Top 50 Most Overrated Electronic Albums

COUGH!
http://valen.host.sk/discografia/resultado/discos/imagenes/radio-activity-(1975).gif

Only 50 because these lists never seem to go on for 100.

"legendary album, way ahead of its time ... complexity yet funkiness is almost unreal" - some boob on discogs.com

the complexity and funkiness = wholly imaginary, actually

legendary = yes, but so are crocodiles in the toilets

ahead of its time = maybe, in that the boring post-techno electronica glut wasn't scheduled to happen for at least seven or eight years.

Yeah but Radio-Activity isn't really "overrated" because NOBODY brings that album up when talking about either classic electronic records or classic Kraftwerk records.

And Play was still included in the new issue of Spin's 25 Crucial Electronic Albums Ever.

overrated 'super discount'

I had to sneak this over to my record store's listening station (to preserve the rep). Utter crap.

Also brings to mind the last few Chemical Brothers records, which while not utter crap, are overrated all the same.

haha xpost

Case closed via review by Aquarius Records:

"At this rate by volume 6 or 7 there may not be any sound left at all, just gentle whispers and inaudible drones."

does anybody still rate leftfield?

i WAS gonna mention 'A Hundred Days Off', i was surprised it seemed to get good reviews all round but it's an album of occasional great moments rather than thru and thru quality and freshness

'Leftism': only real flaw is it's painful '95-ness, if that makes sense. i enjoyed that year tho so it suits me. the poem at the end is bloody silly tho

'rhythm & Stealth': a bit too much boring minimalist thudthud but a lot of fantastic moments still - not quite worth the wait tho i guess

I'm sure his other albums are equally bad, but these are the ones I've heard too much of.

-- strongo hulkington (dubplatestyl...), June 3rd, 2004.

Shit, Strongo! you've got ballz to say the things you say

pure contempt.

and the subtle inflections of the envelope filter are stunning displayed on chainzzzzzzzzz

oh, while i am here:

13. dj/rupture - gold teeth thief

You know Incunabula is a real word, right strongo?

Hmmmm.....can the same be said of Mo'Wax? Or do they escape such scrutiny? UNKLE was/is certainly overrated.....

Well, you don't count. *winky*

stevem otm on Moon Safari, Alex otm on Endtroducing.

That sounds about right....

Them's fighting words.

Also, Come With Us is genius. And while Geogaddi may be better, MHTRTC is also essential. It's not just about "Roygbiv". I mean "Turquoise Hexagon Sun", "Kaini Industries", "Happy Cycling", "Aquarius", . . .

4. prefuse73 - something something vocal uprock narratives

AARRGH.

.....and don't say "like their music"!

K.....

Mysterons
Sour Times
Strangers
It Could Be Sweet
It's A Fire
Numb
Biscuit
Pedestal
Roads
Glory Box

makes more sense afaiac

otm mark w/ s/t though

PLEASE

for example, photek's "seven samauri" was awesome but form and function was less so.
m.

For some reason rock tends to go in for that syncretist "I love my metal and my post-punk but y'know Radiohead and Outkast are definitely the geniuses right about now" approach much more. Perhaps they feel more of a responsibility to be broad-minded and representative (even if their representativeness is seriously flawed!).

my own moment of epiphany was when I lazily posted that sheer hellish miasma was overrated, then realized... how many people in the world are ever going to even learn of this album's existence let alone hear it once. after that, pissing matches like this thread became easier to take... I was trying not to post a candidate until strongo (the loudest pisser on this thread) kicked off his '10/10' contribution with fucking 94diskont and I just lost it

haven't heard anything else by drumm, was scared off. I'll look for 'triangles'.

tim otm. they also overrate everything in their own scene. but hey, enthusiasm over balance is all aprt of being excited.

'The Fat Of The Land' should be on this thread tho i guess

jess otm, as well, I mean, I like orbital's albums loads, but they are, or were at least, very over-rated.

Your first mistake, Anthony. I'm with Siegbran.

Top 50 Most Overrated Electronic Albums=ALL OF THEM

Talking About Records

vs.

Talking About Your General Impressions Regarding the Underlying Pattern of How Other People Have In the Past Talked About Records

Yeah, in context everything is/can be overrated, but I wanted to see if some people would throw down their choices and back them up. I dropped SAW II because while I thought it was a good album at the time of its release, in time it has evolved even further into this groundbreaking ambient work (on many "top ever" lists), which is untrue. If anything, with time it seems to highlight Aphex Twin's tendency to pepper his audience with masturbatory sketches and lazy efforts.

And I totally disagree with Tim Finney's suggestion that people simply don't remember albums being overrated. I was very much into electronic music in the early days of 808 State (which was the point of reference) and it in fact was fairly rated at the time.

And I would agree that DJ Spooky would own this thread, but the only place he's ever been "overrated" is maybe Newsweek or the like.....

This again suggests a need for people to back their claims up with something, otherwise, it's all easily dismissible.

Hey! I like some jazz.

i know alex AND you like some hiphop. its just if someones commenting from outside a position of enthusiasm/fanaticism for a genre they're always going to be mystified by the love particular records get.

to try and reach an objective position on the relative merits of all musics is a project that bloody difficult.

because being in love is a wonderful feeling?

o ok i'll shut up now.

I still can't understand all the ilm love for this one. Are you all still listening to it?

