Taylor Swift - Folklore

and look, apple still pays shit royalties and taylor swift does commercials for them. i'm not painting her as a hero. she's a populist and a capitalist at heart -- i wrote a whole long article on this subject myself.

https://www.spin.com/featured/taylor-swift-pop-music-me-essay/

but to say she doesn't use her platform to advocate for artists w/ less power than her isn't true. and from there i would consider who has the power here -- the three label corporations and two streaming services that currently control how we consume basically the entirety of music, or one taylor swift.

And fair point abt the free trial session re: Apple. I wonder how much that concession cost Apple! probably a lot, tbh

In this situation, Swift has more and less power than we'd think-- she definitely has "more" power in the ruination of an indie label (Big Machine) or an individual (Scooter Braun) with her capacity to activate her fanbase. She has "less" power with regards to her own career than we'd think-- she, too, has to negotiate contracts and will find her creations bought and sold by individuals she'd prefer not to buy and/or sell her work. Considering that a "constructive" solution to The Streaming Problem (TIDAL) failed, I'd be interested to see what kind of "destructive" solution Taylor might come up with re: Spotify. Seriously! Couldn't she sic her fans on Daniel Ek? That's be great

she is very devoted to the idea of her music reaching as many impressionable souls as possible -- this was her explicit reasoning for writing "me," which is a terrible song. i wonder if she would truly want to shatter the DSP system when it's how so many of her fans access her music -- she already caved on this subject once by going back to spotify after her three year hiatus. on the one hand there's the obvious fact that being on streaming makes her more money, but in terms of the overall slice of the taylor swift income pie i would imagine it's pretty small. i feel like she basically already tried the protest, and it didn't really matter bcuz no other artists joined her, and she decided she would rather ppl be able to listen to her music there than not. this is where the power dynamics come into play... what can one person even of her stature actually do, and who is she actually hurting? i think in the case of the spotify boycott she eventually reasoned her fans were losing out more so than spotify. and then to what extent are her decisions driven by her desire to be accessible to her fans vs her desire to make money. it's all very debatable but i do feel like she has tried to hash it out in a public fashion in a way that a large number of her peers are not

That's very reminiscent of Pearl Jam v. Ticketmaster. They tried, no one really had their back, and in the end they decided better to do the best they could from the belly of the beast. Which they more or less have.

She signed the fucking contract. This whining from a billionaire singer is fucking ridiculous. She got fame and fortune out of her contract and now she wants more. Fuck that.

She was 15 when she signed the contract!

Sure, she signed it alone without lawyers there explaining what it meant? Was she also a millionaire at 15 or did she have to wait to 16 before she banked her first million? She got what she wanted out of the contract. In related news, my mortgage company expects me to keep paying them money all because i signed some fucking papers. It's SO UNFAIR.

Good to see this thread revealing all of the predatory corporation bootlickers.

No one should be held to something for the rest of their lives that they signed at 15.

Sure, she signed it alone without lawyers there explaining what it meant? Was she also a millionaire at 15 or did she have to wait to 16 before she banked her first million? She got what she wanted out of the contract. In related news, my mortgage company expects me to keep paying them money all because i signed some fucking papers. It's SO UNFAIR.

― brotherlovesdub, Tuesday, November 17, 2020 11:53 AM (twenty-nine minutes ago)

psychotic posts

that is a post from everyone's conservative cousin about student loan forgiveness.

yeah I totally get giving the kids of a financial-sector goons the side-eye but that seems like a bit much even to me

Huzzah

Well it’s 11/24 and 24-11=13 so I’ve got an announcement 🤓 You haven’t seen this film before ✨ folklore: the long pond studio sessions will be out tonight at midnight PST on @DisneyPlus! #folkloreOnDisneyPlus pic.twitter.com/BTWSRM0yaI

— Taylor Swift (@taylorswift13) November 24, 2020

That was.. really great. Album is a beautiful fit for a filmed studio session.

ugh i need to see this, currently asking all of my friends for a disney plus login

yeah this was fucking amazing. "epiphany" suddenly my favorite song

Quite good indeed. Rather liked “Mirrorball.”

yeah the version of "epiphany" on this is a highlight

Haven't had a chance to watch the film yet, but listening to the Long Pond Studio Sessions today and am quite impressed with what they were able to do with so little. It's a lovely, clear, intimate performance that reminds me of "unplugged" live recordings.

Looking forward to watching this with my family, but I must admit I raised an eyebrow at her dramatic make-under of not-straight hair and flannel. Reminded me of one of those political ads (or mock political ads) of some typically dark-suited dude in a red flannel shirt out in the snow chopping logs for votes.

"epiphany" is gorgeous

I thought this was really good, though I'm only about 2/3rds of the way through so far. As Ned says, "Mirroball" was a highlight too.

xxp probably better to not invite over a makeup/hair team over just to make herself more fuckable during a pandemic

sorry that was harsh, I should have left it at "who fucking cares"

More like the more relaxed look is much more suited to this album's vibe and themes.

Probably also a corrective to the years she spent trying to meet media/fashion industry standards for "perfect" and very feminine clothes/hair/makeup every time she left the house.

Good point as well! That was the part from her documentary that really stuck with me.

Listening to the Studio Sessions tracks now -- I agree, they're really nice. (She also doesn't sound like she's singing "toilet" on "Mirrorball," which is a plus.)

