to what extent does your life revolve around alcohol?

Jesus, I guess I'm closing in on two years since I've had even a single beer. It feels weird, so many good memories wrapped in drinking (and smoking) but I can't drink like I could until ~35 and moderation (one drink with dinner or whatever) holds no interest for me. It's either shots until last call or nada.

Congrats ‘zino!

I stopped drinking, more or less, about two years ago. After having Covid, even the slightest bit of a drink began triggering brutal 2-3 day headaches. This wasn’t the only thing causing headaches post-Covid but it was the most immediately obvious to me.

I still smoke weed though. I know I’m saving money, especially when I go out, but I just spend money on other bullshit instead so it doesn’t feel like it.

Love you all.

My wife and I are both drinkers, as a lifestyle. What we call sustainable hedonism. We love good drinks of all varieties — liquor, wine, beer — and we have a well-stocked home bar. Whenever we travel we always look for the best bars as well as restaurants, and our first trip to Mexico was entirely built around exploring Mezcal production (and trying tons of different kinds). We turned our hobby into a side gig, we run a cocktail catering company with a friend. Mostly we teach cocktail classes, which are super fun — we walk people through the mechanics of making drinks and also talk about the histories of specific liquors or drinks. At the same time, when we work parties we always include a (delicious) NA option.

It may sound funny to say it given that we are obviously in the top 5-10 percent of the population for alcohol consumption (at least according to the stats I’ve read about drinks per week), but we rarely let ourselves get much more than buzzed. I’ll typically have 2-3 drinks a day, almost never enough to even notice it the next day. I’ve gotten better about not drinking within a few hours of bedtime, because I did notice it messing with my sleep, that rebound effect. I have known and worked with alcoholics and I know how destructive it can be, but I’m in 50s and I feel like if I was going to develop a drinking problem I would have by now.

I’m a big fan of the growth of sober culture and the wide availability of NA options, I think it’s good and healthy. Part of our whole alcohol education mission is to make people THINK about drinking — make every drink a deliberate one, and hopefully a delicious one, not just something rote or blotto-seeking. Only drink the drinks you really want, and enjoy them. I can imagine not drinking at some point in the future, or drinking less (particularly if the doctor says so). But for now I enjoy it as one of life’s friendly pleasures.

tips, I'm with you. I'll stick to a cocktail + wine on weekdays, more on weekends.

But, as this thread is here to remind me, I don't for a moment forget how lucky I am about comorbidities and such.

I think the line's always going to be to what extent a person -- for a number of genetic, physical, and psychological reasons -- can handle mild to moderate drinking.

Yep, and knowing how to recognize if it’s getting off balance. We talk about it a fair amount, I think if either of us felt like the other one needed to ease up we’d be very open to the discussion.

I'm 95% sure my blood pressure issues are due to alcohol. When I'm home alone, I never drink. Even socially, I keep it moderate.

But at concerts, I get blitzed to the point of no return sometimes. In 2016 I woke up in an ER, covered in vomit. I've not had anything that bad since but I got thrown out of a show for sleeping on the bar two months ago.

It's not typically to numb pain (though I have had those nights) as I have had this problem a decade. It's mostly an addiction to the feeling of being that lit up at a live show and around friends.

So... that's what I try to tackle next.

I've gotten ads for non-alcoholic tequila and non-alcoholic/non-psychoactive "hemp spirits" lately, both of which strike me as missing the point of tequila and cannabis completely.

Neanderthal I know what you mean about getting smashed at a show. I went through a period, especially going to see really loud bands, where I loved that feeling. The only real blackout I've ever had was the night of an Acid Mothers Temple show. I successfully caught a taxi home from Brooklyn to Manhattan, got into my building, even laid out my clothes in a neat pile and woke up like 10 hours later with no clear memory from about halfway through the show forward. So that kind of set a limit for me, I didn't want that to happen again.

When I tried to cut down on the amount that I drank, I would give in if I had a rough day. Eventually I noticed that my definition of a “rough day” kept changing, and it took less for me to feel that “oh, I really need a drink.” Because I was rewarding myself for having a rough day, I started making my days feel a lot rougher than they really were. That realization was a big moment in convincing me to quit. Our brains are slippery fuckers.

Like many on this thread I can't do moderation. Once I have the first drink around 6, I just continue on until bedtime, and I can get through a lot without particularly noticing. Having just one drink is of no interest to me, I'd rather just go without, so I try not to drink during the week, and at least once a year I take a month off. I'm not willing to give up alcohol just yet, I enjoy it too much, but there's a constant tension there.

