Low: Classic or classic?

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"they just stuck around too long, making not-so-great records compared to their first flush. "

This is an absurd opinion. You might not like their direction but this description seems totally off the mark.

― husked, tonal wails (irrational), Wednesday, September 8, 2021 2:52 PM (seventeen minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

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Sorry Husked - I just checked with the opinion patent office and it's actually registered as a valid one.

^TwIn*InFiNiTiVeS^, Wednesday, 8 September 2021 15:14 (eleven months ago) link

I used to write comments like that when a band branched out from a genre style I was overly dedicated to. Sounds like they developed their sound and it wasn’t to Twin’s taste and they’re confusing that with the idea that band itself is floundering.

― Evan, Wednesday, September 8, 2021 2:57 PM (sixteen minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink
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I'm not confusing a change of tack with an objective drop in quality. To me, what I've heard of their later work just doesn't move me as much as their earlier work - therefore I think it's not so great - it's not an even remotely controversial opinion to hold !

^TwIn*InFiNiTiVeS^, Wednesday, 8 September 2021 15:18 (eleven months ago) link

i do think it's valid!

it's good when people disagree, it stirs up the pot a little too. i generally prefer their earlier stuff, too, though i include Things We Lost in the Fire in that too (maybe since it was the first I heard and got obsessed with). the new albums are very good and fully contemporary, which is a really hard trick for a band going on...carry the 2...65 years now. but if you were obsessed with the (_beautiful_) sounds of their first albums, the absolute quiet and the intensity - that stuff is still there now, but it's balanced by waves of noise and filtering. it's quite different, and - like all music - not objectively "better" or "worse"

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 8 September 2021 15:20 (eleven months ago) link

i never got around to making any sort of point, sorry. instead i did the preamble where i was like "both sides!"

but what i meant to say was i totally get someone who exclusively listens to low's 90s material only and prefers it. i wouldn't put it in terms of "they got worse", but "they got different". sometimes just holding onto the original perfect gemstone is fine

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 8 September 2021 15:37 (eleven months ago) link

<i>cold, inhuman, non-spiritual </i>

These are not words I would describe Double Negative or the new one. I've been the reverse of Twin - when I discovered the band (late 90's) I thought they were interesting but boring. Hadn't heard anything from them for 20 years and then Double Negative comes out and it clicks. They're peaking right now and making me revisit their old stuff again.

Maybe in time the warmth, humanity and spirituality of these last two records will shine through for you.

octobeard, Wednesday, 8 September 2021 16:58 (eleven months ago) link

I'm not confusing a change of tack with an objective drop in quality. To me, what I've heard of their later work just doesn't move me as much as their earlier work - therefore I think it's not so great - it's not an even remotely controversial opinion to hold !

― ^TwIn*InFiNiTiVeS^, Wednesday, September 8, 2021 11:18 AM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

You'd originally framed it as the band getting worse, not just that it doesn't move you as much. I was responding to that. I have nothing against you saying the post-90s material is not for you.

Evan, Wednesday, 8 September 2021 17:14 (eleven months ago) link

I will come clean and say that I prefer everything up to and including "Trust" to anything they made after, and my preference is pretty strong. But Low are among my favorite bands, so I also love the newer stuff, barring "Cmon" and "The Invisible Way." The latter suffers from Tweedy's production and staid songwriting, and the former just doesn't click with me. I've tried many times, even within the past year because of this thread, and I just don't hear anything in it that grabs me.

The first six records tho? whew.

Kind regards, Anus (the table is the table), Wednesday, 8 September 2021 19:54 (eleven months ago) link

If we're talking the NEW new stuff, then I am much more enthusiastic. Everything since "Ones and Sixes" has been great...there were just a few years there where I get a little 'eh'

Kind regards, Anus (the table is the table), Wednesday, 8 September 2021 19:56 (eleven months ago) link

Which, yknow, addiction and the aftermath, maybe that has something to do with it.

Kind regards, Anus (the table is the table), Wednesday, 8 September 2021 19:56 (eleven months ago) link

I swear I will never understand the whole "Tweedy's production" thing on Invisible Way...like I know he's the dad rock boogie man so you gotta distance yourself but seriously it just sounds like an organically, pretty naturalistic record, not even that far from Things we Lost in the Fire....if it were the same exact record done by Jimmy McProducerhead no one would ever mention the production

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvqMfZE41pY

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 8 September 2021 20:10 (eleven months ago) link

You're probably right, but a bunch of sub-par songs in his hands is not great.

