The Anthony Bourdain thread

This sentence remains assez opaque to me.

I loved the contrast between his self-identification as a 'no bullshit' kinda guy and the realization that he's with a lot of other quite lucky people in a nice hotel, swimming and getting a tan while they 'await their fate'. Bourdain's life, of late has seemed a paradise: food, drink, drugs, travel, but all of a sudden he was forced to come to terms with the fact that he's livin' the high life, comparatively.

It doesn't seem so silly if you've seen the episode, and know Bourdain's general attitude toward war and the military, ans especially not if you share his views. He's not a big fan of war, is critical of our government, but was himself stunned by the generosity, personability, and machine-like competency of the US Marines. These are really good people, he said in no uncertain terms.

http://www.salon.com/mwt/feature/2006/07/28/bourdain_beirut/

Our military excels in far more in just killing people. That's what I got that I don't often get elsewhere.

i've heard lots of bad shit about some of the military, but the marines are generally thought of as a different caliber. they seem to demonstrate this on the USS nashville, and in a different way than expected. they're thought of as so hardcore and badass, and here they are described over and over as compassionate and kind as they efficiently evacuate lots of freaked-out and confused people.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/discussion/2006/07/25/DI2006072501108.html?sub=AR

I read A Cook's Tour recently and really liked it.

i like anthony bourdain a lot. i still have never eaten at les halles, mainly because it seems overpriced for what it is - howEVA - i NEVER eat fish at restaurants on mondays now because of him (don't know whether i'm grateful or annoyed by this)

I knew there was a reason behind my kneejerk attitude toward this dude.

Actually, most of my antipathy is just because the Chicago thread talks about him all the time, and I had no idea who he was or why I should care about him.

Sorry, Kenan.

and i'll fourth the fish tip!

hahah me too.
-- s1ocki (slytus...), Today 11:33 AM. (slutsky)

Some fish markets/distributors are open on Monday! Maybe not on the East Coast but elsewhere in the world Monday is just dandy.

But Bourdain is definitely telling you something: go out Tuesday/Fridays for fish.

I’m okay with people who are horrified by cruelty to animals. I understand that completely. Who isn’t? Well, a lot of people aren’t, but I am.

She wrinkled her nose & said "My husband loves him, I'm only here because of him. I just want to see if he's clean."

When I asked her what she meant she smiled in this deranged way and said primly "He looks so dirty on TV. I just came to see if he's clean in real life, or if he really is that dirty."

I swear, she's the single weirdest person I've ever encountered.

I can just picture her snapping on a white cotton glove & giving him the 'finger test' at the signing table....

No.

I like A.B., from what I'v read. And I totally support Nice Guys in the Military, but I support neither the gov't nor the "military."

Also, Dan's right -- I've spent some time in commercial kitchens, and he pretty much nails it.

When I first read Kitchen Confidential I loved it because it showed the Way It Really Is. Now I hate Bourdain because he is an example of The Way It Really Is. He is just the sort of macho, self-aggrandizing, control freak that plagues too many restaurant and makes life miserable for the rest of the staff including waiters, managers, cooks, runners, bussers, and even owners.

I think my breaking point was when I saw Bourdain on The Restaurant, dining at Rocco's in NY with another chef, talking some crap about "Chefs embody madmen, visionaries and artists, all in one body..." as the camera spun and zoomed giddily about them. Blarf.

That said, I have never tasted Bourdain's food, and from what I have heard he's a good, workmanlike chef but not a truly special one. He seems to know his French comfort food, which is still better than what most of America ever eats.

But whatever, he's not even a chef anymore, he's a full-time writer and TV personality. Fuck TV -- he's a professional personality. I happen to like this personality. Some will not.

So I like Bourdain, but only when he is eating durian.

The fish tip doesn't hold true right across the board though, where I work we sell out of stuff over the weekend, so a fresh fish delivery arrives on Monday.

maybe this is why Friday has always =ed "fish day"?

"is everybody happy? well i should say!"

At my former workplace (an upscale fish restaurant) deliveries came in fresh every day except Sunday. And they weren't frozen. And this was in Chicago.

Monday had very fresh fish since we ran out of a lot of stuff on Sunday.

So, suck, Bourdain.

No.

Evan, half the people on this thread also post on the Chicago thread. QED.

I wonder why Les Halles and Bourdain would order that way. If weekends are amateur nights, wouldn't you want to serve the amateurs the 2nd rate stuff and have fresh seafood for your more discerning patrons?

(I grant that this is complete speculation about a business that I am not running, but still.)

So did Steve Shasta upthread!

I think it's worth pointing out that in our kitchen we're all very polite to each other, and even to the floor staff for that matter. That said, I like Bourdain. He loves food, and that's what it's all about.

haha!

He's turning into a hippy with each new season/show though.

Any thoughts on The Nasty Bits, his newest book, a collection of magazine pieces? Enjoyed it, especially the endnotes where he cops to where he was wrong in each.

He rocks.

Well, his marriage fell apart because he was traveling all the time. He was not happy about that.

"I want a maple bacon doughnut."

OR

"I feel like I've been fisting Shamu the killer whale."

And I get to seethe about how much I hate Bourdain, even though I've never read a word he's written or seen him on TV. It wouldn't surprise me to learn that ILX invented him so that certain posters had an arrogant semi-celebrity to fashion themselves after.

(xpost: I think he's saying that he has issues with a personality type that he imagines both AB and certain ILXors to represent, whether or not they in fact do)

NOBODY ASKED ME, BUT……
By Anthony Bourdain

I actually WATCH Food Network now and again, more often than not drawn in by the progressive horrors on screen. I find myself riveted by its awfulness, like watching a multi-car accident in slow motion. Mesmerized at the ascent of the Ready-Made bobblehead personalities, and the not-so-subtle shunting aside of the Old School chefs, I find myself de-constructing the not-terrible shows, imagining behind the scenes struggles and frustrations, and obsessing unhealthily on the Truly Awful ones. Screaming out loud at Sandra Lee in disbelief as she massacres another dish, then sits grinning, her face stretched into a terrifying rictus of faux cheer for the final triumphant presentation. I mourn for Mario..and Alton...Bobby and yes--even Emeril, nobly holding the fort while the TV empire he helped build crumbles like undercooked Bundt cake into a goo of Cheez Wiz around him.

Some thoughts on the Newer, Younger, More Male-Oriented, More Dumb-Ass Food Network:

ALTON BROWN: How did Alton slip inside the wire--and stay there all these years? He must have something on them. He’s smart. You actually learn something from his commentary. And I’ll admit it: I watch and enjoy Iron Chef America-in all its cheesy glory. Absolutely SHOCKED and thrilled when guys like Homaru Cantu show up as contestants--and delighted when Mario wins--again and again, forestalling his secretly long-planned execution. His commentary is mostly good. And that collar-bone snapping fall off the motorcycle on Feasting On Asphalt? Good television!

EMERIL: I’m actually grateful when I channel surf across his show. He’s STILL there--the original Behemoth. And I STILL find him unwatchable. As much mileage as I’ve gotten over the years, making fun of Emeril; he deserves a lot more respect than I’ve given him. He does run a very successful and very decent restaurant group. He is--in fact--a really nice guy. And-as much as I hate the show-- compared to the current crop of culinary non-entities, he looks like Escoffier. He will probably be the last of the Real Chefs. I’m sure they’re growing future replacement options in petrie dishes somewhere, conducting Top Secret focus groups at suburban malls with their latest Bright Young Hopeful. I’m just glad he’s still there--a rebuke to the geniuses who brought us such Great Ideas as Dweezil and Lisa.

BOBBY FLAY: They seem to have noticed Bobby’s strong “negatives” among some viewer responses during focus groups--and decided to respond by subjecting poor Bobby to THROWDOWN; the object of which is to allow every web-fingered geek with a backyard grill--or half-mad muffin maker to proclaim, “I beat Bobby Flay at makin’ barbeque!” at the heart-warming end of show--before returning to tend their meth labs.. I watched poor Bobby battle to a draw recently in some bogus Southwestern “Chili Face-Off.” Now…does ANYONE actually believe that Bobby Flay can’t make a better chili than a supermarket ground beef bearing amateur? I don’t. It’s a cruel exercise in humiliation. A variation on “Dunk Bozo” or “Shoot The Geek,” at the carnival. And whatever I might have thought of Flay’s previous TV efforts, I find the network’s misuse of one of their founding chefs to be nauseatingly cynical. The conspiratorial-minded might be tempted to suspect this as yet another part of the Secret Plan to rid themselves of the annoyingly big ticket chefs--by driving Bobby to quit--or insane with misery. He may not be Mr. Cuddlesworth, but he’s a successful businessman and a good chef--and he doesn’t, after all, need this shit.

MARIO!
Oh, Mario! Oh great one! They shut down Molto Mario--only the smartest and best of the stand-up cooking shows. Is there any more egregiously under-used, criminally mishandled, dismissively treated chef on television? Relegated to the circus of Iron Chef America, where--like a great, toothless lion, fouling his cage, he hangs on--and on--a major draw (and often the only reason to watch the show). How I would like to see him unchained, free to make the television shows he’s capable of, the Real Mario--in all his Rabelasian brilliance. How I would love to hear the snapping bones of his cruel FN ringmasters, crunching between his mighty jaws! Let us see the cloven hooves beneath those cheery clogs! Let Mario be Mario!

