a playwright once wrote a mediocre 10 minute short play that got done here by friends of mine about a society where only a small, lucky percentage of the "plebeians" get actual "jobs", which all pay pennies an hour. the rest are unemployed and fight for scraps (literally and figuratively)
we're pretty much there rn.
― popeye's arse (Neanderthal), Thursday, 13 August 2020 23:14 (three years ago) link
sadly i suspect these are still 'the good times' tbh.
― Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Thursday, 13 August 2020 23:34 (three years ago) link
Paying someone under $14 an hour is illegal where I live.
― Zelda Zonk, Thursday, 13 August 2020 23:44 (three years ago) link
That chart as an article https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/08/13/recession-is-over-rich-working-class-is-far-recovered/
― 𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Friday, 14 August 2020 00:02 (three years ago) link
As talks between Republicans and Democrats in Washington have disintegrated
― DJI, Friday, 14 August 2020 00:46 (three years ago) link
Cool, cool:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/aug/14/us-health-insurers-coronavirus-pandemic-profit
― pomenitul, Friday, 14 August 2020 14:39 (three years ago) link
Imagine if single-payer had been on the table.
― Zelda Zonk, Thursday, August 13, 2020 4:44 PM (yesterday)
same here! ... the chart also has a regional aspect because of this. Not to be all virtue signalling about "where I live has a higher minimum wage" because where I live is way more expensive, and the people in that chart making $14-20/hr where I live are probably in similar circumstances to the $14 and under group in other parts of the country.
― sarahell, Friday, 14 August 2020 17:19 (three years ago) link
it's actually interesting looking at the chart -- because it looks like the $14-20/hr dipped down prior to the $14 and under, and I wonder if there is a correlation between higher cost of living states (e.g. California, New York, Mass.) going into quarantine/lockdown earlier than lower cost of living states ...
― sarahell, Friday, 14 August 2020 17:22 (three years ago) link
* or maybe it shouldn't be states so much as areas -- I guess my point is, the $14 and under and the $14-20 groups are potentially the same class of workers, just with different pay rates due to regional differences in cost of living, and it is interesting to see those compared in terms of regional responses to Covid.
― sarahell, Friday, 14 August 2020 17:26 (three years ago) link
S&P 500’s forward P/E ratio now sits at highest since mid-2000 pic.twitter.com/R3kCQD4q1J— Liz Ann Sonders (@LizAnnSonders) August 18, 2020
― 𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 14:20 (three years ago) link
speculatin' on vaccinatin'
― it's a spicy dinner we're having (Sufjan Grafton), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 15:15 (three years ago) link
Too many suckers with too much free time putting their vacation money into robinhood
― sound of scampo talk to me (El Tomboto), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 15:18 (three years ago) link
lol tom
the crash is coming
― Nhex, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 15:32 (three years ago) link
There really isn't an economic crisis for the rich right now, not even for the moderately well-off. Roughly speaking I think the top third of the income distribution is fine.
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 15:46 (three years ago) link
today, yeah. tomorrow we die.
― Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 16:44 (three years ago) link
pessimism from ulysses, i love it
― Nhex, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 16:56 (three years ago) link
don't know why you would! i'm justifiably depressed!
― Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 17:15 (three years ago) link
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/08/technology/robinhood-risky-trading.html
― sarahell, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 18:46 (three years ago) link
“They encourage people to go from training wheels to driving motorcycles,” Scott Smith, who tracks brokerage firms at the financial consulting firm Cerulli, said of Robinhood. “Over the long term, it’s like trying to beat the casino.”
― sound of scampo talk to me (El Tomboto), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 18:49 (three years ago) link
oh yeah i wanted to read this last month but had run out of free articles
― contorted filbert (harbl), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 18:51 (three years ago) link
this is a particularly bold take
Vlad Tenev, a founder and co-chief executive of Robinhood, said in an interview that even with some of its customers losing money, young Americans risked greater losses by not investing in stocks at all. Not participating in the markets “ultimately contributed to the sort of the massive inequalities that we’re seeing in society,” he said.
― contorted filbert (harbl), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 18:52 (three years ago) link
i felt very reassured and reaffirmed by the chart that showed Schwab customers as the most cautious investors! Yes! It is me! I _am_ a Schwab customer
― sarahell, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 18:56 (three years ago) link
At least a casino gives you free alcohol and possibly some bachelorette parties to interact with.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 18:56 (three years ago) link
Over the long term, it’s like trying to beat the casino
On the one hand, it's not that much like that, because the casino has a long-term negative expected value, and investing in stocks, even day-trading, doesn't. On the other hand, it's definitely true that Tenev's business is giving finance companies the opportunity to skim money from inexperienced investors who can be persuaded to overpay for things in a herd.
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 18:57 (three years ago) link
But yes, everybody who is lucky enough to have money saved beyond immediate six-month needs should put it in a big Vanguard zero-fee meatgrinder fund and forget about it until they're old.
it's like being an uber driver but your car costs $800,000
― contorted filbert (harbl), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 18:59 (three years ago) link
$5,000 passenger charge - cheap jeans caused minor perforation in leather seats
― muntjac wagner (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 19:15 (three years ago) link
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Tuesday, August 18, 2020 11:57 AM (thirty-three minutes ago)
you're being sarcastic, yeah?
