genesis: duke

I think my alignment is Abcacab > Duke > Genesis > ...And Then... > Lamb > some other stuff > Invisible Touch > still more stuff

Does anyone have an opinion on the 2007 remix of this record? Never having heard the original, is it different enough that I should avoid the remix?

I'm actually doing a lockdown cover of TIOA with my old school band buddies at the moment and I wanted to check out how the 'I....I...I...get so lonely" section was written out.

The sheet I’m using as a guide has it down as two bars of 3/4 one 2/4 two 4/4 then three of 3/4 one 4/4 and another three of 3/4 as it comes out of it and there's syncopated quaver tied over each bar line.

Hard to comment on the actual remixes because the digital mastering is brutal, they sound pretty horrible and unlike the originals IMO.

I think my alignment is Abcacab > Duke > Genesis > ...And Then... > Lamb > some other stuff > Invisible Touch > still more stuff

― fade into bolivian (Ye Mad Puffin), Monday, January 11, 2021 5:43 PM (two days ago) bookmarkflaglink

not having Foxtrot up in the top 3/4 is wild imo

I still think SEBTP is their best full album, there are just so many great passages in it

Anyone who ranks an album with "Just a Job to Do" over an album with "Firth of Fifth" has very different aesthetic sense than me.

I still think SEBTP is their best full album, there are just so many great passages in it

seconded.

What is impressive is not just that the passages are great, but so many of them could seem random or disjunctive, but end up contributing to the whole. Take, for example, the long series of solos in the latter part of Dancing With the Moonlit Knight, or the ambient coda on that same song, or the Vicar sequence in Epping Forest, or the whole construction of After the Ordeal.

I still think SEBTP is their best full album, there are just so many great passages in it

Thirded. It actually more or less permanently lives in my car's CD player for those times I can't find anything on the radio.

noticed they just did a colored repress of this. great record but what shop doesn't have a half-dozen used copies of this already? why not make it a 2xLP rather than cram 55 minutes on a single? certainly the sound quality ain't as good as the CD - Collins sounds like he's behind the instruments

I think the people buying the $25 white vinyl 180g version at Urban Outfitters and the people flipping through the dollar bins are 2 distinct market segments.
(also I hate the 2xLP's where there are 13 minutes of music on each side, so i'm happy to sacrifice a little sound quality to not have to flip the record every 3 songs)

Loved the long-form review in Pitchfork today (was worried it was just going to be the history of the band without actually discussing the album, but he gets there, eventually).
But then at the end, it says:

They had made better albums (nearly everything from the ’70s)

sure why not

That review was like the equivalent of an epic side-long suite. Very on point.

That was a nice piece. Also, I think, the first time Pitchfork has had anything substantial on Genesis.

"Misunderstanding" sounds a lot more like "Hot Fun in the Summertime" than that Toto sound. (Not surprisingly, the similarity was consciously by design. I'm surprised a songwriting dispute has yet to come up since the bar for litigable plagiarism has inched lower and lower over the years.)

*Toto song

yeah i mentioned that in the songs that sound like other songs thread. it’s a clear sly stone lift, but with a shuffle beat that is kinda similar to that toto song

as if Wind and Wuthering and ATTWT never happened

nah the writer has it right, W&W and ATTWT are both way better than Duke

"Misunderstanding" sounds a lot more like "Hot Fun in the Summertime" than that Toto sound.

I don't disagree but Phil explicitly says in the DVD documentary that accompanied the reissue a few years back that the song is based around him playing that Toto shuffle.

Didn't agree that was the album that caused a number of fans to get off the bus, always thought Abacab and s/t would have been more obvious points

Well yeah Duke was the last one I ever bought, and liked it with reservations. Heard enough of Abacab on the radio to know that I wanted nothing to do with Genesis from then on.

xps I think "Misunderstanding" also has some of Led Zeppelin's "Fool In the Rain" in its DNA, in that they're both shuffles with similar chord progressions and virtually identical lyrical themes

I'm not really a fan of Duke or Abacab, but when I was going through the catalog this past week, I was pretty sure I could cobble together my favorite parts from both and come up with an LP I'd kind of like.

funny, duke is the only genesis album i've really had time for

"Misunderstanding" sounds a lot more like "Hot Fun in the Summertime" than that Toto sound.

jeez, this hadn't occurred to me. OTM. I'd say, "'Hot Fun...' as played by Toto."

