I find no catharsis in President Biden. If Trump died in a particularly amusing fashion, sure. But he’s going to die rich and free of consequences while the rest of the reactionaries are strengthened in the medium-term and life gets worse for most people over the short, medium and long terms.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:44 (three years ago) link
I’m pretty jubilant today but would like to note that the ILX politics sensible realism crew are equally tedious/ relentless
― rob, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:45 (three years ago) link
personally the impact of trump losing was maybe dulled for me because I've been assuming he would lose since COVID got bad
― it bangs for thee (Simon H.), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:45 (three years ago) link
Everyone Also Sucks, Of Course
― pomenitul, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:45 (three years ago) link
That's fair, Simon. I've little doubt that Biden would've gotten BTFO in a covidless world.
― pomenitul, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:47 (three years ago) link
So many people are happy and relieved, I hope you can find carthasis in that.
― Van Horn Street, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:47 (three years ago) link
A friend of mine maintains that catharsis is a reactionary emotion
― The Bosom Manor Michaelmas Special (silby), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:48 (three years ago) link
that's....not how catharsis works imo xp
― it bangs for thee (Simon H.), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:48 (three years ago) link
Is your friend the Angriest Dog in the World?
xp
― pomenitul, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:49 (three years ago) link
Catharsis is inherently dialectical so if anything I'd say it's a good fit for Marxism and its precipitates. Mehdi Belhaj Kacem has written some good pieces about this.
― pomenitul, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:51 (three years ago) link
You’re right, but there is joy to be found in the carthasis others are expressing at the moment.
― Van Horn Street, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:51 (three years ago) link
didn't brecht think tragic catharsis was reactionary?
― treeship., Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:51 (three years ago) link
If it only serves to sublimate one's oppression at the hands of the status quo, yes.
― pomenitul, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:52 (three years ago) link
I don’t know what Bretch thought about carthasis but he would be dancing in the streets right now.
― Van Horn Street, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:52 (three years ago) link
most ILE thread ever
― Patriotic Goiter (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:57 (three years ago) link
why does everyone have to care so much about what some other people are feeling rn
― Wayne Grotski (symsymsym), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:59 (three years ago) link
*that* is the truly reactionary emotion
― treeship., Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:00 (three years ago) link
I blame Ben Shapiro.
― pomenitul, Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:00 (three years ago) link
When you're miserable about how miserable you are certain to be in the future, nothing in the present can disturb your misery.
― the unappreciated charisma of cows (Aimless), Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:01 (three years ago) link
disingenuousness/gaslighting is just as lacking in civility as “throwing tantrums” or whatever.
otm
Aimless tut-tutted someone’s tone
monotone
Aimless, not sure if you noticed but due to the timing of your post, and the thread you made it in, many of us read you as tut-tutting the impertinent tone of AOC in her tweet, and not - as I now infer from this post - milo.
― @oneposter (✔️) (sic), Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:06 (three years ago) link
"I find no catharsis in President Biden"
Sucks to be you then
― A True White Kid that can Jump (Granny Dainger), Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:17 (three years ago) link
I’m pretty comfortable not deriving joy from the guy who has played a leading role in ruining millions of lives over the past five decades.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:22 (three years ago) link
If Joe Biden is the best thing you got going in your life let me know I’ll send you an edible arrangement or something to try to lend you a little sunshine
― The Bosom Manor Michaelmas Special (silby), Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:27 (three years ago) link
many of us read you as tut-tutting the impertinent tone of AOC in her tweet
Two posts above mine milo posted, without comment, a tweet that suggested:
I am a progressive, and I think you need to develop a more conciliatory and cooperative attitude.
Milo being milo, no comment was required to file this under "scorn and derision". My post was responding to his. Cooperation with anyone not firmly in agreement with all things milo is the worst of sins in his politics. I see I failed to make it clear what and who I was responding to.
― the unappreciated charisma of cows (Aimless), Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:31 (three years ago) link
guys let's keep the "Biden sucks" fights to the Biden sucks thread today, unless it's to disagree with AOC's tone in congratulating him (once, then pushing it down her feed with RAH! RAH! ILHAN OMAR! tweets)
― @oneposter (✔️) (sic), Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:31 (three years ago) link
I see I failed to make it clear what and who I was responding to.
Perhaps you did not see what and who that Karen was responding to; it was aligning yourself with her sentiments that read, in context, as you dismissing the structural and racist aspects of AOC's specific marginalisation.
― @oneposter (✔️) (sic), Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:34 (three years ago) link
No what you are doing is refusing to derive joy from millions who are feeling much better about their future today, you have a right to do that of course, but don’t pretend it’s not a continuous desire to set yourself apart from others.
― Van Horn Street, Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:36 (three years ago) link
no comment was required to file this under "scorn and derision"
Yes, scorn and derision for the literal Karen, representative of thousands of other "I'm a liberal but" halfwits, scolding and policing AOC for daring to counter the moderates who are trying to claw back what little progress has been made in the Democratic Party.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:40 (three years ago) link
i don't want MEdicare4All, I want Medicare4Y'All
― Lover of Nixon (or LON for short) (Neanderthal), Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:40 (three years ago) link
lol @ ‘literal karen’
― flopson, Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:46 (three years ago) link
constant to semi constant misery and an utter inability to chill is a common ailment among leftists I know, myself included. comes with the frustration of the world not being better and having a bit of a concept of just how much collective effort would be required to significantly unfuck it.
― it bangs for thee (Simon H.), Saturday, November 7, 2020 4:23 PM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink
kinda condescending to presume that non-miserabilists care less about the world not being better imho
― flopson, Saturday, 7 November 2020 22:56 (three years ago) link
whenever ppl say stuff like that it reads to me as self-pity at your own pessimism of the will
― flopson, Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:00 (three years ago) link
I don't see any desire for collective effort, just the desire for the 'establishment' to bend the knee to progressives and your favorite policies no matter what.
