Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice - From Software and Hidetaka Miyazaki's new game for PS4, XBone, PC

lol I think I finally figured it out. Don't fret about the first half of the fight, because I have that one down. But for the second one just play it like a dum-dum. Keep my far distance, slash once or twice when able. It takes a while but should be doable. in fact I almost did it a little bit ago but I had to take my daughter somewhere. lesson learned, when the enemy has an attack that can kill you instantly, better to just stay as far away from that attack as possible.

Well, this monkey's finally gone to heaven. In the end the way it played out (or at least the way I played it) was like an old school Nintendo game. Race around the arena evading or avoiding attacks, then when the opportunity arrises bounce on his head two times and run away. It took forever, but I guess it worked. I did not grab the white flower yet, though, because as I understand it once you do that then everything changes. Kind of like the blood moon (or whatever) in Bloodborne.

well done! I've started playing this through again, it takes a while to get back into the swing of parrying, but when it goes well it is so satisfying, this game has THE best combat

I guess? I'm getting pretty tired of clashing swords, which is a bummer, since at some point I wanted to dive into my copy of Ghosts of Tsushima, but thanks to this one (whether or not I totally finish it) it may be a bit. I might have to let the pendulum swim back to something less stressful and violent first, like Last of Us 2.

That was a joke.

It's been a while, but at least as I remember it I think I really prefer the risk/reward system of Bloodborne a lot more. There's no shield, but you're still trained from the start to be aggressive. You have lots of weapons to choose from, and they all have pros and cons, but nowhere near the number or options of Dark Souls. You can retrieve your echoes by racing in and killing the glowing baddie. Similarly, you can reclaim some health by quickly getting back at the baddie that got you. You don't have to parry (riposte/shoot) all the time if you don't want to, but it can help if you're good at it.

This one I think there are many more annoyances, and even a few missed opportunities, like the grappling hook, which where I am so far is more or less just another hoop to jump through, with the exception (so far) of one boss fight. Compared to how integral the similar mechanic is in Spider-man (for obvious reasons).

I do wonder, though, when they're developing these things, how they choose just what works where, and when. Like, they have a hundred different enemies. Do they just spin a wheel and say "this one is vulnerable to poison," or "this one doesn't like fire" or "this one you can take down with this particular combat skill or prosthetic?" Sometimes seems kind of arbitrary, especially compared to certain enemies that require a certain item or specific weapon. Like, headless you *need* divine confetti; otherwise there's really no reason for it to exist. Others can be hurt by snap seeds, but so far snap seeds are even harder to come by than divine confetti. Or the guys with shields, you *need* to use the prosthetic ax, but it's not hard to use, just an extra step.

Interesting to me that this one is the first of these games to more or less abandon the RPG elements (at least some of them), and also to skip both DLC and PVP. It's a lot shorter, too, isn't it? And feels really boss-heavy.

I think there are usually *lore reasons* for enemy placement and weaknesses, but it can arbitrary if you don't pay attention to that, which I often don't. And obscure mechanics are hallmark of these games obv.

It makes sense that losing the pvp is what let them commit to this combat system, it's hard to imagine no endurance + all the deflect/posture stuff working for online pvp (plus the non-customizable character, it just wouldn't make sense). But it's going to be real interesting to see what Elden Ring does as far as taking parts of all the games (like it sounds like the jumping to avoid attacks, some of the weapon blocking, etc are going to make it in along with all the traditional Souls stuff).

I mean, if you aren't feeling it by now it just may not be your game. I doubt the last parts of the game will suddenly change your mind. Ghosts might be more up your alley.

tbf, it's basically 75% like the other games, so there's a lot to like. It's just that the 25% that's different I don't think makes things better, especially after Bloodborne.

I does seem like a bad game to put away and come back to later.

It*

Yeah, muscle memory and momentum seem key. I don't hate it, I just don't like all of it, and a lot of the stuff I like the least seems least essential to the game. I could be wrong, but I don't encounter a lot of online clamoring for another Sekiro.