Kind regards, Anus (the table is the table), Wednesday, 8 September 2021 20:28 (eleven months ago) link

It also sounds like he's pushing the Tweed to 11

Kind regards, Anus (the table is the table), Wednesday, 8 September 2021 20:28 (eleven months ago) link

Oh, did I hear a dustmote? Jeff Tweedy must have produced it.

Kind regards, Anus (the table is the table), Wednesday, 8 September 2021 20:29 (eleven months ago) link

they've said the acoustic direction on the invisible way was less about tweedy pushing them in that sort of direction and more just that his studio had lots of great acoustic instrumentation they decided to play around with. the songs are unusually weak for them though yeah

double negative really is a masterpiece on the level of kid a or loveless, etc., finding that real sweet spot between experimentation and accessibility

ufo, Wednesday, 8 September 2021 20:37 (eleven months ago) link

"on my own" is the single gem on the invisible way

ufo, Wednesday, 8 September 2021 20:43 (eleven months ago) link

i remember liking "amethyst" but its been a while

ciderpress, Wednesday, 8 September 2021 20:50 (eleven months ago) link

new album gives me "royalty free inspirational youtube music" vibes. still good tho.

kurt schwitterz, Wednesday, 8 September 2021 20:57 (eleven months ago) link

C'mon is my favorite of their later period ones, the rest didn't click as much with me. still need to spend more time with double negative though

ciderpress, Wednesday, 8 September 2021 20:57 (eleven months ago) link

You're probably right, but a bunch of sub-par songs in his hands is not great.

― Kind regards, Anus (the table is the table), Wednesday, September 8, 2021 3:28 PM (thirty-seven minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

i think it's probably the least of their albums but if, say, they had come to his studio with all the songs off secret name or TWLITF i don't think the conversation would be about tweedy's (to my ears) fairly hands off sounding production it would be about all the great songs

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 8 September 2021 21:08 (eleven months ago) link

ums otm. I know there's a kneejerk hatred for Wilco and Tweedy around here but I think he takes a really unfair share of the blame for that record.

a superficial sheeb of intelligence (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Wednesday, 8 September 2021 21:11 (eleven months ago) link

i'd bet his method isn't real different than albini's - have the band play really good quality instruments and set up really expensive microphones and then record

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 8 September 2021 21:16 (eleven months ago) link

I think we're all subject to both good or bad brand perception from time to time despite the actual quality of the product.

Evan, Wednesday, 8 September 2021 21:29 (eleven months ago) link

i'm listening to every low album in a row and i'm very depressed

STOCK FIST-PUMPER BRAD (BradNelson), Thursday, 9 September 2021 20:09 (eleven months ago) link

Counterbalance it. Watch all the Fast and the Furious movies in a row or something.

Ned Raggett, Thursday, 9 September 2021 20:13 (eleven months ago) link

It's funny, I don't find them depressing, I find them deeply spiritual experiences.

Kind regards, Anus (the table is the table), Thursday, 9 September 2021 21:10 (eleven months ago) link

I don't mind the low-key (ha) production on Invisible Way as a change of pace, and the Mimi songs are great (Just Make It Stop is one of their best!).

Also just learned that the guy who produced C'mon (which sounds amazing imo) was Katy Perry's touring guitarist/MD and does vocal production for huge pop records: http://mcdman.com/beckley

change display name (Jordan), Thursday, 9 September 2021 21:27 (eleven months ago) link

first two albums are pretty depressing, to me, it's different after that though

STOCK FIST-PUMPER BRAD (BradNelson), Thursday, 9 September 2021 21:29 (eleven months ago) link

secret name has one of their bleakest atmospheres imo

ufo, Thursday, 9 September 2021 21:36 (eleven months ago) link

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sebDnwlEnPs

StanM, Friday, 10 September 2021 12:44 (eleven months ago) link

secret name has one of their bleakest atmospheres imo

― ufo, Thursday, September 9, 2021 2:36 PM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

i guess we're all revealing that we have very different ideas about low and certain low records, but i find the atmosphere of secret name overwhelmingly warm. just on the surface the addition of strings and keyboards and albini's recording does so much to make their sound inviting instead of what it was before: awesome but at times forbiddingly minimal, especially in the stretched out silences of the curtain hits the cast (which is not a criticism, curtain is still my favorite early low record). and these new additions are only applied with the subtlest of touches! it's remarkable

if we were talking about long division though, absolutely

STOCK FIST-PUMPER BRAD (BradNelson), Friday, 10 September 2021 13:38 (eleven months ago) link

low songs that somehow contain their entire career within them:

do you know how to waltz?
don't understand

STOCK FIST-PUMPER BRAD (BradNelson), Friday, 10 September 2021 13:39 (eleven months ago) link

