New York City is for sellouts

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OK, that's hyperbole. But this question is brought on by a spate of friends and acquaintances deciding to move to New York City, and me thinking, is there any more cliched thing to do? There are hundreds of great cities in the US, but no, everyone is moving to NYC. The cynic in me can't help but think that these are people with no outstanding personality, skills, or goals that need some way to define themselves, so they pick "New Yorker," hoping that this will make them interesting, but obviously that's a load of crap. But seriously, folks, why move to NYC and not anywhere else in the world? Is there anything left that's special or unique about NYC that doesn't exist in any other large US city? What leads to this mythology of the Big Apple? (I want to say the fact that most US media is based there helps perpetuate the "NYC is the best" POV, but then again, I'm a jerk).

PS, obviously no hate intended to native NYers or my much-loved NYC ILXors. Although this question is phrased in an antagonistic manner, it's based in pure curiosity and lack of comprehension.

NA (Nick A.), Thursday, 7 August 2003 13:40 (sixteen years ago) link

depends on what you mean by NYC. All my friends are moving to Brooklyn and hating the hipsters that they're encountering there.

Kingfish (Kingfish), Thursday, 7 August 2003 13:46 (sixteen years ago) link

They know me and Tracer Hand live here.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 13:47 (sixteen years ago) link

When I said "obviously that's a load of crap," I was referring not to the concept that being a New Yorker will make someone interesting, but to my whole cynical shpiel.

NA (Nick A.), Thursday, 7 August 2003 13:47 (sixteen years ago) link

NA you ought to be glad you're rid of such shallow people.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:03 (sixteen years ago) link

We love shallow hipsters here! Send more, and when come bring pie.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:04 (sixteen years ago) link

1) jobs
2) sex
3) bars

in no particular order. However, since the Great Sex Crackdown of '01 all sex is prohibited in New York. Many people don't find that out until they get here.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:09 (sixteen years ago) link

I thought jobs were banned.

g--ff c-nn-n (gcannon), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:15 (sixteen years ago) link

Yeah everybody's just here for the "vibe," like the guy who works at the bodega on my corner, he was like "d00d, I spent three months and five days crawling through razor wire and broken glass to get here for the hookers and liquor, and that was after i already got sent back twice" and I was like "at least you can get hookers on Sunday"

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:18 (sixteen years ago) link

I figure that people move to New York when they've exhausted their home towns. I mean, where the fuck else am I supposed to move to? Chicago??

Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:22 (sixteen years ago) link

Wannabe hipsters moving to Brooklyn and bitching when they meet "real" hipsters there -- C/D?

Aaron, yr back?

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:25 (sixteen years ago) link

Sex is only prohibited in the champagne rooms, you dumbass. If you just move it to the bathroom you're fine.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:26 (sixteen years ago) link

my time in new york
was absolutely crucial
for this country boy

I got to indulge
all my 'welcome back kotter'
fantasies therein

made a lot of friends
saw a lot of famous folks
"dude! it's eric b.!"

then I moved to Chi.
never looked back, even once.
now I miss them both.

Haikunym, Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:27 (sixteen years ago) link

Oh hey Yanc3y! Yeah, sorry I haven't emailed. I've been too busy trying to deal with the shambles that my life has turned into in my absence.

Speaking of NYC, I'll be in town from the 25-31st while I'm temporarily homeless. Looks like I'll be moving in December (or May at the very latest, depending on my job situation).

That would make me a sellout for staying longer, and I'm a sellout for moving. Hells yeah!

Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:28 (sixteen years ago) link

Well I guess now we know why Ally's hometown is exhausted.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:29 (sixteen years ago) link

Um, that didn't really work.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:29 (sixteen years ago) link

Ooer I'll git you fer that, you Southern hipster bitch.

(xpost I understand what you were getting at, though I kind of like that the champagne room is now my hometown)

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:30 (sixteen years ago) link

MAY?!?!? I call bullshit on that, my friend. Drop me a line about the 25th. I ain't got no job, so I'm down for whatever.

Tracer, can you email me? I forget yr real addy.

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:31 (sixteen years ago) link

I have never even been to NYC nor do I have aspirations to move there.

Mandee, Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:34 (sixteen years ago) link

What, yr too good to email me all of a sudden? Everyone else is dropping you a line, but I'm not? Fuck you too!

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:34 (sixteen years ago) link

Sorry, yanc3, access to webmail is DENIED today at work. Send me a mail and i'll remember.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:37 (sixteen years ago) link

I'm in the middle of writing you Ally!

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:39 (sixteen years ago) link

my friends are moving to brooklyn from sf because they think it will be more family-friendly. please tell them they are insane.

anthony kyle monday (akmonday), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:39 (sixteen years ago) link

Carroll Gardens is pretty family-friendly.

amateurist (amateurist), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:41 (sixteen years ago) link

Obviously it's ace, otherwise we wouldn't be getting married there (not that I've been before) We may need to start consulting with you NYC types soon for advice on locations for things.

chris (chris), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:42 (sixteen years ago) link

Oh, my friend is dating the girl in the painting on the wall of the Motor City Bar (in NYC natch).

Yanc3y you have email... Kyle, you will have some shortly!

Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:43 (sixteen years ago) link

You should get married in the Motor City Bar, btw, Chris.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:44 (sixteen years ago) link

We have the location (cherry hill in Central park if Vicky oks it in October)for the actual wedding, but will the Motor city bar suit for drinks the night before with me and my best man (plus entourage?)

chris (chris), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:46 (sixteen years ago) link

No no! That place sucks! It's just amusing.

Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:47 (sixteen years ago) link

Well, if you want yr bachelor party to be a time spent looking at grizzled old dudes, hipster men, and ugly bartenders, yeah!!

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:47 (sixteen years ago) link

Yeah, MCB blows. And Brooklyn is VERY family friendly. Try Carroll Gardens, Greenpoint, Park Slope or Gravesend.

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:48 (sixteen years ago) link

They should go to Scores. And also invite me.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:49 (sixteen years ago) link

I'd come out to NY for that.

Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:51 (sixteen years ago) link

There's a Motor City bar in NYC?

Larcole (Nicole), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:51 (sixteen years ago) link

Aaron! You and me lets go. Also we should go to Wall St and ride the bull!!!

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:52 (sixteen years ago) link

The solution is clear: Worcester.

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:53 (sixteen years ago) link

Um, it's a date Ally! Now I just have to figure out a way to ditch the gf. Or maybe she could come too? Or maybe...... (starting to blush)

Re: MC Bar... Yeah! There's a big Camilo painting of this girl that's dating my friend and all sorts of dumb crap on the walls like "Woodward Avenue" signs. The bartenders were incompetent and it generally sucked, other than for the amusement factor.

Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:55 (sixteen years ago) link

I mean, where the fuck else am I supposed to move to? Chicago??

There's this place called the West Coast...

More seriously, I have always enjoyed visiting NYC. I would never EVER want to live there. All it takes are a few humid days or a few winter days to remind me why, the rest of y'all are welcome to it.

NA's initial point about the mediacentric nature of the celebration of the spot is well taken, though. World exists beyond the Hudson River shockah! I'd love to see Woody Allen figure out what the hell to do with himself in Missoula.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:57 (sixteen years ago) link

What, you think I wasn't bringing the bf? Hell I'm pretty sure if you get him drunk enough something really horrible would happen to that bull, actually. IT'S A DATE. A double date. Too bad Traitor Hand isn't invited, what with his moving to England and all!

The West Coast sucks ass, there are like 4 good things about it.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 14:58 (sixteen years ago) link

The Solution is clear : Worcester.

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:00 (sixteen years ago) link

The West Coast sucks ass, there are like 4 good things about it.

Of course! Me, Noise Noise Noise, Mexican food and all my friends and family. Hurrah!

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:03 (sixteen years ago) link

The solution is clear: Worcester

kephm, Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:05 (sixteen years ago) link

bingo.

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:06 (sixteen years ago) link

Mexican food in Cali is overrated if you've ever lived in Arizona, New Mexico, or Texas, sorry.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:06 (sixteen years ago) link

I'll second Nick on this. A huge group of our sort-of-friends/associates are like, "Yeah, we're all movin' up to New York. Everybody's doing it. so-and-so and so-and-so and their friends so-and-so and so-and-so."
Someone else, "Oh you didn't hear so-and-so and so-and-so are going up too?"
Friend:"OH really? Yeah, so that makes... basically everyone."

We are so not cool. It's like, you decide to move to New York and struggle and be poor as crap and that's supposed to suddenly make you one of them.

Sarah McLusky (coco), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:08 (sixteen years ago) link

I want to move to Chloride, AZ.

kephm, Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:08 (sixteen years ago) link

Mexican food in Cali is overrated if you've ever lived in Arizona, New Mexico, or Texas, sorry.

*bows* You must excuse me. This is more a matter of regional differences than schism (as opposed to talking about Mexican food in those states -- and the country itself -- versus anywhere else in the world, but we've been there).

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:09 (sixteen years ago) link

worcester has good mexican food. we also have wonderful seafood (at the one seafood restaurant).

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:10 (sixteen years ago) link

worcester has many hills. never skateboard in worcester.

kephm, Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:12 (sixteen years ago) link

I'm currently filled with a monstrous urge to hop a flight to da NYC, but that's just cuz one of my old-skool bestest buddies M1c4h L0gsd0n's play (that he wrote, that is) The Working Week and Sunday Rest is dropping this month (opening-night I think is Monday?), and I love my bwoy's work!

nickalicious (nickalicious), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:13 (sixteen years ago) link

Fuck Worcester, it's a hole and I'm also not supposed to go back to Massachusetts anyway.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:14 (sixteen years ago) link

worcester rules. ally is gay.

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:16 (sixteen years ago) link

Anyone besides Tracer want to give these questions a shot:

Why move to NYC and not anywhere else in the world? Is there anything left that's special or unique about NYC that doesn't exist in any other large US city?

NA (Nick A.), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:18 (sixteen years ago) link

I love Haikunym.

Really there's probably nothing more hipster than moving to Brooklyn these days other than doing so while wearing a trucker hat.

When Paul's Boutqiue came out I was fourteen and had it set in my mind then that I *had* to live in NYC. I did move there ten years later but was back in TX in less than two. It was something I had to do, for my own reasons. I'm glad I did but it's not a place I wanted to stay.

Part of me would still love to live in SF b/c I just think it's a fantastic city. But moving is a pain in the ass and any move away from TX would just be temporary for me so why bother?

Texas Sam (thatgirl), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:19 (sixteen years ago) link

To answer NA's question more directly: Mayor Bloomberg is unique to NYC, so people move there for him.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:19 (sixteen years ago) link

if i had a choice to move, it would be to St. Albans, Vermont. 1 hour from Montreal and 6 hours from here. Its quiet, peaceful, condusive to furniture making and beard growing.

although i would be interested in the OC. I have never seen california.

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:21 (sixteen years ago) link

i think if you live in the middle of nowhere & want to get the funk out, nyc is as good a choice as any.
is it a bit trendy to move there? yes.
does this ruin the city? no.
competition is a good thing, esp. for musicians no?

masteroftheobvious, Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:21 (sixteen years ago) link

Yeah, I'm interested in this question, too.

Mandee, Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:21 (sixteen years ago) link

Why move to NYC and not anywhere else in the world?

1) Laziness (I'm originally from here)
2) School
3) Innate hatred of the type of people who come on a thread about NYC and then proceed to big up Worchester and LA.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:22 (sixteen years ago) link

Don't fuck with the Worcester.

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:23 (sixteen years ago) link

++Fuck Worcester, it's a hole.

this line is bending my brain

kephm, Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:24 (sixteen years ago) link

"i think if you live in the middle of nowhere & want to get the funk out, nyc is as good a choice as any."

Yeah, this is kind of my point.

NA (Nick A.), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:24 (sixteen years ago) link

although i would be interested in the OC. I have never seen california.

There are better spots than OC out here, believe me, but I'm comfortable enough. :-)

3) Innate hatred of the type of people who come on a thread about NYC and then proceed to big up Worchester and LA.

Show me where I specifically talked about LA on this thread and I'll agree to this point. ;-)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:25 (sixteen years ago) link

Welcome to Boston's inferiority complex, show starts at 7.

Other reasons for NYC is a built up image of glamour and star power and grit that is long gone and no longer a reality. AKA what Tracer said, it's kind of hard to add anything to what he said. He didn't really mention the drugs.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:26 (sixteen years ago) link

Move to NYC and make out with Chloe Sevigny in seedy locales!

nickalicious (nickalicious), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:26 (sixteen years ago) link

Yeah, that's actually true.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:27 (sixteen years ago) link

Yeah, this is kind of my point.

I'll agree. Right now if I was recommending places to get out to from somewhere -- strictly in American terms -- I'd suggest Seattle or SF, actually. Those living there would probably have their own perspectives on why this would be good or bad.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:27 (sixteen years ago) link

So, Ally, are you essentially saying that there's no good reason to move to NYC as opposed to any other large metropolitan city? Your reasons for moving there seemed mainly personal, and you imply that anything special about the city is now gone. Am I reading you right?

NA (Nick A.), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:28 (sixteen years ago) link

True to what Ally said, post-Giluani NYC is like Disneyland.

I've encountered far more grit living in East Dallas than I did in NYC.

Texas Sam (thatgirl), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:28 (sixteen years ago) link

Don't get me wrong I love NYC. But would never want to live there. Way too much for me. Boston suits me well enough.

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:28 (sixteen years ago) link

NYC appears to be the Glasgow of the States.

Archel (Archel), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:31 (sixteen years ago) link

I've done it.

Who's moving here, Nick? Anyone I know?

And c'mon: NYC = Disneyland? Don't believe yr own hype, yo. NYC's nightlife is amazing, it's the center of the arts universe, it's filled with a ridiculous amount of beautiful people, you don't need a car and if you are aiming for an entertainment- or financial-related job, it's the place to be.

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:32 (sixteen years ago) link

Boston = AAA New York

Modj, Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:32 (sixteen years ago) link

...and it's [NY's] not the center of the arts universe.

...and entertainment jobs are moving to Canada because of the "Canadian Advantage"

Modj, Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:33 (sixteen years ago) link

it's the center of the arts universe

It's stuff like this that sticks in my craw, Yanc3y! I'm not blaming you, I've just heard it too often with further explanation or context -- I'm all for self-fulfilling prophecy and everything but is it actually true?

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:33 (sixteen years ago) link

Nobody you know Yanc3y. Mostly people who were Williamsburg townies or already lived in Richmond, not W&M people.

NA (Nick A.), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:34 (sixteen years ago) link

Hey Yanc3y, ever been to Disneyland? Mickey can tear it up out on the dancefloor.

Texas Sam (thatgirl), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:34 (sixteen years ago) link

Do people in NYC get annoyed with all the hipsters or hipster-wannabes moving in or are there too many people moving in and out all the time to care about the influx?

Sarah Mclusky (coco), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:34 (sixteen years ago) link

Is there anything left that's special or unique about NYC that doesn't exist in any other large US city?

http://www.hollyeats.com/images/New%20York/Hallo-Menu.jpg

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:34 (sixteen years ago) link

Excellent Tracer, see also Chinese Cuban food. (but there are bums everywhere)

Where I worked up there, only two of us were native NYers. Everyone else came from somewhere else. One of those natives, my Creative Director, never travelled in the US really. Why should she, she reasoned, when she lived in NYC. She was half French, half English, hardly bathed and was the most obnoxious person ever.

Texas Sam (thatgirl), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:40 (sixteen years ago) link

wow they have snapple in NYC?

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:41 (sixteen years ago) link

What is Momus doing sleeping on the pavement? And why is he drinking a Snapple?

amateurist (amateurist), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:42 (sixteen years ago) link

Actually, I think that's the singer from Les Savy Fav.

NA (Nick A.), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:43 (sixteen years ago) link

haha worst of both worlds!

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:43 (sixteen years ago) link

my secret hatred of NYC boils down to one thing....the Yankees. Thank you and good night.

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:43 (sixteen years ago) link

Arts universe explanation: Well, I look at it this way -- the vast majority of book and magazine publishing is based here, the news media is based here, there's a ridiculous number of art galleries (both boutique and major ones) here, Broadway is considered the pinnacle of theater (which is both good and bad, obv.), NYC has a thriving music scene and hell! In the parkling lot around the corner from my apartment street people and actors perform King Lear everynight! (tho last week they were doing interpretive dance to Panjabi MC's "Beware the Boys" -- I stayed and watched it every single night. TRULY TRANSCENDENT!!!") The reason I moved to NYC was cuz I wanted to be a writer, and I knew that this was the place to make that happen.

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:44 (sixteen years ago) link

yeah, which makes me another fucking tourist on a long weekend but so fucking what

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:45 (sixteen years ago) link

we've got all that shit in worcester for 1/2 the price.

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:46 (sixteen years ago) link

Every NY'er that ever deigns to visit the rest of the country can be replied upon to complain about the pizza.

I'm glad NY exists.

lawrence kansas (lawrence kansas), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:46 (sixteen years ago) link

and i do interpretive dance to Van Halen.

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:47 (sixteen years ago) link

is there anyone who lives in NY that actually hates it?

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:47 (sixteen years ago) link

Sam there are bums everywhere I know, i wanted to do a diptych that shows: NY has more cultural collision weirdness, encountered on a daily basis, than any other American city i've been to BY FAR, but concomitant with this is more in-your-face human misery, encountered on a daily basis, than any other American city i've been to BY FAR

i hate it, Chris, or at least i've told myself that many times

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:48 (sixteen years ago) link

I wanted to be a writer, and I knew that this was the place to make that happen.

Ya think? I dunno. I have wanted to be/always felt like I am a writer and all, but I figure urban mystique in your brain is where you find it, I can pitch to editors and hash out ideas on-line, you can download all the music and art and whatever you like in life these days, and I can walk out from my door and get great ramen, soul food, Cuban cuisine and fish tacos (and Iranian and Indian food etc.) within a hundred yards. So I dunno, it seems less necessary that NYC specifically should be it.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:49 (sixteen years ago) link

Tracer's German Soul Food photo is the most OTM thing on this thread. I was gonna post a defense of my town but he's already said it all.

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:50 (sixteen years ago) link

I admit that's pretty sweet. There's this one Chinese 50s style drive in around OC that could rival it, though.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:50 (sixteen years ago) link

I think the best place to live as a writer is the place that makes you feel like writing -- I'm not sure local networking is as necessary as it was before the prevalence of the internet, and even comic book writers -- who need to exchange stuff back and forth between editor and artist and letterer and keep to a monthly schedule -- live all over the planet now.

NYC undoubtedly offers more writing-related job opportunities than many places, though.

(The German Soul Food is one of the few things that has made me want to visit NYC.)

Tep (ktepi), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:51 (sixteen years ago) link

I don't understand. It looks just like German food only the word "soul" is thrown in there for no reason that I can see.

lawrence kansas (lawrence kansas), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:53 (sixteen years ago) link

it's pretty much our platonic ideal of 'the city;' anywhere else is just 'a city.'

g--ff c-nn-n (gcannon), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:53 (sixteen years ago) link

Yeah, moving to NYC to pursue a creative field=well and good.

Being moved to write verse/stories/songs/scripts about it and capture the "vibe"=horribly cliche.

Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:53 (sixteen years ago) link

But do ya got Thai gyros? I THOUGHT NOT.

nickalicious (nickalicious), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:53 (sixteen years ago) link

NYC undoubtedly offers more writing-related job opportunities than many places, though.

I'm sure you're right there, given the publishing houses and all -- since that's never really appealed to me as a career path, NYC was never going to be a beacon on that front, but for others (Nabisco, for instance?) it would be a darn good holy grail.

it's pretty much our platonic ideal of 'the city;' anywhere else is just 'a city.'

*rubs chin* Sorta yes, sorta no. Mine seems to be a combination of NYC's transit setup with Melbourne's beachfront and SoCal's food.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:54 (sixteen years ago) link

I don't understand. It looks just like German food only the word "soul" is thrown in there for no reason that I can see.

and therein lies the humor

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:55 (sixteen years ago) link

As far as a place to be that makes you feel like writing a big city wouldn't do it for me. Too many distractions. Im country all the way. Give me cow shit, green grass, pine trees and lakes.

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:55 (sixteen years ago) link

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/summer/popband.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:56 (sixteen years ago) link

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/summer/skyline.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:56 (sixteen years ago) link

I've got a pop band here in my pocket!

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:56 (sixteen years ago) link

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/images/myhouse.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:56 (sixteen years ago) link

NY has more cultural collision weirdness, encountered on a daily basis, than any other American city i've been to BY FAR, but concomitant with this is more in-your-face human misery, encountered on a daily basis, than any other American city i've been to BY FAR

That's because, what 8 million people pack themselves into 25 square miles or something every single day? (i'm pulling these numbers out of my ass but I'm sure they're not too far off). That's one of the biggest reasons I have for no longer living there.

The most desolate, decript bums I've ever encountered were in London.

Texas Sam (thatgirl), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:58 (sixteen years ago) link

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/images/blizzardycar.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:58 (sixteen years ago) link

I guess I was expecting this big culture clash mash up of greens and wurst or something.

lawrence kansas (lawrence kansas), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:58 (sixteen years ago) link

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/images/budweiser.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:58 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.kossarsbialys.com/

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:58 (sixteen years ago) link

Get yer brats on.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:59 (sixteen years ago) link

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/images/panties.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 15:59 (sixteen years ago) link

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/summer/avenuex.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:00 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.informatik.uni-trier.de/~sack/us25.jpg

We have a million diners.

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:00 (sixteen years ago) link

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/summer/cyclone.jpg

(these pictures are all my answers to the question)

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:01 (sixteen years ago) link

An old mental hospital.
>img src="http://www.informatik.uni-trier.de/~sack/us14.jpg">

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:01 (sixteen years ago) link

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/summer/freakshow.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:01 (sixteen years ago) link

An old mental hospital.
http://www.informatik.uni-trier.de/~sack/us14.jpg

Chris V. (Chris V), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:02 (sixteen years ago) link

Those winter pictures are lovely Ally, but really could be in any city in the midwest.

Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:02 (sixteen years ago) link

But if we have the pictures, do we need to go now? *hides*

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:02 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.tribeofman.com/images/NEW%20YORK%20CITY%2311.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:03 (sixteen years ago) link

Those winter pictures are lovely Ally, but really could be in any city in the midwest.

B-b-but if you move here you can have the midwest AND Germany AND Worcester and a million other places all in one city with an easily navigable and reasonably cheap transportation system!

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:04 (sixteen years ago) link

I'm wondering too if there could be any cache to moving to NYC now, after 9/11. Thoughts?

I think most of the reasons one would have for living and loving where you live are personal. They can seem like nice reasons to others but unless they're *your* reasons no one else is going to get them.

Texas Sam (thatgirl), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:06 (sixteen years ago) link

They couldn't be any city in the midwest--all those photos were taken about 2 feet from Central Park, which is the nicest municipal park I've ever gone to in any city.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:07 (sixteen years ago) link

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/images/after.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:09 (sixteen years ago) link

Not technically in the city but within such a reasonable distance:

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/images/belmont.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:10 (sixteen years ago) link

Seriously, the pictures are really good pro-NYC arguments...

..for visiting.

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:12 (sixteen years ago) link

We aren't asking you to move here.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:12 (sixteen years ago) link

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/July4/legoclash1.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:13 (sixteen years ago) link

Heh, well the impetus of the thread was about people specifically moving to New York City.

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:14 (sixteen years ago) link

NA - I'll try to justify later, but for people who live here, honestly, we hold the truth to be self-evident

(also, um, some people grew up here)

gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:15 (sixteen years ago) link

Yeah, but I don't WANT any of you people moving here!

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:15 (sixteen years ago) link

http://toddcam.com/site/nycity/helltcpx.jpg

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:15 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.worldsbestbars.com/images/bars/22_big.jpg

(Tracer, Felicity, Mary, bnw--look familiar?)

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:17 (sixteen years ago) link


Yeah, but I don't WANT any of you people moving here!

Then why make the case for how great it is for all the random googlers who will eventually read the thread! ;-)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:19 (sixteen years ago) link

More discussion, less pictures!

Texas Sam (thatgirl), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:19 (sixteen years ago) link

Yeah, but I don't WANT any of you people moving here!

..says the Phoenix native?

Sorry, Ally, didn't mean to be flippant. No one should be made to feel guilty about moving to any place if they just feel it suits them. But I think NA's indirect point is that there is nagging "NY is the only place" vibe that gets tiring after a while. (not accusing you of that)

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:20 (sixteen years ago) link

Um, DB, I'm NOT a Phoenix native. Living in a place != being born in a place. My dad was temporarily transferred to Phoenix when I was about 12. Where he promptly lost his job when the aerospace industry went "You want a job? Fuck you niggaz!" in the early '90s. Thus stranding my entire family in Phoenix for quite some time. There's a reason why as soon as I had saved up enough cash to buy a one way ticket and a deposit on an apt, I bolted. NYC represented a time in my life when I was happy. Everywhere else did not. NYC won.

http://www.essentialbigapple.com/graphics/66stsign.jpg

Gareth's pix are lovely :)

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:22 (sixteen years ago) link

Goddamn. Too late to weigh in properly on this thread, I guess.

I'll say this, though. I certainly wish fuckin' less people would move here and leave the city for those snobby shits like myself who were actually born here, goddammit!


Just kidding......sorta.

Alex in NYC (vassifer), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:22 (sixteen years ago) link

Ally's NYC seems different from Jody's NYC which seems different from Tracer's NYC.

amateurist (amateurist), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:23 (sixteen years ago) link

also, um, some people grew up here

And some elsewhere! And that's a large part of it too, what feels like 'home,' wherever it is. I had the best of both worlds, I think, in that I grew up moving around to various places -- including upstate New York, let us not forget! -- but kept coming back to San Diego as a home. I'm used to SoCal, its weather and its ways and its atmosphere, and I dearly love it still. For all the cases that can be made for NYC and all the comparative inconveniences that may occur -- the whole 'how do you live in SoCal without a car' thing, f'r instance -- there's as much captivation and potential magic here as there is there. I wouldn't make the case for it being better than NYC but I *would* make the case that it's more equal than either side would realize, and you could make similar comparisons for many other cities and NYC at that.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:23 (sixteen years ago) link

I'd love to move there, but I want some kind of idea of what I'd do (a job, ie) waiting for me. call me unadventurous, I guess.

ha, nativism, gimme a break.

g--ff c-nn-n (gcannon), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:24 (sixteen years ago) link

Yeah, thank you for bringing up a really painful experience, actually! That's not even the worst thing that happened to me in Arizona. My parents are still stuck there, having never recovered from spending about 4 or 5 years on $5k income per year with four kids and having to declare bankruptsy. One day they might be able to move back to the east coast again, and one day I might be able to see them more than, like, once every two or three years. That'd be awesome.

To me, the western states are one big vacuous hole of hellpit.

So yeah, to me, people move to NYC for personal reasons. Other people might be here for other reasons, but since I never ask them, I don't speculate why they might want to be here.

(massive xpost)

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:24 (sixteen years ago) link

Ah, my mistake, Ally, about the Phoenix thing. Sorry. (Though I think having that experience taint your view of the entire west coast is a bit much though.)

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:26 (sixteen years ago) link

My NYC's a lot like Tracer's NYC, but I had a bunch of the photos I posted on this thread bookmarked from showing them to someone recently, so I just pulled them up. :-)

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:26 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.graffiti.org/nyctrains/blend.jpg

Alex in NYC (vassifer), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:26 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.graffiti.org/nyctrains/character.jpg

Alex in NYC (vassifer), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:27 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.umass.edu/tei/ogia/gallery/newyork/subway.jpg

(I'm going back to posting pix, I want to scan in the rest of my photography tonight and upload! So now I am relying on others)

(I thought the west coast was boring before I had a whole lot of shit happen to me)

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:27 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.marcwinnat.com/mw3.jpg

Alex in NYC (vassifer), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:28 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.fenichel.com/72sub-2754-m.jpg

(hahaha everyone on ILX can figure out exactly where I live from my pictures on this thread, it's great)

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:28 (sixteen years ago) link

Part of me would still love to live in SF b/c I just think it's a fantastic city. But moving is a pain in the ass and any move away from TX would just be temporary for me so why bother?

I think I may move to SF at the end of the year Sam, so if you want to visit...

luna (luna.c), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:29 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.urban75.org/photos/newyork/images/ny376.jpg

Alex in NYC (vassifer), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:29 (sixteen years ago) link

I thought the west coast was boring before I had a whole lot of shit happen to me

Can we admit it's all about stereotypes (and ones which pretend the rest of the country doesn't exist)?

East Coast on West: 'Shallow, obsessed with surfaces losers!'

West Coast on East: 'Pretentious, snobbish idiots!'

Truth of matter: 'There are things to like and dislike about both places, actually. D'oh.'

Rest of country: 'Fuck you and your ocean-moderated weather.'

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:30 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.fenichel.com/AnsoniaVerdi2751-m.jpg

ALSO my NYC is covered in snow at all times.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:30 (sixteen years ago) link

I love the west coast. The whole damn thing, top to bottom.

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:33 (sixteen years ago) link

Actually, this thread was necessary for, if any reason, making me want to go out this weekend in Seattle and take nothing but pictures of what I hold dearest about it. Stay tuned for a "Seattle is for sellouts" thread soon!

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:35 (sixteen years ago) link

See this is why Texas is so great. We're between both coasts and could give fuck all what either side thinks about anything. We know it's all goin' down in the center. ;)

Texas Sam (thatgirl), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:36 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.frankjump.com/046.jpg

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:36 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.missingfoundation.com/images/logo001.gif

Alex in NYC (vassifer), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:36 (sixteen years ago) link

Stay tuned for a "Seattle is for sellouts" thread soon!

1991 to thread!

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:36 (sixteen years ago) link

Argh. I go to lunch and this turns into a pic thread.

Okay, I can only talk from my experience. I've lived in the Midwest for all my life, but because my grandparents lived in NYC and my parents grew up there, it has always felt like my second home. When I was young, it was completely intimidating and overwhelming and I used to have panic attacks trying to walk down the street. When I reached high school and college, it suddenly changed and made sense.

New York is impractical. This is why I love it. There is more going on there at any given moment than anywhere in the world, and the thing is, it's all accessable.

That's because, what 8 million people pack themselves into 25 square miles or something every single day? (i'm pulling these numbers out of my ass but I'm sure they're not too far off). That's one of the biggest reasons I have for no longer living there.

This is also why I love it and can't wait to move. Somehow, when so many people have been crammed into the same space, their underlying humanity comes out. I know it's hard to believe and most won't believe it, but I've experienced it every time I visit.

So, anyway, I'm going to law school with an eye to go into media/entertainment law... that's why I'm moving.

Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:37 (sixteen years ago) link

You're entirely right about the underlying humanity in 9 times out of 10 people, Aaron. The 1 left is insane, which makes the city even better.

http://www.rushmillerfoundation.org/FOA%20-%20FDNY%20L-35.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:39 (sixteen years ago) link

Good luck, Aaron!

Nordicskillz (Nordicskillz), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:40 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.sorabji.com/1999/february/4/bull_1.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:41 (sixteen years ago) link

I used to live between 44th and 45th in the same building as one of the German soul food locations mentioned in the sign. After that I lived in the (indeed) family friendly Carroll Gardens, Brooklyn.

After that I left NYC because it became extremely tiresome, increasingly difficult to afford (and still have money to have a life and things I want), and generally anxiety-inducing. I will be the first to admit that my inability to deal with anxiety well was the most important part of the decision and a factor in both of the other reasons I state.

That said, if one enjoys the constant buzzing of activity 24 hours a day, seven days a week, I cannot think of a place in the US that will deliver quite as well as NYC. Aaron's right... there is something magical about how insanely active the place is, but the other side of that is that it's extremely difficult for some people to relax in that city no matter how badly they want to.

I have severely ambivalent feelings toward NYC, but I definitely don't hate it. I just wouldn't want to live there again.

martin m. (mushrush), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:42 (sixteen years ago) link

Moving anywhere is "selling out." Do people really care about this stuff?

bnw (bnw), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:43 (sixteen years ago) link

Somehow, when so many people have been crammed into the same space, their underlying humanity comes out.

Yeah, I'm being a devil's advocate, but for a point. ;-)

As you say, you speak from your own experience -- speaking from mine, the humanity in a place that's more spread out than compacted is no less present and no less affected. And stepping away from where I live to even quieter areas...I've found it's there. Not in the cliched Ray Bradbury-as-misinterpreted-by-morons fever dream of some sort of rural purity of spirit, but just in casual "Hey, what's up? How are ya?" attitudes.