1 Trans-Europe Express - Kraftwerk
2 Blue Lines - Massive Attack
3 Selected Ambient Works: 85-92 - Aphex Twin
4 Adventures Beyond the Ultraworld - The Orb
5 Dummy - Portishead
6 Ambient 1: Music For Airports - Brian Eno
7 Endtroducing... - DJ Shadow
8 Exit Planet Dust - The Chemical Brothers
9 Dig Your Own Hole - The Chemical Brothers
10 Homogenic - Bjork
11 Orbital 2 - Orbital
12 Substance - New Order
13 dubnobasswithmyheadman - Underworld
14 Innovator - Derrick May
15 76:14 - Global Communication
16 (Who's Afraid Of?) The Art of Noise - Art of Noise
17 Utd State 90 - 808 State
18 Homework - Daft Punk
19 Leftism - Leftfield
20 Music For The Masses - Depeche Mode
21 Maxinquaye - Tricky
22 Music Has The Right To Children - Boards of Canada
23 Bytes - Black Dog Productions
24 Everything Is Wrong - Moby
25 The White Room - KLF

So apparently to be overrated you must be
- British
- Ambient/IDM

49. The Stooges - Fun House
50. Nirvana - Nevermind

well they use electricity to power their amps, so counts!

revive

I feel like you could really go to town on some of the electronic albums of the intervening years - Burial, Darkstar, Forest Swords, Actress, Galcher Lustwerk, Andy Stott, Jam City etc but it's like shooting fish in a barrel at this stage.

let’s do it

let’s go to town

i agree w 6 of those 7 btw

galcher lustwerk has an album?

i think he has like five at this point if you count the side projects

http://galcherlustwerk.bandcamp.com/album/dark-bliss

i was into the first few singles (esp i neva seen and the one w “tape 22” on it) but i’m pretty over it now

Arca - literally everything he's recorded that hasn't been with Bjork, and at least half of the Bjork stuff as well

my feeling about arca has always been a very strong sense of idgi

galcher lustwerk is from my hometown so i'll have time for him, though i guess not enough to know he put out an album

the burial debut was interesting but i'm amazing anyone cared after that

i also don't get arca, borderline unlistenable imo

Logos - Cold Mission
Mumdance - Twists & Turns

Hell, anything they briefly tried to sell as 'grime' before everyone remembered what it was.

The entire discography of Jon Hopkins, Daniel Avery, most of Caribou etc.

burial had a hot streak until 2013 when it all started to sound rather samey

omg matt i revived this with hopkins and avery in mind!!!

CLARK

all of it

This is making me sound crankier than I am and tbh I like pretty much everything that isn't tepid 6music indietronica and screwfacey IDMised versions of actually exciting genres.

also uh

boards of canada - campfire headphase
boards of canada - tomorrow's harvest

prob the rest of them too but whatever

tepid 6music indietronica and screwfacey IDMised versions of actually exciting genres

first one has a place, i don't mind easy listening it just depends how indie i guess, second one is v v v v v otm

"it's like dancehall but shit!"

there is a lot of bad mumdance and the grime angle of logos is definitely oversold

but i will go to bat for mumdance & logos “different circles” mix

it is on apple music and spotify, give it a listen if you like heavy ambient, you won’t be dissapointed

only one mention of the orb in the original thread, smdh

i heard this new Orb single the other day and jfc my toes haven't uncurled yet

i thought of clark too ... he reminds me of that part in amadeus ... “too many notes”

I don't mind Hopkins, but the only thing he did I love was the King Creosote collaboration.

a lot of the idea of overrated is about being annoyed by the garrulous "seen the light" hypecitement of people first jumping onto a perceived new thing whereas when you come across stuff in the middle of a big mix of all sorts of other stuff it can be perfectly pleasant and enjoyable

I don't mind Hopkins, but the only thing he did I love was the King Creosote collaboration.

still not entirely sure what his contribution was there.

avery is pretty popular right? "song for alpha" what a terrible album name.

i'm gonna say the new errorsmith album. i want to hear the influences more than the cerebral take on them.

Jon Hopkins is fine and perfectly enjoyable as a sort of candyfloss background music but it's a mystery how he got so big (massive adverts on the Tube, glowing broadsheet reviews) when he's essentially rehashing the sort of thing Stefan Bodzin was rehashing from James Holden over a decade ago.

YES

I agree with the Jon Hopkins thing, it's good but I'm surprised it's so huge.

Logos - Cold Mission

This still sounds great imo. And Jam City. And Forest Swords. And Burial for that matter, even if he's influenced a lot of questionable stuff.

Arca's recent s/t is my favorite thing of his since his early EPs/mixtapes.

a lot of the idea of overrated is about being annoyed by the garrulous "seen the light" hypecitement of people first jumping onto a perceived new thing whereas when you come across stuff in the middle of a big mix of all sorts of other stuff it can be perfectly pleasant and enjoyable

― hepatitis groan (Noodle Vague), Thursday, May 10, 2018 3:38 PM (twenty minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yea otm

im also going to put flying lotus' entire discography here

mmm i like cosmogramma and you’re dead! but he seems like an ass and there’s a ton of equally good or better LA beatmakers

Search

Matmos
Herbert
Gudrun Gut
John Talabot
Talaboman
AGF.
Lappetites
Nina Kraviz
Clark
Belbury pol
Pye corner audio
Blondes
Kuedo

you're dead is ok. there are some incredible moments on a few of those records. but the rest ehhh

idk y’all galcher lustwerk has been pretty reliably good ime

the caretaker
nicolas jaar

yea I don't think I've ever really liked a FlyLo album. god knows I've tried

BOC seem like the right answer here, ooooh its fuzzed out and creepy and I guess that's kinda neat but I gotta go with the normie opinion that it's all about "Roygbiv"

boc are good if the idea of the soundtrack to "the changes" played backwards and combined with numbers stations sounds like a good idea to you

it sounds like a good idea to me

the caretaker
nicolas jaar

Good ones.

