb and Matthew Vaughan as directors before asking Lord & Miller again, signed The Incredible Burt Wonderstone writers Daley & Goldstein as directors, then 18 months later signed It Part Two director Andres Muschetti to direct, and Bumblebee writer Christina Hodson to write.

Keaton was announced as returning in June, Affleck in August.

Absolutely can't see any impediments to them speeding up their pipeline enough to get six features produced each year.

lol

Here's the NYT interview piece:
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/27/business/media/dc-superheroes-movies.html
this sounds like a straight-up trainwreck.

I would suggest to them that six features a year is simply an act of timidity. Triple that and we'll talk, DC. And put a different Batman in each one. And release them all simultaneously.

I can't believe I used to believe that bigwigs became bigwigs via the demonstration of competence.

“In the past, we were so secretive,” Mr. Hamada said. “It was shocking to me, for example, how few people at the company were actually allowed to read scripts for the movies we are making.”

is it possible that they just didn't want to bother reading nine Flash scripts a year that weren't going to be made

So far, “Wonder Woman 1984” has collected $85 million worldwide, with $68.3 million coming from cinemas overseas, where HBO Max does not yet exist.

does this sound threatening to anyone else?

Two terrifyingly expensive movies, “Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice” (2016) and “Justice League” (2017), both directed by Zack Snyder, were deemed almost unwatchable by critics.

ok then

To complicate matters further, HBO Max gave Mr. Snyder more than $70 million to recut his “Justice League” and expand it with new footage. Mr. Snyder and Warner Bros. had clashed over his original vision, which the studio deemed overly grim, resulting in reshoots handled by a different director, Joss Whedon. (That didn’t go well, either.) “Zack Snyder’s Justice League,” now four hours long, will arrive in segments on HBO Max in March.

At least for now, Mr. Snyder is not part of the new DC Films blueprint, with studio executives describing his HBO Max project as a storytelling cul-de-sac — a street that leads nowhere.

wait what

The multiverse concept has worked on television, but it is a risky strategy for big screens. These movies need to attract the widest audience possible to justify their cost, and too much of a comic nerd sensibility can be a turnoff. New actors can take over a character; James Bond is the best example. But multiple Gothams spinning in theaters?

“I don’t think anyone else has ever attempted this,” Mr. Hamada said.

I know they make a point that this guy has no interest in movies and never wanted to work in them, but James Bond is cited literally seven words earlier

It says they weren’t his “first calling,” he’s obviously been a producer for years. James Wan makes him sound like an ok guy:

“A lot of times in studio meetings, executives just repeat buzzwords, and it becomes a joke,” Mr. Wan said. “Walt always brings something constructive, useful and important to the table. He talks to me in a language that I understand.”

Fwiw, this also doesn’t really sound like a James Bond situation, or any other franchise where multiple actors have played a role but with little or no overlap (Batman would be an obvious enough example of that).

oh in that case, stack Fulci & Romero against him too :)

xpost: my point was that there have been multiple Bonds on cinema screens in 1967 and in 1983, both of which my notes suggest predate 2022

It's like a version of James Bond where they release a Connery Bond and a Moore Bond and a Dalton Bond and a Brosnan Bond all in the same year and set in four separate versions of the Bondverse.

^^

how many were written by Maibaum, and how many by Purvis & Wade?

Back to the thread topic: DC's solicitations for March feature the first issue of Infinite Frontier - the latest full DCU reboot and by my count number seven (Golden Age, Silver Age, Crisis, Infinite Crisis, New 52/Flashpoint, Rebirth, Infinite Frontier) and the fourth in fifteen years.

As part of the reboot, there are EIGHT new #1s on the way (Joker, Batman, Harley, "Crime Syndicate", Suicide Squad, Superman, Swamp Thing, Teen Titans). Those join the still ongoing Superman/Action, Batman/Detective, Superman-Batman, Catwoman, Flash, Justice League, Wonder Woman and (somehow still going?) Nightwing... all of those are in Infinite Reboot mode as well, many with new creative teams. There's a new Batman/Catwoman book by Tom King, Neal Adams is continuing his crazyverse with Ras al Ghul, Morrison is winding down Green Lantern. There's a Joker/Harley book. There's a Man Bat book. There's a new Superman anthology series called "Truth and Justice".

Beyond that we got young adult novels with Raven, Catwoman, and the phenomenally odd spectacle of Ryan North penning a young John Constantine trade; Looney Tunes somehow all the way up to #259, MAD's reprint book with a Jim Woodring cover(!).