Humanity is where you find it, and I find it everywhere, compacted or diffused. Thank goodness for that too.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:44 (sixteen years ago) link

No, Byron, we just want to post pretty things.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:45 (sixteen years ago) link

You really need a cast-iron constitution to live here, and sometimes that means sticking around long enough to develop one. That's why the native New Yorkers are so fond of the place -- they've gotten used to all the high-pitched craziness and can actually enjoy themselves.

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:46 (sixteen years ago) link

>>Stay tuned for a "Seattle is for sellouts" thread soon!

1991 to thread!

Look, I never denied I was a dated fuckhead. ( ;-) )

Moving anywhere is "selling out." Do people really care about this stuff?

Heh, I pointed this out earlier. But apparently, people still do...(although in Washington and Oregon states, there might be some valid arguments as to why there's a tradition of hating Cali immigrants.. i'm guilty as charged, your honor)

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:46 (sixteen years ago) link

Martin sums up why NY isn't for me. Relaxation is my middle name. I need only some of the things a bigger city provides and I also need some serious country living within twenty miles.

lawrence kansas (lawrence kansas), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:50 (sixteen years ago) link

New York City != Manhattan

(and if you don't find some of the photos in this thread idyllic and peaceful, you're not looking hard enough)

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:53 (sixteen years ago) link

how do "the arts" have a center?
people create art. buildings & bratwurst do not.
move to tokyo if you want the madd influence/energy of many people going on in one place. better yet, find a decent hill in any suburb and look down at lights flickering in the cookie cutter houses=who really cares???


KING KONG, Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:53 (sixteen years ago) link

I need only some of the things a bigger city provides and I also need some serious country living within twenty miles.

So, like, um, all the beach pictures and woodsy pictures already posted don't count?

(xpost)

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:54 (sixteen years ago) link

I think I would have enjoyed and "needed" NYC during my college years, so i'm actually a little sad i never had the chance to experience it then, or go to college there, but now I think I've become more a member of the relaxation camp, as Martin and Lawrence put it, and i can't get too excited about the prospect of moving to NYC no mo.

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:54 (sixteen years ago) link

THERE'S PLENTY OF RELAXATION HERE GODDAMMIT!!!!!!!!!!!!1111

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:55 (sixteen years ago) link

Within 45 minutes of the dead center of the city:

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/summer/umbrella.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:56 (sixteen years ago) link

THERE'S PLENTY OF RELAXATION HERE GODDAMMIT!!!!!!!!!!!!1111

Best post of the thread so far.

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:57 (sixteen years ago) link

f*ck influence, population & history.
all very overrated

kephm, Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:57 (sixteen years ago) link

Worcester has NKOTB, I do admit that's pretty good.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:58 (sixteen years ago) link

So, like, um, all the beach pictures and woodsy pictures already posted don't count?

I think Lawrence is suggesting they wouldn't count if a good chunk of the eight million are there with him searching for peace and quiet.

To be fair, I've found perfect serenity more than once in the middle of Manhattan, and not in Central Park even. But I think it's more a matter of state of mind, really. Celebrating the rush of everything is similar -- it's not always NEEDED, but it's certainly nice to have around. But at the same time, I've found similar rushes in plenty of other cities (London, SF, Seattle, Melbourne, LA itself), which again takes us back to the whole 'why this city in particular' conundrum we started with...

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:58 (sixteen years ago) link

My own dislike of the major western cities aside, does no one else on this thread seem to realize that "I'm moving to NYC" != "I'm NOT moving anywhere else"? I.E. it is not a diss for god's sake.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 16:59 (sixteen years ago) link

Heavens! You NY'ers are an excitable bunch ;-)

lawrence kansas (lawrence kansas), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:01 (sixteen years ago) link

Holy crap that's a giant pic.

Good luck, Aaron! Thanks Nordic! Hope your SF living situation works out as well. My fingers are crossed for you.

Another thing I love about NY is how green it is. Unless you've been or visited you don't realize how many parks and trees there are. Detroit, by comparision, definitely is an asphalt jungle.

Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:01 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.pbs.org/jazz/images/places/times-square-2.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:01 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.evanzucker.com/times%20square%20billboard.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:02 (sixteen years ago) link

Okay, now I really want to move to NYC.

luna (luna.c), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:02 (sixteen years ago) link

Holy crap that's a giant pic.

I assume a beach, but what beach?

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:02 (sixteen years ago) link

Is it that big of a picture? It's not big on my computer. (I'm assuming you meant mine) It's Sandy Hook, NJ.

http://www.payphone-project.com/payphones/photos/usa/212/square.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:04 (sixteen years ago) link

Another huge one but this isn't mine, no control

http://www.stat.uiuc.edu/~masha/nyc/met1.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:06 (sixteen years ago) link

Breathe easy, DB. Census says more people move from WA to CA every year than vice versa.

(Did you get my email?)

chester (synkro), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:06 (sixteen years ago) link

does no one else on this thread seem to realize that "I'm moving to NYC" != "I'm NOT moving anywhere else"? I.E. it is not a diss for god's sake

It's all context, though.

"I'm moving to NYC because it seems cool (or from past experience, one knows it is cool) and I think I would enjoy it given my interests and goals." = very spiff

"I'm moving to NYC because there is nowhere else in the world that has anything like any of this anywhere else and I refuse to believe that anyone would say otherwise and anyone who does just doesn't understand." = er (and NO, I don't think anyone on this thread has said this -- but I have encountered it face to face more than once, and it just makes me scratch my head)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:06 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.ne.jp/asahi/hp/mastervision/guggenheim.jpg

Ned, you do this on every single thread about any city ever. "Oh yes it's lovely but I only want to live on the west coast". Do you realize this?

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:08 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.dvdtalk.com/images/BMA.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:08 (sixteen years ago) link

http://www.bigappleweb.vitare.de/sightsee/san_gennaro.gif

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:10 (sixteen years ago) link

Haha now I'm annoying myself that I'm not at home to scan in my own photographs cos they're better than the touristy shots I'm finding online, fuck being at work.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:10 (sixteen years ago) link

I didn't say NYC = Manhattan. I lived in Brooklyn for two of the four years I spent in NYC. And there are plenty of places within city limits that I'm sure are quite relaxing for many people. I personally have trouble relaxing in areas with too many other people around, which is most everywhere in NYC. I did say it was my experience and my situation and not necessarily everyone's.

I think everyone's wanting to move to NYC is fine. It just means that there will be less people in Seattle when I move there at the end of September, and that's fine with me.

martin m. (mushrush), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:10 (sixteen years ago) link

Oh, and I do love Brooklyn. Love love love it. But am not prepared to live there again for a long while...

martin m. (mushrush), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:11 (sixteen years ago) link

areas with too many other people around, which is most everywhere in NYC

wrong

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:12 (sixteen years ago) link

Ned, you do this on every single thread about any city ever. "Oh yes it's lovely but I only want to live on the west coast". Do you realize this?

If I do, it is partially hyperbolic. I've considered a move to Michigan seriously at one point, for instance, in another instance was coming around to the idea of living in the UK, and looking in the future both Australia and New Zealand were captivating enough for me to want to visit again and not necessarily rule out a move. I don't necessarily think I'll be living on the west coast the rest of my life.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:12 (sixteen years ago) link

http://medlem.spray.se/johanochelin/chinatow.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:13 (sixteen years ago) link

I've considered a move to Michigan seriously at one point, for instance

I'm so sorry, Ned!

Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:20 (sixteen years ago) link

We could have a whole spinoff thread on "people who move to places for dumb reasons," I think; I have more respect, approval, whatever, for any of the upthread reasons to move to NYC than I do the "hey, tits and beer, party on!" kids who move to New Orleans. (Or the "hey, Anne Rice and goths, mope on!" kids, for that.)

Tep (ktepi), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:20 (sixteen years ago) link

wrong

Fair enough, and you'd know better than I, but in the time I was there I didn't have much luck finding the kind of places I needed to find for me.

Not only that, but the amount of $$ necessary to live there was enough to make relaxation nearly impossible for me even if I had known of a place I could go to be alone for a while.

martin m. (mushrush), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:20 (sixteen years ago) link

Heh. It was because of your employer too, Aaron! ;-)

I have more respect, approval, whatever, for any of the upthread reasons to move to NYC

Agreed there. Ain't nobody here idiots none, which is the point, really.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:21 (sixteen years ago) link

Well, you made the right decision not moving, obviously!

Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:22 (sixteen years ago) link

JBR, remember yr approaching this as a natvie NYer and probably don't have the set of expectations in terms of 'relaxation' and 'personal space' that people from other parts of the country have.

Texas Sam (thatgirl), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:23 (sixteen years ago) link

Sam, I need as much relaxation and personal space as anyone! Also I may be a native New Yorker but I've lived in semi-rural areas and small cities. NYC isn't my only frame of reference.

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:26 (sixteen years ago) link

128 new posts in the hour that I was at lunch. That's what I like to see. Gabbnebb, see the caveat at the end of my first post re: native NYers.

The pics are beautiful, but prove nothing. Anybody from any city can post pretty pictures of their home city. Sorry, but it's true.

Anyways, I didn't mean for this thread to be "people that live in NYC, defend it," but rather: Why is NYC is the default place for people to move to? I like NYC, it's great fun, but I've had just as much fun in every city I've lived in or visited. Do people just have no imagination?

NA (Nick A.), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:26 (sixteen years ago) link

The short answer? Yes.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:27 (sixteen years ago) link

And JBR is right, it seems quite a fallacy to assume that the people born in NYC have no other frame of reference for living...there's no need for a "unless you were born there" caveat because it's not like any of us are trapped here.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:29 (sixteen years ago) link

The pics are beautiful, but prove nothing.

I hate to say this because it sounds like I'm saying "lady, if you have to ask..." but if these photos prove nothing to you about why people would want to move here, I feel sorry for you.

Why is NYC is the default place for people to move to?

Live here for a while (and by "live here" I mean "actually take advantage of the place") and you'll understand why so many people move here.

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:30 (sixteen years ago) link

but if these photos prove nothing to you about why people would want to move here, I feel sorry for you.

I really think this is just a very, very subjective thing. What a place looks like wouldn't even make my top ten list for why I would or wouldn't want to live somewhere, and not much of the content (like, what they're photos of, as opposed to how nice they look) would really sway me one way or the other. People want different things from where they are; if that weren't the case, the only things that would vary would be climate and cost of living.

Tep (ktepi), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:32 (sixteen years ago) link

It's just one of those "use other words please" debates, I suppose. I'm not someone who is looking for tons of personal space/relaxation time but when I want to just be alone I have absolutely no trouble finding it. I understand that there are specific cases and stuff who cannot live at all under city conditions (ie I don't think martin is "wrong" in his case) but as a generalization it's about as accurate and useful as the concept that, for example, everyone in SoCal is vacuous and slow-moving. This is an obvious fallacy as much as everyone in NYC being tense and packed like sardines is.

(xpost--like I said, there is no way to describe in words why any of us live here besides the explanations already given, so we're using pretty pictures to help illustrate. None of us can speak for the specific people being asked about being as they aren't the ones replying to you)

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:33 (sixteen years ago) link

Anyways, I didn't mean for this thread to be "people that live in NYC, defend it," but rather: Why is NYC is the default place for people to move to? I like NYC, it's great fun, but I've had just as much fun in every city I've lived in or visited. Do people just have no imagination?

I mean I'd hate to think you're implying that people who choose to live here have no imagination.

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:33 (sixteen years ago) link

My photos are not being posted necessarily because of what they look like, though there are a couple of ones that are actually mine (not googled) that I'm kind of proud of. The context and content are the point of mine, not that they're beautiful to look at! One of them is actually my house.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:34 (sixteen years ago) link

When I was in Chicago for a month, I was surprised to find that the majority of people I met in, uh, "Chicago hipster bars" weren't from Chicago either. Ohio, Missouri, Michigan, Texas, the Rockies, even some West Coast transplants. So its not only NYC that the kids are moving to.

phil-two (phil-two), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:34 (sixteen years ago) link

The pics are beautiful, but prove nothing.

Well, to be fair, NA, you did kinda spring this thread during the day when proud New Yawrkers are at work and can't go home to prepare Powerpoint slides and portfolios. :)

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:38 (sixteen years ago) link

When I was in Chicago for a month, I was surprised to find that the majority of people I met in, uh, "Chicago hipster bars" weren't from Chicago either. Ohio, Missouri, Michigan, Texas, the Rockies, even some West Coast transplants. So its not only NYC that the kids are moving to.

Yeah, I always felt like the real sellouts are the people who move to Chicago instead of New York because it's "easier to make it." If that's the case, why not stay in Ohio, Missouri, Michigan, the Rockies, etc.?

Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:39 (sixteen years ago) link

My school looks like a city unto itself!

http://www.cap.bnl.gov/nufact03/campus_lo2-020924c.jpg

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:40 (sixteen years ago) link

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:40 (sixteen years ago) link

Again, I kinda like how this thread turned out -- if for anything, that we'll see more "[city that you love] is for sellouts..." threads showing some great and yet not so necessarily touristy photos.

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:41 (sixteen years ago) link

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:42 (sixteen years ago) link

No, PBR, I'm not implying that all New Yorkers lack imagination. I'm implying that people who move to NYC without considering moving to any other US city just because it's NYC so it's gotta be great! lack imagination.

NA (Nick A.), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:42 (sixteen years ago) link

No, PBR, I'm not implying that all New Yorkers lack imagination. I'm implying that people who move to NYC without considering moving to any other US city just because it's NYC so it's gotta be great! lack imagination.

Maybe they're more informed than you think?

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:44 (sixteen years ago) link

name one person who moved to nyc for this reason

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:44 (sixteen years ago) link

besides momus

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:44 (sixteen years ago) link

zing

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:45 (sixteen years ago) link

For what reason? Jason Sehorn?

http://www.jericbarnes.com/shp/columbia/images/large_columbia_statue.JPG

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:46 (sixteen years ago) link

I only need one good reason to move to NYC and that I've got. Unfortunately I also need a job.

Millar (Millar), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:49 (sixteen years ago) link

I'm implying that people who move to NYC without considering moving to any other US city just because it's NYC so it's gotta be great! lack imagination

How do they necessarily lack imagination? NYC is well documented as great by a number of sources. So are some other cities, but arguably none as much as New York. So what imagination are they lacking? The imagination that will convince them that some other city is great when they've never heard anything great about it? Is it lack of imagination that causes people to go with a "sure win" instead of something more risky?

I'm moving to Seattle after living in New York and Nashville, but I don't think I'm any more imaginative now than when I wanted to move to NYC. Seattle was suggested to me by a few people who know me well as a place they thought I'd like, and I had started seriously considering moving there. I finally had a chance to visit it, and I did like it a lot, so I'm moving. But I don't think imagination had much to do with it at all.

martin m. (mushrush), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:49 (sixteen years ago) link

My imagination tells me I should live under the sea.

Texas Sam (thatgirl), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:50 (sixteen years ago) link

in fact, regarding my current occupational experience and situation I'm kind of selling out by staying in the DC area.

xpost for shit

Millar (Millar), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:51 (sixteen years ago) link

I only need one good reason to move to NYC and that I've got. Unfortunately I also need a job.

I hear NYC has a huge demand for Ringo Starr impersonators.

Larcole (Nicole), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:52 (sixteen years ago) link

My imagination always said I should become a space hooker and pilot the Millennium Falcon to be honest. All silver clothes and space cowboys, yo. What the fuck, NYC is total ass compared to that.

Fuck having a job in NYC, I'm not going to have one in approximately 4 months and it'll be wonderful.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:52 (sixteen years ago) link

My apartment has a huge demand for such, at least.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:53 (sixteen years ago) link

Ally, move to Tokyo with me.

phil-two (phil-two), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:54 (sixteen years ago) link

Defending NYC brings Ally and JBR together! What further proof does one need?!?!??!

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:55 (sixteen years ago) link

Can I change my name to Fujiko, Phil? Cos I am so in!

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:55 (sixteen years ago) link

Ny is too pally

lawrence kansas (lawrence kansas), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:56 (sixteen years ago) link

My real reasons for staying in NYC.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 17:58 (sixteen years ago) link

I still don't understand why you would think moving to NYC is for sellouts. I don't think it's "mythology" at all that there are more opportunities to do whatever the hell you could possibly think of here than anywhere else in the world. I guess maybe except surfing. That's better on the west coast. If you wanted to get into publishing, why the hell would you want to move to Chattanooga? and so on.

phil-two (phil-two), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:00 (sixteen years ago) link

I guess I'm just irrational, but when 800 million people start to talk about how great something is, I instantly want to dislike it.

NA (Nick A.), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:00 (sixteen years ago) link

no you're right - new york does suck

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:02 (sixteen years ago) link

Fujiko Kearney?

phil-two (phil-two), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:02 (sixteen years ago) link

remember yr approaching this as a natvie NYer and probably don't have the set of expectations in terms of 'relaxation' and 'personal space' that people from other parts of the country have.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:04 (sixteen years ago) link

Blount, what do you like exactly?

Phil, yeah, I like that. Can I bring a guest on this move? Can I wear silver space shoes?

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:04 (sixteen years ago) link

Argh. I am not saying that New York sucks or that people that live there are stupid or even that people that move there are stupid.

I think I need a cooling off period. I'm not reading this thread again until 3:45. That's 37 minutes from now.

NA (Nick A.), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:06 (sixteen years ago) link

it would help if you could provide one example of a person moving to nyc for the reason you state

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:08 (sixteen years ago) link

you can wear whatever you want, fujiko... except no panties.

i need to find someone to move with me. i donut want to go all alone :(

phil-two (phil-two), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:10 (sixteen years ago) link

I posted a better explanation of my statment about expectations above but the browser crashed so whatever, bleh. this thread's totatlly not what Nick wanted anyway.

I want to talk about living under the sea.

Texas Sam (thatgirl), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:12 (sixteen years ago) link

Like I even wear panties half the time anyway, dude do you even realize how long I went without doing laundry? The women who did my laundry for me wree probably thinking I was a prostitute with all the panties they washed.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:12 (sixteen years ago) link

Whoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooolivesinapineappleunderthesea?

luna (luna.c), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:13 (sixteen years ago) link

why move to NYC and not anywhere else in the world?

Well for one thing, NYC is located at a convenient midpoint between London and Los Angeles (my second- and third-favorite cities).

felicity (felicity), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:13 (sixteen years ago) link

SPONGE BOB SQUAREPANTS!!!!!!!!

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:14 (sixteen years ago) link

There's no point in naming names as you wouldn't know any of the people, but there is quite a crowd of folks moving from Richmond up to New York City this summer. I asked the one who is closest to me, Tim, why he's going there and he's just like, "Meh." Then he started talking about how he wants to do something with his life because he's bored. It's like, you move to NYC and suddenly your life means something (uh, not you, just you in a generic sense).

Anyway, this thread got rather touchy. Who knew?

Sarah McLUsky (coco), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:17 (sixteen years ago) link

I'm sure NYC is a lovely place to live in. I mean, heck, I've entertained thoughts of living there from time to time. (Not as much as I've entertained thoughts of living in London, though -- my Anglophilia rules over all.) But I think the general point of this thread is that people who move to a place because it's supposedly "hip" and "cooler than thou" and offers this gigantic mystique that could very easily be had many other places around the U.S. (or even around the world) are not exactly thinking clearly. Sure, if you feel this intense draw to move somewhere, move there, but after you weigh all sides and you are truly prepared to live where you are moving to. Or, conversely, if you live somewhere already where you feel comfortable living in, stay there. No need to move about or have to defend why you love your home.

In fact, I can totally understand it if one might be tired of defending one's home locale. Lord knows how many times I've had to explain to incredibly ignorant people that Texas is a wonderful state, that we are modern, that we have all the comforts of living in any other state in the U.S., that we aren't the way we're depicted on TV and in the movies, etc. One of the few moments when I was moved to cry in deepest anger was when I was watching the episode of "Coach" supposedly set in my city (San Antonio, for those not paying attention *wink*), that was filled with all of these horrid and humiliating stereotypes of what the city was supposed to be like instead of anything even remotely resembling what the city really is like. I do realize that yes, this is a sitcom, and yes, they are bound to do this, but imagine being younger and not living in this city. Imagine being influenced by what you watch on TV in regards to what your opinions and thoughts of a particular place is, and having nothing but horrible old and decayed stereotypes that essentially add up to "oh, avoid this backwards place" thoughts. It really hurts. It really hurts me every time I see something on TV or in a movie that shows Texas in a negative light, because we have had so few opportunities in the past to have it shown in a positive light OR EVEN IN JUST A REGULAR, TRUTHFUL LIGHT. To me, it's just as if there was a movie that was released and the central female figure was this huge, cartoonish, firey Latina maid who sang mariachi songs and said "Madre de Dios" every half minute, and who had that ridiculous frilly off-the-shoulders blouse and wore horrendously bright red lipstick, and this creature was presented as a Real, True Latina.

*ahem* Many sorries. I digress. Just had some issues to work out.

Anyway, if you're a huge fan of NYC, good for you. If you're a huge fan of another location, good for you. Just try to keep your mind open to the fact that there are other locations out there with their own fans and their own good points, and that there are people EVERYWHERE who wouldn't give up their OWN locations for all the money in the world. This goes for both sides here.

Just Deanna (Dee the Lurker), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:20 (sixteen years ago) link

But not one person on this thread has given any single reason as to why A) moving to a place cos you think the place seems cool is bad B) who is actually up and doing this anyway. Sarah kind of just gave B right now. No one is trashing any other city here nor is anyone saying you shouldn't live in your chosen locale.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:22 (sixteen years ago) link

Ok, I must've missed something here.

Don't mind me. Am just going through a really touchy period. Thanks.

Just Deanna (Dee the Lurker), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:25 (sixteen years ago) link

i donut want to go all alone :(

!!

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:25 (sixteen years ago) link

I think it's a sign that you need to come to Tokyo too.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:26 (sixteen years ago) link

You can't build space stations in NYC. To build space stations you have to move to Alabama.

Millar (Millar), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:27 (sixteen years ago) link

Not enough people think under the sea is cool.

Texas Sam (thatgirl), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:27 (sixteen years ago) link

Um, well Sarah and NA, I guess the point is.. you guys already know better. So spread some science to your friends, yo. :) And tell them NYC don't got no X10, Pop Faction, Avail, nor Rah Bras nor all the awesome folks at Elwood Thompson's.

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:29 (sixteen years ago) link

I think part of the weird thing is not that people would move somewhere that they think is cool, but that when they announce they are moving to NYC it's like this announcement that they're so much cooler than you. Perhaps it's in the delivery. And I realize one could say I'm just jealous, but it's just bizarre. And it's such a big to-do.
Sometimes, it sounds like:
* I have decided... to move to NEW YORK CITY. Yes, it is true. I am really cool and god said that I could move there. I am a chosen one.

Sarah McLusky (coco), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:30 (sixteen years ago) link

OK let's move to Alabama immediately.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:30 (sixteen years ago) link

ha ha, donut bitch.

How come you know so much about my city? Did you used to live here? I'm such a dumbass. I didn't realize.

Sarah McLUsky (coco), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:31 (sixteen years ago) link

it's just you and Jimi, Sam

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:32 (sixteen years ago) link

What's a Rah Bra? I"m picturing a bra with pom poms on the front. sweet.

Texas Sam (thatgirl), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:32 (sixteen years ago) link

TUSCALOOSA, HERE WE COME!

phil-two (phil-two), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:33 (sixteen years ago) link

Dude ILX could totally take over Alabama. We should all move immediately (disclaimer - the radio stations are fucking terrible)

Millar (Millar), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:34 (sixteen years ago) link

BEAR BRYANT!

lawrence kansas (lawrence kansas), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:35 (sixteen years ago) link

How come you know so much about my city? Did you used to live here? I'm such a dumbass. I didn't realize.

DUDE, I've been trying to hint to you and NA that I know a lot of Richmond folks via my very best friend here in Seattle who used to live in Richmond. I've met and now know the notorious Mich**l Otl*y who seems to be the Richmond kingpin. :) I met a lot of these folks when I visited Richmond last year, and took a walk through Carytown. (Also met Marty and Adam via having done sound for Young Pioneers a few times on KUCI and various other shows). Plan 9 is also, like, the best record store on the east coast.

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:35 (sixteen years ago) link

theory: NY is such a festering hell-hole of high prices, raw sewage smell, dishonest real-estate agents, and an all-around disloyalty ingrained in the culture, that moving to New York is the "default" kick-my-ass-cause-i-need-it option for kids too chickenshit for the army

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:36 (sixteen years ago) link

(x-post to Sarah...but don't ask Michael if he knows donut bitch.. haha.. ask him if he knows all the Brians in Seattle :) )

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:37 (sixteen years ago) link

No we should not motherfucking "all" move to Alabama.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:37 (sixteen years ago) link

also, kings dominion is the happiest place on earth. except that fucking anaconda ride almost broke my neck on

phil-two (phil-two), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:37 (sixteen years ago) link

Better or worse than Cyclone?

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:38 (sixteen years ago) link

Good thing you made that disclaimer, donut bitch, or else I would've asked him if he knew a Mr. Bitch and he'd be like, "NO! What kind of person do you think I am?" And then I would have called you a liar and it would have gotten really ugly.

But yeah, that's cool.

Sarah McLUsky (coco), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:39 (sixteen years ago) link

An ILX commune would be a frightening prospect, whether it was located in Alabama or NYC.

Larcole (Nicole), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:40 (sixteen years ago) link

Uh yeah, I'd like the ability to be choosy when I go blast into outer space for cowboy bounty hunter adventures, right? This is not a goddamned open invite and if it is I am so not coming.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:41 (sixteen years ago) link

No we should not motherfucking "all" move to Alabama.

you know what I mean

Millar (Millar), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:41 (sixteen years ago) link

The words "all" and "ILX move" were used in the same line=I am frightened and staying in my goddamn apartment until this passes.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:49 (sixteen years ago) link

The Neverending FAP starts now!

NA (Nick A.), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:52 (sixteen years ago) link

NYC: one of the better places to meet new people, and/or try that new food you have heard so much about. However, it's grown too damn expensive to survive in. It says summat if many (previous) Manhattanites have returned home to Mum and Dad cause they can't afford the rent.

Was born and raised in the madness, so I'll always love it. But what will happen to Jersey or Staten Island when NYC can't hold the 20 million determined to move there?

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:52 (sixteen years ago) link

The Neverending FAP starts now!

Been there, tasted that.

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:54 (sixteen years ago) link

But what will happen to Jersey or Staten Island when NYC can't hold the 20 million determined to move there?

Ever seen The Fifth Element?

Millar (Millar), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:56 (sixteen years ago) link

The Neverending FAP starts now!

TURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRN around...

http://www.kajagoogoo.com/Images/albums/limahl/limahl_7_neverending_german_a.jpg

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 18:59 (sixteen years ago) link

I was wondering where the rest of my hair gel went.

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:02 (sixteen years ago) link

These days I wonder where HIS went. Though he still needs a bit:

http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/gallery/2002/01/18/LIMAHL.JPG

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:05 (sixteen years ago) link

I just wanna get out of the way of the asteroid that's DEFINITELY going to hit Manhattan (I read that somewhere), so that's my real reason for not wanting to live there.

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:18 (sixteen years ago) link

Yeah, my mom read that too. I'm still waiting for it.

Ally (mlescaut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:19 (sixteen years ago) link

I just wanna get out of the way of the asteroid that's DEFINITELY going to hit Manhattan

DB, tis called an urban legend. Too many diasters should have happened to NYC by now. Much like the "big one" that's supposed to sink California.

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:22 (sixteen years ago) link

Yeah, that's what I was gonna say Nichole. Every time I tell my mom I'd like to visit San Fran some day, she freaks out about how it might sink when I'm there.

Sarah McLusky (coco), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:23 (sixteen years ago) link

Arts universe explanation: Well, I look at it this way -- the vast majority of book and magazine publishing is based here, the news media is based here, there's a ridiculous number of art galleries (both boutique and major ones) here, Broadway is considered the pinnacle of theater (which is both good and bad, obv.), NYC has a thriving music scene and hell! In the parkling lot around the corner from my apartment street people and actors perform King Lear everynight! (tho last week they were doing interpretive dance to Panjabi MC's "Beware the Boys" -- I stayed and watched it every single night. TRULY TRANSCENDENT!!!") The reason I moved to NYC was cuz I wanted to be a writer, and I knew that this was the place to make that happen.

this is all bollocks?

RJG (RJG), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:32 (sixteen years ago) link

Fuck earthquakes. the reason I'm not ever going to California is the black widow spiders.

phil-two (phil-two), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:46 (sixteen years ago) link

Austin:Texas::NYC:USA (maybe Olympia:Washington, Athens:Georgia, other states are kind of a blank)?

It's where you dream of moving when you're outside the cultural norm of your area (especially as a teenager). Nightlife, record stores, shopping, interesting people, adventure, etc. Basically a "get the fuck up and out" ideal.

And the reality of both is far less exciting than the fantasy.

miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:47 (sixteen years ago) link

Phil, in the separate times I've been there, never saw even one. Need another reason, then.

Nichole Graham (Nichole Graham), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:48 (sixteen years ago) link

as of today, i am officially looking for work in philadelphia. fuck new york city and its legal community. i don't even give a shit about having to take another bar exam at this point.

Tad (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:49 (sixteen years ago) link

Ha ha. In a normal analogy, I think that would be DC:USA, but I know what you're saying.

Sarah McLUsky (coco), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:49 (sixteen years ago) link

Whaaaa---, Tad? Let me know if you end up there. It would be a plus on the philly side of the list!

Sarah McLusky (coco), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:50 (sixteen years ago) link

well okay, if you like death by venom, by all means, move to california!

phil-two (phil-two), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:51 (sixteen years ago) link

Austin:Texas::NYC:USA (maybe Olympia:Washington, Athens:Georgia, other states are kind of a blank)?

Ur, well Olympia is more like the "Albany" of Washington state, for obvious reasons.

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 19:59 (sixteen years ago) link

Phil is right. They even eat that shit. If you see "Black Widow Burrito" anywhere, run away.

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:02 (sixteen years ago) link

christ is new york is anything like athens I'll never go there

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:05 (sixteen years ago) link

Ur, well Olympia is more like the "Albany" of Washington state, for obvious reasons.
Why? I thought Olympia was 'cooler' than Seattle since grunge died.

miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:08 (sixteen years ago) link

Oh man, you have no idea how wrong that thought is. But Jess could say more...

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:10 (sixteen years ago) link

Ha Olympia is the dumping ground for all the "fake hipsters" who couldn't make it or get dates in NYC, or anywhere else larger than the hickish hometowns they're supposedly fleeing from.

chester (synkro), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:11 (sixteen years ago) link

Well, yes, precisely. It occupies the same niche for Washington hipsters/hipster-wannabes that NYC does nationally.

"My life would be cooler if I lived there!"

miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:16 (sixteen years ago) link

hanle y and kate the saint both lived in or around Albany, NY at some point = Albany, NY is WAY cooler and more wonderful than stinky Olympia, WA could ever hope to be.

Tad (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:18 (sixteen years ago) link

RE: grit

Dallas now has the highest per-capita crime rate in the nation for cities of 1mln+, and Dallas County is the twelfth most-polluted county in the nation.

miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:20 (sixteen years ago) link

Hey Tad, what about me! Can't I be cool? (Saratoga Springs, 1982 to 1985)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:26 (sixteen years ago) link

I've lived upstate (for three years); and when I was growing up the folks and I went to the Hudson Valley practically every weekend. Also I worked in Westchester County for a while so I was always taking the Metro-North up there. I consider upstate NY my second home. So I feel qualified to say: nice foliage and rivers and mountains, but the small towns are fuckin' HELLHOLES.

Asymmetric Cocktails (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:30 (sixteen years ago) link

Milo what I meant is that Oly is a super small pond and therefore much easier to "make it", in a high social standing sense, than NYC. The two really aren't comparable AT ALL in this regard.

chester (synkro), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:31 (sixteen years ago) link

ie, it's generally easier to be hip anywhere else in the country than in NYC (I'm supposing).

chester (synkro), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:33 (sixteen years ago) link

puh-leeze

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:43 (sixteen years ago) link

real hip motherfuckers get PhDs in aerospace and move to Alabama

Millar (Millar), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:47 (sixteen years ago) link

The idea of folks moving to Olympia today only to become scenesters is just truly boggling... which might actually be a good sign for the town these days, as I think the last thing its shaky economy needs now are more black wavy haired crows in high fashion competing for the birdseed.