I still think FlyLo has a distinctive thing and makes records worth listening to, but yeah his persona has been a bummer.

I've never heard of Galcher Lustwerk.

BoC never really did it for me.

I like Tomorrow's Harvest, but it's fair to put it on here. It evokes very specific emotions for me, even though it doesn't really have a lot going on.

Fennesz - Endless Summer. Just never saw the appeal even tho the descriptions of it sounded all up in my alley.

is Tomorrow's Harvest overrated? apart from the publicity launch hoohah i thought it was poorly regarded by BOC fans and kind of indifferently received by the real world

for me it's a classic and possibly their best LP? as moodles says, "evokes very specific emotions", might not be technically that innovative but has a great deal of conceptual and emotional clout

i like that one Jon Hopkins song a lot, Open Eye Signal. The music video probably makes it work for me a lot better though tbh.

tomorrow's harvest does indeed evoke very specific emotions for me. mostly listening to it makes me want to kill myself.

ha

I feel like there's some weird calls on Ross' list - I have really fond memories of Herbert's Around the House, Bodily Functions and even 100 Lbs, but haven't listen to them for years (maybe they've aged really badly?). Blondes first two albums are dope. Matmos have done some great stuff, and Talabot's fin I could see people perhaps being less than enthused about, but I'm not sure it deserves to be listed as overrated.

100 lbs is the besy herbert imo!

best, even

But just so I'm contributing, and looking over recent releases, Daniel Avery strikes me as pretty overrated.

Also Caretaker and Nicolas Jaar get my vote.

UK lo-fi ironic house stuff like Ross from Friends, DJ Seinfeld and DJ Boring, although this could just be my own personal Spotify dilemma.

actually the best herbert is globus mix 5

then 100 lbs

i’m ok w calling the rest of it overrated

xp i have to ask - have you listened to much dj seinfeld, ross, dj boring, etc?

i was a naysayer for a while but then i got hooked - aside from the silly names they actually produce really legit house music

like there is very little that i would call “ironic” about their music

their names, yeah, are awful

Yeah, that mix is great - he had this real abrasive techno side mixed in with early microhouse.

The remixes comp from memory had some good stuff on it too.

They are all over my Daily Mixes by proximity to, I guess, 100% Silk stuff or Pacific Rhythm... so it comes on and sort of just passes me by. The names annoy me and the foggy production sorta seems beyond cliche at this point.

They are all playing at Field Day so tbh I was curious to see what they're like as DJs and prepared to make up my mind then.

But yes, the names are so bad, I couldn't help but mention them.

Actually, that DJ Seinfeld Shai remix actually did catch my ear, so perhaps I should pay the whole album some attention.

Actress's last album didn't do much for me but I still love his other full lengths. I rep hard for RIP and the misunderstood GHETTOVILLE.

(re: Matt DC's list)

and i'm so down for the lofi house/tech shit. here are a couple favs from last year:

dj swagger - lost
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iiVLmCA0qtE

no moon - everyting has a return
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19Jm_RdMq8Q

brb gonna listen to my favorite electronic musician, DJ Eddie Frasier's Dog

yeah actress is so dope

brimstead i started a lo fi house thread

word!

brb gonna listen to my favorite electronic musician, DJ Eddie Frasier's Dog

shurely DJ Eddie, Martin Crane's Dog?

DJ Eddie the Eagle from the Hilarious 1988 Winter Olympics

the possibilities are endless

the appeal of Jon Hopkins will remain forever a mystery to me

The Black Madonna, great personality in interviews and very much needed as a proud feminist figure in a male dominated scene, and her DJ sets aren't bad, but her own productions are really mediocre

Jamie XX - "hey guys here's an album full of my interpretations of really exciting dance music trends in recent years, only watered down to lifeless tempos with all the joy removed from the samples and a cloying sense of fake nostalgia"

I like a lot of early Bicep tracks and remixes but their album was just really formulaic and boring, not in a joyous and familiar way but in a predictable and unthrilling way

idk if around the house is overrated but it is a delightful airy late 90s house record

ime it sounds best when you're actually doing things to it, so it succeeds on the level of its concept

Mouse on Mars
Matmos
Orbital
Gas
Nicolas Jaar
The Orb
Arca

I don't actively hate any of them, except maybe Mouse on Mars (a little). And while I generally enjoy Arca's music, the s/t was just unbearably narcissistic.

Whoever said Actress is dead RONG.

Daft Punk, probably

Best Herbert is scale

Not sure what’s weird about my list

i agree w your list

What if you've never listened to this kind of music (typically preferred traditional song structure and guitars or whatever) and are now suddenly into it but know NOTHING about it? Is there a thread for Top 50 Most Properly Rated Electronic Albums?

