Orson Welles

Message Bookmarked
Bookmark Removed
Not all messages are displayed: show all messages (795 of them)
thomson says of "chimes": "the film - like so many things welles did - is monstrous, arbitrary, like a child's tantrum, so immature and yet so passionate, mistaken and yet radiant." sounds like a dismissal, or at least a complete misunderstanding, to me - even "passionate" seems like the wrong word, since "chimes" is so restrained a film.

harold bloom's thinly disguised self-worship aside, jack falstaff is a con man AND a buffoon! i personally find the performance very moving, much moreso than almost any other welles ever gave - the long close-up of his face after hal banishes him is just a beautiful piece of acting.

J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Saturday, 16 July 2005 00:20 (eighteen years ago) link

thomson says of "chimes": "the film - like so many things welles did - is monstrous, arbitrary, like a child's tantrum, so immature and yet so passionate, mistaken and yet radiant." sounds like a dismissal, or at least a complete misunderstanding, to me - even "passionate" seems like the wrong word, since "chimes" is so restrained a film.

To me, that's the most generous kind of praise: you dismiss a film's flaws, but love its pluses. Do you want more two-dimensional appraisals?

As for "If I wasn't very rich..." the scene in which it's found is just pompous and lacking nuance. Kane sits there, intones, and allows the line to sink in; there's no irony intended. It's clear Welles (or Mankiewicz) was crafting a moment of pseudo-profundity, and, to their credit, one of the few in a movie that's far from the shallow masterpiece Kael declared it to be (how's that for nuanced praise?)

Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Saturday, 16 July 2005 01:21 (eighteen years ago) link

A friend of mine recently saw it for the first time, and declared it: “Cinema, Cinema, Cinema!”

haha what kind of asshole?

She's built like a steakhouse, but she handles like a bistro! (Adrian Langston), Saturday, 16 July 2005 02:56 (eighteen years ago) link

an asshole who can not contain their enthusiasm. in other words, not an asshole.

Eric H. (Eric H.), Saturday, 16 July 2005 03:20 (eighteen years ago) link

Elaine: Did you read the whole thing?

Kramer: Oh! yeah.

Elaine: Huh . So What's it about?

Kramer: Well it's a story about love, deception, greed, lust and...unbridled enthusiasm.

Elaine: unbridled enthusiasm...?

Kramer: Well , that's what led to Billy Mumphrey's downfall.

Elaine: Oh! boy.

Kramer: You see Elaine, Billy was a simple country boy. You might say a cockeyed optimist,

who got himself mixed up in the high stakes game of world diplomacy and international intrigue.

Elaine: Oh! my God.

She's built like a steakhouse, but she handles like a bistro! (Adrian Langston), Saturday, 16 July 2005 06:57 (eighteen years ago) link

three months pass...
anyone going to this?
http://www.monkeytownhq.com/october_tuesdays.html#fake

October 18

F is For Fake vs. Dial M for Murder
Orson and Alfred by alphabet.

Audio will alternate with each seating
4:00pm Dial M for Murder audio
6:00pm F is For Fake audio
8:00pm Dial M for Murder audio
10:00pm F is For Fake audio

We're not sure if there are any synergies besides their alphabetic titles, but seeing Orson's last great masterpiece next to Alfred's waltz with Grace Kelly should reveal something, right?

Orson Welles' F is For Fake (1974) deserves the same level of praise as Citizen Kane and Touch of Evil. This past year, Criterion Collection released it on DVD. Alfred Hitchcock's Dial M for Murder (1954) is a murder-melodrama wrapped in Hitchcock's formalist, baroque aesthetic.

waxyjax (waxyjax), Monday, 17 October 2005 21:10 (eighteen years ago) link

Was talking to someone at a party last weekend who studied under Barbara Leaming back in the '80s. Said the only thing Leaming would allow to interrupt her class was a phone call from Welles, which she would take privately but would then tell the class about if it was particularly kooky. He supposedly had watched Sixteen Candles once and called her right after to get her opinion on it.

