Terrorist attacks throughout Europe

In a country that celebrates Marine Le Pen this is not unexpected.

Agreed, also expecting that another violent attack relating to these cartoons will happen within a few years. Since no lessons has been learned. The RN's legitimacy will keep growing as a consequence.

Pretty much, yeah. None of the root causes are being addressed, and that's not bound to change any time soon.

I’m just glad you all aren’t talking about Darmanin’s remarks today. Obviously I’m more sympathetic to the mainstream French approach to this than others here, but Darmanin’s comments today were batshit.

Batshit and stupendously stupid.

If the French mainstream involves over ten million people voting for a fascist for the presidency, I’m not sure that’s much to be proud of.

Lol I saw that Euler. Darmanin may want to think about banning the insular, radical, uh, organic vegetable isolation in supermarkets as well. Different aisles for that shit. Drove me crazy in Auchan - the organic bananas being like three aisles over from the regular ones.

It just blows my mind how fucking stupid these people are

and they rule us! I just... I can't

Behold, the true face of terrorism:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DcRElhqXUAAChmk.jpg

I eat so much halal food, Darmanin’s should try it, it can be great. Not so much the old El Paso but I get really good tortillas delivered from a place in Prague, really

Undoubtedly it was a poor choice, but the reasoning behind their use is quite accessible, even if flawed. I doubt the reasoning was, "I hate my muslim students and want to disrespect them as deeply as I can."

― the unappreciated charisma of cows (Aimless),

I doubt it too. It was a honest mistake, perhaps. My problem lies in the press, politicians and l'éducation nationale celebrating his actions with heroism.

― Van Horn Street, Wednesday, October 21, 2020

No, this is not an honest mistake. It's ignorant and malign. It is like a classroom of white and Asian kids clips of I. Y. Yunioshi and Long Duk Dong and going 'hey, what's wrong with what I just did?'

glad "la vie de mahomet" de Charb is still available on amazon.

xpost Sure, if there had been a Long Duk Dong massacre and you were teaching a course on free expression. Otherwise, exactly the same.

No, this is not an honest mistake. It's ignorant and malign.

One can make mistakes.One's thinking can be ignorant. One's actions can be malign. All these characterizations fit the teacher's thinking and his actions well enough. But this does not mean that his reasoning was "I hate my muslim students and want to disrespect them as deeply as I can."

Do we have any evidence that this was his intent? If it was not his intent then there is no reason to impugn his honesty.

I think that part of the conversation here is that there is clearly a segment of French culture that allows for an atmosphere where such malign actions, intentional or unintentional, can flourish.

And another part of the conversation is that as long as that atmosphere persists, there will be horrific incidents such as the one in question. That isn't blaming the victim-- it's understanding the way that structures of culture and reactions against it work in the world

It’s not not blaming the victim

Whatever, I truly don't care about anything you say.

Feeling even more validated now tbh.

After slamming “Islamo-leftism,” France’s education minister has a new interview out today: “There’s a combat to be led” against an intellectual framework coming from US universities and intersectionality, which go against France’s republican model https://t.co/wX3Gk159mi pic.twitter.com/hpyiXjKeMp

— Cole Stangler (@ColeStangler) October 25, 2020

They might do a better job of peeling off some of those FN votes if they weren’t so coy about peddling this shit. Ofc all the fascists approvingly qting it will never vote for them when they can vote for the real deal, but as long as they can hide behind the values of the republic then there’s no problem. 🙃

jesus christ

Opposition to USA-style identity politics is widespread here. That’s not the difference between the FN and LREM e.g.

There's an important clue in the way the phrase "identity politics" others all identities beyond the bourgeois monoculture

"you have identity politics, we have the universal rights of man"

Lol just using “identity politics” is such a red flag in itself, literally denying the impact people’s ethnicity/gender/race etc has on their lives, but sure, liberty equality and brotherhood. Rich man and poor man are both forbidden alike from sleeping under bridges, after all.

I’m glad you’re such an expert in French life to know how identity politics functions here. I have so much to learn from you about where I live!

Tell me about how to treat poor people, British residents.

Hey Euler, either add us to your lengthy blocklist or explain why the ideas are fine and not bigoted. I notice you had nothing to say about Aimless’s clueless interjections, which was all fine as he was agreeing with you of course.

Tell me about how to treat poor people, British residents.

Gone native I see.

I had no time to read this thread over the week so I don’t know what Aimless said.

This is the terrorism in Europe thread. If you want to attack France, which I mean sounds fun! maybe try another thread?

gyac , I mean you live in a country devoted to the rawest capitalism, and may well be bougie yourself as a London resident. I live in social housing in one of the poorest neighborhoods in Paris. But yet you’re saying that France treats rich and poor the same. That’s ignorant bullshit and you should be ashamed.

Personally I'm not attacking France any more than my hatred of other western governments and/or polities means I'm attacking those countries per se

That’s not what I’m saying at all, if you must take the most overly literal impression then that’s not my problem. Also, I don’t live in London and your repeated insistence on calling me a “British resident” as though my life as an Irish person in the UK is entirely irrelevant to what I might think about the othering of groups of people - well, it’s quite the thing, isn’t it? I’m sure there are no suspect motives there or anything.

I think we need a Mon Père's Bigger Than Ton Père thread.

On the « terrorist attacks throughout Europe » I would have hatred of terrorism might have had more of a place than yet another place to gripe about how awful western governments are, but ILX, do you, I guess

gyac don’t you have a BDS rally to attend?

Wow

If you want to attack France, which I mean sounds fun! maybe try another thread?

idk France has been attacked and conquered quite a lot in the last 100+ years ... it's feels too much like punching down tbh

maybe we *should* start a "colonialism is a boon to all the benighted peoples of the world" thread, fair enough, i'm out

Wow

and sure Noodle Vague there’s no difference between “the beheading of a schoolteacher is bad” and “colonialism is good”, cool posts

While there may be a bit of "Fred B-ing" here from non-French posters, I feel like the majority of criticism isn't of France, but of right-wing or centrist attitudes and policies and the lingering affects of colonialism and Western imperialism, which are prevalent in the U.S. and the U.K. and the same posters decrying it in this thread, tend to be equally (if not more so) critical of it in re their own countries.

_Wow_


on the “you have suspect motives” tip...

on the “you have suspect motives” tip...
― All cars are bad (Euler), Sunday, October 25, 2020 11:27 AM (four minutes ago)

is there something I'm "missing" here, because I don't see any suspect motives on gyac's part, other than general concern for respectful treatment of marginalized people and the poor?

ok one more. nobody on this thread said anything other than that murder was an atrocity. there is a discussion to be had about the ways in which official French notions of monoculture serve to contribute to a racist society which creates the petri dish for appalling acts of inexcusable violence on all sides. when people have made this argument you've not engaged with it Euler save to insist, with no real argument to back it up, that the post-revolutionary settlement is neither colonialist or discriminatory. maybe that goes on another thread, sure. but if you insist on not addressing the issues people have raised then sometimes conversations get fraught, for better or worse.

That's the problem with ILX these days, not enough people are patriotic about and supportive of the countries they live in.

actually maybe what's yanking my chain worst of all is that i read you as implicitly saying that laïcité, liberté, égalité, fraternité are somehow neutral values which exist in some purer realm to trivial contingencies like "identity". if i'm wrong in reading you that way i apologise but i haven't seen you argue otherwise

xp isn't that what the Real England thread is for?