pitchfork is dumb (#34985859340293849494 in a series.)

Anyway, D-40 is right that it doesn’t need editing

― bruce spr!ngisH3r3 on broadway (Whiney G. Weingarten), Saturday, June 26, 2021 8:53 PM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

I said that Rob’s critiques were correct. Don’t put words in my mouth defending indefensible treeship posts

I just think it reads like a college reviewer, who thinks their favorite artist can do no wrong, resorting to hyperbole and “this-is-good-actually.”

What editor doesn’t read “limitless flows and intonations”; circle “limitless” in red pen; and write a question mark next to it.

― we don't have to be around all these coffee shops (morrisp), Saturday, June 26, 2021 9:28 PM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

I have issues with the piece but don’t really get this tone from the piece at all. If anything from a musical perspective it’s kind of reserved and I wish it grappled with it a bit more, was a bit less measured or detached — but the idea that it’s some hyperbolic stan type article feels incredibly off base to me.

Her attitude feels perfectly calibrated for a burnout generation. Some artists release albums that function as grand gestures, but Doja Cat doesn’t have to; Planet Her is an enormous shrug, the edgelord hottie pop star telling the world that it’s not her job to care.

the virtue of the album is said to be its dgaf attitude. throughout the piece, she provides examples of ways in which this is the case, including doja working with doctor luke and posting online in an "edgelord"-y manner.

this is the key theme of the review: people doja to care, and she never does. she is a pop star who exists above (or below?) the fray of a culture that is always making moral and political demands of her.

i am not going to assent to this alternative, deejconstructive reading.

*people expect

I didn't get deep into the review, but the phrase "triple threat" signals "someone who is good at three things," which isn't a neutral reading at all, especially in the world of pop music and entertainment, who literally give awards for such people

https://www.billboard.com/articles/news/950804/lea-michele-to-receive-billboards-first-ever-triple-threat-award-at-women-in

http://armyofselenagomez.com/news/30473/

https://people.com/awards/jennifer-lopez-at-the-people-magazine-awards-wins-triple-threat-award/

I suppose, technically, a case COULD be made that "This person is exceptional at three things: Just stating facts, not implying that that is a good or bad thing," but that betrays both the phrase's origins in sports AND the contemporary use as an award given to pop stars

And also pointing out "Black women [are expected to] mobilize against offense instead of causing it" in the lede is either A) Like treeship says, explicitly praising the convention-breaking antics of things like showing the feeties to the Pepes or B) Making a grand and valid point about black women in the internet sphere, but awkwardly shoehorned into a lede to a record review that just got done laying out all the things this artist is exceptional at.

If it's A it betrays the stance that P4k have been taking of dinging artists like X and the Wipers and Tyler and Belle and Sebastian for not understanding/incorrectly navigating contemporary attitudes towards American racism. If it's B it's just bad editing because it certainly made it look like A.

In conclusion, 4chan is where Doja Cat is a viking

You guys are being very weird. I was responding specifically to the quoted portion in the post, not the entire review, the part that begins “on the surface” and ends “…instead of causing it.”

“Her attitude feels perfectly calibrated for a burnout generation. Some artists release albums that function as grand gestures, but Doja Cat doesn’t have to; Planet Her is an enormous shrug, the edgelord hottie pop star telling the world that it’s not her job to care.”
the virtue of the album is said to be its dgaf attitude. throughout the piece, she provides examples of ways in which this is the case, including doja working with doctor luke and posting online in an "edgelord"-y manner.

