Christgau's Consumer Guide Grade List: A+

I don’t think the problem is a lack of overrated warhorses; for me, it’s a lack of many interesting/provocative choices around albums I do know (which would be signposts that there’s something to be learned from digging deeper). It just reads like some guy’s personal taste.

I don't know, I think those things are in there. Like, why this Tribe Called Quest album and not either of the first two? Why Sign o the Times and not Purple Rain? Flipside of that, why Born in the USA and not Born to Run? Many of these albums are warhorses or classics or canon or whatever because so much time has passed, but given so many of the artists listed are themselves warhorses or classic or canon themselves, sometimes the choices he makes can still be interesting. Again, like why that Ornette album, which iirc was even out of print for eons? Or why the first Paul Simon, but not Graceland (which got a rave of an A, which I suspect he downgraded from an A+ for political reasons)? Or how the African stuff might ostensibly be obvious (now), but honestly wasn't (and isn't) to the vast majority of Americans?

Or, for example, why those Dylan albums, out of all of them, including collections, get the A+s.

that Tribe album is literally the only intersection with my own canon of 10/10s lol, difference being that I am not the soi-disant Dean of American Rock Critics

xp Well the Dylan choices are a good example—if those are someone’s three favorite Dylan releases since 1970 (including, exactly, the first few Bootleg Series collections), it’s hard to think our taste will be very simpatico. Somehow his choices are unexpected yet boring.

idgi, love and theft and the basement tapes are excellent picks

I think (per my Graceland example) his reasoning sometimes becomes more clear when you read the review(s). Other times, opaque and arbitrary, but it ain't a science.

xpost But as canon building goes, would you tell someone to start with those? That's how I read his reviews when I was a lot younger. "Wow, an A+, I should start with such and such." Which I think is not necessarily the right way to do it.

basement tapes is maybe a little unwieldy and steeped in its own myth, but fuck yeah i'd use love and theft to introduce someone to dylan and they'd probably really like it

One of his A plusses doesn't need to become an A plus for me (if I rated records) to be worth hearing.
And true, these are not necessarily starter picks (though the compilations may well be).

I think just about every record up there is worth hearing. If they lead someone back to a better A- or B+ record, that works for me!

(xpost) I remember Graceland was an A+ on release, yes; Who's Next, too.

Haha, I had no idea he like Procol Harum that much!

that Tribe album is literally the only intersection with my own canon of 10/10s lol, difference being that I am not the soi-disant Dean of American Rock Critics

― imago, Tuesday, June 8, 2021 8:48 AM (nine minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

lj i feel there is stuff on this list u need to check out

*likes

A Thousand Leaves, excepting two standout tracks, is second worst SY album after NYC Ghosts. I was talking about this with a friend the other day— I don't go to SY for hippie noodling or for rocking indie-pop, I go to them for aggressive, noisy art-rock. A Thousand Leaves is a dull record and no critic will ever convince me otherwise.

they're good at hippie noodling though cf. murray street. a thousand leaves i would argue proves there's no binary between hippie noodling and noisy art-rock

it opens with "contre le sexisme" ffs

That's another good example—I'm not an SY head but I've listened to all the albums, and that one's like "huh?"

i'm not a christgau defender but i think he saw certain artists very clearly, chief among them al green and sonic youth imo

(I actually like NYC Ghosts, but I wouldn't give it an A+ either... I don't think they were going for a perfect grade, anyway, with that one)

thousand leaves is such a fucking awesome record and i encourage everyone to smoke a bowl and hang with it

With the exception of "Hits of Sunshine," I hear no hippy noodling on A Thousand Leaves.

might be referring to "wildflower soul" as well idk

"Hoarfrost" is Ranaldo's best song, "Sunday" is the aggressive noisy art rock that table's looking for, and "Karen Koltrane" is spooky as fuck.

It's not an A+ but it's my favorite SY of the nineties: they stretched and it mostly worked.

When CDs were still a thing, I burned or bought copies of Love and Theft to introduce skeptics to Dylan and it almost always worked. The reaction tended to be, "Whoa! This cranky old dude is fun!" Many skeptics come to him mythos-first, which would make me a skeptic too.

upset that, AFAIK, "Karen Koltrane" has never been deployed in a horror film

Karen trips on a cloud
Sets down stars in her eyes
She's alone in a room
She's deep inside of her mind

I wish I'd hung onto the LP.

This reminds me, there was once a thread entitled something like "Would you trade all your records for those that Christgau rated A or higher?", which is a demented concept unless you are 10 years old or hate your music collection for some reason.

"Hoarfrost" is Ranaldo's best song

This is the most absolutely wrong thing you've ever written on these boards, fwiw.

And also further proof that I shouldn't listen to y'all about SY. A Thousand Leaves sucks.

I contain wrongitudes!

