You Can't Be 20: Old-Person Songs by Young People

maybe gram parsons, "return of the grievous angel"? i guess it depends on how you interpret "Twenty thousand roads I went down, down, down", but he was still in his early 20s when he wrote that. need factchecking on how many roads GP went down down down before dying

Not sure he wrote the lyrics for that song?

oh shoot, is that right? i really don't much at all about his songwriting practices, partners/collaborators, etc, so i'm sure you're right

don't ^know^ much at all

"Wish that I knew what I know now / when I was younger" - Faces, all 27-28 at the time

That kind of thinking sets in pretty young in a lot of people, doesn't it? I remember regretting the decisions of my school and college years quite soon afterwards.

tbh quite a lot of stuff in this thread sounds like the words of youth.

I can't remember the band, but I friend saw an early 90s reunion of a first gen hardcore band where the thirtysomething singer hobbled his way on stage with a walker. And when I started my own thirtysomething punk band in the wake of 9/11, we certainly felt oooooold. Double Negative had the right idea to just ignore that shit and rip.

Rush - I Think I'm Going Bald and Lakeside Park, both written by Neil Peart in his early 20s.

I recall someone saying this about a song by Throwing Muses from the first album because they were only 16 or something, don't remember which song but all that album is stunning

Ian Anderson, 29 y.o. when Jethro Tull released to album Too Old to Rock & Roll, Too Young to Die

The Tull album is explicitly about the character of Ray Lomas, aging rocker (in the mods vs. rockers sense).

I wonder if there's a distinction between songs where:
- young people feel nostalgic for their childhood (which, for them, is not actually that long before)
- young people empathize with or imagine being "actually" old people

I've also read that much of the Disintegration album was written in response to turning 30.

― Ex Slacker, Monday, September 27, 2021 7:08 PM

and bloodflowers upon turning 40. he was seemingly born with bittersweet nostalgia hardwired into his heart.

i think roddy frame from aztec camera and archy marshall from king krule both seem worth a mention here. i can't think of any songs specifically mentioning age because they're both overbearing blowhard poetic types -the type which i can't seem to get enough of- but things like "knife" (the song) and "rock bottom" feel relevant.

- young people feel nostalgic for their childhood (which, for them, is not actually that long before)
- young people empathize with or imagine being "actually" old people

The first few songs I listed are a mix of the two, so--without really thinking about it--I guess I had both meanings in mind.

"Time and time again see I be thinking about that future" - Andre 3000, 19, on the opening line of Outkast's debut album.

Balcony Beach by Latyrx. Lyrics Born was 25 when rapping about how his hair is falling out and new information can be a challenge for him to comprehend.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tfX62bK1Ufc

The Cure song "I Want to Be Old" is definitely presented as irony.

Some of these sound like a singer-songwriter trying to inhabit a persona ("Angel from Montgomery"), or empathize with the old (like "Hello in There").

I think the spirit of the original post might be "sounding old before your time."

Another category ("Darling Be Home Soon") might be "people who think they're old but really aren't."

"Dark Was the Night, Cold Was the Ground" was recorded by Blind Willie Johnson at the age of 30, but he sounds at least 130

Snail Mail has this vibe, but strong.

Balcony Beach by Latyrx. Lyrics Born was 25 when rapping about how his hair is falling out and new information can be a challenge for him to comprehend.

This just came up on a playlist and I immediately thought of this thread. Came here to post this. Great song.

"The Circle Game" ("We're captive on the carousel of time"--Joni Mitchell, 24

came here to post this one, and it's in clemenza's OP! one tiny amendment: although her version came out on 1970's Ladies of the Canyon, she was performing it as early as 1966, at age 22. the 1970 recording is lovely, and a great capper to the album, but it almost makes more sense as a wistful mid-60s folkie meditation on childhood and growing up, than as a statement on countercultural coming-of-age. that is, as far as micro-genres of this type of lyric are concerned, i'd slot it alongside "Puff, the Magic Dragon," which Peter Yarrow seems to have written/adapted while a college student in the late 50s.

she was performing it as early as 1966

...and she wrote it as a reply to "Sugar Mountain" (which gave this thread its title) before either had been recorded.
I wonder if she saw a certain extra nostalgia in recording the song four years after it was written; I've read interviews where she has been dismissive of the lyrics compared to what she saw as more sophisticated later work.

Joni OTM. Paul Simon also tends to dismiss early work as juvenilia. I love both artists inordinately but am not eager to hear "Circle Game" or "Dangling Conversation" again any time soon.

