ha! yeah, gold rush
and the other song was happiness, listening to it now. in fact if someone had played this for me and told me it was a tori amos song I'd have believed them.
― akm, Friday, 18 December 2020 03:02 (three years ago) link
also, I wonder if it's weird for Aaron Dessner who went from being 'guy in a moderately famous indie rock band' to cowriter of what will probably be seen as collectively one of the best American music releases of the 21st century.
― akm, Friday, 18 December 2020 03:39 (three years ago) link
I have been curious about how/if her core fanbase have been acquainting themselves with his work and everything he's attached to (namely The National ofc)
― winters (josh), Friday, 18 December 2020 04:01 (three years ago) link
Some good stuff here from Marissa Moss on Evermore / Taylor's relationship with country music
https://dontrocktheinbox.substack.com/p/dont-rock-the-inbox-issue-3
― Indexed, Friday, 18 December 2020 16:05 (three years ago) link
xp Speaking of her core fanbase – I was chatting w/a coworker who seemed like a gonzo fan (based on his Slack comments re: Folklore); I mentioned Red, and he admitted that he hasn't heard anything earlier than 1989.
― good karma, my aesthetic (morrisp), Friday, 18 December 2020 23:23 (three years ago) link
FYI, there’s an EP with a few different versions (mixes?) of “Willow,” including the one that brad posted above.
― good karma, my aesthetic (morrisp), Saturday, 19 December 2020 02:43 (three years ago) link
There’s something so... relaxed, superficially “minor” about “Ivy” and “Cowboy Like Me”, a vibe which feels almost like a breakthrough in her songwriting (they’re not actually minor at all, of course - this is some of her loveliest songwriting, performed with great delicacy) - an increasing realisation that you can skip the exclamation marks and the bold underline emphasis and still capture something important and alluring.
― Tim F, Saturday, 19 December 2020 05:43 (three years ago) link
^yeah, this is well-stated... these songs don’t have that slightly “show-offy” quality that her stuff often has (including folklore, even though its songs present themselves as “understated”).
― good karma, my aesthetic (morrisp), Saturday, 19 December 2020 07:29 (three years ago) link
(and “show-offy” isn’t bad – just to be clear! – but I think one reason I connect w/evermore so much is that the songs work that other vibe which Tim expressed.)
― good karma, my aesthetic (morrisp), Saturday, 19 December 2020 07:32 (three years ago) link
one of the tracks she's reused melodic phrases from in "champagne problems" is "all too well" but i haven't managed to place the others yet
― ufo, Friday, December 11, 2020
"i knew you were trouble"
for whatever reason, the one song that has really stayed with me from these first few days with this album is gold rush, which i haven't seen discussed much...
― petey v, Sunday, December 13, 2020
what popped for me at once on first listen: morrissey's coastal town, interpolated in a way that immediately calls to mind some of the conjurings of NFR! (CSN, Cohen, sorry haters!) which hey, we found the Antonoff track! (so everything comes full circle and on first listen it's my favorite track on the record, until the next one comes in to eclipse it)
― Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Saturday, 19 December 2020 19:36 (three years ago) link
Huh, listen to “Cowboy Like Me” and Tori’s “Crazy” back to back.
― Tim F, Sunday, 20 December 2020 00:49 (three years ago) link
now you hang from my lipslike the gardens of babylon
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Sunday, 20 December 2020 03:02 (three years ago) link
yes, the phrasings in bits of cowboy like me are very amos also. none of this is a knock, IMO. I'm all for more people writing songs that sound like this.
i saw some people giving 'some tent like thing' some criticism but I really like that line.
― akm, Sunday, 20 December 2020 17:43 (three years ago) link
Me too - it's a cool line, and doesn't seem like the kind of lyric she would normally write.
― good karma, my aesthetic (morrisp), Sunday, 20 December 2020 17:48 (three years ago) link
that line is amazing!!!!
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Sunday, 20 December 2020 17:48 (three years ago) link
(It reminds me of a particular band or artist that I can't place.)
