The Great ILX Gun Control Debate

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newsflash: angry white males (aka The Death Wish Audience) be creepy, too. see also: Roger Adultery

― milo z, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:42 (seventeen years ago) link

http://www.degreesofme.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/12/conan.jpg

"What is good in life?"
"To crush your enemies, see them driven before -- oh, shit, wait, dude, I shouldn't say that, no one will like that line at all."

xpost yes, because only white males want to kill people, and there are no other movies, or forms of entertainment, depicting revenge fantasies that have appeal beyond that narrow subset. "Hothead Paisan", anyone?

― lurker #2421, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:44 (seventeen years ago) link

lurker get a fucking clue already

― TOMBOT, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:44 (seventeen years ago) link

just ONE

― TOMBOT, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:44 (seventeen years ago) link

I am not being disingenuous, Ally!

― Fluffy Bear Hearts Rainbows, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:46 (seventeen years ago) link

and the way the nature of that revenge fantasy seems related to his fixation on rape and his defensiveness about race.

You're losing me here, Horseshoe. I re-read Lurker's posts, and I'm under the impression that he talked about rape victims only as an example of someone that we might consider justified for having revenge fantasies. The only issue I have with that is that, unless he's been raped himself, it's a bit presumptuous to speak on their behalf. But really, the reason he went there was because some people seemed to think that he was a weirdo for having a revenge fantasy in the first place. All he was saying was, "Revenge fantasies need not be creepy. Consider such-and-such a situation." Your post makes it sound like he's fixated on rape fantasies, which is a wild leap to make.

― jaymc, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:47 (seventeen years ago) link

http://web.israelinsider.com/Articles/Politics/7344.htm

"A group of elderly Holocaust survivors came forward with accounts of a death squad they formed after World War II to take revenge on their Nazi persecutors, recounting a brazen operation in which they poisoned hundreds of SS officers."

VERY CREEPY

xpost exactly, thank you, Jaymc!

― lurker #2421, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:48 (seventeen years ago) link

hey lurker can you call me sir a few times

― TOMBOT, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:48 (seventeen years ago) link

I don't understand what the existence of revenge porn movies and posting revenge porn to a gun control thread really have to do with each other.

xpost John, I really don't think it's a wild leap. the race and rape stuff came out of nowhere and John Justen and Ally have already articulated what's so gross about using them as hypotheticals.

― horseshoe, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:49 (seventeen years ago) link

Star Wars has an appeal for me, to watch and enjoy it, but that doesn't mean I want to hang out in a pool of rotting garbage getting crushed to death while i scream at a gay robot to turn the garbage compactor off.

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:49 (seventeen years ago) link

ok, really, can we just ban anyone who draws a line between teen hooligans and Nazi camp guards? Pretty plz?

― milo z, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:50 (seventeen years ago) link

"A group of elderly Holocaust survivors came forward with accounts of a death squad they formed after World War II to take revenge on their Nazi persecutors, recounting a brazen operation in which they poisoned hundreds of SS officers."

VERY CREEPY

Not that creepy at all. Waving a gun in someone's face because they called your friend an awful name? Pretty fucking creepy.

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:50 (seventeen years ago) link

again, I don't necessarily think it's creepy to have had revenge fantasies (although I'm annoyed at the insinuation that I have to relate), it was the posting about it in lingering detail that seemed off to me.

― horseshoe, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:50 (seventeen years ago) link

well this sure is tiresome...

the Brit upthread obviously doesn't understand some fundamental differences between British and American jurisprudence - namely that Americans have a document, the Constitution, that IS set-in-stone as the rule of law (barring amendments). I understand this is not the case in the UK, but really get one fucking clue. All federal laws are derived first from the Constitution, rather than the willy-nilly accumulation of precedent that is the British legal system.

many x-posts

― Shakey Mo Collier, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:50 (seventeen years ago) link

mr que otm re star wars

― river wolf, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:51 (seventeen years ago) link

R2 was gay?

― onimo, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:51 (seventeen years ago) link

the best thing about the garbage compactor is how they're in all this "stinky garbage" but 100% of the garbage appears looks exactly like scrapmetal and woodchips

― TOMBOT, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:51 (seventeen years ago) link

exactly!

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:51 (seventeen years ago) link

"race and rape stuff came out of nowhere" = me saying is there anyone in the world who you'd say, yes, it's OK for them to want to do this?

I mean, there's footage kicking around of seven or eight white kids kicking the shit out of a mentally retarded black kid, who asks over and over again, "What'd I do? What'd I do?" It's one of the most harrowing and disturbing things I've ever seen. How can you not want to do something horrible to those kids, even if you just feel that impulse for a minute or two?

Or those cops Tasering that guy in the library -- does no one but me, watching that footage, have any urge to beat the shit out of them, or even more so, to...to humble them? To make the torture stop, but also to teach the cops how it feels when you're in that position?

― lurker #2421, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:52 (seventeen years ago) link

what i don't get is where the death star comes up with all that liquid waste.

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:53 (seventeen years ago) link

dood you watch too many torture videos wtf

― Shakey Mo Collier, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:54 (seventeen years ago) link

hey lurker can you call me sir a few times

On the one hand, I have total respect for your position Tombot (even though I disagree with it), but OTOH, this is a really fucking creepy thing to say. Are you honestly threatening me with violence, dude?

― lurker #2421, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:54 (seventeen years ago) link

dirty mop water

― TOMBOT, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:54 (seventeen years ago) link

are you guys talking about the death star?