Nice review on p4k today, as if I wasn't already excited enough to hear this. I've avoided everything so far and my copy should be awaiting me when I get home from work today.

a superficial sheeb of intelligence (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Friday, 10 September 2021 13:40 (eleven months ago) link

oh yeah long division is the other one i find really bleak, probably their most glacial apart from songs for a dead pilot, which is a real extreme of their sound.

the curtain hits the cast & i can live in hope aren't quite as bleak to me, there's a faint warmth to them, while at times on secret name that warmth goes out completely - "i remember", "don't understand" and "days of" especially.

ufo, Friday, 10 September 2021 13:49 (eleven months ago) link

i guess even on the darker parts of i could in hope, like "cut", there's still some sort of catharsis

ufo, Friday, 10 September 2021 13:54 (eleven months ago) link

maybe the more appropriate contrast how warm secret name seems to me is songs for a dead pilot, which is slowcore so pushed to its limit that it fragments and goes abstract

STOCK FIST-PUMPER BRAD (BradNelson), Friday, 10 September 2021 14:06 (eleven months ago) link

this is btw the best band of all time

STOCK FIST-PUMPER BRAD (BradNelson), Friday, 10 September 2021 14:07 (eleven months ago) link

there's definitely moments of real warmth on secret name but when it's bleak it's really bleak, which is what colours it that way for me. i get what you mean

i really can't think of any band with a better overall discography, it's really ridiculous how good they are

ufo, Friday, 10 September 2021 14:12 (eleven months ago) link

there's definitely moments of real warmth on ________ but when it's bleak it's really bleak

This is the description of pretty much every Low album. No album is entirely warm nor entirely bleak. What’s interesting to me is that they have been bleak in a dozen different ways, and their warmth is one of the most beautiful things in music.

sctttnnnt (pgwp), Friday, 10 September 2021 14:39 (eleven months ago) link

Hell, there are some individual Low songs that are both warm and bleak. The verses of "(That's How You Sing) Amazing Grace" are spare and glacial-feeling, and the chorus is soaring and warm.

Kind regards, Anus (the table is the table), Friday, 10 September 2021 15:58 (eleven months ago) link

I resisted downloading before just now, eugh this record is so good.

Kind regards, Anus (the table is the table), Friday, 10 September 2021 15:59 (eleven months ago) link

Ok this rules.

I wanted to love the last two like I'm loving this.

change display name (Jordan), Friday, 10 September 2021 16:02 (eleven months ago) link

Yes it does. The way White Horses starts is amazing, as is the way it segues into I Can Wait.

willem, Friday, 10 September 2021 16:17 (eleven months ago) link

did not know:

Fun fact: the vinyl mix of C’mon is actually different than the digital, as we kept skipping the needle during vinyl mastering, so had to re approach the mix ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

— matt Beckley (@teneightEight) September 10, 2021

StanM, Friday, 10 September 2021 16:39 (eleven months ago) link

That's pretty common, right? Gotta be increasingly common given how loud records are often mixed/mastered these days.

change display name (Jordan), Friday, 10 September 2021 16:47 (eleven months ago) link

Esp lots of deep electronic bass, the first record by the band Police is actually mono because they couldn't accommodate the bass in stereo

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Friday, 10 September 2021 16:54 (eleven months ago) link

Nice review on p4k today

lol "8.4," I guess that's where the dart landed. It's shame the band just played the 'Fork fest in 2019, because if ever there were a weekend when Low should be on the bill it's this one.

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 10 September 2021 17:07 (eleven months ago) link

they are playing a really cool outdoor festival called the square lake festival tonight and tomorrow night in mn, hoping to score a way in, but it should be lovely, i would imagine this is more their speed, hoping to get a way in even though it's sold out

https://www.squarelakefestival.com/

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Friday, 10 September 2021 17:38 (eleven months ago) link

The album fucking rules

a gentle push against my Wonder Bread face (DJP), Friday, 10 September 2021 19:44 (eleven months ago) link

xposts warm and bleak go together naturally i think. depression/sadness is often like a warm blanket you wrap around yourself; it can become the most comfortable

"HYYOOOOOOONK!" is the sound I make (Karl Malone), Friday, 10 September 2021 20:42 (eleven months ago) link


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