Star Trek: Classic or Dud?

Hm, that actually would be a good way to get in some sharp ideas via a larger superstructure. Wonder if the Star Wars novels have said range. (I am not anxious to find out for myself.)

I remember it getting pretty good near the end, although I only caught episodes here and there.

re: Trek books, the best one that I've read was called Federation -- great writing, high concept and a TOS/TNG x-over.

http://www.btinternet.com/~bbkuk/tbshrine/mainmenu.htm

Ronan909: data's is funnier
SIMONTRIFE: i mean it was a lot funnier than when fucking ryker did it
SIMONTRIFE: yeah
SIMONTRIFE: so data like goes back to his room to cry
Ronan909: cos if someone did it to ryker he'd not be smiling in that fucking smug way
SIMONTRIFE: only he cant bcz he doesnt have the emotion chip
Ronan909: haha
SIMONTRIFE: i really wd probably beat the shit out of him
Ronan909: he was in north and south too
SIMONTRIFE: THIS ONES FOR WORF
Ronan909: imagine the entire crew dancing to get low
SIMONTRIFE: 'number one'
Ronan909: haha
SIMONTRIFE: haha
SIMONTRIFE: i can imagine like data doingthe running man
SIMONTRIFE: stop being so fucking SERIOUS
SIMONTRIFE: why is no one gay in the future
Ronan909: yeah
Ronan909: they have replicated the problem away thanks to ryker
SIMONTRIFE: the closest to gay wd be like ryker wd fall in love with some woman who turns out to be a shapeshifter
Ronan909: haha
Ronan909: that would be hilarious
SIMONTRIFE: she shouldve turned into molten lava while rykers dick was in her
Ronan909: he's about to fuck her and then its like
SIMONTRIFE: dude that was an episode
SIMONTRIFE: except the lava
Ronan909: "ambassador tomalahawk, you ROMULAN SCUM"
SIMONTRIFE: her real form was this furry rat thing
Ronan909: "I was working undercover picard, i knew it was ambassador tomahawk"
SIMONTRIFE: haha
SIMONTRIFE: everyones a racist in the future
Ronan909: remember his son appeared or something
Ronan909: and it was a bug
SIMONTRIFE: i love the movie with kirk and the klingons
Ronan909: yeah
SIMONTRIFE: thats seriously my favorite movie of all time
Ronan909: kirk at least tried to sleep with women
SIMONTRIFE: its even better than wrath of khan
Ronan909: they made them assexual in the next gen cos they were so embarassed
SIMONTRIFE: kirk is fucking rugged
Ronan909: do you mean the one where kirk and co get framed
SIMONTRIFE: even when he was old he still was a pimp
SIMONTRIFE: yeah and sent to the ice planet!!
Ronan909: haha
SIMONTRIFE: kirk actually fucks a shapeshifter in that too
Ronan909: yeah
Ronan909: shapeshifters are the modern day tranny
SIMONTRIFE: and bones is like rolling his eyes
SIMONTRIFE: 'here he goes again'
SIMONTRIFE: that movie is awesome
Ronan909: bones is kind of sexually dead
Ronan909: and just dead in every sense
SIMONTRIFE: it has the skank from sex in the city as spocks little vulcan girl
SIMONTRIFE: she overenunciates everything
SIMONTRIFE: well he is dead now
SIMONTRIFE: the actor
SIMONTRIFE: theres an old episode where he fucks a shapeshifter too
SIMONTRIFE: it turns out to be a monster that eats salt and has a vagina for a face
SIMONTRIFE: a vagina with teeth!
Ronan909: haha
Ronan909: the old ones are all about weirdo mind control
Ronan909: and kind of eerie character warping
Ronan909: the new ones are like BIG MORAL ISSUES
SIMONTRIFE: kirk would make a good rapper
Ronan909: NO JOKES
SIMONTRIFE: i bet he refuses to go down on girls
SIMONTRIFE: bcz hes james t fucking kirk
Ronan909: warf would be a good rapper
Ronan909: it involves BITING
SIMONTRIFE: haha and in the klingon movie you learn at the klingon trial his middle name is TIBERIUS
SIMONTRIFE: 'i like earth bitches'
Ronan909: eastside boys featuring james tiberius kirk
SIMONTRIFE: lil kirk
Ronan909: "I Fuck All Races"
SIMONTRIFE: remember worfs son!!!
Ronan909: haha
SIMONTRIFE: he was such a little shit
Ronan909: and his brother or cousin or whoever
Ronan909: who kept calling him a pussy for wearing his fancy earthman sash
