Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny

Like I have genuine respect for George Lucas more so these days for what he attempted in the prequel trilogy, he wasn't trying to recreate the magic of the first Star wars trilogy, he was trying to do something else entirely different and it was an eminently respectable endeavor. And in retrospect definitely a pure expression than the very mercenary and empty storytelling of the sequels.

Related, the most vocal fans of a thing online tend not to know what made them fans in the first place(which is understandable, as you need more than a bit of perspective and understanding of this shit) and just glom onto the most simplistically/superficially kinda distinct aspects of the thing and trumpet that.

The RedLetterMedia guys have good impulses in what makes franchise fans tick, or at least, what marketers rely on to sell shit to these fanbases. “They love their logos,” to quote Rich Evans.

They just covered Temple of Doom, which they both really like, not least because it's not just packed with callbacks, like most sequels these days.

did they copy over the racism too

https://64.media.tumblr.com/a2832cc61f43e6fe258e4892d9c3e058/4a01adfb56406366-0f/s540x810/877694a03676215b80d906e5857778dea1f4cd67.gif

Like I have genuine respect for George Lucas more so these days for what he attempted in the prequel trilogy, he wasn't trying to recreate the magic of the first Star wars trilogy, he was trying to do something else entirely different and it was an eminently respectable endeavor. And in retrospect definitely a pure expression than the very mercenary and empty storytelling of the sequels.

― omar little, Wednesday, June 28, 2023 11:52 PM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

totally, I mean the sequels were totally better movies than the prequels in a lot of ways but also I don't remember shit about them, whereas with the prequels I remember a lot of random shit. something to be said about how bad movies are often more memorable and interesting than good ones. which makes you wonder which one is really the bad one. oh well.

I only think those comments really apply to TFA and RoS - Last Jedi actually turned many long-standing assumptions on their head and challenged the idea of a Jedi, and also wasn't directed by Abrams

(I also did like TFA even if it was a bit retread, and enjoyed RoS despite recognizing what a lazy, unimaginative screenplay it was)

The last Jedi is one I was gonna step in and defend from my own comments but ultimately with its story memory wiped and it floating in between the other two, it's just a meaningless film. Even though it's a pretty good one. TFA benefits from Abrams having that ability to hook you in the opening of a story (see: Alias), though it feels empty upon subsequent watches. ROS I was forced to watch a second time w my son for completist reasons and he was even more appalled than me. It underscores dramatically Abrams' inability to ever conclude a story (see: Alias) That film is the reason he'll never want to watch mission impossible 3. Anyway, that dude sucks. I've said it a couple times here before but him being given the keys to the kingdom for so many major franchises is an indictment of hollywood.

I mean I hope they've learned their lesson by now though.

i liked them all fuiud

but i’m on record as loving solo so yknow

They just covered Temple of Doom, which they both really like, not least because it's not just packed with callbacks, like most sequels these days.

I still remember going to see Temple of Doom when it came out and being absolutely appalled. I couldn't believe this was supposed to be the successor to Raiders.

https://i.imgur.com/ohbJTk4.gif

^why you gotta floss, folks

I made my uneasy peace with Temple of Doom a long time ago; it's in many ways a better film than the first film. And politically I prefer Capshaw's airhead '30s-era loony tune to teasing a good actress like Karen Allen with a hint of strength before stripping it reel by reel.

Surprisingly, if anything I've made less peace with Temple of Doom over the last decade. But it's still the one I'll defend against the other three Spielberg himself directed, at least.

I don't hate it as much as I did at first, but it still pretty much sucks.

https://i.imgur.com/ebhJLnI.gif

I don't hate it as much as I did at first, but it still pretty much sucks.

― immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Thursday, June 29, 2023 3:05 PM (twenty-two seconds ago) bookmarkflaglink

RIP Morbs.

I had similar reactions to The Goonies and Popeye.

Oh, I'd sooner sit strapped to a chair watching Last Crusade (which I hate) and Crystal Skull (which I don't) for six months on end than submit myself to five minutes of The Goonies again

I like The Goonies, sorry. Mine is a high and lonely destiny.

xxpost personally i gotta disagree on that

Temple was a fave as a kid for memorable “bits” like “chilllled monkey brrrains” & KALIMAAAAA heart grabbing & minecart rollercoaster

But now watching it now again recently the vibes are SO dark and grimdark in so many unnecessary ways and even at the time really unsupportable racism … it just feels so far away from what the first movie brought & was not a pleasant experience at all

First movie to me is better on almost every level, script, pacing, cinematography action & performance

The only thing enjoyable or qualitatively good for me now is the Short-Round/Indy relationship & genuinely heartfelt interaction which hold up beautifully & add a lot to both characters

Yeah, as with The Goonies your reaction may be at least in part a function of where you were in your life at the time. I was almost 19 when Temple of Doom came out.

yeah Mr Veg was about the same age, 19 or 20 and he has never liked it

I was 10.