I am dismayed to read that Andy Stott, Burial, and Actress are overrated. Like, do I have bad taste in electronic music? Those are all the ones I've been into recently, hahaha. Excited to check out DJ Mad About You, etc. I like dumb names. I think a lot of the reason I stayed so far away from electronic stuff is it seems to take itself SO seriously.

look this thread is not about what the correct ratings are, it’s just a place to dish about albums we don’t like

nothing personal abt your taste

everything personal about taste tho

i must note it is funny that you stayed away from electronic due to self seriousness but listen to actress burial and stott

xp my statement about my taste is not a statement about your taste

electronic music that tries to be funny is overrated

sorry lg I wasn't contradicting you I was adding to the thought

herbert is not overrated

DJ Stolling Rones. To me he is no more than just an overrated jerk who writes melodically dead emotionally dry music. The most overrated electronic act I know of, actually.

i will not be contradicted on my own thread revive

>:-(

i like arca, actress and andy stott. mouse on mars too

if there is one really highly rated thing that I’ve never really connected with - and god knows I’ve tried - it’s drexciya and their offshoots. Also I have come to realise that I don’t really give too much of a shit about wm. basinski

Future Sounds of London are so overrated. Good to see they’re slowly fading away, haven’t heard anyone namedrop them in years. Back in the late 90s early 00s they got namedropped a lot.

That’s Future Sound not Sounds

imo drexciya is fantastic up through grava 4 but there’s definitely an element of scraping the barrel with all of the posthumous releases

I like some of they’re songs like Papua New Guinea I assume that one sounded like some next level shit for someone back in the early 90s.

Their not they’re goddamn you cellphone

haha I'm listening to FSOL right now!

also I love Drexciya

Best Herbert is scale

― Ross, Friday, May 11, 2018 12:55 PM (one hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Agreed. Scale is one of my favorite albums!

I like most of the stuff itt tbh to some degree or other. What I would like is for people to state an album they feel is underrated next to the one they think is overrated, but it's not like I'm contributing anything so it's cool

that would be cool

I have never knowingly heard Boards of Canada.

i definitely don't get Nicolas Jaar

FSOL rules imo, i don't think people namedrop them much because tbh they're not very trendy. as much as i love them their peak albums are extremely '90s. also after Dead Cities they didn't really have much interest in going the traditional studio album release route, and i think compared to other artists who are were their contemporaries that results in them being overshadowed.

Accelerator/ISDN/Lifeforms/Dead Cities = classic. and Amorphous Androgynous, too!

Floating Points

Also never got very far with Hopkins, Arca or Actress for that matter. Filed under "not for me".

Probably stating the obvious but with so much electronic music out there anything that achieves a self-sustaining level of visibility is likely to be relatively 'overrated' to some degree, even if it is actually very good. With a concomitent amount of stuff being underrated, or as is more likely hardly heard at all.

I remember hearing Papa New Guinea and thinking it was pretty cool. was a bit crestfallen to find out right after that it was their big track

my intro to FSOL was via We Have Explosive. still love that one. also FSOL was my entry into Dead Can Dance via that PNG sample.

Tried to listen to Lifedorms recently and CBA with it. Their reworkings of that prog band (um, Syd Arthur) as Amorphous Androgynous a couple of years ago was OK. Playing to their strengths.

Apt typo ;-)

I was hugely into Papua New Guinea in the mid-90s, had the single and played it a lot, but never listened to anything else by FSOL until the 00s. Dunno why! I remember walking into a club as a student and PNG was playing and I had to find out who it was, luckily one of my friends knew it. This would've been at least 2 years after it came out tho, I was never really on the pulse with dance/electronic music, then or now tbh.

stakker humanoid is fsol too amirite? cos that is v klassic

def! that's right up my street that one.

FSOL was kind of big for a minute thanks to AMP, they received a lot of play on there. So did Adam F and Mocean Worker and others of that ilk. best show ever.

papa new guinea is an incredible track, up there w 808 state “pacific”

speaking of which ... never really got into much 808 beyond that beside ”flow coma” and “narcossa”

My controp is electronic music just keeps getting better.
Drop the old canon of aphex- boc. Autechre

Create Yr own canon

i would agree w/r/t bobbins, not so much w/r/t idm

Best Herbert is scale

― Ross, Friday, May 11, 2018 12:55 PM (one hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Agreed. Scale is one of my favorite albums!

― Evan, Friday, May 11, 2018 2:32 PM (twenty-six minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

not to be all drug bro but listening to this on acid with a friend and both of us gradually getting super creeped out by the dread underlying the bright disco surface of the album was a really memorable listening experience

Future Sounds of London are so overrated.

each to their own, but this is so wrong.

Nah man I see you xpost

xp i had the same type of experience listening to phish

re FSOL - I've never listened to anything later than Dead Cities, and I've heard that the later stuff is a bit shit? could that be the reason for the negativity, Moka did say late 90s/early 00s.

That’s when I started listening in. 1999 forwards, of course I listened to their previous record but that scene was nearing its expiry date by the early 00s. Again that’s just my pov. For someone older than me they were probably amazing back in the 90s

re FSOL - I've never listened to anything later than Dead Cities,

FSOL have not released another album of new material since that one (not incl. the various archive releases).
the other albums were released under their AA moniker which is a very different vibe - 60s psych etc.

Looks like The Isness was a Future Sound Of London release in the US?

To everyone to responded to me earlier: thank you - I completely agree! Really getting a kick out of reading this thread.

I started a Top 50 Most Properly Rated TechnoRavers thread if anyone wants to help me. Pretend it's '94, you're working at a record store, and a 14-year-old comes in with a Smashing Pumpkins shirt on talking about the Pavement Cut Your Hair video on MTV and wants to know more about that kind of music. Except, you know, electronic music.

Looks like The Isness was a Future Sound Of London release in the US?

yeah, this was a mess of a release.
they were forced to add the FSOL name to the release I believe in order to get it released.
but its an AA album.

