Post a controversial music opinion

she didn't make a bad record in the 70s. and her hathaway collab is likewise essential.

Xp Scott Seward , this is the only literature I found on the subject
https://www.theonion.com/affluent-white-man-enjoys-causes-the-blues-1819565488

Wow, I haven't clicked on an Onion link in many years, and it's striking how different the site feels when you have to scroll through 70% ads / cross-promotion / video embeds to read your 5-paragraph article. Truly, we have ruined the internet (of course, I'm not sure how long we assumed everything could stay free).

I guess ilx is an oasis because it's missing all that clutter. Who's paying for all this?

George Soros.

Speaking of which, this month's check is late. I need to give his office a ring.

@ scott, I’m not a Nina-fanatic because I fetishize Black pain— if anything, the opposite might be true? a fetishization of songs of Black strength? I cannot watch her performance of “I Wish I Knew…” from Montreux without feeling complicated feelings of elation.

I have, however, done internal audits on my Nina-fanaticism insofar as her pianistic style relates to heavily to “Western” training. Re: that same performance from Montreux, she deliberately starts the song in a lite-ragtime mode, almost apeing the style (and doing so effortlessly), almost to satirize her existence onstage in front of a predominantly white Swiss audience, like she’s doing a “pretend-Minstrel” bit. “Here’s a bit of ragtime for you squares, lol!” The fact that her piano-training is so deep that she can engage in these pomo experiments— not to mention her “yeah I can do that too” Bach quotation moments she so often works in— might cause me some favourable bias, here. Like, “she’s a virtuoso in the traditional Western sense of the word”, even when she uses that virtuosity to subvert the listener’s expectations

The Netflix doc "What Happened, Miss Simone?" is, I think, helpful.

https://www.netflix.com/us/title/70308063?s=a&trkid=13747225&trg=cp&vlang=en&clip=80049674

I haven’t seen a single Nina feature, doc or otherwise, I always just put on the recordings instead, but I’m gonna watch that one tonight, thanks YMP

"@ scott, I’m not a Nina-fanatic because I fetishize Black pain"

oh god i know. i'm talking decades ago i felt this way. i was just really paranoid of people's intentions. and perhaps my own intentions. i didn't trust people back then. and i have learned that intentions are...the best laid plans of mice and men. no, i feel like why people do anything can be such a complicated thing. and sometimes its very simple. but i have realized over time how very wrong i can be about a lot of things. if you live long enough and keep thinking you can get past your suspicions.

and sometimes, most of the time, people just appreciate great artistry and a unique voice.

i was not a fan early on because i didn't HEAR everything when i was younger. i could be quick to judge. i'm a much deeper listener now. back then she just sounded slow to me. and also her voice...it sounded...wrong? to me. harsh maybe. i really don't want to search old ilm for stupid stuff i said. people change!

i will listen to someone i'm not that big on for decades and sometimes i will really end up on the other side. i never give up. well, sometimes i do. you can't like everything.

Haha her vocal delivery is so, so slow. Her phrasing on the verses of “Do What You Gotta Do” is the laziest slowest thing, it sounds like somebody taking three minutes to sit down

Diamonds and Pearls is Prince's best album, the fullest realization of his talents.

now THIS, friends, is a truly spicy take!

random 2 data points of late 90s Nina revival ... the "Thomas Crown Affair" had a noteworthy scene set to "Sinnerman"

Felix da Housecat remixed "Sinnerman"

also feel like Curtis Mayfield was having a bit of a 'revival' in the late 90s—reflected in part in how much people loved Pharrell doing these falsetto hooks as on 'I just wanna love you (give it 2 me)'

also somehow bran van 3000 got a mayfield acapella cleared

my first encounter w nina was one of those or maybe 'baltimore' or 'my baby just cares for me' I cant remember?

it would never occur to me to think she was 'overrated' though, she never saturated culture like whatever classic rock acts & also her voice was just so obviously "one of a kind" that its like, theres a certain sound that literally no one but nina simone can do, shes cornered the market on that, if she's 'overrated' then who are you gonna get to capture that exact feeling? theres literally no one

none of these are controversial music opinions just weighing in on general thread discourse

The aforementioned "Who Knows Where the Time Goes" featured prominently in The Dancer Upstairs.

