Good books about music

I seem to recall somebody mentioning a recent book that had a lot about Jazz and The Outfit but can't remember anything else.

Was it in Bob Stanley's book?

I seem to recall somebody mentioning a recent book that had a lot about Jazz and The Outfit but can't remember anything else.

Dangerous Rhythm by T.J. English. I've got it here but haven't cracked it yet.

R.J. Smith's Chuck Berry bio is one of the best written, most insightful I've read in years.

I've heard very good things about his James Brown bio too.
Seems like maybe 10-12 years ago that the NYTimes did a good feature about W. Eugene's own scene--in an isolated-looking building, actually like later pix of the South Bronx if not even later Middle Eastern urban warfare coverage: this cube in a vast plain of rubble. In there, he kept the reel-to-reel going for years, so you get conversations, housecleaning, conversations, bottles and plates. chairs, records, radio, TV (maybe some musicians dropping in as well)---don't recall any indications of outside connections with any other scenes (or whether the building was surrounded by rubble all those years). The pix he took in there were considerably more varied than his official product (a friend who knows the history of photography was amazed that the otherwise constrained W. Eugene could roll like this).

yeah Smith's James Brown book is fantastic, cant wait to dig into the new one.

there was W. Eugene Smith "Jazz Loft" doc a handful of years ago with tons of his tapes and audio material, rehearsals, jam sessions, stoned bull sessions, amazing stuff

for round 8, mccarthy's nominator is going with "support the troops", and "it brings a tear to my eyes, yes it does" *applause*

_I seem to recall somebody mentioning a recent book that had a lot about Jazz and The Outfit but can't remember anything else._

_Dangerous Rhythm_ by T.J. English. I've got it here but haven't cracked it yet.

has anyone here read Needles & Plastic: Flying Nun Records, 1981-1988?

I've been skipping around it. Of course I love it, it covers my all-time favorite label at the height of their powers! It gives you great insight into each release during that time, using primary sources from the time and no retrospective views.

Roger Shepherd's memoir In Love With These Times: My Life With Flying Nun Records was quite good too.
got it really cheap from FOPP a few years back.

Got Needles & Plastic for Christmas; will check it out sometime soon.

Mentioned this on ILB:

I've started Dilla Time, the recent bio about J Dilla, and it looks like it's going to be more ambitious than I thought. The author is really intent on making the case for Dilla radically altering ideas about time signatures and contextualizing him in music history.

I'm about halfway in, it's fantastic so far.

How about that Kranky Records book?

Anyone read Susan Rogers's This Is What It Sounds Like?

Didn’t know it existed!

I often buy books like that but am usually disappointed by them.

Hmm. First musical example, in the Authenticity section, is The Shaggs, and the writing is pretty good, so looks I might take the bait yet again.

I"m really enjoying the new book about Some Bizzare, 'Conform to Deform". It's in an oral history format which can be a bit hit-and-miss sometimes, but the participants are pretty great so far, time is given to the lesser-known acts and non-musicians who were in the scene at the time.

It also nicely weaves together the many connections between the various musicians and bands, some of which were pretty interesting.

Stevo is in there, an unreliable narrator as you'd expect, making dubious claims. Quite often there's a statement from him that is then contradicted by two other people directly afterward, which is kinda funny.

Oh, thanks for the reminder, need to get that one!

Me too! Hoping for some controversial Coil content

I quite enjoyed that Dylan Jones book on New Romantics 'Sweet Dreams' probably because of how wide catchment it had of the times between 75 and 85. JUst thinking of it cos of mention of an oral history of Some bizarre above cos it mainly follows that format with a few pages of Jones overview holding it all together.

Started a History of the Blues by Francis Davis which apparently tied in with a PBS series on the subject in the mid 90s.
So have mainly read the Introduction so far. But looks good.

Jon Szwed has a new one out then
https://open.spotify.com/episode/0MDQnFDUU0iiAp8zX8As4p?si=5a559b48509f458a

on Harry Smith. I've enjoyed what I have read by him before and this should be an interesting subject

thanks for the tip

Yeah noticed that.

He's 87 years old!

great cover too

https://johnszwed.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/08/cosmic-scholar333x500.png

Yes

Spotify keeps playing podcasts from that new books series without audio. Has happened a few times this week with different episodes. Had to go back to listen to one on audio and live taping tge Grateful Dead a couple of days ago.
Sounds like another book I want to read too. The Gratefu Dead one.
Having to go elsewhere to hear this Sawed one.

Can anyone recommend a book about pop/rock than looks at it more from the perspective of the public than the artists? Doesn't have to cover all of rock history, bird I don't mean just something on the fans of a particular group or scene. Something that explores changing tastes/attitudes toward music and arists over time, I guess.

Not a book but have you seen the bbc People's History Of Pop?

