I totally get and respect the "i don't want my cat to get killed so i keep it inside" argument. Also, I am very glad that people have started posted pics of their cats in this thread.
― sarahell, Monday, 3 January 2022 17:31 (two years ago) link
personally I'm glad my landlord's cat killed that rat.
i stood over the rat and told it I was glad it was dead
― they were written with a ouija board and a rhyming dictionary (Neanderthal), Monday, 3 January 2022 17:34 (two years ago) link
but that's my fear of rats talking
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSuH1E4yZxA
― (I'm Not Your) Steppin' Razor (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 January 2022 17:38 (two years ago) link
if you've had to smell and/or clean up ratshit, (not saying you haven't), you also have other reasons besides fear to appreciate the rodent death
― sarahell, Monday, 3 January 2022 17:38 (two years ago) link
don't you mean this one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4H1RHqVI58
― sarahell, Monday, 3 January 2022 17:41 (two years ago) link
voted other, because it depends on where the "outside" is. would be a sin for us, as we have a nearby busy road and a garden that attracts birds.
― Ssäm Sauce | Martha Stewart (Sufjan Grafton), Monday, 3 January 2022 17:51 (two years ago) link
this whole "how dare you let your cat eat animals" stance feels a bit hypocritical.
Well yeah it would be, if anyone had ever said what you quoted there. The issue isn't "cats shouldn't eat creatures" but "cumulatively, cats decimate wild bird populations and so we should consider that when deciding to let our pets roam outdoors"
― A True White Kid that can Jump (Granny Dainger), Monday, 3 January 2022 17:58 (two years ago) link
sarahell, upon further thought I think it should be this one, do u see?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CYrJ1POzns
― (I'm Not Your) Steppin' Razor (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 January 2022 18:08 (two years ago) link
cumulatively, cats decimate wild bird populations and so we should consider that when deciding to let our pets roam outdoors
uh, that's just a more politely worded version of what I quoted ... still think that if y'all are merrily eating meat yourselves it still seems hypocritical. Or maybe the birds in your yards are just inherently more worthy of life than the ones you eat? idk ... it's not horrible to think that way tbh
― sarahell, Monday, 3 January 2022 18:11 (two years ago) link
Well yeah it would be, if anyone had ever said what you quoted there.
thx GD. I was going to say that climate change deniers and minimizers make an argument very similar to saying you must be a vegan to have legitimate concerns about the effects of half a billion cats on the ecosystem. It runs along the lines of: people who are clamoring about the climate crisis, but who still make use of gas-powered autos, fly in airplanes, or consume items transported by trucks are nothing but hypocrites, and they can't suggest that anyone else ought modify their habits until they have stopped using all fossil fuels themselves.
― more difficult than I look (Aimless), Monday, 3 January 2022 18:14 (two years ago) link
I've had inside cats all my adult life and haven't had any qualms about keeping them inside. Twice in the late oughts, an untagged/uncollared cat wandered up and adopted us, and I got it neutered and kept it fed as an outside cat. The first, Bruce, was a total stoner pal, and loved to climb into the large pot where I'd sown catnip and just laze around and occasionally smoke a bowl eat a leaf. He was safe in our fenced back yard, but one night he wandered into the front yard and was attacked and killed by roaming neighborhood dogs. This happened under my daughter's bedroom window, so she got to hear the whole thing. The next year, Ziggy adopted us, and one day went from apparently healthy to obviously dead of a respiratory issue before I could even get him to the vet. I like outside cats, and there are a couple on our block that come up to me for skritches, but the emotional whiplash is a bit much.
― Everybody Loves Ramen (WmC), Monday, 3 January 2022 18:18 (two years ago) link
sara, the issue is more one of vast ecosystem destruction with songbirds as a major marker and domesticated and feral outdoor cats as one of the key concernshttps://www.birds.cornell.edu/home/bring-birds-backhttps://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380
― i cannot help if you made yourself not funny (forksclovetofu), Monday, 3 January 2022 18:19 (two years ago) link
there are some seriously delicious vegan "meats" and "cheeses" out there ... like, hey, you care about the bird population and ecosystems and you are keeping your cats inside because of it, that is a thoughtful thing to do ... another environmentally thoughtful thing you could do is reduce your own meat consumption.
― sarahell, Monday, 3 January 2022 18:28 (two years ago) link
The wildlife issue with domestic cats is far less killing and eating than killing for sport.
The “oh but you eat meat” argument would work if you’re talking to someone who goes out in the neighborhood killing birds and squirrels for the hell of it.
― papal hotwife (milo z), Monday, 3 January 2022 18:31 (two years ago) link
The first, Bruce, was a total stoner pal, and loved to climb into the large pot where I'd sown catnip and just laze around and occasionally smoke a bowl eat a leaf.
