"The August 2020 US Politics Thread is highly thought of, but nobody likes me. It can only be my personality. That's all."

It is sort of curious.

A senior Department of Homeland Security official whose office compiled “intelligence reports” about journalists and protesters in Portland, Ore., has been removed from his job, according to three people familiar with the matter.

Brian Murphy, the acting undersecretary for intelligence and analysis, was reassigned to a new position elsewhere in the department, the people said, speaking on condition of anonymity to discuss a personnel matter.

Murphy’s removal follows revelations in The Washington Post that the Intelligence & Analysis Office (I & A) at DHS compiled Open Source Intelligence Reports about the work of two journalists who had published leaked department documents. In a separate intelligence report, the office also analyzed the communications of protesters in Portland.

The acting secretary of homeland security, Chad Wolf, ordered I & A to stop collecting information on journalists after The Post article was published on Thursday.

"You're going to have to take the fall for this, Brian, but I want you to know you've done great work and your country thanks you."

"they don't call me Chad Lamb, y'know"

he’s been reassigned to the kidnapping department, which was his true calling anyway

Good morning!

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/hamedaleaziz/trump-administration-asylum-application-fees

The US now joins the ranks of Iran, Fiji, and Australia in charging a fee. In the US, asylum-seekers will be charged $50 on asylum applications starting in October.

$50 Asylum for August Thread Title.

the tiktok thing seems like it's going to end up like that time he tried to ban vaping while obviously not knowing what it was, and that it was incredibly popular.

ha yeah could be! annoyingly it is also one of those times where he inadvertently raises a complicated issue that is worth paying attention to (data sovereignty & the nat sec implications of tech infrastructure geography) but does so like a cartoon fascist

He's gonna accidentally ban Ke$ha.

shame he doesn't have Guru to warn him against banning lemonade

Monetary policy is complicated! Converting back to the gold standard would have a ripple effect not only on Ke$ha, but also on 50 Cent, who might have to change his name to 47.9 Cent.

annoyingly it is also one of those times where he inadvertently raises a complicated issue that is worth paying attention to (data sovereignty & the nat sec implications of tech infrastructure geography) but does so like a cartoon fascist

Said this to someone earlier - TikTok is almost uniquely predatory in terms of the amount and breadth of data it harvests from its users, so it is definitely a Bad Thing that should be destroyed, but that doesn't mean that this dumb fuck a) knows that b) is shitting out this particular combination of words for that reason. Plus, he's gonna be distracted by something else and forget all about this anyway (or be told that he can't actually do it). So whatever.

Exactly. Wait until he hears about Amazon Web Services lol

i don't see why it should be banned when selling to microsoft is an option, other than friend of the administration mark zuckerburg does not wish it so.

Journalists will not be permitted to attend/cover the Republican convention.

"Trump has had a sometimes-contentious relationship with journalists"

lol

True inasmuch as, however much he treats them like shit, he'd literally shrivel up and die if the media ever stopped hungrily gleaming his cube.

the media created him in the '80s

out of mud and vonnegut's universal symbol for asshole

If Trump is nominated and no one is there to hear it, does it make a sound?

Perhaps Donald Trump doesn’t like the Postal Service because it delivers.

— Dan Rather (@DanRather) August 2, 2020

that's the frequency

my man

https://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2020/08/blaming-congress-for-failing-to-pass-a-covid-relief-bill-is-carrying-mitch-mcconnells-water

An accurate report of what’s happening is that a lot of people have just lost a lifeline because Senate Republicans refused to act or even do more than pro forma negotiation. That’s what happened. You don’t have to express your judgment about which side is right, but it’s a serious disservice to your readers to generically blame “Congress.” If a majority of your readers will infer from a straightforward description of what’s going on that Republicans are nihilistic monsters who refused to help suffering people even when it’s in their political self-interest to do so, that’s not your problem.

One of the biggest problems with high-veto-point systems is that they dilute accountability. But that doesn’t mean people whose job is informing the public should make things worse.

https://findsomethingnew.org/
this is a response?

Biden gets the crucial Bob Avakian endorsement
https://revcom.us/index.html

another deaccelerationist joins the united front

President Trump slams Dr. Birx as “pathetic” for offering public health guidance that went against the official line on Covid. https://t.co/qdz9isCoQ4

— Vivian Salama (@vmsalama) August 3, 2020

I like the idea of "Dr." being a nickname insult akin to his others. Sleepy Joe! Crazy Nancy! Dr. Brix!

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4e/Brix_Smith.jpg

I always read 'Birx' as 'Brix', and I'm not really into The Fall.

Heh, I don't think I've ever noticed it's Birx and not Brix.

wait'll you take a closer look at Senator Berenstain

it bears inspection

Dying at Sen. Berenstain, kudos.

ok, it seems clear to me he's calling Pelosi and her criticisms pathetic, not Birx.

So they found a spine at last:

Democrats are warning Republicans not to fill a possible Supreme Court vacancy this year after denying President Barack Obama the chance in 2016, saying it would embolden a push on the left to add seats to the court whenever they regain power.

"We knew basically they were lying in 2016, when they said, 'Oh, we can't do this because it's an election year.' We knew they didn't want to do it because it was President Obama," Sen. Tim Kaine, D-Va., said in an interview.

Kaine, the party's last vice presidential nominee and a lawmaker with a reputation as an institutionalist, said confirming a nominee of President Donald Trump this year could compel Democrats to consider adding seats to the high court.

"If they show that they're unwilling to respect precedent, rules and history, then they can't feign surprise when others talk about using a statutory option that we have that's fully constitutional in our availability," he said. "I don't want to do that. But if they act in such a way, they may push it to an inevitability. So they need to be careful about that."

The draft language, reviewed by NBC News and expected to be approved later this month, denounces Republicans as having "packed our federal courts with unqualified, partisan judges who consistently rule for corporations, the wealthy, and Republican interests" and for "blocking a Democratic president from appointing a justice to the Supreme Court."

Sen. Mazie Hirono, D-Hawaii, said she has been "talking with people who have different ideas about what we can do — including adding to the court, including having certain circuit court judges cycle in and other ideas" like term limits.

"I'm open to those kinds of suggestions," she said.

47 SCOTUS Justices, 41 of them Democrat.

a theoretical spine, in the distant future

The real point is that it's Tim Goddamn Kaine raising it.

He don't lie, he don't lie, he don't lie . . . Tim Kaine.

Kaine, raising?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/republicans-race-to-promote-mail-voting-as-trumps-attacks-discourage-his-own-supporters-from-embracing-the-practice/2020/08/03/9dd1d988-d1d9-11ea-9038-af089b63ac21_story.html

One recent Facebook sponsored post from the Johnston County, N.C., Republican Party exhorted voters not to dismiss a GOP mail piece coming their way: “ATTENTION!!! If you receive an ABSENTEE BALLOT MAILER like shown in this picture, please know that it is legitimate!!!”

“Please don’t confuse North Carolina’s absentee system with other states’ all-mail elections,” read the message from party chairman. “NCGOP and JoCo GOP agrees with the President that our current absentee ballot request system is safe and secure.”

The assurance was met with skepticism from many commenters. “Burned it! I will go in person to vote straight Republican,” wrote one.

I'm not sure why they couldn't see that coming from a mile away

He don't lie, he don't lie, he don't lie . . . Tim Kaine.

Straight guffaw from me over here on that one, kudos

Same, LOL.

Hurray for sternly worded letters and all but it's not like Democrats could stop them if the Senate GOP collectively decides that a 6-3 majority for a generation is worth going nuclear.

But would Biden and 53 Dem Senators add 4 new judges for a 7-6 majority

Could any president just decide on their own to do that?

A president and a Dem Senate majority could.

FDR tried and would've succeeded had not his own party turned on him.

Joe Biden and Joe Manchin aren't packing the court.

oh cool, well conversation settled then.

yup, thank god for killfile

http://youtu.be/zaaTZkqsaxY

^ that's a link to the video of axioss/jonathan swan interviewing trump, about 40 minutes long

honestly, it's essential viewing. if you showed a clip of this, say, minutes 12-16 or so, where they talk about the coronavirus stats, to someone in 2016, they would not believe you. it's like sci-fi

lol, the section at 23:00 on about mail-in voting is so hard to watch. it's the worst thanksgiving dinner wine conversation ever

I watched the entire thing in a state of constant tension.

what a babbling fucking idiot

I feel like I should watch this, but would probably regret it if I did

I was listening to a podcast today that used clips of Bush speaking around the 2004 election and they both give me a brain-breaking feeling. I understand how they appeal to 35-50% of the population but I can't grasp that it's real.

I have no words for that shit show

it feels like what would make this a better world is a continuous trickle of unedited interviews with the babbling fucking idiot to clarify that he is a babbling fucking idiot

But do his fans ever even see this stuff?

jeeeeeeeeezus, i just finished

is this real life? wtf

honestly it was like watching an out of touch old man get intensely and continuously burned by a 10-year-old

For the 40% left in his camp, having their noses rubbed in it/him will just make them more defensive and dedicated to him.

sucks for them

oh man i got to the part where he asked if he thought he was doing better than LBJ and it's clear that he has no idea what LBJ's politics are

his answer to "is john lewis impressive?" was "nobody's done more for black people than i have"!
his answer to "is john lewis impressive?" was "nobody's done more for black people than i have"!
his answer to "is john lewis impressive?" was "nobody's done more for black people than i have"!
his answer to "is john lewis impressive?" was "nobody's done more for black people than i have"!
his answer to "is john lewis impressive?" was "nobody's done more for black people than i have"!
his answer to "is john lewis impressive?" was "nobody's done more for black people than i have"!

Yeah, the ending is just brutal

Watching all of that without any skipping around felt brutal. I knew how stupid and hateful he was, I’ve always known, but watching him be stupid and hateful on video is so much worse. I’ve avoided his blathering for years but had to rubberneck at that one.

Lol brutal on brutal. The whole thing is brutal! There’s not a single topic he doesn’t make you feel like shit about, especially if you know people who believe in his dumbass takes

.@jonathanvswan: "How do you think history will remember John Lewis?"