The mere existence of "Mote" disproves your opinion about which is Lee's best track, and also "Goo" came out in 1990, so it wins for best SY of that decade afaic.

I gave up on Sonic Youth after hating the single from Dirty. I came back for Murray Street because the Borbetomagus horns were guests on one track, but it turned out they were barely audible, so I gave up again. I keep telling myself I should deep-dive their 90s/00s catalog, but something more enticing always comes up.

Ranaldo's my least favorite of the songwriting trio precisely because he makes the most effort to make his okay lyrics legible, but I love at least a dozen of his songs.

I mean, it's not like the Grateful Dead never got noisy. There's a similar sort of loose, jammy, psychedelic quality to ATL, although it's SY doing their take on it with their vocabulary, so I get what someone means if they call it "hippie noodling". (I also get why Dead- and Television-loving Christgau likes it.) I like it but I like all their albums.

"hoarfrost" is totally my favorite ranaldo song this side of "mote"

The mere existence of "Mote" disproves your opinion about which is Lee's best track, and also "Goo" came out in 1990, so it wins for best SY of that decade afaic.

― heyy nineteen, that's john belushi (the table is the table), Tuesday, June 8, 2021

"Mote" is great.

and "Hey Joni"!

But, like, I once recommended ATL to a guy who loved DMB and he thought it was unlistenably pretentious avant-garde noise.

All the albums I've listened to all the way through from the list are really good.

I give xgau a lot of shit these days but he praised Omona Wapi almost from the moment it got some kind of American release and hasn't stopped proselytizing for African music.

And he loves DeBarge.

(A note that I actually love hippie noodling, I just don't listen to SY for it).

(Or the Dead. My big problem with the Dead is that I'll be jamming the hell out and then all of a sudden one of those assholes will start trying to sing and ruin the whole experience)

lol that's how I respond to Ranaldo sometimes

That's really funny, that's more how I respond to Thurston

This list is too long for my brain, but Tabu Ley Rochereau: The Voice of Lightness [2007, Sterns Africa] is stupendously gorgeous. The two Franco collections are amazing too, but his profile is higher and I can put TVOL on any time and be enraptured

A Thousand Leaves, excepting two standout tracks, is second worst SY album after NYC Ghosts. I was talking about this with a friend the other day— I don't go to SY for hippie noodling or for rocking indie-pop, I go to them for aggressive, noisy art-rock. A Thousand Leaves is a dull record and no critic will ever convince me otherwise.

― heyy nineteen, that's john belushi (the table is the table), Tuesday, June 8, 2021 11:59 AM (thirty-two minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

I loved the SYR EPs that led up to A Thousand Leaves, and thought, "Jeez, based on these EPs, the next album's gonna be insane!" It still stands as one of the blandest and dullest (and most disappointing) records I've ever heard. I continued on with the SYR series -- which was mostly great -- but never listened to anything else they subsequently released. And whenever I asked SY fans if the new record was any good, the response was always, "...eh..."

Their '00s albums are fantastic, a couple of which are better song for song than the Geffen material.

how'd Wussy do?

https://robertchristgau.substack.com/p/deans-list-2021?r=khofd&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email

lol Neil Young

So although preliminary listening and research persuades me that Rolling Stone had reason to put Puerto Rican pop phenom Rauw Alejandro’s Vice Versa high on its list, there’s no way he’ll ever be Olivia Rodrigo or even Harry Styles for me unless he starts singing in English (as he probably will, to exactly what effect is another matter). And while there’s no denying that Toronto’s Tamara Lindeman showcases actual songs on Pitchfork’s seventh-ranked Weather Station album Ignorance, their smug gentility reminds me all too vividly of Joan Baez putting me off lo these many decades ago. Which isn’t even to mention the impressionistic musical poesy of Pitchfork’s second-place L’Rain, or the huzzahs that greeted my old fave Jazmine Sullivan when she compensated for her songwriting drought by inviting women to contribute spoken-word accounts of their sexual travails and got album-of-the-year plaudits from Pitchfork for the dodge

Correct about Sullivan, RONG about the Weather Station.

Figures: he's always had a blind spot about Baez's better albums, and, closer to Lindeman's sound, early Joni as well. Haven't gotten into L'Rain's album, though will listen more; she's effective on the xpost Bowie trib, Modern Love.

I remember noticing a couple years back that Firesign Theatre was the first act to whom he'd awarded two A+ grades, and a friend rightly said, "how like Christgau of you to notice"

sexual travails: manages to be a lofty shit even "just" en passant; that's some A Movable Feast-level shit, class out the ass!

Something Scott Woods created, a tribute to some of Christgau's A+ albums. I'm one of the readers, fumbling my way through his Attica review--also Kevin Bozelka and a couple of others.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIIfvvDzI2w