What in God's Green Goodness Are We Up To In Afghanistan?

I just finished reign of terror by Spencer Ackerman. Recommended for fans of ending wars. Absolutely deranged 25 year period. I was either too young or too not in the UK or US for some of it, but most of it id just forgotten. When you lay it all out … It really got out of hand, huh?!

I am just wondering what you guys have achieved to reverse this situation

Until you've overthrown the political and economic structure governing the US and its lackey states, you can't criticize it. We have reached peak galaxy brain here, I think.

Or maybe criticizing female journalists for not having overthrown the political and economic structure and going along with the few options given to them is harsh. What can be said is that they have actually been journalists in Afghanistan, which I don't know, seems that it might have had a more positive impact on society than whatever the Nihilist Co-op of ILX have been able to muster with their hundreds thousand of posts.

and there was me thinking that posting opinions on ilx was changing the world - you daft prick!

van horn street more like shoe horn deez arguments heyoooooo

can't believe all those days of xyzzzz doing actual canvassing and boots-on the ground work over many years has been invalidated by too many internet posts, keep on moving those goalposts VHS

this whole demanding-qualifications thing is a super weird trip, even for you

(in other words m bison is otm as usual xp)

i want to zing VHS but i'm having trouble understanding what the argument even is

can you criticize journalists OFF the internet? but only if they are men? are women ever accountable for their actions or is it ok because they are doing the only job they could get?

going along with the few options given to them

Were the Times and WaPo given powers of conscription or something?

i see this argument made in different forms that "well if she was more X she wouldn't be here because there aren't opportunities for women" but like, why is that my problem? the men on CNN are this bad at their jobs too.

took one post to go from "mega media corporations are perpetuating neocolonialism with journalistic practices aimed at maximizing viewership in order to maximime shareholder profits over the true aims of journalism" to "seems that it might have had a more positive impact on society than blah blah blah"

VHS what have you achieved to tell a pakistani woman her criticism of western journalists swarming the middle east is wrongheaded? 🤔

can you criticize journalists OFF the internet? but only if they are men? are women ever accountable for their actions or is it ok because they are doing the only job they could get?

― criminally negligible (harbl), Monday, August 30, 2021 8:07 PM (eight minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

My argument is really just that there's almost no jobs or careers that can sustain ideological purity and probably even less in journalism. Asking white female journalists a standard of ethical perfection that can only exists within discussion spaces like twitter or message boards is just lame. It is impossible. Intuitively and in real life, it makes no sense, we are all pushed to not be as ethical as we would ideally want to be and we all have to balance difficult pros and cons. It's okay if someone comes up with different conclusions than you and maybe you consider yourself virtuous enough to shit on a whole subset of a profession, which great, congrats, I think it's arrogant and sad.

And yes, criticism and accountability are useful and welcome, this is just lapidation for sins 99% of us have to deal with because the world happens to not be working the exact way some ideologue on the internet want. Acting like these women are monsters is just virtue signalling, linking them to german soldiers during the Wars is beyond the pale.

I have no idea what this thread's about.

We're out of Afghanistan and it's fucking great.

VHS what have you achieved to tell a pakistani woman her criticism of western journalists swarming the middle east is wrongheaded? 🤔

― ✖, Monday, August 30, 2021 8:26 PM (three minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

I do not agree with Zakaria's statement, but I am not going to say she is 'bad', 'unethical' or compare her to german soldiers taking orders. I just happen to have another reading than she does.

linking them to german soldiers during the Wars

nobody actually did this, you tedious prick

by your logic nobody should ever criticize anyone else for any reason, got it

virtue signalling

FPed

otm

xposts

why are you responding to the ensuing posts rather than the woman who wrote this book, which is not a post on the internet. she seems to have had real experiences with white women making harmful assumptions about her, and is talking about a real phenomenon of journalism being used to justify military action. i don't know if you remember the early 2000s, when there was constant footage of women in burqas. you are also again conveniently responding to arguments that no one here has made, that people are required to be ethically perfect and "criticizing female journalists for not having overthrown the political and economic structure," which maybe answers the question i asked in sentence #1

as sure as eggs is eggs people that use "virtue signalling" are invariably total fucking arseholes

yup

xposts

why are you responding to the ensuing posts rather than the woman who wrote this book, which is not a post on the internet. she seems to have had real experiences with white women making harmful assumptions about her, and is talking about a real phenomenon of journalism being used to justify military action. i don't know if you remember the early 2000s, when there was constant footage of women in burqas. you are also again conveniently responding to arguments that no one here has made, that people are required to be ethically perfect and "criticizing female journalists for not having overthrown the political and economic structure," which maybe answers the question i asked in sentence #1