It's definitely more of a niche fandom but I see some people say it's their favorite. It's my favorite to watch for sure.

it's not their best but its biggest weakness is probably the way it reuses a lot of content more than anything else, a lot of minibosses you fight again & again, some areas get reused a few times etc. the core combat is as great as always with their games, even if it's faster-paced here and probably the most difficult it's ever been, i'd be very excited for a sequel. my only complaint with the core systems is spirit emblems should just be always re-stocked upon death instead of you having a finite stash that you can run out of and have to grind for - bloodborne's blood vials are similarly frustrating.

with the ape i find it's definitely worth saving spirit emblems to use the umbrella just for the scream, it's the most dangerous attack without it by far, & not having to worry about it lets you play more aggressively. there are some bosses where you do really have to play very cautiously in a more dark souls-esque manner, but with the ape you can actually just deflect a lot of stuff. there's a lot of pattern recognition as always & i think the increased difficulty in sekiro comes from there being a lot more options in-the-moment in combat than in dark souls.

Case in point re: (imo) needless bullshit. Beating the Guardian Ape took me many, many tries. I know I am not unique here, and that doesn't even include the poor fools that attempted it earlier in the game, let alone wherever/whenever I am in the game. Losing a million times to the monkey means 1) burning through my spirit emblems 2) giving everyone dragonrot 3) emerging out the other side with no XP and no gold. First, re: the gold, spirit emblems are not so easily farmed that banking them that way is better than just buying them, so if you want to restock you have to shell out gold (at an apparently inflating rate), which means farming for money (since they apparently limit the number of money bags you can buy, for some dumb reason). But second, the ape gave me 4000 or so XP, which sounds like a lot but really isn't, as the next big skill point costs some 9000 or so XP. And yet, because I expect to die many more times, so as not to waste all that effort on the ape the game more or less forced me to farm for XP, too, to bank my next skill point before losing half on the next death. Even then, there seems to be soooooooo many skill points/trees I'll be unable to unlock short of never dying, since it takes so long to save up thousands of them, let alone doing so with no setbacks. That just adds an air of unnecessary tedium, assuming I'm even able to unlock then at all before the end of the game. And if the point is to unlock them before playing the game *again*, no thanks.

It's weird, I don't remember worrying about XP or emblems this game, but maybe I just forgot.

And I never had a problem with the equivalent in Dark Souls or Bloodborne. I think it's the whole "lose half your shit" system that makes it such a strain here. Also, most enemies don't really give that much XP, so it's hard (for me) to save up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmDYUXitwMQ

My brain is so warped from watching speedruns like that one. Dude takes the ape down in like no time.

But how many hours did he play to get to that skill level? A billion?

assuming I'm even able to unlock then at all before the end of the game

you are not expected to complete the skill tree before the end of the game & a lot of the skills don't particularly matter at all. they're far less important than just levelling up from previous games. my recommendation is don't force yourself to grind out of some fear of losing out on the skill points, you're just making everything more unpleasant for yourself. unlike in previous games where levelling up can significantly make a difference, most of the skills just offer playstyle variations or some marginal benefits.

It's weird, I don't remember worrying about XP or emblems this game, but maybe I just forgot.

i don't think the XP change is a real issue at all - unlike in souls/bb you keep a skill point after death if you gain it, so it's not a total loss. however if you die a lot on a boss that you're heavily using the prosthetic against then you can completely run out of emblems, which is frustrating, but this is just a minor frustration in the same way as blood vials in bloodborne being finite was.

Oh yeah, definitely don't try to unlock the entire skill tree! That would be like trying to build a level 800 character that can use every weapon and spell in a Souls play through.

The blood vials thing is what always stops me from replaying BB tbh. It's fine the first time, when you're exploring and killing every enemy. But if you're trying to cruise through and get stuck on a boss, it's annoying to have to stop and grind. But emblems aren't as essential as vials, generally.

unlike in souls/bb you keep a skill point after death if you gain it, so it's not a total loss.

