Midnight Oil: Classic or G'dud!

I know, I keep forgetting about Species Deceases. Also Bird Noises.

I never gave this band a good listen until now. I don't even think I listened to any Australian bands the last time I checked them out, and that feels relevant given how topical their best music can be. For example, one of my favorite Paul Kelly songs, "From Little Things Big Things Grow," doubles as a history lesson on the Gurindji strike - an extraordinary story that became my gateway into the history of Aboriginal Australians. It won't change whether or not you like Midnight Oil, but I'm sure some of their songs won't feel as sharp if the context is completely lost.

Anyway, I just went through 10,9,8,7... and Diesel and Dust. 10,9,8,7... isn't bad but it didn't really do anything for me musically speaking. However I liked Diesel and Dust quite a bit, including "Beds Are Burning" (which I never hear played anywhere, even though it's supposed to be the "hit"). It's stunning how much of the album deals with Aboriginal land rights, and it does so without feeling limited or monotonous - just the opposite.

Both albums sound very different though, and there's something about the latter that feels like it's more accessible to anyone with a taste for mainstream American rock while the former sounds a bit more daring - I'd normally favor that, but on a basic level the songwriting on Diesel and Dust feels more engaging.

Looks like I gave my opinion on this thread back in '03 and it still holds. If anything, I enjoy Diesel and Dust more now (not a track I don't like). The next two albums are weaker versions of it with some moments that work. I've had 18 years to listen to their pre-Diesel albums and still haven't done it - time to remedy that!

Yeah, I think "Diesel and Dust" is start-to-finish great, and definitely more accessible. Aside from the singing it's even sometimes hard to believe it's the same band, and in that regard it reminds me of (in concept) "Laid" by James, a concerted but successful decision to strip things down and back and focus even more strictly on songs. The previous Midnight Oil albums are so full of ideas, not least because the prog-like approach and context didn't force them to discard any of them. Usually for the best, since those albums are rad, but I think there was no good next step further in that direction. Downshifting was inevitable, and D&D was a great example of a band doing so at its peak, not when it ran out of ideas or steam or suffered some setback or failure.

FWIW, I like "Earth and Sun and Moon" better than "Blue Sky Mining." The latter is so sterile and over-considered, the former is a bit looser and more organically band-in-a-room. Both albums have some great songs on it, but "Earth" delivers them better, imo.

I also prefer the more organic sound of E&S&M to the one on BSM, but I don't recall liking one album much more than the other. it's been years since I listened to either though

I haven't listened to Blue Sky Mining in ages, either. I remember liking it well enough, and I do like the title track (the only thing that sticks in my head at the moment). But all the dismissals of it itt make me wonder how it would hold up if I listen again. My sense of liking it is also related to having seen them play on the BSM tour, and they were really good.

I really liked Midnight Oil in like 7th-9th gr. I had Diesel & Dust + bought Blue Sky Mining the day it came out! I loved everything about both of those albums and revisited both recently. I hadn't listened to either in aaaaaages and it was a fun time capsule. My memories of being a little righteous crusader all came back. I never really got into the band beyond those albums.

This thread title always literally makes me lol bc I picture someone posting simply "G'dud"and that's funny.

I can't remember now if I became aware of them circa Diesel & Dust or if I had Red Sails in the Sunset first, but I definitely liked Red Sails more.

i definitely only became aware once they had a big single. they probably became uncool because kids like me liked them lol

A friend of mine grew up in Perth and told me that Midnight Oil was so huge in Australia in the '80s that you could literally stop a random person on the street and sing, "US forces give the nod" and they'd immediately respond, "it's a setback for your country." I have no idea how true that is, but I've always wanted to go to Australia to test it out and/or make a fool of myself.