President Trump to #AxiosOnHBO: "I don't know...I don't know John Lewis. He chose not to come to my inauguration." pic.twitter.com/LDv76rrIFc

— Axios (@axios) August 4, 2020

Wonder how QAnon is taking the bit about Ghislane

They mostly didn't melt down when he wished her well last week. It's all part of the 12D chess.

The way I feel after watching all of that is beyond any words I can muster. Saying that I’d do anything to stop his re-election is just trivia.

I’m just going to watch more youtube videos about cooking until I pass out. Otherwise I’d probably end up dead or in jail, and that’s no good, my daughter needs me.

I’m an angry person by default but that interview made me something else that doesn’t have a description

ppl, practice self-care

you too El T

Lord help us.
Yeah, this video is essential, in a way, to watch this clusterfuck of history as it's happening. "Good" to see it relatively unedited too

Even his sitting in a chair posture is goofy.

Wonder how QAnon is taking the bit about Ghislane

you'd never guess, but there's a way that this all fits into the theory, you see...

honest q: why did he agree to do that interview? he tends to stay in his protection zone of fox, oann, and tbn (lol). swan and axios did a pretty prominent interview with kushner just a few weeks ago that made him look like a total asshole. at least, it appeared that way to me. so why would he agree to do it?

that's not even the first time he's sat down with swan for a 1/1

holy shit this like some horrible black comedy

"i'm looking at the charts, we're lower in so many categories, we're lower than... the world"
"lower than the world?!"

I heard the St Louis lawyer couple got off scott free and even offered a pardon from the state governor.
So glad to see justice is colourblind.

boy, I'd dismissed Swan as milquetoast. I hope he chugged a quart of Wild Turkey before and after the interview.

His dad is Norman Swan, nationally beloved and respected physician-reporter for Aus Broadcasting Corp’s “The Health Report”. There’s no way Swan Jr would countenance a half second of Asshole’s spin and bullshit.

swan concluded he only had three more months to get leaks from trump, decided to cash it in on a golden opportunity to look like a Real Journalist

Swan senior is the hardest working national treasure in the rona times. Sad to hear his son is a prick.

I'm not familiar with the younger Swan's work, but it was slightly refreshing to see someone actually effectively check Trump on some of his bullshit in real time. The refreshment was outweighed by the fact I've been waiting aghast to see this happen since 2016, but Swan was very skilled at throwing out just few enough "that's bullshit"s and a few pretend-but-actually-content-free flatteries to keep the gibbering shitbag talking.

xxp I wonder if he was playing the long game? I guess people can grow and improve, even.

it's wild how trump dismisses rising cases by saying the US does more testing than anyone else - and less than a minute later says that 'deaths per cases' is the relevant statistic to look at. like, you have just said that cases are supposedly inflated due to all the testing the US does. that necessarily implies that your low number of deaths per case is a garbage stat. you can't have it both ways. i know i know, it's like shouting at a cat

But cats walk away after shouting at them.

he really is a master of the ‘i caught a fish this big — no, *this* big’ gesture

tracer that was driving me insane too

don't think I could manage to sit opposite this guy for forty minutes w/o throwing a punch

i know it's been said four hundred million times, but it is absolutely maddening that this asshole's supporters view barack obama as a clumsy, teleprompter-dependent buffoon who ran the country into the ground through his idiocy, venality, and extremist politics.

It is a tremendous blessing that I don’t live anywhere near any MAGAts, yes

Just watching him lumber in, you can practically hear him belch.

Probably farting since he learned that was a "power move" to put his enemy off-balance.

nah farting is not 4D chess, it merely is necessity to sustain forward momentum

it would explain his posture

lol

I imagine he waddles around sheathed in a distinctive cloud of spray tan, KFC gas, and neck smegma.

KFC Famous Bowel®

4DFarty Chess

some of you are really dedicated to poisoning your own thoughts lol

seriously, let's just be grateful none of us will ever know what he smells or feels like

May I yet have the chance to snuggle that misshapen burlap sack filled with a puree of gas station nachos and deviled ham.

I assume he smells like old luggage that has been kept in attic storage for several years.

You fart on your old luggage?

don't judge me for how I deal with personal baggage

Nobody really knows except his proctologist and his proctologist's therapist

I don't know if I can watch that Axios interview. I can't stand his voice and mannerisms for 45 seconds, let alone 45 minutes. And ultimately it will do nothing but grind in what I knew 4 years ago: he's stupid, narcissistic, and dangerously incompetent. And I will just be reminded yet again: his. followers. don't. care.

xpost Well, this took a turn.

Yeah, there's no way I can watch that interview. Even a 20-second clip I come across fills me with rage.

Right. I'm sure it buttresses much of what I already know/suspect but at this point I just DGAF about mashing my face into the horror I've already accepted. All I can hope is it has an effect on anyone who is still UNACCOUNTABLY on the fence at this point.

the fuck

Here’s the clip pic.twitter.com/b4NtCuEa2z

— Brennan Murphy (@brenonade) August 4, 2020

semitic suck-oyahs

I'm sure it buttresses

God can we please stop talking about butt

No.

America was built on butts and White Supremacy.

"a 21 ass salute"

Assmerica the Beautiful

full of booty

How can he mispronounce yosemite but correctly pronounce sequoia?

He doesn’t

or maybe it’s just his trash accent

In the case of mispronouncing 'Yosemite', I think it's just that he's much more familiar with a similarly-spelled term. Like he would probably mistakenly say 'Lewis Grandwizard', that sort of thing.

He says sequoias the way I say sequoias ... ?

The Swan interview is no different than a million interviews he's given in the last 4 years. The thing I find "fascinating" is that 75% of the questions are softballs that any half-way intelligent non-sociopath could just give a pat answer to or deflect, but he is just always in a such a heightened state of anxiety/grievance he can't get out of his own way.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sequoia

There’s a w in it!!

i did not watch the swan interview but it seems like some people found it ... useful? swan is not a good interviewer. if you think he is you are an easy lay. it sounds on this one he reached the low bar US TV news usually fails to reach because it's populated by a bunch of prigs who respect the office of the presidency and walter kronkite.

https://observer.com/2018/10/axios-hbo-jonathan-swan-slammed-trump-interview-baby-citizenship/

https://splinternews.com/jonathan-swan-is-a-bootlicker-1830095400

Jesus Christ, that explosion in Lebanon. I saw the first few tweets that showed the smoke that looked like a huge fire, but then I finally saw the whole clip and I'm sick to my stomach.

As someone pointed out, the fact that it was captured from so many angles implies people saw the smoke/fire first, which seems to rule out a bomb - I think I saw rumors it might have been a fire in a grain elevator? - but it's a very impressive blast.

(Sorry, just saw it has its own thread)

It was a fireworks factory that might have also been located next to some other highly combustible material like flour or nitrates.

1) Florida is fast at counting mail ballots.

2) Florida is filled with seniors.

3) If Trump discourages Republicans from voting absentee there during a pandemic, Biden wins the state, and thus the whole election, ON ELECTION NIGHT.

4) Ergo, the below tweet. https://t.co/Uben7QTbs8

— Brian Beutler (@brianbeutler) August 4, 2020

This tweet will definitely come up in court proceedings if the Trump campaign tries to get ballots in Florida rejected or disqualified after the election this November 😂 https://t.co/ZkGELTW822

— Grace Panetta (@grace_panetta) August 4, 2020

second point in particular (although courts being courts, who knows)

So the plan is to insist mail in votes are a fraud only in states where

Hit submit too quick

where Trump may lose.

Yup, even more transparent about it that I ever imagined.

In that interview, Asshole babbles about some governors handling covid really well, and some states handling it poorly, then teases he is ready to name names of which gov was which. I kinda wish he was called on that just to hear him say the shitty red state governors with the most cases have been great.

Conservative Ammon Bundy arguing for defund the police, and support of BLM

"if you think BLM or Antifa are coming for your freedoms you must be hypnotized by social media codewords or conservative talking points"

Good to see one of the libertarians actually sticking to this line through this

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/08/03/politics/pro-sports-associations-against-gop-stimulus/index.html

A letter signed by the executive directors of the NFL, NBA, NHL Major League Baseball and Major League Soccer players associations has come out against McConnell.

"The introduced language by Senate Republicans, as we understand it, would federalize all COVID-19 work claims and provide employers with an immunity that is so broad that not even egregious behavior would be actionable."

Can you guys recall another instance of players' unions teaming up to deliver a pro-worker message on such a widely applicable issue?

nope. never happened before.

Seriously though! They’re usually kind of..... famously silent on things that might affect, say arena workers

'Never Trump' Republicans team with progressives to convert the president's religious base

A left-leaning group focused on persuading religious Americans to vote out Donald Trump in November has recruited some of the president’s leading Republican agitators to assist them.

On Wednesday, Vote Common Good will launch a new partnership with the Lincoln Project, an anti-Trump GOP group founded by veteran Republican strategists, to mobilize faith voters to reject Trump on Election Day.

The initiative will focus on courting white evangelicals and white Catholics — two demographics Trump won by significant margins in 2016 — who have lost patience with the president’s behavior or been disappointed with his handling of the coronavirus pandemic and the Black Lives Matter protest movement against racism. The efforts will be concentrated in six battleground states — North Carolina, Ohio, Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania and Florida — where multiple polls have shown Trump trailing his Democratic rival, former Vice President Joe Biden.

...

Getting white evangelicals to peel away from Trump — much less to vote for Biden — is no easy feat. The political alliance between white evangelicals and Republican politicians dates back decades and has rarely shown signs of weakness during the president’s first term. Before this spring, the only time Trump’s most prominent conservative Christian supporters had publicly split with the president was over his push to withdraw U.S. troops from Syria.

But recently, segments of Trump’s Catholic and Protestant supporters have been distancing themselves from his response to the Covid-19 crisis. The Lincoln Project and VCG hope to capitalize on that waning confidence, which has extended to Trump’s ability to handle the worsening economic crisis, public health catastrophe and civil unrest.