You don't lose the actual point, but if you are, say, 4500 points toward the next skill point at 10000, and you die, then suddenly you are only 2250 points toward your next skill point. And then if you die again you're down to 1100 or whatever. And so on. But if getting skill points is indeed not that important, then I guess yeah, it doesn't matter.

Anyway, I just beat the double apes, which thankfully were not as hard as the single ape. It helped that I learned/realized too late that I can drink from my purple gourd *before* he uses his terror, not as a heal but as inoculation! So as he roars I just swing away. And to that end, I also learned that the headless ape is weak to divine confetti, for whatever reason, so that made it that much easier. The other brown monkey, fwiw, thankfully does not grab, does not fart and does not throw poo, among other downgrades, and it doesn't have too much health, either. So all it took was some firecrackers and quick ass kicking to get it out of the way. One thing that happened that surprised me, though, was that after I killed the headless ape (for, what, the fourth time?) the red deathblow icon flashed *again*, so I instinctively hit R1, just in case I hadn't closed the deal. (Which has happened before, I panic in shock that I've finally "killed" it and actually miss my cue and basically have to hit it again to get the deathblow cue back.) Only this time when I hit R1 I somehow used my mortal blade, which I literally forgot I had (even though it has been on my back for most of the game), killing the ape/centipede/whatever for the fifth or sixth time and getting me another ninja skill! That was pretty cool.

OK, I can tell these last few bits are going to be a pain, but I do appreciate this game's endgame. Ghost enemies have started to appear here and there, I think it's getting darker outside (?) and now I suppose I need to fight my way through the castle again, with new, tougher enemies? I guess I don't mind, it's kind of like having a DLC built in. It's also kind of a relief to realize that skill points are not that important, and certainly not as important as prosthetics can be. It would have been really frustrating to get this game a couple of years ago and dive in blind thinking it was even possible, or at least practical, to get all those skill points and combat arts. I suppose only letting you use one combat art at a time is a hint they're not really necessary, even if the ability to pause for once does let you switch things around on the fly, however awkwardly.

Something else novel (for From) about these games is whereas past games of its ilk encouraged you to separate and fight groups of enemies, or gives you the option to run past them, here there are a few choke points of ninja gank squads that all but indicate you're supposed to outright skip them if you can/want, like the super aggro nu rooftop ninjas or those annoyingly agile little toadstool guys. They're just not worth the effort, really, especially in groups.

It's happened a couple of times now, but I love it when the NPCs fight. And as cheap as it was, needing to fight another ninja mini boss again ... with a second ninja hiding in the corner, was worth it for me to (after dying a bunch to both of them) learn I needed to puppet the second one and let it take out a hunk of health from the main one before I stood a fighting chance.

Oh, so now I have to fight two more bosses, one after the other, to get the first "bad" ending? Or I have choose a different ending and fight different bosses? And then there are two more potential endings? Yeah, I think I may just call it a day on this game. I really couldn't care less about the "plot," as such, and generally I haven't really been enjoying the boss fights that much, which have been almost exclusively aggro sword fights. This game is fine but I just didn't get much out of it. All the upgrading, the prayer beads, the combat arts, the prosthetic, they never really felt like they gave me much more power or advantage, it was all pretty imperceptible, since so much of the game is built around deflecting/parrying/posture. Which, if that's your thing, I can totally see someone really digging this. But from my perspective - and who knows, coming right after RDR2 might have been the problem - this feels both more difficult and more rote than that Soulsborne games, which makes it less ... fun. All work and no play, etc. It had its moments, though, and I'm glad I made it through as much as I did.

Oh shit, it looks like there is a *ton* more!? Yeah, nah. I can't do it, don't want to do it.

well done! I've started playing this through again, it takes a while to get back into the swing of parrying, but when it goes well it is so satisfying, this game has THE best combat

― Critique of the Goth Programme (Neil S), Thursday, 7 October 2021 08:06 bookmarkflaglink

otm.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQeeRBtQgzE

What a show off. At least, I assume they're showing off. I watched it blindfolded.