Playing Diesel & Dust, I'd forgotten that I bought a bullroarer because of this album. Will have to search that out, if I still have it.

they were really smart to go pop because I've been listening to their cool early stuff and they were a mediocre post punk band

XXP: That's probably not too far off the mark, Tarfumes. I'd not be surprised if tracks from the first half of the 80s ("Armistice Day", "US Forces", "Short Memory", "When the Generals Talk", "Power and the Passion", etc) are *still* prominent rock radio fixtures in Aus. Possibly more so than later stuff?!? They certainly were when I was last force-fed daytime commercial radio in the workplace.

growing up in Oz, the Oils were pretty ubiquitous. it wasnt really a question of liking them or not, everyone sort of accepted them as decent? some ppl prob found them annoying maybe idk.

the question was more if you were INTO them.
i know in high school the ppl who were super into the Oils were mostly dorky farm boys

i don’t think i fully got their impact until i was at university and the relevance of their message became much more clear - but i still dont know if i fully appreciated them musically etc wholly until my 20’s

when a band is THAT ubiquitous it takes a long time to critically assess them on their own merits imo

How popular were Paul Kelly and the Go-Betweens back in the day? In the U.S. they remain more or less critical favorites with a small but devoted cult following. I always wondered if they did that well in Australia - it wouldn't seem logical for a local artist struggling for a hit in Australia to get major label distribution in America, but I could be wrong.

Paul Kelly had the same ubiquity — was very well known & most everbody knew his music just from radio etc

again - the question was *how* into his music you were, not whether you were into him at all

GoBetweens for me was a bit different - i knew Cattle and Cane but not much else until i started hanging out w cool ppl at university
they didnt the same kind of broad radio play where i grew up (country town, limited to commercial radio for a long time until the broadcast strenth of indie radio improved in early-mid 90’s

and to guard against sicbot corrections
talking abt personal experience in rural victoria, i am not speaking for country as a whole

when a band is THAT ubiquitous it takes a long time to critically assess them on their own merits imo

That all sounds like growing up with the ubiquity of Springsteen in the US in the ‘80s. At a certain point — years, or maybe decades later — those who generally accepted him, but weren’t necessarily fans, stopped and said, “wait, WHY is he so beloved? I should look into that.” And I think the Spin piece in 1985 called the Oils the Australian equivalent of Springsteen.

The Midnight Oil 1984 documentary was tremendously illuminating in terms of their politics/convictions. But that’s where the Springsteen comparison falls apart: Reagan mentioning Bruce in an ‘84 campaign speech was strange: a president is using a rock star to woo voters?! The idea of Springsteen running for office, as Garrett did, at any level would’ve been utterly bizarre and unthinkable.

yeah Springsteen comparison re Oils’ ubiquity in Australia is a really good example.

i think with Garret at some point we all just assumed he’d run for political office eventually, it was mors just a question of when lol

*more

if we can just play "ask vg how popular bands were in australia", how about Little River Band

VERY

i think with Garret at some point we all just assumed he’d run for political office eventually, it was mors just a question of when lol

*beep boop* he ran for office in 1984!

I suspect quite a few people are over Garrett now, post-actual-parliamentary career. But the description of '80s ubiquity seems very OTM.

Paul Kelly was perhaps wise to avoid public office. I've seen no evidence of anyone actively disliking him, ever. It feels like each Xmas every male in Aus confesses to getting misty-eyed over "How to Make Gravy", at the very least. LOL.

I know I had to actively seek out Go-Betweens stuff beyond "C&C"/"Spring Rain"/"Streets of Your Town" in the hiatus period. They were certainly indie-famous, but far as I can tell only "Streets" crossed over to commercial radio, when it was too late. They are possibly more appreciated now.

xp re Garrett running for office:

then he quit the party six months later because it had been infiltrated by socialists

then twenty years later he joined the center-center-left party on the invitation of a leader who is now a right-wing nutjob conspiracy broadcaster, got elected, and was forced by the party to publicly renounce his opposition to US spy bases and missile sites on Australian land, publicly declare that he would vote in favour of new nuclear facilities if ordered to (and later became the minister with responsibility for, and approved, the expansion of a uranium mine), campaign in another state by lying that the Greens were in allegiance with the right-wing government, and eventually got sacked and thrown under the bus when a bunch of tradies died installing roof insulation under a gov't scheme that was being rorted by private contractors.

Correction: Labor leader who was one handshake away from being prime minister is now NSW state leader of One Nation, sitting in the state's upper house.

As someone else who grew up in not-Melbourne Victoria, vg's recollections ring true.

less of a correction, more of an addition. it's been a whole 3 hours since he posted video of himself talking to Bolta on Sky News:

IDENTITY POLITICS USED BY ELITES TO KEEP THE REST OF US IN CHECK

The claims of victimisation by the Duke and Duchess of Sussex highlight the fraudulent nature of identity politics. By dividing us on race and gender, the “woke” elites divert attention away from their own privilege!

