what is post-rock - seriously?

You're thinking of Mark Perry on ALternative TV's first album. He has a lot of albums spread out on the floor and they're all fucking great, I think he has Beefheart, van Dyke Parks, Gil Scott Heron, lots of stuff.

There is no substance to this label (but then again that applies to a lot of labels).

There isn't much substance to the music either.

I can't stand these historically revisionist inaccuracies! We ALL had capes, but they were strictly for religious ceremonies.

what about henry cow? area? 'lark's tongues in aspic'?

I go on the internet a few days later, and apparantly they have SURPASSED rock. Wow.

Postrock. A relatively new genre which continues to evolve in scope and definition, postrock is a treat to the ears. With bands like Godspeed You! Black Emperor, Explosions in the Sky, Sigur Rós, Do Make Say Think, and Mogwai at the helm, it has slowly grown in recognition through movie soundtracks. Yes, there's quite a plethora of postrock bands, but is anything necessarily revolutionary, or just a rehash of past ideas brought into contemporary context?

Is this true? ''Very few things are easier to play than adequate post-rock, which is why so damn many bands do it.''

I wouldn't apply it to that album, which I've enjoyed a lot, but it's certainly easy enough to make a tongue-in-cheek post-rock bingo checklist and see it all played out to cringeworthy effect in any number of sub-par uninspiring instrumental bands.

I would say that statement is pretty true, you do need to attain a certain level of proficiency at your instrument, however once you have, there are a whole mess of songwriting & structural issues that you can completely ignore if you wish.

Play a lot of really vague, noodling open string interweaving guitar with practically no harmonic movement, add occasional noisy guitar effects and some laptop glitch/circuit bent toys for a bit of that modern flavour. If the drummers girlfriend plays violin or cello even better.

Thinking about it Drone music is maybe more applicable to that statement, trouble is both genres are easy and enjoyable to play, hence the surfeit of draggy-arsed post-rock and drone.

fearless
THE MAKING OF POST-ROCK
JEANETTE LEECH

The definitive guide to some of the most groundbreaking music of recent decades, from Talk Talk to Slint to Godspeed You Black Emperor.
Cover designed by Graham Sutton of Bark Psychosis.

Published June 6th 2017

‘The best thing about the so-called post-rock thing was it had this brief moment where the concept of it was to make music that came from the indie scene but had no limitations.’ KIERAN HEBDEN, FRIDGE/FOUR TET

‘There was no earthly reason, no logical reason, no pragmatic reason, to function the way that most bands functioned.’ EFRIM MENUCK, GODSPEED YOU! BLACK EMPEROR

‘The main reason we were coming together to try these songs was as an alternative flavour to being in a rock band. Not to replace that experience, but in addition to it.’ RACHEL GRIMES, RACHEL’S

‘We were young and naïve.’ STUART BRAITHWAITE, MOGWAI

‘When you don’t know anything, you’re much more fearless about it.’ GRAHAM SUTTON, BARK PSYCHOSIS

In 1994, the music critic Simon Reynolds coined a new term: post-rock. It was an attempt to give a narrative to music that used the tools of rock but did something utterly different with it, broadening its scope by fusing elements of punk, dub, electronic music, minimalism, and more into something wholly new.

Post-rock is an anti-genre, impossible to fence in. Elevating texture over riff and ambiance over traditional rock hierarchies, its exponents used ideas of space and deconstruction to create music of enormous power. From Slint to Talk Talk, Bark Psychosis to Godspeed You! Black Emperor, Tortoise to Fridge, Mogwai to Sigur Rós, the pioneers of post-rock are unified by an open-minded ambition that has proven hugely influential on everything from mainstream rock records to Hollywood soundtracks and beyond.

Drawing on dozens of new interviews and packed full of stories never before told, fearless explores how the strands of post-rock entwined, frayed, and created one of the most diverse bodies of music ever to huddle under one name.

Published June 6th 2017 • 392pp paperback, with dozens of rare images

Jeanette Leech is a writer, researcher, DJ, and music historian who contributes regularly to magazines including fRoots and Shindig!. She also writes extensively in the health and social care fields. Her first book about music, Seasons They Change, a history of acid folk, was widely praised as ‘an engaging celebration of music from the fringes.’ She lives in Canterbury, England.

I'll definitely pick that one up. Curious where she ends, on what subset of bands.

seasons they change is dope

And here's an excerpt from the book. Great read

http://thequietus.com/articles/22977-post-rock-fearless-tortoise-bastro-gastr-del-sol-book-review

Funny how TNT was perceived - also by McEntire - as a 'difficult' album to get into. It had an immediate 'swing' to it, sounding way more organic than anything they ever did.

The excerpt certainly selling the book, can't wait to read it.

Which is crazy considering they recorded it one part at a time (was reminded of this in McEntire's Trap Set interview recently).

By the artists quoted/cited in that books' promo blurb above and this thread generally, "post-rock" houses some of the few "rock" acts from the 90s I still really like (Tortoise, Stereolab, Rachel's, Talk Talk, Slint, that Louisville/Chicago spectrum generally) and the stuff I still viscerally feel annoyed at ever having to hear back then (Mogwai, Godspeed You Black Emperor, Sigur Ros).

I wonder if the divide is between people who listened broadly to music, and then made music informed by eclectic tastes; vs. those who thought they were "post" everything without ever listening to almost anything, such that they just made boring epic rehashes of Universe Zero and Crispy Ambulance and Savage Republic kind of stuff and thought they'd reinvented rock music because they didn't have a singer?