I made a health trello at start of November, with idea of tracking various things good and bad and aiming for an under/over on each. Plan was to allow for either 2 or 3 days per week with alcohol. I then went six weeks without a drink. I don't think the two things are related, probably more likely the arrival of colder weather

But I've definitely never gone that long without alcohol before. The only thing is, I don't really feel any different other than anything next-day related, but no longer or wider difference

Might try something similar with coffee

Since getting poleaxed at a wedding in July, I've managed to limit myself to a maximum of 3 or 4 beers at the weekend and have thoroughly enjoyed it. I've been going to the pub on my own with a book and goddamn if it isn't the best hour or so of my week.

Christmas will be the issue. I will inevitably spend a lot of time with my wife's family, all of whom are staggeringly competent pissheads. They can drink beers and a bottle of wine and whiskey afterwards and be up for it the next day. Historically, the only way I can really cope with these events is to join in/self-medicate. And be rotten hungover and anxious for days afterwards. I either don't go and further my standing as the 'grumpy bastard' who 'doesn't like us', or go, drive, and hover on the edge of things, wondering when is too early to leave.

"As a machine learning model, I do not have a personal life or experiences, and therefore my life does not revolve around any activities or substances, including alcohol. I am a purely computational entity, and my sole purpose is to assist users in generating natural-sounding text based on the input provided to me. I do not have personal beliefs, desires, or experiences, and I do not engage in any activities, including the consumption of alcohol. My function is solely to assist users in generating human-like text."

I should probably start drikning

An old post reminded me that last time I quit drinking (because I was badly injured in an accident and it took me weeks/months to recover and I didn't have any health points left for vices), within a few days I was UNCONTROLLABLY craving baked goods and sweets! So it's a wrap, the fact that eat almost zero sugar and don't want sweets or desserts is because I'm getting all my sugar as alcohol.

When I tried to cut down on the amount that I drank, I would give in if I had a rough day. Eventually I noticed that my definition of a “rough day” kept changing, and it took less for me to feel that “oh, I really need a drink.” Because I was rewarding myself for having a rough day, I started making my days feel a lot rougher than they really were. That realization was a big moment in convincing me to quit. Our brains are slippery fuckers.

― Cow_Art, Sunday, December 11, 2022 9:03 PM bookmarkflaglink

so otm. I had a tendency to romanticize the causes for my drinking for the longest time. "if only I wasn't depressed", "it's what I do to deal with things", but....I pretty much went HARD in my 20s when yeah, I didn't have anxiety meds and had mood problems, but most of the nights I went out drinking was when I was in a celebratory mood. The director of one of the plays I was in actually emailed one of my best friends worried about my drinking back when I was 24. Back then, we'd go to the Bennigans (lol) after the show got out, and they did two for ones all night, so I'd pound Gin and Tonics until my friend Eddy would tell me to sleep over at his place a few miles away, and he'd drive me there. Rinse repeat.

there were definitely sometimes I'd do it to cope, but I couldn't say that was a primary reason. I just liked to party because it made me a different person (to the chagrin of the people around me, no doubt). After driving drunk more times than I was proud of and almost crashing into a parked Fire Truck, I stopped (temporarily) drinking hard liquor and moved to beer, which I genuinely enjoyed, and for a while, mostly cut back on it.

I think my second 'wave' of drinking in my mid-30s did start more out of anguish than previous. First, I was a project manager terrified of losing my job due to abuse from a higher ranking person, working ungodly hours and being miserable 24/7 (and very nearly got a DUI when I wrecked my car, which was the final wake-up call, and why I Uber ANYTIME I go to a show or think I'm going to have a lot). and then my dad (long before his stroke) was living with my brother and I and I felt suffocated with a lack of privacy, so I started taking a lot more trips out of town to get some me time. that was only a few months, but I started enjoying the high of going on these trips, getting lit up and enjoying live concerts in holes in walls around the globe, so even after that bad chapter was over, now it was all I wanted to do. nevermind how hellish I would feel the day after, given how the alcohol interacts with my anxiety meds. I had an outright mental breakdown at Maryland Deathfest in 2016 that lasted the entire trip as a result.

my friend who is married w/ kids now told me he 'envied me' one day in frustration and I said "lol if you think this is bliss, it's usually a few hours of euphoria and cleanup for long after." I do miss some of the trips only because I love traveling, but I'm kinda glad I can't do it as often I was doing back then, cos literally I left FL so often my friend Rene would joke about how she'd go on FB to see "where Neanderthal is this week".