Ronan909: in fairness they were right, that ship was full of twats
SIMONTRIFE: haha
Ronan909: "perhaps i like twee anglophilia brother"
SIMONTRIFE: yeah remember like when worf goes back to the klingon home planet and theyre like 'wtf'
Ronan909: "but WESLEY CRUSHER, HE IS WHAT WE CALL A FOOL"
SIMONTRIFE: all the klingons cant believe hes hanging out with these total losers
Ronan909: haha
Ronan909: ilxors as next generation
SIMONTRIFE: q was asexual though
Ronan909: so he said
Ronan909: he was actually quite cool
SIMONTRIFE: calum is like on the old star trek when theyd meet some god and he wd fuck with them but then in the end he'd just be a big baby
Ronan909: sense of humour
SIMONTRIFE: yeah anyone who makes picard so mad!!
SIMONTRIFE: 'STOP IT Q'
Ronan909: hahaha
SIMONTRIFE: i guess he is calumn
Ronan909: "Q I FEEL GREAT ANGER TOWARDS YOU"
SIMONTRIFE: 'Q I THINK WE SHOULD TALK THIS OVER'
Ronan909: "Q I AM FURIOUS, HAVE YOU EVER READ SARTRES"
SIMONTRIFE: kirk wouldve just kicked him in the teeth
SIMONTRIFE: he wouldve done that sideways kirk kicking thing where he lands on his ass
Ronan909: "q theres a line on jay z's the blueprint, it reads simply 'i will not lose ever FUCKER'"
SIMONTRIFE: the borg movie has a lot of hilarious stuff with picard talking abt herman melville
Ronan909: yeah haha
SIMONTRIFE: i guess literature just stopped!
Ronan909: he always shitted on about obvious contemporary literature
Ronan909: or culture
SIMONTRIFE: in the future nobody writes anything but self-help books
SIMONTRIFE: yeah i know
SIMONTRIFE: listening to bach
SIMONTRIFE: white supremicist
Ronan909: "in normandy, when they're bedding the horses, they are always sure to say why not my beautiful vicar"
SIMONTRIFE: hahaha
Ronan909: he is like captain MCDEPTH
SIMONTRIFE: remember when he gets trapped in the elevator and he sings frere jacques to the kids!!
Ronan909: i was just thinking of that
SIMONTRIFE: he wasnt even fucking french
SIMONTRIFE: he has a british accent!!
SIMONTRIFE: remember his vineyard
Ronan909: yeah
Ronan909: and geordie was so bored he was visiting his old boss
SIMONTRIFE: haha sometimes they wd drink wine on the enterprise
Ronan909: and play cards
SIMONTRIFE: theyre such 80s yuppies
Ronan909: ryker the jazz fan
Ronan909: GUINAN
SIMONTRIFE: they would have like those 80s cd players that are really huge
SIMONTRIFE: hahaha
SIMONTRIFE: 'captain i am detecting the prescence of whoopi goldberg in a stupid hat'
SIMONTRIFE: she looked like a fucking chess piece
Ronan909: picards voice is so funny
Ronan909: hahaha
SIMONTRIFE: they could play three dimensional chess with her!!
Ronan909: you know when he goes all slow and kind of contemplative
SIMONTRIFE: god they were always playing chess too
Ronan909: yeah
Ronan909: they played 3d chess in deep space nine
SIMONTRIFE: its funny to imagine teh rest of culture continued on without them but on the enterprise they just wanted everything to be old and european bcz they were white supremicists
SIMONTRIFE: like, everybody else in the galaxy is listening to get low 2450
SIMONTRIFE: theyre like a bunch of renaissance faire nerds
SIMONTRIFE: its a show abt a bunch of nerds who fly around in a spaceship
SIMONTRIFE: a bunch of rich white yuppie nerds
Ronan909: yeah
Ronan909: they just lamely stun them on that one
Ronan909: did they ever kill anyone
Ronan909: in the entire thing
SIMONTRIFE: maybe they like shot a cloud and then it gave birth
SIMONTRIFE: 'we're witnessing something very beautiful here...'
SIMONTRIFE: picard was like a shitty professor
SIMONTRIFE: he was always making the crew gather round to look at stuff they didnt care about
Ronan909: haha
Ronan909: "have some malt whiskey lieutenant"
SIMONTRIFE: 'yemtemenos 8.... we finally made it'
Ronan909: hahaha
Ronan909: they were all rapt with interest though
SIMONTRIFE: haha they drank stupid yuppie wine
Ronan909: "captain i intend to take some rock samples for my studies"