They’re also hoping to pitch Biden as an attractive religious alternative to Trump. Biden, a Catholic, has portrayed himself as the unity candidate in an intensely fractured political landscape and rarely shies away from discussing his personal faith.

i feel like republican resistance to trump has gained some traction and it's probably going to be enough to make a difference of a percentage point or two.

better chance of converting them to judaism

"Jews for Jesus...and Joe"

The main question for me is where they live.

If Never Trumpers like George Conway or Max Boot or whover live in New York, DC, of California? They will not move the dial at all. Golf clap for your participation but I am not exactly moved to organize a parade.

I want to know about the Never Trumpers of North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Ohio, etc.

Grifters gonna grift.

good luck w getting evangelicals to vote for anybody but a republican as long as abortion remains even a tiny bit legal anywhere

Chris Hayes had a never trumper guest on his Why is This Happening Today which was an interesting talk.

some of the president’s leading Republican agitators

Politico writer starts in on a sentence, gets as far as "leading Republican", and stops short. Casts about for the word that describes the people he's referring to, those prominent Republicans who oppose the president, who mock him, deride him, wish to remove him from office. Wrinkles brow. Sweats. What the hell word is it? Detectors? Retractors? Defectors? Ah fuck it. Writes: "agitators". Thinks: good enough.

Lol

Chris Hayes had a never trumper guest on his Why is This Happening Today which was an interesting talk.

― Stevolende, Tuesday, August 4, 2020 3:43 PM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

Isaac Chotiner got to him too: https://www.newyorker.com/news/q-and-a/why-stuart-stevens-wants-to-defeat-donald-trump

when freedom becomes just too costly

BREAKING: Mississippi Gov. Tate Reeves issues statewide mask mandate.

"I want to see college football. The best way for that to occur is for us all to realize is that wearing a mask, as irritating as that can be & I promise I hate it more than anyone watching, is critical."

— Ashton Pittman (@ashtonpittman) August 4, 2020

"if college football doesn't become a reality, then masks are off the table."

should be "don't"

Mississippi Gov. Tate Reeves knows masks are a hard sell in his state, so he hits Mississippians right where they live, college football. then he throws in some self-pity just to show he's really one of them.

Look, I want to hasten the demise of my elderly and infirm loved ones as much as anyone...but maybe we should start thinking about what's best for the football.

That Chris Hayes pod was pretty good, one part that rang true is how Republicans have basically had nothing to do since Reagan so the “us vs. them” aspect is all they really have left

The reason that Trump flails around so much when asked what he plans to do in a 2nd term is 100% stupidity end ignorance. A good portion of it is just an utter lack of any Republican governing priorities.

That should say *isn't 100%

Posting and drinking...

classic

My specialty

Trump's latest interview vs monty python parrot sketch pic.twitter.com/GKlpNF4ffB

— Darren Dutton (@Darren_Dutton) August 4, 2020

💥An earthquake win for the left's quest to expand its foothold in Congress in Missouri.

Cori Bush, a pastor and Ferguson activist, has ousted 20-year incumbent Rep. Lacy Clay in #MO01 primary. Bush is virtually certain to win in November & join Congress.

— Taniel (@Taniel) August 5, 2020

Missouri!! That’s where Star-Lord is from.

Clay and Clay's father a combined 52 years in office

also MO voted for medicaid expansion you love to see it

Cori Bush is a badass! This is amazing news!

very exciting!

Was pointed out that Kobach losing (again! and again!) in Kansas probably rules out the Dems picking up a seat in that red meat state, but since Kansas wasn't even considered a real possibility that seat would always have been an election bonus had it somehow gone blue.

Last I saw that pos Sheriff Joe was, incredibly, neck and neck to get the nom again in Arizona.

Was pointed out that Kobach losing (again! and again!) in Kansas probably rules out the Dems picking up a seat in that red meat state

on the bright side, this means Peter Thiel spunked a load of cash up the wall for absolutely nothing

At least four people who have been active in Republican politics are linked to Kanye West’s attempt to get on the presidential ballot this year. The connection raises questions about the aims of the entertainer’s effort and whether it is regarded within the G.O.P. as a spoiler campaign that could aid President Trump, even as those close to Mr. West have expressed concerns about his mental health as he enters the political arena.

One operative, Mark Jacoby, is an executive at a company called Let the Voters Decide, which has been collecting signatures for the West campaign in three states. Mr. Jacoby was arrested on voter fraud charges in 2008 while he was doing work for the California Republican Party, and he later pleaded guilty to a misdemeanor.

Mr. Jacoby, in a statement, said his company was nonpartisan and worked for all political parties. “We do not comment on any current clients, but like all Americans, anyone who is qualified to stand for election has the right to run,” he said.

New York Magazine reported Monday evening on the campaign’s links to two other people with partisan ties. One is Gregg Keller, the former executive director of the American Conservative Union, who has been listed as a contact for the campaign in Arkansas. Mr. Keller, who did not respond to a message seeking comment, is a Missouri-based strategist. He was under consideration to be Mr. Trump’s campaign manager in 2015, a role that was ultimately filled by Corey Lewandowski, according to a former campaign official.

Huh.

I think the word is “rat fucking”.

The true secret of NIMH.

No one is going to vote for a Black mentally-ill megalomaniac.

Not with that attitude.

I have little doubt that the Republicans think they can split the vote because Republicans take it as an article of faith that “blacks will always vote for the black guy because they are the real racists”.

A left-wing group that opposed Joe Biden in the primaries is launching a six-figure digital campaign aimed at persuading progressive voters in battleground states, especially Bernie Sanders supporters, to cast a ballot for the former vice president.

But don’t expect it to air rose-colored ads about Biden: RootsAction.org, POLITICO has learned, has recruited some of the biggest critics of Biden within the Democratic Party to make an unvarnished case for why they’re voting for him despite their disagreements.

The group said leftist professor Noam Chomsky, former Sanders surrogate Linda Sarsour, ex-Sanders adviser Winnie Wong, longtime Sanders ally RoseAnn DeMoro, Medicare for All advocate Ady Barkan, Code Pink founder Medea Benjamin and ex-Sanders campaign co-chair Rep. Ro Khanna are among those who have signed onto its “#VoteTrumpOut” initiative.

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/08/05/bernie-sanders-group-boosts-joe-biden-391575
The organization’s kickoff video, which stars Chomsky, paints a picture of a world that is under threat by imminent climate disaster and President Donald Trump.

“Another four years of Trump may literally lead us to the stage where the survival of organized human society is deeply imperiled,” Chomsky said in the spot. “It doesn’t matter how I feel. It doesn’t matter whether you like Biden or not. That's your personal feelings, irrelevant, nobody cares about that. What they care about is what happens to the world. We have to get rid of Trump, keep pressure on Biden, just as Sanders and associates have been doing.”

If Never Trumpers like George Conway or Max Boot or whover live in New York, DC, of California? They will not move the dial at all. Golf clap for your participation but I am not exactly moved to organize a parade.

I want to know about the Never Trumpers of North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Ohio, etc.

The editor of the Bulwark, a main Never Trumper organ, is Charlie Sykes, who has a very long and prominent career in Wisconsin GOP punditry. There is no question that Trump's support is soft in the traditional Republican power centers of the state (e.g. "crucial Waukesha County") and that's who people like Sykes speak to, and for.

The large majority of those Waukesha Republicans are going to pull the lever for Trump but he definitely runs behind "generic Republican" there and that matters.

it is going to be extremely weird when Lincoln Project types shower praise on chomsky but I guess we've been on this trajectory for a while

yea I tried that pitch to several people I know who traditionally vote Republican but really didn't like Trump - "I know you don't like Hillary, I don't really either, but seriously if this guy wins the entire Republican party is going to be a laughingstock and young people will never trust you again"...in the end I think they all voted Trump anyway, but things are different now. like life maybe wasn't great in 2016 but it was at least stable enough where maybe these folks thought "whatever, give him a chance, maybe a dipshit businessman is what this country needs" and now we're in a situation where things are legitimately terrible, like "worst since the Great Depression" bad and what's worse there's really no end in sight, and any illusions that Trump secretly was remotely competent have all been shattered. of course Biden isn't ideal but I think he's got two legitimate upsides - one, he's not Hillary Clinton, none of the attacks on him are really sticking, and two, the progressive wing doesn't really like him either, which I think gives permission for the soft Republicans to vote for him. like the GOP can run as many "Biden is just Bernie + AOC + Ilhan" ads as they want, does a single person legitimately believe that?

i know at least 2 people who do, but yeah, i don't think nearly many as people are fooled by that as the trump team thinks

fwiw I don't think the progressive wing who promised to sit this out after Bernie lost are gonna abstain either, "this country cannot survive 4 more years of Trump" is looking less and less like hyperbole every day

vote or die

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XB90b8xXYIk

...in the end I think they all voted Trump anyway, but things are different now

Some people, you can't just tell them, "Don't touch that, you'll get burned." You gotta just leave the stove on and walk out of the room and come back three and a half years later and point to the cauterized stump from where they've been repeatedly touching the burner and say, "Told you."

"Biden is just Bernie + AOC + Ilhan" ads as they want, does a single person legitimately believe that?

Millions and millions of people believed it about Hillary Clinton and still do; why would they not believe it about Joe Biden?

took 20 years to get them to believe it about Clinton though

also, Biden has a penis

kindly stop reminding me

That detail may change tho

But don’t expect it to air rose-colored ads about Biden: RootsAction.org, POLITICO has learned, has recruited some of the biggest critics of Biden within the Democratic Party to make an unvarnished case for why they’re voting for him despite their disagreements.

I have no idea what kind of impact something like this has, but I think it's a good idea. I was thinking the other day that there needs to be a coherent (if not legally coordinated) campaign between all the anti-Trump 501c4s just hammering and hammering the message that he has been and continues to be a disaster. Biden barely needs to even show up in that campaign, except as the alternative to disaster.

There is a segment of the voting population whose idea of fact-checking is like a dog's idea of confirming if some piece of trash sitting on the ground is edible. They swallow it without thinking much either way and only discover later if it causes a fatal bowel obstruction.