I was a Bennigan's guy in my '20 #copperclover

In my earlier drinking years, I was attracted to it because I thought it helped ease my social anxiety. It was helpful when I was with 3 or 4 other teenagers sharing a thermos of vodka in the woods behind the high school or whatever.

But then social drinking evolved into bigger, louder parties and bars. "Come on Doug, we're going out to the pub." "You guys sure you don't want to go hang out in the woods tonight?"

I would try to achieve those same loquacious results, but it wouldn't work, so I would keep drinking and drinking over the course of a night to try and get there. The end result often was that I'd get sick and pass out on the bathroom floor, or make an ass out of myself in some other way. All I wanted to do was be social with people, but I couldn't understand how other people were able to maintain conversations. The only conclusion I could come to was that I was just not cool*.

I realized a few years ago that I still had those same problems communicating in crowds despite being sober. At some point, it clicked that it has to do with auditory processing disorder related to ADHD.

As I mentioned above, I was at a Christmas party over the weekend, completely sober. When I arrived, there were just a handful of people, and things were fine. But after a while, the room became filled with 10 or more people and I because lost. Conversations were swimming all around me and I couldn't focus. That was a separate moment from the one I described about wanting a drink, but the impulse may have been related.

*Of course, I have not completely eliminated this possibility.

I because lost = I became lost

Day 5 of what's hopefully a mostly dry January (I drank on New Year's Day, of course)... I did a mostly sober October so it wasn't so jarring this time.

I always feel a bit of hesitation with these things, but a couple days in and 1) I feel more positive overall 2) I'm eating healthier 3) I wonder why I don't do this more often.

Still struggling with sleep: I took heroic doses of valerian, melatonin, and even liquid ZZZQuil last night, and was still tossing & turning at 2am. Hopefully that will fade

Ultimately I'd like to get into the habit of doing a sdry week per month, I think this is totally feasible and will help keep me on my toes

I think the line's always going to be to what extent a person -- for a number of genetic, physical, and psychological reasons -- can handle mild to moderate drinking.

― Malevolent Arugula (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, December 11, 2022 3:38 PM (three weeks ago)

This is super otm ... I have friends that are alcoholics and can't just have one drink, I have friends that are totally sober for the same reason ... I have the friends that will do the equivalent of fasting in re booze, then go back to being functional lushes. My life currently revolves way less around alcohol than it used to. I haven't had a drink in a little over a month (since unofficial work holiday party where I had 3 ciders ... only 3 ... no shots, no cocktails ... I felt good about being able to moderate) ... Like that's basically my goal: to be able to drink in moderation and to be able to stop when I need to, AND to recognize the negative affects of alcohol in terms of being able to distinguish them from the anxiety/depression that are my rock and hard place tbh.

one fun "life hack" I've discovered is that smoking weed or taking an edible and then having 2 drinks gets you as messed up as like, 8 drinks. but you don't feel shitty afterwards, nor are you risking a DUI (obviously I try not to drive until I've come down but you know how it is sometimes). the hard part is sometimes those 2 drinks turn into like 6-7 and that's when you get those really weird hangovers, it's not like the throbbing pain of taking too many shots but you do feel utterly emotionally drained

Edibles or weed have done wonders to blunt the effect of alcohol, but tbh age is doing it already. In the last month with friends in town for backyard hangouts I'm likely to mix two cocktails, have a hit or two of weed, and I'm fine. I wake up in the morning even finer.

Historically I did it the other way round: if I was uncomfortably high, drinking a modest amount of wine or beer would help center me (because my body knows what to do with booze. I know tipsiness and am more used to it).

Nowadays I have dramatically reduced drinking (due to a health scare), and turned to newly legal weed (and weed-adjacent products) as recreation/relaxation/sleep aid.

I genuinely like beer and for a good long while, my primary reason for drinking alcohol at all was to try new ones at dinner.

I still like to do that but my primary motive is often being buzzed and in a zone so I've started drinking shittier beer with higher ABV more often.

Edibles are cool but my resting heart rate hits like 150 on em

St Bernardus is my fav, and I used to savor it, sipping for an hour, now I wind up gulping it and ruining the experience.

xp frogbs -- my anti-anxiety medication also has this effect. Like, i have a baseline quantity I take, but if I take the maximum prescribed, I can have one drink only and feel the same fun euphoria "I'm a charming social person" feeling that normally it would take 3 drinks to achieve.

