itt we talk about Enlightened on HBO, seasons 1-1000000

i've seen basically every actor in this show in a different hbo show lol

Looking was a great show, I forgot that he was in that. Great actor.

I love this show, partly because the last time we went to maui we stayed next door to this resort (this is the Four Seasons); we did eat over there a few times and walked through it enough for it all to be familiar.

I agree that Britton is underwritten so far but figure it might focus on her a bit more in the second half. It is hard too say what the overriding 'story' of the show is, but I kind of don't care because I enjoy the writing so much and Mike White really does write great characters.

it always takes me a moment to register when connie britton is meant to be playing an unsympathetic character because i know and love her from her role as saint on earth tami taylor in friday night lights

yeah I'm kind of willing to give her character all kinds of credit because I am in love with her

I wouldn't describe her character in this show as wholly unsympathetic

nb, i haven't seen episode 3 yet

https://www.newyorker.com/culture/the-new-yorker-interview/mike-white-on-money-status-and-appearing-on-survivor

yet to arrive as a cast member: molly shannon

:D

Oh yeah, my wife clocked her voice on the phone, loving her late career Renaissance.

that nyer interview was great

ep3 was really good & hilarious imo

Agree the interview was really good. Fascinating that the college girls are in some ways the characters he identifies with (which makes sense, since he is, in some ways, the hardest on them.)

"we have a stylist pick them out" was a great line

The sound in this show is really intense

this made me lol

MELFI: and this tv program makes you anxious

TONY: jennifer cooler's crying, this one's fuckin mother in law showed up, and then you got the music

MELFI: what about the music

TONY: THEYRE JUST SITTING ON THE FUCKIN BEACH, WHY'S THE MUSIC SCARY?

— Ben Rosen (@ben_rosen) August 9, 2021

Really no more discussion? Loved this show

Yeah, it didn't hit the heights of Enlightened but I enjoyed it very much.

Has been renewed for a second season, btw. Apparently as a season-long anthology of sorts, as the second season will take place at another White Lotus property with an all-new cast. It's more Mike White so I'll take it.

Loved Uncle Rico as Tanya's terminally ill boyfriend.

still remember him best from Real Genius.

was great, but Rachel's change of heart seemed pretty out of the blue, I felt like it needed an additional scene in there. also a bit surprised they let Shane leave so quickly.

Good interview with Mike White:
https://www.vulture.com/article/the-white-lotus-finale-mike-white-interview-departures-ending.html

This was really good. Not as good as Enlightened but what is? I like the way no one in it was let off the hook.

was great, but Rachel's change of heart seemed pretty out of the blue,

From the White interview:

Some people read it as cynical; to me, the thing that I feel about Shane is that even though he is a privileged asshole, he does really love her. Even if it’s just an idea of her.

This is how I feel about it too -- remember, Rachel dated this guy for months and married him -- it's the "this guy's an asshole and I can't spend my life with him" that was an out-of-the-blue change of heart! I think the genius of Lacy's portrayal is that he makes Shane a huge asshole and SIMULTANEOUSLY a person you might actually fall in love with and want to make a life with.

That's kind of the strength of White's work all over. His characters are often deeeeeply flawed but drawn with enough nuance that they maintain their humanity/relatability. Shane is an enormous asshole but he's not just like a straight-up villain. Like no one is really blameless or wholly to blame for the circumstances they find themselves in.

I feel like somebody told him "Basil Fawlty but sympathetic, go"

ha ha vg

had never seen Bartlett in anything before, skimming his resume I guessed this might be the first time he's used his own accent in two decades?

Coolidge kinda took the Amy Jellicoe role this time around where she initially seemed like a comic relief caricature but got some more nuanced and sympathetic development. And then she got to end on a pretty assholish note of her own (which I called from the moment poor Belinda perked up at the idea of getting her own business).

Bartlett was great. I've never seen him in anything before, either. I hope his career gets a deserved boost from this.

Quick thoughts...