Jay Vee (Manon_70), Monday, 17 October 2005 21:52 (eighteen years ago) link

I want to know Welles' opinion of it.

tokyo nursery school: afternoon session (rosemary), Monday, 17 October 2005 21:55 (eighteen years ago) link

one month passes...
As part of its annual 'Spanish Cinema Now' fest, Lincoln Center is showing several Don Quixote-related films, including a '92 reconstruction of Welles' (whose degree of 'authenticity' is fiercely debated -- still better than nothing). I saw a few minutes of raw footage at Film Forum's OW fest -- anyone seen this assemblage?

http://www.filmlinc.com/wrt/showing/spanish05.htm

Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Monday, 5 December 2005 15:56 (eighteen years ago) link

I've heard really awful things about the Jess Franco version that's showing. I'm still seeing it, though, and I'm pretty excited.

C0L1N B... (C0L1N B...), Tuesday, 6 December 2005 00:25 (eighteen years ago) link

Sounds promising... "Some may quibble with the postmodernist quirks—Quixote runs into Welles at a film shoot and thinks he's Satan..."

http://www.villagevoice.com/film/0549,morales,70712,20.html

Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 7 December 2005 22:20 (eighteen years ago) link

two weeks pass...
Did you end up going tonight, Morbius?

I saw it and found it really frustrating. I'm not sure how many of those "postmodernist quirks" were Welles' and how many were invented by Franco using the In the Land of Don Quixote footage.

The dubbed voices were really terrible--especially in light of Welles' hyper-attention to the way actors sounded. I couldn't tell how many of the jokes were just flat and how many suffered due to the hammy dubbing.

I'm not sure why the footage looked so awful--if Welles used bad stock, or if it wasn't preserved well or if Franco did that to normalize the look of the film, but I felt like I was watching a movie on an Apple II.

I mean, I'm still glad I saw it and these are just my first impressions, but it certainly wasn't a particularly enjoyable film going experience.

C0L1N B... (C0L1N B...), Friday, 23 December 2005 02:25 (eighteen years ago) link

I did! 70 extra walking blocks too... I'd seen 5 minutes of footage before, and generally got what I expected: a must-see curio. It's hard to evaluate in the condition it's in, tho the 'Sancho in '60s Spain' section went on too long. I hafta think the p-m touches were Welles (under the infl of Bunuel etc).

Either the footage had deteriorated, or OW was delusional that hewas making something releasable.

Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Friday, 23 December 2005 14:13 (eighteen years ago) link

two months pass...
i rented f for fake a couple of nights back and it's pretty astonishing. one of the more inventive films i've seen in terms of tone and editing, with welles at both his most playful and his most profound. i especially love this:

"Ours, the scientists keep telling us, is a universe which is disposable. You know it might be just this one anonymous glory of all things, this rich stone forest, this epic chant, this gaiety, this grand choiring shout of affirmation, which we choose when all our cities are dust; to stand intact, to mark where we have been, to testify to what we had it in us to accomplish. Our works in stone, in paint, in print are spared, some of them for a few decades, or a millenium or two, but everything must fall in war or wear away into the ultimate and universal ash: the triumphs and the frauds, the treasures and the fakes. A fact of life... we're going to die. 'Be of good heart,' cry the dead artists out of the living past. Our songs will all be silenced - but what of it? Go on singing. Maybe a man's name doesn't matter all that much."

gear (gear), Sunday, 12 March 2006 21:02 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah, I need to get this, thanks for the reminder. My pay raise can't come soon enough! Finally start splurging a bit.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 12 March 2006 21:06 (eighteen years ago) link

The Criterion edition is a marvel. Ned, you will not be disappointed.

Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Sunday, 12 March 2006 21:28 (eighteen years ago) link

I should hope not, or I would hunt and slay. (Exactly who I would target would be a slight mystery, true.)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 12 March 2006 21:30 (eighteen years ago) link

Cheers gear. Now I'm crying again.