FSOL have not released another album of new material since that one

what are all these "Environments" albums? archival stuff? there's a load of stuff on discogs.

officially they are archive releases.
though I believe one of them was supposedly new material.

some of the early ravey FSOL stuff is awesome. indo tribe, mental cube, "PNG" of course..

papa new guinea is an incredible track, up there w 808 state “pacific”

two things i always get mixed up.

"pacific" is, like, my theme song

FSOL's "Stolen Documents" (I think? It's on Robbie Hardkiss's Mixed Messages mix) is a great early track from them.Accelerator generally is pretty great, though not Frequencies or early Black Dog level.

yeah that’s a good one!

it’s the b side on the png single iirc

If you cut things off at about 1994 so much of the early work of (mostly UK) artists who generally are considered IDM or electronica just sounds like great, smart techno.

yeah true

Jon Hopkins' music does sound like iPhone commercial music (the consonance, tonality and epicness of it), but it does sound good - various rehashing of "Open Eye Signal" - the synthesizer sounds fat/immediate/saturated (filter cutoff gimmick esp.), timbrally sweet. The timbres are sometimes dry and magnified, the rhythms flow easy, and it has that stretching, pulling effect. For the average Radiohead fan, it could be a revelation--roughly the equivalent of somebody beginning to 'recognize' the quality of Autechre's music, but in one shot. It wears thin pretty quickly.

The Campfire Headphase is overrated? I thought that people equated it to Starbucks dining room music.

Kelly Lee Owens
M83
LCD Soundsystem
James Blake

Noooo I love the KLO album

Ricardo Villalobos is shit

DJ Koze too, shit

Ricardo Villalobos is shit

― the article don

the don speaks the truth

agree on koze

villalobos has moments - esp as a dj - but yeah he’s been in a rut and he was overrated to begin with

I mean the heavens didn’t exactly open up for me when I listened to Alcahofa but I’m not going to give anyone flack for having a 10/10 response to it.
Like, what do any of us stand to gain from saying “I like this thing less than the popular consensus” when that stems entirely from personal taste rather than anything inherently hateful about the thing

Other than venting, I suppose. Which I get on some level

we gain satisfaction from trolling u

OVERRATED: The Orb - Adventures Beyond the Ultraworld
UNDERRATED: Irresistible Force - It's Tomorrow Already

mixmaster morris definitely underrated

probably bcz he acts like an ass

my mixmaster morris pick would be global chillage and the one where all the title have the word high in them

Villalobos is awesome listen to some singles for once in your life ffs

Eat some funk

Villalobos himself probably hasn't listened to all the music he's made in the past ten years, and I object on principle to the kind of critical treatment that seeks to elevate him above other dance music producers as some kind of profound rule-breaking genius (though this has receded over about the same period as Villalobos' own output hit total critical mass). But a top twenty productions list (assuming we could all agree on its contents) would be straight fire.

The same is true to varying extents and in different ways for Moodymann, Theo Parrish, Autechre, Aphex Twin, arguably Terre Thaemlitz - all artists who get lauded as iconoclastic auteur geniuses and, well, it's understandable, but it also not my preferred way of thinking about any of them.

DJ Koze in a different category, at least for me: there's a middle stripe of amazing widescreen and inventive dance floor material that he puts out which I think is mindblowing, and then there's the more minimalist material he puts out that I think is fine but not necessarily that distinguishable from other similar producers, and the jokey stuff on the other side which is kind of whatever. I feel like his elevation to near iconoclastic genius category is almost an accident of history, a need to fill a void. It's interesting to imagine an alternate scenario where it wasn't Koze who ended up assuming that role but, I dunno, Kalabrese or someone.

(the obvious actual alternative is Maurice Fulton but I think a lot of people would say "yeah, but he is a genius tho")

middle stripe you mean middle brow

haha sure if you like

i think you are mostly otm except come on theo parrish really is a one of a kind madman

moodymann pretty overrated esp lately

he had his day when he was untouchable but he has been getting worse and worse for a long time now

Behead all Villalobos disbelievers.

Parrish is a bit like Carl Craig in that the critical treatment is still wrong but he almost makes it right (though for different reasons).

i like the comparison because a moody top 20 would indeed tower over 99% of deep house music but he has always also had misses (like any mere mortal) and he is treading water and i hate his lame persona

there is good villalobos for sure - i will rep for the au harem and fizheuer and his taka taka mix until i die

but he should have stopped a while ago

Yep

this here is villalobos at his finest

http://soundcloud.com/vander-funkinhausen/ricardo-villalobos-live-fabric

forever and eternal

tell me more about your views on parrish because i really think there is very little like his work post- american intelligence

actually a lot of his old stuff is really weird too

Look I have no problem with "non dancers" listening to electronica but just slow your roll when it comes to shitting on things because they don't give you emotions when you're half listening to them in your flat

808 Bass Queen is all time

The one that's like an epic hard remix of "computer world" is all time

But yeah the cult of singular genius wrt Villalobos is kinda annoying. He's produced a fair amount of awesome hypnotic tracks and also a few weird full length albums that are very good but of course overfawned upon

The whole Villalobos cult thing is really wild in that he's a good dj when he's really working it, and most of his album-length things are good, but I can't really point to a single album (as opposed to his body of work as a whole) that was really overrated. Long-term, best album lists maybe have Alcachofa on them and not much else? Maybe Achso or something was overrated but there doesn't seem to be much longevity of praise

Jon Hopkins and a few other acts are enjoyable but sound more like a synthesis of other sounds done in a more composer-centric way, or arranged like it's dancefloor-oriented electronic music for non-dance fans. That probably describes a large portion of overrated albums, though, especially when the styles that are being concentrated aren't really casual listening or album-centric.