We have friends a couple of blocks away whose dog had clearly eaten something that was making it act off, and it turns out she got into the stoner neighbor's yard and went to town on a pot plant. The vet essentially said she just needed to sleep it off.
― Josh in Chicago, Monday, 3 January 2022 18:35 (two years ago) link
also imagine a factory farmed chicken would behave a bit like Sporky if released in the wild. the evil is baked into the bird's existence.
― Ssäm Sauce | Martha Stewart (Sufjan Grafton), Monday, 3 January 2022 18:36 (two years ago) link
the problem with eating bird meat isn't that we are depleting a once thriving bird population. The problem is that we are fostering a monstrous bird population incompatible with the natural world, similar to fostering a monstrous predator cat population. In this comparison, eliminating the factory farmed bird population entirely is more similar to keeping your cat indoors. It makes no sense to draw comparison between eliminating the factory farmed bird population and eliminating the wild bird population.
― Ssäm Sauce | Martha Stewart (Sufjan Grafton), Monday, 3 January 2022 18:48 (two years ago) link
considering that the majority of ILX is not vegan, (I'm not either), this whole "how dare you let your cat eat animals" stance feels a bit hypocritical
Considering that the majority of ILX eats meat, and people are made of meat, and people are very environmentally destructive, then the whole "don't eat people" stance is also a bit hypocritical.
― ; (Ye Mad Puffin), Monday, 3 January 2022 19:06 (two years ago) link
I mean, since I eat bacon and hamburgers I might as well eat bald eagles and spotted owls and my neighbors' children, right?
Any other stance would be... hypocritical eek
― ; (Ye Mad Puffin), Monday, 3 January 2022 19:09 (two years ago) link
I feel like we've collectively addressed the weaknesses of sarahell's 'hypocrisy' argument now.
― more difficult than I look (Aimless), Monday, 3 January 2022 19:10 (two years ago) link
"still think that if y'all are merrily eating meat yourselves it still seems hypocritical"
Then I still think you're not grasping the argument being put forth. But I get that it can be pretty difficult to part with a "the people I don't agree with a just hypocrites" comfort blanket.
― A True White Kid that can Jump (Granny Dainger), Monday, 3 January 2022 19:28 (two years ago) link
(Tho fwiw I'm not a staunch "you shouldn't let your cat go outside" person)
― A True White Kid that can Jump (Granny Dainger), Monday, 3 January 2022 19:29 (two years ago) link
as milo already correctly pointed out, the emphasis on cats being 'allowed to eat birds' is somewhat misplaced since non-feral cats that hunt and kill small birds and animals rarely eat them anyway; they are usually very well-fed and do it for reasons other than appeasing their hunger.
― more difficult than I look (Aimless), Monday, 3 January 2022 19:42 (two years ago) link
because they're adorable little psychopaths
― papal hotwife (milo z), Monday, 3 January 2022 20:06 (two years ago) link
I was inspired to become vegetarian by a lost cat poster. I realized I couldn't justify my compassion for a cat while eating a different animal.
― Halfway there but for you, Monday, 3 January 2022 20:39 (two years ago) link
whenever you have the choice between killing and not killing, not killing is best. keep kitties safe inside, play with them a lot, provide stimulating environments and experiences so they don’t get bored, be a good servant and steward to all the creatures around you.
some cats won’t ever be happy with that, though, and some cat owners can’t provide it. then you have to balance the happiness/misery of the animal whose life you’ve personally taken responsibility for with the dangers and vulnerabilities of your immediate ecosystem, which can differ vastly from country to country, region to region, neighborhood to neighborhood.
gonna paws here to reiterate, keeping kitties inside is best and everyone shld try it wherever feasible
but there’s no pristine ecological system left to preserve, those horses escaped that barn centuries ago, and the barn is on fire and the horses are on fire and everything is on fire and the rising seas will swallow it all up anyway
https://www.britannica.com/science/invasive-species
https://www.un.org/sustainabledevelopment/blog/2019/05/nature-decline-unprecedented-report/
this is not to abdicate responsibility! even if everything’s burning it’s still morally indefensible to just give up and add to the blaze for the numb nihilism of it. but a dozen ilxors and their pets, strewn across the globe, will have no impact either way.
so hug your cats, spay and neuter your kids, skynet for presidetn 2024
also what is the root of Neando’s rat antipathy, i met a rat once and it was a very nice person
― cat? (cat), Monday, 3 January 2022 21:18 (two years ago) link
https://imgur.com/a/XYhJYft
― cat? (cat), Monday, 3 January 2022 21:22 (two years ago) link
Pele sez go veg
https://imgur.com/a/B7F4Iql
― cat? (cat), Monday, 3 January 2022 21:25 (two years ago) link
also buy four of horses by softer drive, available at a bandcamp near u
https://imgur.com/a/m6Lvd1V
― cat? (cat), Monday, 3 January 2022 21:45 (two years ago) link
FTR I am well aware that when I open a can of cat food for my inside cat, what he's getting is bits of birds and fish who were once alive. Further, I know that I regularly nom on animals. That doesn't mean that letting my cats loose inside the Small Mammal House at the zoo would be okay. There are differences in degree and in kind at play here.