A line in that review makes me wonder... were there any established bands who became "more prog" in the late 70s? Rush, I suppose, maybe The Enid? Any others?

Or even bands who stayed "just as prog" as they were before?

not quite "late 70s" but Todd Rundgren's prog phase was from 1973-1977 which is pretty late to jump off the deep end

True, but as soon as late 1977, Oops Wrong Planet made a big shift to AOR.

yes made "awaken" in 1977, that's pretty prime prog. tho sure, the rest of the going for the one album was not quite as "progressive"

Phil has cited Beach Boys' Sail On Sailor as an influence on Misunderstanding, Hold The Line way more bombastic and generally unchill than either

xxp yeah and Hermit of Mink Hollow was perhaps a bigger shift

for context this is what was happening in 1978 so I don't blame everyone for getting out

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-bg_f-oSfYJ4/VbUlJQA2fII/AAAAAAAAObk/sfNnzcB7XdU/s1600/ELP%2BCRAIG%2BPlayboy.jpg

You would just figure, for all of the fans who complained about these groups "selling out" etc., that there would have been a market share for at least one of these groups to "hold the line" and stay loyal to the progressive cause. I guess a lot of one's point of view depends on whether you think 80s King Crimson "went commercial" or "stayed progressive".

there would have been a market share for at least one of these groups to "hold the line" and stay loyal to the progressive cause

prog isn't always on time

I guess the first 70s act to "regress to progressive" was Anderson, Bruford, Wakeman and Howe in 1989, giving audiences the multipart suites and show-off playing they had been waiting for for more than a decade.

Rush definitely, Hemispheres (78) is the apex of their prog tendencies

but then start retooling (inspired by the Police, Talking Heads, etc)

Selling Out Fans by the Pound

the tracklisting on the AWBH album makes it seem way more progressive than it actually is

it is kind of surprising that none of these bands tried a comeback in the mid-80s when Marillion was hitting it big. I guess most of them were broken up or just not getting along.

Mid-80s? Yes had a pop comeback, Floyd had vanished up Waters' arse, Genesis were making $$$, Tull were pootling along towards dad-rock, ELP tried and failed with the ELPowell album.

No-one else much was big enough to survive punk/new wave, other than soft proggers like Camel or BJH who also headed dad-rockwards.

There was The Enid but they were more like a creepozoid religious cult by then.

i guess if we're counting floyd, animals was possibly their proggiest effort and that was '77.

There's the popular conception of prog musicians as "dinosaurs" by the time punk hit, although many were not much older than 30 (and Genesis were all younger than that). But I wonder to what extent the energy of youth fed into progressive rock in its golden era. As they aged, it was just easier to play triads on a synth pad than to try and write a concerto with every song, especially when the synth triads get you an ovation from the crowd.

It's not well regarded now but Momentary Lapse of Reason by Pink Floyd was really huge (4X platinum in the U.S.)was huge for kids, "Learning to Fly" and that music video were huge and definitely got a newer generation of fans.

Pink Floyd in 1987 was my first concert, and that album has a lot of progressive trappings like instrumentals and extended running times, but I said elsewhere that "Sorrow" is "Heartbeat" by Don Johnson dragged out for eight minutes.

Lately when I've listened to Duke it reminds me a lot of Gloss Drop-era Battles

It's not well regarded now but Momentary Lapse of Reason by Pink Floyd was really huge (4X platinum in the U.S.)was huge for kids, "Learning to Fly" and that music video were huge and definitely got a newer generation of fans.

The only time I ever saw Floyd was on this tour.