Alcachofa was the closest Villalobos ever got to bending to the rules of the album as it exists in non-dance formats, but thankfully he never tried to make songs

it’s decent as a trad album, still love the TLS remix (cover!) of Dexter

One of the reasons Villalobos albums subsequent to the Fabric mix aren't specifically overrated is that there's probably only about one hundred people in the world who have listened to them any later than 6 months after their release date.

he’s kind of had three fitting that bill, and I honestly have meant to check out Empirical House but forgot, enjoyed Vasco, and forgot Dependent And Happy

he did the ECM remix thing with Max Loderbauer and it was mildly interesting, and I even saw it done live, but it’s not the fawning-over type of thing

and, tbh, Vasco felt like a double EP which is probably true of the latest

(Oh wait there was a Vasco EP1 with remixes and I bought that and not the “album”)

As for Parrish, I'm not sure I've heard everything post American Intelligence. Love "Leave The Funk To Us" (total Dinosaur L jam), think "Preacher's Comin" and "Gullah Geechee" and interesting more than they are lovable, from memory "Warrior Code" is great but I need to go back to check it again.

With Parrish I have this thing that, with the odd exception (like the Hand Made single) I tend not to be too enthused by the smaller releases and the like, but think each of First Floor, Parallel Dimensions and American Intelligence are amazing, so I wouldn't be surprised if the issue is me.

Best Herbert is scale

― Ross, Friday, May 11, 2018 12:55 PM (one hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Agreed. Scale is one of my favorite albums!

― Evan, Friday, May 11, 2018 1:32 PM (three days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

ugh

pop herbert

Best Herbert is Secondhand Sounds and Let's All Make Mistakes.

remix of Life Goes On! What an awful sleeve though, I hid mine!

i've come to the conclusion the only Herbert i really like is "Leave Me Now"

Best Herbert is 'Bodily Functions'

when i think about herbert i just remember that whole pig debacle and no i don't mean 'sow into you'

tim’s post about theo kinda mirrors my own approach to his work; i get so dazzled by the album projects that anything surrounding it i kinda end up missing

Endtroducing has not aged well.

maybe not but the early shadow singles r still dope imo

Agreed but Private Press has aged surprisingly well imo

Endtroducing has not aged well.

Agreed but Private Press has aged surprisingly well imo

Couldn't disagree more with both of these statements!

yup

agree (with Against The 80s)

but i'm so not against the 80s

best herbert

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3FNi8kQwAY

I'm not saying it's bad, just that it feels like a time capsule.

pop herbert

― Listen to my homeboy Fantano (D-40), Monday, May 14, 2018 2:36 AM (twelve hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

so?

Trans Canada Highway is what Campfire Headphase should've been.

the cool thing about Tomorrow's Harvest and Dead Cities is that you could swap their track titles and they'd still be appropriate!

JIV that is some generic fast fashion bullshit house Herbert and you should know better

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjUnO0BKZMA

Pick something that at least exhibits his trivial experiments in kitchen-tools-as-sample-fodder

Actress wins this hands down just based on this decade and I love a bunch of his tracks. Ditto Laurel Halo - found her last three albums mostly dud.

Oh and def. Bicep.

Another electronic movement that seemed really cool back in the 90’s but sounds lame in retrospective is Big Beat. It’s most respected album might be Dig your own hole by Chemical Brothers and that one is mostly duds and two or three decent songs, definitely overrated.

That scene was never really intellectualised though (as opposed to D&B or 'Trip hop') which always made it harder (for me at least) to think of any albums from it as over-rated as opposed to just dated within a few years.

yea even when Dig Your Own Hole came out I think most people knew it was a passing fad. album still bangs though. sounds better than all the stuff inspired by it

Also: Their trick to stretch out a song for two or eight more minutes is to add an annoying flanger effect to the loop.

Actress this decade has been amazing imo

Thanks for putting 'Song To The Siren' back in my head for the first time in a while :) xp

endtroducing is not overrated imo

lots of kompakt was overrated

the field especially

yea I never got the fawning over the first Field record. a lot of people's minds were blown that he sampled Lionel Richie, I guess. I feel like people are doing way more interesting stuff in the vaporwave space these days.

this thread is deeply lame

kompakt ughghghugh stop calling dry dance music overrated godammit

they do put out pop stuff like the field sometimes yes

big beat owns

Endtroducing is weird record for me cause I really like it to this day but never got why it caught on like it did and got hailed as a masterpiece.

brimstead otm

also not really an albums genre, Chems and How To Operate With A Blown Mind aside

isolee 'wearemonster' got overrated imo, 'rest' was way better but critical attention was inversely proportionate

Nicolas Jaar, Ricardo Villalobos, Actress, and early Isolee is incredibly overrated. Still really enjoy some stuff from all these guys though.

Oval, Pole, ~scape records, and Clicks'n'Cuts (early 2000's glitch) scene was so overrated I kinda swore off of electronic/IDM for a half decade and listened to a ton of indie rap and electro instead.