Black Label continues with Jeff Lemire's return to Sweet Tooth, a Scott Snyder "American Vampire" book, a reboot of Batman Black and White ("risky" stories) and a Harley Quinn book. There's also the ongoing John Ridley "Other History" of the DC Universe, which is an illustrated novel retelling DCU chronology from the perspective of characters of color, and the ongoing Rorschach and Adam Strange books by Tom King. There's also a Dreaming series still continuing somehow.

So that's 37 books for March and a full universe reboot! Considerably more than we presumed as of the first post. No idea what this portends.

I tried getting on board with each of the last two reboots; should I try again for this one?

if all those authorial teams, and the satisfying results of the last four universe reboots, appeal to you based on past reading, then of course

I’ll pro’ly just buy this Infinite Frontier #0 and stick it next to Rebirth #1 on my DC shelf.

Wonder of many of those are minis. At least I know Crime Syndicate, Bat/Cat, Batman: Black and White and Other History are limited. I'm pretty okay with them doing those, especially if they're not tie-ins to some event.

The YA stuff is completely separate from DC continuity and don't really connect except for the ones done by the same authors

I actually think Rebirth was decent as far as reboots go, but just like then I'm happy just reading 95% of this stuff later through the library when there's time.

While some of the creative decisions they're making at the moment are surprising and admirable (eg Mariko Tamaki on Detective comics), I have zero confidence in DC management at this point and no interest in getting sucked back into their in-continuity titles (as opposed to the 12-15 titles/month I read prior to Flashpoint, when I hopped off the train and never looked back). The only non-reprint books of theirs I'm buying at this point are the Sandman universe stuff (almost done once Spurrier's Dreaming series ends) and the Young Animal stuff (almost done once Far Sector ends) and the odd mini (King's Strange Adventures, which is likewise almost done). Oh and Morrison's Green Lantern (which, yes, is in-continuity but thankfully self-contained aaaaaand likewise almost done).

I tried getting on board with each of the last two reboots; should I try again for this one?

The Ghost of Christmas Past is telling you that he hasn't read a current Marvel or DC book in at least two years.

on reflection my cynical mind suggests that DC bought another year of publishing budget by arguing "reboots sell!" and that this is the last gasp while AT&T attempt to arrange an IP megasale for 2022/23

you think they're really going to sell any IP? I would think the lesson of 21st Century Disney/Fox is NEVER sell your IP because 100 years later it'll still be making money

Wasn't the theory that they would license comic book publishing to Marvel?

i'm no genius with this stuff but my sense is that AT&T needs to pay off a huge chunk of debt and that IP would probably take care of that and then some to satisfy their shareholders? seems like the fastest way to clean up their books and the most intangible asset... the superhero goldmine is still a relatively recent thing and there's no guarantee that this won't go the way of cowboys and indians in the 2030's.

licensing publishing to marvel/disney would probably work as a getting-to-know you strategy while they work out numbers and terms, sure.

I think they're looking to sell off DirecTV, while the DC IP is fueling all those hit movies (I didn't realize that even Shazam! was a hit).

Marvel is so bad at publishing that Disney license their catalogue to a company run out of an unheated, leaky house instead

superheroes come back every 25 years, give or take!

sure in one form or another but the current boom is both unprecedented and frankly unsustainable.

everybody betting their trillion dollar companies on the surety that Teen Titans 6 is gonna rule the (nonexistent) box office in 2032 confounds me. but then i'm just some dude on the internet, what do i know

xp true, i agree with that

Feel like the horrific wealth accumulation and corporate hegemony of this century is increasing and we're more likely to see things consolidating vs break-ups in the long run. Besides climate disaster I'm not sure what's going to even slow down that trend

Right now it does feel like a safe bet something from the Massive IP Farm will the biggest money-makers in 12 years. But who can know for certain

In fairness, they also have the Scooby-Doo and Space Jam franchises.

to clarify - yes the current superhero boom is unsustainable and will morph into something else at some point

but economies don't make sense anymore. how did Elon Musk make $133 Billion this year?

I mean, he didn’t.

I just like that they plan to combine the Robert Pattinson and Ben Affleck universes by bringing together Ben Affleck and... Michael Keaton?

are they gonna computer unage him or will batman be bald

this is a pretty good article about what we were just talking about:
https://musingsonmouse.substack.com/p/star-wars-nostalgia-fatigue-and-marvels
julia alexander's "Musings on Mouse" substack is well worth subscribing to

are they gonna computer unage him

I didn’t even consider this (just assumed it would be a Dark Knight thing); but now I’m expecting the worst, lol

xp is there a way to get that through RSS instead of email?

nah they're not gonna do it. assumed they're just make him Flashpoint Batman or Batman Beyond-era Bruce Wayne (like they did with Kevin Conroy in the recent Arrowverse crossover)

nm - found it searching on Feedly

They should bring back Val Kilmer.

https://static01-nyt-com.cdn.ampproject.org/i/s/static01.nyt.com/images/2020/05/07/magazine/10mag-kilmer/10mag-kilmer-mobileMasterAt3x.jpg

as palpatine?