So Rashida Tlaib won her primary 66-34. Can someone explain why so many political journalists spent the last 2-3 months writing "Tlaib In Danger!" stories? It feels like it was because *they* didn't like her, so they refused to believe that the people in her district did.

they need to hammer trump on incompetence, all the empty cabinet positions, gutting the adminstration's ability to respond to a pandemic, then when a pandemic came, not caring about responding effectively, preferring to shift blame

probably a lot of that along with a few ppl who liked / were rooting for her making sure that people didn't get complacent about her chances? xp

I mean, the media is mostly propaganda aimed at upholding a centrist status quo, so that might be part of it. xpost

"the media" is a circle of like 75 people treading water in the middle of a rapidly closing circle of sharks

Fact checking more like fart-checking amirart

Treezy otm

Yeah I mean, the greatest-hits reel of Trump's almost uncountable idiocies and fuck-ups just needs to be on a constant inescapable loop in all the social media feeds.

treeship! that's good!

Nice image, treesh

glad to see the senate is focused on pressing issues today like asking Sally Yates these important questions

Kennedy isn't even pretending to give Sally Yates a chance to answer his questions. He's just blatantly going for the 20-second Hannity soundbite. pic.twitter.com/vVNXh8bBnW

— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) August 5, 2020

it's hard to compare anyone to Hillary given the sheer amount of negative conditioning conservatives have been subjected to

honestly I have no clue how much conservatives "actually believe" anything, so much of it feels performative at this point

they believe that they should have whatever they want all the time with the least resistance possible

Trust me, you want to read the survey email.

bill thinks trump donors are even stupider than brad did and that is really saying something https://t.co/gJ40SWvQSB

— kilgore trout, new tone haver (@KT_So_It_Goes) August 5, 2020

"Kennedy isn't even pretending to give Sally Yates a chance to answer his questions. He's just blatantly going for the 20-second Hannity soundbite."

ime this is the expected behavior in these sorts of hearings

so they're adjusting their copy to reflect the spirit of conspiracy in the QAnon zeitgeist. very cool. xp

in previous election cycles, i remember noticing a significant ramp-up in the pace and volume of news and political gossip, to almost unbearable levels by late september-october. we're not there yet, but it's interesting how (to me) the election is just another enormous gravitational pull, but hardly much more than all the other shit going on. oh, it's probably going to be litigated from election night until inauguration day? cool, add it to the list

i don't think it will be litigated if biden blows him out of the water, only if it's close. i don't think it will be a blowout either, unfortunately. if you read the right-wing press, you'll see that fear and hatred of democrats is higher than its ever been. biden won't be able to present himself as a "normal" alternative to many of these voters.

so yeah, i guess we'll have another supreme court case and a lot of bullshit about "voter fraud"

Those voters are't voting for Ronald Reagan himself, and those voters aren't Lincoln Project types.

maybe, i don't know. it will be interesting to see if biden can make inroads in areas where trump won (which he needs to do). the recent civil unrest is unnerving to a lot of people, and this has been played up A LOT by outlets like fox news, who are saying that the democratic party has been captured by a radical activist wing

whether people are actually buying that line outside of diehard trump supporters, who knows.

Biden already is, but for the most part these are people who reluctantly voted for Trump in 2016 and expressed voter booth remorse in 2018.

none of the MAGAs in my neighborhood -- the ones whose Trump flags unfurled in the last three weeks -- are persuadable. In conversations they'll admit they prefer Biden to Clinton but think he's a senile vessel for AOC, Ghost of Fidel, Pol Pot, and Stalin.

the Mount Rushmore liberals want to see

idk if the civil unrest is really a point in Trump's favor, particularly when it's so clear that much of this is a direct response to Trump himself

pol pot would also be a ghost though

oh stalin too iirc

I think Alfred is saying they’d all be one ghost. Like “sandwich of bacon, lettuce and tomato”

shit forgot my oxford comma

I think that a very large percentage of voters in national elections have always been clueless political simpletons who just vote based on vague ideas of which politicians are "on their side". It is much more noticeable now because in the past the parties limited voters' presidential choices to reasonably competent and experienced candidates. The Republican Party derailed itself by elevating Palin to the ticket in 2008 and barely escaped nominating some complete bozo in 2012. In 2016 they finally imploded. Here we are.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wf9DYeePLJY

that's why the right wing press is doubling down on the idea that democrats hate republican voters and all they stand for.

they're leaning hard into the culture war.

they're leaning hard into the culture war.

And polls indicate that it's not working. Like, really not working. At all.

hope so!

none of the MAGAs in my neighborhood -- the ones whose Trump flags unfurled in the last three weeks -- are persuadable.

fixed

Don't correct a corrector.

Maybe you just need to offer them an alternate method of committing slow and spiteful suicide.

so many to choose from

why not fast and spiteful

i don't think it will be a blowout either, unfortunately. if you read the right-wing press, you'll see that fear and hatred of democrats is higher than its ever been. biden won't be able to present himself as a "normal" alternative to many of these voters.

I think a blowout if it comes will come from a massive increase in Democratic turnout. Republican fear and hatred of Democrats has been redlined since Obama got elected, increasing it at this point doesn't increase Republican turnout, it actually causes some percentage of them to die of strokes. Biden is the most normal presidential candidate I think is possible. He was VP for eight years, he's an old cishet white guy... it is his privilege to vanish in a way no other candidate could, presenting a minimal target for Republican caricature while being a blank canvas for a wide spectrum of independents and Democrats to happily color in.

Dems are used to being field mice that anytime they hear the phrase Excite Trump's Base they assume the president can command 987 million voters to overwhelm polling stations. I expect his base to remain excited through November and even after his loss.

There are no McGovern/Mondale blowouts anymore. 330-350 EVs is a ‘blowout’ for the foreseeable future.

yeah, a blowout in this sense being all the tossups going to one party

Yep. Obama's 2008 electoral vote total is the closest we'll see in our lifetimes. The parties have settled: we have no liberal Republicans or conservative Dems

I want Biden to win all 50 states. I know he won't come close. But god it all needs repudiating with extreme prejudice. The racism, the rape apologies, the petty small-minded greed.

that's why the right wing press is doubling down on the idea that democrats hate republican voters and all they stand for.

― treeship., Wednesday, 5 August 2020 19:02 (two hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

In my case - they're right!

no ... conservative Dems

citation needed

citation my ass!

In my case - they're right!

The vast majority of voters on either side in a two-party hegemony are either general-purpose dipshits or people who "don't really think about politics." Tribalism provides an easy excuse to allow themselves to continue to not think about it: there's someone to be opposed to, therefore you are in the right.

A huge amount of Republican voters could easily be swayed by a candidate or party that actually represents their interests, as opposed to poorly but loudly pretending to. The systems of communication are set up to disadvantage anyone attempting to actually reach them.

All of this sucks, but it can be enough to hate everything they vote for, and to feel frustration and pity for them without hating tens of millions of strangers as a lumpenmass.

agreed

A huge amount of Republican voters could easily be swayed by a candidate or party that actually represents their interests

I don't think this is true. For a lot of people, voting as an assertion of identity will in fact outweigh self-interest.

Yep. The GOP has no interests outside eliminating the tax burden from the rich. It's a collection of racists. The racism is the point.

That is the GOP's goal, I agree, which all the 'serious' Republicans understand. Their tactics, on the other hand, are pure culture war. Hence - as you say - the collection of racists, abortion crusaders, etc.

And yes, it helps that so many aspects of the culture war integrate so neatly with eliminating taxes for the rich. It almost adds up to a vision.

an electoral blowout would still be made up of many relatively close races, many hinging on the results of mail-in ballots. i do want it to be a landslide, but i still fear the extended litigation nightmare

yeah one scenario I can see happening is - in person voting is counted on election night, showing several swing states red, then as mail-in ballots get counted, they slowly flip to blue, causing Trump to tweet "all the fake news showed I was WINNING and now I am LOSING....this is fraudulent, cancel the election?" - iirc he did something similar in a recent election but I can't remember which one

that is if mail-in voting favors Dems - I know it usually doesn't, but it probably will this time

All voting is going to favor Dems because we're going to kick their asses from here to Kankakee

not a ton of EC votes in the mid-Atlantic iirc, maybe shoot for "here to Hawaii"

dammit

I'd go with "Old Maui"

fwiw I think f hazel is right - I respectfully suggest that sic is overestimating the power of political messaging to budge people out of tribal allegiance with talk of "representing their interests."

Like, I try to imagine a group of very intelligent, eloquent, and persuasive Republicans showing up at my doorstep and convincing me that I've been wrong all this time, and that my truest interests lie with supporting their party and its candidates.

They show me charts. They cite respectable peer-reviewed journals. At some point, I say, "wow, you're right, the Laffer Curve is correct! Burdensome taxation and excessive regulation DO stifle entrepreneurship and therefore the betterment of humankind, including the plight of the downtrodden. I just never knew! And wow, you're also right about all these pesky culture-war issues that I used to think were important. Now I realize it's just liberal virtue-signaling, and doesn't actually help any people of color. People of color are best aided by economic growth! I realize now that trying to help them through welfare programs is paternalistic and condescending. Thanks, guys!"

This is not gonna happen. Nor is its opposite.

all you can do is imagine those people exist

I get being mad at people who vote dumbly! And I absolutely didn't say most of them could be convinced with better information. But you don't have to hate people who've been conned. My thinking on electoral politics is that I want policies which benefit the greatest possible majority of people, and imo it's helpful to actively hope that said people would have their lives benefited.

Also a big part of my thesis is that those chartwielding Republicans couldn't convince you because you are already thinking correctly.

sorry for party treeshing

lol

sic otm. in any case, that's how i think about these things. people are more their just their political allegiances -- some people don't even think about these things that much and just go along with what their community thinks. and right or wrong, those people aren't in the same moral category, for me, as mitch mcconnell. they're just people.