I still rep for Pole's 1/2/3 because I had surgery and was laid up for a week and mildly drugged up and I just sat around listening to all of them on a loop and staring at a textured wall and intermittently napping

you know what was good was snd's first album

even the good posts in this thread are marred by the premise of it. i feel like "overrated" is such a one-dimensional concept especially when applied to electronic music where the ratedness is so marginal and in-the-moment in the first place. when it arises it comes from a rock perspective which is just deeply lame. and the less serious variety is like cyclical revulsion/nostalgia, "what were people thinking from 2003-2007" or w/e.

it makes me think of the pipecock era, or when i was just getting into dancier and blacker music and sort of trying to digest the history of it, when it was like there were these gradients of what is and isn't ok to like among different types of fans. i know a little bit more now and have a better sense of what kind of fan i am and i can think of a bunch of more rewarding ways to engage with what people think about electronic music from their past than "overrated" ffs.

this guy, yeah

I love Pole 1,2, 3

I think the problem is that in electronic music overated and dated go hand in hand and it’s almost impossible for electronic-based music not too sound dated a few months after release because it’s one of the first genres to take risks gear-wise and to create production tricks that tend to permeate and influence every other genre when succesful.

Per example a genre like rock is very backwards-thinking and your casual rock listener basically treats classic rock as a noble class. In which every new rock band has to know precisely where they come from and they are expected
to tribute (or shamelessly steal from) the gods that came before them.

electronic music doesn’t have a fetish with influences and roots but with technology. It’s almost designed to keep looking forward, everytime new experimental music software and hardware is created the first genre that is assumed will raise its hand is electronica. This ultimately results in loads of novelty music and effects that sound mindblowing when premiered but sound dated soon when every act (even outside electronica) starts using the same software presets.

a record with a friendly feeling and serene vibes that decrees a bank holiday for the receptors in the brain, that is never dated! especially if there is a miscreant glint in its eye, that is eternal!

Pole 2 is okay, 1 and 3 were just felt like relatively lazy creative efforts with few if any tunes leaving any memorable impact. I will confess more than a few songs on 2 felt interesting and memorable, and blended rhythm and melody better than the others. However, the overall style and quality of the 3 albums could be expressed in an EP to satisfaction. That's all well and good, many artists put out samey albums with minimal creative development among them and rehash ideas in unexciting ways. But damn, the press those records got at the time far exceeded the quality of what was actually on wax for my ears. Which is why I brought them up.

But I will agree that this thread is an unproductive one. Most music could be construed "overrated" regardless of genre. Where's the "underrated" thread?

Also: Their trick to stretch out a song for two or eight more minutes is to add an annoying flanger effect to the loop.

ha, all my failed 90s attempts to make music do this trick too

not sure if I got it from them or if it's just because (unlike many other effects) flanging a drum loop is easy and fun to play with in 90s tracker software

I still rep for Pole's 1/2/3 because I had surgery and was laid up for a week and mildly drugged up and I just sat around listening to all of them on a loop and staring at a textured wall and intermittently napping

this is a v good way to listen to records ime

(not electronic but) my maybe-favourite Oneida record "The Wedding" isn't anyone else's favourite Oneida record iirc, but it is the one that was on the 3-disc changer during my week off after surgery, drifting in and out of awakeness/awareness, dosed up with a big bag of synthetic opiates

even the good posts in this thread are marred by the premise of it. i feel like "overrated" is such a one-dimensional concept especially when applied to electronic music where the ratedness is so marginal and in-the-moment in the first place. when it arises it comes from a rock perspective which is just deeply lame. and the less serious variety is like cyclical revulsion/nostalgia, "what were people thinking from 2003-2007" or w/e.

― you bet, nancy (map)

like i said in the other thread, most of the stuff in this thread, including stuff i've contributed, is stuff i enjoy and think is good. when i talk about "overrated" i do talk about it from a rock perspective because, one, i come from a rock background, and two, most of the "overrating" does seem to come from a rock mindset - favoring albums, etc. you know what it reminds me of, actually? people who will insist with a straight face that frank zappa is the best 20th century composer. most of the people who say that haven't heard very many 20th century composers!

But I will agree that this thread is an unproductive one. Most music could be construed "overrated" regardless of genre. Where's the "underrated" thread?

― octobeard

it's called "house and techno bobbins 2018", it's full of great stuff, check it out

there are others as well, techno/house bobbins of the past, basically anything saer posts

they're not called "underrated" but i think that's probably for the best

you know what was good was snd's first album

― you bet, nancy (map), Wednesday, May 16, 2018 8:21 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

fuck yeah

the worst thing about this thread is people shitting on whole artists for not producing albums that sound like Discovery or something

the thread is for ALBUMS

Clicks and Cuts was and still is great fuiud

That reminds me: Discovery

I saw snd live and man sounded like sandpaper on wax

Mark Fell is God, afaic

it makes me think of the pipecock era, or when i was just getting into dancier and blacker music and sort of trying to digest the history of it, when it was like there were these gradients of what is and isn't ok to like among different types of fans. i know a little bit more now and have a better sense of what kind of fan i am and i can think of a bunch of more rewarding ways to engage with what people think about electronic music from their past than "overrated" ffs.

― you bet, nancy (map), Wednesday, May 16, 2018 11:43 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

even tho i have participated itt in prob dumb ways i think u are otm

also rush otm too when he said itt or maybe the other one that all these albums are worth listening to, imo nothing we are saying here really has to do w/ the music itself anyways. if you love those clark albums then i am ultimately very happy for you

btw i love those pole albums

def think a most underrated albums thread would be more useful

or a "random old electronic music you're loving" one

JIV that is some generic fast fashion bullshit house Herbert and you should know better

― El Tomboto, Tuesday, May 15, 2018 9:34 PM (two days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

house music is good

i made an album all of samples taken at a mcdonalds and it's a comment on capitalism is less good

eh i like this thread lol even though its full of people being wrong

don't get re albums that supposedly sound dated re electronica.
I mean, I still listen to Kraftwerk/Yello/Cabs/Pedro/Prefuse 73 etc a lot.
if its good upon release, then its good a few years later even if there are new generations of software that may be better now.

