Obamacare is a failure - costs have continually increased, healthcare as a percentage of GDP has increased, quality of care and outcomes has not improved.
The Most Powerful Man In The World denigrating policy as unwise or unrealistic limits the extent to which it can be taken seriously as a goal. Running on weak and bad policy means you do things like lose House seats and fail to flip the Senate.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 20:46 (three years ago) link
The Man Who Would Be King
― the unappreciated charisma of cows (Aimless), Saturday, 7 November 2020 20:48 (three years ago) link
This is still Shoot Em In The Leg Biden we’re talking about here
― The Bosom Manor Michaelmas Special (silby), Saturday, 7 November 2020 20:49 (three years ago) link
I have my disagreements with progressive but I didn't think 'it will be under attack by the idiots' will be an argument I'll see one day, you guys call yourselves socialists most of the time exactly because the strength is that you stop caring about what the other aisle think.
It's not about what the "other aisle thinks."
Universal programs are safer, as policy achievements, because everyone benefits, everyone is invested, everyone has skin in the game. Social Security is the Third Rail, mostly safe from the likes of Joe Biden (lol) and George W. Bush because everyone's grandma got that check.
One reason Obamacare has been a failure is because of the (horribly confusing) means-tested subsidies.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 20:50 (three years ago) link
Obamacare is a failure
people with pre-existing conditions cannot be thrown off their healthcare thanks to the ACA.
― treeship., Saturday, 7 November 2020 20:51 (three years ago) link
this is not ideal but it's not nothing. i wouldn't want to go back to a world before the ACA.
Healthcare you can't use because of cost isn't actually healthcare.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 20:53 (three years ago) link
I’ll give it (and the GOP lol) this: folks are really starting to clamor for sOcialized medicine
― A-B-C. A-Always, B-Be, C-Chooglin (will), Saturday, 7 November 2020 20:54 (three years ago) link
xp it's still better than before for millions of people. you have to admit thatobviously a single payer option would be best, but Obamacare was sabotaged from the beginning and especially frmo 2012-onwards
― Nhex, Saturday, 7 November 2020 20:55 (three years ago) link
Universal programs are safer, as policy achievements, because everyone benefits, everyone is invested
^hard agree. it's the best structure by far.
Obamacare has been a failure is because of the (horribly confusing) means-tested subsidies.
it is a failure measured by some metrics, a success measured by others. compared to the hit and miss system of medical insurance through employment, it has been a clear, but incremental and flawed, improvement. you sound indistinguishable from the 'abolish the ACA' crowd of hard right shitheads.
― the unappreciated charisma of cows (Aimless), Saturday, 7 November 2020 20:55 (three years ago) link
Sabotage and state refusals to expand Medicaid, etc. are used to excuse it - but that's why it (and why things like Biden's plans) has been bad policy. If the functioning of your program is entirely dependent on the reactionary party playing nice, you're fucked.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 20:57 (three years ago) link
How is even-handed rational dispassionate debate still anyone’s understanding of how the world works at this late date
― brimstead, Saturday, 7 November 2020 20:59 (three years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAN_jLnD_Q8
― the unappreciated charisma of cows (Aimless), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:00 (three years ago) link
although tbh I think maybe the left should start just tricking people into supporting socialism or something
― brimstead, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:00 (three years ago) link
(Also, the original sabotage came from “liberals and moderates”)
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:00 (three years ago) link
i agree that single payer is the only sane healthcare policy.
― treeship., Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:02 (three years ago) link
"Obamacare is a failure -"
It's an improvement over what existed before it. Aimless is right, this is the same dumb argument with the same obtuse posters that get off on being wet blankets.
― A True White Kid that can Jump (Granny Dainger), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:07 (three years ago) link
There are other public health care systems around the world that work pretty well too!
― Van Horn Street, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:07 (three years ago) link
tbh GD y’all make it so easy
― The Bosom Manor Michaelmas Special (silby), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:08 (three years ago) link
Obamacare is simultaneously a success and a failure.
― pomenitul, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:09 (three years ago) link
progressive policy goals still face an uphill battle. that didn't change because biden was elected but no one is saying they did. that's why i don't get why we're having this conversation again now.
― treeship., Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:10 (three years ago) link
are we ever not
― it bangs for thee (Simon H.), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:11 (three years ago) link
It has be to easier now with Biden than with Trump, the difference is going to be like night and day.
― Van Horn Street, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:12 (three years ago) link
We’re having this conversation because Aimless tut-tutted someone’s tone xp
― The Bosom Manor Michaelmas Special (silby), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:12 (three years ago) link
We've already solved this conundrum forever:
Are you an accelerationist, y/n?