SIMONTRIFE: they replicator was just one of the cardboard boxes of wine they sell at teh grocery store
SIMONTRIFE: they just put a piece of black plastic on it
Ronan909: "you do that lieutenant, WAIT, a cloud???? IN THIS GALAXY?"
SIMONTRIFE: i imagine them just going from cloud to cloud
SIMONTRIFE: uss retard
Ronan909: "cloud 9, i've heard of this one"

SIMONTRIFE: wtf was there mission anyway
SIMONTRIFE: haha
Ronan909: "to eliminate clouds"
Ronan909: and take rock samples
SIMONTRIFE: 'hey... you...get offa my...'
SIMONTRIFE: to learn lessons from clouds
Ronan909: they just gave them a fake mission and threw wes crusher on board
SIMONTRIFE: to make the holodeck malfunction and almost kill everyone
SIMONTRIFE: haha
Ronan909: to get rid of them all
SIMONTRIFE: it was secretly a reality show
Ronan909: cos they were the worst bunch of bores ever
Ronan909: they kept making faces when kirk or other federation cronies got lecherous or drunk or sexist.
SIMONTRIFE: 'what happens... when nine crew members stop being real... and start getting polite'
SIMONTRIFE: haha i know
SIMONTRIFE: they were like
Ronan909: you can see thats true cos they hate all the old federation guys
Ronan909: RAJON 5
Ronan909: what was with the dumb names of planets too
Ronan909: they sounded like washing up powders
Ronan909: LUSTRE 7
SIMONTRIFE: hard-on 12
Ronan909: haha
Ronan909: BALDHEAD 1
Ronan909: captains log, supplemental
SIMONTRIFE: STRONGO 14
Ronan909: after rendez vousing with the venetian blinds on GETLOW 7
SIMONTRIFE: his captains logs were fucking useless too
SIMONTRIFE: always making shit jokes in them
Ronan909: we have found a primitive culture known as "fun"
SIMONTRIFE: or being really obscure
Ronan909: yeah
Ronan909: "the clouds have gone, for now, perhaps we were unable to understand them"
Ronan909: and then it got all wonder years
Ronan909: "we didnt realise it and neither did they but that day our crew and the moons of Raijilicus 4 were closer than ever.
SIMONTRIFE: 'i guess you could say we learned something from the rigelians... about ourselves'
SIMONTRIFE: or he would smugly mention another crewmember
Ronan909: this was truly a space miracle"

Ronan909: haha
SIMONTRIFE: my first cloud
SIMONTRIFE: captain, dr crushers brother has died on VIETNAM 7
Ronan909: "commander data meanwhile has not mastered the subtle art of bonhomie, but with my guidance, he shall continue to learn"

