GET OUT: US politics November 2020

I used to be on his mailing list and he spent a lot of time responding to people who were actual physicists who wrote him to disprove his idiotic "new theory of gravity" claiming that he actually knew more about science than they did and how gravity is just a THEORY and therefore you can't actually debunk it and his ideas are JUST AS VALID as anyone else's and yeah it really pointed the direction to where he was going

is there a Dilbert character that resembles Adam’s’ personality?

So about those rallies:

As the 2020 campaign wound down, President Donald Trump held rallies across the country to fire up his supporters and get them out to vote. Many saw the rallies as a sign of big enthusiasm for Trump, but the data suggest the visits did not produce the desired impact for the president.

Comparing Trump campaign stops over the last two weeks of the race to election results shows that in the overwhelming majority of cases, Trump underperformed his 2016 margins in the counties he visited, in some cases by large amounts.

There were 30 Trump campaign stops in that period, according to an NBC News tally, in states from Arizona to Nebraska to Pennsylvania. In five counties that Trump visited he saw better results than he did in 2016, but in the remaining 25 his margins of victory got smaller, his margin of defeat grew or the county flipped Democratic

that's the funny part, I think everyone imagines when they read the strip that he saw himself as Dilbert but he really sees himself as Dogbert. and actually resembles the pointy-haired boss more than either.

iirc there was a garbageman character who was secretly the smartest man in the universe and I remember thinking "I really hope this isn't supposed to be a stand-in for Scott Adams" and what do you know it actually was

Yeah, I used to subscribe to his mailing list. He used one of my ideas for one of his weekend strips.

SA was kooky in the 90s too. He claimed that since the Dilberito was the perfect food, your body would recognize it and only want to eat Dilberitos for the rest of time.

anybody fired by t now could conceivably be rehired by Biden. I mean if there was any redemption for anybody still around to be fired like.

I don't think I'm ready to wade into the Biden thread, but I'm really feeling disheartened today by all the people who seem to be very demonstrative in completely writing off the Biden presidency already instead of, y'know, making plans to continue pushing him. Like, no, I'm still not a fan and I'm really skeptical about him making any significantly progressive moves, but at the same time, after what we've been through for the last four years, it's hard to me to see people so ready to just wash their hands of the next four years.

Yeah I don't touch the Biden threads, but Antony Blinken is a warmonger. We're in for bad times.

so i guess you love bombing Iraqi children, is that it jon

Blinken is absolutely terrible, for sure, but I don't think burying our heads in the sand to wait out the next four years is the answer either.

I don't know who's planning on burying their head in the sand, or really what that would mean here, but pressuring the Biden admin against war has to start now. Blinken's alleged Francophilia, a much touted "feature" over here, doesn't encourage me, since I can see Europe gladly joining a war against Iran and/or Syria (and/or Turkey? au revoir OTAN)

Some good and bad in his record but Bernie’s FP advisor said Blinken was a good choice.

Biden campaigned on rejoining JCPOA and his cabinet will be full of people who supported that diplomacy.

Biden campaigned on rejoining JCPOA and his cabinet will be full of people who supported that diplomacy.

Fwiw the "head in the sand" isn't aimed at anyone around here, just a general vibe I'm seeing from a lot of folks on Twitter who say they are focusing on getting someone more progressive in line for 2024. Which, yes, but there's some other work to be done in the meantime too.

genuinely recommend logging off of twitter

I don't think I'm ready to wade into the Biden thread, but I'm really feeling disheartened today by all the people who seem to be very demonstrative in completely writing off the Biden presidency already instead of, y'know, making plans to continue pushing him.

I expressed a similar sentiment in the Democratic (Party) Direction thread this morning. I sense a divide between people (like me) who place some measure of hope (however small) in the presidency as a means to advance meaningful change and those who find it hopeless so long as the administration is made up of members of the "political establishment."
(I suspect this is partially a matter of different lessons being drawn from the Obama presidency.)

Dudes, Joe Biden isn't going to go to war.

He's probably going to do dumb things, and he won't do a lot of things he should, but if John Bolton + Donald Trump in the White House didn't give us war with Iran, Joe Biden is not going to.

Biden has become much more skeptical of interventionism over the past decade or so.

nonsense, we're invading Mar-a-lago on 1/20

(I'm not saying there won't be drone strikes or any of the other mainstays of post-9/11 interventionism, there most certainly will be. I just think large-scale military action is exceedingly unlikely for a whole bunch of reasons.)