― treeship., Sunday, June 27, 2021 2:36 PM (thirty minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

This quote, on the other hand, is an accurate, neutral description of the album. You’re suggesting that her assessment that it’s “perfectly” calibrated is hyperbole intended to pump up the critical value of the album; I maintain it’s an assessment of the artist’s affect, suggesting that there’s a clarity of signification

If we want to talk about the “triple threat” thing, I don’t really get the problem with saying pop star, edgelord, and hottie, though I guess you *could* critique by saying edgelord and hottie fall under the pop star umbrella I think it’s more accurate to say a star encompasses a pop star, and edgelord, and a hottie. Don’t really get the issue with that at all

this is the paragraph that comes right before it:

But while SZA’s words ripple with angst, Doja is unconcerned. She exceeds the mark without ever appearing like she’s trying. She’s an underachieving overachiever, singing the lines to “Imagine” (“Imagine, imagine, put the studio in the mansion”) like she took a muscle relaxant.

right here, her understated affect as a singer is said to be good. if it is not necessarily superior to sza's "angst," it is at least a salutary correction to this tendency.

then the writer pivots to claim that the album itself sort of holds back from being a "grand gesture." the understatement isn't only in the vocal performance or the music itself, but in how the album is positioned in the arc of the artist's career. this is also seen to be good; as you said, there is a "clarity of signification" here between what the album sounds like and what it means.

also in this sentence, the writer returns to the phrase "edgelord hottie pop star," referencing once again the way she "doesn't care" about what the world thinks about her hanging out with alt right trolls, or whatever. what this adds up to is an impression that doja is cool because she doesn't "take the bait" of the culture, or conform to expectations. and this is interesting because it does seem to contradict pitchfork's messaging in other articles.

unrelatedly, i don't think it's convincing. nothing in the review made me think that doja cat seemed like a cool or interesting rebel who is expressing something meaningful about her own "burnout" generation.

but that is secondary. the point is that nothing about how the article is put together suggests that the writer is simply neutrally observing that doja is a bit of a troll and dropping it. they make this point central to the discussion of her. it is right in the beginning -- part of her "triple threat"

Gary Glitter is a triple threat: Pop star, fashion icon and convicted pedophile

If it's A it betrays the stance that P4k have been taking of dinging artists like X and the Wipers and Tyler and Belle and Sebastian for not understanding/incorrectly navigating contemporary attitudes towards American racism. If it's B it's just bad editing because it certainly made it look like A.

― bruce spr!ngisH3r3 on broadway (Whiney G. Weingarten), Sunday, June 27, 2021 2:58 PM (thirty-two minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

When did Pitchfork diss the Wipers this way? I checked the archive, and their only Wipers coverage in the past few years was a few things about Youth of America (a Sunday review and spots on their '80s album list and top 50 PNW punk albums list) and all were totally positive.

The Wipers Sunday review took them to task for their white privilege

I must have missed that one. I guess I never thought of sage’s consistent doomerism as white privilege, but I suppose it is a manifestation of it

You could read it that way. I was scanning for explcit mentions of race or similar, of which there are none. Just a really dumb opening paragraph about Sage's use of the phrase "no fair".

Gary Glitter is a triple threat: Pop star, fashion icon and convicted pedophile

citation needed

“right here, her understated affect as a singer is said to be good. if it is not necessarily superior to sza's "angst," it is at least a salutary correction to this tendency.”

You keep, over and over, making this same jump. What on earth makes you think it’s considered a “salutatory correction” instead of just a point of contrast ?

Gary Glitter is a triple threat: Pop star, fashion icon and convicted pedophile

― bruce spr!ngisH3r3 on broadway (Whiney G. Weingarten), Sunday, June 27, 2021 3:33 PM (fifty-one minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

You of all people—Eminem fan, dirtbag left defender— should recognize that edgelord and pedophile are not parallel, that edgelord is a pose and not a like, ideological commitment (it tends to have certain ideology commitments associate with it which we all might dismiss as “edgelord bullshit” but the concept itself is more a cultural stance than anything still)

It is a point of contrast that works in the song. That is interesting to observe, for the reviewer. And which ties into various elements of her public persona that are also implied to be good because this is a positive review of an album not a 5th grade book report.

The reviewer closes the article by saying that, in the album, doja is “telling the world that it is not her job to care,” a pose that is “perfectly calibrated for the burnout generation.”

It does not say that doja seems to believe it isn’t her job to care, and may be wrong, or that time will tell whether her calculated aloofness will resonate with her audience.

