should i give the grateful dead a chance?

I was a big fan of the How Sweet It Is album that came out in 1997. Haven't listened to any of the releases since then though.

You totally need this if you don't already have it.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/06/Jerry_Garcia_Band.jpg/220px-Jerry_Garcia_Band.jpg

Let's put it on the list then :)

You might find this useful: Jerry Garcia Solo/JGB/Grisman/etc. - S/D

Also, this guy's got tons of stuff, by Jerry, Dead, many others---note that they're all alphabetical by first name--these are FLACs, but he's got everything in mp3s also, just check the main menu.
http://www.ousterhout.net/lossless/jgarcia.html

Late 68 some of the band were vying for both Pigpen and Bob Weir to be fired from the band.l Which coincides witha number fo sets recorded wthout either onboard which gives way to moe open ended jamming. BUt I do like the behind the beat rhythm guitar thing Weir did.
& Pigpen wasa decent singer. But only a garage/r'n'b keyboardist not one open to endless jamming.
He was sorely missed when he went though i think.

But they brought in Topm Constanten in late 68 to 69 and he was a bit more technical.

was recently listening to a dark star from their april 1971 fillmore east run with some particularly spacey keys throughout and was thinking no way this is pigpen, turned out tc was sitting in for that show.

re the pigpen/weir-less thing: if my memory of the material released as mickey & the heartbeats is anything to go by, i think it's a very good thing they reconsidered.

re the pigpen/weir-less thing: if my memory of the material released as mickey & the heartbeats is anything to go by, i think it's a very good thing they reconsidered.

― no lime tangier

it's... hard to say. the thing about the dead for me was that they were always a giant, rolling clusterfuck. honestly, i'd kind of like to hear what a garcia/lesh/kreutzmann power trio could have done! it might have been awful but the dead were awful a lot of the time anyway!

I've been thinking lately that lesh might be the most crucial member of the band. His bass might be more important to what made the dead the dead than Jerry's guitar or vocals.

that's crazy talk

i'd say that jerry, bob, phil, and billy were _all_ crucial to the band as they were. i just am not really taken with most of what weir brought to it :)

lol at that ousterhout site, 284 bootlegs of which a good 80% plus are marked as "REALLY GOOD", this is why people don't get into dead boots :)

haha, not only that one of the only '72 shows he _doesn't_ list as exceptional is portland 07-25, which has that all-time pre-verse jam in "the other one"!

The most distinctive part of the dead (for me) is that weird, loping shuffle so much of their stuff has, for which I think Lesh is most responsible.

xp to waterface

bob's rhythm playing in 72 is quite impressive stuff but on the whole i agree

yeah i mean to each his/her own, maybe weir all listening 2 different bands in a way

god help me I really like the rock n roll type stuff bob sings like “promised land” and “going down the line”

ousterhout linked mainly for the Garcia sidetrips; the ones I've listened to are good. ditto Dead sets.
Christgau's early Dead articles, archived on his site, incl. mention of the Pigpen-Weir band, which was an idea some or all of the others had, but, according to xgau, they couldn't afford it, meaning, I take it, couldn't afford to hire more musos for such a band, or sep. road crew, if they shunted this projected thing off to sep. gigs, rather than opening act on Dead tours (Xgau says Pigpen was the favorite of a big audience segment, be hard to follow, esp, when shifting gears into more varied excursions).
I do know people who turned against them when Pig was gone, won't listen to anything later.

hard to follow, esp, when shifting gears into more varied excursions) And this was already happening while he was in the Dead, which was a reason for wanting him excised, again according to the 'gau.

The Pigpen Review! I think a "review" was pretty full-sized presentation.
Musically, this made sense, but because the Dead was also a spiritual unit, it was distressing. Then it was revealed that this was a breakup with a difference: two groups would result but the new one, to be called the Pigpen Revue, would tour with the Dead.
It never did happen, partly because the group, which is always in debt no matter how much money it earns, couldn't handle the finances. When the Dead appeared here last February, Tom Constanten was on organ. But Pigpen was on-stage too, banging inaudibly on a set of bongos and singing or blowing mouth-harp sometimes. The Dead wouldn't have been right without Pigpen to root them to the ground,and they knew it. Not only was their music better than ever, so was their gestalt. On their recent Aoxomoxoa (Warner Brothers WS 1790), the last three credits read: "Bill Krutzmann/Percussion; Tom Constanten/Keyboards; Rod McKernan/Pig Pen." He is his own instrument.
From https://www.robertchristgau.com/xg/news/grateful-69.php

The part about him being the favorite of segment is in another newspaper story somewhere on there, I think; anyway,I've certainly heard it from heads.

Re: Weir. Him singing El Paso Is some underachieving shit i cringe everytime i see it on youtube. The look in his eyes says get me out of here i dont know why he doesnt belt it out more confidently. Such things fascinate me

Never understand all the shit Bob Weir gets. Rhythm guitar > lead guitar.