― sarahell, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 19:32 (three years ago) link
i don't think so, that's basically what i do
― contorted filbert (harbl), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 19:36 (three years ago) link
Me too
― 𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 19:37 (three years ago) link
like one of the pre-mixed "target" funds?
― muntjac wagner (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 19:55 (three years ago) link
When I thought I was going to have enough money for a retirement account, all advice was to put it into one of the Vanguard ‘Total Stock Market’ or Balanced Market finds.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 20:07 (three years ago) link
And to look at it as little as possible.
Chief KyiV neVer returned.
― Yerac, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 20:08 (three years ago) link
Wait, no, not at all, why?
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 20:14 (three years ago) link
it's a common thing to do, and not a _bad_ thing to do -- like, I can see it, from the individual's point of view, as if they had an employer pension and the pension fund was managed by a responsible third party. I don't think people should be obligated to do regular maintenance on their retirement savings (if that's the function of the savings -- other people have shorter term goals).
However, if you want to "maximize" your investments, the big zero-fee Vanguard fund isn't the way to go. ... And I am definitely not saying everyone should want to do this.
Also, one of the positive aspects of DIY investing is that you have more control over where your money goes -- I'm thinking of all the protests / activism around pension fund divestments for ethical reasons -- granted, there are targeted funds for "social impact" and "ethical investing" ... i guess i am probably just being too nit-picky.
― sarahell, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 20:14 (three years ago) link
Not having more control over where your money goes - ie minimizing the potential for an individual to fuck it up - is a large part of the point.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 20:18 (three years ago) link
at least for me it is not my retirement money and not the only investment i do but i don't touch robinhood-type things, also easier on the ethics forms i have to do at work for individual stocks and sector funds
― contorted filbert (harbl), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 20:18 (three years ago) link
― Nhex
on november 4, 2020
come on, we all fucking know this, right?
america doesn't have a functioning economy
― Kate (rushomancy), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 20:23 (three years ago) link
Robinhood does not force people to trade, of course. But its success at getting them do so has been highlighted internally. In June, the actor Ashton Kutcher, who has invested in Robinhood, attended one of the company’s weekly staff meetings on Zoom and celebrated its success by comparing it to gambling websites, said three people who were on the call.Mr. Kutcher said in a statement that his comment “was not intended to be a comparison of business models nor the experience Robinhood provides its customers” and that it referred “to the current growth metrics.” He added that he was “absolutely not insinuating that Robinhood was a gambling platform.”
Mr. Kutcher said in a statement that his comment “was not intended to be a comparison of business models nor the experience Robinhood provides its customers” and that it referred “to the current growth metrics.” He added that he was “absolutely not insinuating that Robinhood was a gambling platform.”
― Nhex, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 20:23 (three years ago) link
my company has its own internal group of financial advisors and for a fee, we can give them control over our 401(k) investment strategy. I did that years ago and my returns went through the roof.
except this year obv but the losses have been managed.
― muntjac wagner (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 20:31 (three years ago) link
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Tuesday, August 18, 2020 1:18 PM (thirty-one seconds ago)
Oh, I agree -- and this is why I believe the "starve the beast = let's eliminate social security because individuals should be able to do what they want" philosophy is bad and will result in even worse poverty problems and income disparities than we have now.
Like, even if I were to subscribe to the position that the problem is financial literacy, and if as a country we did more to educate people on these things ... (if y'all are bored at some point, we can play the fun game where I defend this position while everyone attacks it) ... but even if I did wholly believe in the "financial literacy" thing, people will fuck up financially and make "bad" decisions or will just have Job-like series of tragedies happen to them (and most likely the victims of these tragedies will be poor black people or other POC) ... then what? As a society, we shouldn't say, "Whelp, sucks to be you, start a gofundme or starve" ...
However, I feel like there is potential for using investment funds in a social justice / activist / anti-corporate way ... and some of my aversion to the "just put all the money in a Vanguard fund and let them handle it" is that investing (and knowledge / skills related to it) could do a lot to challenge the status quo.
― sarahell, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 20:31 (three years ago) link
Every bit of advice I've read has just said put money in Vanguard Star Fund.
― dan selzer, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 20:34 (three years ago) link
It also depends on whether it's a tax-sheltered investment ...
― sarahell, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 20:36 (three years ago) link
A question for y'all: for those of you who are vehemently anti-capitalist, progressive leftists, fuck Joe Biden and the Democratic Party -- do you feel awkward or any sense of conflict about having your money invested in some Vanguard-type managed fund?
― sarahell, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 21:00 (three years ago) link
Like, I have ethical issues and feelings like that in terms of my investments (mine are different but not virtuously aligned with my politics by any means)
― sarahell, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 21:01 (three years ago) link
absolutely
― A-B-C. A-Always, B-Be, C-Chooglin (will), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 21:01 (three years ago) link
My KBR shares have gone up in value recently -- not 100% proud of that.
― sarahell, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 21:02 (three years ago) link
otoh I rationalize this investment in the profitability of fascist-adjacent industry by noting how many hours I have volunteered doing work for anarchist collectives and activists ... sorry for boring middle-aged ilx-ing
― sarahell, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 21:05 (three years ago) link