Interesting that Eddie VH was the first choice. I think Dweezil said once that Eddie was the first musician to call their house when Frank died.
“ Every once and I while I wonder how Lou was chosen for that induction job. Here’s something on a Zappa borad, but don’t know how much I trust someone who doesn’t know who Doc Pomus is. http://forum.zappa.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=13616#p326852 “
― “Big” Don Abernathy, Tuesday, 22 December 2020 02:18 (three years ago) link
I believe they did a Beatles medley on the same tour where they did Stairway.
I saw that tour - no Beatles songs. Here's the set list.
― but also fuck you (unperson), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 02:27 (three years ago) link
I guess this is where that HOF story came from https://wiki.killuglyradio.com/wiki/Zappa_Inducted_Into_The_Hall_Of_Fame
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 02:32 (three years ago) link
Where can the original Lumpy Gravy be heard?
― They sold me a dream of Christmas (Sund4r), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 02:33 (three years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Qqtmhx_btI
― Three Rings for the Elven Bishop (Dan Peterson), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 02:43 (three years ago) link
Wow!
― They sold me a dream of Christmas (Sund4r), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 02:46 (three years ago) link
The Beatles medley known as Texas Medley (Norwegian Jim/Louisiana Hooker with Herpes/Texas Motel) plus a straight cover (iirc) of "I Am the Walrus" are on the only FZ bootleg I have. Looks like they came from 3/13/88, Springfield MA.
― Motoroller Scampotron (WmC), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 02:47 (three years ago) link
I actually find the spoken word segments moderately interesting, in a surreal, free-association kind of way.
― Three Rings for the Elven Bishop (Dan Peterson), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 02:48 (three years ago) link
...segments of Lumpy gravy...
― Three Rings for the Elven Bishop (Dan Peterson), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 02:49 (three years ago) link
Lou's speech was good actually
― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 02:58 (three years ago) link
Yes, was pretty good. Although it still causes me no small amount of grief that nobody who edits that FZ wiki has heard of Doc Pomus.
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 03:02 (three years ago) link
well presumably not a big fan of songwriting
― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 03:08 (three years ago) link
what the fuck...just noticed that Freak Out!, We're Only In It for the Money, and the Lumpy Money Project/Object (which includes the original Capitol mono edit of Lumpy Gravy) are missing from Spotify...
― Motoroller Scampotron (WmC), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 03:20 (three years ago) link
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 03:33 (three years ago) link
First two are listed under The Mothers of Invention
― Mr. Cacciatore (Moodles), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 03:57 (three years ago) link
^^Yeah, and MOFO is under Zappa solo.
― "what are you DOING to fleetwood mac??" (C. Grisso/McCain), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 04:02 (three years ago) link
...which is to say, there is a version of Freak Out on Zappa's page.
― "what are you DOING to fleetwood mac??" (C. Grisso/McCain), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 04:10 (three years ago) link
From 1969
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zz9bn24rxrI
― Elvis Telecom, Tuesday, 22 December 2020 08:46 (three years ago) link
Still wondering if Lou actually liked any of Frank's music or was just sort of expanding or at least shoring up his own brand, given the overlap in fan base (that I myself observed anecdotally). Maybe he liked Ruben and the Jets, who knows. I recall that John- who was married to one of the GTOs! - had some problems with FZ, although the real keeper of the grudge was in fact Sterling.
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 13:54 (three years ago) link
Warhol hated on Zappa in his diaries, and this was in the '80s. He felt Zappa hogged all the credit for Moon Zappa's success with "Valley Girl."
― Josefa, Tuesday, 22 December 2020 14:06 (three years ago) link
I've never heard Lou Reed praise anything by Frank Zappa, I can't really imagine it being his thing at all. They both liked doo-wop, that's true. I think maybe Lou was trying to clean up his image by that stage and present himelf as a kind of venerable elder statesman of rock and roll? Or maybe it was connected to the Czech/Eastern European experience of the Velvets and Zappa being twin symbols of subversion.
― Eggbreak Hotel (Tom D.), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 14:10 (three years ago) link
Yes, that is how is I always thought about it, those last two sentences. I never knew about this: https://www.altaonline.com/dispatches/a4456/miss-christine-rock-legend/
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 14:15 (three years ago) link
Just found this reference to the HOF induction: Zappa - C/D
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 14:27 (three years ago) link
todd is to me the corrected version of zapps: when he does a genre parody, like "wolfman Jack" or "you cried wolf," it's "i love this music, even if its teenage and corny, and i'm going to put my heart into it." for many year's I've thought that zappa/mothers are to clinton/p funk as todd is to Stevie W.
there can be little doubt that zappa strongly disliked lou reed and his milieu, and I strongly doubt that Vaclav Havel succeeded in changing his mind; and it could only be that Jon Landau or somebody similar convinced miserable old Lou that it would be in his benefit to say "I liked Frank and I know he liked me" at the induction. Dweezil —who while VJing on MTV described Lou's solo on "Video Violence," off of Mistrial, which I've never heard beyond "The Original Rapper," is the worst guitar solos in the history of anything— strongly denied that his dad had any use for Reed.
The whole thing re: Dweezil vs Ahmet is fascinating, and is rooted in Gail's domineering stewardship. Within Zappa fandom, I believe no one is more polarizing than she.
'
― veronica moser, Tuesday, 22 December 2020 14:44 (three years ago) link
xpost: Dweezil said "Video Violence" featured the worst guitar solos in the history of anything.