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:55 (seventeen years ago) link

i love the death star!

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:55 (seventeen years ago) link

I'm baffled that lurker cannot posit any difference between wanting to STOP abuse and wanting to HARM the abuser.

― Shakey Mo Collier, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:55 (seventeen years ago) link

dude stop turning this thread into this weird psychological bullying I'm going to describe a bunch of violent encounters in vivid detail until you all admit your secret desire for revenge. wtf? I know it's not the most ontopic thread but it's a gun control debate thread.

― horseshoe, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:55 (seventeen years ago) link

but the death star is full of robots, aren't robots clean? is Grand Moff Tarkin that messy?

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:56 (seventeen years ago) link

either this whole thing just achieved a new level of irony I was not prepared to comprehend or lurker is genuinely trying to be funny

― TOMBOT, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:56 (seventeen years ago) link

I'm baffled that lurker cannot posit any difference between wanting to STOP abuse and wanting to HARM the abuser.

Of course there's a difference! The former's a lot healthier than the latter, but normal people feel both.

Jesus, enough of this. Please, let's just stop, OK?

― lurker #2421, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:56 (seventeen years ago) link

The former's a lot healthier than the latter, but normal people feel both.

define "normal" please. actually, wait, don't.

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:57 (seventeen years ago) link

increase the peace

― river wolf, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:57 (seventeen years ago) link

Yeah, I really don't think it "came out of nowhere."

― jaymc, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:58 (seventeen years ago) link

"race and rape stuff came out of nowhere" = me saying is there anyone in the world who you'd say, yes, it's OK for them to want to do this?

how about we make a deal. i will describe, in specific and vivid creative writing major detail (because that is apparently what is a-ok with nabisco and jaymc, the creepy police), what i would theoretically like to do to you for sitting here destroying the entire thread with lurid posts about rape and torture, if i was someone who actually identified with your position. then, you have won, and you will leave the thread. will this make you happy?

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:58 (seventeen years ago) link

hi jaymc and [nabisco], i actually never want to speak to either of you again.

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:58 (seventeen years ago) link

the robots have little tires and the tire rubber picks up dust from the air and redeposits it (along with some rubber) on the floors

so other robots have to come by behind them and mop it up once in a while

then you got to recycle the dirty mop water, but first it drains through the floor grate and ends up in the trash room

― TOMBOT, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:58 (seventeen years ago) link

BYE NEVER MIND THIS THREAD

― the schef (adam schefter ha ha), Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:59 (seventeen years ago) link

man, the engineering on that thing....breathtaking

― river wolf, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:59 (seventeen years ago) link

[Removed Illegal Image]

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 19 April 2007 18:59 (seventeen years ago) link

The former's a lot healthier than the latter, but normal people feel both.

I guess I'm glad I'm not normal then.

― Shakey Mo Collier, Thursday, 19 April 2007 19:00 (seventeen years ago) link

and cyclopean hair-snakes feed off the wood chips and the tire rubber in the mop water

― TOMBOT, Thursday, 19 April 2007 19:00 (seventeen years ago) link

what I meant by "came out of nowhere" was that he didn't refer to racial hate crime or rape being involved in the encounter as he first described it. no one else said anything about how such a revenge fantasy would be "okay" if he were defending a rape victim/racial minority; he just put that out there in this defensive way and the fact that defending victims of rape came up several times made it seem like there was a vicarious charge to invoking rape.

― horseshoe, Thursday, 19 April 2007 19:01 (seventeen years ago) link

ahhhhh the wiley woodchip hairsnake

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 19 April 2007 19:01 (seventeen years ago) link

Why are people so against revenge??! Do not get. I want to karate chop creepy/hateful men all the time, altho disclaimer, I have never been the target of ACTUAL violence, only the suggested kind.

― Laurel, Thursday, 19 April 2007 19:02 (seventeen years ago) link

cuz its pointless and just spreads the grief around in a never-ending cycle of recrimination...?

― Shakey Mo Collier, Thursday, 19 April 2007 19:03 (seventeen years ago) link

Horseshoe, I'm sorry, I think we're just reading it in a completely different way.

Once again on ILX, empathizing with human weakness wins me enemies.

― jaymc, Thursday, 19 April 2007 19:04 (seventeen years ago) link

there is a big, fat, mile-wide line (in my mind) between wanting to kick don rumsfeld in the nuts once and wanting don rumsfled to call me "sir" and beg for mercy

that's really not the case with a lot of people here which doesn't make me want to kick them in the nuts so much as it makes me just a little more fundamentally depressed about the human race and our greatest invention "language"

― TOMBOT, Thursday, 19 April 2007 19:05 (seventeen years ago) link

I understand that the hypothetical situations were grotesque, but I did not read his initial posts as anything other than an attempt to justify his position. Unfortunately, a lot of people pull a nazi to support an argument. I'm not defending the dude on every point.

waaay xpost

― Fluffy Bear Hearts Rainbows, Thursday, 19 April 2007 19:05 (seventeen years ago) link

human weakness has nothing to do with a propensity for degrading other people and a desire to share that with everybody on the goddamn internet in a discussion of GUN KONTROL

― TOMBOT, Thursday, 19 April 2007 19:06 (seventeen years ago) link

sex_machine.jpg x10000000000000000 cut it out

― river wolf, Thursday, 19 April 2007 19:07 (seventeen years ago) link

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