I missed that Latham was actually elected in that capacity! Ewwww NSW!

(xp) Fair enough. I thought that he's an interviewee rather than an interviewer on Sky these days (not watching video to confirm). The difference is negligible, admittedly.

I owned Scream in Blue at one time, and recall that it was a good 'un.

Don’t forget the role Daniel Johns from Silverchair played in Garrett’s downfall

VG: what is the biggest Aussie band in Australia?

AC/DC vs. INXS

oh also is Nick Cave extra big there or just regular high end of indie popularity like here?

also I forgot Divinyls were from Australia!

AC/DC vs. INXS

The Bee Gees formed in Australia, if you want a three-way battle.

Cold Chisel and Powderfinger are secretly the most popular Aus acts within Australia. (A lie, probably, but it would be amusing if the statistically correct answer was something that never really traveled well.)

Cave albums routinely go comfortably top #10 in Aus nowadays, so he's pretty popular. Close to a household name, I'd say. Though my mother, for instance, can only name the Kylie duet. (I inadvertently tested this recently!)

Mum only pays attention to Cave to tease me about how old he’s getting lol

Rural wise i think AC/DC is def more broadly popular, and across most ages over 40’s 50’s etc

INXS maybe more popular w under 40’s idk and prob women? but thats a big maaaaybe bc they kinda fucked themselves w all the stupid shit they did after Hutchence died lol

i dont farkin know tbh

Chisel and Powderfinger def feel like much bigger cultural presences

Don’t forget the role Daniel Johns from Silverchair played in Garrett’s downfall

idk if I knew it to forget. too late if so!

The difference is negligible, admittedly.

yeah this is the thing, whether he's streaming drunk on facebook live on a $100k parliamentary pension, paid less than that (+ parl pens) to host on Sky News, or paid less again (+pp) to guest, it's still his main activity, and legislating isn't.

plus he's how he made himself eligible to that voting bloc (2 out of 42 seats: he ran on stopping immigration, blocking renewable energy, requiring DNA tests for indigenous dole recipients, and banning the burqa; used his maiden speech to argue that ppl shouldn't be fired for telling gays that they are cursed to hell)

According to a Herald Sun article reposted to this forum thread, it's AC/DC over Bee Gees with INXS third, although international impact is considered. Every band mentioned in this revive is in the list.

(xp) Also happy to be reminded of Johns's role!

I grew up in 80s Sydney and all the bands mentioned in this thread were ubiquitous with the exception of the Go-Betweens, who were very niche indie back then and never had a hit, I don't think even Streets of Your Town charted.

it got a bit of TV play at the time, and became one of the two Go-Bes songs guest programmers would pick on rage through the '90s, but only charted in NZ.

(Cattle & Cane ranked at #11 and #27 on the first two Hot 100s, clung on desperately at #96 in the final year when Nirvana and nationalisation broke the poll.)

The Hottest 100 returns have been wretched for at least a quarter of a century

Final (?) album and final (?) tour coming up. The former (promo snips of which were pretty solid) reportedly recorded before the death of Bones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SV-QrTrpNzg

Actually, I guess the new album is already out? Man, what a world we live in.

for those upthread curious about the Daniel Johns incident https://amp.smh.com.au/entertainment/celebrity/i-should-shut-up-and-stick-to-singing-20070709-gdqktg.html

Classic. Bought 10 to 1 when it came out, it didn't leave my turntable for months. Watched their evolution from there through the Diesel and Dust album and tour, when they were at their height as a live band. Still one of the most electrifying live acts I've ever seen, albeit much diminished the last time I saw them, circa Redneck Wonderland. The new album so far is . . . good. Doesn't look like I'll get a chance to see this final tour; the only possible date is at the Hollywood Palladium, but I have something else that I likely can't get out of.

I hadn't really paid attention to Garrett's political career, and now I wish I didn't know.

garrett's political career was a disaster really, he clearly sold out to no real benefit & then was thrown under the bus for something that wasn't really his fault

he could have very comfortably fit into the greens without having to compromise but back in 2004 when he was recruited to labor the greens were a much smaller political presence here

Yeah, that's my impression. Really ill-advised. He always struck me as being pretty smart, but it seems like he got completely turned around.