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:48 (sixteen years ago) link

Dallas now has the highest per-capita crime rate in the nation for cities of 1mln+, and Dallas County is the twelfth most-polluted county in the nation.

Like I said, grit. .

Texas Sam (thatgirl), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:49 (sixteen years ago) link

(Blount I meant hip in relation to yr immediate surroundings, obv [or maybe not so obv]).

chester (synkro), Thursday, 7 August 2003 20:56 (sixteen years ago) link

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/nyc/adam.jpg

Ally is the next Ryan McGinley.

miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Friday, 8 August 2003 02:56 (sixteen years ago) link

Wait, I take that back. That's just mean.

miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Friday, 8 August 2003 02:57 (sixteen years ago) link

Out of all those pictures you pull that one.

Ally (mlescaut), Friday, 8 August 2003 02:59 (sixteen years ago) link

It was either that or the tattoo artist wearing goggles. What's up with that?

miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Friday, 8 August 2003 03:01 (sixteen years ago) link

His name was Crazy Ninja and he was pretty convinced I was an actress but I'm not sure who he thought I was.

Ally (mlescaut), Friday, 8 August 2003 03:07 (sixteen years ago) link

one of those pictures is very cool and very sad

gabbneb (gabbneb), Friday, 8 August 2003 14:11 (sixteen years ago) link

The first pic of that string is my block! When did you take that, Ally?

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Friday, 8 August 2003 14:18 (sixteen years ago) link

About a month before I found out you lived there, Yanc3y. I was doing it for a linguistics project.

I know which one is the sad picture...I used to go up there like at least once a week to just stare at everything. Actually, two pix were taken from there: the view of the bridges and the one straight down on the city.

Ally (mlescaut), Friday, 8 August 2003 14:20 (sixteen years ago) link

Wait, actually, gabbneb, that's not yr car is it? I'm sorry I wrote on it if that's the sad pic.

;)

Ally (mlescaut), Friday, 8 August 2003 14:21 (sixteen years ago) link

i work in the black building on the right, in the pic going straight down onto church st

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Friday, 8 August 2003 14:58 (sixteen years ago) link

Why move to NYC and not anywhere else in the world? Is there anything left that's special or unique about NYC that doesn't exist in any other large US city?

Yes. I have no idea what. Further study is required.

it's pretty much our platonic ideal of 'the city;' anywhere else is just 'a city.'

Ding ding ding! (though see also London)

I'll say this, though. I certainly wish fuckin' less people would move here and leave the city for those snobby shits like myself who were actually born here, goddammit!

Nothing good ever came of an enterprise of entirely NY-born humans.

Ned:
To be fair, I've found perfect serenity more than once in the middle of Manhattan, and not in Central Park even.

http://www.demotelco.com/fb/photo/resources/217114166216105612301474000001/ned.jpg?tw=450&th=450

OK let's move to Alabama immediately.

Sellout.

--

People move to NYC because they imagine that it has a constant stream of the new and interesting. This is true, because the people that come to see it, bring it.

Obviously, the chips on the shoulders of NYCers born and bred are nothing compared to those of people who moved there.

Sinatra got it slightly wrong: Once you make yourself there, you can take yourself anywhere. For people that are still cookie dough, it's the hottest oven. Obviously this is mass delusion, but so is the United States of America.

(I had to rewrite this, as the first time I was using 'here' instead of 'there').

Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Friday, 8 August 2003 15:00 (sixteen years ago) link

I like the Irish definition of serenity. (That was listening to Slowdive, of course.)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 8 August 2003 15:01 (sixteen years ago) link

Good stuff, Andrew.

Also, milo is OTM here: It's where you dream of moving when you're outside the cultural norm of your area (especially as a teenager). Nightlife, record stores, shopping, interesting people, adventure, etc. Basically a "get the fuck up and out" ideal.

And the reality of both is far less exciting than the fantasy.

NA (Nick A.), Friday, 8 August 2003 15:02 (sixteen years ago) link

OLP, as they say. "gabbneb" and "car" do not belong in the same sentence.

(I'm a little sleepy, so this will be vague - I did miss NA's intention on this thread a bit, but I think he's missing the answer to his question that's implicated in NYC'ers answers to what they imagine the question to be. certainly there are people who move here for a fantasy, and find it or not, and there will be disillusionment for those who don't. but in fact, the reality for many people is better than the fantasy, and perhaps there are people who move here who have realistic, instead of fantastic, notions of what the city is like. therefore for many, whether native or non, NYC isn't overrated because they never rated it on to anything but its own terms. the "fantasy" in fact is perhaps largely invented by people *outside* of New York. people who live here may have trouble explaining it to non-NYCers because they don't have the same reference points. like, explain to me why Richmond is great (though I gather that's not necessarily the sentiment) - I'm not necessarily going to understand very well (though I'm willing to believe it). the backlash against NYC may just have to do with the number and volume of its flacks. then again, NA may be right about why people move here and we're ignoring his question, though it may be self-explanatory. or does the question have less to do with NYC than why *other* cities don't have the same allure? how many people really choose between cities to live in? and are they choosing between the cities themselves or the larger regions that they are found in (i.e. Coast v. Center, East v. West, South v. Middle v. North)?)

gabbneb (gabbneb), Friday, 8 August 2003 15:24 (sixteen years ago) link

does the question have less to do with NYC than why *other* cities don't have the same allure?

The phrasing of that raises my hackles, though I see your larger point. Might it be more accurate to say that other places have their own allure than simply investing NYC with something untouchable and unique?

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 8 August 2003 15:26 (sixteen years ago) link

Ned, whether or not it "raises your hackles" it's an accurate assessment of the situation. AGAIN by pointing out that other cities don't have the "same allure" it is not by default denigrating your city of choice.

I really hate discussing locale with you, though. No offense or anything but like I said you just seem to come in to these threads to play devil's advocate against whatever is being agreed to about the goodness of an area.

Ally (mlescaut), Friday, 8 August 2003 15:34 (sixteen years ago) link

If that's the case I will apologize and rethink (and I did openly use the 'devil's advocate' above myself, since I'm interested in perceptions in general of many different things, not just locale). I think we're more in agreement than might be thought, but it's how we're discussing it (or the terms used?) that causes the conflict. If anything this is reminding me of the popism/rockism endless debates on this board only applied to place -- is the perception (as opposed to the reality and/or individual experience) of NYC as the four-piece guitar band of cities? ;-)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 8 August 2003 15:41 (sixteen years ago) link

I was imprecise. It should have asked why outsiders don't confer the same allure on other cities, which premise was posited in the question. LA and perhaps other parts of OC are highly alluring to me (but I'm not sure I'd want to live there ;-))

However, I do think NYC has something unique (as a matter of reality, not fantasy) that is particularly alluring to people who wish to live in a large city and that perhaps can't be found or is not imagined to be found anywhere else (except maybe London, Hong Kong, etc.). It might not be alluring to people who don't wish to live in a large city, or to people who wish to live in a large metropolitan area without a dense, residential, monumental core and active sidewalk culture.

gabbneb (gabbneb), Friday, 8 August 2003 15:45 (sixteen years ago) link

The city is of its own kind and has its own allure, just as other cities and people have theirs. It is mentalist to think that millions of New Yorkers like and or would like the exact same thing about New York, just as it it would be silly to say to someone, upon being shown a picture of his girlfriend, "Nah, I could show you a photo of mine too, what does that prove?" Everyone likes something different. I mean, it's like saying Venice is better than New York because New York has no gondolas.

DID YOU KNOW that the horse-drawn hansom cabs have rate signs like in taxicabs: " $34.00 for the first 1/2 hour or part thereof, $11.00 for each additional 1/4 hour"? I wonder how these rates stack up against those from Henry James' or Wharton's day.

felicity (felicity), Friday, 8 August 2003 16:04 (sixteen years ago) link

NYC as the four-piece guitar band of cities? ;-)

If suburban mall culture = teen pop, do tourists gravitate towards Times Square because it's the least guitarbandlike place in NYC?

The Four Singing Beatles (Jody Beth Rosen), Friday, 8 August 2003 16:06 (sixteen years ago) link

And also I wonder whether the hansoms will go through the McDonald's clipclop-thru windows.

felicity (felicity), Friday, 8 August 2003 16:07 (sixteen years ago) link

Felicity is indeed wise. :-) I think...I think what it might boil down to is a distinction between someone who says that NYC (or for that matter any other city) has 'everything' and that it has 'everything I need at present.'

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 8 August 2003 16:11 (sixteen years ago) link

Is there anything left that's special or unique about NYC that doesn't exist in any other large US city?

NA this totally depends on what you mean by 'large'. I've felt a similar level of excitement and potential in LA and SF as I did in NY (when visiting; I've never lived in any of these). Both of these cities also have their own strong moving-to mythologies. The only other US cities that can compare to NY in size are Chicago and maybe sorta Boston. If by large you mean Pittsburgh, Seattle or Denver, then yes, NY has a much greater selection of the unique and special. If you're a person who's interested in urbanity, and all the diversity and cultural stuff that comes with it, you don't really want to move to Seattle or Portland, despite the fact that they're officially cities (trust me).

chester (synkro), Friday, 8 August 2003 16:20 (sixteen years ago) link

I don't think NYC has everything at all. There are things that are important to me that I either can't find here at all or can only be found in parts of the city I go to very rarely. It does, however, have the greatest combination of things I want.

New York has no gondolas

but it does!

http://www.rioc.com/tram.gif

xp: chester - what do you mean by large? surely not geography. the LA metro area has more people than does the NY, I think, and also greater density which is bizarre. maybe they count the bodies of water in NY? however, I'm NYC-born and bred and adore Seattle, though admittedly not for its 'urbanity'.

gabbneb (gabbneb), Friday, 8 August 2003 16:32 (sixteen years ago) link

All this notion that NYC is the centre of everything and self-evidently the greatest and most exciting place and why would anyone want to live anywhere else shit is very annoying - that's LONDON, people, NYC is merely a substitute.

Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Friday, 8 August 2003 16:36 (sixteen years ago) link

If you're European or philic, sure.

gabbneb (gabbneb), Friday, 8 August 2003 16:37 (sixteen years ago) link

I chose Cleveland much in the same way felicity chose NY. It's located halfway between my second and third favorite cities (Toledo and Erie, Pa).

lawrence kansas (lawrence kansas), Friday, 8 August 2003 16:39 (sixteen years ago) link

Gabbneb: by 'large' I meant 'whoa, this is so much bigger and more exciting and diverse than Seattle, where I grew up.' Those cities have impressed me with their size; Denver, Phoenix, and other mid-size US cities haven't, they've had that same comfortable feeling I was used to. Subjective, obv, but I was really asking NA what he meant by 'large'.

chester (synkro), Friday, 8 August 2003 16:44 (sixteen years ago) link

I wonder how these rates stack up against those from Henry James' or Wharton's day.

I can tell you. I just received a book in the mail from my gradmaother, who was cleaning out a bunch of books and found "The Real New York," a personal guide on shops and ting, written by a lady reporter in 1933. By 1933 there were only 6 hansom cabs left in the city and they congregated exactly where they congregate now, across from the Plaza Hotel at the corner of 59th and 5th Ave. The price was $3 (length of ride unspecified), which this reporter says had been the going rate for at least 30 years, despite the fact the stable fees had increased five-fold. This book is so great, she says you can go to any basement-floor apartment on 47th St west of sixth ave, ring the buzzer, and when the tiny window bangs open and a pair of beady eyes present themselves you say casually that you were "there last night with Johnny Walker." She says this code works everywhere, even downtown. I'm gonna have to try that sometime.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Friday, 8 August 2003 16:58 (sixteen years ago) link

The only other US cities that can compare to NY in size are Chicago and maybe sorta Boston

Philadelphia is much, much bigger than Boston. So is Phoenix.

See how mythologies work?

That book sounds great, Tracer!

felicity (felicity), Friday, 8 August 2003 17:01 (sixteen years ago) link

It's expensive, it's filthy, and it's a pain in the ass to live in. It's also really big and twice as dense as any other city in the U.S.

If you can't deal/think it's overrated/like your city so much better, just don't come. We won't miss you and frankly rents are too high already. 'nuff said.

Octothorpe (Octothorpe), Friday, 8 August 2003 17:18 (sixteen years ago) link

haha Boston is the only city I mentioned I haven't been to.

chester (synkro), Friday, 8 August 2003 17:20 (sixteen years ago) link

I can't believe Ally posted a photo of the Essex/Delancey subway station. It's the bane of my JMZ-riding existence. It's a stank pit-hole of despair.

phil-two (phil-two), Friday, 8 August 2003 17:27 (sixteen years ago) link

Everything's gonna be ok, Octo.

Sarah McLusky (coco), Friday, 8 August 2003 17:30 (sixteen years ago) link

Phil, I sat on the floor of that subway station and drew a picture of Rufus Wainwright the night I took that photograph. I think I was trying to photograph a rat that was scurrying comically across the platform but unfortunately it was not to be seen.

Ally (mlescaut), Friday, 8 August 2003 17:31 (sixteen years ago) link

more!

gabbneb (gabbneb), Friday, 8 August 2003 17:49 (sixteen years ago) link

felicity it is superb!! She talks about the big stuff of course—the Italian place where Caruso dined, Lindy's, Sardi's, etc and other things that were apparently big enough to be instantly recognizeable to her readers but have lost any meaning for anyone (names of society people, especially), but she also talks about little things, like her favorite lavendar salesman (whose cry of "sweeeet lavendar for saaale!!" was heard for blocks around his stall on 2nd ave), a place to buy wigs, a woolworth's lunch counter presided over by a maitre'd in tails and white gloves where you could get duck a l'orange, and tons of places where the actors hung out, especially a Mexican place (NOT owned by Mexicans: Ned it is a long tradition!!) with "the only enchiladas in New York"

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Friday, 8 August 2003 17:50 (sixteen years ago) link

j0hn wins

again

(xpost)

donut bitch (donut), Friday, 8 August 2003 17:51 (sixteen years ago) link

This seems like such an America centred argument. (I don't mean this negatively in any way) I'm just wondering whether there's any difference between someone in, say, Canada deciding to move to NYC and someone from, say, Burlington, VT. If NYC's mystique is based on some mythologized American ideal of the city, are folks from other places in the world equally affected? (Martin's comment about London got me thinking)

Also, in terms of multiculturalism, Toronto's got everyone beat. 56 different ethnic groups speaking 80 different languages--the most diverse city in the world. (I used to work for Ontario tourism)

cybele (cybele), Friday, 8 August 2003 18:16 (sixteen years ago) link

I find it hard to believe that Toronto is more diverse than Sioux City!

(NOTE: The preceeding might be a lie.)

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Friday, 8 August 2003 18:18 (sixteen years ago) link

Judging people's life choices: dud
Experiencing normal human emotions when your friends move away: classic

felicity (felicity), Friday, 8 August 2003 18:37 (sixteen years ago) link

Felicity, this isn't about my friends, really. I'm not judging their life choices. I acknowledged in my opening thread that a lot of what I think and feel about their reasons for moving is totally irrational and cynical. Confusion and even a little bit of anger are normal human emotions when your friends are moving away from you. Of course I am sad that they are leaving as well as excited for them, but that didn't really seem relevant to the question I was trying to ask with the thread. And I don't think judging people's life choices is a dud, it's pretty much unavoidable. But I'm keeping my feelings to myself and expressing only "normal human emotions" to them, so don't worry about my friends.

NA (Nick A.), Friday, 8 August 2003 18:43 (sixteen years ago) link

Selling out is classic anyway though.

Ally (mlescaut), Friday, 8 August 2003 18:45 (sixteen years ago) link

Ha ha, I just realized that I totally contradicted myself. Awesome. I meant the stuff at the end about judging life choices, not the part at the beginning when I say I'm not judging them.

NA (Nick A.), Friday, 8 August 2003 18:48 (sixteen years ago) link

Toronto's got everyone beat

Taking Sides: West Nile v. SARS

TMFTML (TMFTML), Friday, 8 August 2003 18:49 (sixteen years ago) link

But I'm keeping my feelings to myself and expressing only "normal human emotions" to them, so don't worry about my friends.

I reserve the right to spend a lot of time worrying about NA's friends

J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Friday, 8 August 2003 18:57 (sixteen years ago) link

I want to worry about his friends, go find your own.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 8 August 2003 18:59 (sixteen years ago) link

My friends may or may not be a literary device.

NA (Nick A.), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:04 (sixteen years ago) link

This is one of those "my...friend, yeah" situations, isn't it?

Ally (mlescaut), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:05 (sixteen years ago) link

His friend Harvey.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:06 (sixteen years ago) link

Nick doesn't even HAVE friends.

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:47 (sixteen years ago) link

BURN!!!!

Ally (mlescaut), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:48 (sixteen years ago) link

Not after this thread, I don't.

NA (Nick A.), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:48 (sixteen years ago) link

Wait, how does saying something that's already been implied at least 3 times, but in more direct terms, constitute a BURN!!!? I challenge your BURN!!!

NA (Nick A.), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:50 (sixteen years ago) link

Well, for Yanc3y, it's pretty clever.

Ally (mlescaut), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:51 (sixteen years ago) link

BURN!

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:52 (sixteen years ago) link

Now, THAT's a BURN!!! I will even go so far as to say BOO-YAH!

NA (Nick A.), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:52 (sixteen years ago) link

Ally's like that Paula Abdul song

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:53 (sixteen years ago) link

The one with Keanu Reeves?

Ally (mlescaut), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:53 (sixteen years ago) link

i have nothing left to live for

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:53 (sixteen years ago) link

Ally's like that Paula Abdul song
-- nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (littlejohnnyjewe...), August 8th, 2003 3:53 PM. (later)

BURN!!!

NA (Nick A.), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:54 (sixteen years ago) link

"cold hearted"

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:54 (sixteen years ago) link

Look into my eyes!

Ally (mlescaut), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:55 (sixteen years ago) link

kapatown my ass!

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:56 (sixteen years ago) link

Sa da tay!!

Ally (mlescaut), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:56 (sixteen years ago) link

you're a baddy daddy lamatai tebby chai

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 8 August 2003 19:58 (sixteen years ago) link

I'm a lady, you dirty greasebag.

Ally (mlescaut), Friday, 8 August 2003 20:00 (sixteen years ago) link

I thought the premise of the entire thread was to worry about NA's friends.

felicity (felicity), Friday, 8 August 2003 21:01 (sixteen years ago) link

Bill Parcells is a homo

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 8 August 2003 21:02 (sixteen years ago) link

It just seems like everyone and everything will pass through NYC at some point, that's what's appealing about it. London has that same appeal. Other cities...Chicago, San Francisco, etc. can be beautiful, but they seem stifling. They seem like dead ends, to me. More like islands.

Melissa W (Melissa W), Friday, 8 August 2003 21:46 (sixteen years ago) link

London's even worse than New York

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 8 August 2003 22:59 (sixteen years ago) link

Nick, I've asked myself this question before, too. I mean, NYC is awesome, and I could probably even live there for a while, but yeah, I catch your drift.

Know what blows my mind? Well, Emily and I are moving to Charlottesville, Virginia in September -- C-Ville is a small city (with a town-ish feel but lots to do) at the foothills of the Blue Ridge Mountains, an hour from Richmond, three hours from the beach. It's gorgeous there, lots to do, great food, fairly progressive (especially for Virginia!), etc. Now, take Nick's question about picking NYC over any other major US city, and just think of how many minor cities like C-Ville there are out there, cool towns that hardly anyone outside of the state knows about but which are a lot of fun... the mind boggles.

Clarke B., Saturday, 9 August 2003 05:24 (sixteen years ago) link

this is interesting to me, simply because I'm in so many of Ally's photographs (the subway one above w/me and her and Tracer may be a bit washed out but it may be my favorite of the whole bunch involving myself, for reals), and as donut bitch can attest, I'm starting to really feel like a Seattle resident again. I don't feel too conflicted about this dual residency, though, because I feel equally at home here and in NYC. (and Minneapolis, too, though that's a bit different--I don't necessarily see myself hankering to move back there anytime soon, though never say never.)

as some of you know, I moved back here for a job. in a month and a half or so, when a couple of large job-related projects are finished, I will be a much easier person to be around. but I don't *miss* NYC as intensely as I figured I would--and yet I have no doubt that I want to go back, that I WILL go back, someday, who knows when. but one of the city's chief charms is that if you've been there and you enjoy it (not everyone does, of course) you're pretty much a dual citizen of it and wherever you go afterward.

M Matos (M Matos), Saturday, 9 August 2003 06:03 (sixteen years ago) link

this is interesting to me, simply because I'm in so many of Ally's photographs

I find you very interesting to take photos of, you're a good subject. The subway picture is more washed out on the scan than in the original, for some reason--I can't get the levels right at all because of the reflection of the flash off my face. What convinced me to dye my hair black, all the photos from that night are the same, I look SO white and it just contrasts badly and washes out everything. The pic came out real nice though, you and Tracer look just great in it and I remember when we took it, you said, "I think that'll be the best picture of the night" and it was but I never scanned it because it just seemed...personal? I dunno. Which made it fit here.

Just to explain beyond the obvious reasons why I'd take photos of you, ie you're my dawg.

Ally (mlescaut), Saturday, 9 August 2003 06:11 (sixteen years ago) link

although certain things about NYC are pissing me off mightily right now -- and i find the strength in dealing with such shit by reminding myself that i am not a new yorker and i can fucking leave -- i don't really hate the place. when things are going right, it is quite unlike anything else in this world. but it's certainly not the only place in the world where one could live and/or work and have a good, happy and healthy life. matter of fact, yer chances of achieving any of the aforementioned might be higher outside of manhattan. still, it's nice to have around even if one never spends another second in the place -- like having war and peace or finnegan's wake on yer bookshelf, even if you never read either. which means that if/when i move, it'll be to either philly, baltimore or DC (boston is out).

Tad (llamasfur), Saturday, 9 August 2003 06:20 (sixteen years ago) link

yes, it *is* personal. I'm usually pretty uneasy in front of a camera if I know it's there but I look really comfortable there, not straining at all. I get a real sense of gravity from that shot, and a sense of the three of us as a group rather than a collection of individuals, if that makes any sense.

M Matos (M Matos), Saturday, 9 August 2003 07:28 (sixteen years ago) link

I like what Andrew said. If the "sell-outs" include a lot of people hopping off to New York in search of something they haven't identified yet (but something New York big) -- well, it's their presence that makes it possible, isn't it?

New York feels like a city dreamed into existence by a group of seriously coked-up people: "Right, right, there'll be a bar every three steps, and half of the people will look like models on their days off and act like drug-level flirty extroverts, and I guess we need a park so it should be just fucking huge, right, and and and. . ." I already know I don't have the energy (or the accessories) for this city, but whatever.

Other cities are great. Chicago's great, Boston's nice in its own skeezy way, I really like Atlanta now, San Francisco is the most beautiful thing ever (dreamed up by people on some combination of opium, ecstasy, and high-quality weed), and with the exception of maybe Arizona (sorry for your trials, Ally), the southwest is my favorite area of the country, and I can easily imagine myself wanting to live in Albuquerque or northern Colorado or even back in Pueblo, CO again. At some point.

But look, the NYC as "center of the arts" thing isn't just snobbery. Obviously you can make art anywhere; obviously. But the actual people and industries that transform the act of making art into a feasible industry are, for better or worse, all packed around this one city. If you want to work in trade publishing, you're moving there, period. If you want to write, you'll at least sort of benefit from getting out there and connecting yourself with other writers, editors, and agents. If you want to work in theatre, visual art, film. . . . (And you know: I'm sure it is snobbery on a lot of people's parts to point this out -- as if any artist worth anything will obviously be in NYC -- but a lot of the time it's just the realistic desire for people to slip in close to the industries they're trying to enter. You can be a great band in Indiana, but if you want to play a bunch of shows and hook up with a good-sized label, moving to Chicago isn't such a bad plan. Same goes for writers and actors and New York.)

New York is still brain-melting, though. I'm sure the coke-heads woke up the next morning and were filled with a gut-level fear of this massive chattering thing they'd created.

nabisco (nabisco), Saturday, 9 August 2003 14:38 (sixteen years ago) link

"the LA metro area has more people than does the NY"

I really don't think so-- NY and vicinity has about 2x metro LA's population, from what I remember. Same applies to the cities themselves.

As for the Toronto booster: I think Jackson Heights alone beats your numbers for ethnic and linguistic diversity. I do really like Toronto, outside of its Protestant middle class, but alien-ness of New York is one of its most insistent and compelling features. And it applies to immigrants from inside the US: I know of subcultures of (for example) Detroiters, and there's a sizable building in Greenpoint filled with people from Memphis.

Benjamin (benjamin), Saturday, 9 August 2003 21:28 (sixteen years ago) link

"Protestant middle class"

To expand: more English than England

Benjamin (benjamin), Saturday, 9 August 2003 21:32 (sixteen years ago) link

yeah, I was wrong re metro area pop. NY is ~21M, and LA is ~16.5. NYC is ~8M and LA I think ~3.5M.

gabbneb (gabbneb), Saturday, 9 August 2003 21:42 (sixteen years ago) link

Adrian, Ga's pretty cool

nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Saturday, 9 August 2003 23:50 (sixteen years ago) link

But seriously, folks, why move to NYC and not anywhere else in the world? Is there anything left that's special or unique about NYC that doesn't exist in any other large US city? What leads to this mythology of the Big Apple?

Nick, obviously, NYC is not for everyone, but your remarks seem to betray a willful ignorance of the draw of the metropolis for many people. There is a definite NYC-bound pattern and history of writers (Fitzgerald, Capote, Thomas Wolfe, etc) and artists (Warhol et al) that feeds and perpetuates the mythology as the city as an escape from one's limited background.

In the above cases, NYC is provided in contrast to St. Louis, Alabama, North Carolina, Pittsburgh. The city holds a special draw for people from the South and the Midwest and is (was?) seen as a sight of licentiousness and freedom; historically it is one of the few places in America where gay men could feel comfortable.

Now, with the unearthing of subculture via TV and especially the internet, and the farming out of hip lifestyles to every corner of the US, the city is perhaps less necessary than ever for those wishing to lead an "alternative" life. Good thing, since the prices here preclude any sort of bohemian culture to greet any would-be cityspotters.

At the same time, the city itself is undergoing a suburbanization, and is awash in Starbucks etc. Sixth Avenue has become Avenue of the Stip Malls, with Bed Bath and Beyond and their like setting up camp. In addition, thanks to Giuliani and (and now Bloomberg?) civil liberties here are likely now at an all time low.

Stil, for many (and I can especially see why in the case of VA this would be the case, as it is my home town as well) the city still represents great opportunity and contrast. I came here because when I visited I really liked the energy on the street--yes, I thought it was like nowhere else in America, and I've since realized it is like no where else in the world (that I've been to).

I woundn't be too hard on your friends if they are acting smug about their planned moves--they will be struggling soon enough. It is definitely a challenge to live here.

(Disclaimer: I'm sure that many cities besides NY share characteristics with what I wrote above, but Nick asked about NYC, not anywhere else.)

Mary (Mary), Monday, 11 August 2003 17:40 (sixteen years ago) link

TS: Acting smug about moving to NYC vs. acting smug about moving to Paris

amateurist (amateurist), Monday, 11 August 2003 17:58 (sixteen years ago) link

Acting amug about moving to Paris is better, because you can pepper it with unbelievably pretentious French words and expressions. Or wait, maybe that's "worse"? I don't know what you're asking actually. Forget it.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 11 August 2003 18:06 (sixteen years ago) link

You must be in the same mood I'm in today.

amateurist (amateurist), Monday, 11 August 2003 18:10 (sixteen years ago) link

Good points from all. Special thanks for nabisco and Mary for taking the time to write long, well-thought-out posts.

Bah, I just wrote a long response to Mary and then intentionally erased it. I guess I'm just not in the mood today. But thanks for the contributions.

NA (Nick A.), Monday, 11 August 2003 18:27 (sixteen years ago) link

HOLY SH*T HOW DID I FORGET ! !

The Cruise to thread*
the greatest film about NYC evah !!!!

kephm, Monday, 11 August 2003 20:04 (sixteen years ago) link

four months pass...
http://www.artseensoho.com/MAPS/MapGIFS/nsgreene002.gif

Alex in NYC (vassifer), Friday, 12 December 2003 11:33 (fifteen years ago) link

This entire thread is about how much Nick hates Yancey.

Allyzay, Friday, 12 December 2003 14:36 (fifteen years ago) link

From http://www.dashes.com/anil/index.php?archives/007890.php. I don't even live there yet, and I'm printing it out and putting it on my fridge.

For those of you who live in the United States or are familiar with its culture, imagine a place that starts with a political and social system that's identical to today's United States, but has a few significant differences.

In this place, most people speak more than one language. Almost no one owns a car, even the millionaires. Many people don't even knowsomeone who owns a car. There's no Wal-Mart, no Target, no Home Depot.

People regularly and willingly use mass transit to get around for the few things they can't approach on foot. Almost every neighborhood has the basic amenities in walking distance, like a hardware store or dry cleaner or drug store, and they're almost all mom-and-pop operations, not multinational chains.

The people in this place, in addition to being well-educated on average, are extremely friendly, showing a repeated willingness to talk to and greet strangers, and an eagerness to educate tourists or visitors on the customs and rituals of their home. Their cultures are an extremely varied mix of cultures, backgrounds and identities, pervaded with an astonishing level of tolerance and respect.

There's also a deep ethic of civic-mindedness. Average citizens are not just aware of, but actively engaged in efforts such as city planning and zoning laws and the design and preservation of public spaces. Architecture is valued and protected by well-organized, well-financed groups, often consisting of canny partnerships between public, private, and corporate concerns. New urbanism is an understood goal, not just a theoretical ideal.

And this society exists within an unparalleled environment of artistic and entrepreneurial innovation. Constant reinvention paired with startling new creations. Music, dance, theater, film, sculpture, writing, and any other manner of expression all functioning at levels unsurpasssed anywhere else in the world at almost any other point in history.

So this place? It's where I live, Manhattan. New York City. That's why I write about the city with such reverence, and why it exists as a living, breathing character in my life and in the lives of every New Yorker. It seemed like something I needed to remind people about, if they're interested in reading what I have to say.

I was recently asked what my site was about, and what I had originally intended for it to be about, and I replied that the first name for my site was "New York New Media New Funk" and that I was hoping to get back to that mandate. I've mostly moved the New Funk over to my Pop Lifesite on TypePad, so the focus for now is to try to articulate why, exactly, I love my city so much.

There's a tendency for any positive dialogue about New York to be seen as unseemly, the vain preening of a city already too obsessed with itself. This is mostly the opinion of people whose impression of New York City is stuck somewhere between 15 and 25 years ago, when subway cars were still covered in graffiti, and when city parks were dangerous instead of idyllic. I'm fine with people's outdated notions of New York, though; It keeps them from overcrowding the city with their tourism.

And it goes without mention that there are problems here, serious ones. Most of them we see as charming idiosyncrasies, the same way we see the failings of a curmudgeonly uncle. It's loud here, much of the time. There are, of course, Targets and Home Depots in the outer boroughs. Sometimes the power goes out. People resent the Yankees. Bill O'Reilly broadcasts from here.

But it's important to remember that New York isn't just peerless among modern cities, it is inarguably among the greatest cities that has ever been. The renovation of our public parks in the past 10 years alone seems poised to leave this city, even in the shadow of our still-aching wounds, on the brink of a renaissance to rival the Beaux Arts splendor that beautified the city 100 years ago.

I tend to have a status update on the top of this site, as a tagline. Right now, it says "New York Invented Xmas" but it's just as likely to say that New York Invented Hip Hop, and the beauty of being here is that I get a vivid reminder that both of those statements are true.

So thanks for indulging me in keeping New York as part of my site's title, even though I've never done an adequate job of explaining exactly why it gets such a significant role. If you've never been here, if you've never lived here, you might not ever understand. But maybe now you'll at least have a hint of why it matters so much to me.

Elvis Telecom (Chris Barrus), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 05:56 (fifteen years ago) link

that's beautiful, mang

gabbneb (gabbneb), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:11 (fifteen years ago) link

There's no Wal-Mart, no Target, no Home Depot.

There's a Home Depot in Brooklyn.

bad jode (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:13 (fifteen years ago) link

...and he mentions that.

ModJ (ModJ), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:17 (fifteen years ago) link

There's also one in Queens that will let you rent a 25A genny for 60 bucks. Or at least that's what it used to cost.