What I found so striking about this is how hyper-literate and rational Taylor is in describing her own songs. It’s all very “I started with this fundamental premise which grew out of this aspect of the arrangement, and I embellished it by connecting it with this other idea over here, which is explored more fully in this other song...” It’s like you’re reading a Wikipedia or Genius entry.

yeah, it was funny to see the contrast between the internet's fantastical readings of i.e. "betty" as an autobiographical admission of lesbian love and taylor's explanation of "well joe had written this entire chorus, and i thought it was really good, and i also realized i'd never sung a song from a man's POV apologizing to a woman, it's always the woman asking a man for an apology, so i thought it would be interesting to include that in my discography." she alludes to the autobiographical nature of some of the songs (mostly as it pertains to scooter braun or kanye) but so much of her songwriting process seems to be wrapped up in either subverting or bolstering her entire previous history as a songwriter. every song is a puzzle piece in the context of her full discography which sounds exhausting but is sort of clarifying.

that said i wish to forget the whole discussion about how celebrities are like disco balls

Haha yeah I found that part unhelpful too.

I think it’s astute to connect “Mirrorball” with “This Is Me Trying”, but it goes beyond the idea of “trying”, or perhaps rather that idea is bigger than it seems. Both songs are profiles of the same personality type - the person who is motivated by the need to be things for others, to give them what they want, who perhaps isn’t sure if they have a genuine real persona just for themselves - but from different vantages, with the latter focusing on the limitations of that persona and the former on how its successes can conceal the limitations.

The mirrorball metaphor is or should be about more than celebrity culture: the key point is that mirrorballs only reflect and retract light from another source. “I’ll show you every version of yourself tonight” - because I don’t have a “myself” to show; the glittery surface is also the core.

But the literal details of how all that manifests in Taylor’s life - as a celebrity who goes on tour - are the least interesting part of that frame - and only serve to make the frame seem less empathetic than it is.

I love the vulnerability in the Mirrorball lyric, the part about "I've never been a natural/all I do is try, try, try." Maybe a little more revealing than Taylor is comfortable talking about?

yeah the more literal that explanation gets the more limiting the song feels

i did like her explanation of “peace” tho which is a branch off the same tree. but for me there’s also something more deeply felt about that production and vocal performance compared to “mirrorball” that makes it more easily transcend her specific context for it

I had some thoughts:

https://www.patreon.com/posts/covid-coping-44462404

Ned, the Laid analogy is unexpected and apt.

lol now I'm imagining a Swift album produced by Eno.

quite easy!

I'd be down, of course. It might be like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R9FW1N2FR_w

I’m imagining one produced by Albini.

I bet a Swift alone with piano or guitar album produced by Albini would sound great.

Better than a Shellac album produced by Eno.

I'm imagining Taylor Swift producing The National.

Swift by Eno could come too close to Surprise.

^^^^ I had the same thought.

had to partially tune out the "mirrorball" convo once i realized swift's interpretation of the song was much... narrower than mine, but i think she did a least a little bit of work to expand that interpretation beyond the limits of her own celebrity by saying it's about "people who have to be on all the time." kinda think that feeds into my idea of the song, which is that it's about a chronic people-pleaser who has no inner resources to fall back on once said people leave. also i think i'm just repeating tim's post, which is otm

Ned, the Laid analogy is unexpected and apt.

Thanks -- a random flash thought the other day that suddenly made a huge kind of sense.

"Swift by Eno could come too close to Surprise."

or one of his boring ass Coldplay albums. he'd be the wrong producer for her (as much as I like his work on that Siberry album)

had to partially tune out the "mirrorball" convo once i realized swift's interpretation of the song was much... narrower than mine, but i think she did a least a little bit of work to expand that interpretation beyond the limits of her own celebrity by saying it's about "people who have to be on all the time." kinda think that feeds into my idea of the song, which is that it's about a chronic people-pleaser who has no inner resources to fall back on once said people leave.

is it too circular to say that this is otm?

jordan's following observations are almost like a meta-version of this:

she alludes to the autobiographical nature of some of the songs (mostly as it pertains to scooter braun or kanye) but so much of her songwriting process seems to be wrapped up in either subverting or bolstering her entire previous history as a songwriter. every song is a puzzle piece in the context of her full discography which sounds exhausting but is sort of clarifying.

The fact that taylor even thinks of her discography in these terms is just another example of her chronic people-pleasing, which is not just about pleasing people but also constantly situating yourself from the perspective of the other, asking "how will this be perceived by (insert)?" Which can be simultaneously selfish and selfless.

And then of course "mirrorball" (or lol even "me!") could be read as meta-commentary on her discography and songwriting approach.

And then of course "mirrorball" (or lol even "me!") could be read as meta-commentary on her discography and songwriting approach.

I think the current re-recording process could actually work out really well if done properly - rather than her just redo the albums I'm imagining a 2-cd album that is effectively a greatest hits collection and draws out different nuances to the older songs. I remember the glassy synthesiser version of "Love Story" (very "You Are In Love") from the 1989 tour was really lovely.

For me the best production job on Folklore (and a lot of the time my favourite song give or take "Peace") is "August", due to the real unity of vocal, emotional and arrangement heft - the sudden hit of the guitars during the second repeat of the second bridge ("second repeat of the second bridge" is such a taylor trick) is both obvious and inspired, and shows an increasing sense on her part and the part of her producers of how to deploy arrangement and production tricks that are very specific to the songs in question and designed to draw out their specific qualities. But yes, I think a fairly obvious "future pathway" for TS is to further explore a kind of gauzy textural vibe, whether it's organic or synthetic or somewhere in between.

Upthread I said I'd enjoy hearing Taylor produced by Jenn Wasner, and I was thinking specifically of Wye Oak's live performance of "We Belong", the sound of which would be a logical next step after Folklore IMO.