― good karma, my aesthetic (morrisp), Sunday, 20 December 2020 17:49 (three years ago) link
I think the comment I saw about that was on the hoffman forums, and someone did add "not sure what else she would have said, 'tarpaulin'?' and now I think "the tennis court was covered up with some tarpaulin' half the time, which is what elvis costello would have written and it would have been stupid
― akm, Sunday, 20 December 2020 17:59 (three years ago) link
love Bernie Tarpaulin's lyrics
― good karma, my aesthetic (morrisp), Sunday, 20 December 2020 18:03 (three years ago) link
i am unsure why i love "cowboy like me" as much as i do (maybe because it reminds me of "papa was a rodeo" if covered by emmylou harris) but it is full of some terrific and realized writing, including "some tent like thing", it really nails down the protagonist's vernacular. amy hempel could've written it. unshowy and minor as referenced above, but no less striking. actually even more impressive than the knockout one-liners she's proven capable of.
― billy, Sunday, 20 December 2020 18:09 (three years ago) link
That line reminds me of Connie Converse's "some sort of a squirrel thing"I've found myself starting the record at "ivy" and then just letting that last stretch play. "cowboy like me" my fave though
― bunny slopes, Sunday, 20 December 2020 18:17 (three years ago) link
yeah "ivy" --> "evermore" is her best ever stretch of songs
― billy, Sunday, 20 December 2020 18:21 (three years ago) link
"papa was a rodeo" if covered by emmylou harris
^nice! it also makes me think of "papa was a rodeo" (but I shied away from mentioning that, as it felt too indie-schmindie a reference).
― good karma, my aesthetic (morrisp), Sunday, 20 December 2020 18:23 (three years ago) link
need more stately songs about reckless swindlers meeting their match tbh
― billy, Sunday, 20 December 2020 18:31 (three years ago) link
i was talking to tim about this record yesterday and he pointed out that "cowboy like me" features one of her favorite lyrical tricks (which is all over this record), the repeated phrase that is altered by its new context each time it recurs, cf. "i haven't met the new me yet" in "happiness." "cowboy like me"'s is "i could be the way forward / only if they pay for it" which curdles into "we could be the way forward / and i know i'll pay for it." i keep thinking that insecurity and melancholy are the driving emotions of that song even though on the surface it is about finding love in your chosen field if that field happens to be con artistry, because it's a relationship where you're never certain if the person you're falling for is the real one, and you never know if they're ever being truly honest with you. and this is never stated outright, it just works through the song ambiguously, compromising every declaration of certainty, subtly poisoning lines like "i'm never gonna love again" from the very roots. it's great writing
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Sunday, 20 December 2020 18:38 (three years ago) link
song feels bottomless both in its sound and vision
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Sunday, 20 December 2020 18:40 (three years ago) link
we also talked about "ivy," i am sort of struck every time i hear it that it's the apotheosis of her career's worth of themes, the pull of an imaginary fairytale universe somehow unlocked by true love b/w the overdriven romantic and sexual tensions of songs like "treacherous," except in this song the latter so darkens and confuses the former that it feels like you're wandering through the ruins of a castle or a magical forest full of dead trees. it is so lost in this effect that lyrically she gives almost nothing away, there's so much allusion and incident that only sort of indirectly tells you what's going on ("and the old widow goes to the stone every day / but i don't, i just sit here and wait / grieving for the living"). it's like the song is wreathed in a fog. so often her successful writing is rooted in the specificity and resonance of her details so "ivy" really does feel like it has its foot in another world where nothing resolves so easily. so like while it's the apotheosis of her themes it delivers them with what feels like a new obliqueness and mystery
at least half of these ideas are copyright tim f btw
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Sunday, 20 December 2020 18:52 (three years ago) link
I also like the "tent-like thing" line a lot, but I wish she'd kept up that voice all the way through the song. The "gardens of Babylon" line sounds more like Taylor Swift to me, less like something that character would say.
― Lily Dale, Sunday, 20 December 2020 21:48 (three years ago) link
I'm sorry, the old Taylor can't come to the phone right now
― good karma, my aesthetic (morrisp), Monday, 21 December 2020 23:50 (three years ago) link
i was talking to tim about this record yesterday and he pointed out that "cowboy like me" features one of her favorite lyrical tricks (which is all over this record), the repeated phrase that is altered by its new context each time it recurs, cf. "i haven't met the new me yet" in "happiness." "cowboy like me"'s is "i could be the way forward / only if they pay for it" which curdles into "we could be the way forward / and i know i'll pay for it."