ModJ (ModJ), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:18 (fifteen years ago) link

(yeah, I notice K-Mart is unmentioned. and the Sixth Ave strip is conveniently ignored)

gabbneb (gabbneb), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:19 (fifteen years ago) link

And don't mention Starbucks.

bnw (bnw), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:19 (fifteen years ago) link

and one, maybe more, in Queens. There's also a Target in Queens.

Tonight was another breakdown where I bum myself and the girlfriend out by contemplating publicly about having to move away.

x-post.

hstencil, Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:20 (fifteen years ago) link

And Best Buy on 6th now too... le sigh...

ModJ (ModJ), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:21 (fifteen years ago) link

more Starbucks please. Torrefazione too.

gabbneb (gabbneb), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:21 (fifteen years ago) link

most (but not all) of the great things about New York City have nothing to do with Manhattan.

hstencil, Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:21 (fifteen years ago) link

*cries*

gabbneb (gabbneb), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:23 (fifteen years ago) link

I wouldn't be so adamant about it if (some) Manhattanites weren't so fucking smug.

hstencil, Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:24 (fifteen years ago) link

but what the hell, even in my shitty "bridge & tunnel" neighborhood you can endure shitty service from some stuck-up European.

hstencil, Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:25 (fifteen years ago) link

...and he mentions that.

yeah, serves me right for not reading thoroughly enough.

bad jode (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:26 (fifteen years ago) link

"Brooklyn: Top Of The Food Chain"
-- Mike Tyson

http://www.screensavershot.com/sports/tyson.jpg

ModJ (ModJ), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:27 (fifteen years ago) link

but this writer lists Home Depot as being in league with not liking the Yankees or Bill O'Reilly so fuck him/her, really.

hstencil, Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:29 (fifteen years ago) link

Home Depot is great! It totally beats the pants off of Wal-Mart or ANY of the other megalomart chainstores.

bad jode (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:30 (fifteen years ago) link

exactly! Which is why this smarmy Manhattanite can go fuck his/herself.

hstencil, Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:31 (fifteen years ago) link

also, when you can't afford to own where you live, of course you have no need for home improvement!

hstencil, Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:32 (fifteen years ago) link

but home depot sells storage for the manhattan apartment you have no room to fit anything in!

bad jode (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:33 (fifteen years ago) link

but you have to go to *ugh* Brooklyn or Queens to use it!

hstencil, Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:34 (fifteen years ago) link

Can I just say that if I still lived in Queens I'd be for secession? Honestly, that borough gets such a bum rap but it's the largest, has great food, cheap rent, etc., etc.

hstencil, Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:35 (fifteen years ago) link

http://espn-i.starwave.com/media/pg2/2002/0123/photo/a_tyson_i.jpg

Mr. Tyson takes umbrage with your statement

ModJ (ModJ), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:36 (fifteen years ago) link

home depot is pretty fucking radical as far as big-box chains go. for one thing, it's a store which will sell you the raw materials to make cool shit rather than just sell you stuff so you can have stuff.

their plants selection is pretty awesome as well (though i bought a venus flytrap there once for like $3 and it was the saddest venus flytrap ever, i had to force-feed it bugs)

geeta (geeta), Wednesday, 17 December 2003 06:37 (fifteen years ago) link

My point wasn't to rag on Home Depot, but rather to point out that you can get the same stuff you get from Home Depot without going to an orange-wrapped chain store. You could just go to a mom & pop hardware store here, and you wouldn't have to suffer warehouse ceilings and, well, warehouse unfriendliness.

Anil, Monday, 29 December 2003 18:17 (fifteen years ago) link

I think some of us were just pointing out the piece was being a bit intentionaly blind to some of the chains (and problems) that do mark Manhattan. If big corporation = inherently evil, then NYC should be handing out pitchforks.

bnw (bnw), Monday, 29 December 2003 18:31 (fifteen years ago) link

i got out. NJ rulz. muthafucka new yawkas and yer stupid taxes and shit!

Eisbär (llamasfur), Monday, 29 December 2003 18:39 (fifteen years ago) link

I can't wait to get the fuck out of this godforesaken hellhole.

Allyzay, Monday, 29 December 2003 19:04 (fifteen years ago) link

one month passes...
So the story behind that big giant image posted by:

"Ally (mlescau...), August 7th, 2003"

Apparently Ally can't read. I clearly state on my site (ON THE FRONT PAGE EVEN!!):

"One final detail. I work hard to put these images online for everyone to enjoy. Please respect my rights. Any photo contained in this website is (registered) copyright 1997/1998/1999/2000/2001/2002/2003 (and beyond!) Mr Steve, aka Stevem. You are welcome to view them here or save them for your own personal, non-commercial use. Feel free to refer your friends to the site if you'd like, but please *DO NOT* distribute, publish, transmit, retransmit, link to, or in any way duplicate these photos. "

I pay money every month to keep my colocated website up. I work hard taking the photos, editing them and putting them online. It's a time consuming process, but a passion of mine. When you make a direct link to one of my images, in direct violation of my stated restrictions, you are STEALING from me! You are using my bandwidth to serve your purposes and not paying me for it. Not only that, but you are depriving me of the credit I deserve for capturing the image in the first place. One of the things that make it worthwhile for me to put my efforts into my web site is the feedback that I get from visitors. Not much chance of feedback when I'm not getting a photo credit, now is there? I'm sure that many of the photographers whose work is being STOLEN on this site would share my feelings of being ticked off about this.

So whenever someone is stealing my images and at the same time stealing my bandwidth, I happily send them out a gigantic image, which deprives them of what they are trying to steal, as well as making sure their page downloads very slowwwwwww.


Mr Steve, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 03:46 (fifteen years ago) link

Well then.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 03:51 (fifteen years ago) link

So whenever someone is stealing my images and at the same time stealing my bandwidth, I happily send them out a gigantic image, which deprives them of what they are trying to steal, as well as making sure their page downloads very slowwwwwww.

...which, uh, robs you of even more bandwidth.

You sure told her off. Uh-huh.

Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 03:57 (fifteen years ago) link

He's a passionate man, Mike.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 04:00 (fifteen years ago) link

Mr Steve, aka Stevem

aka chook fucker

bnw (bnw), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 04:03 (fifteen years ago) link

I didn't say that I can't afford the bandwidth, or that my pipe isn't big enough to handle the puny load imposed by your message board...

It's the principle of the matter. I clearly say I don't want to serve my images for other web sites or users. Ally has created a post that is attempting to steal from me.... I know you clever people on this thread are capable of wrapping your well developed minds around the concept of theft -- especially since so much of it is going on around here...

If someone removes the illegal and unauthorized link to my site, I'll happily go away. if the next time I happen to browse my web logs I see evidence of continued theft, I'll throw together a little perl script to collect a bunch of image tags from your various message threads and send email to the owners of those domains to be sure they are aware of the theft of bandwidth and possible copyright violations. The fact that many copyrighted images, including mine, have embedded comments indicating a copyright should make it easy to find some stolen images on your site...

I don't have a legal team, and I'm sure folks reading this don't have a legal team. I know Disney has a legal team. Have you ever seen how rabid Disney is about protecting their copyrights and trademarks? Got any pictures of Mickey Mouse around here? I'm sure you friendly message board types don't have assets worth going after, but what about those companies that make *this* message board possible?

Of course I would send a copy of any evidence of illegal activity on this board to the folks at keypoint (http://www.keypoint.com.au/) who so kindly provide your little message board a home. And let's not forget those nice people at Labyrinth Connections that host your DNS. They should be made aware of any potential legal liabilities arising from their apparent charitable hosting of this site. I'd somehow feel guilty if I didn't also look into who the upstream providers are for your netblock...

Yes, I'm a prick. Yes, I'm pissed off. and YES, what you guys are doing is WRONG. Make all the jokes you want, but remove the link to shooter.net

I don't have any illusions about how effective my actions may be, but I know that I wouldn't want some prick pointing out to everyone and anyone (especially those people nice enough to host my site) how I was breaking the law... I'd just take the fucking link down and be done with the matter...

Cheers,

Stevem

Mr Steve, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:00 (fifteen years ago) link

http://espn-i.starwave.com/media/pg2/2002/0123/photo/a_tyson_i.jpg

ModJ (ModJ), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:08 (fifteen years ago) link

did you ever stop to think you stole stevem's name, fucktard??! I'm calling the FCC.

Allyzay, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:14 (fifteen years ago) link

Ha ha ha ha, what a ponce!

Jon Williams (ex machina), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:16 (fifteen years ago) link

http://www.simplebits.com/archives/2004/02/04/common_sense_and_image_lifting.html

^ read dumbass

Jon Williams (ex machina), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:19 (fifteen years ago) link

NYC?

RJG (RJG), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:20 (fifteen years ago) link

Ally sold us all out.

bnw (bnw), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:23 (fifteen years ago) link

He's going to get GWB to invade Australia to remove those links!

Jon Williams (ex machina), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:24 (fifteen years ago) link

It was always my plan to destroy ILX. THRU MASSIVE BANDWIDTH DESTRUCTION.

Allyzay, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:27 (fifteen years ago) link

Take off every zig!

bnw (bnw), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:30 (fifteen years ago) link

zig-ah-zig-ah

RJG (RJG), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:31 (fifteen years ago) link

I guess you guys aren't as smart as I thought....

Funny that I mentioned Disney. A simple glance at the image tags on this page reveals:

a_tyson_i.jpg

it's from: http://espn-i.starwave.com

espn is a Disney company....

I'd suggest that you read:

http://disney.go.com/corporate/legal/terms.html

If you are smart, you'll simply shut up and remove the offending link from your site. You guys are in the wrong. Period.

Disney hasn't bothered with you because you haven't hit their radar. Yet. Your providers haven't been bothered by your rampant casual THEIVERY because it hasn't appeared on their radar. Yet. While you may or may not get shot down, I can make sure you show up on several radar screens like a freaking 747...

Mr Steve, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:34 (fifteen years ago) link

http://espn-i.starwave.com/media/pg2/2002/0123/photo/a_tyson_i.jpg

ModJ (ModJ), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:35 (fifteen years ago) link

http://www.ryman-novel.com/car1/dumb-bell.gif

Jon Williams (ex machina), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:38 (fifteen years ago) link

http://www.funny--pictures.com/pictures/i_see_dumb_people.jpg

Jon Williams (ex machina), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:39 (fifteen years ago) link

It's like my logic professor got really bored and decided to come on ILX or something.

Allyzay, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:44 (fifteen years ago) link

http://ilx.wh3rd.net/newquestions.php?board=55

Jon Williams (ex machina), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:47 (fifteen years ago) link

WTF picture is he even on about? Just delete the damn thread, all it is is Nick hating on Yancey anyway.

Allyzay, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:49 (fifteen years ago) link

This is a first for me.

Jon Williams totally OTFM.

donut bitch (donut), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:57 (fifteen years ago) link

And here I thought it was N.W.A. reviving this thread talking about how much Ice Cube is a New York sellout.

donut bitch (donut), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 06:57 (fifteen years ago) link

Mr. Steve, in the amount of time it took to post here a couple times, you could have easily edited your .htaccess file

Details here: http://www.simplebits.com/archives/2004/02/04/common_sense_and_image_lifting.html

Elvis Telecom (Chris Barrus), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 07:00 (fifteen years ago) link

their plants selection is pretty awesome as well (though i bought a venus flytrap there once for like $3 and it was the saddest venus flytrap ever, i had to force-feed it bugs)

omg geeta, thats so cute.

phil-two (phil-two), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 07:03 (fifteen years ago) link

I know about .htaccess files.

Instead of flipping me shit, one of the knowledgeable users of this board could have indicated how I could request a moderator to remove the offending link. Somone could have said, "Oh, we're doing something illegal that pisses you off? I'm sorry, we'll stop." I know, that's asking entirely too much... But come on guys, there is so much petty thievery going on around here that it seems like this site must be run by the government... If someone complains the smart thing to do is point them to a moderator, or even better, make a request for moderation of the offending link, apologize politely and be done with it.

But since you guys have chosen to not do the "smart thing", you've *really* pissed me off, and I will be satisfied with nothing less than removal of the offending material.

Hopefully someone will have the good sense to rectify this situation. Trust me, it'll be a lot more difficult to deal with the fallout from a few well placed emails from a pissed off prick than it would to do the "right thing".

Cheers,

Stevem


Mr Steve, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 07:21 (fifteen years ago) link

there's a Moderation Request link near the bottom of the page

oops (Oops), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 07:22 (fifteen years ago) link

every fifth post on this board today has read like a marissa marchant monologue.

jody (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 07:31 (fifteen years ago) link

steve, linking to images on remote servers is one of the ways that the web "works." it's built into the spec. it's NOT illegal and it's NOT "thievery," no matter how much you would like it to be. if you tell us who the photographer is we'll credit him or her, but if you want the image gone from this thread, please just edit your .htaccess file! damn!!

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 13:35 (fifteen years ago) link

I've edited Ally's post so that it doesn't directly link to Mr Steve's site. Hopefully he will now shut up and go away.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 13:36 (fifteen years ago) link

You'd think, but I have this hunch.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 13:41 (fifteen years ago) link

Steve, while I realise that bandwidth and fair-use issues are important to you, that politeness thing works both ways in that a simple, polite request to a moderator to remove your link would have been preferable to flaming like a BK Broiler. You may be right, but that doesn't excuse any rudeness. I also like the bit where you tell us to read your page carefully - although if your pic came from Google images, that might not have happened because of how it works - and then cannot be bothered to scroll down far enough to see a moderation request link when you pay us a visit.

Also, if there is any whiff of abuse or slander on the part of someone puroprting to be considering legal action, it doesn't look very good for the complainant. It could, in fact, be seen as extortion based on certain precedents.

suzy (suzy), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 13:58 (fifteen years ago) link

WTF picture is he even on about? Just delete the damn thread, all it is is Nick hating on Yancey anyway.

-- Allyzay (notthatyanceydoesntdeservei...), February 18th, 2004 1:49 AM. (later)

THIS IS EXACTLY WHY IT NEEDS TO STAY UP!

NA (Nick A.), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 14:22 (fifteen years ago) link

yancey?

RJG (RJG), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 14:23 (fifteen years ago) link

Tracer:

You (and the others) just don't get it. That's what pisses me off. You say, 'Linking to images on remote servers is one of the ways that the web "works." it's built into the spec. it's NOT illegal and it's NOT "thievery," no matter how much you would like it to be.'

When there is a specific notice, specific language forbidding linking to images on my site, and cleary requiring my permission before using any of my images, it IS wrong to do so, and it is a copyright violation. Copyright violations are "intellectual property theft". I'm not just blowing smoke, it's true.

'if you tell us who the photographer is we'll credit him or her'

Please pluck a clue off the tree. simply giving a photo credit doesn't relieve you of responsibility to ask PERMISSION before using someone elses property. My images, yes I'm the photographer, are my property. You couldn't take my car and then defend yourself against car theft charges by saying, "well, I put a sign on the car door saying it belonged to Stevem" Taking without permission is theft.

'but if you want the image gone from this thread, please just edit your .htaccess file! damn!!'

No. Simply ask permission before using someone elses work. It's really not that hard. If Ally would have dropped me an email and asked to use the image, my standard response is, sure, go ahead. But that didn't happen. It's not my responsibility to prevent you from breaking the law. It is your responsiblity to obey the law.

Since you guys have finally removed the offending link, I"ll be leaving you all alone to your own little game. However, I hope that this ugly episode will at least make you think about asking for permission before helping yourself to the work and bandwidth of others.. And gawd, if someone complains about copyright/bandwidth issues, be nice. remedy the situation and apologize...

Oh, one last thing, when you do a google image search, pay attention to the line that says, "This image may be subject to copyright."

Cheers!

Stevem

Mr_Steve (Mr_Steve), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 15:41 (fifteen years ago) link

stevem, you've changed.

RJG (RJG), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 15:42 (fifteen years ago) link

"intellectual"

suzy (suzy), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 15:44 (fifteen years ago) link

Well, it's been a pleasure chatting with you folks. Thank you very for removing the offending link. I'll be on my way now. But before I go, I'll give you an example of the right way to point to content in the absence of usage permission:

http://community.webshots.com/html/violation.htm

Yup, it's that simple, post the link. Now I could have cut and pasted the content from that page right here in this little text window, but that would have been a no-no.

By the way, any admins paying attention to this thread. It would demonstate a modicum of due dilligence if you were to have a readily available link to your policy regarding complaints of copyright violation. A somewhat murky "moderation request" will likely not provide you with anywhere near the protection (and ease of use for victims) that the above reference link would provide to you... Just a thought, and a demonstration of how to be a good Netizen...

Ciao!

Stevem

Mr_Steve (Mr_Steve), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 15:50 (fifteen years ago) link

'but if you want the image gone from this thread, please just edit your .htaccess file! damn!!'

No. Simply ask permission before using someone elses work. It's really not that hard. If Ally would have dropped me an email and asked to use the image, my standard response is, sure, go ahead. But that didn't happen. It's not my responsibility to prevent you from breaking the law. It is your responsiblity to obey the law.

This is like, say, owning a nice home with lots of nice things in a sketchy neighborhood, but refusing to lock the doors because you think people should know better than to steal things because, after all, stealing is obviously wrong. Once you've been relieved of your car, VCR and jewelery, sure, the theft is the robber's fault, no question. But you'll still look pretty silly -- perverse, even -- for not locking your damned doors.

Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 15:57 (fifteen years ago) link

what the bloody hell

stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 15:58 (fifteen years ago) link

i've been referred to as Mr Steve before as well, on mainstream radio no less.

stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 15:59 (fifteen years ago) link

This thread needs more

http://bs20002.tripod.com/006.jpg

Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 15:59 (fifteen years ago) link

Haha yeah, "Moderation Request" is a pretty confusing way of putting forth the concept of how one would find a moderator. "I thought if I clicked it, my desktop would suddenly have a scooter on it and my start up noise would be a...a...Faces song!!"

You still haven't apologized for stealing stevem's name.

Allyzay, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 15:59 (fifteen years ago) link

i feel so violated

stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:00 (fifteen years ago) link

Better a bandwith thief than an oxygen thief.

suzy (suzy), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:01 (fifteen years ago) link

I hope to god somethingawful.com never finds this place.

Allyzay, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:02 (fifteen years ago) link

Stevem if I were you I'd stop fannying around on ILE and check he hasn't moved into your house or cleared out your bank account in the process.

Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:03 (fifteen years ago) link

What is it with all these irate Googlers today anyway? I've a good mind to go and revive the B4ngbus thread just for a laugh.

Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:03 (fifteen years ago) link

it's like i said to my man Tracer in Le Swimerama, 'move it or lose it buddy, we can take this all the way to Coney'

mr stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:03 (fifteen years ago) link

i still don't get why there are two stevems with the same e-mail on the ILE statsc0ck now either

stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:04 (fifteen years ago) link

You're going to be REALLY freaked out come the next FAP.

Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:05 (fifteen years ago) link

I think he just needs friends, he seems pretty upset that I didn't start emailing him. When you look at it that way, it's touching, almost.

Allyzay, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:08 (fifteen years ago) link

and there have been two lookalikes of me reported by ILXers in the last fortnight as well

PORTENTS PEOPLE! PORTENTS! ICH BIN EIN DOPPELGANGER

stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:09 (fifteen years ago) link

Kate will be overjoyed...

Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:10 (fifteen years ago) link

I know who you should call.

http://www.jagweb.com/jaguarmodelclub/TVjags/Quadrophenia-1.jpg

Allyzay, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:11 (fifteen years ago) link

uh oh

http://unit.bjork.com/77island/77island/images/alarmcall61big.jpg

stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:16 (fifteen years ago) link

God whatever happened to the Crash Test Dummies?

Allyzay, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:19 (fifteen years ago) link

Forget them, what about Chocolate Milk?

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:20 (fifteen years ago) link

mmmmmmmm...morphine

stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:21 (fifteen years ago) link

http://www.mountainmantaxidermy.com/images/gallery/BeesNestBlackBear.jpg

hahaha... the evil Stevem walked into the ILX bees nest!

Aaron W (Aaron W), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:32 (fifteen years ago) link

I can see how remote linking can be seen as wrong, but I still can't see how it's illegal. Copyright refers to the duplication of material. Mr Steve's pictures aren't being copied (except in the sense that all pictures on the internet are copied in order to arrive at the browser screen). Ally just provided an alternative route to them to the one on your webpage.

N. (nickdastoor), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:54 (fifteen years ago) link

Isn't the problem here that he pays for bandwidth, so if we use his bandwidth then it's costing him money? Or do I misunderstand?

Markelby (Mark C), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 16:59 (fifteen years ago) link

Yes, that's the problem.

The other problem is that it's easier to configure your site so that people can't link images from it than it is to yell at people who link images from your site.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:01 (fifteen years ago) link

It's kind of a legal grey area at the moment...

http://news.com.com/2100-1025-1023629.html

We're not really profiting from posting Mr. Evil Stevem's pictures though, so I think we're more likely to fall under fair use.

Aaron W (Aaron W), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:13 (fifteen years ago) link

I hope to god somethingawful.com never finds this place.

No worries, Allyl. Somethingawful.com, UNLIKE THE ABOVE STEVEM, knows the way of the .htaccess issue, and has a very clever way of dealing with it.

They just replace external image links to a link to a huge pic of a swollen cumming cock-head. Thee best way to teach a lesson, and come out look K-COOL (if not K-CRUEL)

Just ask Chris V.

donut bitch (donut), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:28 (fifteen years ago) link

yep. giant cock heads everywhere.

Chris V (Chris V), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:30 (fifteen years ago) link

http://espn-i.starwave.com/media/pg2/2002/0123/photo/a_tyson_i.jpg

"And take your sucky Jr. High photogirl pictures with you you skinny white Ho."

ModJ (ModJ), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:33 (fifteen years ago) link

(Of course, if you just COPY the pics and load it into your own host space, all of the above issues go away.)

donut bitch (donut), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:35 (fifteen years ago) link

But that would be a very clear violation of copyright (or are you joking?)

Isn't the problem here that he pays for bandwidth, so if we use his bandwidth then it's costing him money? Or do I misunderstand?

Yeah, but I use his bandwidth by looking at the picture in its original setting too. Much more of it, in fact.

N. (nickdastoor), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:38 (fifteen years ago) link

Well, now with the links down, no one will will be able to know about his images except for the people he told about his site... so... if a tree falls in the woods...

ModJ (ModJ), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:41 (fifteen years ago) link

I found an actual pic of the Steve guy though... he looks somewhat familiar..

http://www.wasteoftechnology.com/motw/williamatherton/peck.jpg

donut bitch (donut), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:44 (fifteen years ago) link

haha, is that from his site?

RJG (RJG), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:46 (fifteen years ago) link

Not THIS version

http://www.kuci.org/~brianm/ile/peck.jpg

donut bitch (donut), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:47 (fifteen years ago) link

(if the former goes down, then THERE WILL STILL BE ONE)

donut bitch (donut), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:48 (fifteen years ago) link

yep. giant cock heads everywhere.

ilx in a nutshell

jody (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:52 (fifteen years ago) link

I wonder if the evil stevem is a dave matthews fan....

Jon Williams (ex machina), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:53 (fifteen years ago) link

Oh and when people used to do this to my site, a quick redirect of image leechers to goatse.cx would always stop them.

Jon Williams (ex machina), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 17:54 (fifteen years ago) link

i've been curbing my leeching anyway by doing as donut bitch suggests - saving images, uploading them to my own space and then linking to that instead. if the 'owners' of the image have a problem with that they only have to contact me and request that i either remove it (which i would be extremely reluctant to do but would probably comply) or add a credit to them/the source of the image on the image itself which i am happier to do and that way more people get to see it and its good publicity for them but i still think that's being pedantic. i didn't kick up anywhere near this kind of fuss when some schmuck in California stole my images and design and used them for his own website a few months back. i mailed him and asked him to change it or at least credit me but i got no reply. oh well, some people have no integrity (it wasn't even that great a design tho).

stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 18:16 (fifteen years ago) link

http://tfp.killbots.com/scans/181_zoid-dance.gif

Jon Williams (ex machina), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 18:20 (fifteen years ago) link

Isn't the problem here that he pays for bandwidth, so if we use his bandwidth then it's costing him money?

Actually he stated numerous times that he didn't give a shit about that so honestly I'm not 100% sure what his issue is besides people seeing his picture without him getting a counter hit on his website. I'd understand more if it was the bandwidth thing, though not really why he was dealing with it in such a fashion (the same shit happens to me all the time and I just don't even give a fuck to be honest, like as been pointed out it's really easy to fix if I cared about it).

Allyzay, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 19:40 (fifteen years ago) link

(haha if he really just wants email, people could go reply to his original thread on the moderator request board and that should satisfy him)

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 19:41 (fifteen years ago) link

let's clear one thing up right away: Dave Matthews Band Sucks!

Mr_Steve (Mr_Steve), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 20:41 (fifteen years ago) link

OH SNAP NOW YOU DONE IT

Kingfish Beatbox (Kingfish), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 20:46 (fifteen years ago) link

You all are too funny. Now I'm having fun...

On the one hand the "other" stevem says he complained when the found out somone was leeching (his word not mine, but mighty appropriate) from their site. And the reason that the he was upset? Because he wasn't getting CREDIT for his work. And you guys say you don't understand what my issue is. I want credit for my work! DAMNIT! I want control of how my artistic output is used. It's my right to have both of those! But then the other stevem goes on to say that rather than leeching now he copies the images and serves them off his web server, and that he *might* (though likely not) stop using the image if the owner comlained. So he's willing to ask someone to stop using his work or give him credit, buy may not afford somone else that same courtesy? Internally inconsistent.

Regarding the bandwidth issue. Just because your message board didn't tax my bandwidth means it is okay to "leech" some of it? By this (failed) logic the next time you go to the ATM and take out a hundred bucks from your overflowing bank account, you won't mind if I reach into your wallet and extract a 20 dollar bill?

It is precisely this attitude of entitlement and open flouting of legal and ethical behavior that I find so offensive. The hypocritical element is just frosting on your cake of moral turpitude. Have you people never heard of the Golden Rule? Did your mommy fail to teach you that it's wrong to take something from somone (even if they have plenty) without their permission? Did your daddy somehow forget to teach you that stealing is wrong? Someone absolutely forgot to impart empathy or responsibility upon you... But judging by your moral development, you're only 10 years old, so there's still hope.

Mr_Steve (Mr_Steve), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:00 (fifteen years ago) link

Dude, when Netscape first put background images into their spec, they had a "how-to" page with lots of sample images that you could use. In their instructions they encouraged you to link directly to the images on their server.

It's the WORLD WIDE WEB. If you don't want people linking to your images, this is a bad place to keep them.

To paraphrase Chuck D, it's like dropping a whole bunch of M&Ms and freaking out when people pick them up.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:01 (fifteen years ago) link

Have you ever heard of politely asking people to do something rather than ranting like a lunatic?

Jon Williams (ex machina), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:02 (fifteen years ago) link

But then we wouldn't have gotten to argue like this, Jon!

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:04 (fifteen years ago) link

The hypocritical element is just frosting on
your cake of moral turpitude.

When Julia Child and The People's Court combine efforts.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:06 (fifteen years ago) link

photography isn't art anyways. nothing ever changes.

kephm, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:07 (fifteen years ago) link

To be honest, I think we're being a bit disrespectful to Mr Steve. He has a justifiable complaint, and even if he's putting it a bit wankily, I think recognition of what he's saying (and an apology) would be more approrpiate than some of the really nasty sniping. IMHO.

Markelby (Mark C), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:08 (fifteen years ago) link

I suspect, Mark, that had he simply said a few lines asking for the link to be removed -- and noting that he was somewhat angry about it but didn't want to get all hyped up immediately without seeing what the initial reaction would be -- then none of this would have happened, and an apology would be readily and easily given on behalf of the board.

As it is, I now *strongly* wonder if he tries this same sort of tactic every time for every potential link he's gotten.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:11 (fifteen years ago) link

yeah, and he'll be calling us "want a be's" next.

Kingfish Beatbox (Kingfish), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:13 (fifteen years ago) link

Like we give one fuck.

Markelby (Mark C), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:14 (fifteen years ago) link

Leonard J Crabs to thread.

Felonious Drunk (Felcher), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:16 (fifteen years ago) link

Richard, people have also politely suggested remedies to his complaint, but he's only angrily and somewhat bizarrely replied THAT SHOULDN'T BE MY RESPONSIBILITY. (Getting back to my house example above, it's like saying "crime is the fault of the criminal and not the victim, therefore, I'm not going to put locks on my home because criminals should know better.") I suspect, like Ned does, that whatever dismay he gets over the theft of his pictures is greatly outweighed by the pleasure he gets complaining about it.

Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:19 (fifteen years ago) link

Richard?

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:20 (fifteen years ago) link

well,

http://www.deansabatino.com/images/portfolio/portfolio_richard.gif

Kingfish Beatbox (Kingfish), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:24 (fifteen years ago) link

Ricardo, whatever.

Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:29 (fifteen years ago) link

Waaitaminute. I've confused a couple people here. My bad.

Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:30 (fifteen years ago) link

OMG it's usenet! RUN!

Orbit (Orbit), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:31 (fifteen years ago) link

Ricardo, Markelby... YOU ALL LOOK ALIKE

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:31 (fifteen years ago) link

Nope, I don't beat the crap outta people like this all the time.. In fact I generally don't give a shit if people try to steal my work. Generally the 2.8 MB image of the lunar surface or some crap like that causes the "offending party" to remove the link. But you guys just don't care. the image Ally intended to steal NEVER worked on this board. My .htaccess file redirected to the big whonking image first time the request came from this stie...

But no, you guys can't take a hint. You've collectively downloaded that big ass file more than 1200 times since August. at a toal bandwidth utilization of about 3.3GB. My site generally pushes about 4 or 5gb+ a day... That's why it's colocated. Regardles of your bandwidth consumption (which would have been significantly lower if you had got the little 640x480 image you were requesting), you are not entitled and have not been granted permission to use my images or bandwidth... Yes, it really is the principle of the matter.

Then when I started looking around and saw how casually and OFTEN you guys steal images, I couldn't believe my eyes! And then there was this "fuck you" attitude of "it's our right to take from you whatever we want" that just amazed me!

So check this shit out... I know you all think I'm whacked outta my gourd... Even if I am whacked outta my gourd, What I'm saying about copyright and usage is real. So here's the real deal:

if you are interested in understanding copyright laws/issues:

http://www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html

pay special attention to the section on inlining in this link:

http://www.templetons.com/brad/linkright.html

It really is a good idea for your guys to responsibly address this issue. Add a link to the front page of the site that says "click here to protest the use of your content" or some such thing. And then nicely remove any protested content. Instead of inlining images, post links to html pages so the owner, creator, person doing the work, gets credit. Ask permission if you want to use an image. Probably 98% of the time, the owner will say, fine. I've only turned down one request for using one of my images, and that guy was a stock broker! Grow up be responsible, put money in a savings account, use condoms when bumping uglies, Don't run with scissors in your hand, don't play leapfrog with unicorns. stop and smell the kine buds... Live love and prosper...

Just don't steal my fucking shit! ;\

Mr_Steve (Mr_Steve), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:32 (fifteen years ago) link

Dude, I carry a little laminated slip of paper in my wallet to remember my phone number. C'mon, what do you want from me?

Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:33 (fifteen years ago) link

Mark is Barry Lasagne, he is unique!

El Diablo Robotico (Nicole), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:36 (fifteen years ago) link

Grow up be responsible, put money in a savings account...

fitter, better, happier....etc


and to quote A Fistful of Yen, "Visit a dairy, and learn how milk is made!"

Kingfish Beatbox (Kingfish), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:39 (fifteen years ago) link

Steve:

Your objections/position/suggestions have been noted.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:41 (fifteen years ago) link

Well, regardless steves tone, isnt he right? They are his images. If he says he wants them removed, then they should be removed.

This is also regardless of it happening on thousands of other web forums, its wrong there also i would say. Though this does raise the following issue. if the boardowner is to be held responsible for this, does that mean that i, if i so wish, could i post a million of steves pictures to a board i didnt like, in order to get them into trouble? (i dont wish to do this, but it interests me how much responsibility the siteowners must take (of course yahoo ran into a similar problem with their groups thing)

also, i think the majority of the pictures here (not on this thread, which i havent seen until now, but on the board in general) are actually taken from members own sites (there are a lot of people on this board, a tiny minority of which are on this thread).