THAT ACE OF CAKES GUY: Hey…He’s got talent! And..he seems to be a trained chef! And he’s really making food--and selling it in a real business! I think…I like it! If I have one reservation, it’s that I have no idea if the stuff actually TASTES good. It LOOKS really creative and quirky--and I’m interested but…I mean...it’s like construction going on over there from what we’re told and shown. One suspects that the producers don’t want to waste valuable time talking about anything so technical as food--on “Food” Network. I mean...what’s in those cakes, beneath the icing and marzipan and fondant? That said, it’s the only “kicky, new, cutting edge, in-your-face” hopeful they’ve managed to trot out of any quality in memory. Hope it lasts. Wait till they try and put the poor bastard on a pony--or do a “Tailgate Special” with the usual suspects. Or a “Thanksgiving Special” where he has to sit down with the bobbleheads and pretend to like it. On balance, it’s still probably the best new project they’ve come up with in a long, long time.

GIADA: What’s going on here!? Giada can actually cook! She was robbed in her bout versus Rachael Ray on ICA. ROBBED! And Food Net seems more interested in her enormous head (big head equals big ratings. Really!) and her cleavage--than the fact that she’s likeable, knows what she’s doing in an Italian kitchen--and makes food you’d actually want to eat. The new high concept Weekend Getaway show is a horrible, tired re-cap of the cheap-ass “Best Of” and “40 Dollar a Day” formula. Send host to empty restaurant. Watch them make crappy food for her. Have her take a few lonely, awkward stabs at the plate, then feign enjoyment with appropriately orgasmic eye-closing and moaning..Before spitting it out and rushing to the trailer. Send her to Italy and let her cook. She’s good at it.

RACHAEL: Complain all you want. It’s like railing against the pounding surf. She only grows stronger and more powerful. Her ear-shattering tones louder and louder. We KNOW she can’t cook. She shrewdly tells us so. So...what is she selling us? Really? She’s selling us satisfaction, the smug reassurance that mediocrity is quite enough. She’s a friendly, familiar face who appears regularly on our screens to tell us that “Even your dumb, lazy ass can cook this!” Wallowing in your own crapulence on your Cheeto-littered couch you watch her and think, “Hell…I could do that. I ain’t gonna…but I could--if I wanted! Now where’s my damn jug a Diet Pepsi?” Where the saintly Julia Child sought to raise expectations, to enlighten us, make us better--teach us--and in fact, did, Rachael uses her strange and terrible powers to narcotize her public with her hypnotic mantra of Yummo and Evoo and Sammys. “You’re doing just fine. You don’t even have to chop an onion--you can buy it already chopped. Aspire to nothing…Just sit there. Have another Triscuit…Sleep….sleep….”

PAULA DEEN: I’m reluctant to bash what seems to be a nice old lady. Even if her supporting cast is beginning to look like the Hills Have Eyes--and her food a True Buffet of Horrors. A recent Hawaii show was indistinguishable from an early John Waters film. And the food on a par with the last scene of Pink Flamingos. But I’d like to see her mad. Like her look-alike, Divine in the classic, “Female Trouble.“ Paula Deen on a Baltimore Killing Spree would be something to see. Let her get Rachael in a headlock--and it’s all over.

SANDRA LEE: Pure evil. This frightening Hell Spawn of Kathie Lee and Betty Crocker seems on a mission to kill her fans, one meal at a time. She Must Be Stopped. Her death-dealing can-opening ways will cut a swath of destruction through the world if not contained. I would likely be arrested if I suggested on television that any children watching should promptly go to a wooded area with a gun and harm themselves. What’s the difference between that and Sandra suggesting we fill our mouths with Ritz Crackers, jam a can of Cheez Wiz in after and press hard? None that I can see. This is simply irresponsible programming. Its only possible use might be as a psychological warfare strategy against the resurgent Taliban--or dangerous insurgent groups. A large-racked blonde repeatedly urging Afghans and angry Iraqis to stuff themseles with fatty, processed American foods might be just the weapon we need to win the war on terror.

AND FINALLY: Some IRON CHEF AMERICA match-ups I’d REALLY like to see:

-Mario Batali (with one arm tied behind his back--and drunk) vs. Regina Schrambling
-Michael Ruhlman, swacked on Ripple, vs. John Mariani-- in a Charcuterie Challenge
-Grant Achatz vs. That Guy In Australia Who Ripped off his recipes as his own
-Marco Pierre White vs. Gordon Ramsay
-Charlie Trotter vs. Martin Picard (Chicken Livers vs. Foie Gras)
-Chris Cosentino, Fergus Henderson, Martin Picard vs. Alain Passard, Roxanne Klein and Charlie Trotter (Cooked vs. Raw Challenge)
-Martha Stewart vs. Rachael Ray (bare knuckle cage match)
-Ducasse vs. Robuchon
-“Mikey” from Top Chef vs. Sandra Lee

Video Gold!

White v Ramsay wouldn't be much of a contest these days, sadly. Marco's too busy doing the whole well-fed Venetian Prince thing, and good for him.

Crapulence.

Something about it really struck me, it exactly described the pleasure I get out of spending a Sunday making stock, or braising a beef dish, or, like last week, spending the day making pork tamales. Just a little paragraph summed up everything I love about cooking.

And his Food Network rant sums it up pretty well. Hooray for PBS.

I love the bit where he rants about how if you can't roast a chicken, you have to just pack it in. Cooking is not for you.

I only just now got around to reading The Nasty Bits and his essay how raw food adherents who fear "toxins" and "impurities" are interchangeable with xenophobic tourists who fear anything served outside the hotel restaurant because it might be "dirty" or "ooky" was so OTM that I blurted out "OTM!" when I read it.

I felt the same about the "Bottoming Out" essay abt junkies & downward spirals, but that could be because a friend of a friend had attempted suicide like two days before. Gah.

I just went and bought this, didn't even know it existed.

There was some giveaway that Tep found out about last year -- I got my copy for free!

The Portland/Seattle No Reservations is great, my favorite of the series so far.

cleveland with mawky ramone and harv pekar on this monday

it's a repeat, it was pretty fun.

I like the Portland/Seattle one lots, but he doesn't quite capture the spirit of the latter the way I see it. The geoduck-digging location is great, but the only really Seattle-proper-feeling part of it for me is when he's walking along those Capitol Hill-looking houses en route to the private dinner.

Sorta the same with the Cleveland one - I think it's great, but I dunno how I'd feel if I were from there.

heck, I was dissapointed with the NY one. It needed more queens/brooklyn love, not to mention bronx/staten island. Glad the went to the Red Hook Ballfields and Kebab Cafe, but a NY episode and no Difaras Pizza? I don't like the need to be a "travel" show and do stuff like spend 10 minutes of him doing circus acrobatics. More food please.

I don't like the need to be a "travel" show and do stuff like spend 10 minutes of him doing circus acrobatics. More food please.

I suspect that since the show is on the Travel Channel, that there's some impetus to keep it away from being all 100% food. The LA show was the same... 15 minutes of him hanging around roller girls and the cops, blah blah blah

Anyone see the ep where he almost broke his neck on the ATV?

i don't have a problem with the skip-the-sights-and-look-for-the-soul approach, but I think the result is usually better when he lets locals do the looking for him

I think there were a fair number of complaints in A Cook's Tour about the bs he has had to put up with while filming the show. That and details about all the off-air stuff they couldn't show.

this guy is corny as hell, but i think his overall attitude to food and life and other parts of the world is pretty good. and my older brother is way into him.

as a food/travel show guy i'd put him ahead of andrew zimmern and even with mark bittman

That Bizarre Foods show (the Andrew Zimmern one) is horrible, though! For all of Bourdain's faux-spiritual dialog and going on about respecting local culture, Zimmern has this annoying-as-hell thing where you're supposed to think "OMG HE'S CRAZY TO EAT THAT" every episode! It's like taking the sideshow from Bourdain's show, that some foods are going to be kind of weird to western eyes, and making a whole half hour out of showboating it.

zimmerman sucks.

actually i think zimmern isn't all that googly-eyed zany about all the wierd shit he eats. he's pretty respectful, actually! considering yeah it's basically an engrish gross-out show. but as a host i don't like him much, a little too dorky.

He's respectful, but that doesn't mean that he escapes the show's premise!

china episodes are the best. hong kong is perfect and the beijing/chengdu and shanghai/yunnan. and japan episodes, back to a cook's tour and the weird rural cambodia/tokyo half-half one. singapore's cool. a cook's tour is always tight, no lameshit immunity challenge filler shit with roller derby and skeet shooting, fuck that shit, but sometimes too tight, none of the 10 minutes in a beijing sheep guts restaurant segments that i like. and the dude on a cook's tour is less tanned and weathered and professional and more naive and genuinely excited about shit, "oh fuck i'm eating a bento box on a bullet train."

i really liked those gaucho dudes in argentinia

i hate zimmerwhatever. i've only seen a couple of episodes, but i found it pretty meanspirited not to mention tame. so you tried a bite of guinea pig - big whoop.

see that's the thing, the SHOW is like that by design, but i get the feeling that ZIMM doesn't feel or act that way. i think he really is goofily excited and interested in grub worms and snake pancreas or whatever -- but still, i don't like him much, for other reasons

zimm = kid on the playground who would eat worms

also chaki otm re: gauchos, I want to go to Argentina even more now

he went to Patagonia right? I need to see that one.

the bit where bourdain got a real-deal tribal tattoo and had this amazing looking chicken way up in the hills in malaysia (i think?) elicited a complicated you are a douchebag/wow that's beautiful reaction from me.

The Tuscany episode was pretty awe inspiring too.

lauren Zimmern eats much crazier shit than guinnea pig. The fried bat was pretty nasty, for starters.

I like him, I think he's goof and fun, but after seeing a few episodes, it's just not that interesting. Once you've seen him eat every kind of bug there's not much left.

tonight's Bourdain repeat in Uzbekistan was ok, had some fun stuff in it, I'm guessing the food isn't all that great because they spent about 5 minutes eating!