I think i may have discovered Nina through 'Get By' tbh

there’s also a killer remix of “Sinnerman” by Luciano, former ILM favorite during the mnml years

The aforementioned "Who Knows Where the Time Goes" featured prominently in _The Dancer Upstairs_.

Wow flamboyant tie, I admit I am a little surprised you hadn't seen it!

Enjoy.

I liked What Happened, Miss Simone? a lot, but I don't believe I really "got" her (whatever that means) until I saw her performance in Summer Of Soul

For a long time it seemed a lot of her stuff was available only as cheaply put-together German CDs that mixed studio and live material from lacklustre 80s performances in Europe. She felt genuinely underrated in those days.

iirc this lead to her going to Charley Records with a gun because they weren't forking out royalties

It might be a completely uncontroversial opinion, but Nina Simone's cover of "Who Knows Where the Time Goes" is one of the greatest recordings ever.

Then again, maybe that is controversial.

To add to this, this version of her cover of Suzanne is exquisite.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgaIxOJzAZs

The arrangement is beautifully simple and the last verse has these incredible moments where her voice seems to harden in a subtle but unmistakable modulation to convey some sense of brittle resilience, a stern, bittersweet joy.

The first, self-titled Boston album is the equal of Pet Sounds in terms of arrangement, production, songwriting and emotional resonance.

I put on Nina Simone's cover of "Who Knows Where the Time Goes", then halfway through was just about to go downstairs to get something, when I remembered her haranguing the audience member at the Montreaux festival (as shown in the Netflix doc) so I respectfully sat back down till it had finished.

oh boy I loved that "Suzanne" cover!

I think Bojack Horseman introduced a few people to her with this ending:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WWXsTOw_Tk

the whole concept of overrated/underrated feels really tired to me

feels like it's just a way to say "i don't like this but i have no significant thoughts about it" without saying that

underrated is fine imo, it works well to attract a certain type of listener to check someone out or give them a second listen

overrated becomes less useful as monoculture recedes further and further into the past, because...overrated by whom?

in the context of ilm, calling something "overrated" feels a little like one of those videos where someone throws a ping pong ball on some mouse traps.

It comes down to the quality of the conversation imo.

Like just listing overrated/underrated artists without real context comes across as "taste preening", but it can be interesting to examine the factors that caused some acts to become huge that might be tangential to the quality of the music as well as what causality might have held back another artist.

Problem is too often the conversation often never actually goes further than the initial statement

as monoculture recedes further and further into the past

citation please

The waning popularity of pretty much all generalist media, from newspapers to tv stations to traditional radio?

I am not btw saying a non-monoculture world is better.

it does feel like ppl's myopia is more apt to be about 'entertainment silos' rather than some kind of overarching Popular Culture

Meanwhile I have decided that Stevie Nicks is underrated (despite being globally famous, widely adored, and probably rich).

listening to dave van ronk is like having my skin slowly peeled off my body. watching him sing is like having my body boiled in a cauldron of dave van ronk's fiery-hot sweat.

ewww, did i just say that out loud...

fiery hot sweat hot sauce now comes in a bottle and can be purchased at yr local guy fieri approved location

Guy Fieri is apparently a real mensch

in the context of ilm, calling something "overrated" feels a little like one of those videos where someone throws a ping pong ball on some mouse traps.

― ꙮ (map), Tuesday, October 24, 2023

LOL. Underrated post.

it’s really important work, judging people for liking stuff too much

it is, quite literally, God's work.

Why'd you have to go and make things so overrated

https://i0.wp.com/tracklist.com.br/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/avril-lavigne-e1494207145154.png?fit=523%2C350&ssl=1

Plopped it on the turntable and confirmed my teen feelings: Highway 61 Revisited is really dragged down by those slow ones. Kinda surprised they're still a slog for me, but they are.

morton feldman is boring as fuck

so is dylan but at least his songs and albums are over quicker

Which are the slow ones? I think it generally moves along fairly snappish.

I guess Ballad of a Thin Man is slowest.

I count "Ballad of a Thin Man" as 1) typically (of '65/66) brilliant; 2) historically important; 3) my least favourite song on Highway 61. Just don't like the way it sounds, and can't remember a time when I ever did.