I heard the tail end of an interview with someone on the radio in a piece about party allegiance to certain policies. I think they were talking about immigration, and specifically DACA, and they had managed to dig up a person who supposedly tends to vote Democratic, but was anti-DACA, and I thought - who the fuck is this person?

People are complicated! I would not be at all shocked by a traditionally Democratic voter who grew up in a Democratic household and has stayed mostly Democrat — because they support public schools, Social Security, maybe even environmental protection — but also thinks "people should come here the right way" and is a little unnerved by seeing signs in Spanish popping up around the community.

There are probably some of them in my neighborhood, which is mostly lower-middle-class and has a lot of retirees and votes like 80 percent Democratic. (Also, that same person may well be on great terms with their new Latino neighbors, of whom there are a lot more now than 20 years ago.)

There was a poll taken just a few weeks ago that showed something like 70% of Trump supporters - not just conservative and Republicans at large, but specifically Trump supporters - support DACA, iirc. If 70% of *Trump supporters" are behind DACA, then a Democrat being against sounds like a pretty serious outlier.

Trump's Bank Was Subpoenaed by N.Y. Prosecutors in Criminal Inquiry

The New York prosecutors who are seeking President Trump’s tax records have also subpoenaed his longtime lender, a sign that their criminal investigation into Mr. Trump’s business practices is more wide-ranging than previously known.

The Manhattan district attorney’s office issued the subpoena last year to Deutsche Bank, which has been Mr. Trump’s primary lender since the late 1990s, seeking financial records that he and his company provided to the bank, according to four people familiar with the inquiry.

The criminal investigation initially appeared to be focused on hush-money payments made in 2016 to two women who have said they had affairs with Mr. Trump.

But in a court filing this week, prosecutors with the district attorney’s office cited “public reports of possibly extensive and protracted criminal conduct at the Trump Organization” and suggested that they were also investigating possible crimes involving bank and insurance fraud.

...

Deutsche Bank complied with the subpoena. Over a period of months last year, it provided Mr. Vance’s office with detailed records, including financial statements and other materials that Mr. Trump had provided to the bank as he sought loans.

Deutsche Bank’s cooperation with Mr. Vance’s office is significant because other investigations that have sought Mr. Trump’s financial records have been stymied by legal challenges from the president and his family.

Last month, the Supreme Court dealt a blow to congressional investigations into the president’s finances when it ordered lower courts to reconsider whether Deutsche Bank and Mazars USA, Mr. Trump’s accounting firm, had to comply with congressional subpoenas seeking his records. The ruling meant that the subpoenas would not be enforced until after the presidential election in November, if at all.

Mr. Vance’s office declined to comment.

August surprise?

👀 https://t.co/rzJzTk8OGw

— Renato Mariotti (@renato_mariotti) August 6, 2020

um

https://www.newsandguts.com/twitter-bans-trump-until-he-deletes-coronavirus-post/

(ftr, this is a thing Twitter does. I'm permabanned on three separate accounts for being brutal to Trumpers, but when you first break their rules, they tell you of your temporary suspension, then they make you go out there and delete the offending post, unlike Facebook who removes it for you. Then your temp ban ends and you can return to your stupid audience).

btw circumventing a ban only requires a new phone number, apparently. google voice must be doing great business amongst trolls.

I thought it was the trash account TeamTrump that was banned

you are apparently correct. meh.

woulda been an 11 hour ban at most anyway

just can't wait for these fuckers to go away forever

They won't.

Maybe Ivanka will join a Tom Cotton #resistance movement in 2028.

Cotton will be making human suits out of people long before that

he is creepy

Hawley is too

Data points.

* U.S. PRESIDENT TRUMP SAYS CORONAVIRUS VACCINE POSSIBLE AROUND NOV. 3, ELECTION DAY@Reuters

— Carl Quintanilla (@carlquintanilla) August 6, 2020

How can voters be sending in Ballots starting, in some cases, one month before the First Presidential Debate. Move the First Debate up. A debate, to me, is a Public Service. Joe Biden and I owe it to the American People!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) August 6, 2020

"I thought it was a good interview," Trump says of @jonathanvswan's interview. "A lot of people liked that interview." He says some people think it was unfair but Swan is a nice guy and he thought it was fair enough. (He does add that some of Swan's numbers were "phony." No.)

— Daniel Dale (@ddale8) August 6, 2020

trump has a secret plan to end the ronnie

Good morning!

Can’t you find common ground with the GOP on doing something for minorities and the disenfranchised? @MadMoneyOnCNBC's @JimCramer asks.

“Perhaps you mistook them for somebody who gives a damn for what you just described?” House Speaker Nancy Pelosi says. https://t.co/RbVuuUTDhx pic.twitter.com/pGOo20SBPR

— CNBC (@CNBC) August 6, 2020

damn

lol

I really enjoy No-Fucks-Left Pelosi

she should use these lack of fucks to light a spark under jerrold nadler's overly-cautious ass

yeah. nadler was not a good person to be in a leadership role, ranking member of the house judiciary committee, these last 2 years.

as predicted, it looks like neo-nazi Steve King's defeat in the primary does ensure a republican victory in IA-4:

CD4: The outlook for this race changed dramatically when long-time Rep. Steve King lost the Republican primary to Randy Feenstra. Democrat J.D. Scholten was hoping to improve on his narrow 3-point loss to the controversial incumbent two years ago, but the current poll results suggest otherwise. Feenstra has a commanding 54% to 34% lead over Scholten among registered voters, with 8% undecided. The Republican’s advantage widens among likely voters in both a high turnout scenario (55% to 34%) and in a low turnout scenario (56% to 33%).

https://www.monmouth.edu/polling-institute/reports/monmouthpoll_IA_080620/

I think I mentioned it in a distant thread but about 4 years ago I stayed at JD Scholten & his then-GF's home (not in Iowa), he was working as a paralegal and baseball coach, he made no mention of joining politics. Super cool dude, incredibly tall and good taste in beer.

My wife just corrected me: it was exactly 4 years ago today, that whole weekend.

thought you wrote "and he tasted of beer."

Wow, I guess I should point out this was not a swinger's weekend, it was for a mutual friends' wedding.

I’ll trade the one seat for Steve King eating shit.

He tasted of Schlitz, his wife's into pits.

The Harris/Markey/Sanders $2k temporary UBI is such a beautiful fantasy to think about.

Is the NY AG presser on anywhere?

BREAKING: NY AG calls to dissolve @NRA and oust Wayne LaPierre, its leader for the last 39 years. In lawsuit filed today, AG accuses LaPierre and top lieutenants of a decades-long pattern of fraud -- and of diverting millions from NRA coffers to line their own pockets.

— Carol Leonnig (@CarolLeonnig) August 6, 2020

culture war! culture war! culture war!

get HYPED

huh, hasn't started yet but embargo for leaks has ended I guess?

https://ag.ny.gov/livestream

NRA just announced today they'd be ploughing millions into supporting Trump in battleground states

check the dn

Ah, this must have been the root of Turmp's "Catholics love the 2nd Amendment" wordbelch yesterday

The chief executive of the National Rifle Association and several top lieutenants engaged in a decades-long pattern of fraud to raid the coffers of the powerful gun rights group for personal gain, according to a lawsuit filed Thursday by the New York attorney general, draining $64 million from the nonprofit in just three years.

it's always a strange feeling, watching powerful people go down for things that seem auxiliary to the main crime they perpetuate on a daily basis (fighting tooth and nail against any regulations against guns for decades).

Crime vs "crime"

Already seeing the "the Republicans are gonna turn this into culture-war victory in November" on Twitter. Personally, I don't think this is gonna be the thing that drags President 40% - President 150,000 Corpses - across the finish line, but I've been wrong before.

Of course they will spin it as "see?!?!?!? they ARE coming to take your guns", but I'm cautiously hopeful that the actual issue being "widespread fraud" will tamp that down a little bit.

haha yeah that's essentially what i just said on an NRA thread. i highly doubt it will make any kind of appreciable difference in the election but still, the timing is maybe less than ideal.

Trump has improved in the polls a bit in recent weeks (that should subside when he screws up whatever he screws up this week). his approval ratings outside of Rasmussen though are hot garbage. they had improved a bit towards end of last week, but the first few that came out this wee were 40 - 56, 40 - 59, et al.

pepole should be falling over themselves getting him to say something awful to use in ads right now. like have a Better Call Saul camera crew ready to edit commercials on the fly

Safari bribes lol.

I mean they accused of stealing their own member’s money and NOT using it to defend 2a rights! But of course they are all too used to being grifted on and openly defend it

Yeah, I don't think most NRA members are going to care about how their money was used, ultimately. It's finally truly sinking into my brain, this notion that these people don't care whether their personal interests are served so long as they're part of a group who's sticking it to the other side.

It's finally truly sinking into my brain, this notion that these people don't care whether their personal interests are served so long as they're part of a group who's sticking it to the other side.

Life as high school football – ad infinitum, until you mercifully expire.

Old Lunch - that's exactly what has been so disheartening about the last three years, learning that there's a not insignificant percentage of the American population for which it's not really about pushing forward their agenda, but just about making sure "the other side" feels awful and terrorized.

Only libcucks think everyone can be a winner.

trump has improved in the polls because he's not been in the news for a couple of weeks. he'll be in the news again.

Love that thing where, the moment some people stop having the direct + visceral experience of shit stench up in their face, they start thinking 'hmm, maybe shit doesn't actually stink after all!'

Old Lunch - that's exactly what has been so disheartening about the last three years, learning that there's a not insignificant percentage of the American population for which it's not really about pushing forward their agenda, but just about making sure "the other side" feels awful and terrorized.

Not only does the American Black experience drill this into you, but also getting bullied; sometimes the two overlap.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/06/politics/mike-dewine-coronavirus/index.html

The announcement came shortly before DeWine, a Republican, was scheduled to meet with President Donald Trump in Cleveland. He currently has no symptoms.

we seriously can't catch a break

Seriously, can we just have one infection announcement come out immediately after the infectee has hacked a lung into Trump's spittle-flecked face?

like, not just a cough, I want to see an infectee blow applesauce all over his face. let's make doubly sure we get him.