Totally. She does this elsewhere in "Cowboy" with "I've got some tricks up my sleeve" then "You had some tricks up your sleeve" then "I've had some tricks up my sleeve," which seems simple enough but is a subtle and clever way to tell stories with the chorus not just the verses.
― Indexed, Tuesday, 22 December 2020 14:39 (three years ago) link
Probably stating the obvious (and previously stated), but this feels like the "10 years later" version of Folklore: the high-school drama has turned into adult relationships and regrets. Today it's "happiness" that's hitting me hardest.
― timber euros (seandalai), Friday, 25 December 2020 01:59 (three years ago) link
"the lakes" is the only folklore track i don't really care for so i am really surprised at how great the evermore bonus tracks are
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Sunday, 27 December 2020 18:51 (three years ago) link
"great" may be overstating it, i wouldn't swap them for anything on the record, and "it's time to go" sort of confirms this is her joni mitchell record, taylor just had the good sense to cut "the windfall (everything for nothing)" from the official tracklist
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Sunday, 27 December 2020 19:02 (three years ago) link
I think my CD is scheduled to arrive tmrrw. Looking forward to it
― Qui-Gon's Noble End (morrisp), Sunday, 27 December 2020 19:12 (three years ago) link
lol I haven’t heard these yet but I still get the windfall joke
― Tim F, Sunday, 27 December 2020 22:14 (three years ago) link
but which is 'Ray's Dad's Cadillac'?
― kniphofia face (Sufjan Grafton), Monday, 28 December 2020 08:11 (three years ago) link
closure sounds like casiontone for the painfully alone imo, i like its sentiment but it doesnt work for me
― johnny crunch, Wednesday, 30 December 2020 19:36 (three years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ur_wAcYDnuA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1iRbIYkccgw
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Thursday, 7 January 2021 14:44 (three years ago) link
Really nice songs, IMO
― Four Jacks and a Jill (morrisp), Thursday, 7 January 2021 21:53 (three years ago) link
girl... enough
― J0rdan S., Thursday, 7 January 2021 22:04 (three years ago) link
I guess “Right Where You Left Me” sounds a little like “You Belong to Me”... which is not an unwelcome callback, for a post-breakup song years later. Such good lyrics—
I’m sure that you got a wife out there Kids and Christmas
― Four Jacks and a Jill (morrisp), Saturday, 9 January 2021 21:44 (three years ago) link
Wow, just listened to "Tolerate It" and "closure": p cool; 5/4 grooves were not what I expected from her.
― Inside there's a box and that box has another box within (Sund4r), Saturday, 23 January 2021 16:56 (three years ago) link
I find “Tolerate It” pops into my head a lot.
― one of the only artist who is genuine (morrisp), Saturday, 23 January 2021 18:56 (three years ago) link
One of several remarkable things about "Cowboy Like Me" is how it kicks off with what turns out to essentially be the bridge melody, when it returns around 2:50. Can anyone think of another example of a song that does that? (I'm a connoisseur of bridges in songs, I can't off the top of my head.)
I love how this song floats along, stately & serene, lightly touching down every time it shifts from section to section.
― Home Pong (morrisp), Friday, 29 January 2021 02:25 (three years ago) link
It’s easy to imagine a Matrix-produced version of “Long Story Short” being a hit for an Avril or Michelle Branch in the early ‘00s (this is a virtue, btw).
― Home Pong (morrisp), Friday, 29 January 2021 02:36 (three years ago) link
I feel like "Ivy" through "Long Story Short" is her finest 3 song run ever.
― Tim F, Friday, 29 January 2021 03:03 (three years ago) link
Yes! (That’s the run I just experienced in the car.)
― Home Pong (morrisp), Friday, 29 January 2021 03:05 (three years ago) link
i wish to knowthe fatal flaw that makes you long to bemagnificently cursed
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Friday, 5 February 2021 21:20 (three years ago) link
the "lay the table with the fancy shit" chapter
― babe for the weekend (morrisp), Saturday, 6 February 2021 01:07 (three years ago) link
the AND NOW! backing vocals in "long story short" are so deliriously infectious
― uberweiss, Saturday, 6 February 2021 10:53 (three years ago) link
Ftr, I was wrong about “Cowboy” kicking off with the bridge melody (don’t know why I heard it that way earlier).
― babe for the weekend (morrisp), Saturday, 6 February 2021 23:16 (three years ago) link