Unrelated, this new Superman looks like the dickhead from Accounts at a company barbecue:

https://variety.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/supermanandlois-suit-1-e1607554527118.jpg

Not a new Superman by any stretch as he has portrayed Supes on multiple seasons of Supergirl already. He's dece.

Cool. He still looks like he’s asking a receptionist to “put Deez Nutz on hold.”

it's on like krypton

I mean, the point is that he's Dad Superman. If you put a moustache on him he'd look like the dad from Inside Out, so job done.

Kyle MacLachlan (dad from Inside Out) actually has voiced Superman, so I guess it all ties together?

A somewhat younger MacLachlan would have perfect as a (live action) Superman / Clark Kent, btw

https://i.imgur.com/MBIMkUK.jpg https://i.imgur.com/HEGa0Yh.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/9w6Gmht.gif https://i.ibb.co/wLXDRRV/giphy.gif

https://i.imgur.com/az295lc.jpg https://i.imgur.com/olwVPOp.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/ufLJXDp.jpg https://i.imgur.com/JCf7d41.png

<3

https://i.imgur.com/U2TP0jI.jpg https://i.imgur.com/75AGLJc.jpg

enhance

https://i.imgur.com/Z1Ssg2H.jpghttps://i.imgur.com/JzgbaZp.jpg

Anyone here read the “Wonder Woman: Dead Earth” miniseries? Sounds interesting.

it's good.

Guys.

They're changing Black Adam's name to

(hang on)

(wait for it, it's worth it)

SHAZADAM

Gesundheit!

His mother's name will be changed to Shazmartha.

Okay, u just about made me choke on my lunch there

Holy shit

https://bleedingcool.com/comics/dc-comics-buyout-in-the-works-from-fans-with-lots-of-money/

(Also don't know why it didn't occur to me before but: Shazadam and Boogaloo Shrimp)

that sounds disastrous

t/s: dc is run by a bunch of clueless rich assholes on a salary vs dc is run by a bunch of clueless rich assholes who also own the company

https://bleedingcool.com/comics/other-people-who-have-heard-about-the-big-dc-buyout-pitch/

So weird to think that there's a pool of high roller comic nerd venture capitalists floating around out there. Like they clearly have accrued their wealth from some entirely different, non-comics thing but for some reason comics are the toilet they're eager to flush their money down (to which I say: welcome to the club).

gotta burn them $GME profits!

Bleeding Cool understands that it was former DC President Diane Nelson's decision to move DC Comics from relatively expensive offices in Manhattan to insanely expensive offices in Burbank that was the biggest factor in the decision.

I have been assuming this was likely a major factor, lol / nice to have it semi-confirmed

Why are the offices in Burbank more expensive? (It's not mentioned or explained in the link.)

Some quick Googling suggests that midtown Manhattan is #2 in the country, while Burbank is much, much cheaper -- on average, of course.

DC moved from 666 5th (now owned by Jared Kushner, and a major liability that he's tried to leverage through various of his governmental roles through the last four years) to across the road from Letterman around... 1993? '95?

When Levitz left all the way back in 2009 and Diane Nelson took over, moving the offices to the West Coast was once again considered—and a whole west coast office that was staff-ready was already built— but Levitz, or someone, had signed such a long lease on the offices that to break it would literally have cost more than the move.

Dc Entertainment staff began using that Warners-built office in 2010; in 2011 they signed a https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/dc-entertainment-readies-move-new-2051786 million lease even closer to Warner, but it took a few years to purpose-build another space in the floor they leased in that tower. In 2013, DC Entertainment and relocated DC Comics staff moved in; in 2015 DC Comics as a whole was moved to the west coast.

MAD was a major canary in the coalmine of my thinking, too.

NB that Nelson told the Wall Street Journal in 2013 that the awkwardness of judging the office Halloween costume contest via video conferencing is what convinced her to require the entire New York staff to move a few buildings away from her, or to pay out their redundancies.

Haha

that linking glitch should say "$16 million lease" btw

Well, Nelson's sure sounds like an opinion one should throw millions of dollars at.

Can we say for certain that DC/WB/AT&T isn't some Producers-esque scam whose architects desperately want it to fail? Because Occam's Razor suggests...

