Greta Gerwig's Barbie movie

You have to see Oppenheimer first. This is because Barbie lives in the world that Oppenheimer built.

— Lynda Carter (@RealLyndaCarter) July 10, 2023

It's a good line and I hope her social media manager gets a bonus

The second season of the L.A. Made podcast is about the history of Barbie, as told by those who were there. It's fascinating.

https://letterboxd.com/journal/the-official-barbie-watchlist-greta-gerwig/

She has great taste!

Well, screening's on Monday. Good luck, America.

My sister im law the other day was talking about all the great things she's heard about it, and I let her know that functionally no one has seen it yet, so three cheers for marketing.

https://time.com/6294427/barbenheimer-future-of-movies-barbie-oppenheimer/

Thanks. I don’t know what I.P. means in this context.

Not a long time ago these movies would have opnened on the July 4th weekend. Late July was always the dumping ground for bombs and quickie comedies for bored teenagers.

xp Freely

The Russos do the same namedropping shit with their Marvel movies. Thus, a Captain America movie becomes The Parallax View.

ok but greta gerwig has made two excellent movies

Yeah, also it's just a very different thing: conspiracy films depend on a certain amount of political sophistication that The Winter Soldier clearly does not have, Gerwig is for the most part listing a bunch of great frothy spectacles as inspiration for her own big frothy spectacle. It might very well turn out to not be very good but the references are coherent.

https://i.imgur.com/aN8HYb5.gif

https://i.imgur.com/Frn8rdm.jpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HyfQVZHmArA

apparently gerwig's next project as writer/director after this is 'at least two' narnia films, which seems like an incredibly bizarre move - why would anyone want gerwig to do that? why would she want to do that? how could she possibly make that actually compelling?

*raises hand*

I can imagine a good Narnia series directed by Gerwig but I confess I can also imagine her getting swallowed up by franchise considerations. Anyway I'm guessing Barbie box office might determine if this becomes anything more than a vague project.

I will happily see Barbie, but confess that Gerwig getting tied up in Narnia bums me out.

they don't tie people up in Narnia, their punishments are far weirder

has a good director ever truly elevated one of these franchise movies? maybe Cuaron's Potter entry, though I'll never rewatch it to check. I'm probably forgetting something obvious though. Agree with the general ugh at this idea, though I'm not a gerwig stan

Not a long time ago these movies would have opnened on the July 4th weekend. Late July was always the dumping ground for bombs and quickie comedies for bored teenagers.

― Gerard Grisey Funk (Boring, Maryland), Friday, July 14, 2023 10:17 AM (yesterday)

I can't tell if this post was joking or not (Oppenheimer = bombs; Barbie = the rest)

no, I was being serious. "Big" films opened before July 4, or even Memorial Day.

That still happens. This year the Little Mermaid opened on Memorial Day weekend and Indiana Jones opened the weekend before July 4.

my vague memory is the cuaron potter was the best one, certainly elevated beyond the others, but i have no desire to revisit it even ignoring rowling's descent into reaction, and was it really something that anyone wanted or needed anyway?

The Raimi Spider-Mans certainly benefit from his direction, though I guess jury's out on whether "a Sam Raimi film" is something more elevated than "a Spider-Man film". They also already seem to hail from a very different era in terms of the creative control a director gets when doing a franchise film, but otoh Narnia ain't exactly the hottest property and I could imagine Gerwig getting some leeway.

xp
yeah, that's a good point. even though it was better than the rest, I would much rather have had AC try his own take on english fantasy. it's been said before, but it is depressing contemplating a good director getting sucked into these big-budget studio production, they can't help but be compromised imo (as Daniel just said)

Raimi an interesting case. Young me would probably want to mention Burton's Batman films, but I don't actually think he's a good director now lol

batman returns is still great

willing to see what gerwig would do with narnia but who knows, doesn’t feel like it’s on the same level as her doing a mcu movie (where even raimi’s style got consistently derailed by the stupid and boring continuing storyline)

The first two Burton Batman flicks rule.

