stashing assets for the 2023 nba offseason

the coach perspective is a particular one, they have these players and theyre not trying to analyze them theyre trying to win games, they cant really make the players better at basketball skills like shooting at least not in the short term so they focus on things like effort execution etc, which makes total sense, tho its not uncommon for coaches to get high on their own supply and start to believe that those are really the only things that matter and you see them do things like play washed vets over talented rookies

also i think theres a lot of things that people call competitiveness that arent really like motor which is more of a talent than it is an effort thing

if extreme competitiveness was really "an nba superpower" (pile of shit phrase flush it away please) the league would be full of dylan brookses but its not and in fact he sucks

the reason everyone doesnt play with a marcus smart or draymond green level motor isnt because they lack the desire to achieve a basketball success wins mindset its because if they played like that they would make mistakes and be bad at basketball, like dylan brooks is, playing with high intensity is a skill not a power

motor is it should also be said psychological some people just have more energy than others

*physiological

brooks was a top 60 overall player in his high school class, which means that he was both a very talented basketball player and was also ranked behind lots of guys who never even sniffed the NBA. so it’s not like we’re talking about pat bev or something here, i think his raw talent is prob being a bit understated. but also i buy there is something about his drive that mattered in a real way in terms of him becoming a fulcrum of an NBA franchise for a period of time

I mean he was a second round pick with bad measurements and borderline NBA skills, he’s not a guy who’s going to be a starter for 12 years imo. he might be a heat culture guy tho they should take a flier

someone should do a heat culture team with delusional guys i would tune in

he needs to go to the mavs

Whatever team trades for Kat should sign him

I mean he was a second round pick with bad measurements and borderline NBA skills, he’s not a guy who’s going to be a starter for 12 years imo. he might be a heat culture guy tho they should take a flier

― k3vin k., Thursday, May 4, 2023 10:52 AM (fifty-one minutes ago)

his last two years at oregon he was the leading scorer on the team in seasons where they were a 1 seed in the tournament that made the elite 8 and then a 3 seed that made the final four. that first season he put up 16-5-3 on 47/33/80 splits, that second season he put up 16-3-3 on 48/40/74 shooting. some of the illustrious names drafted before him in the second round include frank jackson, wes iwundu, frank mason, ivan rabb, jonah bolden, semi ojeleye, jordan bell, juwaun evans, dwayne bacon, and tyler dorsey. so maybe his "bad measurements" and "borderline NBA skills" were actually just misevaluations by NBA front offices?

he also was given a 3/35 extension by the grizz. the only guys drafted in the second round that year who made it to a second deal are thomas bryant, isiah hartenstein (the immediate two picks before brooks, oddly) and monte morris. dude was just underrated by the league *shrugs*

hartenstein will prob make it to a third deal. half the first round that year is already out of the league or on minimum contracts at the end of benches. he was clearly a first round talent, the league just whiffed on him. which happens. but the characterization of him as a no talent try hard doesn't actually hold up to scrutiny, to me. he's a flawed player quite clearly but also clearly an NBA talent.

hes a very good defender but a strong minus on offense that adds up to what a situational bench guy, but then also he has alienating personality and doesnt at all understand his niche, sure hes better than guys drafted ahead of him who arent in the league but also hes just not that good

if he could learn to his an open three and understand his role hed be a solid starter but he seems pretty far from that right now

for sure. you're just gonna have a hard time convincing that, despite what NBA front offices thought, dillon brooks was not one of the 32 most talented players in his draft class. what was the amazing talent being displayed by justin patton, DJ wilson, TJ leaf, terrance ferguson etc? those guys are probably better athletes (though are they really?), but that isn't basketball talent

no doubt hed be in the 1st round of a redraft but also the draft is just kinda like that

interesting little discussion here

Agree with your larger point and obviously you know Dillon personally, but I continue to question that he needs to play up to the line on offense to be able to do so on defense when Kyle Lowry and Marcus Smart have managed to find that necessary balance.

— Kevin Pelton (@kpelton) May 4, 2023

This season, his field goal attempts were down when Morant/Bane both played. He was taking a lesser role, but somehow shooting even worse. Made it clear he wasn't happy with that role, though.

— Chris Herrington (@ChrisHerrington) May 4, 2023

yeah it was like it neutered him somehow

— John Hollinger (@johnhollinger) May 4, 2023

taking bad fall away long 2s are somehow his best % shots

— Faceless Man (@Topher_Jones) May 4, 2023

yeah, for whatever reason that's been a bigger "me vs. me" -type battle for him than for those other guys you mentioned. Although in Lowry's case that also was accomplished by changing from an awful shooter to an awesome one.