AT&T seem all-in on WB; they've been aggressively remaking the studio (to the dismay of longtime staffers). I don't know how they feel about the publishing business, though.

they are actively shopping the publishing business to dipshit nerd venture capitalists; estimates are $300 million to half a billion for print rights in perpetuity, no underlying IP.

revenue streams! revenue streams!
https://newsroom.spotify.com/2021-02-22/audio-brings-new-dimension-to-the-dc-comics-universe/

these podcasts have been surprisingly successful for Marvel, so I guess why not

Not 2020, but I've been reading John Ostrander's Legends miniseries from' 86, post-Crisis. Setup to launch new series, particular his run on Suicide Squad which I'm also reading. While that one's good, this series has got a lot of painful Len Wein dialogue. Vibe is part of the JLA and required to say "amigo" every other line. Also, I didn't realize just how early DC was doing the "public turns against the superheroes!" bit, as this feature Darkseid as the main villain utilizing G. Gordon Godfrey as propagandist. Boy, they went back to that well a lot in the past decade, didn't they?

tbf that schtick is a old as the birth of marvel

Sure, but it's something of a dividing line between them, I'd have thought?

sure. DC was doing wacky superheroes well into the 80s before they caught the grim and gritty bug.

his name was Ambush Bug, iirc

POP!

were early Avengers storylines like that or something? i haven't read the early Marvel stuff in-depth... though Spider-Man of course always had people hating him as a major plot element, it didn't have this particular feeling or nostalgia behind it

X-Men were always hated and feared
Avengers and FF definitely had early storylines about them being good or bad
same, as you say, for Spider-Man
Captain America is the only earthly hero who get off without suspicion in the early MU iirc

oh, duh, X-Men. that's the most outstanding example for sure. but i guess, in my mind, since they and Spider-Man were hated from the beginning as outcasts/freaks/racial allegories it felt "baked in"?

in Legends, there's a scene where a brainwashed mob of "everyday" citizens beats the life out of Jason Todd and puts him in the hospital, I was surprised to see it

caught him stealing their rims

DC officially done waiting for the floppy to die on its own, hastens its demise by raising cover price to six fucking dollars (for 40 pages): https://bleedingcool.com/comics/dc-increases-price-of-batman-monthly-comic-and-others-to-6-each/

This is even funnier considering that for the last six months, almost every DC book I've bought doesn't even scan for sale properly, due to all the distribution shenanigans that happened in 2020

Also I bet those $5.99 books will still be crawling with ads. Let's pay for more Snickers advertainment!

Yeah, I thought the least concession they could make was to slap 'No Ads!' on the cover but I'm sure there's little chance of that.

Like god knows I do more than my fair share to keep the floppy market afloat, but if Marvel winds up going down this road, I might honestly throw in the towel. I'd like to think Disney isn't that stupid but maybe they're equally eager to kill off our beloved pamphlets and this is just the direction the entire market will go.

you've got to be kidding me

And with the Batman/Fortnite: Zero Point #1-6 priced at $4.99

BTW, the right way to do this would be to note that each issue has a "limited run" and then sell them as the collectibles they need them to be for that price point but they don't seem to give a shit

I guess it just applies to a handful of titles at the moment but it's a tremendously shitty precedent. Hopefully one that will blow up in their faces before it really takes root.

i presume they're curious to see how much if at all pricing impacts the floppy audience. They might not be wrong in assuming that anyone who already submits to the indignity of buying these pamphlets will buy three floppies for $18 instead of six for the same and bitch about it but put up with it.

Probably the latter, guilty as charged. (So much indignity, lol)
Especially those Black Label books which sometimes use cardstock covers and bump up the price to $5 already.
Hell, even TMNT: The Last Ronin (which wasn't bad, as a corny and fun deliberate throwback story) was printed in a semi-prestige oversized format at $7.99 per issue, which largely inspired me not to continue. This week I saw Batman: Urban Legends - a new anthology series which I would have tried at normal price - selling at $7.99 as well, and said no. In fairness, at least that book was 64 pages, but still... that's almost the price of a 200pg manga black and white volume.

With Rebirth their schtick was $2.99 comics - that was ultimately a failure so I guess they're going to aim higher.

A little corporate history and speculation on what happens next for DC: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/dc-comics-warnermedia-discovery-1234954536/

(well, not so much speculation as “who knows?”)

Batman reality shows are going to make some very annoying people very very angry.

well you'd be annoying too if some guy hired by HBO kills your mother and father to send you on a sociopathic spiral

Posting these dresses seen in the window of a vintage shop, just b/c they’re awesome:

https://i.imgur.com/3ETcHSl_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium

Grant Morrison in good-comic-shocker. I have no idea/interest how it interacts with DC continuity - such as it is - but SUPERMAN AND THE AUTHORITY is most fun I’ve had reading a Grant Morrison comic in about a decade. It’s very middle-tier GM but not unenjoyable.

It’s Grant in “What if Millar but bearable” mode

I hope he actually bothers finishing this Authority story.

