Punk vs Metal

xp - Colonel -- maybe it's more of an American thing?? idk ... like so many dudes I know who were punk teens and "matured" to being post-punk / indie dads will rep for Maiden but very little other metal of that era (ok, Maiden and Slayer) ... but maybe it's just the t-shirts? ... It's kinda the flipside of metal dudes of a similar age who think punk sucks but will rep for Misfits and Suicidal Tendencies idk

Slayer is probably a better example over here. I do see a fair amount of Slayer t-shirts at hardcore gigs. And I do like Slayer.

I think it's just that I'm not that into most of the big NWOBHM bands outside of Motorhead, Girlschool and Venom. Most of the 80s metal I like is from 84ish onwards and that's probably not a coincidence that the punk influence increased around that time tbh

I do know a much more punk guy than me who likes Iron Maiden tho tbf

Maiden was a huge chart pop band in the UK, right? So it would be kind of like repping for Motley Crue or someone in North America? I wonder if that makes the difference.

This is wild: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_Maiden_discography#Singles

yeah maybe? they were definitely massive and had top 10 hits. but they seem to be doing something different to the stuff I like so I'm not sure it's just some kind of ew no too mainstream thing

I am living this thread right now though, just now I was listening to Vio-lence (80s thrash metal) now I'm listening to Cadenaxo (hardcore punk from this year)

one of the bands that got a lot of my punk/hardcore friends and i into metal was Power Trip (RIP Riley Gale)

Power Trip were great, I never saw them but I love that crossover sound and that guy seemed to be such an all round dude, it's really sad

I definitely feel like the premise of this is weird, esp. now and I feel like anyone (in America at least) born after say, 1976, is going to have grown up with popular bands that fuse punk and metal, which makes it difficult to even define in musical terms, which leaves us either with sub-genre affiliation or social ones.

like I remember seeing Nirvana in early 1991, and thinking, as a 16 year-old wearing my favorite joy division t-shirt and punk jacket and combat boots, "wow, I like this metal band!" ... but then apparently they were also considered "punk" (i.e. The Year That Punk Broke).

Yeah, totally.xp

hmm. I mean I was born in 1976 but I never thought Nirvana were metal

I hadn't heard of them before -- they were the opening band at a rare 16+ club night I went to a few months after I turned 16 lol.

serious answer is even through the 90s to me metal seemed to be a totally different scene to punk/indie whether that was in my head or in reality, it was this other thing

not saying there weren't differences -- just like, the music that is "popular" like ... what you'd hear on the radio or see on MTV as say, a 13 year old ... the music that was "metal" and the music that was "punk" had intermingled more in the 90s onward than say prior to that? idk again, maybe American thing.

actually, I think I'm just gonna walk that back and stick to the i don't know and "it really depends on how you define each one" position.

though i stick to my assertion about skateboarding as a factor in the intermingling.

no I think we did have that here but I think more towards the end of the decade, and probably not really stuff I was into tbh

nirvana were seen by kerrang readers as metal (except by the people who didnt like them)

indie weekly mags saw them as indie. Manic Street Preachers also straddled both. As did anything grunge really.

Wasnt til later really that rock/metal were seen as separate things.

your punk knowledge is very impressive to me, Colonel, just fyi ... like, seriously, I bow down

It wasn't exactly uncommon for folk to have sabbath,zep,purple, pistols, ramones, metallica, killing joke, megadeth, the cult, the mission, sisters of mercy, ac/dc,motorhead,maiden, whitesnake ,priest, slayer, janes addiction and nirvana in their collections.

esp when bands like metallica and megadeth played punk songs live

colonel poo is the daddy

i forgot faith no more in that list.

and g n' r

skid row covering ramones got a few of my younger pals into them actually.

Infact I can pinpoint the moment young kids stopped listening to the older heavy rock bands here. It was nu metal where anything traditional was seen as old fashioned.

I remember seeing Jello Biafra speak in 2000. He praised someone in the crowd for having the 'courage' to wear a Metallica T-shirt with a punk spiked jacket. It seemed strange to me bc I had never known anyone who wore spiked jackets that disliked Metallica.

I think Megadeth's version of "Anarchy in the UK" might have been the first one I heard.

i think Motley Crue covered it too?

https://i.imgur.com/UWIVUCg_d.jpg?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium

fwiw I saw Jello Biafra speak in 2015 and he criticized the staff at 924 Gilman for losing the actual vinyl record of "Little Marcie sings to ($1.98) Children" and only having the album sleeve lying around ... it is a classic album of the creepy christian ventriloquist genre tbh.

Creepy Christian ventiloquists are p metal.

My rule of thumb: are the vocals obnoxious? If the answer is an unqualified 'yes', then it's punk.