— John Hollinger (@johnhollinger) May 4, 2023

I suppose it’s possible that he goes from an atrocious shooter to a great one…personally I would not bet on it

yeah. Marcus Smart was 24 and in his 5th season when he became a more consistently good-enough-to-stay-on-the-floor shooter. Brooks is 27 and entering his 7th. tbf in a smaller role he was a league avg 3p shooter for his first few years, but unlike marcus he hasn't really shown improvement on offense, has moved in the other direction

yeah marcus is a good playmaker too and just generally a high level basketball understander where brooks is very much not

marcus was also the no 1 PG in his high school class and the 6th pick in the draft. he should be better at all those things than dillon brooks.

and is

he was the projected #1 pick in the anthony bennett draft but he stayed for his sophomore season, rare decision that never gets talked about, not sure he wouldve actually been the 1 pick in that fucked up draft but still very rare for someone whos projected so high to stick around

wow didn't remember that

i wasn't suggesting they were comparable across the board, just looking for comps of guys whose shooting limited the role you could give them who made it work

https://stathead.com/basketball/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&player_id1=brookdi01&p1yrfrom=2023&player_id2=smartma01&p2yrfrom=2023

yeah marcus has had a very weird career trajectory. i guess you'd put him in a group w/ like wiggins & harrison barnes as super hyped talents who, in retrospect, clearly were never gonna be perennial all stars but ended up as key role players on great/title teams. but it never quite felt like those two guys were ever like fully headed out of an NBA rotation the way it was w/ marcus for a bit?

interesting to me how few defensive stocks dillon picks up for a defensive minded player. more of a gets his body into you defender but not a lot of deflections/steals come from it

yeah. that feels like a wingspan thing. he also plays w/ the best rim protector in the league so that might have some effect on it... tho that also makes it easier for him to guard body to body as he does

I think it's worth noting that Brooks has successfully promoted himself into the consciousness of the hoops media and fans to where we ILHers are arguing about his skill set and speculating about his next team. Not many 2nd round picks whose talent makes them a natural 'situational defense bench players' manages to draw this much of our attention. He's now marginally famous, where justin patton, DJ wilson, TJ leaf, terrance ferguson, etc have dropped off the edge of the world. This may not be an nba-level superpower, but you have to admit it is pretty astonishing.

also the game last night stank so there's nothing else to talk about

he promoted himself mush like patbev by being repulsive

wow didn't remember that

― Lavator Shemmelpennick, Thursday, May 4, 2023 2:08 PM (twenty-seven minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

yeah dont remember if it was true by the end of the season but def at some point

there's this theory that there is no bad publicity. we'll now see if NBA FO's think he's got that dawg in him, or if he just screwed the pooch.

yeah marcus has had a very weird career trajectory. i guess you'd put him in a group w/ like wiggins & harrison barnes as super hyped talents who, in retrospect, clearly were never gonna be perennial all stars but ended up as key role players on great/title teams. but it never quite felt like those two guys were ever like fully headed out of an NBA rotation the way it was w/ marcus for a bit?

― J0rdan S., Thursday, May 4, 2023 2:11 PM (twenty-six minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

i dont think i ever thought he was gonna wash out but being an 8th man was def on the table, idk why he was ever considered a top prospect tbh part of it is prob that his class was weak and i guess that was the era when everyone was stoked on big dynamic point guards, but with say wiggins you can understand the hype its like he was built in a basketball laboratory, but with marcus i dont see it hes not that athletic he doesnt have some crazy deep bag etc

guess it was more of a high school assessment which are not known for their accuracy cause by the time hed done two years of college he went 6th which is more accurate but even there you want to draft more of a high upside player typically

yeah i remember watching him at ok st and thinking that he seemed like a good player but that he was clearly several levels below blake griffin or whatever

the players from the top 10 of marcus class who made the nba were nerlens noel, shabazz muhammad, kyle anderson, steven adams, sam dekker and anthony bennett. kris dunn was 11 on this 247 list i'm looking at. has to be one of the worst high school classes of the 2010s

lol yeah thats bad

no less than 4 future Timberwolfs!

hahaha

it's amazing, like if all these years you would have just assigned a number 1-10 to the ten highest rated players left in the draft and used a random number generator to pick one, you'd probably have a better record

BREAKING: The Milwaukee Bucks dismissed coach Mike Budenholzer, sources tell ESPN. Budenholzer is out after the East’s top-seed suffered a first-round loss to the Miami Heat. pic.twitter.com/wQp0Zk3lxi

— Adrian Wojnarowski (@wojespn) May 4, 2023

there you have it

not much choice there

thank you for the wonderful culture of winning we love it but no thank you to the culture of losing in the first round it sucks

In a statement, Bucks GM Jon Horst said: “We are grateful for the culture of winning and leadership that Bud helped create in Milwaukee.”

— Adrian Wojnarowski (@wojespn) May 4, 2023

damn rip big man

trying to think of what underachieving team on the rise could use a floor-raiser like bud next season and im struggling.

mavs

thats crazy enough to work but i wonder if cubes would settle for a reliable camry rather than roll the dice on a yet-to-explode tesla.

if i were a coach i wouldnt go near a team with kyrie on it, assuming they resign him