Ronan909: haha
Ronan909: they probably all sat around laughing at his captains logs
SIMONTRIFE: we sent you through that cloud to collection ion samples!!
SIMONTRIFE: haha
Ronan909: "another cracker from jean luc"
SIMONTRIFE: 'look... hes crying!!'
SIMONTRIFE: god i know i sat around laughing at him
Ronan909: haha
SIMONTRIFE: i want to see the one where he cries so bad now
Ronan909: there is so much mileage in mocking it though
Ronan909: what was his nephew called
SIMONTRIFE: 'he was.... so.... so... so YOUNG'
Ronan909: lilian
Ronan909: or florent
Ronan909: or something
SIMONTRIFE: he actually says that
Ronan909: lilian-florent
SIMONTRIFE: yeah something gay
SIMONTRIFE: omg dude how cd i forget this!!!
SIMONTRIFE: when he goes inside the ribbon that grants your wishes
Ronan909: hahaha
SIMONTRIFE: and his wish is to have a gay charles dickens christmas with his family!!!
Ronan909: and he's married to a victorian woman
Ronan909: hahahaha
SIMONTRIFE: what a loser
SIMONTRIFE: kirk is like chopping wood and getting back in bed with some green woman
SIMONTRIFE: picards is just little brats going 'pa-PA!'
SIMONTRIFE: 'faaaather...'
Ronan909: haha
Ronan909: it would have been so cool if “relax” played and picard is in some brothel looking aroused and disgusted with himself all at once.
SIMONTRIFE: why is malcolm mcdowel in that
Ronan909: the intro and then picard is like "nooooooooo"
SIMONTRIFE: it really is a travesty
SIMONTRIFE: except when data says shit
Ronan909: THE NEXUS
SIMONTRIFE: hhaha
SIMONTRIFE: the enterprise is THE LEXUS
Ronan909: haha
SIMONTRIFE: cruise control, faux leather seating
SIMONTRIFE: beige EVERYTHING
SIMONTRIFE: picard was like 'make it beige, number one'
Ronan909: its such a pathetic vision of depth
Ronan909: MAKE IT BEIGE, LIKE A FINE WINE
SIMONTRIFE: 'what color shd the spaceship be??' 'MAKE IT BEIGE'
SIMONTRIFE: like my shriveled old man hea
Ronan909: number one, i think you'll find the seats are plush leather
SIMONTRIFE: uss fleshtone
Ronan909: easy on the rear
Ronan909: uss pofaced
SIMONTRIFE: the old enterprise was cool
SIMONTRIFE: all grey and simple
SIMONTRIFE: the new one had like cup-holders everywhere
Ronan909: the bar in the new one is the worst
SIMONTRIFE: and stupid little ridges
SIMONTRIFE: haha
Ronan909: it looks like the worst yuppie bar ever
Ronan909: MAKE IT BLAND NUMBER ONE
Ronan909: "aye aye sir"
SIMONTRIFE: they were such fucking yuppies
Ronan909: little did they know about warf and datas SEcrEt CrUnK parties in the holodeck
SIMONTRIFE: ;make it crunk'
SIMONTRIFE: worf probably listened to like tribal klingon music
Ronan909: "what in the name of fornicating clouds is going on here warf"

Ronan909: i can imagine warf as an industrial fan
Ronan909: front 242
SIMONTRIFE: 'it is too HARSH... for human ears... no melody... just rhythm'
Ronan909: haha
Ronan909: insane clown posse
SIMONTRIFE: haha
Ronan909: "its......too shit for human ears"

SIMONTRIFE: 'there is a lot of... sucking'
Ronan909: ha
Ronan909: there must be other characters
SIMONTRIFE: yeah we've hit the wall here
Ronan909: i am saving this without doubt
SIMONTRIFE: remember bajorans
SIMONTRIFE: nose ridges
Ronan909: horrible noses
SIMONTRIFE: yeah totally we have to make this into something
SIMONTRIFE: 'tasteful suburban bookstore, 1988'
SIMONTRIFE: 'macintosh computer, flying toasters screensaver'
SIMONTRIFE: 'magazine rack, macworld magazine'
Ronan909: haha
SIMONTRIFE: 'packaged biscotti, dry'
Ronan909: music, tepid indie
Ronan909: clothes, amusing v neck sweater
Ronan909: prejudices, multiple
SIMONTRIFE: music, tribal groove
SIMONTRIFE: music, moby, play
Ronan909: worf is like
Ronan909: place, klingon semen basement 2077
SIMONTRIFE: sting, new album
Ronan909: music, BEYOND HOLODECK COMPREHENSION
SIMONTRIFE: haha
Ronan909: sex, full blown, many clowns.
SIMONTRIFE: location, the very mild fetish club
Ronan909: klingon sex is unusual
SIMONTRIFE: sense of transgression from 'biting', third grade level
Ronan909: "it involves...........clowns"