I think it's only three issues so he should be able to stick it out.

Was wondering if I wanted to get on board this wave of Superman stories, Bendis just finished his run. There are maxis for Jon Kent (by Tom Taylor), Supergirl (by Tom King) and the Morrison one. Probably just wait them to hit Hoopla in 2022.

DC Direct is now a division of McFarlane Toys.

Rorschach #11, penultimate issue. Excellent work, especially by Fornes. All finally coming together. Definitely going to have to re-read this entire thing.

I just read Infinite Frontier #1 and I think it put me off comics forever. I can't do it, folks.

When our heroes saved the Muliverse from Perpetua in Dark Nights: Death Metal, everything was put back where it belonged... is some too much time on ilx shit

lol they are using the "multiverse being real" like its covid or something - which could be interesting.. the masses are fighting about it. but people say "the multiverse was RESET AND REBOOTED" about 100 times in issue one and it was the first time a ever threw a comic book across the room

Don't let present-day DC put you off of comics forever. Let it put you off of present-day DC forever.

This is the exact thing that I was talking about in the X-men thread...sounds like total blech.

I do need to go pull my file as I haven't been to the comic store in a couple months (maybe 3)...yikes. Should not be all that much as I don't have but a couple titles on pull anymore.

im being hyperbolic of course ill still read things but whhhyyyyyyy do these people think having an infinite crisis every few years is a good thing?!

that "illusion of change", baby!

https://www.cbr.com/webtoon-wayne-family-adventures-surpass-dc-batman-comics/

Batman: Wayne Family Adventures is the first collaboration between DC Comics and Webtoon. It heavily features Batman's supporting cast and explores the relationships between Gotham's vigilantes. The series launched with three episodes on September 8 and has since gained over 500k subscribers. The most recent monthly reports for Batman, Detective Comics and Batman: Urban Legends show those books selling roughly 125k, 53k and 44k, respectively. The last time a Batman title sold over 500k units was in 2019, when Detective Comics #1000 sold 574,705 copies.

I only sold four of these apples but I managed to give away four hundred of these free oranges, I guess we know which is the runaway success.

i will let spotify know that their free orange delivery system stands no chance against sam goody's apple dispensary

OANN calling for mass executions, brought to you by @ATT pic.twitter.com/1EIzWHITnm

— jordan (@JordanUhl) October 8, 2021

Truth Justice and a Better Tomorrow

Sentiment - good
Actual phrasing - sounds like a microloan startup slogan

wonder how this will work out for DC
https://variety.com/2022/biz/news/att-spin-off-warnermedia-43-billion-deal-1235168480/

weird to me that DC hasn't hopped into the NFT field. Seems like you could sell each individual comic that way and create your own lame ass stock market.

they did NFTs "hand-selected by Jim Lee" four months ago

Ah, of course they cid.

so.. what does this mean

I think it’s just a stock thing

More on the business stuff: https://variety.com/2022/film/news/dc-warner-bros-discovery-zaslav-hbo-max-1235232185/

top leadership have been toying with the idea of turning DC into its own solidified content vertical

A turd by any other name

Honestly though - how can that get even more vertical? WB already owns the IP and produces all the material which goes to its subsidiary video channels after theatrical.

They mean having one person or team in charge of it all (films, tv, etc.), rather than folks from across different divisions of WB.

(lol Ward)

DC Universe app just went live in the UK and has a free 7-day trial. Lots of amazing stuff there (Sandman, Invisibles and, er, The Heckler, were the only things I missed) and the app seems slightly-more-functional than MU. No categorising by author or artist, though, which is annoying.

I'm off to bury myself in crap comics from 1990

Giffen nine-panels look great on iPhone panel-to-panel!

I took the plunge with a trial, just to get an idea of what you have access to with this service. I had a suspicion it would be full of nasty digital recolours and it lived up to my expectations on that score, but lack of consistency across the board is really disappointing.

Uploads just seem to be pulled from whatever random version of each issue is immediately at hand, with no-one bothering to check if a better source might be available. This is really evident in a quick scan through of Detective Comics - the earliest issues just have the Batman pages and have not been correctly rescaled for tablet viewing, so they look ugly as hell in portrait mode (this was also an issue with a Perez Wonder Woman issue I looked at). I'm pretty sure these pages have just been yanked from an existing compilation of Bat-material, hence lacking the additional stories, but what's doubly strange is they credit writers and artists whose work doesn't appear as those pages aren't even included!

The further down you go, you find some random issues do appear to've been sourced from original scans(and these *do* include the extra material), which immediately are an improvement on the digital versions, but these will be right alongside some truly grotesque mid-2000s recolour jobs (what they did to some of the Neal Adams issues really is a sin) - it's bafflingly inconsistent. There are also quite large numbers of issues missing, so anyone hoping to do a complete readthrough this way is going to be disappointed.