The Star Tribune endorsed Ilhan Omar's challenger, jfc

https://thehardtimes.net/blog/we-sat-down-with-trump-because-i-have-the-coronavirus-and-this-is-our-chance/

The Star Tribune endorsed Ilhan Omar's challenger, jfc

Apparently they've done this three times now. Clearly their endorsement isn't carrying the weight they'd like it to.

Fuck the Strib, I sent my overseas ballot with a vote for Ilhan.

lots of serious concerns about Omar but fuck if I'm not voting for her esp with all this out of state money flooding this race

Here's Trump in Ohio claiming that Joe Biden is "against God."

"No religion, no anything, hurt the Bible, hurt God. He's against God," Trump says. 🙃 pic.twitter.com/IwAjgbkEyB

— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) August 6, 2020

he hurt God? that's the coolest thing about joe biden i've ever heard

Please Biden don't hurt Him

There's really no better source on the religious devotion of others than The Beast himself, I find.

He broke God's little heart.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-F3n_G_0O0

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DXj2Zb2V4AYghNf.jpg

Yeah, I don't think most NRA members are going to care about how their money was used, ultimately. It's finally truly sinking into my brain, this notion that these people don't care whether their personal interests are served so long as they're part of a group who's sticking it to the other side.

There is - I guarantee it - not a single NRA member who thinks they haven't gotten their money's worth. Who cares what Wayne LaPierre's suits cost. They've won basically every legal battle for decades, by being completely opposed to any limits whatsoever.

Yr average red-hatted NRA guy is gonna be completely unable to locate any outrage about what happened to his $25 or whatever.

This does seem like weaponized concern-trolling by the NYAG, but I'm still all for it.

You know, my grandpa was a chemistry teacher, and he also was coach of the school's rifle club (it was the 50s and 60s lol), and a card-carrying member of the NRA for a long time. He later started a Veterans for Peace chapter in the small city he moved to after he retired, and he spoke bitterly of how the NRA changed during his lifetime. He was appalled.

I basically only shared that because that's all I think about when I think of the NRA. That and how every time a person buys a firearm in the US, there's a membership form to fill out and mail in to the NRA in the literature one receives. No joke!

You can think this evil fuck for the most part
https://www.thedailybeast.com/the-teen-killer-who-radicalized-the-nra

Thank

That paywall is a suck. I know the basic story but would be interested in reading more.

I hurt my God today
To see if he was real

Thanks, neighbours:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-president-trump-announces-10-per-cent-tariff-on-canadian-aluminum/

No tariffs on Canadian aluminium, though. Add the British empire ‘I’ and beat the tariff.

The Teen Killer Who Radicalized the NRA

wechat and tencent ban jfc

NEW — Trump’s pollster fears that Kanye’s bid might actually hurt Trump. https://t.co/gEXqhofjqm

Via @swin24 and @willsommer

— Sam Stein (@samstein) August 7, 2020

ffs wechat?

(xp)

Trump's pollster is afraid to tell Trump that Trump's bid is actually hurting Trump.

the person I see getting most hurt by Kanye's shenanigans is Kanye.

I thought I was only person here who used Wechat.

Oh no! The NRA lawsuit is gonna win America's Big Strong Boy a second term!

Donald Trump is losing the culture wars

His law-and-order rhetoric isn’t registering with suburban voters. One of his leading evangelical supporters, Jerry Falwell Jr., was just photographed with his zipper down. Immigration isn't provoking the response it did in 2016, and NASCAR has spurned the president.

Even an attempt by a New York Democrat to take down the National Rifle Association — a lawsuit announced Thursday by state Attorney General Letitia James — looks unlikely to juice Trump's reelection hopes.

“America has changed,” said Frank Luntz, the veteran Republican consultant and pollster. “Every person who cares about the NRA is already voting for Trump. Suburban swing voters care about the right to own a gun, but they don't care about the NRA.”

A brawl between the NRA and New York state once would've been turnout gold for a Republican president. And some Republicans and Democrats alike on Thursday suggested that Republicans could use the episode to stoke turnout among Trump's base.

But the NRA is not the institution it was in American politics even four years ago, when it spent heavily to help Trump win election. Beset by financial problems and infighting, public support for the NRA has declined during the Trump era, falling below 50 percent last year for the first time since the 1990s, according to Gallup. At the same time, nearly two-thirds of Americans want stricter gun laws.

...

The culture wars of old, said Paul Maslin, a top Democratic pollster who worked on the presidential campaigns of Jimmy Carter and Howard Dean, seem “miles away from where this election is right now.”

Gun control and other cultural issues, he said, “are always a backdrop and a way for Trump to maintain his base. But again, his base is 42 percent. Where’s the other 5 to 6 percent he needs going to come from?”

icymi the Orange Dunce called Thailand "Thighland"

How did an idiot like you ever get famous? https://t.co/IOur8TKCR5

— Doug Henwood (@DougHenwood) August 7, 2020

the shit he's harping on Biden for right now feels so desperate

ok but if someone is trying to hurt god I think it's fair to call them out

“Thighland,” not “Tai-land,” is how English speakers around the world say it

i will be eternally hateful

HOT FREAKS!

He truly is eternally hateful.

LOL, totally missed mookieproof's post.

Obama seemed to project genuine empathy while ordering the drone bombing of Americans. Politicians, especially good ones, aren't jus' folks.

lol oops -- wrong thread but who cares

lol mookieproof

ffs Dinesh really quadrupling down on Thigh-gate, huh?

i love how in another tweet, someone told him "uhh nobody I know pronounces it like that" and he smugly responded "Do you know anybody who lives in Australia or the UK" and then hundreds of people from Australia and hte UK said "mate we don't say it like that'

Why does anyone willingly engage with someone whose brainpan is filled with air, why, just why

I tweeted at Dinesh a clip of Boris Johnson saying "Thailand" the normal way, and a British dude replied, "God, don't use Boris as any sort of reference point!"

we call it thigh food cos a minute on he lips is a lifetime on the hips.
or not as the case may be.

/“Thighland,” not “Tai-land,” is how English speakers around the world say it/

i will be eternally hateful

i saw "thighland" was trending on twitter and just assumed it was a new ludacris track or something. didn't know it related to trump but alas everything does.

i saw "thighland" was trending on twitter and just assumed it was a new ludacris track or something

irl LOLs

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eMIa7_HwAGQ

i will be eternally hateful

― mookieproof, Friday, August 7, 2020 10:28 AM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

HOT FREAKS!

― blue light or electric light (the table is the table), Friday, August 7, 2020 10:33 AM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

my mind went there instantly as well

Australian cities famously have hundreds of Thai restaurants with punning names like Thigh One On, Thigh Foon, Thigh Pan, To Thigh For, Thigh Riffic, Thighnamite, Thightanic, Thigh Me Up Thigh Me Down, Appethighsing, and EnThighSing.

NEW: Matt Lieberman, a Democratic candidate for Senate in Georgia, wrote a bizarre novel filled with racist tropes in 2018.

The president of the Georgia NAACP says he should drop out of the race.

Story w/ @ClaireEFallon:https://t.co/FScNTFKCav

— Kevin Robillard (@Robillard) August 7, 2020

Here is Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders' John Hancock on @kanyewest's nomination papers. Sanders now apparently resides on Tripoli Ave. in Milwaukee. pic.twitter.com/rot32aqwn8

— Daniel Bice (@DanielBice) August 7, 2020

Mickey apparently moved to Milwaukee (I think?) as well. pic.twitter.com/7ysI3zMVI7

— That Clerk Rachel (@badachie) August 7, 2020

NEW: Matt Lieberman, a Democratic candidate for Senate in Georgia, wrote a bizarre novel filled with racist tropes in 2018.

The president of the Georgia NAACP says he should drop out of the race.

Story w/ @ClaireEFallon:https://t.co/FScNTFKCav
— Kevin Robillard (@Robillard) August 7, 2020

― brooklyn suicide cult (Dr Morbius), Friday, August 7, 2020 11:57 AM (six minutes ago)

In case you're wondering like I was, yes it's Joe's son.

speaking of awesome VP picks

sorry i meant to include that info

when you wrote "Joe" I thought you meant Biden, not another white male person who's 10 times worse.

Meantime, how to bury some Friday news unsuccessfully.

Liberty Univeristy President Jerry Falwell Jr. is taking an indefinite leave of absence starting immediately. pic.twitter.com/7f6oZMCgIj

— Richard Chumney (@RichChumney) August 7, 2020

"We urgently request Jerry Falwell, Jr. contract COVID-19 and die."

On Falwell, I'm having an internal conflict between "enjoy this" and "it won't make a damn bit of difference." Right now "enjoy this" is winning.

"I’m gonna try to be a good boy from here on out" is an A+ apology though

said somewhere else that I actually buy his explanation of the photo (no other explanation makes any sense), but since I hate him, I don't care; someone can go bury him the desert for all I care.

Anyay, stimulus talks collapsed (surprise); earlier the administration was talking about extending the $600/wk unemployment benefit for a few months until things got worked out, but this was rejected by the Dems; if he comes out and does an executive order for that and the direct payment again, any chances this makes the Dems look like assholes for not accepting the offer in the first place? I understand they're holding out for money paid directly to states and local governments.

if he comes out and does an executive order for that and the direct payment again, any chances this makes the Dems look like assholes for not accepting the offer in the first place?

On Fox News, sure.

By all accounts his Bedminster 'press conference' tonight was so bad even Fox cut away, directly to Tucker Carlson talking about Kanye as a man of deep thoughts about how to live a proper life.

Trump can’t write stimulus checks or extend the UI bump by fiat. Spending bills are still firmly out of his grasp.