SIMONTRIFE: self-satisfaction, high
SIMONTRIFE: 'klingon sex is... unusual... it doesnt... happen often... because i... live with my parents'
Ronan909: and ryker is like "get that clown back to calgon 7 immediately warf"
SIMONTRIFE: he would just smirk, 'nice little rimjob, worf' 'LITTLE Commander??'
Ronan909: worf got deanna in the end
SIMONTRIFE: in that same one he has to take the defense controls again and ryker goes 'sure you can remember what everything does?'
SIMONTRIFE: what a dick!
Ronan909: he pretended to be sensitive and care about clouds
SIMONTRIFE: haha she can predict his biting
SIMONTRIFE: 'ohhh'
Ronan909: the amount of her talking about other peoples thoughts you'd have to sit through
SIMONTRIFE: 'i sense... horniness... very much...'
SIMONTRIFE: ugh
SIMONTRIFE: worf had space-aids
SIMONTRIFE: didnt they have an aids episode?
Ronan909: did they
Ronan909: ryker disgusted by it
Ronan909: "FIRE PHOTON TORPEDOS, LETS KILL THIS VIRUS AND EVERYONE SUFFERING FROM IT"

SIMONTRIFE: thats a little too edgy
SIMONTRIFE: 'fucking faggots'
SIMONTRIFE: ryker was disgusted all the time
SIMONTRIFE: hes like a slaveowner
SIMONTRIFE: he was always either mocking someone lower than him or just grimacing in disgust
SIMONTRIFE: that dumb-ass smirk
Ronan909: yeah
Ronan909: and the beard
Ronan909: enson, clean my quarters
Ronan909: "and dont forget the underwear, hmph-haha"

SIMONTRIFE: he grew the beard to look manly

Ronan909: haha
SIMONTRIFE: brb!
Ronan909: no wonder wes had parted hair
SIMONTRIFE: i have to go!
SIMONTRIFE: its been fun
Ronan909: ok me too really
Ronan909: yes!
SIMONTRIFE: we will pick this up again
Ronan909: definitely.
SIMONTRIFE: more infantile star trek sex jokes
Ronan909: "have you ever read camus"
SIMONTRIFE: the final acceptance we are never getting laid again
Ronan909: haha
Ronan909: "theres a line on a beermat i read will"
SIMONTRIFE: making two hours worth of star trek sex jokes
Ronan909: its prob even worse than liking star trek
Ronan909: non ironically
SIMONTRIFE: yeah at least you can get star trek fangirls
SIMONTRIFE: like um
SIMONTRIFE: later ronan!!
Ronan909: see you!

Ryker in fact falls in love with a person from a gender-neutral species.

worf probably listened to like tribal klingon music

He actually listens to Klingon opera.

BEST PC EPISODE EVER

JD, yeah, me too... fuck.

God, I am such a nerd.

Looks like the combined effect of 'The Matrix' and reality TV has finally killed off Star Trek, which was something I used to think was one of those untouchable, uncancellable TV franchises.

This means that I not only believe in an alternate timeline for the original series, but that I also played a tactical simulator based on that timeline using counters and hexagons...

But that's The American Way! Even the earliest books on the first series point out the show is about America in the '60s, esp foreign policy. Kirk = LBJ + JFK's libido...

I was a Trekkie on the original's reruns between ages 10 and 14, including NY conventions (circa '76) where the cast attended, including Shatner and Nimoy. Saw maybe 3 episodes of TNG, did zip for me.

Wrath of Khan's Burger King uniforms: awsum!

The biggest problem was that Enterprise was never really Star Trek. Yeah, they reference some of the same things, but to do the prequel they really had to make it more like cowboys in space, which doesn't really touch what I found most attractive about Star Trek. I think they did it to themselves, really, and unfortunately once they came up with the idea that it was a "prequel", there's only so far they could go towards making it more like the other Star Treks we knew and loved, without confusing the timeline, so to speak.

I hope they come up with another Trek series along the lines of Deep Space Nine. Or maybe they could do it as a sitcom: the kinda-dumb Data prototype (from the end of the last movie) stumbles through the future! Laughs ensue!

Counsellor Trios ass and tits were ok, but that nose ruined all. Still I bet Riker would often chuckle with Warf about how if she had a abg over her head he'd do her, and then Warf would probaby say "Yeah, and her fore head isnt bumpy enough". There was an episode when the crew was all morphin ginto prehistoric froms of themselves and Warf came on to Trio by saying "GET OUT OF THAT BATH! " and biting her. Not very romantic, those Vulcans.
-- Mike Hanley (pennyson...), July 24th, 2001.

so classic

This article summed up a lot of my feelings pretty early on:
http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=20020325&s=minkowitz

also: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBXal1GAA4A&NR