Paul Simon did that early on the sleeve notes of his "Songbook" album

I see Richard Thompson has been mentioned upthread - excellent choice. Meet on the Ledge also fits, and was written when he was just 19. Interesting how a fair few artists mentioned in this thread are folk singers - maybe knoweldge of all those centuries-old songs put their own mortality in perspective.

Recently discovered this one on an Oldies show: "The Old Crowd" sung by the then-17 year-old Lesley Gore (not sure who wrote it)

[Intro]
Sometimes I get to thinkin' 'bout days gone by
And I start cryin' every time
What I wouldn't give if I could just relive
One day with those old friends of mine

[Verse 1]
No one ever planned it, but every day at four
We would get together at the corner candy store
We would just ignore the sign, "No dancing allowed"
Oh wo yeah, how I miss the old crowd

[Verse 2]
Sally was the funny one, Sue wore the hippest clothes
Eddie was the wise guy, was always one of those
Johnny used to sing off-key, but boy he was loud
Oh woah yeah, how I miss the old crowd

[Bridge]
Well now, it is funny when high school are through
Friendships always come to an end
Everybody tells you they'll keep in touch, yeah
But you don't see them again

[Verse 3]
Oh no, It's not that I'm unhappy; I know I still have you
But I still think about those good times we knew
We were so carefree, our hearts were on cloud
Oh woah yeah, I miss the old crowd

[Outro]
Oh, how I miss the old crowd
Yeah, how I miss the old crowd

I'm 26 and would greatly enjoy more songs by youngsters about how their lives have been relatively, disappointingly static for about fifteen years or so

Self-XP Wiki says "The Old Crowd" was written by Goffin/King! Which totally makes sense because it really feels like the musings of a married with children couple in their early 20s.

The Carpenters were 26 and 23 when they released the super-nostalgic "Yesterday Once More"

"The Class of '57" by the Statler Bros. (Released in 1972)

Tommy's selling used cars
Nancy's fixing hair
Harvey runs a grocery store
And Margaret doesn't care

Jerry drives a truck for Sears
And Charlotte's on the make
And Paul sells life insurance
And part-time real estate

Helen is a hostess
Frank works at the mill
Jenett teaches grade school
And probably always will

Bob works for the city
And Jack's in lab research
And Peggy plays organ at the Presbyterian Church

And the class of '57 had its dreams
We all thought we'd change the world with our great works and deeds
Or maybe we just thought the world would change to fit our needs
The class of '57 had its dreams

Betty runs a trailer park
Jan sells Tupperware
Randy's on an insane war
And Mary's on welfare

Charlie took a job with Ford
And Joe took Freddie's wife
Charlotte took a millionaire
And Freddie took his life

John is big in cattle
Ray is deep in debt
Where Mavis finally wound up is anybody's bet

Linda married Sonny
Brenda married me
And the class of all of us is just part of history

And the class of '57 had its dreams
But living life, day and day, is never like it seems
Things get complicated when you get past eighteen
But the class of '57 had its dreams

Oh, the class of '57 had its dreams

I'd say the Carpenters one is the American Graffiti-type situation in which in 1973 America, ten years ago seemed liked ages ago.

"In My Life" (John Lennon, 25...not a personal favourite, but obviously it fits)

there are a lot of 80s Madness songs that have this melancholy ruminative focus on childhood memories from the perspective of early-mid 20 somethings, but possibly this is a distinct thing from the old before your time type songs, ruminating on your childhood is maybe a typical early 20 something thing to do?

Madness were only young when they started having hits, late teens to early 20s, only a few years older than the kids buying their records, and this was obviously part of their appeal, that they were peers of their young fans, but even from the start there's this sense of people looking back at the youth they've just left behind, even if only recently

Their last album before they broke up (Mad Not Mad from 1985) has lots of lyrics about ageing and weariness, I think that's to do with the band coming to an end and tiredness of being on the record/promote/tour carousel non stop for several years, which is maybe why a lot of young pop stars end up writing these kind of songs.

Mood-wise, not even remotely the same thing, but Ian MacKaye was 23 when Minor Threat put out "Salad Days" (their last single, I think). In his world, 23 actually was old.

I think people in their mid-20s are often more nostalgic for childhood/teen years than older folks

Miley Cyrus had a god awful single last year called Used To Be Young. She was 30 at the time on release. Absolute pensioner.

I don't know if this counts but I think Leonard Cohen wrote "Tonight Will Be Fine" (my favorite Leonard Cohen song) in about 1968. When he was maybe 32 or 34?

It begins "sometimes I find I get to thinking of the past."

in 1973 America, ten years ago seemed liked ages ago

The Beach Boys reminisced about the days of rock and roll in "Do You Remember", released in 1964!

Ray Davies had this market cornered.