Roffles -- the actual post is here but is being swamped, so:

Just got back from seeing Anthony Bourdain in in the city, and it was an absolute treat. He is every bit as much fun as you would imagine him to be. Lots of good and useful stuff in the talk, but two stick in my mind:

1. Truffle oil is the ketchup of the newly affluent.
2. To find good places to eat, provoke the nerds.

#2 showed a remarkably precise understanding of the internet. The question at hand was how to find good restaurants, and his answer was to take the city you want to go to and just google up some restaurant names that serve the dish you’re after. Then got to chowhound or another foodie site, and rather than asking about restaurants, you put up an enthusiastic post talking about how you just had the best whatever you’re looking for at one of these restaurants.

At that point, what drivingblind likes to call the nerdfury will begin. Posters will show up from nowhere to shower you with disdain, tell you how that place used to be good but has now totally sold out and – most important to your quest – will tell you where you would have gone if you were not some sort of mouth breathing water buffalo.

(Actual post's title: "Hunting Vegetarians with Ted Nugent")

Bourdain is a troll! I knew it!

Confirms everything I love about AB, and more.

Christmas special had some rough spots - too much forced humor, QOTSA cameo, yawn. And I could have done without the foie gras apologism - instead of justifying what is clearly unnatural and bizarre, just say "yeah, it's unnatural and bizarre, but a million times better than your average chicken farm..."

Food looked really good, tho.

the show has gotten a little old for me - I've seen the movie a few times now - but it's still capable of doing something rare - that NoLA episode is maybe the best thing about the post-hurricane city I've seen

The show in Iceland is still one of the greatest food shows I've ever seen.

New one tonight: Saudi Arabia.
Haven't watched all the Colombian one yet, but liked what I saw.

crew blog: http://no-reservations-crew-blog.travelchannel.com/2008/07/under-the-abbaya-female-produc.html

this is a great show to tivo up and just have some eps kicking around for like hangover sunday watching.

wow, he really outdid himself on this Tokyo ep

Bourdain bank

Mexico ep was good.

I am super-psyched: apparently he's going (or has gone?) to Ethiopia for an upcoming episode.

I like his persona on this show, if only because I think he's one of very few presenter types on TV who is recognizable as an actual human. There's a palpable personality there, and on balance I think it's a charming one: he seems smart, he can be serious-minded at times, he's endearingly grumpy, he does/says things that are lame and embarrassing enough to seem like an actual person, etc. (Is this just because he writes his own narration? Is that why actual personality seems to be there?) Unlike some people upthread, I don't get a huge macho or tough-guy vibe out of him, though I can see something that could be mistaken for that.

Seriously, really psyched for any forthcoming Ethiopia episode.

And -- to be honest -- I'm having trouble even dredging up another example of a host/presenter of this sort who seems to me like a televised human, as opposed to just being competent and professional. Maybe this one dude on Globetrekker, I dunno.

In the Mumbai/Kolkata episode, the local writer said "in Kolkata we like Jerry Garcia, and in Mumbai they like Jim Morrison" and Bourdain was like "I love Jim Morrison" and the writer sorta glared at Tony.

I love how in the Colombia episode he ate at one of my fave places in Medellin, around the corner from my Dad's house.

my friend from Columbia was over my house and i showed him that episode. He didn't even know who bourdain was but he loved it.

A little Anthony Bourdain goes a long way.

I'm a big fan of all the South American episodes. Like the massive meat bbq in Uruguay or when he was hanging out with some people in Argentina and was all "vamos Boca!" and they gave him the death stare before responding that they supported River Plate.

my bro was blown away that he was chillin with those kids on the roof top.

Maybe this one dude on Globetrekker, I dunno

which one? http://www.pilotguides.com/tv_shows/globe_trekker/travelers/index.php

got a bit of a crush on Megan. I think the fact that Bourdain has basically no media/journalism training sets him apart from the pack, ie he never was trained to develop a robotic, distanced, TV persona.

got a bit of a crush on Megan.
me too a little bit

me too more than a little bit despite her Romney shit, but maybe that should be on a travel show personality S&D thread rather than the Bourdain one

"Tony's in" Venice next week, which I'm looking forward to cuz I may do the same this year

and he's doing DC the night before the inauguration.

He is in Detroit today, apparently, to film a segment for his show.

Everyone crushes on McCormick (there are some creepy fan sites about her, even). I had Ian in mind, but now that I think about it, Justine is way more Real Recognizable Person to me; Ian's just more charming. I even figured out that she was from the Bay Area before she said so, just because you can somehow ... tell.

My big strike against Bourdain is that he's friends with Batali, which seems like not a good sign.

What's wrong with Batali? His folks are awfully cute in the Seattle episode.

saw a cool episode recently where he ate on the texas/mexico border

Ooh. Venice could be interesting. Right now the Korean episode is my favorite... it's hilarious, and he eats lots of good food and I really liked that they showed his friend's family. What country was it where his camera man knocked over a few shelves full of food in a small restaurant and had to help clean up? That was a pretty good one as well.

It doesn't seem so silly if you've seen the episode, and know Bourdain's general attitude toward war and the military, ans especially not if you share his views. He's not a big fan of war, is critical of our government, but was himself stunned by the generosity, personability, and machine-like competency of the US Marines. These are really good people, he said in no uncertain terms.
I'm just going to say that it's a good thing that I missed this the first time around. Military guys normal people shockah. (yes, I am still dating the coastie and yes that of course colors my opinon)

What's wrong with Batali? His folks are awfully cute in the Seattle episode.
His dad (runs Salumi) is AWESOME. I've chatted with him a few times when I've been in there getting a sandwich and he's always talking with the 9 million people waiting in line- really wonderful guy.

Bourdain comes off like a complete moron in the Beirut episode.

The knocked-over shelves of food was in Indonesia, I think.

I used to not like Batali but he seems alright - anyone who's had their show purged from the Food Network has to be doing something right. He seems like a total food nerd in the best way.

He was on this local Michigan produced TV show hosted by an incredibly annoying guy who was asking him if he planned to open a restaurant near Traverse City, where his wife is apparently from and where he hangs out a lot in the summer. He was all "fuck no, this is my vacation spot, moron" and I can respect that.

Bourdain comes off like a complete moron in the Beirut episode.

Really? Complete? I think that's a bit uncharitable, a bit incendiary. I thought he came across as a tad naif and yet thoughtful.

I have no reason to be charitable towards him, but you're probably right.

Tony Bourdain, and Morcheeba?

"Bourdain comes off like a complete moron in the Beirut episode."

Not. That episode was really good.

I'm really looking forward to the Venice show. He usually can't stand places like that.

. He usually can't stand places like that.

Indeed. That's why I'm thinking it will be fantastic.

For all the touristy shit in Venice and the weirdness of the local cusine in comparison to most of the country, I had some really lovely food there. He'll figure it out.

Probably. But he'll take his pound of flesh before he does.

the Korea episode is awesome, but the most recent Japan one is next level

justine is faintly charming, but ian is annoying as fuck

i am amused by the intersection of bourdain's quasi-badass persona and his half-horrible music taste

agreed re: ian, he was the last one i'd have guessed nabisco would note as seeming like a real person. he's always "on." or trying to be, at least.
bourdain's quasi-badass persona is so see-through, and that's why it's endearing. the regular viewer has enough bg info to know that when he exhibits it, it's a defense mechanism.

bourdain's quasi-badass persona is so see-through, and that's why it's endearing

right, of course, and pretty much intentionally so. but it's not clear how much he gets that some of his cool is pretty middlebrow (in a pretty nyc metro kinda way).

never liked this guy. when it comes to the travel channel, I prefer that schlumpy "I WILL EAT ANYTHING" dude. The episode where he was in rural china eating three-week old, raw, fermented pork out of a jar = klassick.

self-xp - he's likely my favorite exponent of that type

Haha that guy reminds me of Curly so everything time I see him eat something which even he acknowledges is AWFUL I keep expect him to do a little Three Stooges routine with it.

that show is the Ow My Balls of food/travel shows

any idea what the 4 other restaurants Carlos runs outside of Les Halles are?

I keep expect him to do a little Three Stooges routine with it

haha would watch

totally blanking on his name now.

and come on all of these shows are basically "Ow My Balls" and have next to nothing to do with how people actually cook/eat

I watched Man vs. Food twice and I was unimpressed w/ the quality of the challenges (and the show in general which is just a lame knock-off of the already lame Diners, Drive-ins & Dives.)

i didn't see the Mexico thing yet, but there are 4 locations of Les Halles

Andrew Zimmerman, I think.

and come on all of these shows are basically "Ow My Balls" and have next to nothing to do with how people actually cook/eat

i didn't no what 'these shows' are, but Bourdain's show has everything to do with how people actually live/eat/cook

andrew zimmern, who was in first class on a plane i was on btw. brushes with fame, so fleeting.

xp

but it's not clear how much he gets that some of his cool is pretty middlebrow (in a pretty nyc metro kinda way).

he's old. his coolness is rooted in another era. one era's cutting edge is another's middlebrow.

Okay, weird, I don't know why Zimmern's dorkiness doesn't count for me as Real Live Person -- we get a pretty clear view of what that dude is like -- but there's something about it where it's like a dorky guy trying to be cheery and entertaining and presentery, doing a job, that cuts against what I mean. You will never get an "are you freaking serious, I'm supposed to do this" face from Zimmern, he'll never make a sarcastic comments about other people's behavior, and you'll never see him in a van trying to compare his poop with the production team's (aka Bourdain's biggest kinda-lame moment on the show, which I nevertheless enjoyed because, okay, travel + eating show = you are going to think about your poop more often than other people).