I'm thinking six, six, six (noodle vague), Sunday, 12 March 2006 21:36 (eighteen years ago) link

I still need to know Wells' take on "Sixteen Candles." And oh will nobody give it up for The Stranger, maybe my sentimental favorite of Welles' works?

Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Sunday, 12 March 2006 22:28 (eighteen years ago) link

Second on the Criterion edition. The (rejected) trailer for the film is something to behold.

phil d. (Phil D.), Sunday, 12 March 2006 22:48 (eighteen years ago) link

And oh will nobody give it up for The Stranger, maybe my sentimental favorite of Welles' works?

It never made an impression. Reportedly Welles wanted to cast Agnes Moorehead in the role that eventually went to Edward G. Robinson, but the studio nixed the idea. Fascinating.

Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Sunday, 12 March 2006 22:49 (eighteen years ago) link

And oh will nobody give it up for The Stranger, maybe my sentimental favorite of Welles' works?

i thought this movie was wonderful!

PRIVATE HELL 36 (Jody Beth Rosen), Monday, 13 March 2006 05:10 (eighteen years ago) link

i just watched this tonight!!

yeah, the trailer is awesome.

i love this movie.

s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 14 March 2006 03:01 (eighteen years ago) link

I still need to know Wells' take on "Sixteen Candles."

ringwald gets her comeuppance.

The Man Without Shadow (Enrique), Tuesday, 14 March 2006 12:11 (eighteen years ago) link

Well, swung by Amoeba last night and there it was, F for Fake on Critierion and used, even. I am a happy Ned!

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 18 March 2006 15:15 (eighteen years ago) link

used!! lucky guy!!

the stuff on the second disc is rad.

s1ocki (slutsky), Saturday, 18 March 2006 15:16 (eighteen years ago) link

used!! lucky guy!!

Amoeba is good for that. There's a whole section of nothing but Critierion discs (they know their crowd) and many discs turn up used.

Yeah, all the bonus features look a treat. :-)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 18 March 2006 15:17 (eighteen years ago) link

Coincidences! My girlfriend works in a used bookstore and ended up grabbing The Stranger for me this week and I had already picked up F for Fake a month or so back. So very good.

mike h. (mike h.), Saturday, 18 March 2006 20:23 (eighteen years ago) link

this video store near me has their own criterion section, and i think they have every single criterion disc. i almost rented wajda's kanal last night, but went with domino for reasons i now regret.

gear (gear), Saturday, 18 March 2006 20:30 (eighteen years ago) link

if you found domino in the criterion section your video store is definitely trying to pull something on you

s1ocki (slutsky), Saturday, 18 March 2006 20:37 (eighteen years ago) link

there's a criterion edition of armageddon

latebloomer is a belly with a guy pierce in it (latebloomer), Saturday, 18 March 2006 21:02 (eighteen years ago) link

:-O

pixel farmer (Rock Hardy), Saturday, 18 March 2006 21:05 (eighteen years ago) link

Please don't remind me.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 18 March 2006 21:07 (eighteen years ago) link

kanal sorta sucks

well, no, it doesn't suck, but it hasn't dated well

i am teaching "f for fake" on monday!

amateurist0, Saturday, 18 March 2006 21:57 (eighteen years ago) link

well see i was thinking to myself (though in the end maybe i wasn't thinking at all) that i should go with a movie that would be good for a night in which i stumbled home drunk. something a little loud and a little stupid, and wajda films are typically somewhat quiet and not that stupid at all. so i staggered over to the new releases section and came away with domino, which was filled with the promise of violence and tits and tony scott camera angles. not enough violence, boring tits, and what in the end resembled not a tony scott film but a dj skribble remix of a tony scott film.

gear (gear), Saturday, 18 March 2006 22:01 (eighteen years ago) link

i haven't seen F is for Fake in a while but my main memory of it is welles sitting in some cramped editing room and babbling, interspersed with intermittent interludes of diaphonously-clad nymphs traipsing around in a forest?? there must be more to it than that but i swear that's all i remember.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Sunday, 19 March 2006 03:29 (eighteen years ago) link