Did u forget that he is a billionaire

Supposedly they want to loot the FEMA budget for UI money.. right when hurricane season just started

Friday Night Massacre at the US Postal Service, with Trump postmaster general getting rid of 23 USPS executives as a "sweeping overhaul of the nation's mail service." https://t.co/3lbWPJnt1e

— Ken Layne (@KenLayne) August 7, 2020

DeJoy and his wife, Aldona Wos, whom Trump has nominated to become ambassador to Canada, own between $30.1 million and $75.3 million of assets in competitors to the USPS

Is that a conflict of interest and is that enough to have him removed?
& is it too late to correct the mess he has created.

was wondering if there was any way of getting rid of the problem.
BUt has that meant that the election is already a bit screwed.

Who's going to remove him?

Conflict of interest is a positive as far as Trump is concerned.

The goodies who must be about to come riding over the hill, happens in all good westerns dunnit?

I mean one must maintain a belief in the goodness of teh law mustn't one? A lovely fellow like teh Attorney General must see the benefit of justice mustn't he?
& just being a wrecker of civilisation isn't an end in itself is it?
Or does it make a lovely pastime?

You hate to see it etc

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/08/08/trump-antagonizes-sheldon-adelson-phone-call-392688

This is the first thing that actually says to me he might really not want to win.

A direct quote from Maureen Dowd's column in today's New York Times (to which no correction has yet been appended):

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ee52LMiXkAA3JMt.png

I guess it does feel like about 36 years since November 2016...

lol wow

oh, Mo

Is it really so strange...

This description of what “antifa” is... is insane! Mind blowing that the NYT would publish this as facthttps://t.co/YnNZ6P04ax pic.twitter.com/yJgRoJzBc4

— Hamilton Nolan (@hamiltonnolan) August 7, 2020

that article is pretty terrifying though...

When a tall man in a trench coat and hiking boots walked over to question Mr. Khan, the man spread his coat open, revealing several pistols on harnesses around his chest and waist. He presented a badge on a lanyard that read “Black Lives Matter Community Patrol.”

His name is Rick Hearns and he identified himself as a longtime security guard and mover who is now a Black Lives Matter community guard, in charge of several others. Local merchants pay for his protection, he said as he handed out his business card. (Mr. Khan said he and his neighbors are now paying thousands of dollars a month for protection from Iconic Global, a Washington State-based private security contractor.)

Over the past couple of days I have seen references to both Trump asking how hard it would be to add a face to Mount Rushmore, and also Trump wanting to open up the Grand Canyon to mining or something. I have no idea if either of these things are remotely accurate, and that alone shows where we are.

xp yeah, definitely makes CHOP look pretty bad

he's wanted to open GC up to mining for the last 4 years

the uranium lobby (????) wants it iirc

xp yeah, definitely makes CHOP look pretty bad

In a way that walking around it every day didn't. You don't think Rancho Bravo would have done a month's worth of business every week if they'd been open?

^ especially during the riots, pre-CHOP

ok lol

Either @TimKaine and I had a very vivid shared hallucination four years ago or Maureen had too much pot brownie before writing her column again. https://t.co/J3SSwtkg7x

— Hillary Clinton (@HillaryClinton) August 8, 2020

xp I mean, it already looked bad in a lot of ways - but particularly the store owner fighting off robbers, getting no help from the cops, and then blacklisted and harassed by protestors, that's some Fox News bait

either factchecking is cold and decomposed or Dowd is belatedly promoting "HRC is a man" meme

how terrible has the world become when a Clinton tweet is funnier than any Dowd column

So I guess in the original article it was "36 years since a man and woman ran on a ticket together", which prompted the Clinton tweet, and then the NYT changed it to "since a man chose to put a woman on the Democratic ticket with him"

I really hope somebody got fired for that blunder.

Maureen Dowd will keep earning six figures long after continents slide into the sea.

Wasn't the environmental bill that Teddy Roosevelt passed introduced to prevent exploitation of the Grand canyon back in whenever that was 100 odd years ago. I watched Public Trust the new film on public lands last week and i think that was a point made in that.
Overall feelgood film with every subsequent President signing vast areas into protected public land, some grassroots groups having fought for years to protect certain areas and finally getting legislation passed by Obama. Sudden sinking feeling as t comes into power and sets up various industry people to positions controlling departments they've been fighting.
Sounds like some good is happening at the moment so hope that does last.
Heard that the pipeline protest in Dakota thought it had won its recent battle and turned off the flow only to have it appealed and I think turned back on.

Fascists making jokes:

It seems like a rushed editorial process led to the publication of an Op-Ed that did not meet the New York Times's standards. pic.twitter.com/h4JMlUgh3y

— Tom Cotton (@TomCottonAR) August 8, 2020

Dowd is a self-made joke.

President Trump said if he is re-elected, he will look into terminating the payroll tax permanently! No explanation of how he would fund Social Security.

Also, will anyone contest in court the executive order to give out $400 (down from $600) in unemployment benefits via money that the White House is claiming they can shift from unpsent funds

tbf, the op-ed page is a joke

even if dowd were good, you can't expect her to deliver something (apparently without editing) interesting twice a week for 25 years. krugman can at least go wonky if necessary, but the whole edifice is self-perpetuatingly rotten

The thing is, Cotton thinks he's calling out hypocrisy but he's basically right, the same shitty process that led the Times to institutionally think it was required to let him wipe his ass on their page didn't go away is still in place shoveling other shit into our faces regularly

along with other stuff that is good

There is no positive balance to any op-ed page, abolish them all.

Dowd makes Gail Collins read like Molly Ivins

Executive Order and memos

1/ Evictions: No eviction moratorium or new rental $, asks HUD to "consider" if evictions should stop

2/ Unemployment: Uses $44B from FEMA to cover $300/week benefit for ~5 more weeks

3/ Taxes: Option to defer payroll tax payment, but w/o new law they'll still be due

FEMA money during Hurricane Season

I guess we can just Nuke the 'canes then.

IIUC the $300 only happens in states that chip in an extra $100

Triple Matched!

“The pen-and-phone theory of executive lawmaking is unconstitutional slop,” Sasse said in a statement. “President Obama did not have the power to unilaterally rewrite immigration law with DACA, and President Trump does not have the power to unilaterally rewrite the payroll tax law.“

Senate Judiciary Chairman Lindsey Graham (R) offered less harsh comments, saying that while he appreciated the president’s orders, he “would much prefer a congressional agreement.” Sen. Lamar Alexander (R-Tenn.), blamed Democrats for failing to reach an agreement, but indicated he didn’t support the president circumventing Congress.

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/511202-some-gop-lawmakers-express-discomfort-with-trump-executive-orders

President Trump said if he is re-elected, he will look into terminating the payroll tax permanently! No explanation of how he would fund Social Security.

Hey, remember Tulsi Gabbard? Well, you can forget about her.

BREAKING: Kaiali'i Kahele wins Democratic nomination for U.S. House in Hawaii's 2nd congressional district. #APracecall at 7:22 p.m. HST. #Election2020 #HIprimary https://t.co/lGfinkb1KC

— AP Politics (@AP_Politics) August 9, 2020

wow

Well, she wasn't running.

tulsi has already left her old career as a legislator and launched he next career as a media figure. maybe she can join the Home Shopping Network as a presenter.

maybe she can be a proactive spokesperson (ok that was very bad)

why do evangelicals vote for trump, part 10334: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/09/us/evangelicals-trump-christianity.html

typical stuff, but this conversation jumped out at me:

The years of the Obama presidency were confusing to her. She said she heard talk of giving freedoms to gay people and members of minority groups. But to her it felt like her freedoms were being taken away. And that she was turning into the minority.

“I do not love Trump. I think Trump is good for America as a country. I think Trump is going to restore our freedoms, where we spent eight years, if not more, with our freedoms slowly being taken away under the guise of giving freedoms to all,” she said. “Caucasian-Americans are becoming a minority. Rapidly.”

She explained what she meant. “If you are a hard-working Caucasian-American, your rights are being limited because you are seen as against all the races or against women,” she said. “Or there are people who think that because we have conservative values and we value the family and I value submitting to my husband, I must be against women’s rights.”

Her voice grew strong. “I would say it takes a stronger woman to submit to a man than to want to rule over him. And I would argue that point to the death,” she said.

She felt freer as she spoke. “Mike Pence is a wonderful gentleman,” she said. “This is probably a very bad analogy, but I’d say he is like the very supportive, submissive wife to Trump. He does the hard work, and the husband gets the glory.”

There's a photo in that article showing a family, heads bowed in prayer, about to eat. A gallon of milk rests on the table. It's the saddest photo I've ever seen.

I am never leaving the city (I know, I know)

From the start it appeared an impossible contradiction. Evangelicals for years have defined themselves as the values voters, people who prized the Bible and sexual morality — and loving your neighbor as yourself — above all.

Donald Trump was the opposite. He bragged about assaulting women. He got divorced, twice. He built a career off gambling. He cozied up to bigots. He rarely went to church. He refused to ask for forgiveness.

It has to be tough for the author to pretend he's never met an evangelical.

He gestured to his front door. “You don’t lock the doors,” he said. “I never take the keys out of the car.”

Then he patted the stainless steel Smith & Wesson .38 revolver carried in a tooled leather holster at the small of his back - "But you can't be stupid."

I couldn't read that because it wasn't reported from a folksy diner. I have standards.

Caucasian-Americans are becoming a minority.

Well, what's wrong with that? Are minorities treated badly or something?

tfw when you’re so worried that others, elsewhere, might be accorded one teenie tiny bit more respect and dignity than they have historically enjoyed that you find yourself voting for donald trump. hateful creeps. i hope they drown in a vat of black, gay, trans communist jism.

^ underrated Zappa album

Her voice grew strong. “I would say it takes a stronger woman to submit to a man than to want to rule over him. And I would argue that point to the death,” she said.

two options: submit or rule over.

yeah, the dichotomy is sorta telling there isn't it

lol this guy

"TikTok is not just China’s revenge for the century of humiliation between the Opium Wars and Mao’s revolution. It is the opium — a digital fentanyl, to get our kids stoked for the coming Chinese imperium."

— Niall Ferguson (@nfergus) August 9, 2020

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBssFzSx6sI

od'ing on the digital fentanyl that is the first 15 seconds of Lottery

Poor Niall, forced to say crazy bad things just to get noticed on Twitter.