I also like the taste of good cocktails and I recently discovered a blackberry cider that is super delicious

Neando, I find that if I was t to savor a beer but also really want to chug one down I drink a cheap beer first to get full then I am physically and psychologically able to nurse the next one.

Been busy af with work and family this week so have thankfully been back on my no drink / no smoke during the workweek schtick. Feels good but will probably have some spare time to get stupid soon enough

Christmas is usually a difficult time for me with booze but, one blowout on Christmas Day aside (which, tbf was a 12hr blowout), I pretty much avoided booze altogether. I went to a party on the 29th, where I drove, had a couple of non-alcoholic Guinness and two moderate beers and drove home. I felt *magnificent* the next day. I think this could be sustainable in the future.

1) The non-alcoholic Guinness is really *good* but 2) I still hid the cans when I'd poured them. Coward.

Agree that it's basically down to metabolism. After my Christmas Day session, I was out of action for basically 3 days; the people I'd drunk with were back down the pub Boxing Day. I have no idea how.

yeah my metabolism re alcohol has gotten slower as I've gotten older ... it used to be I'd be drinking, out of action for a day, and then back to drinking the next, basically, every other day getting wasted. Now, it's definitely two days of recovery time, if not 3.

I've gone out two nights this week and have my godson's birthday tomorrow plus lunch with a former ILXor, which means tonight I stay home, mix a Negroni, and have two glasses of wine for dinner. In bed by 10 p.m.

One thing that's definitely a corollary of the metabolic slowdown: not wanting to stay up late. I can't be doing with 3am sessions any more. I can't be doing with midnight sessions, tbh.

two cocktails, have a hit or two of weed, and I'm fine

This is kind of my ideal, a mild mixed buzz.

My wife and I are actually doing dry January this year. In the past we'd maybe do a week, but it's joined to a broader New Year's health rededication. Doing fine with no booze so far though granted it's not even a full week yet. Mostly just drinking a lot of La Croix, kombucha and tea, though we did buy some of the fancy new NA drinks to try for fun.

what about weed or is it not a part of your lives?

It's not included in the "dry January" because they're separate things to me (and alcohol is obviously a lot unhealthier than weed). But so far limited to a few nighttime gummis.

My current go-to NA drinks are the Ritual gin alternative (good and peppery, great with tonic and lime) and of beers, Athletic (mainly the Upside Dawn). The NA Heineken and Beck's taste pretty much like their alcoholic equivalents. OK in some contexts but not mindblowing.

We have some Canadian NA beer in the fridge — Sober Carpenter — but haven't tried it yet. Had a "Phony Negroni" last night that was basically Campari-flavored soda, not bad.

think I am the only person in the world who those unrealistic 'just say no' to drugs adverts/ kids tv shows worked on. ie the whole one drag of weed will lead to being a heroin addict within the week. therefore I have never been high. the most alcohol I have ever consumed in one night is two beers, so i've never been drunk either. Haven't actually drunk alcohol since I was 18. I guess being a bit drunk must be nice otherwise noone would do it but i'm too old and probably too incurious to give it a go now.

bravo!!

Definitely no reason to start if you haven't. I enjoy mild-to-medium mood- and mind-alteration, it works for me but I don't have any illusion that it's "healthy" per se. And it's nice to take a break just to know for sure that I don't "need" it.

I can thank/blame my school's anti-drug classes for introducing me to the existence of LSD and accidentally making it sound like the best thing ever (and it is, as well as the worst)

idk if more focus on the perils of booze beyond the already-outdated-by-then scourge of "alcopops" would have helped or hindered me but every time I'm drunk like now I'm reminded what a nasty piece of shit drug it is

anti-drug propaganda was so embedded within the school, one of our typing assignments was reproducing a three or four page anti-marijuana paper, which basically suggested a high school girl basically ate her baby and couldn't play the piano anymore because of weed

I've done my share of drugs and would not recommend starting over forty.

xpost Professor Longhair would have some things to say about that. (The piano, not the baby-eating.) There's a great passage in Dr. John's memoir where he talks about Fess smoking spliffs the size of your arm before he went on stage.

these days staying sober seems way more fucking cool than whatever bullshit 3rd hand hippie hangover drug romanticism we inherited which I really hope has finally run its course by now