So went right ahead and watched F for Fake tonight -- marvellous. 'Kinetic' surely is the only word, but that made the pauses/slower moments all the more effective. At points I laughed out loud in delight at the sheer immediacy and turn-on-a-dime touch of the editing -- the performance, if you like -- and the last time something did that for me was hearing Mr. Bungle's California. What a pleasure of a film.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 19 March 2006 06:23 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh yes, Tracer, to answer your own question upthread:

F is for Fake -- great mindfuck, partly because it appears that he's hellbent on deconstructing his own cinematic authority when in fact he's doing the OPPOSITE (viz. his locating himself in the editing room) - his capricious excursions and tangents from whatever loose plot there is only underline his ultimate control. especially vis-a-vis the half-naked girls who show up from time to time.

-- Tracer Hand (tracerhan...), February 10th, 2002.

So there you go. ;-)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 19 March 2006 06:25 (eighteen years ago) link

haha see exactly! the only two things i remember!

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Sunday, 19 March 2006 09:01 (eighteen years ago) link

f is for fake i first found out from robert anton wilsons book on conspiracies, oddly enough...

its one of my favourite movies of all time, formally and it moves me emotionally too

anthony easton (anthony), Sunday, 19 March 2006 09:22 (eighteen years ago) link

he lived with cybil shepherd for a while and almost burnt her place down by accident. He also wore a silky women's kimono.

Mr Jones (Mr Jones), Sunday, 19 March 2006 10:35 (eighteen years ago) link

it'd be more accurate to say he was living with peter bogdanovich, and cybill just sort of put up with it.

J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Sunday, 19 March 2006 11:15 (eighteen years ago) link

That lying bitch! I bet she didn't pork Elvis either! I wasted my time reading her autobiography! I think we can reliably say she rimmed Bruce Willis though.

Mr Jones (Mr Jones), Sunday, 19 March 2006 11:19 (eighteen years ago) link

Two of the things I liked most about the movie were mentioned upthread -- the Chatres speech and the wordless intercutting between Elmyr and Irving about signatures on the paintings. Both serve as the most extended 'pauses' in the film, and so very deftly handled at that.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 19 March 2006 14:45 (eighteen years ago) link

ahh that wordless intercutting was ace, one of the greatest proofs i've seen of eisenstein's montage theory

gear (gear), Sunday, 19 March 2006 18:28 (eighteen years ago) link

I can see why Welles spent a year editing the damn thing -- pre-Avid, what a total nightmare that must have been technically, I admire his patience. Legrand's score is the perfect icing, but its absence at moments like said montage is equally wondrous. I do like Marcello's comment upthread about it being 'film as blog,' that's quite observant.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 19 March 2006 18:31 (eighteen years ago) link

(I also enjoyed on the technical side how the Critierion restoration as such was not 'perfect' but I'm willing to bet Welles would have never intended it to be so. Makes me think about how now the graininess, scratches, etc. are when included in recent films as much a signifier of authenticity as vinyl noise on CDs, a fetishization of a medium's nature/failings as essential for 'truth.')

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 19 March 2006 18:33 (eighteen years ago) link

I can't believe this thread has gone on this long without anyone mentioning how COOL Welles looks in that hat and black cape. Darth Welles.

Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Sunday, 19 March 2006 18:37 (eighteen years ago) link

I admit at this point it makes me think of Michael Palin's parody of that look in Ripping Yarns:

http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:xnmm9TyWYm49dM:images.amazon.com/images/G/01/books/ripping-yarns/palin-intro-tomkinsons-roje.jpg

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 19 March 2006 18:41 (eighteen years ago) link

(But yeah, striking and perfect self-dramatization. But I think my favorite moment of him in it is when he's chilling out in the countryside with the kids and the dog just having a drink.)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 19 March 2006 18:42 (eighteen years ago) link


You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.