― veronica moser, Tuesday, 22 December 2020 14:46 (three years ago) link
Zappa picked All Tomorrow's Parties as one of his 30 favorite songs in the history of music upthread so he must have appreciated Lou somewhat
― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 14:49 (three years ago) link
"Venus In Furs", I think? Yes, I can't imagine Lou would ever have returned the favour.
― Eggbreak Hotel (Tom D.), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 14:51 (three years ago) link
No, you're right it was "All Tomorrow's Parties", completely with Lou's raga lead guitar.
― Eggbreak Hotel (Tom D.), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 14:52 (three years ago) link
Maybe he just felt bad about an incident mentioned here and wanted to make up for it: https://www.criticsatlarge.ca/2013/10/the-wild-side-lou-reed-vs-frank-zappa.html
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 14:52 (three years ago) link
when he does a genre parody, like "wolfman Jack" or "you cried wolf," it's "i love this musicWanted to say the same thing about Weird Al, who was mentioned upthread.
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 14:55 (three years ago) link
xp is there even a solo on "Video Violence"...isn't the whole thing Lou w/ careening lead under all tha nah-nah-nah's
― early-Woolf semantic prosody (Hadrian VIII), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 14:58 (three years ago) link
The incident being
In between sets, Frank Zappa got up from his seat and walked up on the stage and sat behind the keyboard of Nico's B-3 organ. He proceeded to place his hands indiscriminately on the keyboard in a total, atonal fashion and screamed at the top of his lungs, doing a caricature of Nico's set, the one he had just seen. The words to his impromptu song were the names of vegetables like broccolli, cabbage, asparagus... This 'song' kept going for about a minute or so and then suddenly stopped. He walked off the stage and the show moved on. It was one of the greatest pieces of rock 'n roll theatre that I have ever seen."
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 14:59 (three years ago) link
New York had the Fugs, so I'm sure the Mothers didn't come as any great cultural shock to New Yorkers.
― Eggbreak Hotel (Tom D.), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 15:02 (three years ago) link
The Velvets didn't take kindly to the insult and Reed returned the favour. "Zappa is the single most untalented person I heard in my life," he sneered. ""He's a two-bit, pretentious academic, and he can't play rock 'n' roll, because he's a loser. And that's why he dresses funny. He's not happy with himself and I think he's right."
https://www.criticsatlarge.ca/2013/10/the-wild-side-lou-reed-vs-frank-zappa.html
― early-Woolf semantic prosody (Hadrian VIII), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 15:02 (three years ago) link
oh ha xp
It was one of the greatest pieces of rock 'n roll theatre that I have ever seen."jackoffmotion.gif
― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 15:03 (three years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mXIL_LKvvI
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 15:05 (three years ago) link
Guy who wrote that long article also wrote 33 1⁄3 book on Trout Mask Replica that some people seem to like.
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 15:12 (three years ago) link
Reed calling Zappa a pretentious academic is tbh ludicrous considering it was Reed and not Zappa who got a formal university education and Reed's documented poetic aspirations are not more intrinsically rock'n'roll than Zappa's compositional aspirations.
― They sold me a dream of Christmas (Sund4r), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 15:49 (three years ago) link
One interesting fact that seems to have thus far gone unnoted is Zappa’s go-to Sabbath song changing from “Supernaut” to “Iron Man.”
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 16:09 (three years ago) link
dweezil's comment on the guitar in video violence suggests he doesn't really get how the songs works and what the guitar is doing in it?
tho when it gets scribbly (just before the five minute mark) it's maybe a wee bit more phoned-in and perfunctory than reed scribble is elsewhere? but calling this out as "worst" suggests someone paying very close attention to reed guitar-scribble down the years lol
― mark s, Tuesday, 22 December 2020 16:11 (three years ago) link
on the whole i don't feel either camp was very good at insults
― mark s, Tuesday, 22 December 2020 16:12 (three years ago) link
I dunno, think that Nico was pretty good at it at least.
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 16:15 (three years ago) link
Velvets had a higher percentage of members with far right political opinions, as far as I'm aware, so FZ wins on that score.
― that heat (Matt #2), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 16:26 (three years ago) link
Now thinking about one of my favorite topics, Tom Wilson, and how he was kind of a house producer at Columbia, producing “Like a Rolling Stone” and overdubbing “The Sound of Silence” right before he left (or got fired from?) the label and ended up at Verve/MGM with The Mothers and Velvets (along with producing The Animals).
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 16:27 (three years ago) link
and the mothers had roy estrada xp
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 16:28 (three years ago) link
This is the Lou "Video Violence" clip in question. MTV showed this concert live (which also featured Miles Davis, U2, Peter Gabriel, Santana -- with Fela! -- the Police, and Joni Mitchell), but also ran this Lou excerpt in medium rotation during the following weeks. I saw Dweezil say it was the worst solo ever and thought, "what?! The guitarist on the Don Johnson record hates this solo?!"
solo starts at 4:03, and it's fucking beautiful:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L7HGosUNALI
― Montgomery Burns' Jazz (Tarfumes The Escape Goat), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 16:31 (three years ago) link
the Mothers had a high percentage of child molesters
― ( X '____' )/ (zappi), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 16:32 (three years ago) link
"Gerry Hologram" followed by "Sweet Home Alabama" is hilarious
― real muthaphuckkin jeez (crüt), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 16:33 (three years ago) link
Yeah, thought so too.
― Whamagideon Time (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 22 December 2020 16:33 (three years ago) link