Yeah, he doesn't have the charisma of Garcia, but can be very effective performer---rizzx, hope you've got Weir's Ace on your list.

I should prob have said he doesn't have the talent and skill of Garcia, but more of an everyman figure, and certainly the journeyman, never slick enough to be the hack, but learning on the job (starting as Garcia's student at the guitar store),

The look in his eyes says get me out of here i dont know why he doesnt belt it out more confidently.

Based on '80s and '90s performances of "Estimated Prophet," asking Weir to belt it out is an extremely bad idea.

LOL yeah I once heard Weir's 'belting voice' accurately described as an unattractive foghorn bellow - and he's still a better singer than Phil Lesh!

Phil can be an interesting player in the group unit but some of his bass solos are horrendous.

phil is this fascinating mix of innovative player and obnoxious noise-maker. when he goes into something like the "philo stomp", i'm _extremely_ impressed, but as much as i love avant-garde music, "seastones" is just a load of crap.

there’s this dead show from the early 90s I watched awhile back that was equal parts awesome and hilarious... I don’t know if bob was on something that night but he was doing weird stuff with his vocals. Like he sang the verse of “estimated prophet” as a series of descending semitones so it sounded like all haunted and fucked. and he wouldnt sing the proper chorus of “one more Saturday night” he would just sing “..... yah Saturday night!!”

284 bootlegs of which a good 80% plus are marked as "REALLY GOOD", this is why people don't get into dead boots :)

lollll

which people?

@dow - read good things about Ace, so def. on the list. Have listened to Weir's recent-ish albums like Kingfish and Blue Mountain quite a bit and liked most of it.

Haven't heard those, but think Ace is still gen. considered his best.
xpost The only person I've ever actually met who didn't get into Dead boots etc. was this guy who used to shop a turn-of-the-century store where I worked; Dead product pretty much kept the lights on. One day I was describing how I finally got into the Dead, and he said, "Yeah---that's great, if you want to hear 500 performances of the same 18 songs," this mummified hippie with his kindly gap-toothed smile---and the scales fell from my eyes! For a second.

hi all, i've been doing the Year of The Dead for awhile now and today's show from the Fillmore West 1968 is something else. the first show after Anthem was released, 21 min. Alligator! peace

https://archive.org/details/gd1968-08-21.139746.sbd.MasterReel.Gastwirt.Miller.Noel.pcfix.t-flac1644

listening to a lot of the dead lately, really into them. lots of random dick's picks listens on Spotify etc. have been taking a lot of hallucinogens also, turning into a boomer hippy at 36.

started off p much mortified every time bobby was getting into it but grown strongly fond of him.

Lol, jim, I wouldn't have thought. That was about the age I got into them seriously.

@llurk what is that Year of The Dead thing you mention? Listening to a show from the same date a whole year long? And how do you decide from which year you pick the date?

Enjoying 1975 at the moment, One From the Vault is a true gem I keep going back to

I've been listening This Day in Dead History on archive.org every day for months now, prep course for Advanced Head Studies. The calling comes as an unexpectedly exceptional version of Looks Like Rain.

I started by focusing on the years that I knew were choice - 73/74, 77, 68 - but then branched out into all eras. There's good stuff all over, the August 1982 Midwest tour and current 1972 run to Veneta, OR have been epic.

Look for a Matrix mix of the best soundboard/audience tapes available or mastered by Mr. Charlie Miller, they tend to sound the best, dropping into the jam of Playing or a favorite song can give you a sense if the band is 'on' that night.

and rizzx, check out their next show on 9/28/75 - its One From The Vault as a free show in Golden Gate Park. https://archive.org/details/gd1975-09-28.mtx.seamons.102155.sbeok.flac16

Sounds like a fun job! I've been telling myself stick to the albums available on Spotify because I always do that to myself, put restrictions on my listening. Barriers to prevent me from losing myself completely. But I'll check those archive shows out though!

Archive.org at least used to have almost every show in various file formats.
Like from 65 or 66 through to Garcias death in 96. Probably some of the related stuff too Other Ones, Furthur etc.
I think there was possibly some removed thanks to commercial releases or made into stream only or something.
I used to frequent the site in the early 00ies.
They also have a load of Dream Syndicate as well as quite a few other bands in less complete form.

I think I'm becoming a Pigpan fan, good grief

er Pigpen lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmP4BEIzE4s

Pigpen is their secret weapon----

Nah he's too much of a basic blues dude, with a lot of passion but still...I keep skipping his tunes after two minutes

I used to think that, but listening today to "I'm A King Bee" on the Port Chester 1971 live set on the 50th anniversary Workingman's Dead, I heard something deeper.

Hmmm shall give it a try, but maybe you're just tired? No but I am, I need a rousing PITB now

Lovelight from Live/Dead is where it's at

^^^
Possibly Pigpen's greatest moment (other than hiring the Hell's Angels at Altamont).

Mr Charlie, Easy Wind, that's all folks.

OPERATOR

doctor say better stop ballin that jack