I'm really feeling disheartened today by all the people who seem to be very demonstrative in completely writing off the Biden presidency already instead of, y'know, making plans to continue pushing him.

There is no mechanism to push him (presumably left). The time to do that was in January, February or March 2020 by nominating someone else. Joe Biden's politics have been on display for our entire lives - better than Trump, but still thoroughly rotten.

The one option that's even theoretically possible - primarying him or not voting for him in 2024 - is most likely irrelevant because he's not likely to run again. (And let's be honest, no matter what he did, anyone suggesting primarying a sitting Democratic President would be strung up for suggesting it in the age of every election being a referendum on the end of the world and Worst Republican Ever.)

Maintain hope (in Biden) or don't, that's none of anyone else's business - but likewise, there's no reason to disdain people who look at the situation and don't reach that conclusion.

I hope you're right. I never thought the outgoing president would go to war: the fucker did just what he said he was gonna do, and not going to war was one of those things. I don't trust Biden and "the Democratic establishment" on this, not when "an economy" is gonna need to be "stimulated". But I hope I'm wrong.

Harris will surely not appear to be a sure thing to the Mayo Petes of the world in 24

It’s kinda hilarious that if Biden plans to decline a second term instead of I guess dying he’ll have to announce it by like March of 2023

I don't believe the right-wing talking point that there's a done deal for Biden to step down by date certain so Harris can run as an incumbent, but it's certainly a possibility.

I have no fear of war in the sense we understood it before... 2008. Boots on the ground means body bags coming home means bad press - we'll just carry out assassinations, drone strikes and the occasional strategic bombing (though they probably even learned their lesson about that from Libya and Syria) and let the fine folks at the CIA foment coups.

There is no mechanism to push him (presumably left). The time to do that was in January, February or March 2020 by nominating someone else. Joe Biden's politics have been on display for our entire lives - better than Trump, but still thoroughly rotten.

The one option that's even theoretically possible - primarying him or not voting for him in 2024 - is most likely irrelevant because he's not likely to run again. (And let's be honest, no matter what he did, anyone suggesting primarying a sitting Democratic President would be strung up for suggesting it in the age of every election being a referendum on the end of the world and Worst Republican Ever.)

Maintain hope (in Biden) or don't, that's none of anyone else's business - but likewise, there's no reason to disdain people who look at the situation and don't reach that conclusion.

It's not disdain, I just don't agree that giving up is the answer. No, there isn't an easy mechanism, but I don't agree with the premise that there is nothing that can be done.

Baring a specific health setback or his prospects being obviously nil, I would expect Biden to run in 2024. You don't spend 30+ years trying to be president just to give it up because people think you should.

we'll just carry out assassinations, drone strikes and the occasional strategic bombing (though they probably even learned their lesson about that from Libya and Syria) and let the fine folks at the CIA foment coups.

And selling loads of weapons, of course.

He's wearing a boot today as a result of a hairline fracture, not the first health problem we'll see.

The negative nancies are operating under the (understandable, given the past four years) misapprehension that the president = the entire party. He's not a king, and if you're already giving up hope that his actions and decisions could ever possibly be curtailed, that's on you.

If it looks like Biden's thinking about a second run, I'd expect to see lots of Democratic leaks and rumors about him "slipping" and so forth.

those will be overwhelmed by republicans saying he's literally dying, he's worse than reagan in 1988, or that he's straight-up dead. in any of those cases, the plan the entire time was for kamala harris to become president. and that's a big problem, because she's not white

It's not disdain, I just don't agree that giving up is the answer. No, there isn't an easy mechanism, but I don't agree with the premise that there is nothing that can be done.

'Giving up' on Biden is not the same as giving up politically, though. It's actually more valuable, because it means redirecting your energies to somewhere you can at least possibly make a difference. Taking part in a union drive at work would be a more concrete and effective political act than anything you could do in terms of the Presidency for at least the next 3.5 years.

You say no 'easy' mechanism - what is the mechanism at all?!

Taking part in a union drive at work would be a more concrete and effective political act than anything you could do in terms of the Presidency for at least the next 3.5 years.

otm

xpost - C'mon now, you are just being willfully obtuse at this point and I'm done engaging with you. You know very well there are other methods to hold our elected officials accountable, even when it isn't easy.

There is no mechanism to push him (presumably left).

