Current bobbins

now that there are < 10 dance music posters on ilm it doesn't really seem helpful to follow microgenre thread topics that closely or maybe i just don't care.

i wish we had a different name for house and techno threads but this one is somewhat adequate, i guess, if dated

bobbins is used informally in brit-english as a synonym for nonsense, and i'm guessing it was originally used on ilx in that sense but in an affectionate way?

I'm just going to assume y'all really like sewing machines?

i seem to remember the music in the bobbins threads being compared to sewing machines early on but the detective search work required to verify that is beyond me.

Interesting, thanks for your responses! I love that the term is hyper-specific to ILM. It's like a secret code language.

Anyways, sorry for the interruption. Back to the bobbins!

https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/169/907/tumblr_lqe951gVzb1qzxegjo1_500.gif

Knew I could rely on ILM for a genuine, snark-free response.

It refers to bobbin' ya head?

I’ve always understood that bobbins are something for literally rolling thread, and this was the rolling thread for house/techno. Originally there was “minimal house bobbins” and “electro house bobbins” so I don’t think it was meant to describe a specific sound, but in the mid 00s we talked about kompakt-y techno (and the like) incessantly there, so the association stuck, though not by design, I don’t think.

i’m an american, been around since it first “dropped”, and this never did not make sense to me. although maybe i misunderstand it? i’d heard the expression “bits and bobs” a lot growing up (to mean a collection of random things) and always assumed “bobbins” was a particularly british version of that expression

Some recent bobbins ordered:

Huerta - liquid social ep https://soundcloud.com/subwax-bcn-distribution/lzr003

and continuing kalahari oyster cult’s incredible run:
fantastic man - alpha
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iy2TGRyfDSU

sillygirlcarmen - bad blues

great non-schaffel karizma remix too

📹

Ooh I freaking love the "rolling thread" explanation for the bobbins title!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79MjrLGIZwo

Yaya details his take on it here

There's a house or techno track from about ten years ago or so and there's a guy's voice on it that says something that sounds like 'bobbins bobbins bobbins bobbins'

Not sure if this helps

thought we did this before and came to the conclusion bobbins are odds & ends

I’m no boffin though

now that there are < 10 dance music posters on ilm it doesn't really seem helpful to follow microgenre thread topics that closely or maybe i just don't care.

i wish we had a different name for house and techno threads but this one is somewhat adequate, i guess, if dated

― (grim) pump track (wales) (map)

Kinda feel this is a problem with house/techno and other electronic/dance adjacent genres. There’s very few discussion about it, it seems like it’s music designed not to be talked about lol.

Even on reddit which has 400+ million users I still haven’t found a decent subreddit for finding and discussing “bobbins”.

I miss the blog era. Those were the days were I could really rely on a handful of electronic focused blogs to discover amazing tracks.

i think part of the deal is that djs still rely on obscurity to establish reputations in the party industry

what do you mean, map? you mean ppl build reputations by playing obscure tracks from unknown producers, so they keep tight-lipped about it?

don't worry moka, 90% or more of past music criticism about techno / house was garbage (including at least 99% of my ilx posts from the 00s) so not missing much ... looking back, it seems to match most music criticism from the internet age, which is to say writers doing cheap sociology based on broad assumptions about partygoers and listeners etc, enhanced by lack of actual knowledge or understanding of dj'ing, production, distribution networks, regional scenes, actual party culture, etc

what do you mean, map? you mean ppl build reputations by playing obscure tracks from unknown producers, so they keep tight-lipped about it?

somewhat but i also don't think it's down to individual intent that much, it's just a part of how the industry has been built over the last few decades. a bunch of other factors play into it too, vinyl being a preferred format, class and exclusivity, etc.

lack of actual knowledge or understanding of dj'ing, production, distribution networks, regional scenes, actual party culture, etc

i would counter that the "actual" part of this doesn't exist. you either have it or you don't, there's no birds eye view of it, party culture exists wherever there are parties which is everywhere, it's by definition embedded / experienced. and it's very much shaped and gatekept by class. how authenticity discourse works in tandem with class is weird and interesting but i'd say that generally it "works better" when the producers / consumers in question are of a certain class or at a certain level of class.

just some random thoughts.