Stringent Stepper (Stringent), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:46 (fifteen years ago) link

Regardless of the way people are responding, Stringent Stepper, I think you've stated the majority opinion.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:48 (fifteen years ago) link

So, New York fucking blows, eh?

NA (Nick A.), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 21:55 (fifteen years ago) link

Yeah I put my valuables on the street for everyone to admire and wouldn't ya know - they were gone when I got home!

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 22:04 (fifteen years ago) link

I don't know about NY, but SF Rawks, we've got the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence!

http://www.shooter.net/folsom%20street%20fair%202003/source/17.html

Mr_Steve (Mr_Steve), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 22:05 (fifteen years ago) link

and that guy was a stock broker!

gabbneb (gabbneb), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 22:10 (fifteen years ago) link

what i said in my last post may sound inconsistent but it's a slightly different thing. it depends on HOW the copyright material is used for me. some guy downloaded all my images and code and added only a tiny amount of his own input and then presented this as his own site on his server. like i said i haven't whinged about this to quite the same level as alt-stevem - i only sent one e-mail, it would be hypocritical of me to have threatened or forced the 'offender' to generate his own material when i borrow so many ideas from other people and adjust them to my own preference (this includes stealing, or as i say, SAMPLING, existing material and appropriating it as i choose, as many artists, even good artists do/did all the time - if you think that's wrong then you're a Luddite and shouldn't really talk to me ever)...but still, i would never just take someone else's work and present it as my own so blatantly which is what this guy did. it annoyed and disappointed me in that it's a shame some people who purport to be creatives lack such integrity and imagination. he could've created something just as good (as i said earlier it wasn't that inspiring or imaginative a design anyway) but didn't bother, and I thought *I* was lazy yeesh. anyway the point is i don't mind plagiarism and appropriation of other people's material as long as either a) original author is credited, b) original author is not caused some sort of harm e.g. financial loss* - only one of those two is needed. that's why i download and upload music - the authors are always credited, the issue of whether they've technically LOST anything by me doing this is as grey as a geriatric elephant - they never had the sale in the first place so what's been lost? blinkered logic perhaps but no more than the logicsuch industries are founded on, plus it eases my conscience ho ho) - it may be the fucking law but we don't have to obey it, do you see alt-stevem? i suppose you've never downloaded or shared any copyright material in your life, though I find that hard to imagine.

i've found alt-stevem's lecturing on copyright and ownership dull, familiar, predicatble and patronising as i suspect we all have. as if we were not aware of the 'rules' when posting images on here (stealing/sharing copyright material)...does he not realise many people just don't care about that even though they're aware of the law. okay so the issue is settled now and the complaint was only made on a matter of (petty imo) principle but i hope i at least clarified my position, however wrong you may deem it to be - though i reserve my right to change my mind obv. - maybe this should've been a new thread already.

stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 22:14 (fifteen years ago) link

Yes, I'm a prick.>>>>

He said it.

Gear! (Gear!), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 22:25 (fifteen years ago) link

This thread is like ground zero for all the bad analogies in the world.

@d@ml (nordicskilla), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 22:52 (fifteen years ago) link

[image imbeds deleted: could you go be a cock somewhere else?]

Let's steal Steve's bandwidth and ignore his copyright!, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 22:56 (fifteen years ago) link

your enduring of my dull, familiar, predictable and patronizing behavior can be considered a pennance for your attitude about stealing other peoples work. You and the others here on this board have provided me with great entertainment during my sick day. I've got a sore throat and I can't sleep and can only barely talk.., in between working on a project for work, and updating images on my web site, I've had a lot of fun blasting out patronizing ranting and raving emails. You can argue the details all you want, but I think weall know that stealing the work of other people is wrong... Thank you!

Regarding your perspective on using/modifying/etc other people work. I see no problem with that. But by your own definition, when you guys link to my images in such a way that my site is never visible to the end user, you are clearly using my work whether small or large effort, and giving me absolutely no credit for it. Trust me, I do a bit of perl coding. cpan.org is my friend. I don't believe in creating any script from scratch. But when I use a module or script that someone else has written, I take the time to drop them an email and say thank you... No, I am not an angel. I've reached a point in my life where it's easier and less worries to pay for my sattelite channels rather than get a decoder. I pay for shareware that I use, and when I needed office for my mac, I convinced my boss to buy it for me. As I've gotten older, pushing 40 now, I have become much more aware that people who create things are not adequately rewarded. I have a bunch of mp3's believe it or not, if there is something I download hat I like and will listen to more than once or twice, I usually buy the CD... Although I'll likely buy it used on Amazon, so really the artists and the record company don't get shit.

I think the biggest thing that I disagree with you on is your attitude when confronted about using someone elses stuff. If you get caught. be responsive. if the owner wants you to stop, then stop. If you feel it at all, apologize...

and finally, is it really so burdensome to ask for permission before using something, or posting a link instead of an inline pull? Is it that hard to be sure that the person whose work you are using gets credit for the work?

I'm assuming the original link from this board was for a photo of SF. if Ally had emailed and said that you guys were having a dick comparison sessions between several large cities, and did I have any images to offer, I would have been happy to come up with a half a dozen really nice shots of SF. I would have felt good about it. Ally would have had photos... It all would have been cool. But that's not how it worked...

fwiw... If you follow politics.. The Republicans released a photo about a week ago of John Kerry sitting a couple of rows behind Jane Fonda (aka to vets as Hanoi Jane) at an anti war rally in the 70s. The effort was to link him to her radicalism. Only problem was that they never even met at that rally, and it was two years before Jane Fonda went to Viet Nam. The photo was taken 30 years ago. That photographer, because he has partnered with Corbis is making money on that image today. Corbis will chase down anyone who attempts to use that photo without the correct permissions.Because of copyright laws, and his ability to enforce or have them enforced, the photographer is making money on an image that he probably never made much money on before now.

Mr_Steve (Mr_Steve), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:04 (fifteen years ago) link

http://espn-i.starwave.com/media/pg2/2002/0123/photo/a_tyson_i.jpg

Lot of dick swinging in this thread.

ModJ (ModJ), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:09 (fifteen years ago) link

Do you go around to the thousands of other message boards that have similar image linking and lecture them as well? Hell even the IMDB boards did this (they stopped not because of murky legal reasons but because some posters were linking up offensive images)

Gear! (Gear!), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:15 (fifteen years ago) link

I've had a lot of fun blasting out patronizing
ranting and raving emails

I think Mike's and my assumption upthread a bit just got proved.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:17 (fifteen years ago) link

Hire a lawyer and take it to civil court already, you unbelievable dickless wonder

TOMBOT, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:26 (fifteen years ago) link

I can be equal measures:

Astounded a the amount of copyright violation happening/condoned on this thread, pissed off because of the 'tude here and the casual way you steal from me and others, and entertained while confounding you all... It's been a full fun filled day.

One point that I wanted to make is this: You (the generic you) may think that you can flaunt copyright law and use a persons images/content any way you want with impunity. On one level you are right, you are probably a punk kid with no assets worth chasing down. However the community in which you operate, meaning the provider that hosts thisserver, and other businesses are vulnerable, and a company like cnn or Disney will pursue them if someone makes enough noise. Wouldn't you feel real stupid if your provider pulled the plug on this board for violating their acceptable use policy after a nasty letter from Disney's copyright enforcement office? It's not beyond the realm of possibilities. It may not be quite the right page, but this link should give you an idea of the kind of legaleze your are up against... http://www.keypoint.com.au/agreement.html

You (the generic you and the community inclusive you) are vulnerable and accountable for your actions online. Period.

Mr_Steve (Mr_Steve), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:35 (fifteen years ago) link

You seem to have paid no attention to all of the people who are essentially agreeing with your point (if not the way you made it).

Now you're just going out of your way to be an obnoxious sockfucker.

El Diablo Robotico (Nicole), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:38 (fifteen years ago) link

Has there ever been a ruling that decided that making embedded links to images on remote servers constitutes an infringement of copyright (as you keep saying it does)? Apologies if I have missed it. That Brad Templeton page you linked to just seems to be one guy's pontificating.

and entertained while confounding you all...

You do realise how ridiculous and pompous this sounds, right?

N. (nickdastoor), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:53 (fifteen years ago) link

If he did, would he continue to post?

El Diablo Robotico (Nicole), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:55 (fifteen years ago) link

and entertained while confounding you all...>>>>

You spend your off-hours playing RPG games, don't you?

Gear! (Gear!), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:00 (fifteen years ago) link

your enduring of my dull, familiar, predictable and patronizing behavior can be considered a pennance for your attitude about stealing other peoples work.

For the record, almost the entirety of my posts and I'm pretty sure most of JBR's posts (being as we have the most amount of pic posts on this thread) are our own fucking photos off our own fucking webpages, you obnoxious cockfarmer. Jesus Christ, get over yourself. Your fucking image was deleted and, quite frankly, no one in the entire world would've been nasty to you if you hadn't come in and acted like an jackoff ramming a bee stick up his ass from the get go. You couldn't even see the words "Moderation Request" on the bottom of the page and you rush in and lose your mind on the reading skills of people who, quite honestly, didn't go to your page to begin with. Whoops, sorry.

On the upside, I was afraid you were a NYer. But you aren't! So no blight on us. I was afraid you were taking a careful stance to prove Nick right about us.

Allyzay, Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:20 (fifteen years ago) link

"'rue the day?!' Who talks like that?!"

Kingfish Beatbox (Kingfish), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:23 (fifteen years ago) link

Mr. Steve on the law, part 1:

It is precisely this attitude of entitlement and open flouting of legal and ethical behavior that I find so offensive. The hypocritical element is just frosting on your cake of moral turpitude.

Mr. Steve on the law, part 2:

stop and smell the kine buds

gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:25 (fifteen years ago) link

Actually I think I say 'rue the day' quite often.

N. (nickdastoor), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:26 (fifteen years ago) link

You would, wouldn't you.

Allyzay, Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:29 (fifteen years ago) link

do you say 'go spare' too?

cozen (Cozen), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:30 (fifteen years ago) link

Sometimes.

N. (nickdastoor), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:32 (fifteen years ago) link

x-post.

cozen (Cozen), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:33 (fifteen years ago) link

Does it matter?

N. (nickdastoor), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:33 (fifteen years ago) link

"believe it or not, george isn't home..."

cozen (Cozen), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:36 (fifteen years ago) link

I really, REALLY hate it when ignorant cockfarmers start spouting intellectual property law that they themselves don't understand IN THE SLIGHTEST. I'm talking to you, Mr. Steve.

Colin Meeder (Mert), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:39 (fifteen years ago) link

Ally OTM, and whats interesting is if you go to the moderator board where he lists a slew of URLs that are being leeched, many of them are THE WEBSITES OF USERS OF THIS FORUM. We're putting up our OWN pictures.

I do photography too, and I put it online. I agree, credit should be respected, but why would I complain if my pics appeared elsewhere - its good exposure. "But no one knows theyre mine!" you might say.

Well, thats why I'd be smart and put a clear copyright watermark with my name etc ON EVERY PHOTO ON MY SITE. There, your getting credit problem is solved, and if you dont mind about bandwidth, what other issue is there?

Sure being asked is nice but were it me, I'd be pleased to see my pics with my name on them all over the web personally.

Trayce (trayce), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:42 (fifteen years ago) link

I think Steve is off confounding a chatroom somewhere.

Gear! (Gear!), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:45 (fifteen years ago) link

Haha Trayce, "Oi! You fookin' kids stop stealin' my photographs, ahright?? It's, like, fookin' kine buds."

http://bitchcakes.topcities.com/garethfap/phoneconfusion.jpg

Allyzay, Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:49 (fifteen years ago) link

Trayce otm. hopefully we've all learned some valuable lessons today. Don't leech other people's bandwidth unless it's something REALLY cool - and if you're uber-precious about your work then config your webspace and tailor your material to reflect this. take care of yourselves, and each other.

stevem (blueski), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:51 (fifteen years ago) link

Gareth could sue us all for millions. Well, maybe just me.

stevem (blueski), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:51 (fifteen years ago) link

We also learned "people in general like to antagonize each other to orgasm", but I suspect we knew that already.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:52 (fifteen years ago) link

Gareth will copyright us all with guns.

Trayce (trayce), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:55 (fifteen years ago) link

To orgasm.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:55 (fifteen years ago) link

only on ILX tho ;)

Ally and Tom could sue me for stealing their infinitely amusing fake e-mail thing

stevem (blueski), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:56 (fifteen years ago) link

I really, REALLY hate it when ignorant cockfarmers start spouting intellectual property law that they themselves don't understand IN THE SLIGHTEST. I'm talking to you, Mr. Steve.

Misstatements of law by lay-persons v. Failure to teach legal principles to citizens generally FITE

gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:57 (fifteen years ago) link

Go ahead. All you guys keep telling yourselves how valiant and righteous you are. That you are justified in taking and using that which doesn't belong to you. Also, go head, keep proclaiming to the choir how "most of the images" belong to us. Did you see this thread: New York City is for sellouts Did you see the list of images I referenced? Did you see how the first 5 out of 6 are copyright violation on the face (unless of course you have permission... I'll leave it to you guys to count up all the image tags in this thread and then count the number that are user owned. If those two numbers aren't equal, guess what, you're probably stealing the rest!

I don't care if 90% of the image tags point to images owned by you guys. It's very apparent to me that many of the images posted in this thread are being stolen. I have no interest in filing lawsuits against you penniless little worms, but every time you go and shoot off your mouth about what a sock fucker I am and all that sanctimonoius crap you're spewing, I'm tempted to send out an email to each of the victims of your theft - including the big guys that might just be looking for a good test case to establish some case law. Isn't your ISP the biggest one in Autstralia?? Hmmmm.... Wanna see if all the people you are stealing from think what you are doing is cool? I don't think so. Also, since I've so clearly spelled out the unlawful activity (yeah, debate it in front of a civil judge if you want, I consider it unlawful and there is case history to back me up), when the complaints hit your provider etc etc, it'll be clear that you guys were notified, warned, and had ample opportunity to remedy the widespread copyright violations that are all over this thread -- and yet you took no action...

But never fear, I'm sure your provider is willing to fight the good fight for you guys, go to bat against the legal department at ESPN/Disney/CNN etc to establish that what you guys are doing is just fine and dandy... Sure, that's exactly what your provider is gonna do... If I were you guys, I'd be looking forward to it. I'm sure it'll be exciting...

You guys are fools. I've been having fun pounding home my point that what you guys are doing is wrong, even if it's commonplace. The quality of the arguments from your side have been good -- for a bunch of fourth grade special education students. I have grown weary of you all and this topic.

And yes, since this whole thing started out with you stealing from me, I have tried to be an asshole to you all. Of course this whole thing has been ridiulous and pompous. Thanks for playing along... Fuck you very much.

Note, this is not a threat, this is not extortion. If you guys continue to link to images on my site, I wll search for and find every instance of image theft, deep linking and any other copyright violations and notify the victims (I'm sure they'll be pleased to know you've been punking them) as well as all of your providers, they have acceptable use policies. I'm sure they'll enjoy seeing the postings where you say, "fuck it, I know it's wrong but I'm doing it anyway, what are you gonnna do about it sock fucker??". That is not a threat, that is a promise. Leave me and my site alone, and I'll leave you alone. Fuck with me with me and you better hope you don't so much as spit on the sidewalk next to the building where your server is located... Because I'll be there to call attention to it.

I'm outta here...

Have a nice life kids...

stevem

Mr_Steve (Mr_Steve), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:59 (fifteen years ago) link

If this was a film you'd be played by Anthony Michael Hall.

Allyzay, Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:03 (fifteen years ago) link

Ally, I think you need to apologize to Anthony Michael Hall. This guy would be played by Randy Quaid.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:04 (fifteen years ago) link

i ws saying 'ALLYZAY RIGHT ON!' lots of times but -. when did we get so hermetic? only towards assholes? is stevem an asshole? and Evil stevem?

stevem isn't an asshole. he only has hair.

cozen (Cozen), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:04 (fifteen years ago) link

when did we get so hermetic?

When was the first ILM post? Sometime in 2000?

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:05 (fifteen years ago) link

I sure I had something funny to say worth saying.

x-post. : /

cozen (Cozen), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:06 (fifteen years ago) link

< /sub-RJG at best>

cozen (Cozen), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:07 (fifteen years ago) link

Steve didnt even address my point about watermarking his goddamn photos. Geez.

And if Labyrinth is "Australias largest ISP" I'll eat my hat. My several friends who work there will find that terribly hilarious actually.

Trayce (trayce), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:09 (fifteen years ago) link

whoa, dude has pictures of kmfdm. I assume Sascha and co. gave him permission.

bnw (bnw), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:13 (fifteen years ago) link

oops

bnw doing it again (bnw), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:14 (fifteen years ago) link

sub me?

RJG (RJG), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:15 (fifteen years ago) link

The thing is, the whole thing is hysterical. I've never seen anyone act like this, I mean a good general policy to have is to be at least vaguely polite about things. The other thing is that huge ass corporations like Disney have people who they pay to basically sit there and run through referral logs, which anyone with half a brain knows. So I'm assuming that such a learned legal authority as evil stevem knows that his bizarro threats are like the rantings of a crazy senile man in a rent-controlled building in NYC: weird, pointless, delusions of grandeur. They already know about it. And, obviously, don't give a shit. The guy just gave himself a ton of bad publicity on a site that is supposedly getting 1,200 hits per day, as he claims this thread is getting (!!! which seems, er, ludicrious but I guess Andrew would know that better than I), for no reason other than to be a curmudgeonly asshole who flip flops what he says on every other post.

I mean, good lord, Trayce OTM, as someone trying to get attention for your photography, do it in a positive fashion. I'd be pleased too, and am pleased when this happens to me. If the issue is bandwidth, which happened when I was at the newspaper, a polite email was generally all it took to stop anything from going on. I sure as hell wouldn't have gone on a website ranting maniacally about how I'm going to take down all and sundry supposed illiterates garnering myself and the publication I worked for a bunch of ill-will and ridicule.

It's just horrible fucking marketing and as a fan of popular shite, I can't condone that.

Allyzay, Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:15 (fifteen years ago) link

[MOD NOTE: STOP LINKING PICS FROM THIS GUY'S SITE, YOU GIGANTIC ASSHAT; IT WASN'T FUNNY THE FIRST TIME]

dA oRiGeNaL sTeVEm!, Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:16 (fifteen years ago) link

(I hope he appreciates my metaphor, it seems the only way he speaks)

Allyzay, Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:17 (fifteen years ago) link

stop being a nobhead dA oRiGeNaL sTeVEm

can we just delete alt.stevem's pics and links to and just lock the thread now?

stevem (blueski), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:17 (fifteen years ago) link

but what about the sellouts in new york city?

RJG (RJG), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:18 (fifteen years ago) link

what about yancey?

RJG (RJG), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:19 (fifteen years ago) link

yeah, sub me.

cozen (Cozen), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:19 (fifteen years ago) link

probably x-post.

*acting cool like I don't already know*

cozen (Cozen), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:19 (fifteen years ago) link

"Also, since I've so clearly spelled out the unlawful activity (yeah, debate it in front of a civil judge if you want, I consider it unlawful and there is case history to back me up), when the complaints hit your provider etc etc, it'll be clear that you guys were notified, warned, and had ample opportunity to remedy the widespread copyright violations that are all over this thread -- and yet you took no action..."

The Copyrighted images are not being hosted on this server. No Copyright violations are occurring. You have no recourse here.

Andrew (enneff), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:20 (fifteen years ago) link

Also, I should probably mention that ILX is not a Keypoint Subscriber and thus not bound by that legal document.

Andrew (enneff), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:25 (fifteen years ago) link

*unimpressed by dA o. s., reads through Mr. Steve's tendentiousness*

There there, you just need some wawa and your nookie and your blankie.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:28 (fifteen years ago) link

[There's really no point in continuing to link this guy's images, considering he has a script in place which returns the http://wh3rd.net/ home image instead.]

dA oRiGeNaL sTeVEm!, Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:34 (fifteen years ago) link

Actually, maybe da o. s. is Mr. Steve.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:35 (fifteen years ago) link

Mr Steven no one know who you are, no one cares, and you're not gonna fuck with any of us because you're a big twat. please go away.

Gear! (Gear!), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:35 (fifteen years ago) link

Haha Ned said "nookie".

Allyzay, Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:36 (fifteen years ago) link

shooter.net is for sellouts and asshats

dean! (deangulberry), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:53 (fifteen years ago) link

three months pass...
Reviving for this great piece

Hot Times: The carping about summer in New York City has already begun so it's about time to begin the contrarian’s response—I love summer in the city.

Opera in the park, with bits of cheese and chilled Sancerre in plastic cups. Lingering lunches in shaded sidewalk bistros. Rooftop parties overserving beer out of garbage cans filled with ice and sand. Sunrise whiskeys with bartenders in the Rockaways. Girls in short skirts with beads of sweat on the small of their backs. Falling asleep on the lawn alongside the Hudson River. Aperitifs at A60. Midday movies to escape the humidity. Seared tuna salad and buffalo mozzarella and three pinot grigio lunches. The song of the summer. Pretending the subway doesn’t exist. Dancing at the Bulgarian bar until your clothes stick to your everything. Bloomsday breakfast Guinness. Poolside rooftop mojitos. Kids playing whiffle ball in the park. Rounds of lights and darks at McSorely’s. Backyard barbeques. Churchyard sangrias. Pints of lager outside the Ear. Steamy shagging. Belmont Stakes. Publishing girls drinking at noon on Fridays. Emerging from a perspiration and beer soaked dive bar into the crisp pre-dawn air. Summerstage beertent. Making out in taxis, aroused from the sudden application of air-conditioning. Shakespeare in the Park. Champagne breaknight breakfasts in Inwood Park. Salted Tecantes in a Chinatown Mexican restaurant. Smoking cigarettes in the Goodworld alley garden. Flirting with the daughters of firemen in Breezy point. Long days spent in dark bars. Chilled gazpacho. Watermelons soaked with vodka. Interns with improbably fashionable clothes and the spending habits of people who are spending other people’s money. Old flames. New infernos. Tar beach sunbathing. Avoiding parades with all day bruches that turn into all night bacchanals. Chasing the ghost of Dylan Thomas at the Whitehorse tavern. Fireworks from an Avenue B rooftop. Wilting while watching the Yankees. Midnight oysters at Milk & Honey.

Gear up, lads and lasses. We’re going in.

Elvis Telecom (Chris Barrus), Thursday, 17 June 2004 21:39 (fifteen years ago) link

Wilting while watching the Yankees.

BOO!

just about everything else is fine by me, tho.

hstencil (hstencil), Thursday, 17 June 2004 23:11 (fifteen years ago) link

Oh, Chris. Now you made me wanna go to NY. But I guess Stockholm, Sweden is quite good in summer as well.

TBA (TBA), Friday, 18 June 2004 00:11 (fifteen years ago) link

four months pass...
four months pass...
J0hn's post way upthread misses out on Iowa's great former tourism slogan that predated the "fields of opportunity" (groan) one. It used to be "A place to grow" and was accompanied by this clover-looking symbol that my parents insisted looked like a pot leaf from the right angle.

So, "Iowa: A place to grow (marijuana)"

BTW, D4rni3lle sold out and left Iowa, anyway.

mike h. (mike h.), Thursday, 10 March 2005 19:45 (fourteen years ago) link

three years pass...

Hello again. Sorry to email again so soon, but it seems the new phone number has already made it's way onto the internet.
When I opened Milk and Honey in January of 2000 it was not reservation only, and had no lock on the door. It was open to anyone who knew the address, and attracted a community of people with one thing in common: knowing how to drink and remain polite, to each other and the residents of Eldridge Street.

The barrage of constant write ups forced us to start running reservations, in order to prevent crowds outside from bothering our landlord (who lives directly upstairs.) Changing the number each time it was published worked for several years to keep the chain of word of mouth relatively strong.

Now, however, with the advent of blogging, there is no chance for that to work. Since the number change of a few weeks ago, my staff actually report an increase in first time customers, who have evidently never heard that it was a quiet bar, merely that it was a trendy one. The landlord has given us his first noise complaints in almost 9 years of business, all regarding the conversation of smokers outside or people exiting loudly.

Over the years our "first call, first serve" policy, while being fair on the face of it, I now realize was quite unfair to our regulars. The people were awake at 9 AM to send in the earliest text message and people who quietly exit the bar at 2 AM seem seldom to be the same people. In an effort to get back the small, like-minded community that we had in the beginning (and regain the quiet that we need to get our year-by-year lease renewed,) I am taking steps to convert Milk and Honey into a private social club.

This process will take over a year, involving the granting of a Social Club Charter by New York State.

In the meantime, we will adopt a half measure that allows us to remain within the law. If membership in such a program interests you, read on. If not, for the next year or so, reservations will still be available on [REDACTED].

M&H Regular Program

Four of our six tables will be allocated to our regulars, who may make an advance reservation, call twenty minutes prior, or just stop by without calling. Regulars will be given a key to the front door. If there are no seats available, you may lock up the next table, and go to White Star or another nearby bar and we will call you when the table is ready. There will be no standing room, and no more advance wait list.

Cocktails will be priced for regulars and their guests at $9, Regulars may bring up to 3 guests., and the key is non transferrable. There are three types of key available. A Standard one, which is $300 a year plus tax. ($325) To renew the membership at the same rate, the regular must have attended at least 10 weekdays the previous year, defined as Sunday through Wednesday. Everyone wants to come during prime time, but without consistent weekday business we will fail.

An Unrestricted key can be used as seldom as you like, and is 3000 a year, with tax $3250. If you have more money than time, this is for you. The Unrestricted key in no way has any advantage in service over a Regular Key. Tables are allocated first come or call, first serve. It is merely that we need each of the 250 keyholders to contribute their share into the business, one way or the other.

Lastly, an Industry key is available for people in the restaurant business. This key has no minimum visits, costs the same as a Standard key and is only valid after 1 AM. If an Industry key holder wishes to come before 1 AM on they must make a reservation, through the normal channel, for one of the other two tables, and will receive no preference in the reservation book.

The program will go into effect the first of November. Payment is by check to "M&H Concierge Services, inc". I will be at White Star, 21 Essex Street between Hester and Canal from 7-9pm starting Thursday, signing people up until we have reached 250 Standard key holders. I would like to meet each key holder face to face., and look forward to reconnecting with some old friends.

Sasha Petraske
14 October 2008

― max, Friday, October 17, 2008 8:28 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

metametadata (n/a), Friday, 17 October 2008 14:44 (ten years ago) link

the initial post on this thread is so fucking otm

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:47 (ten years ago) link

i moved to new york so i could go to milk and honey

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:48 (ten years ago) link

its not true that there are hundreds of great cities in the us

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 14:49 (ten years ago) link

THERE IS ONLY ONE LOL!

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 14:50 (ten years ago) link

It ain't nothin' but a concrete jungle with people packed like sardines
Where everybody's tryin' to live beyond their means
Where all the natives hurry and scurry too and fro
And like a fleas on a puppy dog they got no place to go.

I wouldn't live in New York City if they gave me the whole dang town
Talk about a bummer it's the biggest one around
Sodom and Gommorah was tame to what I found
I wouldn't live in New York City if they gave me the whole dang town.

Well, I ain't seen the sunshine since the day that I arrived
'Cause brother I've been busy a-tryin' to survive
Nobody knows you've been here till you're six feet under ground
Than you become a statistic if they remember to write you down.

I wouldn't live in New York City if they gave me the whole dang town
Talk about a bummer it's the biggest one around
Sodom and Gommorah was tame to what I found
I wouldn't live in New York City if they gave me the whole dang town...

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:50 (ten years ago) link

FU U JEALOUS!

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 14:51 (ten years ago) link

i def. don't think there are "hundreds" of great cities, BTW

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:51 (ten years ago) link

is this thread the earliest known challop on ilx?

metametadata (n/a), Friday, 17 October 2008 14:51 (ten years ago) link

what are the great cities in the us besides new york

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:51 (ten years ago) link

oh they're all great

metametadata (n/a), Friday, 17 October 2008 14:52 (ten years ago) link

plz tell me where to sell out.

(max, come to ILB FAP Sat nite)

Dr Morbius, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:52 (ten years ago) link

funny story: earliest known challop is actually ilm's first thread: Indie Rock: What's Going On?

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:52 (ten years ago) link

morbs i got ur email but i got concert tix that night

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:53 (ten years ago) link

but q u said "the initial post on this thread is so fucking otm"

see thats what i hate abt non new yorkers theyre so imprecise

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 14:53 (ten years ago) link

and ugly and smelly

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 14:53 (ten years ago) link

and dumb obv

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 14:53 (ten years ago) link

yah but initial post also says

OK, that's hyperbole.

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:54 (ten years ago) link

YOU ARE HYPERBOLE FOOL

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 14:54 (ten years ago) link

i never get uppity when someone sez dc sux

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:55 (ten years ago) link

perhaps wikipedia can answer this important question

The City of New York, most often called New York City, is the most populous city in the United States, in a metropolitan area that ranks among the world's most-populous urban areas. It is a leading global city, exerting a powerful influence over worldwide commerce, finance, culture, and entertainment. The city is also an important center for international affairs, hosting the United Nations headquarters.
Located on the Atlantic coast of the Northeastern United States, the city consists of five distinct boroughs: The Bronx, Brooklyn, Manhattan, Queens, and Staten Island. It is the most densely populated major city in the United States, with an estimated 8,274,527 people occupying just under 305 square miles (790 km2). The New York metropolitan area's population is also the nation's highest, estimated at 19,750,000 people over 6,720 square miles (17,400 km2) in three states.
New York is largely unique among American cities for its high use of mass transit, and the overall density and diversity of its population. In 2005, nearly 170 languages were spoken in the city and 36% of its population was born outside the United States. The city is sometimes referred to as "The City That Never Sleeps" due to its extensive 24-hour subway system and constant bustling of traffic and people, while other nicknames include Gotham and the Big Apple.
Founded as a commercial trading post by the Dutch in 1624, it served as the capital of the United States from 1785 until 1790, and has been the nation's largest city since 1790. The Statue of Liberty greeted millions of immigrants as they came to America in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. Wall Street, in Lower Manhattan, has been a dominant global financial center since World War II and is home to the New York Stock Exchange. Today, the city has many renowned landmarks and neighborhoods that are world famous. The city has been home to several of the tallest buildings in the world, including the Empire State Building and the twin towers of the former World Trade Center.
New York is the birthplace of many cultural movements, including the Harlem Renaissance in literature and visual art, abstract expressionism (also known as the New York School) in painting, and hip hop, punk, salsa, disco and Tin Pan Alley in music. It is also the home of Broadway theater.

of course, if you're uncomfortable being packed like sardines, it may not be the place for you

gabbneb, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:55 (ten years ago) link

but tell a new yorker that NYC is overrated and they're all OMG SHAKE SHACK THE METS OMG FAMOUS RAYS WOWEEE WOWWW WOWW

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:55 (ten years ago) link

thats cause dc is the worst place in the world obv xp

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 14:55 (ten years ago) link

hahaha or they cut and paste propaganda from wikipedia

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:56 (ten years ago) link

NYers=insecure sardine pizza babies

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:57 (ten years ago) link

new york is where all awesome handsome fun people come to breakdance the nite away and everyone is super jealous of our incredible lifestyle choices

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 14:57 (ten years ago) link

what are the great cities in the us besides new york

LA, SF, Chicago, DC

gabbneb, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:57 (ten years ago) link

i don't think that you will find any new yorkers bigging-up famous ray's

gabbneb, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:58 (ten years ago) link

no gabbneb that's all any new yorker i've ever spoken with talks about is either a) Carlos Beltran or b) Famous Ray's.