"i didn't no what 'these shows' are, but Bourdain's show has everything to do with how people actually live/eat/cook"

It's hit or miss. It tries more than most, I'll give you that.

i didn't no what 'these shows' are

cooking shows as featured on the Travel Channel, Bravo, and the Food Network. About half of them are bullshit "challenge" style shows, and the other half is about evenly split between food tourism ("ooh look I'm eating at a diner/poor person's house/tourist trap!") and shitty "how to make scrambled eggs"-type cooking shows for morons. There's the odd glimmer of hope in each of these categories but by and large all of them are terrible.

I kind of like how Bourdain acknowledges at some level that he's a better writer and tv personality than a chef and I live vicariously through his eating and drinking jaunts around the globe; he may not be the best cook but he seems like a first class diner.

man, i don't really get a "badass" or tough guy vibe from Bourdain at all. most of Bourdain's humor seems to be in the self-deprecating lol-i'm-an-awkward-tall-white-guy-from-NYC-who-doesn't-fit-in-here vein. i won't pretend i've seen a lot of his show, but i've read two of his books and seen a few really good episodes.

xpost-

he's old. his coolness is rooted in another era. one era's cutting edge is another's middlebrow.

i just backspaced over this other paragraph i wrote because this said it better. i also made mention of Patton Oswalt's cringe-inducing Fugazi name-dropping as something it reminds me of. kind of ickily reminds me of baby boomer 'tude.

The problem is I think he was a good writer about being a chef (I only rate Kitchen Confidential, everything starts to go downhill quick from there.) He's a run-of-the-mill writer about being a cultural tourist and he's a hit-or-miss cultural tourist.

I couldn't get past the first few pages of Kitchen Confidential. sorry

Yeah even that book's mileage may vary based on how much of Bourdain's "voice' you can tolerate.

He is in Detroit today, apparently, to film a segment for his show.

― Nicolars (Nicole), Wednesday, January 7, 2009 12:22 PM

Maybe he'll give a shout out to Ron Asheton. When I talked to him earlier this decade he told me his favorite album of alltime was Fun House.

This so-called "voice"

It turns out that I can tolerate quite a lot of it!

but it's not clear how much he gets that some of his cool is pretty middlebrow (in a pretty nyc metro kinda way).

this plus the Patton Oswalt-related comment upthread are what really bug me about him. There is a weird boomer-esque smugness to him and the way he thinks he and his tastes are "cool" that I find really irritating (ooh you did heroin and like the Doors = you are a dork)

its a kind of studied machoness that equates coolness with leather jackets and motorcycles but in Bourdain's case also happens to include his foodie preferences.

i agree with shakey except i don't actually have a problem with him being a dork

i should make it a goal to go to detroit before his show comes out

any idea what the 4 other restaurants Carlos runs outside of Les Halles are?

― dan selzer, Wednesday, January 7, 2009 6:07 PM (23 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i don't know but dude should really open up a mexican food place.

I don't disagree with you Shakey and yours is a totally valid reaction to him, but, like I said, it's the fact that I can see through all that to the real person (goofy, kinda hippiesh more than NYC O.G. punk cool, when it comes down to it) that endears me to him.

I don't have a problem with pointing out his clay feet but I am charitable to him mostly because I am sure that my tastes and the touchstones for what is 'cool', thorugh the inevitable and inexorable processes of genrations individuating themselves (if not simply thtough my own native dorkitude) will leave me, like almost everyone, completely uncool, if they haven't already and I've come to terms with that.

Fwiw, I didn't think there was anything much special about Les Halles when I finally went there last year.

Do you guys really think Bourdain thinks he's cool because he wears a leather jacket and likes some bands? That is some petty shit.

Why are you arguing about it then?

Maybe the point is more that Bourdain thinks OTHER people are cool cause they wear leather jacket and like some bands? I could care less regardless.

COULDN'T

Dude's in his 50s; the fact that we're even talking about whether he's "cool" seems notable

I don't think he's "cool," by the way -- I'm firmly in the "it's just nice to see a recognizable human personality on TV" camp -- but honestly, if we're talking about music/fashion tendencies here, I know a million people twenty years younger than him who he strikes me as pretty much like, so I'm not going to around calling him out for not being sufficiently cool.

Ok, I lied, I don't know a million people, but you know what I mean.

The thing to remember is Would Smash.

ooh you did heroin and like the Doors = you are a dork

i lol'd (because it's true) but i like him a lot and don't mind this corny aspect of his persona. all in all he presents himself as a pretty humble and curious dude, and those are winning qualities.

Fwiw, I didn't think there was anything much special about Les Halles when I finally went there last year.

there isn't now, and probably never was

Bourdain comes across as a likable doofus whose in on his own joke so I'm able to forgive a lot of his excesses.

My favorite episode is the Catalonian one where he visits El Bulli and Arzak. If I ever get the urge to spend several hundred dollars on a meal (seems completely frivolous I know) I'd definitely give El Bulli a shot. Plus, the restaurant looks like someplace that could have been designed by Peter Saville. http://www.elbulli.com/

Bourdain comes across as a likable doofus whose in on his own joke so I'm able to forgive a lot of his excesses.

OTM... He says over and over again throughout his later books and his TV shows that he basically hit a big score and has been riding the wave ever since. Whether he's a good chef or cool or whatever, I think that kind of honesty comes across in his writing and most of the presentation of his shows.

I have to wonder where he's going to go in Detroit... I'm guessing Coney Dogs, maybe Middle Eastern food in Dearborn, and the requisite compare/contrast of the new developments downtown with the destitute rest of the inner city.

Seems like he'd have to hit Eastern Market too. I hope he ends up at one of the random hole-in-the-wall soul food or ham sandwich places I used to drive by but regretfully never stopped at.

he basically hit a big score and has been riding the wave ever since

Exactly - he knows that he lucked into this second unexpected career and digs that he gets to do what he does now and gets paid for it. There seems to be real happiness about it that you can't fake and I enjoy watching.

he's not cool because of the leather jacket and heroin history, he's cool in spite of it.

I think he's genuine because of it, because you get the sense that he's not the guy going "I served food to my favorite bands and slept on the beach because I'm a cool guy," you get the sense that he's the grown-up version of the kid who's drawing band logos on his school notebooks so hard that the covers fall off because it just thrills him to do it.

Maybe I'm trying to get at the idea that he's not really at all pretentious, he's just really honest about what he's about and isn't doing it to prove anything. Or at least he comes off reasonably well like that.

The DC episode was great. This season has been fantastic.

nice!got that on the tivo.

Recent interview

Would you want to do a country-specific exploration show, like the Spain - On the Road show featuring Chef Mario Batali, cookbook writer Mark Bittman and Gwyneth Paltrow?

I would love to do something with Mario. It's been an unrealized ambition to produce a show for Mario, honestly. He's so smart. The guy knows so much. He's easily the funniest and smartest celebrity chef out there. The Spain show. I'm disappointed. After seeing the Spain show, I see room for improvement. Life is good for Mario, he's got life by the tail. It was probably a lot of fun for him to make that show and not too demanding of his time. But I would very much like to produce a show where he tells us everything he knows about Italy. I think that would be good and informative television. I just don't know if he wants to put in the time commitment given all the businesses he has.

Okay, I'll just say it. I think the Spain show is f***ing awful. Mark Bittman comes off unsympathetic to say the least. Bringing someone who cannot or will not eat jamon [Gwyneth Paltrow] to Spain is a misjudgment. My crew grinds their teeth with rage looking at the crummy production values. Bad camera work, bad sound, bad direction. The whole thing sucks. It's unfortunate. It's mesmerizingly awful.

Does traveling make you appreciate being an American more?

I think traveling HAS made me appreciate America a lot more. Not because the rest of the world is deprived or so awful that we should appreciate what we have in America. To the contrary, I've been having a really great time. A lot of the world has a lot to hold over us in a lot of respects. I think it makes me more appreciative, more open to people, more appreciative of what it's like to live in a place like Detroit. I'm just more tolerant and open-minded about different cultures. Buffalo is a different culture. I look at Buffalo and Buffalonians as a different culture now. Ten years ago, I would have looked at them as those poor guys who live upstate, and I'm lucky enough to live in Manhattan. That's the way I would have seen it 10 years ago. Now I see it as a very distinct personality, a very distinct culture with its own architecture, its own kinda feel. It's, actually, a weirdly wonderful place. Even in winter. I think it took me traveling around the world to get to that point.

The inauguration is tomorrow. Do you have any advice for our soon-to-be president?

I would not presume to advise him on anything. By virtue of being elected, he has made my life as a traveler much much easier. I've felt the impact abroad already. I get congratulated by complete strangers walking up to me in Sri Lanka and Vietnam. It's been a tough eight years to be a traveling American. I don't think people hated Americans, but there was a look that people gave you. Just by virtue of being an American you were like some well-intentioned, but rabid golden retriever. A look of curiosity, disbelief and horror. And this was in England and Australia. I'm particularly proud and happy about our new president. There will be a tangible difference in the way Americans are treated abroad. It just feels better. Above and beyond all the policy.

Any advice about food?

I'll tell you. Alice Waters annoys the living shit out of me. We're all in the middle of a recession, like we're all going to start buying expensive organic food and running to the green market. There's something very Khmer Rouge about Alice Waters that has become unrealistic. I mean I'm not crazy about our obsession with corn or ethanol and all that, but I'm a little uncomfortable with legislating good eating habits. I'm suspicious of orthodoxy, the kind of orthodoxy when it comes to what you put in your mouth. I'm a little reluctant to admit that maybe Americans are too stupid to figure out that the food we're eating is killing us. But I don't know if it's time to send out special squads to close all the McDonald's. My libertarian side is at odds with my revulsion at what we as a country have done to ourselves physically with what we've chosen to eat and our fast food culture. I'm really divided on that issue. It'd be great if he served better food at the White House than what I suspect the Bushies were serving. It's gotta be better than Nixon. He liked starting up a roaring fire, turning up the air conditioning, and eating a bowl of cottage cheese with ketchup. Anything above that is a good thing. He's from Chicago, so he knows what good food is.