More about changing styles/aesthetics imo

but that happens in every genre

isolee 'wearemonster' got overrated imo, 'rest' was way better but critical attention was inversely proportionate

Though production techniques can factor in...some end up sounding 'timeless' or 'classic' because they keep getting re-used, others are popular for a minute and then not so much (like sidechain compressing everything to the kick drum, or glitchy Pro Tools sample chopping all over the place, or putting mid-tempo breakbeats through guitar pedals in a way that sounds very '90s, etc)

xp

but that happens in every genre

Exactly?

ok thought we were saying electronic stuff gets pegged as dated more than other genres and positing theories as to why

that was Moka's post i dont really agree w it either

100% agree w/r/t Isolee. Rest is much better than wearemonster, but perhaps the people who loved wearemonster were new to the genre and so they overvalued the album because they weren't around for the release of Rest.

it's an obvious point but dance music can get just as caught up in roots and tradition as others musics, like deep house for ex

it's not all "must generate new alien sounds"

I think stuff that's using a brand new instrument or tool gets pegged to a time... until there's a revival a couple decades later and then people marvel about how "contemporary" something sounds

sometimes it's just revisiting older sounds, but other times it's enthusiasm for something new that's a different take

for instance, all the eurorack stuff now

do I need to dig around and find out what eurorack is ?

it’s a modular synth system

someone had the genius idea to come up with a standard form factor/voltage/specified cable for modular synth units so you can put them all in a little box or cabinet and plug them all together using the same cables

you've heard a bunch of stuff in recent years made that way, trust me

it's the thule roofbars of synth

you've heard a bunch of stuff in recent years made that way, trust me

I have no doubt that's true.
however, I have never heard that phrase before.
ta.

someone had the genius idea to come up with a standard form factor/voltage/specified cable for modular synth units so you can put them all in a little box or cabinet and plug them all together using the same cables

Robert Moog did that in 1964!

"today" is my jam off wearemonster, so so dope

xp yeah, but someone had that genius idea again in the mid 90s

and thus the cycle of modular synth rises again

btw the coolest niche thing now is the vcv rack software, which in a recursive manner, emulates and gives people a way to build modular synths in software and wire them up. other software has done it but this is a pretty cool framework

link for a nice example https://www.facebook.com/groups/vcvrack/permalink/184204178906401/

Mark Fell is God, afaic

― brimstead, Thursday, May 17, 2018 5:16 PM (two days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

^

like for all of the interviews he gives where he's just so anti-dancing (yawn), he sure has made some v. funky (and gorgeous) music

Wearemonster generated a lot of buzz at the time but it doesn't seem to have lasted in the critical memory in the way that, say, Alcachofa has. Isolee in general now feels like one of those producers who made so many great, detail-packed records and now gets overlooked in the rush to lay hosannas on Villalobos as the crowning auterish genius of his era.

(Beau Mot Plage has lasted, obviously, but individual tracks rarely feel over or underrated in the way that albums do)

I like a lot of early Bicep tracks and remixes but their album was just really formulaic and boring, not in a joyous and familiar way but in a predictable and unthrilling way

Yeah. I bought the album purely on the strength of seeing it appear several times in the ILM 'best of 2017' poll, not previously having heard a note of it. I was quite dismayed by how pedestrian it is. Probably the first time that the hivemind has let me down.

"probably the first time that the hivemind has let me down"

If that was only your first time, you're in for a world of hurt

challop: SAW 2 is 85% meh

I have a bunch of Thomas Koner CDs that I picked up because The Wire was all over them, and I'm still not sure just what the hell I'm supposed to be hearing! (The Porter Ricks stuff is pretty good, though.)

Wearemonster generated a lot of buzz at the time but it doesn't seem to have lasted in the critical memory in the way that, say, Alcachofa has. Isolee in general now feels like one of those producers who made so many great, detail-packed records and now gets overlooked in the rush to lay hosannas on Villalobos as the crowning auterish genius of his era.

― Matt DC, Saturday, May 19, 2018 4:49 AM (six hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

this to me feels like a better example of 'overrated' than villalobos for that reason kinda? like, i also actually want to listen to achso but not wearemonster

that said 'rest' is pretty awesome to me still in the way that mid 00s villalobos is

I've always felt that way about SAW2

köner is awesome
thirded on the SAW2 "what gives?"

I agree with the post upthread to the effect that a lot of the excitement around Wearemonster was catch-up for people who missed Rest the first time around. The former is still a great record IMO, but Isolee's "auteur" period was really in the years leading up to and culminating with Rest (see also the early singles, many of which ended up on Western Stores, and stuff like the remix of Blaze's "Lovelee Dae").

There's still total classic tracks in the following years like the "Lent" and "Sweet Chat Rio" remixes from 2003, and especially the "Cardiology" and "Africa / Brazil" remixes from 2004, but they're more like superb dancefloor articulations of all of the producer's assembled tricks and tactics (no surprises that this stuff is often my favourite Isolee) (actually in retrospect Playhouse really missed a trick by not putting out a remixes collection at about that point).

The fact that Isolee was really an auteur in the years before the microhouse / minimal crossover means that, while Wearemonster arguably was overrated on release, Isolee as an artist is now underrated - perhaps because more people had the luxury of following the tail end of Villalobos' classic era in real time, it's easier to think of his work as "important" in a way that is less obvious for Isolee.