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 14:58 (ten years ago) link

perhaps wikipedia can answer this important question

The City of New York, most often called New York City, is the most populous city in the United States, in a metropolitan area that ranks among the world's most-populous urban areas. It is a leading global city, exerting a powerful influence over blah blah blah blah

of course, if you're uncomfortable being packed like sardines, it may not be the place for you

― gabbneb, Friday, October 17, 2008 9:55 AM (39 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

this argument just reminds me of people who need a gallon of some insane b.s. CODE RED THREE-ALARM hot sauce to enjoy any food they eat

metametadata (n/a), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:00 (ten years ago) link

dc is def def not a great anything except maybe receptacle for styleless assholes

new orleans is a great city tho - and so is montreal which is technically inside the us state of canada

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:00 (ten years ago) link

new orleans is very awesome, yes

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:00 (ten years ago) link

how about fuck carlos beltran

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:01 (ten years ago) link

dc got some good ethiopian food

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:02 (ten years ago) link

but let me tell you, good ethiopian food does not a great city make

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:02 (ten years ago) link

i hav srsly never heard anyone rave abt beltran or rays

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:03 (ten years ago) link

people do make fun of rays a lot tho

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:03 (ten years ago) link

guys every new yorker i've spoken with will not shut up about a) something they read in the new yorker and did i read it or b) brett farve

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:04 (ten years ago) link

i stopped reading the new yorker cause i was not shutting up abt it and annoying myself in the process to be totally honest

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:05 (ten years ago) link

how about fuck carlos beltran

^lol Melky Cabrera fan

Certainly Manhattan sucks shit, even compared to just 10 years ago.

xp:
a) fuck that mag (i just trashed 'pro rate' subscrip card)
b) fuck football

Dr Morbius, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:06 (ten years ago) link

i continue to the read the new yorker but i only hang out with people who dont read it so when i repeat things i read there they will think i am a genius

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:06 (ten years ago) link

sweet deal bro *new york style fist pound*

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:08 (ten years ago) link

fyi i am a new yorker writer

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:09 (ten years ago) link

how's that 15,000 word essay on the history of yo-yo's coming along?

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:10 (ten years ago) link

i read the new yorker cause i have a long commute and it is usually interesting. were i in any other city, i would probably drive and therefore never read and therefore be dumb.

mizzell, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:10 (ten years ago) link

hilarious que but its actually "yo-yos" with no apostrophe

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:11 (ten years ago) link

snap!

mizzell, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:11 (ten years ago) link

wow you new yorkers sure showed me

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:12 (ten years ago) link

http://www.newyorker.com/images/2008/10/20/p465/081020_contest_p465.jpg

i read the new yorker cause i have a long commute and it is usually interesting. were i in any other city, i would probably drive and therefore never read and therefore be dumb.

metametadata (n/a), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:13 (ten years ago) link

i like how you claimed to stay calm when people diss dc and that nyers are all babies, but you seem to be the only one on this thread that is actually upset about something.

mizzell, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:13 (ten years ago) link

gas money^^

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:13 (ten years ago) link

think i could win?

mizzell, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:14 (ten years ago) link

i am not really upset about anything, i could give two shits i am just having fun and lols

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:15 (ten years ago) link

although i gotta say nyc is the septic tank of the usa

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:15 (ten years ago) link

dc residents are so unserious and i hate them

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:16 (ten years ago) link

I think NYC is kind of awesome to a fault. The sense of ambition and energy and limitlessness of options can be a bit overwhelming, and sometimes I want to live somewhere a bit more low key like Philadelphia (not to mention cheaper). You can't really say there's any *thing* NYC doesn't have, it's just that it has so much of everything.

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:19 (ten years ago) link

cheap housing

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:20 (ten years ago) link

nice friendly people who don't yell at you

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:20 (ten years ago) link

lakes for swimming

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:20 (ten years ago) link

actually que new yorkers were just rated the friendliest people in the universe in some new study

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:21 (ten years ago) link

published in the new yorker

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:22 (ten years ago) link

THEY ARE ALL FROM OHIO ANYWAY AMIRITE LOL!

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:22 (ten years ago) link

let me guess the study was run by. . . new yorkers?????

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:22 (ten years ago) link

ha ha as tho there are scientists in any other cities

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 15:23 (ten years ago) link

srsly

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:24 (ten years ago) link

Praying to god for the answer isn't a "study"

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:24 (ten years ago) link

LAST TIME I CHECKED

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Friday, 17 October 2008 15:25 (ten years ago) link

Que's challenging NYC disses are so skewed and sideways that I don't even have a response to any of them! I dunno. It's, you know, a city. A particularly large and teeming and vigorous one. It is not, in the end, a fundamentally different sort of entity from other cities, including less-large and less-teeming ones that are cheaper and more relaxing. There are differences in character, certainly, but you talk about it long enough and just becomes ... whatever.

Besides, not to get all class-analytical here, but most of us talking here, and (I'm guessing) most of the types of people we associate with in cities, are all post-collegiate cosmopolitans who don't come from that city anyway, am I right? New York, L.A., Chicago, all populated by young people from the same suburban zones. Would things seem different if we discussed cities in terms of their true "native" types? I'm not sure I could decide between NYC's and Chicago's -- might lean toward Chicago's!

nabisco, Friday, 17 October 2008 16:13 (ten years ago) link

most of us talking here, and (I'm guessing) most of the types of people we associate with in cities, are all post-collegiate cosmopolitans who don't come from that city anyway, am I right? New York, L.A., Chicago, all populated by young people from the same suburban zones

most of us

gabbneb, Friday, 17 October 2008 16:14 (ten years ago) link

nabisco. . . i was just clowning around with everything i said on this thread. just some friday lol clowning, not serious, etc etc

Mr. Que, Friday, 17 October 2008 16:14 (ten years ago) link

see what happens when u insult nabiscos city

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 16:16 (ten years ago) link

he posts multiple paragraphs in a calm and measured tone

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 16:16 (ten years ago) link

NYC has an extremely wide range of "native types"

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Friday, 17 October 2008 16:17 (ten years ago) link

Also a lot of suburbanites are sons and daughters of native types -- particularly the ones from Jersey.

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Friday, 17 October 2008 16:18 (ten years ago) link

my dad was born in nyc

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 16:18 (ten years ago) link

NYC has an extremely wide range of "native types"

That's true: gabbneb, Casuistry, JBR...

jaymc, Friday, 17 October 2008 16:19 (ten years ago) link

Haha calm and measured because I didn't get them at all! Which I guess was the joke('s on me).

xpost yes, NYC probably has a few more than Chicago, just on the numbers. I just ... conversations about cities I'm in usually tend to be about what kind of lifestyle they provide to or draw out of post-collegiate non-native types (like me and lots of the people I talk to); they could sound really different, is what I'm saying.

nabisco, Friday, 17 October 2008 16:20 (ten years ago) link

Qualludes.

NewBeefLover, Friday, 17 October 2008 16:21 (ten years ago) link

New York's soccerball team sold out to Red Bull

big louie moilolnen (dan m), Friday, 17 October 2008 16:21 (ten years ago) link

thats why the best way to determine which city is best is by seeing how awesome its sports teams are

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 16:21 (ten years ago) link

xp to nabisco

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 16:21 (ten years ago) link

is that was true then boston would be the best city and boston obv sux

joe the plumber (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 16:24 (ten years ago) link

i wish mpls had a soccerball team

the valves of houston (gbx), Friday, 17 October 2008 16:24 (ten years ago) link

No really,you can get Qualludes.

NewBeefLover, Friday, 17 October 2008 16:25 (ten years ago) link

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota_Thunder

xp

big louie moilolnen (dan m), Friday, 17 October 2008 16:25 (ten years ago) link

i wanna MLS team

the valves of houston (gbx), Friday, 17 October 2008 16:30 (ten years ago) link

Unfort for gbx, the most recent candidate cities for new MLS teams are Atlanta, Montreal, Miami, Ottawa, Portland, St Louis, and Vancouver -- seven bids for only two teams. Final announcement by end of March.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 17 October 2008 16:41 (ten years ago) link

most of us talking here, and (I'm guessing) most of the types of people we associate with in cities, are all post-collegiate cosmopolitans who don't come from that city anyway, am I right? New York, L.A., Chicago, all populated by young people from the same suburban zones

most of us

― gabbneb, Friday, October 17, 2008 4:14 PM (48 minutes ago) Bookmark

HA you guys live in manhattan and work behind desks.

ian, Friday, 17 October 2008 17:06 (ten years ago) link

NYC is pretty expensive for what you get out of it.

TOMBOT, Friday, 17 October 2008 17:11 (ten years ago) link

Chicago is priced appropriately in the get-what-you-pay-for free-cell-phone sense

TOMBOT, Friday, 17 October 2008 17:12 (ten years ago) link

nyc is a pretty good deal compared to dc

FACED!

mr. cool (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 17:14 (ten years ago) link

DC may not know how to dress itself or be an exciting place to film a movie, but at least we don't have a vote, like you whores. And our hot dog stands still sell actual hot dogs instead of whatever the hell is up there on the streets in wherever you live, person I am berating

TOMBOT, Friday, 17 October 2008 17:14 (ten years ago) link

metro doesnt smell

○◙i shine cuz i genital grind◙○ (roxymuzak), Friday, 17 October 2008 17:16 (ten years ago) link

subway doesnt make u swipe on the way out

mr. cool (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 17:20 (ten years ago) link

subway costs $2 so you can watch a dude eat in front of you while another dude sleeps

TOMBOT, Friday, 17 October 2008 17:23 (ten years ago) link

alternatively sometimes it costs $2 so you can watch two guys breakdance on a moving train

TOMBOT, Friday, 17 October 2008 17:24 (ten years ago) link

eating where ever u want is everyones right as an american

mr. cool (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 17:25 (ten years ago) link

Subway: Gets you more places.
Metro: Makes a cooler sound.

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Friday, 17 October 2008 17:25 (ten years ago) link

metro`s kinda beautiful

○◙i shine cuz i genital grind◙○ (roxymuzak), Friday, 17 October 2008 17:28 (ten years ago) link

like a mausoleum almost...

mr. cool (ice crӕm), Friday, 17 October 2008 17:29 (ten years ago) link

Yeah, it has those awesome inside-of-a-whale stations

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Friday, 17 October 2008 17:30 (ten years ago) link

Subway aesthetic is also kinda played out imho

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Friday, 17 October 2008 17:30 (ten years ago) link

subway is the gr8est

max, Friday, 17 October 2008 17:30 (ten years ago) link

I do love the metro, esp the escalator at Dpont Circle and how on a sunny day it's basically symbolically departing the womb for your new life/greener pastures (ie a place where you can smoke). I like a little rebirth in my daily life.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 17 October 2008 17:31 (ten years ago) link

subway doesnt make u swipe on the way out

i still sometimes reflexively take out my metrocard on the way out ;__;

gabbneb, Friday, 17 October 2008 17:33 (ten years ago) link

i don't actually understand, like, at all, the whole "nyc is more expensive for what you get" argument. mainly because it is not actually significantly more expensive than the other cities we are talking about, imo.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 17 October 2008 17:54 (ten years ago) link

our hot dog stands still sell actual hot dogs instead of whatever the hell is up there on the streets in wherever you live, person I am berating

^otm

The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall, Friday, 17 October 2008 20:45 (ten years ago) link

if there are nathan's hot dogs in the grocery store, i couldnt care less what is being sold on the streets

○◙i shine cuz i genital grind◙○ (roxymuzak), Friday, 17 October 2008 20:46 (ten years ago) link

Manhattan might be more expensive for what you get than those other cities, but not New York as a whole.

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Friday, 17 October 2008 20:47 (ten years ago) link

depends rather heavily on where in manhattan you are living.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 17 October 2008 20:56 (ten years ago) link

That's true: gabbneb, Casuistry, JBR...

I forgot Alex in NYC.

jaymc, Saturday, 18 October 2008 02:34 (ten years ago) link

Ok, but it depends rather heavily where in ANY city you are living, and on the whole Manhattan is more expensive. I mean I'm pretty sure New York is still the overall highest rent city in the country.

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Saturday, 18 October 2008 02:47 (ten years ago) link

who are the native chicago people on ilx (born & raised w/in city limits)?

velko, Saturday, 18 October 2008 02:52 (ten years ago) link

it is not actually significantly more expensive than the other cities we are talking about, imo.

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, October 17, 2008 12:54 PM (8 hours ago) Bookmark

^^^ if you have included chicago in your "other cities" then you are utterly, spectacularly wrong

the valves of houston (gbx), Saturday, 18 October 2008 02:52 (ten years ago) link

who are the native chicago people on ilx (born & raised w/in city limits)?

Only ones I know for sure are Phil-Two and K3rry K3an3. I can never remember the deal with deej and Amateurist -- I know both went to high school in Evanston, but I think both lived within city limits at some point, too.

jaymc, Saturday, 18 October 2008 04:12 (ten years ago) link

("lived" = "grew up in," like pre-high school)

jaymc, Saturday, 18 October 2008 04:12 (ten years ago) link

jaymc, do you know where i was born?
this is not a test.

ian, Saturday, 18 October 2008 04:29 (ten years ago) link

i'm just curious.

ian, Saturday, 18 October 2008 04:30 (ten years ago) link

I do love the metro, esp the escalator at Dpont Circle and how on a sunny day it's basically symbolically departing the womb for your new life/greener pastures (ie a place where you can smoke). I like a little rebirth in my daily life.

this would be word except my option in life has been apparently to return to this hellish robot womb every day, in order to perform my hellish robot duties, and then be exhumed into darkness so that I may recoup morale via those meager means my neighborhood makes available at such hours (read: playstation with doctor ben and lager)

TOMBOT, Saturday, 18 October 2008 05:34 (ten years ago) link

and btw frankly any white person who expects some kind of big props for being born in the city limits of a major metropolis can kind of lick it, congratulations, you tried to be black and you were *squishes head* THIS CLOSE!!

TOMBOT, Saturday, 18 October 2008 05:36 (ten years ago) link

i wish mpls had a soccerball team

http://pages.globetrotter.net/bb/pennants/nasl/MinnesotaKicks.jpg

I saw these guys play when I was a kid.

Eazy, Saturday, 18 October 2008 05:38 (ten years ago) link

playstation with doctor ben and lager

this btw is really an excellent way to relax and decompress, I just wish my favorite pizza joint would deliver after 11pm (the hours are an issue with DC I will not deny. however, just because it's always open doesn't mean it's good. You know who you are.*

*TOWNS WITH BIG MUSIC SCENES.

TOMBOT, Saturday, 18 October 2008 05:45 (ten years ago) link

oh i thought that meant papa john's.

ian, Saturday, 18 October 2008 05:54 (ten years ago) link

sell outs man dont they know its all about thea rt art

bart_stanberg, Saturday, 18 October 2008 05:54 (ten years ago) link

;) ;)

ever since the late night fried chicken place closed down, late night dining just hasn't been the same here in pros. heights.

ian, Saturday, 18 October 2008 05:54 (ten years ago) link

oh right, new york is so serious about their pizza you actually let papa johnses exist all over the place. Funk dat.

TOMBOT, Saturday, 18 October 2008 06:03 (ten years ago) link

I will never stop repping for DC as the best-kept pizza secret in all of this major metro area culture wars

TOMBOT, Saturday, 18 October 2008 06:04 (ten years ago) link

hahahahahaha goddamn i will eat shitty pizza anytime, but i'll only buy shitty pizza if it's all that's open.

ian, Saturday, 18 October 2008 06:04 (ten years ago) link

the secret of pizza is that you make it yourself and it rulez and is mad cheap.

ian, Saturday, 18 October 2008 06:05 (ten years ago) link

and you can put ANYTHING ON IT!K@&*(!&WS

ian, Saturday, 18 October 2008 06:05 (ten years ago) link

I try that but really when you add it all up, even with tip, the 3-5 topping specials around here are regularly more economical than DIY. Should probably point out that I am too concerned with stuff like my cat and video games and internet bullshit to learn how to properly handle dough. There is a convenience factor, kind of like not owning a car.

TOMBOT, Saturday, 18 October 2008 06:08 (ten years ago) link

my cat likes it when i hang out in the kitchen. he likes to eat when there are people around. i have to encourage him sometimes, tell him to "show me what a good eater" he is. annnnyway.

ian, Saturday, 18 October 2008 06:10 (ten years ago) link

my cat is a tubby guts and I had to put him on the catkins diet. I am really not looking forward to the next litter exchange.

TOMBOT, Saturday, 18 October 2008 06:12 (ten years ago) link

i make my pizzas with those boboli prefab crusts

bart_stanberg, Saturday, 18 October 2008 06:16 (ten years ago) link

jaymc, do you know where i was born?
this is not a test.

No. My knowledge of your early life begins here:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v208/jcoombs/april2600-outside.jpg

jaymc, Saturday, 18 October 2008 07:21 (ten years ago) link

my experience of Dupont Circle is very much the same as Laurel's, though I think it helps to exit the South Escalator

i don't think, per tombot, that being born in the city limits of a major metro awards you great properties (tho growing up in one very well might), i just think it explains why you might find sardine-ism normal or even necessary, and that this might explain your taste for new york just as much as growing up in a less urban or developed place might explain your distaste for it. i also don't see what being born in the city limits of a major northeastern metro has to do with being black, outside of quasi-northern DC or Baltimore, or maybe Newark, where the black population is just over 50%. the black population of Manhattan is only about 30%, and the other boroughs aren't substantially higher.

also, there is good pizza in DC, which is somewhat underrated as a food town, but i doubt there are many more than 2x the good pizza places there are in New Haven, 1/10 its size, or that the average quality is marginally better than the pizza available in LaGuardia Airport, which has a branch of Todd English's Figs. and of course a slice is not available on every other corner like in you know where.

gabbneb, Saturday, 18 October 2008 12:55 (ten years ago) link

yea the deal with NYC isnt that it just has good pizza, its that its got good pizza every two blocks

max, Saturday, 18 October 2008 13:01 (ten years ago) link

gbx i never really consider the midwest because i couldn't live there (not s ome kind of cultural imperialism nonsense, i like to be near the ocean) -- sorry for the oversight!

gabbneb otm both on there being good food in dc, and that there is only about 2 good pizza options there. no offense to mr. "i like that upside down backwards pizza!" que, we've debated that one a couple times already.

also uh no one else gonna call out on the "you tried to be black" thing? jesus fucking christ.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Saturday, 18 October 2008 17:12 (ten years ago) link

Ok, but it depends rather heavily where in ANY city you are living, and on the whole Manhattan is more expensive.

dude, haven't you read the hand-wringing recently over apts in bk becoming more expensive than significant portions of manhattan? i'm being totally serious here, there has been newspaper drama over this factoid especially wrt the whole "what you get out of it" segment of the crowd, because what you get out of living on mckibbin in terms of amenities is significantly less than what you'd get in the east village for example. it's been a rather laughable drama, to me, because who the hell didn't see that coming once bk became hip and family-friendly to yuppies and college students? i read the articles for the lolz (this is generally the only reason to read the times, actually).

which of course it is like omg times way to ignore, like, bed-stuy in your analysis but it just goes to prove the point that queens and bk aren't really different from manhattan in this regard anymore.

nb sorry staten island and the bronx you still do not count

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Saturday, 18 October 2008 17:22 (ten years ago) link

also uh no one else gonna call out on the "you tried to be black" thing? jesus fucking christ.

jesus fucking christ indeed! I'm fighting a straw man here anyway since nobody's really saying anything like "I'm from queens I am realer than all you suburbanite transients"

El Tomboto, Saturday, 18 October 2008 17:29 (ten years ago) link

yeah but dude this is like the second time in recent times that i've seen you fight a strawman in that kinda fashion and it's a little wtf!

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Saturday, 18 October 2008 17:32 (ten years ago) link

ie i don't think it was a good or accurate or very nice way of fighting the scarecrow.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Saturday, 18 October 2008 17:34 (ten years ago) link

I will never stop repping for DC as the best-kept pizza secret in all of this major metro area culture wars

― TOMBOT, Saturday, October 18, 2008 2:04 AM

got ya back here

mookieproof, Saturday, 18 October 2008 17:38 (ten years ago) link

well if I was good or accurate or nice I wouldn't be so good at my job ha ha

El Tomboto, Saturday, 18 October 2008 17:47 (ten years ago) link

which of course it is like omg times way to ignore, like, bed-stuy in your analysis but it just goes to prove the point that queens and bk aren't really different from manhattan in this regard anymore.

The only part of Queens that is more expensive than manhattan isn't worth living in. The rest is still greatly cheaper than Manhattan and most of Brooklyn too.

dan selzer, Saturday, 18 October 2008 19:33 (ten years ago) link

any white person who expects some kind of big props for being born in the city limits of a major metropolis can kind of lick it, congratulations, you tried to be black and you were *squishes head* THIS CLOSE!!

― TOMBOT, Saturday, October 18, 2008 1:36 AM (17 hours ago) Bookmark

I don't really see where any white person on this thread is claiming being born in a city as anything other than a fact about where they were born. I was born in Manhattan. I lived most of my pre-college life just inside the city limits of DC, where I went to public schools. My junior high was about 60% black and my high school was 90% black. None of this made me tough or black (though I get the feeling your conflating the two?), in fact I am a weakling and a coward.

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Saturday, 18 October 2008 23:40 (ten years ago) link

also, probably shouldn't be assuming blacks are the dominant minority group of any city post-1970s. changing demographics lol. latinos dominated my neighborhood growing up, and were in roughly equal number to african americans in my inner-city high school. i am extremely white btw.

velko, Sunday, 19 October 2008 00:03 (ten years ago) link

Where is Tombot from? Where does 'trying to be black' even come from? NYC area is the largest metropolitan area in North America; there's a lot more to it than the handful of traditionally black neighborhoods scattered around the place.

xpost on the latinos thing; where I grew up outside of NYC it was mostly Italians, Poles, eastern European Jews, and Puerto Ricans.

burt_stanton, Sunday, 19 October 2008 00:05 (ten years ago) link

i grew up in a wealthy predominantly white suburb of boston and im a bad ass motherfucker

parade! (ice crӕm), Monday, 20 October 2008 13:06 (ten years ago) link

dudes this is 2008, there is good pizza everywhere

metametadata (n/a), Monday, 20 October 2008 13:23 (ten years ago) link

blacks are a majority of the population in most big Southern cities, especially in the Deep South, but outside of the South only in Detroit, Gary, and Newark (and DC and Baltimore if you don't define them as the South for this purpose)

gabbneb, Monday, 20 October 2008 13:24 (ten years ago) link

and only barely in Newark

gabbneb, Monday, 20 October 2008 13:25 (ten years ago) link

"We believe that the best of America is not all in Washington, D.C. We believe -- We believe that the best of America is in these small towns that we get to visit, and in these wonderful little pockets of what I call the real America, being here with all of you hard working very patriotic, um, very, um, pro-America areas of this great nation."

"This is where we find the kindness and the goodness and the courage of everyday Americans. Those who are running our factories and teaching our kids and growing our food and are fighting our wars for us. Those who are protecting us in uniform. Those who are protecting the virtues of freedom."

-- Sarah Palin, Greensboro, N.C.

gabbneb, Monday, 20 October 2008 13:30 (ten years ago) link

of course, that wasn't a dog whistle or anything

gabbneb, Monday, 20 October 2008 13:30 (ten years ago) link

http://www.timeout.com/chicago/articles/comedy/68404/bust-a-move

jaymc, Thursday, 30 October 2008 19:51 (ten years ago) link

the things that time out publishes are appalling. that said, chicago seems marginally better than ny or london in terms of writing. point to chicago! uh, that imitation of this thread you just posted non-withstanding.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:29 (ten years ago) link

I thought it was funny. I know that dude, though.

jaymc, Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:33 (ten years ago) link

i just think it sounds like some kinda tiresome ilxors, sorry i didn't mean to insult your friend :\

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:34 (ten years ago) link

also to respond to something from a week ago

The only part of Queens that is more expensive than manhattan isn't worth living in. The rest is still greatly cheaper than Manhattan and most of Brooklyn too.

mostly true but there were several "this makes this more expensive" factors for renting in quite a lot of queens that made me decide against the neighborhood. for buying it is like head & shoulders above brooklyn without a doubt.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:35 (ten years ago) link

and quite frankly above any number of more "reasonably priced" cities that ppl have brought up in this thread as well.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:35 (ten years ago) link

I haven’t done my research, but I’m pretty sure this is where Spike Lee’s Crooklyn was set. I may be paying twice as much rent as I was in Chicago, but I’m literally living inside a hit movie.

YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE YOUR RESEARCH

edb, Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:40 (ten years ago) link

Queens? Might as well live in Jersey.

burt_stanton, Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:41 (ten years ago) link

haha queens is more/just as accessible to the city as most of bk is. tho don't listen to me, being stuck on the j for 6 months made jersey city look appealing.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:43 (ten years ago) link

queens might as well live in some sort of culinary wonderland

888 (ice crӕm), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:44 (ten years ago) link

That guy is more than welcome to move away from New York at any time. But I can understand that he has to live somewhere with public transit, it's hard to drive when you're looking so far down your nose. So his options probably ARE limited.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:46 (ten years ago) link

guys he's a COMEDIAN so he's making JOKES

metametadata (n/a), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:47 (ten years ago) link

The best Kumail joke I ever heard was him complaining that MS Word spellcheck corrects his name to "Camel".

big louie moilolnen (dan m), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:47 (ten years ago) link

way to disprove his central thesis about NYers having no sense of humor

metametadata (n/a), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:48 (ten years ago) link

there are certain ppl in my social group who are just like terrible "brooklyn shut up" types (it is like there are two parts of nyc, soho/les and brooklyn lol!!) and i have been kind of pushed back upon going other places than these douchebag wonderlands and i plan to rectify that and start dragging pplz asses back to queens at some point when i no longer have the BIRD FLU or whatever is killing me right now

xpost i get it's a joke, nick. it's not a funny one??? he's doing kind of an outdated "lol midwesterners who move to nyc act like dickbags" thing that he apparently stole from you, in 2003?

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:49 (ten years ago) link

My sense of humor has been sharpened by unemployment and the teeth of rats. That writing is like the broad side of a barn.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:50 (ten years ago) link

"this makes this more expensive" factors for renting in quite a lot of queens

for me, the fact that it really helps to have a car in queens, yet parking in some areas is almost as hard as brooklyn. That's an issue.

Queens has way more going on then Jersey City, though Jersey City may have better Dosas.

Queens has Nick's Pizza though, which I had for the first time last night.

dan selzer, Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:50 (ten years ago) link

i mean if you are getting that his central thesis is that new yorkers are assholes then you aren't getting what he's saying about asshole transplants actually.

even with that lolling at this piece would be like lolling at tom's ppl pretending they are black strawman upthread??? why are you making fun of a thing that doesn't really exist except in a very limited format, and why do so many ppl do this tired thing?

xpost yeah not having a car really limits you actually! you have to keep yourself to a certain number of neighborhoods if you want to be able to make it to work in less than 2 hours.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:51 (ten years ago) link

Are we surprised by the NYCers getting all bitter and defensive about a harmless article?

jon /via/ chi 2.0, Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:53 (ten years ago) link

??? how is it being "bitter and defensive" to say it's not funny? i even apologized to jaymc. we're not actually the ones misunderstanding the dumb thing. this is kind of like saying that ppl are sexist for not liking sarah palin, guys.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:54 (ten years ago) link

xp it's a touchy subject, so no

big louie moilolnen (dan m), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:55 (ten years ago) link

Queens just isn't pleasantly walkable the way Brooklyn is. Too many highways and boulevards and train yards between neighborhoods.

dan selzer, Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:56 (ten years ago) link

my post was supposed to be a zing on the time out "empire" anyway which is british! just fyi.

xpost yeah a lot of brooklyn is set up better for pedestrians, basically. i have a friend who lives out in far rockaway and basically when i get off the train i have to call her and have her pick me up cos there's no way to get there otherwise. i'd like to walk, rockaway beach is beautiful!

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:57 (ten years ago) link

I think we had this conversation in another City vs City thread, but people who don't like NYC are welcome not to live here! It's not really an argument I'm interested in having.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:58 (ten years ago) link

haha laurel

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 30 October 2008 21:59 (ten years ago) link

It just seems like some people in here are all pissy about the article, "he's a dickbag" etc. I think if a similar article was written about Chicago, most chilxors would either shrug it off or think, "yeah, that is kinda true".

jon /via/ chi 2.0, Thursday, 30 October 2008 22:00 (ten years ago) link

I don't get the pizza thing. I've been living in NYC since I was 14, and sure, there's okay pizza. But I must be spoiled because it's never blown my mind. It's pizza. Someone explain?

Mordy, Thursday, 30 October 2008 22:01 (ten years ago) link

and people who don't like people not liking NYC are welcome to not read this thread, which is titled "New York City is for sellouts"

metametadata (n/a), Thursday, 30 October 2008 22:02 (ten years ago) link

yeah he's not a dickbag, i mean he's just making fun of a tired old trope that is kind of lame re: dumb kids movin to ny to find themselves and how awesome it is. it's kind of like a oh god stupid time out why showcase this thing.

the problem is that unless n/a was directing at laurel that it WAS chilxors that got pissed off about whether or not this was funny or lame?? the rest of us are tryin to talk about real estate. oh well, who cares i can't wait 'til the dc contingent chimes in!

xpost i think the pizza thing is either you get it or you don't. if it's your kind of pizza it's great. if you prefer a different style pizza or you just aren't really that into pizza then whatever.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 30 October 2008 22:04 (ten years ago) link

Jon, some of the strawmen in that article could be true here but for such a small slice of people that it's not really relevant? If you want to go places where you can't get served (lol Daddy's!) or feel overshadowed by others or whatev, you're welcome to do so. But you can go your whole NYC residency without doing any of those things, plus there's nowhere in the world that has the market cornered on douchebaggery, I'm sure you could experience all the same social failings right in Chicago.

I don't think "he's a dickbag", I just think...okay, so he doesn't see what else there is to like about New York. That's fine, I don't remember NYC running nationwide ads encouraging young people to give up their affordable housing in DesMoines and move here? But no place ISN'T going to have pros and cons, and some days one side seems longer, and some days the other side does, and that changes in your 20s and again in your 30s and etc.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Thursday, 30 October 2008 22:08 (ten years ago) link

Hard to believe, but some people live in NY because that's the place that makes sense to live in - for work, friends, family, geography, community, etc. I love living here, but that's because I love the people I've grown up with here. I can't imagine moving here to be alone.

Mordy, Thursday, 30 October 2008 22:12 (ten years ago) link

But no place ISN'T going to have pros and cons, and some days one side seems longer, and some days the other side does, and that changes in your 20s and again in your 30s and etc.

i bet you could come with a really hilarious comedic article based on this premise

metametadata (n/a), Thursday, 30 October 2008 22:12 (ten years ago) link

God knows I don't find anything romantic about my neighborhood shithole.

Mordy, Thursday, 30 October 2008 22:14 (ten years ago) link

"hilarious" okay sure whatevs.

ian, Thursday, 30 October 2008 22:40 (ten years ago) link

are people really defending the hilarity and/or satirical premise of that article - shits kinda dumb - new york rulez - lets move on

888 (ice crӕm), Thursday, 30 October 2008 22:53 (ten years ago) link

can't wait for dude to move to LA and read his hilarious take on fake boobs

velko, Thursday, 30 October 2008 22:56 (ten years ago) link

I don't get the pizza thing. I've been living in NYC since I was 14, and sure, there's okay pizza. But I must be spoiled because it's never blown my mind. It's pizza. Someone explain?

― Mordy, Thursday, October 30, 2008 6:01 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

move anywhere outside NY/NJ/Providence/Chicago/DC and try to find good pizza. seriously try.

max, Thursday, 30 October 2008 23:56 (ten years ago) link

italy

888 (ice crӕm), Thursday, 30 October 2008 23:57 (ten years ago) link

hey there clever logic guy u could write for time out

max, Thursday, 30 October 2008 23:59 (ten years ago) link

i would enjoy that - do they accept unpunctuated 20 word articles

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 00:01 (ten years ago) link

submit an i love cricket thread

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 00:06 (ten years ago) link

i bet TONY would be v. v. interested in our 10 pt plan to revive nyc

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 00:06 (ten years ago) link

i smell a cover!

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 00:09 (ten years ago) link

i'll hook you up

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 02:03 (ten years ago) link

thx btw we charge $600/wd

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 02:07 (ten years ago) link

btw your borough may be a wonderland, culinary-wise, but nick's pizza is also found in manhattan

gabbneb, Friday, 31 October 2008 04:40 (ten years ago) link

Now schwarma places on the other hand...

Mordy, Friday, 31 October 2008 04:41 (ten years ago) link

oh yeah forgot about that! Does it hold up?

dan selzer, Friday, 31 October 2008 06:18 (ten years ago) link

ive never found any good indian food in nyc, but i dont know where to look admittedly

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Friday, 31 October 2008 12:46 (ten years ago) link

new jersey

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 13:58 (ten years ago) link

india

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 13:59 (ten years ago) link

logic guy, strikes again

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:01 (ten years ago) link

I wish I'd had Indian food at JSq when I lived convenient to there, but it wasn't something I had tried up to that point. Silly grul.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:02 (ten years ago) link

indian food in jersey city is SO good.

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:13 (ten years ago) link

is there good indian food in bk?