Well that last paragraph is a blast and a half.

What a maroon.

He's from Chicago, so he knows what good food is.

This is something I've never heard before, and I'm not sure how it's supposed to work. (I'm not disagreeing with it, just not sure what the thrust is!)

i'm with him, Alice Waters annoys the shit out of me as well

It'd be great if he served better food at the White House than what I suspect the Bushies were serving.

wow, so something he and Alice Waters have in common are misconceptions about the food served at the White House.

Alice Waters and Walter Scheib, a former White House chef, have been nattering at one another for several months over who could or should cook for the new first family. The two reached a détente Sunday night, at the same party where Tom Colicchio performed the Heimlich maneuver on Joan Nathan.

They met during a dinner honoring a dozen chefs from around the country who came to Washington to cook a series of dinners. Held in private homes on Monday night, the dinners raised money for two local soup kitchens and helped promote Ms. Waters’s desire to make federal policy more welcoming to local, organic and sustainable food.

Mr. Scheib and Ms. Waters made their way to an upstairs room and closed the door. His first words were: “I’m 100 percent behind your agenda. The only dilemma I had is over what you said about Cris, who is my friend,” a reference to Cristeta Comerford, who was hired by Mr. Scheib and was promoted to executive chef after he left, in 2005. “She can’t talk publicly so I became her surrogate. I defend my friends.”

Ms. Waters and others had suggested the Obamas replace her with a chef who would cook locally and sustainably. Mr. Scheib took offense, he said, not only because Ms. Comerford is a talented cook, but because the White House kitchen already does many of the things Ms. Waters has suggested.

During the Clinton Administration, in response to a suggestion from Ms. Waters for a big vegetable garden on the White House lawn, a small garden was planted on the roof . It provided enough tomatoes, peppers, squash, cucumbers and herbs for the first family, but not their guests.

At about the same time, Mr. Scheib said, the White House began buying from about 40 different local farmers and co-ops, although for security reasons this was not widely discussed. If word leaked out that a purveyor was supplying food to the President, it was immediately dropped from the list, a Secret Service requirement.

Laura Bush took things a step further. “To her credit, Mrs. Bush was adamant about organic foods,” he said. “It goes counter to her perceived personality, but it was never important to her that the information to be released.”

xpost - Basically I dunno it it means "he's from an urban center with a diverse food culture, so he knows what good food is" or if it's actually saying "hey, Chicagoans know their food"

I love how people are annoyed by Alice Waters now... and she hasn't changed her local/organic-gourmet philosophy in almost 40 years.

"i'm with him, Alice Waters annoys the shit out of me as well"

She annoys the shit out of me too, but the line "I'm a little uncomfortable with legislating good eating habits" reveals that he has even less of a fucking clue than she does.

I think it's supposed to say "hey, Chicagoans know their food", but it's like saying "he's from Hawaii so he knows his surfing."

I honestly don't think I've ever heard anyone say "wow, those Chicagoans, they really know their food" -- the city usually gets those Wisconsin/German-style jokes about loads of sausage, beer, and cheese. But I don't think it's at all wrong, mostly for those major-urban-center / diverse-food-culture reasons; I mean, it's a big old thriving city, obviously lots of its residents are going to be relatively sophisticated about food.

"I honestly don't think I've ever heard anyone say "wow, those Chicagoans, they really know their food""

Really? I've always heard Chicago was a great food town.

yeah i mean i am not saying AB knows any better

chicagoans know their food, i saw it on SNL when i was a kid. the skit about those guys that had heart attacks while discussing their local football team. . .??

i've never had larger portions than i had in Chicago. that is for sure. i once got a salad (for under $10 w/ tax+tip) that could have fed a family of four for an entire day. and i'm a big eater too.

"I honestly don't think I've ever heard anyone say "wow, those Chicagoans, they really know their food""

Really? I've always heard Chicago was a great food town.

― Alex in SF, Wednesday, January 21, 2009 4:47 PM (12 minutes ago) Bookmark

Same here. Plus Bourdain is on record as being a proponent of a meat-centric diet, so I am not surprised he thinks highly of Chicago.

I feel like this was a running theme of Top Chef in Chicago, where certain contestants kept going "oh, these people are midwestern, they're not going to understand anything but fried meat" and certain judges kept going "you realize this is traditionally thought of as the third major urban center of the country and not some grand collection of rubes, right?"

It is a great food town -- it'd be hard for it not to be -- but I guess I rarely get to see people say it outright, since there are common assumptions to the contrary. But I guess if you're Bourdain you are used to talking in food circles where it's perfectly understood that Chicago's a good food city and doesn't have to be explained defensively.

Maybe he was referring to this:

Haha is he really on Check Please! What restaurant did he pick?

http://blogs.kqed.org/food/2009/01/06/check-please-barak-obama/

Nice, Dixie Kitchen! (Once upon a time there were three cold winter weeks in Evanston during which my girlfriend ordered Dixie Kitchen daily, compulsively and weirdly, and I think it says something good about Dixie Kitchen that it wasn't until the third week that I seriously got sick of it.)

chicago episode was pretty cool. L2O looked crazy!

The US Southwest episode sucked. Too much quirky shit, not enough food.

I thought Bourdain was going to move to Chicago after that episode.

I kind of liked Bourdain's visit to Ted Nugent's ranch. I call bullshit on Ted that that was his second beer ever. He's always said shit like that, but i guarantee he used to get high.

I can't stand Ted Nugent so I couldn't watch that episode. Chicago OTOH was pretty good.

The Ted Nugent part is at the end, so if you want, you can watch the boring first 45 minutes and then turn it off.

I had it on the background while I did dishes.

nugent has always been a dickhead sXe guy. always.

I was horrified to find out that Mancow and I have the same favorite movie.

I think among chefs and foodies, Chicago's reputation as a superior food town was sealed by guys like Charlie Trotter, Rick Bayless, and now Grant Achatz. Plus, the restaurant that Barack and Michelle go to for their anniversary -- Spiaggia -- was nominated for a James Beard Award for Outstanding Restaurant a couple years ago.

I think the two favorite meals that I've had in Chicago were at Avec and Hot Doug's so it was cool to see both of them there.

I was surprised there wasn't really anything about Mexican food at all, other than the sketchy tamale hotdog atrocities.

"I think the two favorite meals that I've had in Chicago were at Avec and Hot Doug's so it was cool to see both of them there."

Those were my two best Chicago meals too!

The mexican food here sucks. I know, I was surprised, too.

Haha Kenan I think that opinion says more about your lucky lack of exposure to sucky Mexican food than it says about Chicago

I grew up in a solid hard-shell tacos / Old El Paso seasoning packet / packaged shredded cheddar / canned black olives kind of Mexican food place so Chicago seems pretty decent Mexican-wise to me.

Could be. All I know is, the mexican food in Texas is fan-freakin'-tastic, and here it ranges from stomach-churning to meh.

Just out of curiosity, have you been to any of the upscale places (Frontera/Topolobampo, Salpicon, De Cero, Adobo), or are you basing that just on neighborhood taquerias?

I grew up in a solid hard-shell tacos / Old El Paso seasoning packet / packaged shredded cheddar / canned black olives kind of Mexican food place so Chicago seems pretty decent Mexican-wise to me.

You forgot the shredded iceberg lettuce.

http://www.aintnosurfintexas.com/zz%20top%20tres%20hombres%20mexican%20feast3%20copy.jpg

On my other favorite show, Diners Drive-ins and Dives, they went to a mexican place in Chicago that looked AWESOME called Puebla Cemita or something.

I like the actual diners, drive-ins & dives, but I cannot watch the pink fuckface on that show for more than a few minutes.

I've been to De Cero and Frontera and thought they were both decent but kind of disappointing. De Cero seemed to be taking itself to seriously and didn't live up to what they thought of themselves. Frontera was good and maybe was really innovative like 15 years ago when everyone thought Mexican food was hard shell tacos with iceberg lettuce but didn't seem all that interesting to me now. I also thought whichever of the three Pasaditas I went to wasn't anything all that great.

But I've really liked Taqueria Moran every time I've been there - which admittedly I was either starving or hung over or with lots of friends so that may cloud it.

Frontera/Topolobampo

Oh man, Rick Bayless's places are amazing. Really killer stuff. I guess that's not what I meant by Mexican food -- I took my Dad to Frontera once while he was in town, promising great Mexican food, and I could see the puzzlement on his face as he looked at the menu. "Where's the giant bowl of queso?" So I guess I put that in another category, even though maybe I shouldn't.

jinky: best. gatefold. ever.

"Where's the giant bowl of queso?"

uh

I don't want to get into a whole Mexican thing, because we've done it before a whole bunch of different times, but lookit: I occasionally felt like Chicago's Mexican was lacking compared to the tasty southwestern stuff I grew up on (which is a whole different kind of food in the first place), but honestly, compared to almost any place else in this country, it is generally decent and nothing to complain about. Honestly. Seriously. Up until I found a good southwestern-style place here in New York, I'd have killed for even the kind of stuff you can get at Flash Taco.

(I would also submit -- from personal experience! -- that if you're really used to Texan or "southwestern" Mexican, you can get to a point where someone gives you certain types of authentic Mexican food and you're like OMG this is terrible, given that it's a big country and many parts of it are not gussying up their dishes with as much first-world richness and stewing and cheese as parts of ours.)

haha xpost! -- the parenthetical bit above = "where's the giant bowl of queso" EXACTLY

yeah, if i can get some tacos with tasty carne al pastor, cilantro, onions, and spicy salsa, then i'm happy. no queso necessary.