let me try to clarify

one of my all-time favorite pieces of music writing is from ilx's very own pinefox, who wrote a thing about going to the all tomorrow's parties at camber sands that was curated by autechre. of course, since they skewed heavily toward drone, noise and experimental, pinefox ended up hating all the music. there's a particularly funny bit about trying to enjoy a pint in the bar while some anonymous dj (who for some reason i always assume was baby ford) is banging out endless "honking" noises (i think i remember that right)

anyway eventually pinefox comes around to the conclusion that going to festivals really isn't about *the music* it's about seeing friends on the train, pints between acts, chilling at the campsite / cabin / airbnb (anachronistic but you get the idea), it's about the anticipation and planning and bumping into ppl blah blah blah. there are definitely important things going on in the music world (social relations if you're into cultural criticism, or maybe just important experiences if you're an emo diarist type) but they're not determined by the formal qualities of the music, they're mostly adjacent to it.

hopefully i'm not misrepresenting the gist of it (i think it's on freakytrigger if you want to go look it up?) but i thought this was all very beautiful and true. and i think it is especially true when you're talking about dance music, the sort without words that gets pressed onto 12" by shadowy nameless producer types, that really doesn't have "content" outside of formal qualities (no lyrics, etc). i suppose when you have lyrics and musicians who do interviews and take stances on social media, maybe it does influence the social relations a bit more, but with djs and parties it's definitely adjacent / tangential in my mind

to give you an example, in the late 90s, when jungle took off in california, a lot of ppl who weren't dedicated "dance heads" heard about it through djs like r.a.w. + mictlan. since dnb is like 150-180 bpm, it mixes nicely with hip hop, dancehall, etc (i'm sure we all know this) and so that was their gimmick, they made quite a few big mixtapes that started w/ rawkus style backpacker rap or the sort of us ragga you'd hear on labels like weeded, and then eased into jungle. so you had an influx of new fans, who didn't really come in through the existing house / techno scene but instead ppl that might be more into snoop dogg and bob marley than doc martin.

this is all well and good, but hey, it's like a paragraph, not a 1500 word thinkpiece. from there, you probably end up embellishing into bullshit if you want to map anything about the music onto the party. in my experience, the dynamics of the party are determined by a million things other than the music itself - who the promoters are, what the town is like, what the people that live there are like, whether there's public transportation, are there existing bars and clubs, are there nightlife ordinances. and you can definitely write about that stuff, people often do, i suppose. but i don't think any of that really determines whether ppl at the club are listening to deep house or hard techno, and vice versa

i moonlighted as a hack fitness music support editor for a year. they turned out 140 bpm clones of top 40 tracks, like several a week, for gym classes. one of the other editors used to say "at the end of the day we're just making party music." that has lodged in my head and sort of expanded to mean a bunch of different things, a mantra in response to a lot of the self-seriousness in like resident advisor-aligned dance music culture. not that i don't like or partake in that kind of thing! xp

yeah 100% agree. it's really not that complicated

similarly you can get into the specifics of dj'ing, but it's actually super boring. i guess supposedly i do some sort of weird deep kvlt gatekeepy mystical thing by mixing vinyl + rotary, but hey, it's not rocket science, i'm basically playing two metronomes and just trying to get them to match. i can speed them up or down, and i can bump them forward or back (you can't do that with a metronome). it's a binary operation - you're either 1) too fast or 2) too slow and there's no third option to it. eq'ing is also pretty boring when you get down to it, and effects (like eq'ing and a lot of other things) are best imo when used extremely sparingly. there's nothing magical about it, it just took about five years of daily practice to get good at it, and i happen to find it more fun and engaging than playing digital, plus fuck looking at a screen for any longer than i have to (i'm pretending to work on the weekend right now, honestly, i don't even have a tv)

so yeah this is all pretty boring stuff (maybe someone can ask former ilxor mikebee about distro networks!) and maybe i guess that's why we hew to dumb myths like "in koln they have trees and big windows and eat minimal spaghetti on birch laminate folding furniture, which is why kompakt sounds like this and not like berlin techno!"

Oh yeah I totally get that writing pabout dance/electronic music is usually trash. It’s very hard to try to convey why you think a bobbins track is good because it’s not really about de the ideas behind the music for most sub-genres. If you get too technical about it is boring for most people and then some reviewers either resort to the cheap sociology you mention or get too abstract to mean anything to anybody but themselves.