I will say there are *some* good things about it, the feature that allows you to view specific series like all the "Crisis" stories is a good start, but this is still far from being the best way to read these old comics unfortunately.

I'm enjoying it for the basics, i.e. reading comics from the golden era between COIE and Death of Superman, and the brief few years between Gotham Central and Final Crisis when DC seemed relatively interesting again. But, yeah, the app (although marginally less buggy than Marvel Unlimited) isn't great.

The curation of storylines (e.g. being able to read crossovers in one go) seems more carefully curated than in the Marvel app, but -- as with Marvel -- once you finish reading an issue, it sends you to the subsequent issue of that comic rather than the next part of the crossover, which is an annoying basic to fuck up.

I'm less concerned about reproductions, but, yes, the recolouring remains awful and the digitization seems to give everything a slightly more "ligne claire" inked look than I remember in the original comics. Still -- the access to the great 85-92 years is pretty thorough.

I've never been that interested in pre-Crisis DC -- with the exception of Batman, it always seems pretty square and dry. I find the Curt Swan house style deeply drab. What am I missing?

Like - does DC have analogues to the Gerber/Starlin weirdo Marvel comics of the 70s, or the Miller/Sienkewicz innovations of the early 80s -- or does all that stuff happen later in the 1980s? I know the Titans are a pretty lame substitute for the XMen.

Well there's the Kirby stuff but I'm guessing you've read that already?

would Shade The Changing Man qualify? i only know the vertigo reboot but the original is Ditko

I have some of the Kirby stuff in print collections. TBH I find them completely unreadable but they're terrific art books.

Unfortunately the Milligan & Ditko Shades are both missing

Kamandi and Demon are pretty readable imo.

Also, I find myself unmoved by LOSH or the Silver Age "Batman turns into a frog and fights aliens" type stories so beloved by GM, but I could try harder I guess

I went in hard on those Showcase volumes when they first started coming out and in retrospect a lot of it is unbearably tedious. The Captain Marvel stuff felt like actually well done kid's humor comics, and the Superman volume was best for the WTF moments, but important to just read an issue or two at a time or you just become numb to the insanity.

def not the same flavour as Starlin or Gerber tho!

Demon's not on there. Kamandi is a good shout

Not really a DC stan - and if you find the Fourth World 'unreadable' we're probs not on the same page anyway - but I would say all of the following are worth a download:

Wonder Woman by Denny O'Neil, Mike Sekowsky and Dick Giordano - WW becomes Emma Peel.
Swamp Thing by Len Wein and Berni Wrightson - foundational DC gothic - lots of great art in the horror anthology titles like Witching Hour, House of Secrets, House of Mystery too.
Stalker by Paul Levitz, Steve Ditko and Wally Wood - nice self-contained little fantasy four-parter with a great art combo. Ditko's 60s series The Creeper and Hawk and Dove are essential too. Don't know if Charlton's The Question will be available but it's the apex of Ditko's masked hero work.
The Shadow by O'Neil and Michael Kaluta. I like the Frank Robbins issue very much too, but he is the definition of an acquired taste.
Green Lantern/Green Arrow by O'Neil and Neal Adams. The 'relevance' stories have dated of course, and seem clumsy and corny now, but Adams really elevated the material with his intensity and attention to detail. Deadman, the O'Neil and Adams Batman issues and Superman v Ali also worth a read.
The Brave and the Bold and Batman comics drawn by Jim Aparo in the late 60s/early 70s are clearly influenced by Adams's work and have some of the same energy and excitement, a definite break from the Swan house style. Aparo also drew a very consistent run of Aquaman comics in the late 60s, written by Steve Skeates, and in the early 70s an amazing run of mind bogglingly violent Spectre comics written by Michael Fleisher. Talking of whom ...
Jonah Hex by Michael Fleischer. Very consistent western series with great art from Tony DeZuniga and others. The special issue where Jonah dies and is stuffed and mounted as a museum exhibit is one of the all-time great DC strips, beautifully drawn by Russ Heath (who together with Joe Kubert did great work on the DC war comics, often on some fairly tasty Robert Kanigher scripts (his 'White Devil, Yellow Devil', masterfully drawn by Alex Toth, is another all-timer.)
Plop!
Captain Action by Jim Shooter and Gil Kane, inked by Wally Wood. Again, a beautiful art combo and not bad stories for one of the earliest toy cash-ins. Just about to be reprinted in book form.
The Angel and Ape by E Nelson Bridwell and Bob Oksner. There are a number of these uncategorisablegroovy 60s titles that are quite unlike anything Marvel was producing at the time - Brother Power the Geek, Anthro by Howie Post (caveman), Secret Six, Metamorpho (drawn by Ramona Fradon), etc.
USS Stevens by Sam Glanzman. Autobiographical war strip that appeared as a back up in Sgt Rock etc throughout the 70s. Again, totally unlike anything else being published in mainstream comics at the time.
Manhunter by Archie Goodwin and Walt Simonson. Terrific self-contained story that appeared as a back up strip in the 70s issues of Detective Comics that Goodwin edited, all of them worth checking out. There's Alex Toth's only Batman story, written by Goodwin, and an excellent silent Batman strip by Steve Englehart and Sal Amendola.