(i realize that the tex-mex thing is totally different, and i'm not that familiar with it)

You're making me so so hungry for things covered in red sauce and melted cheese.

That whole southwestern-vs-authentic thing once led to a really embarrassing conversation between me and another ILXor, about a local restaurant:

ME: Everything seems really weird and thrown-together there.
HIM: It's pretty much just authentic Oaxacan style.
ME: No way, they just throw that runny white cream on everything!
HIM: I believe that's known as Oaxaca Cream.
ME: Well they're definitely using some kind of cheap, bland cheese.
HIM: Yeah, that's called Oaxaca Cheese.

i hate that white cheese

so do they really provide big bowls of cheese at tex-mex places?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/65/Queso.jpg/400px-Queso.jpg

I have never seen such a thing.

I've never seen anything like that in my life.

Not saying I wouldn't down the whole thing, just saying.

so basically Chicago mexican is more authentic than Austin/SATX mexican?

Queso is amazing.

so basically Chicago mexican is more authentic than Austin/SATX mexican?

well, "authentic," like nabisco said.

My mom makes it as an intermediate step to homemade mac'n'cheese, it's basically your roux with sharp cheddar and whatever else melted into it. Then she has to beat us about the hands with her wooden spoon as we try to scoop it up with chips before she puts the pasta in.

But sitting, possibly lukewarm, on a restaurant table? I can hardly imagine.

I am also a fan of the giant hollow puffy fried corn tortilla smothered in queso. (Which is short for chile con queso, not to be confused with queso blanco, which is the stuff I could seriously live without.)

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3016/2891374366_b89ab3436f.jpg?v=0

not like i don't like cheese, but that seems kinda unnecessary. mexican food isn't exactly healthy to start with, i don't need a giant bowl of cheese too.

Well, when they put it in front of you, just try not eating it.

Texas is all about the unnecessary

I think I would be totally fine with not eating that. But I can be picky about cheese products.

I would totally eat that.

I can't believe how many people haven't had queso! Surely most of you have at least had, like, a jar of crappy queso dip from the supermarket? Cause it would be sad if processed nacho cheese was as close as someone had come.

Anyway: it's not an authenticity battle, I'm just saying that when you're used to awesome American-regional versions of Mexican food, other versions can throw you, for a second. But yeah, I'd say that the bulk of decent Chicago Mexican falls into one of two camps: (a) the tacqueria-style basics, and (b) sit-down restaurants, catering to a good share of actually Mexican patrons, serving actual Mexican entrees -- you know, not just enchiladas and stuff but the seafood dishes and fried things and whatnot.

There's plenty of both in Chicago that's pretty good, and this is even ignoring "nice" places. But it's true, if you're used to Southern California style, or New Mexican style, or Texan style, or something like that ... some of these might seem blander or drier or less mind-blowingly delicious, I guess?

The queso home game is a bowl of melted velveeta mixed with salsa. It ain't art, but it's quality slumming.

Anyway, someone let me know when Bourdain goes to Ethiopia, please

Well, when they put it in front of you, just try not eating it.

yeah, you obviously don't know me at all.

he will never never eat the queso
oooooooooooo

if someone puts it front of me i pretty much have to eat it all

I think that's what Kenan meant -- like, you just try not eating it.

My mom will often bust out a block of Velveeta mixed with a can of Rotel tomatoes, melted in a crock pot and served up for an event of some sort with a bag of Tostitos. This dish is referred to as "Rotel". My mother-in-law was known to do a similar thing with a can of Hormel chili instead of the Rotel tomatoes. Authenticity, regionalism, whatever be damned - I'd eat both of them.

I love Rotel cheese dip, esp. with a strong shot of sriracha added.

velveeta and canned chili, which sounds awesome in a drunkfoods sort of way, becomes incredibly disgusting after about five chips worth. had it at a party last year, was at first psyched. then not.

My Texan friend likes to mix a small quantity of Velveeta with real cheese just so the queso has a better consistency.

I think that's what Kenan meant -- like, you just try not eating it.

this.

wouldn't have to

I was in Russ & Daughters today getting lunch, and the folks behind the counter told me that there's a No Reservations airing tonight where he goes to Russ & Daughters. !!!!

I had a pumpernickel with plain cream cheese and Gaspe salmon. (One of the only lunches I'll willingly pay $9 for, since it's SOOOO GOOOOD. Any other lunch over $6 is mad overpriced.) We'll see what Mr Bourdain eats tonight. ;-)

No Reservations is great television. Even when it's lying it's telling the truth. The Vancouver episode was so ineptly done that it accidentally revealed the truth about the city: it's based on stock footage of people snowboarding and doing "outdoor activities," a film industry nobody really cares about, and bullshit quality of life rankings in International Magazines.

Good episode except he kept saying non-ironic over and over. WE GET IT!

That was Bourdain at his Morbsiest.

I had never thought of it, but Bourdain is pretty Morbsy every week. But almost always in a "charming curmudgeon" way.

I hug them both.

Come on! Katz's is OK but dude, SARGE'S! You'd think being a midtowner, even if all the way left instead of right, he'd know better.

I crave Sarge's so bad at all times. I make sure to go every single time in NYC.

Sarge's. 36th and Third. Sit-down. Huge menu. Flawless matzoh ball soup. Best pickles and cole slaw on earth. Best pastrami in New York. (That's from our old friend Paul Eater--does he still post?) Open 24 hours. Almost nobody I meet in New York has heard of it or been there, because it's in midtown where there is basically nothing. I want to live there. Every one of you reading this owes it to yourself.

I don't think I've ever seen him take such giddy delight in anything as he does the Chinese meal.

ooh, def. checking that out. not too far from workplace and my immediate vicinity's lunch options are kind of a culinary wasteland so this is good to hear. thx matos!

i've faulted him in the past for being too idiosyncratic in his takes on places, but a few of the recent ones feel a little too greatest hits-y. i mean, i admit i'd rather watch NY and DC than, say, Ghana and Vietnam, and i can't really fault him for knocking off an easy episode at home with the young kid over a cold winter, but it does seem like he might be getting a little too comfortable in the job.

36th and Third is what, 3-4 blocks from the 2nd Ave Deli now?

where is the outcry about the Upper East Side content in this one?

the pink press threat file, I used to work in midtown, and yes, it's pretty dire. btw, Sarge's also delivers.

maybe they just feel greatest hits-y because i know the places

I don't think I've ever seen him take such giddy delight in anything as he does the Chinese meal.

I don't think I've ever seen ME take so much delight in a meal as Chinese food in NYC, because you can't get it anywhere else.

It's one of those rare and still dirt-cheap regional cuisines, like Mexican food in Houston.

haha I now regularly go with my girlfriend's family to the Allen/Delancey Congee Village whenever I visit. It really is amazing.

(but srsly, visit one west coast)

ok ok I need a guide to the Mexican food of LA, maybe. Last time I was there I was too busy kvetching to eat much.

I'm watching his episode on Laos now, and it's kinda heartbreaking.

(but srsly, visit one west coast)

Yeah. Seattle has awesomely delicious chinese, japanese, and vietnamese. Seven Stars Peppers, for one, has the best hand shaven noodles I've ever had anywhere. My favorite dishes there from a few years ago:
chong gin chicken
house special chicken
hot pepper fish
sizzling rice shrimp special
hand shaven noodles beef chow mein
hand shaven noodles shrimp chow mein
baby bok
choy and mushrooms
mongolian beef

I ended up Tivo-ing this episode last night, so I still haven't seen it; hopefully this evening.

http://newyork.grubstreet.com/2009/10/ten_things_anthony_bourdain_an.html

awesome. Love the cupcake hatred.

I don't know who David Chang is, but I love everything about that article.

great nyer profile of chang: http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2008/03/24/080324fa_fact_macfarquhar

Hating cupcakes? What's the point of that?

there is a proliferation of cupcakeries these days

When I can get super fancy cupcakes at the small town farmer's market in northern Idaho I imagine the saturation level is probably exasperating in big cities. It doesn't mean they're not good, but still.

are ppl forgetting that cupcakes are fucking delicious?

i mean this seems like a good problem to have imo. OH NO THERE ARE TOO MANY GODDAMN CUPCAKES, WE WILL HAVE TO EAT OUR WAY OUT OF THIS.

Actually cake is fucking delicious. Cupcakes are for children's birthday parties and moments when whimsy matters more than taste or texture, because they're basically all exterior from a baking standpoint and are nearly impossible to keep from drying out.

i don't hate cupcakes, but it is a thing. also the last few weddings i've been at have had cupcakes instead of a cake.

yup. good idea, too, wedding cake is usually ass.

Wedding cake is usually ass for the exact opposite but sort of same reason that cupcakes are non-optimal: it's hard to get that enormous mass of batter cooked evenly without the edges being dry. Cakes that are made in medium-sized segments and joined together are better, cos each can be of a size and shape to bake in a sensible way (in a normal oven).

why we gotta do normal sized cake vs tiny cakes, of course regular sized cakes is better

Yeah just sain' that cupcakes are okay to hate, if you want to do that, because they put silliness over actual food quality. If you want to enjoy the silliness then go ahead, but it makes an understandable reason to hate them, if you care about a different set of priorities.

Laurel, you've been having the wrong cupcakes, I need to bake you some and fax them over.

also the last few weddings i've been at have had cupcakes instead of a cake.

Yeah, this is a thing now.

My problem with cupcakes is that I don't like buttercream frosting.

I need to bake you some and fax them over.

YSI plz!

for those who deny that the cupcake trend has gone too far:

http://www.seriouseats.com/2008/12/meatloaf-bakery-chicago-illinois.html

The hipster cupcake proliferation is kinda redic but I’ve had some damn good ones.