― criminally negligible (harbl), Monday, August 30, 2021 8:40 PM (four minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

Of course anyone can criticize without being perfect, but assuming whole groups are evil and unethical instead of thinking they are trying their best in a tough world is to me extremely insulting, and does not make it criticism or anything constructive. So yes, I disagree with Zakaria on that point, although she seems very clear in that paragraph that editors are very much to blame too, meaning that she knows from the beginning that the white female journalist's integrity is in jeopardy. She's at least knowing that yes, ethical dilemmas happen because we do not live in a vacuum. Should a white female journalist not continue her path into covering Afghanistan because of that? I happen to not think so and I sincerely believe asking that level of integrity of people is harsh, and I believe insulting them for doing so insulting, pedantic and a shinning example of virtue signalling.

virtues are good and signaling them is also good bc then ppl will do the good things is how i break it down

is it vice signaling if i tell u to stop posting itt?

bc u shd absolutely consider it

as a white woman, when people say "white women" i don't feel insulted at all but maybe i'm just being extra virtuous

evil signalling is obviously much better, because it's a big part of the process of getting with the realpolitik and growing up!

it's a rare condition this day and age to read evil signaling on the newspaper page

bc u shd absolutely consider it

― class project pat (m bison), Monday, August 30, 2021 9:05 PM (thirty minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

Nah because I still appreciate this bunch and except for the few who can stop themselves from just insulting and belittling others instead of having discussion, I do believe they are great and disagreements are only disagreements.

the guy you're attempting to argue with wrote this immediately after bringing up following orders:

I don't literally think they're anywhere near the same level of malfeasance as SS officers

https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2021-08-30/family-says-several-children-killed-us-missile-strike-kabul

i believe they were at the 60% level of malfeasance as SS officers. it's time for a change. it's time to go to the center-right.

Nah because I still appreciate this bunch and except for the few who can stop themselves from just insulting and belittling others instead of having discussion, I do believe they are great and disagreements are only disagreements.

― Van Horn Street, Monday, August 30, 2021 8:39 PM (twenty-six minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

those ppl shd also consider not posting itt

the guy you're attempting to argue with wrote this immediately after bringing up following orders:

I don't literally think they're anywhere near the same level of malfeasance as SS officers

― symsymsym, Monday, August 30, 2021 10:00 PM (seventeen minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

The point that people shouldn't always follow orders is pedantic, in one way or another, 99.9% of us are stuck having to follow orders we don't agree with on a regular basis, that does not make us unethical or evil, if anything it should make us compassionate. If you are one of the lucky few who can have a career without dilemmas, congratulations, I just think berating the rest of us isn't constructive.

why are you pushing so hard for this specific pointless dead end conversation

looks like van horn street is a...cul de sac 😎😎😎😎😎😎😎😎

Hahaha

why are you pushing so hard for this specific pointless dead end conversation

― Left, Monday, August 30, 2021 10:36 PM (five minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

Because it matters to me of course.

YEOOWWWWWW

The point that people shouldn't always follow orders is pedantic

but the only person itt actually making that point immediately disavowed it

anyway, new sponsor just dropped https://t.co/InSCvMCzVy

— jamie k (@jkbloodtreasure) August 30, 2021

Because it matters to me of course.

― Van Horn Street, Tuesday, 31 August 2021 bookmarkflaglink

A liberal using right-wing talking points on the back of an interview with a Pakistani woman is what matters. Ok.

why are you pushing so hard for this specific pointless dead end conversation

pop

I have no memory of posting that.

you ok?

check the batteries in your carbon monoxide detector

xpost The Chinese have graciously offered to set up a new Afghan Ministry of Mining & Minerals, they will fully staff it with friendly technocrats and get the mines up & running asap

This is worth a little more reflection. Ministers have made a sensible & constructive decision here.

Firstly, people given certainty about their future in UK can better plan & organise their lives. Others, like prospective employers, can do same. 1/4https://t.co/s177JSuMEi

— Steve Valdez-Symonds (@stevesymondsAI) September 1, 2021

On the next war.

https://t.co/dtx2K0Vvqa pic.twitter.com/h8zSz6on6k

— Osita Nwanevu (@OsitaNwanevu) September 1, 2021

You mean Taiwan? Yeah. Could be. The nuclear deterrent ain't what it used to be.