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:14 (ten years ago) link

bk isn't known for it the way queens is. the places i've been to (in brooklyn heights, cobble hill, park slope, greenpoint, williamsburg) haven't been great, but that's a very tiny area of the borough.

in the city, tiffin wallah on 28th street is my favorite by far. (well, there's also devi but it's $$$$$.)

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:22 (ten years ago) link

do u hav a fav of the 6th street plces

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:25 (ten years ago) link

Rox, I'm very fond of a place called Joy Indian on Flatbush Ave around Bergen St or there-ish. In particular I love their korma sauce, it has a golden richness and is thick in a way that makes me think there are actually cashews and stuff in it.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:28 (ten years ago) link

whats the area thats like less than a city block but some ppl call it little india

xpost that sounds awesome laurel

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:29 (ten years ago) link

o man i used to gorge on that very korma all the time before i curtailed my delivery habit xp

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:30 (ten years ago) link

move anywhere outside NY/NJ/Providence/Chicago/DC and try to find good pizza. seriously try.

there is plenty of good pizza here (wisconsin), but sometimes you do have to try to find it.

Jordan, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:31 (ten years ago) link

it's been years at this point since i ate at any of the 6th st places, so my advice probably isn't worth much. banjara and brick lane were much, much better than the rest and also quite a bit more expensive than the others. the latter specializes in "anglo-indian."

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:32 (ten years ago) link

Yeah, I have all these awesome recipes for korma and they all require about eleventy hundred different spices and ground cashews and fancy stuff...Joy is the only place where I suspect they may be using the same recipes.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:32 (ten years ago) link

whats the area thats like less than a city block but some ppl call it little india

― corrie ham (roxymuzak), Friday, October 31, 2008 10:29 AM (44 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

6th st between 1st n 2nd

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:32 (ten years ago) link

6th street is probably "little india." there are better restaurants and many more shops in curry hill, which centers around lexington ave from roughly east 24-30th streets.

xposts!

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:33 (ten years ago) link

new yorkers incorrigibility at calling things hills lol

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:34 (ten years ago) link

thanks yall

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:34 (ten years ago) link

i like "heights" more than "hill"

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:35 (ten years ago) link

have you seenl "in da heights"?

ian, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:35 (ten years ago) link

i like how the one real hill in this part of brooklyn is called "slope"

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:36 (ten years ago) link

btw, if anyone wants to go on a dosa field trip, i'm always down.

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:36 (ten years ago) link

http://blog.nj.com/entertainment_impact_arts/2008/06/large_inthe.jpg

I want bar b q. i wonder if they still have free bourbon w/ food night.

ian, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:39 (ten years ago) link

there are threads about new york everything except new york hotels

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:39 (ten years ago) link

no i think there's a hotels thread.

ian, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:40 (ten years ago) link

u like bar b q ian - i wasnt feeling it

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:40 (ten years ago) link

theres a hotel around the corner from my gfs place that looks pretty nice from the outside called akwaaba mansion

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:41 (ten years ago) link

just remembered, i think i go to new york in late march/early april, probably crash w friends in park slope

Jordan, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:42 (ten years ago) link

park heights/hill

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:42 (ten years ago) link

I've never stayed in a New York hotel. My parents once rented a room with its own kitchen in a B&B on the UWS. The room was large and comfortable and pretty and the view was amazing and they loved it, but while not extravagantly priced for a whole suite, it's still not exactly an affordable crash pad.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:42 (ten years ago) link

Normally they crash w me and I sleep on the couch lol

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:43 (ten years ago) link

I need somewhere to stay in New York City.

Hotels in NYC?

ian, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:43 (ten years ago) link

theres that dire looking new best western or whatever down by gowanas - i always laugh when i see it - so incongruous

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:44 (ten years ago) link

expost::

yes i like bar b q. i used to live around the corner and ate there a lot. you can get a ton of food really cheap. the smoked hot wings are A-MAZING. i like the pork, doused in the vinegar sauce. it was often crowded and/or playing bad music. but one time the chef talked to me & my friend about the Feederz.

ian, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:48 (ten years ago) link

it looks like bar b q closed over the summer and re-opened as a bar & grill?

ian, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:48 (ten years ago) link

RIP gigantic smoked hot wings ;_;

ian, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:49 (ten years ago) link

I will definitely continue to rep for the Indian food in Jersey City even as I have otherwise abandoned that place. Particularly Dosa Hut and Sri Ganesh Dosa House. Does Queens have much South Indian?

Rasoi is also pretty good for standard north Indian -- better than the 6th st. places anyway.

There's also a ton of good Indian in Iselin and Edison, and there were good Dosa places along Route 27 btw New Brunswick and Princeton (liked to stop there in my Rutgers days on the way to the Record Exchange)

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:50 (ten years ago) link

i went there once and the food was ok but i really didnt like the vibe xp

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:50 (ten years ago) link

yeah the vibe was often totally crummy. the music was either indie from an ipod or bad electric blues on the jukebox.

ian, Friday, 31 October 2008 14:52 (ten years ago) link

Has nobody since this thread was revived clicked on "show all posts" then done ctrl-f on "mr steve"? It must just be me that remembers it. Lulz.

The Plastic Fork (Pashmina), Friday, 31 October 2008 14:53 (ten years ago) link

there's a new-ish hotel on meeker overlooking the bqe. my favorite incongruously -located best western is the city view in long island city, opposite the cemetery.

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 15:01 (ten years ago) link

lol mr steve internet police!

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 15:01 (ten years ago) link

well i was way wrong re: hotel threads

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Friday, 31 October 2008 15:22 (ten years ago) link

btw i don't recommend throwing a hotel party because ppl will put applejacks in yr bed O_o

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 15:35 (ten years ago) link

Queens doesn't have much South Indian, one Dosa place and a few snack places, that are good in a pinch, but not quite as good as Jersey City, and nowhere near as good as what I've had in Iselin, which is the only place I've had really mindblowing south-indian.

The newest trends that are appearing in NY over the last few years were the indian-chinese, and Nan King, which locations in Jersey City and Jackson Heights, is good, and now Jackson Heights is getting a lot of Nepali/Tibeten food, as that seems to be a quickly growing population over here.

We also have the controversial Spicy Mina, which the Chowhounders generally rank, but I've found just decent the two times I've gone.

I went to a good Dosa place in Hicksville Long Island as well. It's near the Ikea and easier for me to drive to then Red Hook or Elizabeth.

I haven't eaten at enough Curry Hill places.

Joy was good for basic indian but other then that Brooklyn completely sucks. There's some hardcore bengali places out near midwood and kensington but who knows.

dan selzer, Friday, 31 October 2008 15:37 (ten years ago) link

btw i don't recommend throwing a hotel party because ppl will put applejacks in yr bed O_o

is this true!

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Friday, 31 October 2008 15:43 (ten years ago) link

WELL I NEVER

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 31 October 2008 15:46 (ten years ago) link

there is good indian food all over the ny area. is there a better place for indian food in america?

gabbneb, Friday, 31 October 2008 15:46 (ten years ago) link

Yes, actually, I was dehydrated and hungry and wanted cereal at 1am. I ate it in Ally's bed. ADMITTEDLY it ended up everywhere but that wasn't my fault, that was because durnk boys spilled/threw it.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 31 October 2008 15:47 (ten years ago) link

indiana xp

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 15:49 (ten years ago) link

there's a lot of Indians in cali, right? i've never had indian food there though.

Jordan, Friday, 31 October 2008 15:50 (ten years ago) link

NY is way better for indian food than CA

gabbneb, Friday, 31 October 2008 15:55 (ten years ago) link

tza is not a boy, miss laurel. i still sometimes have to hear about this incident you know O_o

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 16:01 (ten years ago) link

ppl should come to dan's night of the living disco dead party tonite, btw. you can get really drunk then go home and throw cereal.

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 16:03 (ten years ago) link

I was going to spare TZA, tho; I think JW started it.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 31 October 2008 16:04 (ten years ago) link

gabbneb have you eaten indian in lawndale, ca

Matt P, Friday, 31 October 2008 16:05 (ten years ago) link

I'm thinking of following the Danger Party free hijinx in the city, altho I will prob bow out before the $$ section starts at the indoor location. I have to be up early tomorrow.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 31 October 2008 16:06 (ten years ago) link

i'm supposed to go to a friend's party in stuyvesant town

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 16:06 (ten years ago) link

i might go to the chinese restaurant disco thing

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 16:08 (ten years ago) link

i always thought hevali east was the best of the 6th street places

i just went to this place last weekend:

http://www.chorbizarrerestaurant.com/

Tracer Hand, Friday, 31 October 2008 16:37 (ten years ago) link

waht is the chinese restaurant disco thing

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 16:38 (ten years ago) link

the thing lauren is talking about

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 16:40 (ten years ago) link

http://www.acuterecords.com/DiscoDead.jpg

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 16:40 (ten years ago) link

o luv m shanghai!

hav never been down to the venue tho

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 16:42 (ten years ago) link

it's cozy.

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 16:50 (ten years ago) link

will there be trick or treating for dumplings tho

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 16:52 (ten years ago) link

bobbing for soup dumplings.

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 16:54 (ten years ago) link

i like how this is just the nyc chat thread now

Jordan, Friday, 31 October 2008 16:55 (ten years ago) link

if you can't beat 'em, discuss regional obscurities until they go away.

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 17:04 (ten years ago) link

M Shanghai's soup dumplings are AWESOME.

I also have to give props to the high-end indian in NY. I really loved Amma and Devi, especially Amma since it's so cozy. Definitely places to let the parents pay, if you're so lucky to have parents in the area who like to take you to nice restaurants.

dan selzer, Friday, 31 October 2008 17:41 (ten years ago) link

let's do this right...

sellout this!

http://www.acuterecords.com/DiscoDead.jpg

dan selzer, Friday, 31 October 2008 17:45 (ten years ago) link

the cauliflower dish and the lamb chops at devi are amazing.

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 17:46 (ten years ago) link

i rly rly want to go to devi

gabbneb, Friday, 31 October 2008 17:47 (ten years ago) link

hay dan is there a cover for yr party - some pre post or mid party dancing sounds just right

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 18:25 (ten years ago) link

no cover.

dan selzer, Friday, 31 October 2008 18:39 (ten years ago) link

sweet

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 18:57 (ten years ago) link

That guy is more than welcome to move away from New York at any time. But I can understand that he has to live somewhere with public transit, it's hard to drive when you're looking so far down your nose. So his options probably ARE limited.

― Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Thursday, October 30, 2008 4:46 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Ha! Before I got to the middle of the second sentence I thought the voice sounded familiar and unpleasant.

another regrettable cheesesteak (Jesse), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:05 (ten years ago) link

guys where can i buy a toy siren in this city? like this one:
http://www.amazon.com/Red-Party-Police-Beacon-Light/dp/B0002VB01K/ref=pd_sbs_sg_4/183-6047788-0210341

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:18 (ten years ago) link

so far have tried two different toy stores and a kmart (i wasn't really holding out hope for kmart but it was on my way back to work)

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:19 (ten years ago) link

i rrrrrrrrrrrrreeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaallllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllly would prefer not to set foot into a ricky's today but if ppl are pretty convinced this item might be there, i might do it. but i want some back up before i trek into a ricky's.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:19 (ten years ago) link

Oh my god not Ricky's. Would they even HAVE a toy siren?? I don't think I've ever seen such a thing?

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:21 (ten years ago) link

What we need here is to know a cop.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:21 (ten years ago) link

well the one i posted is called something like "party dj siren" so you know. i mean i imagine it's the type of thing you can find VERY easily in a spencer's gifts in phoenix arizona but not so much here (in searching the internet i actually came across a story of a person claiming to have been ticketed by nypd for having one in his bike basket because he was "impersonating a cop").

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:25 (ten years ago) link

HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO BE SEXY MATT DRUDGE IF I DON'T HAVE A SIREN >:[

i'm just going to stay home!

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:26 (ten years ago) link

What we need here is to know a cop.

― Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, October 31, 2008 4:21 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

every time i think this, either something bad just happened, or something bad is about to happen

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:26 (ten years ago) link

Ummmmmmmmmm

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:27 (ten years ago) link

i should walk into the precinct on 35th and just ask them. "excuse me, you know those sirens you give to undercovers so they can put them a top their cars when they go into pursuit? can i have one? i have to dress up as internet minor celebrity matt drudge tonight."

surely they'd see it my way.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:27 (ten years ago) link

are there loft parties in nyc still or have they mostly been priced out and everybody goes to bars/clubs now

joe 40oz (deej), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:30 (ten years ago) link

i mean like, one not held by a septuagenarian dave mancuso

joe 40oz (deej), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:30 (ten years ago) link

there are still tons of loft/house parties

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:31 (ten years ago) link

we call them hill parties

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:32 (ten years ago) link

or heights parties

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:32 (ten years ago) link

there's a new-ish hotel on meeker overlooking the bqe. my favorite incongruously -located best western is the city view in long island city, opposite the cemetery.

― lauren, Friday, October 31, 2008 11:01 AM (5 hours ago) Bookmark

i heard from "a friend" has it they have hourly rates

HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO BE SEXY MATT DRUDGE IF I DON'T HAVE A SIREN

you and/or ghost rider has a stupid hat already??!?!?!?!?!

might hit up dan's thing

xpost - loft parties are for 22 year olds and people into "the fetish scene"

Kramkoob (Catsupppppppppppppp dude 茄蕃), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:32 (ten years ago) link

and there's max xposts

Kramkoob (Catsupppppppppppppp dude 茄蕃), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:32 (ten years ago) link

of course we have a stupid hat. do you even know us.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:32 (ten years ago) link

cos a question like that makes me question your commitment to our friendship

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:33 (ten years ago) link

the ricky's by my office has a line down the street! and a guy directing people! chaos.

someone brought a party dj siren to plant bar back in the good old days when dan s djed there. it was the best accessory ever.

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:33 (ten years ago) link

uh, jon, im 23 fyi

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:34 (ten years ago) link

ps what does it mean when you put "friend" in quotes

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:34 (ten years ago) link

ok so ricky's is out. so i either go as a sirenless drudge or i come up with something else. i could go as eli manning but i'd have to go to american apparel to get leggings. maybe i should just be a GROWN ASS WOMAN and not wear a costume.

xpost it means she was a prostitute, max

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:34 (ten years ago) link

"party dj siren"

didn't click yr link but they have all this stuff at Guitar Center I think? n.b. the Guitar Center I know of is way the fuck out in queens

dmr, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:35 (ten years ago) link

oh, what about party city or some other party supply store?

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:36 (ten years ago) link

there's a guitar center on 14th between 6th & 7th.

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:36 (ten years ago) link

I think there's one at Atlantic Center!

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:37 (ten years ago) link

sorry ally im only 23 i dont have any "friends" and i still go to "loft parties" with "fetishists"

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:37 (ten years ago) link

well don't "apologize" to me, you sound like my "boyfriend" basically

anyway i am trying to search thru some of the guitar center info. i wonder if maybe i am overdiong it -- watch, i'll walk into walgreens and they will have an amiable substitute.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:41 (ten years ago) link

that looks like a zagat review

xpost

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:41 (ten years ago) link

"amiable" was not the word i was looking for there

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:41 (ten years ago) link

boy"friend"

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:42 (ten years ago) link

did i do it right

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:42 (ten years ago) link

"right"

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:44 (ten years ago) link

"do it" lol

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:45 (ten years ago) link

yeah I couldn't find a siren on gtr center website
they carry all those spinny lights and fog machines tho
but if they actually have one it might cost $$

dmr, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:45 (ten years ago) link

yeah :\

will dressign up as matt drudge make sense without the siren? i mean the concept probably won't make sense to at least half the ppl i have a chance of seeing tonight anyway even with the siren so...?

new york city is for halloween undecideds

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:47 (ten years ago) link

my gf's little nephew has a little siren that works on batteries. i just emailed his mom to see where they got it.

carne asada, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:48 (ten years ago) link

ally, we're gonna find you a siren.

lauren, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:49 (ten years ago) link

YOU GUYS ARE THE BEST :D

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:52 (ten years ago) link

just put a "press" style piece of paper in yr hat band reading "drudge"

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:54 (ten years ago) link

just carry a paper sign that says DRUDGESIREN.GIF

dmr, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:55 (ten years ago) link

or you could just wander around all nite making siren noises and yelling breaking breaking then telling people about various right wing batshit

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:55 (ten years ago) link

just carry a paper sign that says DRUDGESIREN.GIF

― dmr, Friday, October 31, 2008 4:55 PM (41 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

^^ this is pretty lol

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 20:56 (ten years ago) link

just put a "press" style piece of paper in yr hat band reading "drudge"

― 888 (ice crӕm), Friday, October 31, 2008 4:54 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

^^^ i was thinking of this

just carry a paper sign that says DRUDGESIREN.GIF

― dmr, Friday, October 31, 2008 4:55 PM (1 second ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

^^^ was not thinking of this but now i am, like i could PRINT OUT a drudgesiren.gif and stick that in my hat

or you could just wander around all nite making siren noises and yelling breaking breaking then telling people about various right wing batshit

― 888 (ice crӕm), Friday, October 31, 2008 4:55 PM (24 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

^^^ already do this every friday

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:56 (ten years ago) link

i just bought some aqua scrubs a pack of my little pony bandaids and a medical thermometer

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 20:58 (ten years ago) link

Turntable Lab‎
3 reviews - more info »
120 E 7th St
New York, NY 10009
(212) 677-0675turntablelab.com‎

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 21:05 (ten years ago) link

Ash Sam Music Stores‎ - more info »
160 W 48th St, New York, NY‎ - (212) 719-5109‎
Category: Sound Systems & Equipment (Wholesale)
5 reviews - Write a review
"I was able to get the unit back to its original state thank GOD. Thanks also to ..."

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 21:05 (ten years ago) link

Top DJ Gear‎ - more info »
928 Broadway, New York, NY‎ - (212) 475-4077‎
42 reviews - Write a review
"Its been a good experience so far. In my own opinion not bad. Had some problem ..."

max, Friday, 31 October 2008 21:05 (ten years ago) link

http://i36.tinypic.com/2ntk601.jpg

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 21:15 (ten years ago) link

loft parties are awesome imo but i guess chicago loft parties arent full of fetishist 22 yr olds so that helps

joe 40oz (deej), Friday, 31 October 2008 21:42 (ten years ago) link

someone brought a party dj siren to plant bar back in the good old days when dan s djed there. it was the best accessory ever.

it was mosurock. Tim Sweeney bought one too. Jeremy has one and he's bringing it tonight. He's also bringing his fog machine. I bought the fluid for the fog machine. Yes, at Guitar Center, which has all kinds of stupid dj lights and effects. The Atlantic Center Guitar Center is on top of every subway train in the universe.

dan selzer, Friday, 31 October 2008 21:45 (ten years ago) link

haha sexy nurse!

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 22:02 (ten years ago) link

i used to go to plant bar all the time - my friend bartended there - oof too many free drinks etc

888 (ice crӕm), Friday, 31 October 2008 22:09 (ten years ago) link

"i've decided that my costume, with the darth vader mask, and the hannah montana wig, is cindy mccain" <-- these words were just said to me

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Friday, 31 October 2008 22:18 (ten years ago) link

who was your friend? I threw the monday night party there for 3 years.

dan selzer, Friday, 31 October 2008 23:12 (ten years ago) link

did yall have fun

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Saturday, 1 November 2008 12:49 (ten years ago) link

dan my friend andy was the bartender - im quite positive i attended yr monday nite party many times

888 (ice crӕm), Saturday, 1 November 2008 13:56 (ten years ago) link

andy m?

lauren, Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:21 (ten years ago) link

http://i36.tinypic.com/jh5xsl.jpg

888 (ice crӕm), Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:34 (ten years ago) link

sweet kitty

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:38 (ten years ago) link

that cat was amazing - he was friends w/a fox!

888 (ice crӕm), Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:40 (ten years ago) link

that is so cute!!!! + tough

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:40 (ten years ago) link

i dont believe you

max, Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:40 (ten years ago) link

yeah jho, u need more ppl

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:41 (ten years ago) link

(i believe you, fwiw)

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:41 (ten years ago) link

(and ftw)

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:41 (ten years ago) link

andy is one of the greatest people, ever!

lauren, Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:45 (ten years ago) link

i love that guy!

lauren, Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:45 (ten years ago) link

i never saw the cat playing w/the fox but my friend nick family whos cat it was all attested to its friendship w/the fox and i believe them

i mean the cat did have a v winning personality - hed follow you on long walks in the woods do crazy tricks and all sorts of shit

888 (ice crӕm), Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:45 (ten years ago) link

the truth comes out

max, Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:46 (ten years ago) link

yah andy is a sweetheart - one of my old good friends

888 (ice crӕm), Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:46 (ten years ago) link

max, sorry we took off right away. i realized how many drinks i'd had. damn early start.

lauren, Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:47 (ten years ago) link

ha no worries! i was several drinks "deep" at that point anyway just having a good time boogieing~~we left pretty early too cause ari had work. good to see u again briefly tho.

max, Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:49 (ten years ago) link

yeah, there was some good dancing.

i'm kind of "whoa" that jho was apparently always at plant bar when dan and i were always at plant bar.

lauren, Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:52 (ten years ago) link

i am also kinda "whoa" abt that

is dan the guy who would always play love buzz

888 (ice crӕm), Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:54 (ten years ago) link

no, i think that was probably kevin? luke would play it a lot, too.

lauren, Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:55 (ten years ago) link

i djed there once when there was no one around - it was pretty triumphant if i do say so myself

888 (ice crӕm), Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:58 (ten years ago) link

didn't we all!

lauren, Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:58 (ten years ago) link

ha

888 (ice crӕm), Saturday, 1 November 2008 15:58 (ten years ago) link

as i said to dan last night there are stories of people coming into the bar on monday nights, just hoping to get a drink, and leaving right away because there were half a dozen people dancing on tables to edge of seventeen with most of the lights turned off, plus no one would actually serve paying customers.

lauren, Saturday, 1 November 2008 16:01 (ten years ago) link

lol business model

888 (ice crӕm), Saturday, 1 November 2008 16:03 (ten years ago) link

hey this has nothing to do with plant bar but it tangentially related to the lol original topic of this thread: what is up with ppl who every time their home state is mentioned (in a song, on tv, in conversation briefly, whatever) they like get excited and make a deal about it? is this some kind of overcompensation against the made-up dumbass strawman that n/a is really upset with or are there just some ppl really proud of the state college they didn't even attend or something? i have been thinking about this all morning, not tryna start a beef with anyone.

also: it is IMPOSSIBLE to navigate stuyvesant town. what the hell is with that place.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Saturday, 1 November 2008 17:46 (ten years ago) link

vortex of confusion
http://www.satellite-sightseer.com/id/11497

ian, Saturday, 1 November 2008 17:55 (ten years ago) link

ya and the signs only tell you how to get to the odd numbered buildings and not how to get to the even numbered ones -- it's a nightmare maze!

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Saturday, 1 November 2008 17:56 (ten years ago) link

they do have black squirrels all over stuyvesant town though which is kinda cool.

ian, Saturday, 1 November 2008 17:58 (ten years ago) link

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2142/2316823225_cdc0cfa8e8.jpg

ian, Saturday, 1 November 2008 17:59 (ten years ago) link

CUTE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

KILLER cute!

ok so this is a weird question but is there a kind of boxed wine that is particular to new york

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Saturday, 1 November 2008 18:12 (ten years ago) link

my dad was born in stuyvesant town

max, Saturday, 1 November 2008 18:13 (ten years ago) link

cred alert

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Saturday, 1 November 2008 18:14 (ten years ago) link

the neighborhood has really changed since then

888 (ice crӕm), Saturday, 1 November 2008 18:15 (ten years ago) link

i bet he could find his way around tho

max, Saturday, 1 November 2008 18:16 (ten years ago) link

this is the only thing i could find for ny boxed wine

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/18/opinion/18colman.html?_r=1&em&oref=slogin

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Saturday, 1 November 2008 18:16 (ten years ago) link

hm.

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Saturday, 1 November 2008 18:18 (ten years ago) link

t is up with ppl who every time their home state is mentioned (in a song, on tv, in conversation briefly, whatever) they like get excited and make a deal about it?

hahaha! I definitely do this, I dunno why though. watching tv I'll be all "oh hey wau the st. louis arch" or "ooh look the Mizzou columns" when I'm WATCHING A MIZZOU GAME like duh of course they show the columns

dmr, Saturday, 1 November 2008 18:52 (ten years ago) link

boston is the least mentioned big american city in rap lyrics ever

888 (ice crӕm), Saturday, 1 November 2008 18:53 (ten years ago) link

st. louis never used to get mentioned much except for "Jus Like Compton" and that one Ice Cube track. but now they've got Nelly and Chingy.

dmr, Saturday, 1 November 2008 18:59 (ten years ago) link

"now" meaning five years ago

dmr, Saturday, 1 November 2008 18:59 (ten years ago) link

omg i totally forgot about nelly.

haha i mean i guess what i was thinking of was like, the last hold steady show i went to, the minneapolitans kept like knowingly looking at each other and loudly singing the mpls refs -- and i was like, we are at a hold steady show, how long are you guys gonna be entertained by minnesota references? the answer: a really long time!

then i was thinking, perhaps i am jaded because it is not very weird or unusual to hear/see ny references? but still.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Saturday, 1 November 2008 19:18 (ten years ago) link

thanks for coming those who came, it was an ok night, crowd came and went.

Andy was brought in to bartend when the Rapture started going on tour. He is great people. He was playing with White Magic for a bit then, what's he up to now?

I never played Love Buzz but probably everybody else who came around did. That was definitely a Fitz joint too.

dan selzer, Saturday, 1 November 2008 19:55 (ten years ago) link

lol is the andy u guys are talking about "magic" andy m4cle0d? he drums for brightblack morning light now, or at least he used to. i met in him in LA two years ago. small world!

max, Saturday, 1 November 2008 20:00 (ten years ago) link

yeah I think the hold steady draw that reaction more than most, though ..... they're kind of trying for it? I can hardly think of a show where craig didn't either wear a twins hat or jersey or both or at least talk about the twins onstage

we went to that dvd taping of theirs a month or so ago, it was pretty funny seeing a rock show in some weird fancy wall st. bank building the day after the stock market tanked

xposts

dmr, Saturday, 1 November 2008 20:07 (ten years ago) link

also black squirrels are kinda cool. I saw one last time I was in Sunnyside.

dmr, Saturday, 1 November 2008 20:08 (ten years ago) link

the last time i saw the hold steady was at terminal 5. the reason i have not yet purchased tix to their show in a few days is because it is, yet again, at terminal 5. that place can bite my ass.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Saturday, 1 November 2008 20:15 (ten years ago) link

never seen a show there ... don't plan to if I can help it

dmr, Saturday, 1 November 2008 20:19 (ten years ago) link

it's TERRIBLE. i mean, you have to wait on a line to GO OUTSIDE. i'm not kidding!

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Saturday, 1 November 2008 20:44 (ten years ago) link

it is my goddamned right as an american to go have a cigarette in the middle of "stevie nix" and i'll be damned if terminal 5 is going to stop me.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Saturday, 1 November 2008 20:46 (ten years ago) link

I'm going to the thursday show and anticipating suckage

gabbneb, Saturday, 1 November 2008 21:26 (ten years ago) link

that's the same andy, max. another "whoa" small world moment.

lauren, Saturday, 1 November 2008 21:37 (ten years ago) link

Terminal 5 won't let you outside to smoke?

Serves me right for going to see the Decemberists, then.

James Mitchell, Saturday, 1 November 2008 21:42 (ten years ago) link

bordoms in the round at terminal 5 was perfect - place cracked me up - i felt like i was abt to get into a dance fight the whole time

dan andys an indie session man now hes played w/like 1m bands - i cant keep track - maybe love is laughter and some other bands currently?? i just wore my og white magic tshirt yesterday - and yah max same guy

888 (ice crӕm), Saturday, 1 November 2008 22:30 (ten years ago) link

you are allowed to go outside to smoke if you wait on a line because they only let like 3 ppl outside to smoke at one time -- it is in the middle of BFE, what is this about? thankfully it is really difficult and expensive to get a drink there so i wasn't really drinking at all = reduced interest in smoking anyway.

i can see how boredoms would be good there because, you know, it is a damn nightclub cavernous space, but seeing a rock show there sucks. it is just my least favorite show space and i've got issues with it.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Saturday, 1 November 2008 23:45 (ten years ago) link

tonight was a nice night to be out in new york.
last day of summer?

i got a real goddamn bargain on a Nurse With Wound record, then I got drunk. wooooo.

ian, Sunday, 2 November 2008 06:08 (ten years ago) link

I went to King Yum in Forest Meadows. New York's only 50+ year old american chinese and polynesian restaurant. I had an egg-drop and wonton soup, an egg roll, and a really good dish that involved white meat chicken, pineapple, and a "sweet and pungeant" sauce that was set on fire. It was actually really good. Friends got the chow mein, which was not as good. My lady-friend and I shared a drink called a "Taboo for Two". Yes, it was served in a bowl with two straws.

http://offthebroiler.wordpress.com/2006/07/17/nyc-dining-king-yum/

only problem is we couldn't get seated in the tiki room, though the chinese room wasn't much less kitschy.

dan selzer, Sunday, 2 November 2008 07:45 (ten years ago) link

sorry, "Tabu for Two".

dan selzer, Sunday, 2 November 2008 07:57 (ten years ago) link

i would like to come to NY for like a week with nothing to do but hang out and see stuff. almost every time i've come to nyc it's been for something specific and i've had to be in a certain area and worry about being somewhere at a certain time and getting out of the city by a certain time to go somewhere else.

metametadata (n/a), Monday, 3 November 2008 16:27 (ten years ago) link

we may not always see eye to eye, nick, but you can sleep on my couch for ONE (1) night and i'll take you to the best diner in brooklyn.

ian, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:30 (ten years ago) link

awwww

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Monday, 3 November 2008 16:31 (ten years ago) link

r u talkin abt toms

888 (ice crӕm), Monday, 3 November 2008 16:31 (ten years ago) link

hey this has nothing to do with plant bar but it tangentially related to the lol original topic of this thread: what is up with ppl who every time their home state is mentioned (in a song, on tv, in conversation briefly, whatever) they like get excited and make a deal about it?

Paul Simon's Live in Central Park record always reminds me of this. Every reference:

"There is a girl in New York City..."
"AGHGHGHGH!!!!!!"

Eazy, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:32 (ten years ago) link

thanks ian

metametadata (n/a), Monday, 3 November 2008 16:33 (ten years ago) link

i think that type of stuff is kinda sweet

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Monday, 3 November 2008 16:33 (ten years ago) link

yeah ice craem i am talkin about toms. if yer in the hood and want to meet me and my boy there at noon let's do it.

ian, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:33 (ten years ago) link

yr gogin to toms in a half hour?

888 (ice crӕm), Monday, 3 November 2008 16:34 (ten years ago) link

yeah.

ian, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:34 (ten years ago) link

yokay! i might be like 15 min late

888 (ice crӕm), Monday, 3 November 2008 16:34 (ten years ago) link

I get kind of excited when Michigan comes up because I'm always sort of surprised the rest of the world knows where it is. I know this is stupid, but when I lived there I didn't know where the rest of the world was, so....