But now watching it now again recently the vibes are SO dark and grimdark in so many unnecessary ways and even at the time really unsupportable racism … it just feels so far away from what the first movie brought & was not a pleasant experience at all

You're right -- I saw it again in January and thought, wow, THIS was a blockbuster in 1984? It probably didn't need Molo Ram wresting hearts out of chests and Short Round getting whipped.

There was a lot of stuff going on at the time (which the Red Letter video gets into a bit). On one hand you had George's divorce, which he claims partially accounted for the "darker" tone. Then there was Spielberg not really giving a shit; he admitted he didn't care for the story very much, and (very out of character for him) apparently didn't storyboard every inch of his film for once. But also, for whatever reason, Spielberg had really been pushing the violence in his movies. Melting faces in "Raiders," the horrors of "Poltergeist" (which he at least wrote but probably at least partially directed), shepherding the more grisly elements of "Gremlins" through the studio, "Temple of Doom" ...

sequence where indy/SR watch from behind convenient ledge as some exquisite boy undergoes a textbook issue-free evisceration/lava-immersion so that we understand how the process is supposed to work for later is so impressively sick that the heart moneyshot actually takes its place as only one image among equals-- drumming, screaming, erotic tempo of editing, climactic fireball etc.-- in certain ways this kind of thing is peak spielberg.

The reaction shots of the mesmerized Kali worshipers too.

When my sis and I saw Doom again on VHS with my abuela in the late '90s, she didn't ask us to turn it off but she did mutter, loudly, in Spanish, "Esto es diabólico!"

It sounds like it’s a good thing I haven’t seen Temple Of Doom since like 1990. Yikes

No, I absolutely recommend watching it again.

My biggest gripe with Last Crusade, in the end, is that it's just plain boring compared to Temple and the good parts of Raiders. It belongs, with Always and Hook, to the most dully cautious phase of Spielberg's entire career.

Watched it a couple months back and it largely holds up, in terms of filmmaking craft.

During the editing between drumming and sweating and swaying and heart ripping, there are a couple palpably hot cuts to a terrified Kate capshaw, Spielberg was feeling it obv.

It's definitely not a "fun" film and I think the undercurrents of religious fear play a bit better in ROTLA, it remembers that the bible is a horror story a lot of the time.

Even more than the (perfect) first movie, "Temple of Doom" is such a weird conflation of B-movie tropes, constantly veering from cartoonish violence to horrific violence, sometimes even in the same scene. You can tell Spielberg was practically giddy with the possibilities of gags and set pieces and ott sequences. "Last Crusade" definitely feels more like the retread that "Temple" wasn't, though it has its moments.

i have fond kid-memories of last crusade but it is a movie where indy goes to nuremberg and stands face-to-face with hitler and nobody's abuela bats an eye

Temple of Doom might've been the opposite of Poltergeist: so safe it might've been directed by Tobe Hooper.

Yeah I'm glad I rewatched ToD but it only confirmed my view upthread. The minecart chase is inSANELY long which was more just surprising.

I was down on Raiders for a few years and felt it was overrated for more trivial reasons until recent rewatch made me 180 back on that.

Last crusade is a safe film, albeit entertaining and pretty bloodless (literally!), I mean the first two were grisly as hell (spikes thru heads and gunshots to the face and meltings and propellor chopping) but Indy 3 avoids it almost completely.

Indy 3 has better lines ("Goose-stepping morons like yourself should try reading books instead of burning them!" and "I find that if I just sit down the problem resolves itself").

I SHUDDENLY REMEMBERED MY SHCHARLAMAGNE

ROTLA feels like an elevated story taking place in a place informed crucially by the real world (just the character interactions and asides and beats give it extra verisimilitude, very much in the immediate wake of nu Hollywood in that sense) which makes the fantastical elements hit harder. ToD is strict pulp (not a complaint per se), LC is a big budget summer Indiana Jones on a McDonald's cup kinda movie (also not totally a complaint exactly...)

Also: "She talks in her sleep" said by Sean Connery elicited a gasp from my theatre audience and a nervous look to my prudish mom from me.

lol dlh :)

Oh my

While filming the whipping scene, the crew played a practical joke on Harrison Ford. While he was chained to a large stone, Barbra Streisand appeared, dressed in a leather dominatrix outfit. She proceeded to whip him, saying "That's for Hanover Street (1979), the worst movie I ever saw." She continued whipping him for Star Wars: Episode IV - A New Hope (1977), and making all of that money. Carrie Fisher then threw herself in front of Ford to protect him, and Irvin Kershner chided director Steven Spielberg. "Is this how you run your movies?" This entire sequence was filmed.

https://media.tenor.com/8l2hniWNEHoAAAAd/indiana-jones-last-crusade.gif

Last crusade is a safe film, albeit entertaining and pretty bloodless (literally!)

there are a lot of cruel jokes about killing but there is no blood-- omar otm that it points forward to our current national art form

their double-act (son, i'm sorry-- they got us) is a lot of expert fun and consistently better than the apparatus around it

yet tbf to that apparatus my fave lol in the movie is I'M SORRY DOES ANYONE HERE SPEAK ENGLISH? OR EVEN ANCIENT GREEK