― Van Horn Street, Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:05 (three years ago) link
wait do you ppl all choose what to be miserable or happy about? I definitely can't, so kudos
― it bangs for thee (Simon H.), Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:08 (three years ago) link
There is no collective effort with the establishment. They want different things. One side organizes tenants' unions, the other side takes a million dollars to lobby against rent control.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:10 (three years ago) link
xpost no, but contrary to popular opinion, people don't all process the same information in the same manner
― Lover of Nixon (or LON for short) (Neanderthal), Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:10 (three years ago) link
i mean i'm not gonna deprive someone from feeling misery over things like this but i'll be damned if i'll let anybody tell me I'm wrong for not feeling that way
― Lover of Nixon (or LON for short) (Neanderthal), Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:11 (three years ago) link
That’s a good question, but I generally choose to be happy when like-minded people are so happy they are dancing in the streets.
I am also generally an optimist, and we just saw a lot of growth and victories for progressives over the past week and the falling of one gigantic hurdle (a GOP presidency) so really i’ve just been peeved by the doom and gloom of some posters here.
― Van Horn Street, Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:11 (three years ago) link
Prop 22 is one of the worst harbingers of the future of being a working person in America - the cretins at Uber and Lyft and behind the proposition movement aren't hillbilly Republicans from Tuscaloosa, they're former Obama staffers and Kamala Harris's family.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:12 (three years ago) link
(But the cretins from Tuscaloosa will happily pick up the ball from here, of course.)
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:13 (three years ago) link
Yeah hope you enjoy sharecropping for venture capitalists in your golden years
― The Bosom Manor Michaelmas Special (silby), Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:14 (three years ago) link
i could die of just about everything any day of the week, and i don't wanna die with my butthole clenched
― Lover of Nixon (or LON for short) (Neanderthal), Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:14 (three years ago) link
Would you believe the actual communists I know inform me I’m basically just a liberal
― The Bosom Manor Michaelmas Special (silby), Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:15 (three years ago) link
They aren’t wrong neither
― The Bosom Manor Michaelmas Special (silby), Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:16 (three years ago) link
earnestly wondering if it might be a good idea to have a dedicated gloom and doom thread so the nice people can enjoy themselves in peace
― it bangs for thee (Simon H.), Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:16 (three years ago) link
There’s only #onethread
I’m genuinely not doomy or gloomy!! I resent the implication that I am actually.
― The Bosom Manor Michaelmas Special (silby), Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:17 (three years ago) link
We have the Joe Biden sucks thread and it's not okay to say Joe Biden sucks there so... doubt it.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:17 (three years ago) link
To be fair, rent control is a disaster that made millions and millions for landlords and keynesian economists, the same that are vouching for single payer, consider it to be a fraud most of the time.
― Van Horn Street, Saturday, 7 November 2020 23:20 (three years ago) link
A good NYTimes interview.
We finally have a fuller understanding of the results. What’s your macro takeaway?Well, I think the central one is that we aren’t in a free fall to hell anymore. But whether we’re going to pick ourselves up or not is the lingering question. We paused this precipitous descent. And the question is if and how we will build ourselves back up.We know that race is a problem, and avoiding it is not going to solve any electoral issues. We have to actively disarm the potent influence of racism at the polls.But we also learned that progressive policies do not hurt candidates. Every single candidate that co-sponsored Medicare for All in a swing district kept their seat. We also know that co-sponsoring the Green New Deal was not a sinker. Mike Levin was an original co-sponsor of the legislation, and he kept his seat....What if the administration is hostile? If they take the John Kasich view of who Joe Biden should be? What do you do?Well, I’d be bummed, because we’re going to lose. And that’s just what it is. These transition appointments, they send a signal. They tell a story of who the administration credits with this victory. And so it’s going be really hard after immigrant youth activists helped potentially deliver Arizona and Nevada. It’s going to be really hard after Detroit and Rashida Tlaib ran up the numbers in her district.It’s really hard for us to turn out nonvoters when they feel like nothing changes for them. When they feel like people don’t see them, or even acknowledge their turnout.If the party believes after 94 percent of Detroit went to Biden, after Black organizers just doubled and tripled turnout down in Georgia, after so many people organized Philadelphia, the signal from the Democratic Party is the John Kasichs won us this election? I mean, I can’t even describe how dangerous that is.
We know that race is a problem, and avoiding it is not going to solve any electoral issues. We have to actively disarm the potent influence of racism at the polls.
But we also learned that progressive policies do not hurt candidates. Every single candidate that co-sponsored Medicare for All in a swing district kept their seat. We also know that co-sponsoring the Green New Deal was not a sinker. Mike Levin was an original co-sponsor of the legislation, and he kept his seat.
...
What if the administration is hostile? If they take the John Kasich view of who Joe Biden should be? What do you do?
Well, I’d be bummed, because we’re going to lose. And that’s just what it is. These transition appointments, they send a signal. They tell a story of who the administration credits with this victory. And so it’s going be really hard after immigrant youth activists helped potentially deliver Arizona and Nevada. It’s going to be really hard after Detroit and Rashida Tlaib ran up the numbers in her district.
It’s really hard for us to turn out nonvoters when they feel like nothing changes for them. When they feel like people don’t see them, or even acknowledge their turnout.
If the party believes after 94 percent of Detroit went to Biden, after Black organizers just doubled and tripled turnout down in Georgia, after so many people organized Philadelphia, the signal from the Democratic Party is the John Kasichs won us this election? I mean, I can’t even describe how dangerous that is.
― but also fuck you (unperson), Sunday, 8 November 2020 01:34 (three years ago) link