Is Storm Static Sleep by Jack Schuter any good? Anybody read it?

McEntire is such a douche and Doug is so cool

Reading Fearless now, unexpected appearance of The Police in the first chapter

Funny how TNT was perceived - also by McEntire - as a 'difficult' album to get into. It had an immediate 'swing' to it, sounding way more organic than anything they ever did.

The excerpt certainly selling the book, can't wait to read it.

― Le Bateau Ivre, Tuesday, August 8, 2017 1:46 PM (four days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

That is weird. I remember friends trying to sell me on Tortoise and I just didn't really *get it* until TNT. Then I went back and listened to the first two records and they made sense to me.

Very much enjoying this, am gathering vast playlist of stuff to listen to as I go

q: what do you call a group of post-rock lawyers?

a: the torteoisie

i'm here all week, folks

In the words of James Murphy I was there, so curious what I might get out of a book like this. At the time, I just thought a lot of the groups were kind of proggy and really into Morricone, which was fine with me. I really wished Tortoise, full of jazzbos with good chops, improvised more. But Gastr, I thought what they were up to was totally different. Same, obviously, with bands like Sea and Cake. It's kind of like the CBGB scene, when every band was branded Punk but no two bands sounded remotely similar.

That Jack Schuter book Storm Static Sleep is an earlier book on the history of post-rock that I've had turn up on Amazon recommend searches several times.
I think it's been out for a few years so I thought at least somebody on a post-rock thread might have come across it.
I don't think there are an abundance of books on the subject.
So has anybody here actually read it?

Yes, I read it and I wasn't terribly keen, it felt a little slight although that could just be the spread of bands he chose to write about.

I read it but can't remember anything about it. On that basis I'd hazard a guess it's not essential.

I can't see Savage Republic mentioned in the Fearless index. I thought they were an influence mentioned by several of the bands crucial to post-rock.

Does Leech mention any connection between Rhys Chatham and Nina canal at all. I remember hearing they were married at one point, but can't find confirmation. been wondering if taht was a relationship or marriage of convenience since she was a Brit living in NYC.
She was also in the band the Gynecologists with him and tehre seems to be quite a lot of space given to Ut.

BTW thinking of Ut I really like Sally Young's later band Quint who do a proggy folky thing on their 1 lp Time Wounds All Heals.

fearless is a really great book. though I still think there is a complete division between the US stuff and the UK originated stuff to the point where I don't really think they are they same gentre; but I'm happy to read about all of these bands together I guess.

I still think there is a complete division between the US stuff and the UK originated stuff to the point where I don't really think they are they same gentre

yes to this, but without slint + gybe it would be hard to connect first wave uk stuff to the quiet/loud boreathons of latter day uk + global post rock

fearless is a really great book. though I still think there is a complete division between the US stuff and the UK originated stuff to the point where I don't really think they are they same gentre; but I'm happy to read about all of these bands together I guess.

― akm, Friday, August 25, 2017 9:41 AM (thirty-nine minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i sort of agree with this, other than the fact that mogwai - the biggest uk post-rock group? - are hugely influenced by slint (later stuff not so much)

actually i was thinking that this would make a pretty good audio companion to the book and i guess the mix of uk and us wasn't especially jarring to me at the time:

https://image.ibb.co/iTVRrk/moon_men.jpg

https://www.discogs.com/Various-Monsters-Robots-Bug-Men-A-Users-Guide-To-The-Rock-Hinterland/release/178563

I thought there wasa lot of interplay between bands across the Atlantic anyway. Not sure if results would be immediately recognisable but know taht a band like Bark Psychosis was heavily indebted to the Swans dynamics and both Graham Sutton and John ling hitched following Dinosaur Jr around in '89.

I know taht NYC nouise thing as well as bands like the Butthole Surfers were very popular among bands that went onto be significant in Post-Rock. Also Slint of course.
Trying to think what fed back across the opposite direction.

Not got very far into the book, just reading about MBV being a jangle pop band which wasn't the way I remembered seeing them when i did before they became ghuge. I was thinking more noisey garagey stuff verging on psychobilly back in 1986. So was janglepop a transitive stage or was it a longer term thing somehwere between there and '88. Just trying to think when I followed teh first Silverfish tour which was as support for them and by which time i was thinking much more Sonic Youth.
I keep coming across things in the book that I disagree with and clunky sentences. So I think she's not going to be one of my prefered writers. I found Seasons They Change far too listy too.

Has Leech effectively excised all the bands who had ties in with the garage/psychobilly scene's pasts? I haven't seen any reference to the Wolfhounds or the early pre Debbie Googe days of MBV. Would have tghought it might be something taht she might at least refer to possibly as the primitive rock they were supposed to be post i.e. as a major contrast.

Did I hear that MBV actually first formed as ex-pat Irish in Berlin and already had some influence from Einsturzende Neubauten etc from formation or was that a revisionist history at the time.

Here to muddy the water further re: "what is post-rock?" how about post-rock 1979-1989:

'Post-Rock 1979-1989': https://t.co/XCJUpvI8J9

Post-rock as a continuum of exploration...

w/ Gigi Masin, Laughing Hands, Massacre, Michael Brook, @_thisheat_ Hraold Budd, Material, Spacemen 3, Dif Juz, Dome, The Cure, MBV, Glenn Branca, @DuruttiColumn Colin Newman, Talk Talk pic.twitter.com/zT2nMSNzHE

— Musicophilia (@musicophiliamix) January 19, 2021

it's when you play the guitar and post to ILX at the same time

Soundslike, this mix is wonderful! Thank you.