― Are You Still in Love With Me, Klas-Göran? (Tom D.), Monday, 27 September 2021 15:16 (two years ago) bookmarkflaglink

Bears repeating. Just one example, "Where Have All the Good Times Gone" was written when he was 21.

As the man himself said:

"We'd been rehearsing 'Where Have All the Good Times Gone' and our tour manager at the time, who was a lot older than us, said, 'That's a song a 40-year-old would write'."

Apparently, once a single left the charts it was impossible to find it. So when the Oldies But Goodies LPs came out in the early 1960s they were recapturing something that had been very ephemeral, if only two or three years old. Pop culture moved so fast in part because stuff disappeared from radio and theaters and shops quickly. No matter how poptimist we’d like to be I don’t think we can internalize that sentimentalism. Play it again Sam, etc.

True story: On New Year's Eve of maybe 1990 I was on the roof of the John F. Kennedy Center for the Performing Arts with some friends.

Someone started singing "Still Crazy After All These Years." Most of us were twenty or so.

The oldest person among us (who may have been, yikes, and 22) said to stop it, because "all these years" should be reserved for older persons with longer shared histories.

Okay, point taken, but Paul Simon was probably or 32 when he wrote that line

Yeah, but I bet those people are a lot crazier today

idk y'all, everyone has a past. does a 30 year old former child star get to feel old? i'd say yeah, myself.

absolute king of the young old men has to be orson welles though, right? not a song per se, but him doing "hearts of age" at 19...

i read a lot of the songs upthread about being "old" as just depression. or trauma. like, having a friend die, that'll make you feel old.

i think sometimes about dylan's "so much older than" and mitchell's "both sides now" - there aren't in fact two sides, but it's easy for me to fall into thinking that way.

this whole thing kinda reminds me of those Twitter threads of people in the 50's and 60's who looked like old men in their early thirties, people just seemed to age faster back then

― frogbs

i got a picture of me at age 22 where i look twice that age. i look like i'm about to yell at some kids to tell them to get off my lawn. then i got a picture of me actually _at_ about twice that age, and i look, god, i look at least 60 in that one.

i got no idea how old i look now. i got no idea how old i _am_ now. i mean, i can give you a number. i can give you a couple of numbers. i went to a friend's birthday party a couple months ago. she was turning five. she's looking forward to retiring - she's eligible this year.

Most all of the songs I named date to the mid-late '60s; I'm guessing there was just so much happening so fast, a lot of these people felt prematurely old.

― clemenza

that's the thing, right? it gets graded on a curve. if i hang out with people my age, they don't see me as old, but mostly i don't hang out with people my age. the people i hang out with are younger than me _and getting younger_. transfem HRT will knock ten years off your age over the course of two years or so. do things change fast around me? fuck yes, things change fast. when it comes to transition, two years is a generation. i'm more than four years in and i've started aging forward again. candy darling was 29 when she died, "bored by everything. You might say bored to death." how old does she look in that famous picture?

I did not know the song "Class of '57" but I am picturing Charlotte as Charlotte from Sex and the City.

Sort of reminds me of my favorite Dylan line, "some are mathematicians, some are carpenters' wives," though I think it works better as a single line than as an entire song.

Probably why the Statlers haven’t won a Nobel

Marmalade’s “Reflections Of My Life” seems to fit, though like “Heart of Gold” and several other examples, it definitely feels like it swings between old man POV (“all my sorrows/sad tomorrows/take me back/to my old home”) and young man perspective (all the “changing” and “rearranging” the singer is doing of his life). It actually has two singers, with one sounding older than the other. Anyway, neither band member who wrote it was older than 25 at the time.

the class of what, '09? did the class of '09 have dreams? come to think of it '09 was my 15 year reunion.

i don't know. i don't think i can look at '94 and see a bunch of young people who had big dreams. i mean i had 'em. they were pissant dreams, though.

I wonder if any of the class of 57 had dreams of being Country Music artists, cause that seemed to work out for a few of them

Libba Cotten - "Freight Train" age 11

When I'm dead and in my grave
No more good times here I crave
Place the stones at my head and feet
And tell them all I've gone to sleep

When I die, Lord bury me deep
Down at the end of old Chestnut Street
So I can hear old Number Nine
As she comes rolling by

Great revive…

I think people in their mid-20s are often more nostalgic for childhood/teen years than older folks

R.E.M.’s “Catapult” to thread

some are mathematicians, some are carpenters' wives

When I first heard Tangled up in Blue around age 16 it struck me as very much what it might feel like to look back at your life at 35, and by 35 I’d realized it was pretty accurate. A song about aging that is pitched very precisely! It captures a twisting path of memories where you can only see so far back and so far ahead.