If there is any ambiguity, it lies in the fact that the reviewer doesn’t explain why she finds doja cat’s seeming carelessness compelling.

The article just unconvincingly asserts that this album is a triumph for doja cat against the haters and a victory for the “burnout generation.”

I don’t want to come down too hard on this particular writer. Pitchfork often publishes criticism like this.

An album is discussed in the context of some hazy cultural narrative that might feel vaguely familiar but only really exists, in this particular form, in the reviewer’s head, and then the album is assessed on how well it navigated the choppy waters of this meta-environment. These pieces often seem like post-facto defenses of music the author happens to like—like they need to find a way to say that it is also making a meaningful contribution to the discourse.

This imperfect review is better written than any of your posts itt

written more better, you mean. goodly

Any professionally written and edited review should be far better than a tossed-off ILM post, but for too many of them aren’t, that’s why we come here right?

You of all people—Eminem fan, dirtbag left defender

Wait, what's the third threat?

and this is interesting because it does seem to contradict pitchfork's messaging in other articles.

I don't know how to break this to you but multiple people write for the site, who come to their own conclusions

Yeah, it would have been interesting for the writer to explore why Doja’s opposition the liberal consensus was good, if that is the argument they were making.

Katherine, we know you and others write for the site, which is why anyone ever complaining about it gets shut down immediately. It's tiresome af, if you can't take people not liking a place you write for, then don't write for them

haha what

complaints get shut down?

Lol @ the idea people are defending “pitchfork”

When Greg Sage roars “it’s no fair” midway through Youth of America, the vowels long and colicky, it’s not exactly a noble moment. Complaining about unfairness rarely is, because even if it’s accurate, it’s still a badge of comfort. “No fair” are petulant words, stagnant words, the conclusion of people who have set up camp in their perceived burdens. “No fair” is not a phrase of a revolution, because fairness is built on shifting sands; it’s not as steely a protest as “unjust” or “wrong.” And the people to whom life truly has been cruelest don’t have the time to complain about it; they’re too busy trying to outmaneuver the system that failed them. Now that’s no fair.

Oh Christ.

Wait, what's the third threat?

― Vin Jawn (PBKR), Monday, 28 June 2021 01:01 (twelve hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

shall we ask zooey deschanel

yeah, that is just a bad reading of that song. the point is to express a mood of disillusionment, that moment in adolescence where you realize that you've been sold a bill of goods, that the world is not what you've been led to believe it was:

Out of the shadows, blistering lights
Through the hallways of a sleepless night
Every time I turn around, it's there
Take a piece of our lives, didn't think we'd care?
Take away the chore
Take all of that, and more
And now we're crying
It's no fair

"Now we're crying / It's no fair" is the expression of that moment, that mood. I think it's implied that the speaker will move beyond this lament that the situation "isn't fair," toward a more productive or revolutionary analysis or whatever. But still, it's a necessary moment.

that's a fucking ludicrous paragraph

(the wipers review)

Infuriating really

wow that is the most astonishingly dumb thing I have read in an album review in a long time

And now we're crying /
It‘a unjuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuust!

*guitar soloing*

Big fans of things are still eligible to review them, but probably best if it’s not like this.

Looks like Pitchfork is doing their Peoples' List again with readers submitting their favorite albums from the past 25 years. It will be interesting to see how it will compare with the last time they this: https://pitchfork.com/peopleslist/

I actually really enjoyed some of the breakdowns from that one.

kanye kendrick frank frank kanye kendrick

and radiohead!

I think this might actually be an interesting test to see if Kanye's stock has indeed fallen much (if at all) in the last few years. I suspect not much, but we'll see.

when they did the first peoples list from back in 2012 all the p4k staff members at the time put out all their own individual lists and all those individual lists exposed me to so much good music from those years. like, i could just pull up someone's list, notice there was an album on it i hadn't heard of before, and then bam i have a new favourite record.

but the actual full people's list? boring as hell.