So if TikTok is digital fentanyl, is twitter honest to goodness old fashioned heroine?

heroin makes you feel good

Finally, some serious action from Speaker Pelosi:

August 9, 2020

Dear Democratic Colleague,

On this Sunday morning as we pray for the American people, I wanted to share “A Responsive Prayer for Justice.”

Pray for those who are hungry.

Pray harder for those who will not feed them.

Pray for those who struggle each week to pay their bills.

Pray harder for the wealthy who do not care.

Pray for those who are homeless.

Pray harder for those who deny them shelter.

Pray for the sick and lonely.

Pray harder for those who will not give them comfort.

Pray for those who cry out for dignity.

Pray harder for those who will not listen.

Pray for those oppressed by unjust wages.

Pray harder for those who exploit them.

Pray for those who bear the yoke of prejudice.

Pray harder for those who discriminate against them.

Pray for those whose basic needs are denied.

Pray harder for the public officials who cater to the greedy and ignore those bound unjustly.

Amen.

best regards, (unsigned)

https://giphy.com/gifs/bojackhorseman-3o7aCVYdxJUQmWI0z6

https://media3.giphy.com/media/3o7aCVYdxJUQmWI0z6/giphy.gif

Some good-ass legislatin', right there

Finally, some serious action from Speaker Pelosi:

btw, just a reminder that Speaker Pelosi's powers do not extend far enough to pass whatever legislation she or you might consider necessary for the good of the nation. Gestures like this one are something you may have heard about: propaganda designed to strengthen the political basis for taking "serious action".

Or maybe you haven't heard about this kind of political behavior before now.

I'm familiar with the behaviour of stealing other people's words and pretending that you wrote them, in a completely empty act of ostensible virtue signalling that actually make you look like someone with no appreciation of fairness, sure. (Are... are we going to talk about Shia LeBouef's short films now?)

Anyway, I don't think this made it onto the thread?:

National Security Advisor Robert O’Brien on @FaceTheNation right now, in response to whether Trump has told Putin to stop meddling in US elections: “Unlike my predecessors, I don’t get involved in conversations the President has with foreign leaders.”

No kidding.

— Rudy Mehrbani (@RudyMehrbani) August 9, 2020

The former director of the CIA and NSA in response:

Holy shit. https://t.co/hrYMthaiJP

— Gen Michael Hayden (@GenMhayden) August 9, 2020

xp yeah, definitely makes CHOP look pretty bad

btw today there was an anti-mask / pro-Jesus rally on the CHOP site, with hundreds of ppl gathering without masks and publicly baptising each other, and at least one baby, in a grotty tub. The mayor didn't send in one single cop to break them up, let alone hundreds of cops and National Guard to tear-gas them, though, so it'll probably look pretty... good? when the NYT writes it up.

cripes.

Ann Hathaway is Nancy Pelosi in....

PRAY HARD

That NYT article on Trump evangelicals in Iowa glosses over a key distinction: these aren't evangelicals, they are an incredibly small group of rural Dutch Calvinists. It mentions Dordt College, the site of Trump's 2016 rally being "named for a major church assembly in 1618 and 1619 that declared salvation was only for God’s chosen ones, and expelled from Dutch territory anyone who disagreed", which is the exact opposite of the American Evangelical belief that people can choose their own salvation and be "born again". What difference does that make? It means that the people interviewed in this article believe that they are "God's chosen people" and live their entire lives attempting to demonstrate evidence that they are part of that chosen in-group, lest they be expelled from it. So, when they talk about their religious freedom being impugned, they're really saying that they've always lived in this insular environment where homogeneity = salvation, and the only way they can continue the faith of their fathers is to keep all outsiders out of it. It's telling that their ancestors fled the Netherlands over this same false sense of "persecution", the Dutch government wouldn't let them kick anyone who disagreed with them out of the country, so they came to these rural Iowa towns where they were left alone for 100 years, and now they're confronting the fact that embracing Trump's racism and misogyny is the closest thing they'll get to preserving their "religious heritage" in 2020.

That's a v good point.

I wasn't going to read that article but oh hell yes, Dordt College, I can attest the above is accurate.

That NYT article on Trump evangelicals in Iowa glosses over a key distinction: these aren't evangelicals, they are an incredibly small group of rural Dutch Calvinists. It mentions Dordt College, the site of Trump's 2016 rally being "named for a major church assembly in 1618 and 1619 that declared salvation was only for God’s chosen ones, and expelled from Dutch territory anyone who disagreed", which is the exact opposite of the American Evangelical belief that people can choose their own salvation and be "born again".

i can see some disagreement about whether that congregation technically counts as "american evangelical" or not. i think their current state (bitter resentment and a false sense of overwhelming persecution) is roughly the same, though.

and i'd also argue that for most evangelicals, there is no contradiction between "belief that people can choose their own salvation and be "born again" and declaring that "salvation was only for God’s chosen ones, and expelled from Dutch territory anyone who disagreed". the way they unify the two is like this: people can choose their own salvation, but god has already chosen who will receive. and on immigration, contemporary god is an angry righteous old testament god who chooses to bless or curse entire nations of evil nonbelievers. get born again or leave.

or...something like that. of course it's a hopeless jumble of contradicting ideas, but that's evangelicalism ime, and if the dordt college people ever feel too over-oppressed, they'd fit right in with thousands of other communities and churches that are virtually indistinguishable from them

Also, something that only a former Iowan Dutch Calvinist would likely recognize about that photo of the family praying at the dinner table: all three kids have forks in their food already during the prayer, revealing that they probably started to eat before the parents sat down to pray, which never would've happened when their parents were that age. Just a small detail, but I can tell you, having grown up in it (my sister actually went to Dordt College), those are the kind of things that Iowan Dutch Calvinists obsess about - you had to pray and read the bible at every meal and the church elders would come to your house for "visitation" to observe that your family accurately demonstrated that you were in fact, still part of God's chosen in group. Even this family is not managing to keep the outside world at bay, their kids aren't stopping to pray before touching their dinner. Re-electing Trump is not going to help them with that, and soon enough this tiny, insignificant demographic of Trump voter would go away on its own.

Oh god I clicked on it, and the article just clowns itself and its subjects over and over.

“I guess the biggest concern for me is trying to keep our country the way it was. Conservative. The values. For us, I mean, this is as good as it gets. We can do whatever we want,” said Mr. Driesen

They want the Christian education for their children “so we don’t have to have them indoctrinated with all these different things,” he said. “We are free to teach them our values.”

She worried that the school might be forced to let in students who were not Christian, or hire teachers who were gay.

“People in my circles, you don’t really hear about racism, so I guess I don’t know too much about it,” Mr. Driesen said of the protests.

I don't think either the CRC or the RCA are evangelical denominations, that is, I don't think they're committed either doctrinally or habitually to spreading awareness of salvation by conversion. They would probably be offended to be compared to Baptists, for example.

yeah baptists are total heretics! you think YOU can choose whether to be in god's elect?? pah!

calvinism has this real crazy edge of anxiety and paranoia to it. how will i know if i'm in the elect?? i mean, i can't, but surely someone in the elect would behave in a certain way.. so let's look for those outward signs.. in others... in myself... AAAGGGGHHH

and i'd also argue that for most evangelicals, there is no contradiction between "belief that people can choose their own salvation and be "born again" and declaring that "salvation was only for God’s chosen ones, and expelled from Dutch territory anyone who disagreed". the way they unify the two is like this: people can choose their own salvation, but god has already chosen who will receive. and on immigration, contemporary god is an angry righteous old testament god who chooses to bless or curse entire nations of evil nonbelievers. get born again or leave.

Uh I think most evangelicals, particularly liberal ones, would loudly call bullshit on the idea that God would willingly exclude anyone who chose salvation.

Yeah but the point is these are Calvinists not evangelicals

Yes, and Karl's arguing that there isn't a difference between them.

Wait nevermind

Yeah i agree with you. Evangelicals evangelize—spreading the faith and saving souls is as important or more than personal virtue, the sole concern of the predestination folks

I attended a CRC church for several years (but that was 20 years ago, I married rather than was born into it, etc). The denomination reiterated repeatedly that it is an evangelical denomination, the church does mission work at a denominational level, etc. That's in obvious tension with its ethnocentrism, and this ethnocentrism will be the death of the denomination in a few years (my f-i-l is longtime C@lv1n faculty and has commented on declining enrollment, particularly of their "traditional" student, for many years).

Yeah, I've seen plenty of commentary over the past few years that these sorts are fighting for their way of life because their way of life is literally dying out.

My favorite part of the article is the mom talking about how she likes living in a bubble where she doesn't have to worry about her kids going outside to play with the neighbor kids, even though they go to another church, and then catches herself, "I don't know, maybe that's naive." - Yes, you absolutely need to be more concerned about your kids mixing it up with kids from other denominations, they might put dangerous ideas in their heads like it's okay to browse the Internet on Sundays.

Uh I think most evangelicals, particularly liberal ones, would loudly call bullshit on the idea that God would willingly exclude anyone who chose salvation.

― shout-out to his family (DJP), Monday, August 10, 2020 10:23 AM (thirty-two minutes ago)bookmarkflaglink

Yeah but the point is these are Calvinists not evangelicals

― treeship., Monday, August 10, 2020 10:27 AM (twenty-nine minutes ago)bookmarkflaglink

Yes, and Karl's arguing that there isn't a difference between them.

― shout-out to his family (DJP), Monday, August 10, 2020 10:29 AM (twenty-seven minutes ago)

i'm not arguing there isn't a difference between them. i'm arguing that to the outsider observer, in terms of actions and political beliefs, there is little to distinguish between the Dordt College crowd and white evangelicals.

i must admit i have never seen the words "liberal" and "evangelical" side-by-side, so i guess that speaks to my lack of perspective, for real. (i have to admit i googled it and found 18,500 results, heh). and not for the first time, i've said "evangelicals" when I really meant "white evangelicals". the overwhelming majority of white evangelicals i've known have been very conservative (and many are homophobic white nationalists to boot).