-I didn't read Rachel as having a change of heart, I thought it was her being too confused/unsure/scared to go through with it especially after Belinda walked out the door on her, where one might then think "wow I must have sounded totally insane?".
-I agree Shane wasn't a "straight-up villain" UNTIL they had his character start brazenly hitting on the girls that he hadn't previously talked to before, right in front of Rachel. That seemed like a cheap "let's make sure the audience knows this guy is a piece of shit" move. My wife brought up that it could potentially be him acting out due to their conversation that morning, but it still felt a bit out of nowhere vs. his other spoiled acting out up to that point and after.

yeah I think in if Rachel had been able to talk to someone sympathetic or someone close to her who knew her, she probably would have left

but with Belinda already (understandably) having had a gutfull of white ppl problems, her dismissal made Rachel question herself

also aside from Shane she’s alone in this place, isolated with no friends or anyone to talk to - that will for sure undermine your confidence when you are in need of valudation & in a fragile frame of mind. left to your own devices, one could very easily talk themselves into a change of heart.

and besides, in a very doomed way she’s the kind of character for whom both things can be true: she’s unhappy in her marriage & she loves him

yeah I think in if Rachel had been able to talk to someone sympathetic or someone close to her who knew her

I think there's a hint in that phone conversation with her mom that her mom is not actually as different from Shane's mom as she (and no doubt also Shane's mom) would like to think

the mother inlaw was like, everything i would be terrified of

if i was rachel i probably just would have walked into the ocean & ended my life, not even botheted trying to tackle divorce

like just feeding on that poor girl’s defenseless psyche like a succubus. and the mother inlaw WITH shane, talking to rachel about her life? i would wish no less than a swift & painless death

also my other thought abt rachel was just seeing so starkly how hard it is to say what you want confidently, & demand it, when you havent ever lived your life that way

*bothered

i wanted paula to get dragged more for her actions

like i get hating that family for their privilege (fairly) but the way she flexed her own on that dude as a tool for her own weird vengeance.
like “hmmm no i cant stay with you i have to go to college but i’m going to wave my wand for you & you steal this jewelry from this shitty family because it’ll make your life better i promise”

like i think she kind of despised him a little bit too being corny & wanting her to stay w him

idk

i think at least paula knows she did a terrible, stupid thing that destroyed kai's life. she's not as different from the family she was with as she would like to think. she really liked kai but she has college and a "real life" likely in some big city (i don't remember if they mentioned where they went to college) and staying in some peripheral place like hawaii was just not an option for her.

and her plan to "help" him was her being naive, quite patronizing and frankly dangerous/stupid

Yeah, almost glaringly so.

And that's one aspect of what I mentioned upthread about no one on this show being completely to blame or completely blameless. Like Kai was definitely done dirty by Paula but at the same time he must've had many similar opportunities previously (given his level of access to rich peoples' private space) that he never took advantage of.

yes, he for sure is to blame also but it's something he never would've done without her suggestion. and there was an imbalance of power there, both because she's a guest and he's a service worker, and because he clearly was falling in love with her.

the one thing about this show that always annoyed me: that family was too rich that they would've just had a one bedroom suite for 5 people!!!!!

YES

omg yes

honestly 90% of why i watched this show all the way through was to get a weekly fix of ocean footage

and because he clearly was falling in love with her.

idk abt this, figured Kai wld be happily boning his way through a different daughter or daughter’s friend every week. I assumed he was totally thrown by her expressing concern about his continued existence after she left for a change

as a bonus, here is an exchange from that conversation that was edited out, but which I know has been the source of some questions #TheWhiteLotus https://t.co/W2MV9mq8qv pic.twitter.com/sSsxFKWqEO

— Kathryn VanArendonk (@kvanaren) August 16, 2021

^ re why the family was in a 1 bedroom suite

i loved every second of this show & it should have its own thread frankly but it did feel a little off the way that quinn's story became more dominant over the course of the season culminating in being the final shot. like, "kid who is glued to screen and then is exposed to nature and has his world changed" is prob the least interesting social/cultural phenomenon being explored in the show, to me. i liked him running off at the end bcuz it sort of begs you to picture a version of home alone 4 being spun off from white lotus but ending the show w/ a shot of them all rowing in the canoe felt a bit ham handed to me. otherwise, no notes!

i actually thought there was an ambiguity in the final scene between rachel and shane, the way that rachel says "i'm going to be happy. don't worry about me. i will be happy." left me wondering whether she was referring to getting back into the relationship or her life after him, trying to make him feel like he wasn't to blame. but then i watched the little thing after the episode and mike white was talking about them being back together.

oh i missed that ambiguity but you're right, and I think the ambiguity works even if IN THAT MOMENT she has decided they're staying together, surely it's clear that the matter is not Now Settled For Good

yeah quinn’s arc was a deep eyeroll for me

also i cant imagine having Quinn on the longboat crew helped at all except maybe as ballast lol

new thread here: “Sorry That Chaise Is Taken. But You’re A Very Pretty Man”: A Thread for White Lotus on HBOMax