But, last week we finally entered the big time with Lakeview’s Meatloaf Bakery. While it sounds like the drug fueled dream of a character in some big ticket Hollywood movie, it’s the real deal here in Chicago—a storefront emporium that sells no less than eight types of gourmet meatloaf in appetizer form (aka "loafies"), full loaves, and, yes, the meat cupcake, aka "meatloaf baked in cupcake forms and piped with mashed potato frosting."

To me, the idea seemed an absurdity on every level. Why would I pay for something I could ask my mom to do for free?

"Mommmmm! I need you to whip up some meaty cakes for me!"

do you ever feel like some people are fronting with this OMG I LOVE BACON CUPCAKES shit nowadays

I was at a stand-up comedy show about a year ago, and one of the performers got a huge laugh just by saying, "So I decided to open up a hip new bakery."

David Chang serves complete garbage imo. Been to 3 of his restaurants (1 has since closed), mediocre ameri-asian fusion.

Bourdain's personality/writing >>>>>>>>> cooking based on my 2 samples of LH back when he was in the kitchen.

which of his restaurants closed?

Hating cupcakes is lame.

I like Bourdain but he has these little eccentricities that I hate, like his weird obsession with tiki shit.

And aging rockers.

Bourdain and Chang are two guys who don't seem to be particularly into dessert, so hating cupcakes is not very surprising even beyond the root hatred of culinary fad cycles.

i like a good cupcake! place down the street from my gf's house makes rad ones:

http://www.kickasscupcakes.com

i mean, i'm not big into sweets at all, but if someone makes a good cupcake you can be damn sure i'll eat it.

I like aging rockers and do not partic like dessert, so I'm okay with all this cranky-ass fuckers.

Bourdain's personality/writing >>>>>>>>> cooking based on my 2 samples of LH back when he was in the kitchen.

i don’t think he every really hyped himself up as anything more then a serviceable chef.

Being away from austin for 4 years, I've noticed cupcakes everywhere. I don't really understand it, are there that many people that are craving just cupcakes? There are trailers that only sell cupcakes. I don't think I'm ever just wanting a cupcake.

this profile makes david chang sound like an awful and sad human being

I don't really understand it, are there that many people that are craving just cupcakes?

It's part of the same trend that has bars serving tater tots and restaurants doing "gourmet" macaroni and cheese. In other words, capitalizing on childhood nostalgia with "comfort foods."

people need to stop frontin, cupcakes are delicious. And you can eat them without a fork, which is v. difficult to do with other cake products i.e. regular cake.

You know who else doesn't like to eat things with forks? Small children.

sometimes a man needs to eat cake on the go, and for that cupcakes are a godsend.

this profile makes david chang sound like an awful and sad human being

Yeah, isn't he great?

Disappointed that Shasta didn't like his food. I wanted to check it out some day.

i just want to clarify that as far as i can tell, laurel is the only person who has come out as anti-cupcake on this thread.

i mean i can see if you're not into cake in general but why would you ever hate on cupcakes specifically. like what, you want a whole cake that you can cut into slices? i'm one guy--wtf am i going to do with a whole cake?

Cut it into pieces apparently?

well yeah and then i've got leftover cake or i need to find people to share it with or something. if i get a cupcake i can eat it and not think about cake again for however long i want.

This summer. He's one guy. With a whole cake.

NOTE: THIS IS NOT CALL ALL DESTROYER PICTURED HERE

http://rantendrant.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/fat_lady_eating_cake-3755.jpg

i really liked chang's food when i had it but i guess it's not v 'authentic'

lol fantastic thing to open @ work! thanking u.

why would you ever hate on cupcakes specifically. like what, you want a whole cake that you can cut into slices?

they're basically all exterior from a baking standpoint and are nearly impossible to keep from drying out.

Already answered your question.

sorry

don't worry polyp, i don't like lots of rests/chefs that people love...

and don't want to say that i'm the Alfred Soto of food opinions or anything, I just think the Momofuku chain is defnitely not my style.

I actually do like cake and I prob wouldn't turn a good cupcake down, but then again if they're not really very good I might just say "no thanks!" at the office party or whatev because I don't like frosting and I like cake to be moist.

Have had Cupcake Cafe or some other fancy West Vill NYC hipster bakery cupcakes and was really not happy w them.

also, something else that bugs: naming your chain after the inventor of instant noodles is pretty corny and low-concept.

someone should start a chain named after/inspired by Hungry Man TV dinners.

hahah it's ok mr. que more just the shock + quick minimize than anything actually bad.

they're basically all exterior from a baking standpoint and are nearly impossible to keep from drying out.

uhhh i have had some moist cupcakes so not sure abt this.

people need to stop frontin, cupcakes are delicious. And you can eat them without a fork, which is v. difficult to do with other cake products i.e. regular cake.

just wanted to point out that the current gourmet cupcake craze has almost made eating them without a fork impossible unless you are totes okay with having frosting smeared all over your face like a neanderthal

That cupcake drying thing is crazy nonsense.

yeah there's this new cupcake place near our house and they smear so much damn frosting on the things that I can barely eat one without unhinging my jaw. i love cupcakes and they are delicious, but it seems like overkill

xxp only if they're proportioned wrong or are going insane with frosting towers or something. but i would not eat a cupcake that had those problems.

too much frosting is a mortal sin imo

haha wait didn't you just namecheck Kick-Ass Cupcakes??????

xp I like that it keeps the top of the cupcake moist but I peel off frosting before eating.

lol yeah i just brought cupcakes from there to my parents house when they had us for dinner! i thought they were well-proportioned.

ftr CAD is saying that this is not too much frosting on a cupcake:

http://www.thehightea.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/Cupcakes-Kickass-Cupcakes.JPG

now don't get me wrong, I totally fuck with these, but never would it cross my mind to hold these things up as an example of how one should really frost a cupcake

shocking that these two very well balanced and reasonable dudes are so negative about something frivolous, nostalgic, girly, baby-stroller-y, goop-dot-commy etc

hahahahahhah i can't believe you are just busting out photo evidence like that!

you almost have to smush it or lick it off with a finger--cupcakes should be a little more. . . elegant

i remember thinking it was good at the time but am willing to be overruled by dan instantly producing photos of kickass cupcakes.

Those are beautiful! But also perfect evidence of the boutique approach to baked goods when really I just want a piece of chocolate cake.

yeah i mean cake is pretty undeniable

though i think pie > > cake

looooooooooooooooool I thought Que said "you almost have to smash it" at first and I was all "o_O I have never had the desire to smash a cupcake"

And yes the are gorgeous and they also taste great but there is something to be said for simplicity, right? I mean, these should be an occasional treat, not the norm.

pie is way better than cake

Those cupcakes Dan pictured looked pretty proportional to me.

CUPCAKES should be an occasional treat and not the norm is we're getting technical

*if

the top one on the left and the second one from the top, underneath it look pretty crazy

! So frosting that is as high as the cupcake is an expected, normal proportion to you???????

also want to point out that the only thing visible on the top right one is frosting

If I can see cake around the frosting then there is not too much frosting is my general rule.

i'm kind of over cupcakes too, at least as being this "thing" people "front" about

woah, so that's like ganache ON TOP of frosting? wow.

I could tell what was going on in the top right one. If that's all frosting and you can actuall pull it out of the holder then yes that's too much frosting.

can't actually

See what I don't like about those is that I want a well-distributed amount of frosting with cake in every bite -- that frosting technique guarantees that at some point there will be a mouthful of frosting or else you'll have to pull it apart and re-aportion the bites out, which negates the forkless aspect completely.

it's like people with no baking skills but who want to open a bakery of some sort instead decide to open a cupcake shop and omg toss a few dozen red velvet cupcakes into the display case and suddenly there's a line out the door. yeah it's tasty, sure, but i dunno it's a little boring maybe.

People with no baking skills are baking tasty cupcakes?

it's a funny world we live in

tbf the cupcakes in the photo that i am repping actually use really nice flavor combinations that are kind of cool and unique without being gimmicky.

i dunno, i'm not impressed by the guy who makes nothing but cupcakes. even if they're really good ones.

iirc the one with the dark green frosting is a "green monster" cupcake that uses sam adams in the batter--i was not convinced at first but it totally works and is really tasty.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41oiDpkcsnL._SL500_AA240_.jpg

imo do one thing, and do it well

Yeah as long as the one thing you do totally rocks, it's cool.

tbf the cupcakes in the photo that i am repping actually use really nice flavor combinations that are kind of cool and unique without being gimmicky.

oh I totally agree with you on that, I just have minor issues with their frosting methodology because it seems like half the bakeries around here are copying them and that causes hell on dudes like me who like cupcakes and have facial hair

"i dunno, i'm not impressed by the guy who makes nothing but cupcakes. even if they're really good ones."

I'm impressed by anyone who makes anything tasty.

"and that causes hell on dudes like me who like cupcakes and have facial hair"

Shave or carry wet naps.

Cupcakes are for children's birthday parties and moments when whimsy matters more than taste or texture, because they're basically all exterior from a baking standpoint and are nearly impossible to keep from drying out.

This is the most OTM thing ever said about cupcakes. They're kind of ok, maybe sometimes, but as far as sweet delicious baked goods go, they're somewhere in the bottom third. I don't "fucking hate" cupcakes -- I don't wish they were never born, or blame them for all my problems, or anything like that. But at their very very best, they are efficient frosting-delivery vehicles, and nothing more.

too many of these cupcakes i'm having lately are pretty weak too. i had some the other night from a place in long beach that were purportedly EPIC but they tasted like something you'd pick up for $3.99 for a half dozen at ralph's instead of $5 apiece.

i have had all kinds of fancy-ass OTT cupcakes around chicago but these are still my favorites:

http://www.chicagomag.com/images/2005/12%20December%202005/0512Arena_Cupcake9.jpg

Shave or carry wet naps.

fuck that noise, imo

wet naps are for babies and gurls and I am neither, I am a MAN

a MAN who eats CUPCAKES

http://www.southportgrocery.com/imgs/photogallery/Cupcakes-on-White.jpg

Some of you anti-cupcakists are clearly having inferior cupcakes.

there are way too many fucking cupcakes in seattle.

i like cupcake from time to time but gosh ppl, make something more interesting once in a while!