I'm here for a Gerwig-directed Narnia film that's just Puddleglum (Dean Wareham), Eustace (Timothy Chalamet), and Jill (Florence Pugh) talking in a Lower Manhattan studio.

Fwiw, the movies that Raimi made immediately before Spider-Man were The Quick and the Dead, A Simple Plan, For Love of the Game, and The Gift. Quality aside, I don't think you could look at those four films and think they're the work of someone with an uncompromising artistic vision. He was already enmeshed in the studio system.

counterpoint: for the love of the game is the only one of those that doesn’t feel like a sam raimi movie to me

i don't really get the impression that barbie will be particularly compromised - the unusual thing is that mattel have (correctly) surmised that it was better to give gerwig creative freedom and get something potentially interesting out of it that would make a cultural splash instead of producing something bland and micromanaged (which is apparently part of why previous attempts at making a barbie film fell through)

but with narnia i feel like there'd only be so much room to work with (though certainly far more than anyone gets with the mcu these days) and even if gerwig makes a tltw&tw adaptation that's as good as it could possibly be it'd still be a bit of a waste. i don't know how she could possibly make prince caspian worthwhile

Xp Wasn’t that also right around the time Wes Craven made Music of the Heart?

his style is undeniable in his spider-man films, whereas non-raimi spider-man films i would struggle to say have a style

Wasn’t that also right around the time Wes Craven made Music of the Heart?

― fair but so uncool beliefs here (Eric H.),

I'm glad someone mentioned this. I'd argue pairing Estefan + N Sync was as terrifying as Freddy's first appearance in 1984.

mattel have said they aim to take the same approach as barbie to the 16+ other films they have in development but i really don't know how they'll manage a 'thoughtful' take on hot wheels, or rock em sock em robots, or uno (which inexplicably is supposedly going to be a comedy-heist starring lil yachty?)

my last post was p unclear:

I agree with Ivy and Alfred on the Batmans. I meant Burton's 21st c. filmography has been so very bad I don't think he belongs to the category we're talking about

I don't think Barbie is a studio-compromise film (I mean, we'll see, but it does look too strange for that so far). I only meant these hypothetical Narnia movies seem destined to be that, esp if they really are investing in two at once

16+ Mattel films is end times shit, jesus christ

has a good director ever truly elevated one of these franchise movies?

― rob, Saturday, 15 July 2023 14:38

Let's see how Ben Wheatley's 'Meg 2: The Trench' turns out.

i don't think we will get 16+ mattel films despite their ambitions, a bunch will get made but i doubt they'll all be hits. hopefully we at least get some confused adaptations of obscure mattel lines to completely flop before they scale back the ambitions though

Waiting for Wes Anderson’s He-Man

has a good director ever truly elevated one of these franchise movies?

i know few people agree with me about the second but: first two m:i movies are really successful examples of throwing established auteurs at existing IP

Fan or not, the LOTR trilogy is a good example of how to get a director to bring his or hers qualities to a blockbuster IP. Jackson coming from horror and genre filmmaking is key to the successes of those movies, the odd visual flourishes, camera movement, direction of actors, interesting visual storytelling in general. It spawned a whole lot of movies that don't have that quality and so it's easy to compare - MCU is an example of hiring distinct i (often smaller scale) talent and not giving them the framework or resources to apply their style to the movies. But the LOTR tv show is also probably a good example: Lots of writing talent, but a lack of individual character. Jackson managed to get his whole crew on those movies - from editors to writers to effects and camera people - and doing it in his backyard, which probably explains a lot of it. That's unthinkable for many studios and franchise owners. I don't know what Gerwig needs to imbue her own character on a project, but hopefully she's given it. Narnia doesn't sound like a great prospect to me, but there are ways to make franchises work better than they generally do.

has a good director ever truly elevated one of these franchise movies?

Cuaron Harry Potter?

counterpoint: Chloé Zhao and the Eternals

deathly hallows 1 > cuaron potter, and no i have no idea how this is possible but david yates made the most meditative and best harry potter film

cuaron’s entry is still pretty wonderful and idiosyncratic, and the time travel stuff at the end is beautifully rendered

sorry i feel like this is yet another ilx thread where i am unloading my franchise opinions lol