Actually most of the blogs focused on electronica I followed didn’t really review the tracks. They either posted mp3s/soundcloud/youtube other streaming links without little to no info on the actual tracks. Some like “little white earbuds” did provide some small reviews. Most of them only posted tracks iirc. Most of them are long dead links nowadays. I think “keytars and violins” is still around but posts like twice a year lol.

really cool posts tlg, lots of detail and fun to read.

this all reminds me that, in my small city, there is a crew of long time house music party throwers that have sort of claimed the mantle of the "cool" party people. you can talk to them for a minute and they'll straight up admit that that's their m.o. i have not been invited to join their "cool" club, which smarts a little bit. i was asking to join for like a year. but the reality is, i'm just really turned off by their insecure and giant egos and always have been. it's not like i don't have an ego myself, but i want a bit more effort made to contribute to lower / less pressure / more breathing room on their part and it's just never there. it always comes through every time i go to one of their parties. so i've come to the conclusion that it doesn't matter how big the headlining dj they're bringing in for their next party is, which in a few weeks is eddie fowlkes and ladymonix, because there will always be a bunch of things that make it hard for me to relax and enjoy myself at their parties. some of it i'm sure is me and my own insecurities, but if i'm being real, some of it is that they really do behave like assholes a lot of the time, objectively speaking.

so i'm a little bit stuck outside of the people who play the more "sophsticated" party music that i've been drawn to in the past, that i'm still drawn to somewhat.

one of the funnest party experiences i had recently was where i threw one, and the other two djs besides me were burner adjacent tech house party dudes who are just SO ENTHUSIASTIC and FUN TO WATCH and they put their heart into it, and this kid who plays ed banger stuff from l.a., which whatever, i have no association with that kind of scene so it was just fun to watch and some of the music was undeniably pretty good and party friendly.

another thing i should clarify: i think writing about social relations is important and good! after all, i do subscribe to three newspapers, and i read them. and i think it's great when resident advisor writes about the bad behavior of certain superstar djs, or the challenges producers from (insert whatever demographic) face.

but when i read, say, the food section in the local paper, someone might be like "here's all the challenges i faced trying to get a small business loan as a young guamanian chef, and to try to get ppl to come eat fancy food in unhip nbhd x" and the author might be like "i loved how they put unexpected spice x in the chicken kelaguen", but they're never going to write "the challenges so and so faces in trying to navigate his chamorro heritage are boldly expressed in the unexpected crunchiness of the lumpia"

ok haha wait i HAVE seen restaurant reviews like that, but only in shitty pretentious rags like the nyt

xp so true, i kinda wanted to jump in the "on dj'ing" thread to say that "referral from dj who already plays that spot" is going to outweigh anything you do (reaching out, making good mixes, social media curation) by 1000x, which i 100% think the shitty reality of it, but i don't want to be buzzkill

and honestly prosaic stuff like that (so and so happened to know so and so and invited him to use the studio in exchange for bag of weed) is really how a lot of things happen, vs the heady analysis you see in a lot of early 00s writing about dance music

also i don't think the "it's just party music" point means that what djs do is boring, just that it's ephemeral and about celebration, which can be a liberating realization imo.

xp yep it's really just about being in a network of people irl where they kind of start becoming akin to family... it's also not something that can happen *just through* the internet although i think the internet can support it.

Some of us have babies and stopped listening to dance music in proper social settings :,( the only way to find bobbins is in threads like this.

I just want music to run to or to bob my head to while having some me time while sipping wine at 10pm. For those of you who are still out there, keep the bobbins you find in the wild coming.

hey moka i relate to that, even though i don't have babies, i never go out anymore and my main productive listening time is when i'm running! i am looking for new bobbins on a weekly basis, some of it is admittedly a little corny, but i would like to contribute more as i still find ilm a really valuable resource.

Belatedly, can confirm that "bobbins" originally meant "rolling thread" - there were a couple of threads literally called "Rolling X Thread" in 2004 like for country, teen-pop etc but I think dance sub-trends were the first case of ILM doing year-specific rolling threads for things, so we ended up with "Electro-House Bobbins 2005". I think the fact that the term ended up only being used for dance stuff (and specifically techno and house) was kind of a historical quirk?

i'm glad people have cleared up the origin of the name, it makes a lot more sense than what was in my warped memory lol.

i don’t want to come off as overly judgmental here, so having failed at that, i’ll clarify just one more time

i’ll always have space on my shelf for “aesthetics of rock” and “philosophy of modern music” (lol) and “more brilliant than the sun”. the last one maybe most relevant here (though meltzer probably also relevant to the lizard brain rave / warehouse / big room stuff i love). it’s imaginative and exciting and fun and set the tone for 25 years, but is it right? when you listen to 4hero stretching breaks actually experiencing time travel? i dunno, maybe!