Some of you anti-cupcakists are clearly having inferior cupcakes.

well that was kind of the root of the argument, wasn't it? ie, cupcakes are harder to do than people think they are, so a bunch of them end up being kind of shitty and overpriced...?

the little bakery by my house does a great hostess cupcake imitation that is so good.

i hate the idea that a good cupcake is some kind of artful masterpiece. i will eat a good cupcake but it's not like the be all end all.

yes, tza

n/a's cupcake has perfect frosting to cake ratio

ie, cupcakes are harder to do than people think they are, so a bunch of them end up being kind of shitty and overpriced...?

What is this NOT true of, though? Trying to think of anything that is amazing 90% of the time and drawing a blank.

Where are those from, n/a?

too many of these cupcakes i'm having lately are pretty weak too. i had some the other night from a place in long beach that were purportedly EPIC but they tasted like something you'd pick up for $3.99 for a half dozen at ralph's instead of $5 apiece.

― omar little, Monday, October 12, 2009 2:47 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark

$5 apiece! should have been one gd hell of a cupcake for that.

oh btw I was wrong about that upper-right cupcake, that's essentially molten chocolate cake with ganache stuck in it

The existence of cupcakes at all is slightly questionable, though not offensive. Why do people need to eat pure sugar and flour in this form, in a world where actual cake exists? If you think you need a big sugar rush on-the-go, you are wrong about that.

http://www.kickasscupcakes.com/include/Menu_2009_09.pdf

here's the menu for Kickass Cupcakes, some of them are really ludicrous

(also on the website they have a pic of their s'more cupcake which is pretty much the most lolsome thing ever)

cupcakes are mini-cakes. people like mini-cakes when they don't want to eat (or buy) a whole cake.

i bet i just recognized southport bakery cupcakes on sight

xxxp uhhh maybe i don't want an entire cake?

maybe i like variety and can buy several different cupcakes, cut them up, and share them?

maybe i only feel like cake or a cupcake very rarely and am happy to just buy a cupcake and get on w/my life?

maybe there needs to be a cupcake thread?

i bet i just recognized southport bakery cupcakes on sight

― A B C, Monday, October 12, 2009 1:54 PM (28 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

otm

okay the mojito cupcake is dumb, but WS all over a S'mores cupcake

cupcake bakery hate is definitely, 100% sublimated desire to physically harm women in colored tights

i've had the mojito cupcake, it's good!

maybe i like variety and can buy several different cupcakes, cut them up, and share them?

But none of them will be anywhere near as good as an actual cake, for the reasons Laurel mentions. It's not an optimal way to bake cake. Muffin pans are for muffins. I don't fully understand it, but there is chemistry involved.

I'm impressed by anyone who makes anything tasty.

Easily impressed. Give a monkey some combination of sugar, cream, butter, chocolate and you will be in awe.

btw i am kind of glad the bourdain thread is getting cluttered with cupcake talk. i am imagining him and david chang reading it and being all like "what a bunch of STUPID motherfuckers!!'

women in colored tights

What, mods?

But none of them will be anywhere near as good as an actual cake, for the reasons Laurel mentions. It's not an optimal way to bake cake.

i mean if this had any relation to what i have experienced in my life i'd be totally on board.

it's 2009, there are no mods only hipsters

from the message board that brought you 700-post threads about tacos and 1500-post threads about pizza comes...

cupcakes: u r all gay

I'm with Laurel on cupcake craze = meh. Cupcakes USED to be this kind of oddity, where once a year some person would randomly bring in a bunch of homemade cupcakes...or some whimsical person would go on a 'childhood' flight of fancy. I was okay with them in that context. Now there are ROVING VANS of cupcakes, and bakeries of cupcakes, and there are cupcake wedding cakes and cupcake birthday cakes and they're really not that big of a deal. There's too many of them. Period. Cake pwns cupcake. End of story.

no maybe you are gay, gay max

yeah remember when cupcakes were edgy?

Now there are ROVING VANS of cupcakes

TERRIFYING!

if i had been running into cupcakes as often as some of u people apparently do maybe i'd feel the same way.

it's 2009, there are no mods only hipsters

There is no Dana, only Zul.

there are no mods only hipsters

Not for this thread but you are so wrong.

pizza cupcake

imge #2 for "edgy cupcake":

http://www.wakinglifephoto.com/images/stories/blog/Cullens-Wedding-Reception-04.jpg

i kinda want the martha stewart cupcake book but that's more about martha than cupcakes and probably moot anyway since i steer away from wheat as much as possible these days.

we've been posting about cupcakes on the anthony bourdain thread, i think a digression into mods vs. hipsters is not only appropriate but also necessary

from the newest local cupcakery's site:

Now serving deluxe cupcakes daily--including the favorite "Chocolate-Chocolate-Chocolate-Chocolate" every day, and a constantly rotating selection of flavors like "Caramel-Infused Chocolate Cake with Dark Chocolate Ganache Frosting and Caramel Drizzle" and "Chocolate-Coconut Cake with Coconut Creme Filling and Chocolate Ganache Frosting Rimmed in Toasted Coconut."

Cupcakes sold since May 18, 2009: 32,624

i wonder what contenderizer and nabisco might have to say about cupcakes

there is this cupcake place in the village that does wine pairings w/ its cupcakes

Jordan I think it is your sworn duty to go to that cupcakery and punch everyone there in the gunt.

xxxp too much fuckin' chocolate

"Chocolate-Chocolate-Chocolate-Chocolate"

love cupcakes, hate cupcake names

"Caramel-Infused Chocolate Cake with Dark Chocolate Ganache Frosting and Caramel Drizzle"

I mean seriously wtf with this "name"

xxp Likewise max must savage all people found within 10' radius of that wine + cupcake place.

at least it's not "rimmed" with caramel "drizzle"

i think its called "sweet revenge" or some such

you would expect the whoopie pie to be the answer to the engineering problems inherent in the cupcake format while still maintaining the single serving size and cuteness factor but really the cake portion just ends up sticking to your fingers, or sticking to the wrapper in a way that is less familiar and more upsetting than what happens when you tear away the paper from a cupcake. i still think it might blow up at some point.

"rimmed with crusted chocolate"

whoopie pies > > >> > > cupcakes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbCT5fXdhhc

oh god, please do not get me started on the beard-ruining travesty that is the whoopie pie

i had a ~$4.50 champagne-grape-brie cupcake a couple of weeks ago...that shit just happened

from this place lolz
From the twisted minds at More Cupcakes comes a wallet-baiting creation on par with a thousand-dollar pizza or i65 martini: the $75 white truffle cupcake. The savory creation is built on a base of white truffle-infused cake, topped with bacon frosting (of course) and crowned with a thorough snow of shaved fresh white truffles. If you set aside a mere five bucks a day, you'll have enough socked away by its debut in early October, at the start of white truffle season.

BURN THAT PLACE TO THE GROUND NOW

finally after all these millenia a good use for fire

what the sweet bejesus is a whoopie pie?

This has become the silliest food argument ever. I like that about it.

what the sweet bejesus is a whoopie pie?

Worst trend in porn so far.

whoopie pie is a northerner moon pie

moon pie is a southern version of a whoopie pie

you are just making up names now.

haha thanking u for that clarification que

gourmet cupcakes make about as much sense to me as gourmet 'smores or gourmet caramel apples.

that white truffle cupcake has got to go. yes, yes, there needs to be a fire.

Okay I have had a gourmet caramel apple with dark chocolate and crushed hazelnuts caked to it, and it's a kind of heaven on this earth.

ugh, cupcakes can go straight to hell and burn in the fiery pits for ever.

well then

http://www.kickasscupcakes.com/images/FlavorImage.gif

I kind of love this GIF tbh

tbh i only dislike the proliferation of fancy shop cupcakes cos it means my old system of making cupcakes as birthday presents is now PASSE and i have to think of something else (also i'm no way as good w/ frosting).

also because two pounds for a fucking cupcake, you have got to be shitting me.

http://www.kickasscupcakes.com/Flash/episode2/episode2.html

so what the hell is this

hahah i think i watched that before we actually found the shop and i was pretty wtf

this thread needs some muffin films

the scrapbooking-x-paint-shop-pro-6 ragged edges on that gif remind me of tips, tricks and techniques to jazz up the graphics on your website from the web pages that suck: learn good design by looking at bad design paperback my dad bought me in place of a tree grows in brooklyn in middle school

fyi.

We make a lot of cupcakes in our house - they're ideal for kids' (and non-kids') parties, cos, y'know, you bring a huge fucking tray of them and everyone gets one, rather than people trying to daintily slice 1/32nd of a big-ass cake.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2299/2441208483_0e2fc4e8e6.jpg

Pies obviously >>> cakes. And it's coming up to Pie Season.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3188/3072763324_6aa9ce64d3.jpg

woahhhhhhhhhhh would eat

sometimes i wish i had glasses that would selectively defocus everything apart from like a four-inch strip of space and then the world would look as awesome as it does in food photos :(

like beer goggles, except 'food goggles'? yes, I would like these too.

http://www.tiltshiftphotography.net/examples.php

yes, except not on the internet

We have the technology ... it just needs to be adapted.

I shoot so much at f/2 or faster that that's how I see the world now.

Blurry, except for a small bit in the middle?

Yeah. Lovely bokeh though.