Awesome thanks. I bet 90% of those aren't on the app but I'll definitely check out a bunch in... some way or other. "Jonah dies and is stuffed and mounted" sounds like a must-read

The Manhunter series by Simonson and Goodwin is a high water mark for DC.

weird to me that DC hasn't hopped into the NFT field. Seems like you could sell each individual comic that way and create your own lame ass stock market.

― i cannot help if you made yourself not funny (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 2 February 2022 05:24 (three months ago)

they did NFTs "hand-selected by Jim Lee" four months ago

― bad luck banging, or Lorna Doone (sic), Wednesday, 2 February 2022 09:19 (three months ago)

It’s about time we get some Batman NFTs already! DC Comics and Palm NFT Studio will drop a collection of 200,000 Bat Cowls at $300 each. There is no limit as to how many a user can purchase, but there is a $3,000 daily limit on the platform. The collection will be available on 26 April 2022, with more than 2 billion possible trait combinations. Similar to bats, this will be a blind drop, where purchases will only be revealed in May.

Bat Cowl holders will receive access to exclusive products and collectibles, such as the Bat Cowl apparel collection. They will also get exclusive access and benefits at IRL DC fan events. Furthermore, holders will get the first bite of future DC NFT collections.

In addition, the company revealed a two-year roadmap, releasing new utility every 52 days. Basically, Batman will upgrade the Bat Cowl, rewarding holders with greater access within the DC Universe. By the way, these Bat Cowls are already AR ready, in case you want to flex them on your socials. Last but not least, DC plans to use these Bat Cowls in future DC Comics stories.

If you claimed the free DC Fandome NFTs from 2021, there is some utility after all. Owners will get early access to this Bat Cowl collection. In addition, owners will soon be able to move their assets to non-custodial wallets such as MetaMask.

https://nft.dcuniverse.com/

I like the Frank Robbins issue very much too, but he is the definition of an acquired taste.

LOL, I couldn't remember him by name but based on your description I immediately wondered if he was the dude who drew the '70s Invaders series, and wouldn't you know it.

He had a good style for Sunday strips, not for comic books.

Spent the last month binging all four seasons of Young Justice on HBO Max. Wow - it's really good! Definitely one of the best iterations of the Titans in any medium. They actually took the ambition developed from Justice League Unlimited and ran with it, going much crazier with the sheer amount of characters and years of thoughtful plotting. Hopefully HBO isn't stupid and gives them another season or two to wrap up all the dangling threads.

Last week DC bosses scrapped a $19 million Batgirl movie for a tax write-down.

In May they paid $2 million for the DC.com url.

Closer to $90 million!

Source on the cost of the domain name acquisition?

19 90

ha xp

morrisp: Rich J

dunno who that is

https://bleedingcool.com/comics/when-dc-com-used-to-be-the-url-for-the-crappy-american-car-page/

Thx. "It is estimated," ok

"No you don't understand, this is as coherent as we can make it"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Crisis

“The heroes disapprove of this”

Did not know they officially changed the title to "Dark Crisis ON INFINITE EARTHS"

The original was a lighthearted romp, needed a gritty reboot.

This Wikipedia summary reads like it’s written by one of those AIs that you feed a few lines for inspiration.

Well it doesn't help that the contributor doesn't understand basic sentence structure. But maybe that's just what the attempt to summarize modern-day DC does to the language center of one's brain.

DC continues its unbroken run of absolute chaos since, what, 2009?

I think Flashpoint (2011) was when the freefall began. I was still reading and enjoying like a dozen DC titles up to that point and noped out when that mess began. Still, eleven years of chaos is a very impressive run.

I think I tapped out during Blackest Night, except to finish Morrison’s Batman run.

The period from Gotham Central to Final Crisis was probably DC/Vertigo’s best period since the early 90s imo. Lots of absolute shit, too, but isn’t there always?

Who knew Countdown would turn out to be such a blueprint for the next decade-plus? Depressing

Remind me what Countdown did. That was the their lead-in to Flashpoint after 52, right?