You've said things like this before. Does that mean you think there is no way to exert public pressure through protests or advocacy campaigns?

unless his presidency is a carter-level catastrophe (possible) or his health drastically declines (also possible), biden will absolutely run again in four years.

Observing the actions and words of Joe Biden, and the records of his cabinet members, does not constitute giving up on pushing them (or lower, easier-to-reach elements of the party) in the direction of policies that acknowledge and consider humanity. Rather, it is essential in order to know where they need to be pushed.

You know very well there are other methods to hold our elected officials accountable, even when it isn't easy.

You've said things like this before. Does that mean you think there is no way to exert public pressure through protests or advocacy campaigns?

Before the election I asked what the mechanism was, actually, and got crickets. The idea of 'pushing him left' is a comforting myth - you vote for the politician as they've presented themselves to you.

Two mechanisms - impeachment and removal (Donald Trump couldn't get removed from office after successive iterations of halfwit Watergate) and voting them out/not voting for them (if Biden ran in 2024, anyone who suggested not voting for him would be the Antichrist because every election is the most important one ever, etc.).

Protests? Joe Biden ran for President through months-long civil unrest and has rejected the goals of that protest movement repeatedly. It's being reported that he's still pushing for Rahm Emanuel in the Cabinet.

Advocacy can work on people afraid for their jobs - a Representative who might get primaried or someone at risk of losing in the general, for instance - but in a safe job? What do they have to fear?

Joe Biden is either a one-term President or safely ensconced as the 2024 nominee. Would you, under any realistic circumstances, consider not voting for the Democratic nominee in 2024?

a lot of folks on Twitter who say they are focusing on getting someone more progressive in line for 2024.

That's a legitimate activity, but I'd hope the focus isn't entirely on who the candidate will be, so much as a focus on organizing around anything that excites and motivates progressive voters and can unify them into a more effective bloc.

You say no 'easy' mechanism - what is the mechanism at all?!

Mobilizing a coalition of motivated voters and converting them into activists between elections. Gather your strength and make it manifest. Look at the frigging Tea Party for clues. Their public face may have been a mob of fools, but they were fools who were carefully assembled and directed by good organizers.

That's not a mechanism for "pushing Joe Biden left."

It is a mechanism for pushing politics left and Joe Biden can move or get left behind.

You've said things like this before. Does that mean you think there is no way to exert public pressure through protests or advocacy campaigns?

Joe Biden's response to every-second-daily riots by police against the citizenry in June was to pledge to increase funding for the police, and train them to shoot protestors against police violence, instead of the tear gas they were using against us - in violation of the Geneva convention - at the time.

During the televised campaign debates last month, he repeated these pledges, and declared that the entire institution of American policing was wholly & irreparably tainted, but that enabling collusion between internal police review boards was a solution and that external oversight would not be applied under his druthers.

During active protests against police murder in PA after that, he took off his mask to approach cameras and declare that protestors were the problem. Hours later, cops straight up smashed a woman's car windows and stole her baby while kicking her in the street, in order to create a fake PR stunt. Biden has yet to suggest that this kidnapping by the cops might have been the cops' fault.

It seems very, very unlikely that Joseph Biden, in particular, is susceptible to public protests as a lever of change.

My sense is the US joining the French/UK intervention in Libya and the continuing mess that is Syria has really soured much of the foreign policy blob on overt interventions. The only place it works is where there's the US is just providing fire support for a strong local force (the SDF in Rojava, Shia militias in Iraq).

But Samantha Powers is still on Biden's advisory board, and her life mission is to prevent future Rwandas and Bosnias. If gets an administration post, she'll be the person who poses the greatest threat. Not a s(t)olidly competent blobster like Blinken.

guys for there to be a 2024 election there has to be a 2024 first

Well, if there's nothing I can do, guess I'll crawl into the ground for the next four years and come back out to vote for the Democrat in 2024. So long!

It is a mechanism for pushing politics left and Joe Biden can move or get left behind.

The question was moving Joe Biden left, though. As I said in repeated responses - once you 'give up' on Diamond Joe, you can focus your energy on "pushing politics left" in areas where you have agency.

this was many xps - the impact of right-wing activists (ignoring the Koch money that flooded into the Tea Party from day 3) is effective because Republicans are terrified of their voters. They can't even make the mildest acknowledgement that Biden won the election.

You don't make Democratic politicians afraid of their voters by 'voting blue no matter who.'