― pomenitul, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:12 (three years ago) link
“Wet blanket” - why should the default be sweetness and light?
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:12 (three years ago) link
Aimless tut-tutted someone’s tone
monotone
― the unappreciated charisma of cows (Aimless), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:15 (three years ago) link
The only progressive policy goals with a snowball’s chance in hell of making progress are those that amount to undoing the fascist enterprises of the executive under Trump, which will bring us to the status quo ante of Obama’s second term, so yay trans kids and DACA, boo deportation force and drone war I guess.Any further turn towards progressivism originating in the executive will be wholly contingent on the party in the White House, subject to sweeping reversal as soon as control changes hands.No meaningful legislation on any matter whatsoever will be passed by the next congress if it remains in GOP control, and will still be watered down by the senate if it’s Georgia sends two democrats and it’s 50-50 plus Harris because the likes of Joe Manchin can stomp their little feet whenever they don’t like something, much like Joementun did with the ACA.So I wouldn’t say night and day. Night and slightly less dark night.Anyway abolish the police.
― The Bosom Manor Michaelmas Special (silby), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:16 (three years ago) link
Also fuck machine mayors, vote the bastards out
― The Bosom Manor Michaelmas Special (silby), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:18 (three years ago) link
Abolish the πόλις.
― pomenitul, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:19 (three years ago) link
Hey I’m not an anarchist
― The Bosom Manor Michaelmas Special (silby), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:19 (three years ago) link
Why is your default to be like this CONSTANTLY? it's sucking tedious. I know silby is just a miserable SOB so what's your explanation milo?
― A True White Kid that can Jump (Granny Dainger), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:19 (three years ago) link
I’m pretty cheerful most of the time
Abolish the pelisse.
― pomenitul, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:20 (three years ago) link
constant to semi constant misery and an utter inability to chill is a common ailment among leftists I know, myself included. comes with the frustration of the world not being better and having a bit of a concept of just how much collective effort would be required to significantly unfuck it.
― it bangs for thee (Simon H.), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:23 (three years ago) link
Same, I’m genially amused most of the time. Maintaining a strict poz vibes only attitude about Joe Biden to be happy sounds like torture.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:24 (three years ago) link
That was an xp to silby. Separating political misery from day to day joy is a lefty’s only hope - but I see no reason not to call out the misery when it presents itself.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:26 (three years ago) link
is it really tedious if it amps posters up so muchsilby’s style is more playful imo, glad to have them back
― brimstead, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:26 (three years ago) link
"Maintaining a strict poz vibes only attitude about Joe Biden to be happy sounds like torture."
Dude are you serious. He literally JUST won the election that knocked out the most heinous human from the highest office in the land. People are happy That Trump lost wayyyyy more than that Biden lost. How do you not grasp this
― A True White Kid that can Jump (Granny Dainger), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:29 (three years ago) link
Than Biden won
Ephemeral catharsis is good and healthy while we linger in the interregnum and it won't sully the grandeur of your long-term goals, milo. You should try it some time.
― pomenitul, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:32 (three years ago) link
Joe Biden Also Sucks, Of Course
no he's good actually
Wtf, I love Biden now pic.twitter.com/sk04PZQEqe— Dawn Foster (@DawnHFoster) November 7, 2020
― ||||||||, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:35 (three years ago) link
trust me you can't will yourself into being happy with this outcome xp
― it bangs for thee (Simon H.), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:35 (three years ago) link
sometimes he has good quips. inshallah was good.
― treeship., Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:36 (three years ago) link
No, but the world's proverbial shittiness doesn't mean I'm not entitled to a modicum of happiness in spite of it all, and some of that happiness can stem from spite towards the incumbent loser-in-chief.
xp
― pomenitul, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:39 (three years ago) link
yes everyone is entitled to their feelings
― it bangs for thee (Simon H.), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:41 (three years ago) link
It will never be good enough, and there is some metaphysical solace to be derived from that knowledge (or so I tell myself – I understand not wanting to go down that route).
― pomenitul, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:43 (three years ago) link
I find no catharsis in President Biden. If Trump died in a particularly amusing fashion, sure. But he’s going to die rich and free of consequences while the rest of the reactionaries are strengthened in the medium-term and life gets worse for most people over the short, medium and long terms.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:44 (three years ago) link
I’m pretty jubilant today but would like to note that the ILX politics sensible realism crew are equally tedious/ relentless
― rob, Saturday, 7 November 2020 21:45 (three years ago) link