This is the only Fromsoft Soulsbornelike game I don't own. I've badly wanted to check it out for a while now as it seems to polarise opinion - a real Marmite game. But it's always very expesnive (£60 full price, £40 in CEX). It's on sale on PSN at the moment for £30 and I am trying not to spend too much more this month. Do I snap it up? Is it worth it?

fwiw i loved it. as mentioned above, my favourite combat in any fromsoft game.

Do it! It's their tightest game, just know that it's less "play however you want" and more about learning the combat systems as they are. And it has a grappling hook.

People have called it a rhythm game, and I guess if you are a person who really doesn't do well with reacting to cues in a reasonable amount of time, then you might not enjoy it.

Okay I've done it. If I can't afford to eat by the end of the month at least I'll have Sekiro

Oh wow this game is sooo good and sooo funny

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUCoUivFlIU

First impressions:

- a beautiful looking game on the whole. Nice to see after the browns and monochromes of the other Soulsborne games (other than Elden Ring of course)
- Love the whole sneaky stealth getting the drop on enemies part of the game. It takes real tact
- love the combat side of it for the most part but not sure about the unblockable moves. I can't seem to anticipate what the enemies are telegraphing in time. Does the Japanese word that flashes up change according to what move they're going to do?
- those giant roosters should not be underestimated. The number of times I've cleared the last soldier out of an area only to have a chicken kill me from behind...
- pretty as it is, I hope the decor switches up a bit as at the moment it's mostly pagodas and snow
- it seems you can skip while parts of this game? You can run past everything. There was a mini boss dressed in white who did a lot of thrust attacks I just couldn't deflect. I got fed up with him and found some other area that took me up to a cave and now I'm in a whole new place with buildings on fire. I can't tell if I've just snuck past the boss or if I've taken an alternate route
- in conclusion: lots of fun, but tough as old boots even for a FromSoft game

the roosters are assholes.

It wouldn't be a From game if you couldn't run past 99% of enemies.

It's been awhile...I remembered that you don't have the Mikiri counter (for countering thrust attacks) at the start of the game, but had forgotten that you have to get it from the skill tree: https://sekiroshadowsdietwice.wiki.fextralife.com/Mikiri+Counter. It's extremely satisfying to pull off, and for some fights you're trying to read low attacks vs thrust attacks vs normal ones.

That mini-boss is probably optional, and I think there are some parts of the game that can be done in a different order?

I seem to have no problem doing things like the mikiri counter on the practice zombie. Bosses feel different

Without question, the "Sekiro" bosses are harder than anything in the other From games. So many of the fights are about timing, with no room for error, and the imposed limitations of the game make it hard to steamroll anything through cheese or OP technique.

It confounds me why sometimes in these games certain parts seem a lot easier than others. I struggled so much on most of the mini bosses but I merked Demon Ogyoubu Oniwa (the guy on the horse) first attempt with hardly any damage

For all its emphasis on deflecting and smart counterattacks, I've found that the best strategy for this game so far is generally to attack as aggressively as possible

Piece of piss

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffYBCpY4D3M

In general, this one and Bloodborne are the two From games that reward aggression the most.

Piece of piss

📹

Oh I struggled so much with even some of the minor minibosses. Chained Ogre took ages

Every one of these games have a couple of bosses that are just absolute pushovers. No idea why. If memory serves, just about every other boss in Sekiro is a huge, imposing challenge, with the exception of one novelty boss level.

the pushover is a delight in sekiro. just a lovely gimmick boss level.

I just googled to remind myself, and man, there are some bosses and mini bosses that gave me sooooo much trouble.

It was the Demons Souls bosses that confounded me the most. I think I only had major trouble with about three of them? And half of them went down first time. Some of them barely put up a fight at all, just stood there letting me wail on them