I think DiDio famously said that Countdown was 52 done right. Everything Morrison touched in that period marked the apex of DC's 21st Century output. Leave it to ol' Dan to fail to recognize that. Wotta choad.

Countdown was a New Gods-centric multiverse Crisis weekly that never cohered Into an actual story, but featured a lot of pointlessly nasty character deaths in the Geoff Johns/2007-era bad prestige TV style that was “popular” back then. I think a bunch of Legion characters get eaten by rats or something? It’s bad and non-fun. Every event since then seems to have been some violent & incoherent cosmic epic thing and all DC stories seemed to become boring meta stories about themselves

Brian Hibbs on why 'Distributor discounts are making it harder and harder to carry DC periodical comics':

https://www.comicsbeat.com/dc-periodical-comics-distributor-problems/?fbclid=IwAR1DcIu34qy9AVY-78ZhtkMRVa39LCO0mNjH1fldmRu-dKWRW94JUhJoIo4

If it’s of any diminishing interest to anyone, Mark Waid’s new Batman v Robin is good fun, in a 2000s kid of way, the sort of fun and forgettable thing I always want DC to publish but never do

Obviously in my head the mid-2000s we’re just a couple of years ago but never mind that

Has anyone tried DC Infinite's new "ultra" level?

I tried the trial and read The Nice House at the Lake (starts well, ends hopeless) and some 1990-era triangle Superman (which still holds up, pleasingly). Ultra includes collected editions (which are less fiddly) plus most of Vertigo, and the print-to-digital window is only a month.

It's £85/year which is... a lot, but tempting. Anyone else tried it?

Not a bad price. Maybe this is finally the year I abandon floppies again... if I could get DCUI and Marvel Unlimited for $50 each (that's the typical annual MU deal that pops up) I would probably just pull the trigger, LCS be damned

Right now it's USD $120 per year vs Marvel's $69 annual (but that's with the 3 month delay which tbh there are so few comics I buy and read within that time)

I finished book one of Nice House and while it succumbs to a lot of Tynion's worst impulses, I will certainly read the next volume
it is SCREAMING to be an HBO series

Ha, yes, I will still read the next volume.

I haven't read enough Tynion to understand his worst impulses - my sense was that his restlessness at changing the status quo every other issue (and not in a graceful way like, say, DEATH NOTE) eventually worked against the larger storyline, which is to say, by issue 10 I couldn't figure out WTF was happening or who to care about.

And the characters aren't very exciting. HBO might fix that.

(Sorry ignore my oblique references to Vol 2, which I just spotted that you haven't read!)

oh i read the first 12 issues, which i assumed was "book one"
you do seem to understand his worst impulses btw

Anything in this “Dawn of DC” era worth checking out? I’ve been sort of DC-curious lately, but have no clue where anything stands now.

Yes, every time I take a look at new DC releases they’re all bannered with some impenetrable crossover dressing and it’s extremely offputting. Dark Crisis on Infinite Earths! Knight Terrors! lazarus Planet! Interest lost!

Much like Future State I like the concept and effort, but geez sooo many books that I won't bother.

Hope that The Golden Age/JSA revival turns out well, will check it out in trade

I don't follow regular DC but if anyone here likes the Batman family or "one last job" comics and hasn't read Catwoman: Lonely City by Cliff Chiang, rectify that.

have been checking the library catalogue once a month and no go

Not DC but this month’s Fantastic Four 10 is a great one-off if you dig that sort of thing

Another month, another Fantastic Four #10

it's good. the North run's been pretty decent imo

Has anyone read these Teen Titans books? I guess they're meant for the YA crowd, but they look kinda appealing to me: https://kamigarcia.com/books/teen-titans/beast-boy-loves-raven/

don't let that stop you from trying them! lots of great stuff in the YA space nowadays

^I did end up buying the set, have read two of the three... they're good

Yeah, really good (just finished Book 3, and ordered the next one – Robin). I like the tone better than most of the Marvel stuff I've read lately... not so aggressively jokey. These characters obv have some miles on them, but this feels like a genuinely fresh take.

Read another recent-ish, YA-ish book that I enjoyed a great deal – Supergirl: Being Super, by Mariko Tamaki. Her dialogue is particular strong; some of the best I've seen in a Big 2 comic. It's a Kara origin story, of sorts; though I don't think it's "canonical" or connects with anything in the mainstream continuity (...although the way DC changes it up, who knows).

Btw – I didn't know that Kara goes by "Kara Danvers" these days... as more of a Marvel reader, that's kind of funny, given similarly-named (and -powered) hero on that side of the fence.

Seeing a lot of talk about a new Supergirl one-shot special, also by Tamaki. Anyone here read it? Seems to be generating a (strongly) mixed response.