No I haven't - thanks!

there was a longer radio 2 series, ran for a whole year called "the people's songs"

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01l9qb8

i have exactly one episode on the recorder still, 1977

Country Music Originals Tony Russell
Great resource for 20s and 30s country as in old timey, Western Swing and music that would be blues if played by black artists and lifts straight from the source.
Great overview of individual artists some of whom I knew before. Others I'm discovering are on the Old Timey disc of one of the Proper boxes I got a couple of months back.
Think I need to get a copy since this an interlibrary loan.& I do want to find out more about the artists involved. This is pretty rife with related photos too.

I think the writer wrote stuff on the blues too. Not sure what else

Can anyone recommend a book about pop/rock than looks at it more from the perspective of the public than the artists?

Dunno whether you known it already, as it's discussed quite a bit upthread, but Elijah Wald's How the Beatles Destroyed Rock 'n' Roll: An Alternative History of American Popular Music might possibly be of interest. Note that the first part of the title is pretty much unrelated to the contents of the actual book, afaicr, the Beatles really do not play a major part in there.

This girl-group oral history just came out... I'm interested!: https://www.hachettebookgroup.com/titles/laura-flam/but-will-you-love-me-tomorrow/9780306829772/

xpost There's one called "Playing to the Crowd" by Nancy Baym about how music fan culture was instrumental in building the early web.

X-post — just saw a freelancer review of the girl group oral history book in Washington Post . It says in part:

But Will You Love Me Tomorrow?” has an unusual and sometimes troublesome format. It consists of edited transcripts of more than 100 interviews with notable artists, such as King, Ronnie Spector, Diana Ross, Patti LaBelle, Cher and Johnny Mathis, but we also hear from their managers, producers, songwriters, various band members, DJs and family members. These shared stories foster intimacy, conflicting memories and sometimes confusion. But reader persistence pays off

https://www.washingtonpost.com/books/2023/09/06/but-will-you-love-me-book/

Ah, thanks (curmudgeon – did you receive my email?)

I did ( but didn’t notice it at first) . Thanks

Dunno whether you known it already, as it's discussed quite a bit upthread, but Elijah Wald's How the Beatles Destroyed Rock 'n' Roll: An Alternative History of American Popular Music might possibly be of interest. Note that the first part of the title is pretty much unrelated to the contents of the actual book, afaicr, the Beatles really do not play a major part in there.

I encounter a lot of books like this, but from more of an academic perspective--the heavy metal audience, pop stans etc. There was that Nathan Rabin book about Juggalos and Phish fans too.

I think my interest was prompted by a reaction to Andrew Hickey's 500 songs podcast. It's excellent, of course, but he's very much one for "If so and so hadn't lived/made this record then the whole future of rock would be very different" statements, which I'm always a bit suspicious of (the latest figure being Tommy Steele!). So as a kind of alternative to that, I got an itch to read something very much less personality-driven.

So, not actual studies of specific fandoms, but histories of music that look at it more in terms of currents of listening/taste/fan behaviour.

The B-Side by Ben Yagoda might have some of what you're looking for. Its scope goes all the way from the 1880s to the late 1960s and its main subject is the question of where songs come from - so lots of stuff about the songwriting and publishing business - but there's also a lot about the demand side, investigating how and why tastes changed among music consumers at certain times.

"If so and so hadn't lived/made this record then the whole future of rock would be very different" statements, which I'm always a bit suspicious of

I think my interest was prompted by a reaction to Andrew Hickey's 500 songs podcast. It's excellent, of course, but he's very much one for "If so and so hadn't lived/made this record then the whole future of rock would be very different" statements, which I'm always a bit suspicious of (the latest figure being Tommy Steele!). So as a kind of alternative to that, I got an itch to read something very much less personality-driven.

― Alba, Wednesday, 13 September 2023 15:07

Hmm, to be honest I can’t think of many music writers / podcasters who are less personality-driven than Hickey (maybe it’s a low bar). He is always keen to point out how there is no first anything, and how great music comes out of scenes as much as individuals.

He said of Steele “without him, there would be no British rock and roll industry as we know it” and I do think that is true. Steele was the first British rock and roll star and the club he was discovered in, the 2i’s, was mined for talent after his success, giving us the likes of Adam Faith, Tony Sheridan and Cliff & the Shadows). He was the model all the other early British rock stars were based on including Jim Dale, George Martin’s first pop signing. I don’t think it’s too much to say a huge chunk of the 50s and 60s British pop industry comes directly from Steele - he was Lionel Bart’s first success, Larry Parnes’ first star, the satirised subject in Expresso Bongo, the catalyst for Six-Five Special and the first guest on Oh Boy!. In the UK, he managed loads of firsts - he had the first UK number one album by a British act, recorded the first British rock album, was the first rock star to appear at the Royal Albert Hall and the first pop star to receive an Ivor Novello.

(I’m not Tommy Steele honest :) )

Yeah Steele is a major figure and, like so many figures in pre-Beatles UK pop, is gravely underrecognised.