― ; (Ye Mad Puffin), Monday, 3 January 2022 22:25 (two years ago) link
Now it makes sense why they asked me to leave that zoo
― hrep (H.P), Monday, 3 January 2022 23:53 (two years ago) link
I have an indoor cat and I am vegetarian, hmu if you want me to post an opinion itt
― rob, Tuesday, 4 January 2022 00:12 (two years ago) link
If god had wanted cats indoors hed have made them with little houses already around them imo
The diversion into the morality of veganism in animals is already a strong contender for 2022 best ofs
― pandmac (darraghmac), Tuesday, 4 January 2022 00:15 (two years ago) link
right like church mice and barn owls
― rob, Tuesday, 4 January 2022 00:17 (two years ago) link
precisely
― pandmac (darraghmac), Tuesday, 4 January 2022 00:19 (two years ago) link
opine, rob, opine!!! and post pic of catkin?
― cat? (cat), Tuesday, 4 January 2022 00:25 (two years ago) link
Ya Kid K is back againOutside cats, is it a sin?
― they were written with a ouija board and a rhyming dictionary (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 4 January 2022 00:31 (two years ago) link
human habits can foster an oversize population of one animal or another. sometimes we hunt them to prevent a disruption. I guess we don't generally shoot cats with rifles like deer, but we do catch and kill them. keeping your cat inside so it doesn't heathcliff the hood seems a reasonable and compassionate request that has nothing to do with veganism in animals.
― Ssäm Sauce | Martha Stewart (Sufjan Grafton), Tuesday, 4 January 2022 00:40 (two years ago) link
All cats guilty until proven innocent does not sound a progressive starting position to me tbh
― pandmac (darraghmac), Tuesday, 4 January 2022 00:43 (two years ago) link
^^this is the case. Each cat has a different level of aggression, different responses to the world around them. I respect all of the arguments brought against inside cats (danger of their death, effect on the environment around them), and I think about these things before deciding to allow my cats outside and only allow them out because in my context I don't see these effects really happening. Obviously I could be blind to the mass destruction they are performing or the death-hound and band of coyotes that secretly live at my neighbours and the 11:30pm traffic rush on my dead-end cul-de-sac that I have never noticed, but hey you gotta roll with the cards you've got and I think the happiness and quality of life they are getting because of their outside privileges is worth it.
Besides, they spend 90% of the day asleep on my bed anyways, lazy bastards.
― hrep (H.P), Tuesday, 4 January 2022 00:59 (two years ago) link
case in point
https://imgur.com/610YcKr
― hrep (H.P), Tuesday, 4 January 2022 01:03 (two years ago) link
test post, I think this is how you post images.
https://i.imgur.com/610YcKr.jpeg
― hrep (H.P), Tuesday, 4 January 2022 01:06 (two years ago) link
― cat? (cat), Monday, January 3, 2022 7:25 PM (thirty-four minutes ago)
opinion: people should eat less meat!
pic:
https://imgur.com/myqe2jx
― rob, Tuesday, 4 January 2022 01:08 (two years ago) link
ah right I did the thing too
https://i.imgur.com/myqe2jx.jpg
― rob, Tuesday, 4 January 2022 01:10 (two years ago) link
The diversion into the morality of veganism in animals
this was such a badly wrought provocation that you should consider turning in your provocateur's license, deems
― more difficult than I look (Aimless), Tuesday, 4 January 2022 01:11 (two years ago) link
What if i agreed to go through an agent
― pandmac (darraghmac), Tuesday, 4 January 2022 01:12 (two years ago) link
those are both really great pictures
― Dan S, Tuesday, 4 January 2022 01:18 (two years ago) link
wait did i post mine wrong, did my 3 excellent portraits not show up, should i post them again
many fine cats itt
― cat? (cat), Tuesday, 4 January 2022 01:23 (two years ago) link
xps - said agent would simply deliver similarly dismal results at one remove
― more difficult than I look (Aimless), Tuesday, 4 January 2022 01:24 (two years ago) link