Apart from Detroit; everyone knows (or thinks they know) Detroit.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Monday, 3 November 2008 16:36 (ten years ago) link

hey ice cream i tried to webmail you my phone number, but if it didn't work, just look for the two dudes eating breakfast.

ian, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:38 (ten years ago) link

i think ill recognize u

888 (ice crӕm), Monday, 3 November 2008 16:39 (ten years ago) link

aw, tom's... i would kill for some fishcakes and eggs.

lauren, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:40 (ten years ago) link

i want to go i hate my job

Uncle Shavedlongcock (max), Monday, 3 November 2008 16:40 (ten years ago) link

I love Tom's crabcakes! I had a milkshake there once and it was bad, though. Milkshakes should never involve ice. I may have complained about this before.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Monday, 3 November 2008 16:41 (ten years ago) link

i want to go i hate sitting in lecture

my other son is a zamboni (gbx), Monday, 3 November 2008 16:42 (ten years ago) link

tom's has the best goddamn pork sausages.

ian, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:42 (ten years ago) link

do u guys want to swing by my office in suits and pretend to be important clients who have to take me out to lunch

Uncle Shavedlongcock (max), Monday, 3 November 2008 16:42 (ten years ago) link

do you have an expense account?

ian, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:42 (ten years ago) link

cuz i sure don't.

ian, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:43 (ten years ago) link

gdamn max get in a taxi and treat us to some corporate lunch ffs

888 (ice crӕm), Monday, 3 November 2008 16:43 (ten years ago) link

if i were less busy today, i'd claim a dr. appt and hop on the 2/3.

lauren, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:44 (ten years ago) link

if anyone ever wants to go to tom's on a monday, which is my day off, i am totally 100% down for it. also sometimes on fridays if i get up early enough.

ian, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:48 (ten years ago) link

hmm, maybe i will go to tom's tomorrow after i vote. never been there before.

mizzell, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:54 (ten years ago) link

i hope jhoshea has not left yet cuz we're gonna do this shit around 12:30 now.

ian, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:55 (ten years ago) link

tom's is really, really awesome.

ian, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:55 (ten years ago) link

does it have chicken and waffles? cause if it doesn't i think i will prefer mike's.

mizzell, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:56 (ten years ago) link

no chicken and waffles :( there is a place on the same block that does, though.

ian, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:56 (ten years ago) link

I'm off today, but I can get to Tom's in 2 minutes:(

Virginia Plain, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:59 (ten years ago) link

do we live on the same block, VP?

ian, Monday, 3 November 2008 16:59 (ten years ago) link

lunch was yummy and the company was nice :)

888 (ice crӕm), Monday, 3 November 2008 18:38 (ten years ago) link

yesterday i went to that new huge korean spa in flushing - it was pretty fucking awesome - my only complaint is nothing was quite hot enough - they dont sweat like the russians

http://www.nyspacastle.com

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/11/fashion/11inspa.html

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/05/11/fashion/11inspa.large2.jpg

888 (ice crӕm), Monday, 3 November 2008 18:42 (ten years ago) link

i really want to go! mr. lauren was like, "are you crazy."

lauren, Monday, 3 November 2008 18:43 (ten years ago) link

tom's is cool

love when there's a line and they bring oranges and coffee while u wait

unexpectedly good: their huevos rancheros

dmr, Monday, 3 November 2008 18:48 (ten years ago) link

mizzell do you live over there too? I vote at the school on Washington right down the street from tom's

dmr, Monday, 3 November 2008 18:49 (ten years ago) link

Uhh I think I might be voting in the nabe as well since I never changed my address with the city.

Vampire romances depend on me (Laurel), Monday, 3 November 2008 18:50 (ten years ago) link

we just walked by your old bldg the other night on the way to chavella's

dmr, Monday, 3 November 2008 18:54 (ten years ago) link

yah lauren you should go its pretty ludicrous and fun - theres a sign when yr leaving that says "stop! are you dressed?"

i love this place http://www.wallstreetbath.com too which is not nearly as huge and gleaming - more of a hardcore russian sauna type situation

888 (ice crӕm), Monday, 3 November 2008 18:55 (ten years ago) link

best sign ever.

lauren, Monday, 3 November 2008 19:01 (ten years ago) link

dmr, I live in ft green (vote on adelphi), but will be taking advantage of having the day off: vote, leisurely breakfast, fish n chips lunch with champions league soccer, and roasting a chicken for dinner.

mizzell, Monday, 3 November 2008 19:13 (ten years ago) link

hay thanx for comin out ice craem, was a pleasure!
so full still.

ian, Monday, 3 November 2008 19:24 (ten years ago) link

yah dude - i webmaild u v records btw

888 (ice crӕm), Monday, 3 November 2008 19:32 (ten years ago) link

re records

888 (ice crӕm), Monday, 3 November 2008 19:32 (ten years ago) link

did you guys talk about the new subway map
http://www.kickmap.com/images/7_wholemap_comparison.jpg

lol g'bye cartographical accuracy hello tufte

El Tomboto, Friday, 7 November 2008 23:46 (ten years ago) link

Man, Staten Island sure looks close to Manhattan in both those…

LUTE JOINTS (Catsupppppppppppppp dude 茄蕃), Friday, 7 November 2008 23:55 (ten years ago) link

whaaaaaaaaat subway map is changing ????/??????sdkjbsd

✧✦✵✶✴i feel magical✴✶✵✦✧ (ice crӕm), Saturday, 8 November 2008 09:13 (ten years ago) link

dude we cant be gogin all euro in the wake of or nations greatest victory wtf

✧✦✵✶✴i feel magical✴✶✵✦✧ (ice crӕm), Saturday, 8 November 2008 09:13 (ten years ago) link

btw old map not at all cartographicaly accurate

✧✦✵✶✴i feel magical✴✶✵✦✧ (ice crӕm), Saturday, 8 November 2008 09:14 (ten years ago) link

It looks even more like a sexual health diagramme now... is Rockaway the prostate now or something?

post-apocalyptic time jazz (Masonic Boom), Saturday, 8 November 2008 09:48 (ten years ago) link

omg i think im going to cry and move to france now

✧✦✵✶✴i feel magical✴✶✵✦✧ (ice crӕm), Saturday, 8 November 2008 09:50 (ten years ago) link

It's OK, don't worry, it's all part of Obama's grand plan to turn the US into a European Socialist Scrounger's Paradise, etc. Today yr subway maps, tomorrow - nationalised healthcare or something WACKY like that.

post-apocalyptic time jazz (Masonic Boom), Saturday, 8 November 2008 09:57 (ten years ago) link

cool historical subway maps here
http://www.nycsubway.org/maps/historical.html#1970

velko, Saturday, 8 November 2008 10:00 (ten years ago) link

I'm going to be in NYC in January. I am going to get really really lost, aren't I?

post-apocalyptic time jazz (Masonic Boom), Saturday, 8 November 2008 10:05 (ten years ago) link

i dunno just take yr chunnel map w/you that should work just as good as our subway maps apparently

✧✦✵✶✴i feel magical✴✶✵✦✧ (ice crӕm), Saturday, 8 November 2008 10:06 (ten years ago) link

Dude, I was trying to get to QUEENS, what am I doing in BRUSSELS?!?!?!?

post-apocalyptic time jazz (Masonic Boom), Saturday, 8 November 2008 10:13 (ten years ago) link

1972 was the last good one

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Saturday, 8 November 2008 15:43 (ten years ago) link

I find New York pretty easy to find your way around in since the river provides a convenient north south axis.

LUTE JOINTS (Catsupppppppppppppp dude 茄蕃), Saturday, 8 November 2008 17:28 (ten years ago) link

"north"/"south" axis

Uncle Shavedlongcock (max), Saturday, 8 November 2008 17:33 (ten years ago) link

is that new map for real, like up in subway stations? i think i am opposed to the idea of buying a subway map that fits in my pocket instead of picking up freebies and losing them at my convenience.

schlump, Saturday, 8 November 2008 17:40 (ten years ago) link

Yes, max I am aware that it is "new york north"

LUTE JOINTS (Catsupppppppppppppp dude 茄蕃), Saturday, 8 November 2008 17:43 (ten years ago) link

so no one wants to talk about how both of those NYC subway maps tom posted look like a flacid little cock n balls in profile?

ian, Saturday, 8 November 2008 18:08 (ten years ago) link

i think someone did say that actually

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Saturday, 8 November 2008 18:21 (ten years ago) link

Well, it's nice to know who has me killfiled, innit?

Manhattan is easy enough to navigate but I can't remember how Queens works - I did once work it out, in terms of Avenues and Roads and Streets and Courts or whatever, but I have forgotten. I haven't lived in NYC since there was a Democrat in the White House.

post-apocalyptic time jazz (Masonic Boom), Saturday, 8 November 2008 18:32 (ten years ago) link

Dude, cell phones have google maps now; don't sweat it!

LUTE JOINTS (Catsupppppppppppppp dude 茄蕃), Saturday, 8 November 2008 18:37 (ten years ago) link

Oh man the 1951 map is awesome.

s.clover, Sunday, 9 November 2008 15:03 (ten years ago) link

what is going on with the rockaways in that subway map

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Monday, 10 November 2008 01:26 (ten years ago) link

It's a nice feeling when you realize you've officially become part of the jaded, bitter, heartless new york mass. It's everything I ever thought I'd be when I was a wee one.

burt_stanton, Monday, 10 November 2008 01:28 (ten years ago) link

i think that new map looks nice

i love to hear this again and again (gbx), Monday, 10 November 2008 01:29 (ten years ago) link

lol @ drunken middle of the night me getting upset abt the new subway map

✧✦✵✶✴i feel magical✴✶✵✦✧ (ice crӕm), Monday, 10 November 2008 01:30 (ten years ago) link

jamaica bay does look really weird and wrong tho

✧✦✵✶✴i feel magical✴✶✵✦✧ (ice crӕm), Monday, 10 November 2008 01:32 (ten years ago) link

it's better than that shitty new taxi logo

i love to hear this again and again (gbx), Monday, 10 November 2008 01:32 (ten years ago) link

yeah, I kinda like the Kick Map... it's definitely in the spirit of the Vignelli 72 map. I have a nice print of Vignelli's 2008 update hanging in my apartment.

burt_stanton, Monday, 10 November 2008 01:32 (ten years ago) link

for sure xp

✧✦✵✶✴i feel magical✴✶✵✦✧ (ice crӕm), Monday, 10 November 2008 01:33 (ten years ago) link

honestly brooklyn/queens looks like a laughing monkey in profile.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Monday, 10 November 2008 01:33 (ten years ago) link

shocker: messageboard poster has map of subway hanging in apartment

burt_stanton, Monday, 10 November 2008 01:33 (ten years ago) link

i have a map of the WORLD in my apartment! someone left it here after a party...? i don't understand why a person brought it to my house but it's mine now.

the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Monday, 10 November 2008 01:35 (ten years ago) link

shocker: messageboard poster has map of subway hanging in apartment

is this seriously a stereotype

corrie ham (roxymuzak), Monday, 10 November 2008 16:23 (ten years ago) link

btw old map not at all cartographicaly accurate

Thankin u! Staten Island puh leese.

I'm already partial to this map.

http://www.columbia.edu/~brennan/subway/Subwaymap.gif

Fred Dalton Township (Laurel), Monday, 10 November 2008 16:31 (ten years ago) link

that is a v nice-looking and not very useful map

gabbneb, Monday, 10 November 2008 16:32 (ten years ago) link

path train should just be part of the subway right

SNAKES! (ice crӕm), Monday, 10 November 2008 16:33 (ten years ago) link

Yes, but it would never happen - too much lost revenue if you could just transfer free from PATH to Subway.

Tyrone Quattlebaum (Hurting 2), Monday, 10 November 2008 16:35 (ten years ago) link

plus u would lose all the unique PATH culture & ads

Uncle Shavedlongcock (max), Monday, 10 November 2008 16:36 (ten years ago) link

NO official MTA map is any good for relating trains to surface streets, for that I am completely dependent on the gmaps hack at http://www.onnyturf.com/subway/. But the columbia.edu map is WAY less embarrassing looking than the new MTA one.

Fred Dalton Township (Laurel), Monday, 10 November 2008 16:36 (ten years ago) link

i have never taken the path - a friend of mine used to use it to commute within manhattan

SNAKES! (ice crӕm), Monday, 10 November 2008 16:39 (ten years ago) link

It's cheaper and cleaner than anything on the MTA, for sure, but unlimited cards kind of negate the first. I guess if you're going from the West Vil to Herald Sq it's your favorite train?

Fred Dalton Township (Laurel), Monday, 10 November 2008 16:44 (ten years ago) link

yah that was her commute

SNAKES! (ice crӕm), Monday, 10 November 2008 16:46 (ten years ago) link

i guess that thing looks alright on closer inspection but i like having at least some landmarks on the map

gabbneb, Monday, 10 November 2008 17:43 (ten years ago) link

big map

schlump, Saturday, 15 November 2008 19:24 (ten years ago) link

neat

gabbneb, Saturday, 15 November 2008 19:27 (ten years ago) link

o i luv the neighborhoods on that one

ketchup bro (ice cr?m), Saturday, 15 November 2008 20:18 (ten years ago) link

lol, the Meatpacking District is "Meat Mkt"

gabbneb, Saturday, 15 November 2008 20:23 (ten years ago) link

a bunch of revolutionary war reenactors just marched by my house

ketchup bro (ice cr?m), Saturday, 15 November 2008 20:34 (ten years ago) link

sellouts

gabbneb, Saturday, 15 November 2008 20:44 (ten years ago) link

srsly

ketchup bro (ice cr?m), Saturday, 15 November 2008 20:49 (ten years ago) link

i saw them at the farmer's market and this woman was like, i didn't know people actually did that.

mizzell, Saturday, 15 November 2008 21:06 (ten years ago) link

haha i used to work w/one of those guys - he was pretty sad

ketchup bro (ice cr?m), Saturday, 15 November 2008 21:15 (ten years ago) link

apparently google nyc building has the second largest footprint in the city - here it is http://tinyurl.com/6n5nms it take up a block

whats #1 tho - i cant find it out

??????

ketchup bro (ice cr?m), Saturday, 15 November 2008 21:36 (ten years ago) link

The theme of Google’s Chelsea offices is “urban parks” — so there is a lot of exposed brick, dirty windows (with signs saying they are left dirty on purpose), graffiti font, metal and AstroTurf-ish grass. Blackboards, complimenting white boards, allow Googlers to scribble and be creative to their hearts content (but no photos, please.)

ian, Saturday, 15 November 2008 21:41 (ten years ago) link

the Met? xp

gabbneb, Saturday, 15 November 2008 21:41 (ten years ago) link

google, please

buzza, Saturday, 15 November 2008 21:42 (ten years ago) link

dirty windows (with signs saying they are left dirty on purpose) lololol

ketchup bro (ice cr?m), Saturday, 15 November 2008 21:47 (ten years ago) link

The theme of Google’s Chelsea offices is “urban parks” — so there is a lot of exposed brick, dirty windows (with signs saying they are left dirty on purpose), graffiti font, metal and AstroTurf-ish grass. Blackboards, complimenting white boards, allow Googlers to scribble and be creative to their hearts content

i just threw up a little on my Google Phone

Tracer Hand, Saturday, 15 November 2008 21:48 (ten years ago) link

video of google nyc where i found out abt the footprint here http://www.thebigmoney.com/articles/video/2008/11/12/inside-goog

dirty windows (with signs saying they are left dirty on purpose) (ice cr?m), Saturday, 15 November 2008 21:50 (ten years ago) link

it's better than that shitty new taxi logo

seriously what the fuck is that about, it looks like when somebody takes a font that is already bold/black weight by design and then ctrl-Bs it again. ugly ugly shitto

TOMBOT, Saturday, 15 November 2008 23:05 (ten years ago) link

i've seen the new nyc logo on a bunch of forms. i'd thought it was only for building department related letters, though, which kind of made more sense. i think it's ok.

what's something good and new yorky i can do? i moved here like a month or two ago and i'm sat around at home not doing anything and wishing to utilise my sunday.

schlump, Sunday, 16 November 2008 19:09 (ten years ago) link

go to the momfuku milk bar and tell us all how it is

what should i do with my mom on wednesday

mookieproof, Sunday, 16 November 2008 19:18 (ten years ago) link

go to the momfuku milk bar and tell us all how it is

― the dan glickman from the hilarious motion picture association of america (max), Sunday, November 16, 2008 2:10 PM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

my typo has been turned into hilarious fun

the MOMfuku milk bar

^^reproduced in case you didnt get it at first

MOM FUK U!!!!
lolololoololol

being rich would be the best (roxymuzak), Sunday, 16 November 2008 19:21 (ten years ago) link

"milk bar" sounds wrong, especially with mom fuk u

mookieproof, Sunday, 16 November 2008 19:21 (ten years ago) link

go to the "MoM"A

gabbneb, Sunday, 16 November 2008 19:24 (ten years ago) link

and the Morgan Library

gabbneb, Sunday, 16 November 2008 19:24 (ten years ago) link

i dont get that one

being rich would be the best (roxymuzak), Sunday, 16 November 2008 19:33 (ten years ago) link

morgan library sounds interesting; i popped to moma on a free friday a week or so ago.

the milk bar looks super, but i know that i'd go in, ask for something without sugar and be greeted with the sound of a smashed plate, the piano slamming shut etc. someone else will have to do some research. on the subject of ilx ny hotspots, i might pop to tom's in brooklyn someday.

schlump, Sunday, 16 November 2008 19:36 (ten years ago) link

This sounds kind of funny. I'd want to go see this show:

Endangered Species in Gentrifying Brooklyn
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/24/theater/reviews/24taki.html?8dpc

By BEN BRANTLEY
Published: November 24, 2008
Marion is, by her description, “a big black woman,” and hardly a retiring type. But when she walks into the new French café in her neighborhood — a place dominated by thin, pale, chic people — nobody sees her. It’s not that she’s being ignored, she says; it’s that “I don’t exist.” In Williamsburg, Brooklyn, her longtime neighborhood, she has become an invisible woman.

On the other hand, theatergoers who attend “Taking Over,” the fiery polemical portrait gallery of a play that opened Sunday night at the Public Theater, will find Marion impossible to overlook and hard to forget. She is embodied by a big white guy named Danny Hoch, the play’s author and sole performer.

Mr. Hoch a specialist in placing invisible people in the line of vision of folks who might otherwise never see them. Marion has too much pride to yell, “Look at me!,” but her creator is happy to raise his voice — loudly and raucously — on her behalf, by bringing her and her spiritual kin into being. The extravagantly talented Mr. Hoch has been channeling the restless souls of the dispossessed and the marginalized since the early 1990s, becoming a boiling one-man melting pot in shows like “Some People” and “Jails, Hospitals and Hip-Hop.” Now he is insisting that attention be paid to the endangered species to which Marion belongs.

That’s the hard-core group of New Yorkers in Williamsburg, of varying ethnicity and slender means, who have come under siege from a growing army of upper-middle-class invaders. In the segment that begins the show, set during a Community Day celebration, an angry young man of Polish and Puerto Rican descent named Robert takes microphone in hand to denounce the “yuppie alternative-rocker, post-punk white people — and black people too,” who are effectively running him and his family out of town. “Why are you here?” he screams into the audience. “Nobody wants you here!”

Vichitravirya_XI, Monday, 24 November 2008 14:59 (ten years ago) link

yuppie alternative-rocker, post-punk white people

gabbneb, Monday, 24 November 2008 15:00 (ten years ago) link

YARPPUWP - a new species

Vichitravirya_XI, Monday, 24 November 2008 15:05 (ten years ago) link

he means you

burt_stanton, Monday, 24 November 2008 15:10 (ten years ago) link

who?

Vichitravirya_XI, Monday, 24 November 2008 15:14 (ten years ago) link

Hoch is quite a chameleon... but once when I saw him open in Central Park for Gil Scott Heron, the crowd was booing his transracial portrayals til GSH came onstage and intervened.

Dr Morbius, Monday, 24 November 2008 15:21 (ten years ago) link

I love the new taxi logos! The shitty xerox quality is a huge part of their appeal.

Tracer Hand, Monday, 24 November 2008 16:04 (ten years ago) link

the MOMfuku milkf bar

Indiespace Administratester (Hurting 2), Monday, 24 November 2008 16:08 (ten years ago) link

six years pass...

http://gawker.com/why-do-i-still-live-in-new-york-city-a-roundtable-1707169606

My question is where else to move to in the US if you want dense living (SF is not an answer)

, Tuesday, 2 June 2015 19:35 (four years ago) link

I know I troll these threads a lot but lol @

"Your Mexican food is so bad it borders on racism."

maybe/whatever/so what/boring (admrl), Tuesday, 2 June 2015 20:01 (four years ago) link

one month passes...

What are some ways people have found success finding roommates? I've had a few friends of friends type leads but it's all come up short - I'm finding I'm pretty picky. Sadly.

Treeship, Wednesday, 8 July 2015 15:35 (four years ago) link

i will jump off my roof before i ever have a roomie again

skateboards are the new combover (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 8 July 2015 15:49 (four years ago) link

get a better job, or an apartment in a less convenient location, and live by yourself. i have had exactly 1 good roommate in the last 12 years.

ian, Wednesday, 8 July 2015 22:36 (four years ago) link

wait make that 2.

ian, Wednesday, 8 July 2015 22:36 (four years ago) link

I could do that... But the studios and 1 bedrooms seem like such a ripoff compared to the type of place I could live with a roommate.

Treeship, Wednesday, 8 July 2015 22:46 (four years ago) link

Also in Philly I lived in a studio and it was honestly really lonely much of the time.

Treeship, Wednesday, 8 July 2015 22:47 (four years ago) link

four months pass...

of 1961 NYC residents polled earlier this month, 52% of black respondents, 44% of Bronx residents, 42% of hispanic respondents and 36% of Brooklyn residents claimed that the chance that a family member will be incarcerated is very likely or almost certain. Compare to 15% of white respondents and 27% of Manhattan residents.

xpost to "why not class warfare"

i made a scope for my laser musket out of some (forksclovetofu), Thursday, 19 November 2015 15:44 (three years ago) link

two years pass...

I spent the last week in NY it was kind of fun but mostly sad

sleepingbag, Thursday, 7 December 2017 19:49 (one year ago) link

Also every restaurant I ate at was worse than the average restaurant in Denver

sleepingbag, Thursday, 7 December 2017 19:52 (one year ago) link

sleepingbag: a dipshit at life, not just at posting

-_- (jim in vancouver), Thursday, 7 December 2017 20:02 (one year ago) link

shoulda asked for resto tippos

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 7 December 2017 20:02 (one year ago) link

with so many restaurants in the city it's not too hard to end up in a crappy one but also just as easy to end up somewhere really good. xxp

(•̪●) (carne asada), Thursday, 7 December 2017 20:04 (one year ago) link

that box looks lame

infinity (∞), Thursday, 7 December 2017 20:32 (one year ago) link

pvm in screenname character but yeah of course i agree

Chocolate-covered gummy bears? Not ruling those lil' guys out. (ulysses), Thursday, 7 December 2017 20:41 (one year ago) link

NYC on the whole has a surprisingly large number of mediocre and overpriced restaurants. I agree Denver is more the kind of place where you can just walk into an average affordable restaurant and get a good meal, whereas NYC you really have to know where to go and often be prepared to spend.

NYC makes me sad too fwiw, at least Manhattan does. I enjoy not working there anymore.

IF (Terrorist) Yes, Explain (man alive), Thursday, 7 December 2017 20:45 (one year ago) link

Denver is a great food city tbh!

To be fair, the music + comedy we saw was leagues better than what's typically on offer locally. And for my buddy I went with, visiting Harlem gave him an experience probably akin to what I'd get if I went to Israel (guessing here). But overall the city seemed a lot less impressive then the last time I was there (around 10 years ago) for reasons both objective + subjective.

sleepingbag, Thursday, 7 December 2017 21:01 (one year ago) link

NYC has a surprisingly large number of mediocre and overpriced tourists

ice cream social justice (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 7 December 2017 21:04 (one year ago) link

five months pass...

People who wear boating shoes or flip flops: what the fuck are you thinking

calstars, Sunday, 27 May 2018 20:08 (one year ago) link

I love flips flops. I can walk miles in them. But in the city you kind of want to be able to run away.

Yerac, Sunday, 27 May 2018 20:10 (one year ago) link

ten months pass...

more like a psychological torture chamber than a city, really

Trϵϵship, Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:08 (six months ago) link

Gotta find the city within the city

calstars, Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:37 (six months ago) link

blehhhhhhh

Trϵϵship, Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:38 (six months ago) link

there are many people here who i love. there are many places here that are great. but honestly, so much about this place wears on me.

Trϵϵship, Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:39 (six months ago) link

i renewed my lease though

Trϵϵship, Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:40 (six months ago) link

omg, i totally forgot about that Beware the Boys song. I just started playing it and we are dying laughing.

Yerac, Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:42 (six months ago) link

This is what happens when I just skim these threads. I should maybe re-read it at some point.

treeship, what happened?

Yerac, Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:44 (six months ago) link

NA you ought to be glad you're rid of such shallow people.
― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, August 7, 2003 10:03 AM (fifteen years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeeowch

Nick Chiveon (rip van wanko), Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:47 (six months ago) link

i'm just whining. the proximate cause of my problem is some transit nightmare and then a horrible cab driver who drove in circles for a half hour before finding the williamsburg bridge. but in general, i've felt worn down by the work culture at my job and also i find that when i'm in the city--especially manhattan--i feel this kind of constant, low level anxiety and i'm sick of it

Trϵϵship, Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:49 (six months ago) link

xp

Trϵϵship, Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:49 (six months ago) link

yeah treesh I wish you'd expound. I started a "is NYC dead?" thread a few months ago and I remember you being a bit critical of city life then, too. Genuinely curious which aspects get to you the most.
xp

Nick Chiveon (rip van wanko), Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:50 (six months ago) link

what's the root of the anxiety?

Nick Chiveon (rip van wanko), Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:51 (six months ago) link

Manhattan has too many tourists, too many people. I used to get anxiety having to tell a cab driver to take me to wburg so I always preferred to take the train. I like NYC but I never miss it when I am away. (except for the food and being able to pet lots of dogs).

xpost I think this thread started (by NA) right after that big FAP in NYC over the fourth of July. I wonder what happened.

Yerac, Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:54 (six months ago) link

xp i think i just wasn't made to be in that close proximity to that many strangers every day. which is a shitty thing to say, but i think it's true.

Trϵϵship, Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:55 (six months ago) link

obviously weekends in williamsburg, greenpoint and fort greene (my haunts) are great. but even then, i sometimes wish i just lived somewhere more anonymous.

Trϵϵship, Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:56 (six months ago) link

if i could work in brooklyn i think i would be happier. something about subway commuting just feels like i am descending into hell every morning.

Trϵϵship, Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:57 (six months ago) link

You should move to Queens. I felt a lot more relaxed after a decade in williamsburg, even though I was living in a really lowkey area anyway. Some Canadian who had just moved to williamsburg once told me that he loved the L Train because it was like a cocktail party. The trains are terrible.

Yerac, Saturday, 13 April 2019 00:59 (six months ago) link

I worked in Brooklyn a couple of times. For 2-3 years I could walk to work easily. It was soooo amazingly great to never have real need to go into the city.

Yerac, Saturday, 13 April 2019 01:01 (six months ago) link

that's a good tip. yeah, maybe i should just prioritize "working in brooklyn" when i look for new jobs. it seems strange but it might make a huge difference. it truly is manhattan that i dislike--it feels like a giant mall, but like one where they locked the doors at night on black friday so everyone is trapped inside.

Trϵϵship, Saturday, 13 April 2019 01:07 (six months ago) link

I don't even know what you do but quitting jobs is one of my passions.

Yerac, Saturday, 13 April 2019 01:23 (six months ago) link

yerac someday i would like to see a list of all the places you've lived

definitely feeling the nyc tiresomeness lately

mookieproof, Saturday, 13 April 2019 01:32 (six months ago) link

Technically my place of residence has been in nyc since the early 2000s.

Yerac, Saturday, 13 April 2019 01:36 (six months ago) link

nyc is for BUYERS

I am outta time here

a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Saturday, 13 April 2019 01:52 (six months ago) link

treesh otm new york sucks

american bradass (BradNelson), Saturday, 13 April 2019 01:53 (six months ago) link

and a lot of my recurring anxieties here are commuting on the subway-related too

american bradass (BradNelson), Saturday, 13 April 2019 01:54 (six months ago) link

morbs, are you really leaving?

Yerac, Saturday, 13 April 2019 01:55 (six months ago) link

The subway is so brittle. I was working last fall for a couple of months with a terrible commute and it distinctly would change once some event like the start of school or a cold snap happened. I would leave almost 45 minutes ahead of time so I could just read and not stress.

Yerac, Saturday, 13 April 2019 01:58 (six months ago) link

NYC sucks for sure. I lived in Brooklyn for a while 25+ years ago and it sucked then. I’m happy as hell living in Jersey and only going into NYC once or twice a month (tonight being one of those times).

grawlix (unperson), Saturday, 13 April 2019 01:59 (six months ago) link

Yerac I am literally 3-4 months from running out of money, at which point I will either move into my friend's basement, start living on credit, or go to my sister's in CT.

a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Saturday, 13 April 2019 02:09 (six months ago) link

yeah but is it a new kind of suck, it the old, classic hectic/stressful/loud/lonely kind of suck. did it suck less, say, in the 90s?

Nick Chiveon (rip van wanko), Saturday, 13 April 2019 02:10 (six months ago) link

(first 'it' should be 'or', sorry)

Nick Chiveon (rip van wanko), Saturday, 13 April 2019 02:10 (six months ago) link

Some things were bad in the '90s, but you could live here alone if you weren't an investment banker.

The primary new drawbacks (aside from nearly every bar/institution/eatery I liked in 1995 being gone) are the deterioration of mass transit and millions of phone-staring morons impeding my walking.

The cinema choices are better than ever, however.

a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Saturday, 13 April 2019 02:14 (six months ago) link

don't live on credit. It will will be even more impossible after. Take the kindness of friends or your sister.

Yerac, Saturday, 13 April 2019 02:20 (six months ago) link

xpost i just found after the fact that enid's closed. I didn't completely love it but now it makes sense why people have been talking about that camel for the last couple of weeks.

Yerac, Saturday, 13 April 2019 02:21 (six months ago) link

The phone staring morons are everywhere.

Yerac, Saturday, 13 April 2019 02:21 (six months ago) link

but it matters more when the byways are mobbed.

I would die of boredom in CT inside a year.

a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Saturday, 13 April 2019 02:25 (six months ago) link

i remember elvis telecom, some years ago, remarking on how there was less jaywalking in nyc than he'd remembered. but it was Because of the Phones

mookieproof, Saturday, 13 April 2019 02:27 (six months ago) link

I’m happy as hell living in Jersey

Hahahaha

calstars, Saturday, 13 April 2019 02:53 (six months ago) link

xpost Nothing is permanent. Live in CT for 3 months, 6 months, 2 years. Regroup, get well. It will be a blip after it's over.

Yerac, Saturday, 13 April 2019 03:10 (six months ago) link

it's hard for me to square my concern for morbs with my desire for him to learn how to drive

mookieproof, Saturday, 13 April 2019 03:13 (six months ago) link

Full disclosure: i was lookin to leave this year but i started seeing someone who is incredible. That’s the only reason I’m sticking around for now.

Maybe if I took a job in a less trend-driven industry i wouldn’t feel as aggressively “in new york” as i do now and i could kinda relax about it. There is a sense in which nyc feels like the center of the action, and some people really thrive on that, but i haaaaaaaaaaate that aspect. I just want to be.

Trϵϵship, Saturday, 13 April 2019 03:29 (six months ago) link

However, the universe conspired to bring me here, as it didnyears ago to bring me to ilx, and i’ve met amazing people in nyc and learned a lot of (sometimes painful) lessons and maybe i should just trust

Trϵϵship, Saturday, 13 April 2019 03:33 (six months ago) link

morbs' birthday is coming up

let us fap

mookieproof, Saturday, 13 April 2019 03:45 (six months ago) link

it's a lose-lose

I have been maladapted to New England for 14 years now, I still feel most at home and most comfortable in nyc and try to get down as often as possible, as I will next weekend, but I know I could probably no longer endure the kind of loneliness-in-a-crowd that it can impose when living there

d'ILM for Murder (Hadrian VIII), Saturday, 13 April 2019 03:47 (six months ago) link

how there was less jaywalking in nyc than he'd remembered. but it was Because of the Phones

I wish they'd keep jaywalking, it would cull the herd.

mook if I learned to drive someone would die really quickly.

a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Saturday, 13 April 2019 06:21 (six months ago) link

my birthday falls on Easter Sunday this year, and it's amazing how many of my heathen NY friends are leaving town to eat ham or whatever

a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Saturday, 13 April 2019 06:32 (six months ago) link

i lived in indiana for a decade, depression is much deadlier than boredom

i can also personally attest that it's possible to be a very bad driver for a very long time and not kill anybody

it's been a long time since i've been to nyc, but i've felt that loneliness-in-a-crowd thing everywhere i've lived!

Jaki Liebowitz (rushomancy), Saturday, 13 April 2019 10:19 (six months ago) link

Morbs I had forgotten this! Me

Me too! 4/21

d'ILM for Murder (Hadrian VIII), Saturday, 13 April 2019 10:36 (six months ago) link

i will put in a vote for non-hipster brooklyn. i get the cemetery and prospect park and some old neighborhood shit and no bars. it's nice.
morbs, you share a birthday with bridget everett!
i would do an ilx hang; it's been a very long time.

Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Saturday, 13 April 2019 14:49 (six months ago) link

three months pass...

glad i lost my hair or i might've been pulled in for questioning

a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Friday, 19 July 2019 14:25 (two months ago) link


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