and there’s a third stream of stuff, that talks about the effect that formal properties and social relations have on you yourself (that also doesn’t then need to stretch itself into global conclusions) that a lot of people are really good at! i sometimes ignore this stuff, because if i don’t relate to the writer’s experience i find it hard to get into it, but i’m thinking of things like kogan’s writing or tim f’s yearly roundups.

but leaving that stuff aside, compared to the first form (of explaining the music, thinkpiece style) i think it’s always going to be more valuable to focus on the stories of the people (producers, promoters, above all maybe fans and listeners) rather than the focus too much on the music itself. so if i’m going to read music writing now i’d rather read things like “techno rebels”, veloso’s “tropical truth”, stolzoff’s “wake the town and tell the people” or matos’s “underground is massive”, to name a few, because i think they really tell the story of the music and listeners vs extrapolating a story about the listening experience from the music itself

tldr: imo history, hermeneutics >> semiotics, sociology

Great and illuminating posts, tlg!

i’m an american, been around since it first “dropped”, and this never did not make sense to me. although maybe i misunderstand it? i’d heard the expression “bits and bobs” a lot growing up (to mean a collection of random things) and always assumed “bobbins” was a particularly british version of that expression

I'm also an American and a regular lurker on this thread and I love the word bobbins in this context. I love it so much I created a folder called “various bobbins” comprised exclusively of stuff I learn about in these threads. It helps me keep track of stuff.

enhanced by lack of actual knowledge or understanding of dj'ing, production, distribution networks, regional scenes, actual party culture, etc
― the late great, Sunday, August 28, 2022 12:51 PM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

I think I understand all of this, basically, but the distribution network part. I always wonder how so many labels are able to produce so much vinyl so quickly, and just assumed it was some insider bobbin mystery or a secret pressing plant that only DJs know about

Sorry to derail. Love this thread

bobbins also extremely search-friendly

great posts all

Move D • The Boogie Lander - Reggie Dokes Other Worldly Jazz Remix (Pandemix Live Jams Vol. 5 B2)

this is an incredible tune!

also appreciate the posts upthread, good read

can't remember last time I went to a club but I know I loved it, should go again, there's a good one not far from where I live and friends do monthly nights/mornings

this is not exactly a bobbins, but ... speaking of histories ...

https://tresorberlin.com/product/tresor-true-stories-english/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4TXhv2fe3w

Tri.Al.Trip - Truffles Mayo

outdoorsy shenanigans from Slovenia

I like that one a lot.

I always think of bobbins as meaning “a bit rubbish”, probably not helped by the original "electro house bobbins” thread because, well, a lot of “electro house” really was quite bobbins.

https://i.imgur.com/QAuZe6h.png

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0YDZqeKMnU

Man​/​ipulate - Primary

seafront sounds from Marseille

new Lea Lisa on Phonica, gorgeous early 90s UK techno throwback/homage

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KB9ArCIow4k

sort of echoing that move d pandemix thing in a way

mark e - heartaches

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCxQZDKYYVE

160 bpm breakbeat acid juke? yes sir, i can hardcore

ebb “blue energy drink”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77gghTO2kOU

hello party crew! as you may or may not know South Africa (Mzansi) is the world’s prime House Nation. it’s the only place in the world where six+-minute tracks informed by Mr Fingers, Chicago, acid and other house variations fill up the pop charts on the regular. did you folx even know a bobbin is a South African delicacy?

all of this to say that I’m hoping this poll I created might get the amapiano party fired up again on ILM, because we’re seriously logging… lagging behind. here’s your invitation - I hope you will all participate:

drowning in a blissful ocean of log drums and keys: 🎹🎹 amapiano a-z 🎹🎹 an ilm poll

Happy to see Sascha Funke back on Kompakt. Not micro in the least.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zf9KqVxsfc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjU0mwBSUWw

Tri.Al.Trip - Izistegagozda

The other side of Truffles Mayo. This one slipped past at first but I've ended up liking it as much as the other side, more of an MBG vibe on particularly in the second half once the substitutions were made

new Nikki Nair single is insane (150bpm electro vibes)

https://soundcloud.com/djmag/premiere-nikki-nair-where-r-u

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddX0SVT8qoI

Ted Amber - Looperman

bicycling