Even in that optimistic scenario it's very difficult to imagine how a Corbyn minority government would have survived for very long - particularly trying to get Brexit legislation through the Commons and with Labour MPs sending blood in the water. Even a confidence and supply agreement with the SNP would have crashed on the Brexit rocks surely?
They might have won in early 2018 when they were polling level with the Tories though.
― Matt DC, Sunday, 9 August 2020 11:38 (three years ago) link
If he wanted to go back over numbers he might consider how Labour’s numbers tanked the less ambiguous they were about committing to a Remain position.
― let them microwave their rice (gyac), Sunday, 9 August 2020 11:38 (three years ago) link
Lynskey is correct it's important to be realistic about the outcome of General Elections, referendums, that kind of thing
― The Scampos of Young Werther (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 9 August 2020 11:38 (three years ago) link
steady on!
― anvil, Sunday, 9 August 2020 11:39 (three years ago) link
just addressing the myth of Remain's near miss
― The Scampos of Young Werther (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 9 August 2020 11:41 (three years ago) link
xp I think all the wreckers would have resigned as soon as they could, but then he should have purged them ASAP. No sense in letting people like Ian Austin and John Woodcock call themselves Labour MPs any longer than necessary. But once you get into the messy realpolitik scenario of a coalition like that, it’s difficult to know what would have happened. Certainly if they emerged from the election the largest party we wouldn’t be on course for a no deal exit at the end of the year. What Alphie says above is true, and 2017 was the thing that made people take Corbyn seriously and view him as a real threat. What fools like DL think is neither here nor there tbh.
― let them microwave their rice (gyac), Sunday, 9 August 2020 11:42 (three years ago) link
maybe he could do a thread about how Remainers made the Johnson government
― The Scampos of Young Werther (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 9 August 2020 11:46 (three years ago) link
I can't wait to dig into his mate's How To Be a Liberal book, might just cut straight to the "overlook the results of democratic votes/referendums and cry like a fucking baby for 3 years" chapter and see if I can learn something important about how to have the dignified poise of a great classic liberal!
― calzino, Sunday, 9 August 2020 11:49 (three years ago) link
Yes this discussion from people like Owen Jones and Zara Sultana isn't really about what would have happened it's about countering the idea of unelectability. Even if Labour MPs weren't taking the prospect seriously the Tories clearly were. If they weren't genuinely shook they wouldn't have gone for Johnson - although they were also clearly concerned about Brexit slipping through their fingers.
― Matt DC, Sunday, 9 August 2020 11:52 (three years ago) link
Had the campaign gone on a week longer, Labour may well have wound up at least in government, and possibly won outright. I base this on the phenomenon of people jumping on the ‘winner’ bandwagon when they can see it coming.
― santa clause four (suzy), Sunday, 9 August 2020 14:19 (three years ago) link
Just noting how Bush was quite smart, he would turn up as a reply guy in all sorts of threads with pro-Corbyn people, talk to them, act curious. Most were probably sceptical but because he was courteous it was fine. Something the rest of the media didn't do - and I do wonder if there was better analysis whether they would've seen the threat from Corbyn earlier or not.
Frankly, Stephen Bush is now deliberately being ridiculous.The claim of deliberate sabotage doesnt need comparison with a different campaign, only that1. We're they told to distribute more ambitiously2. Did theyThat's it. pic.twitter.com/CiIvHvduRp— left of Brown (@TKispeter) August 11, 2020
― xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 12:47 (three years ago) link
"Corbyn's arrogant tour of Conservative-held seats"
Is he writing from the pov of the Corbyn sceptic or just himself or are they one and the same
― nashwan, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 12:55 (three years ago) link
I thought Labour were supposed to be speaking to people they disagreed with? Anyway the leaked report alleged a whole shadow campaign in 2017 where resources were diverted so Bush can fuck off.
― let them microwave their rice (gyac), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 12:58 (three years ago) link
I immediately bin any commentator who calls Corbyn ‘arrogant’ because it transparently means ‘is not doing the thing I would like him to do, because he ignores melts like me, and I keep trying to speak to a manager’.
― santa clause four (suzy), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 12:59 (three years ago) link
it's entirely possible that 2017 was somewhat sabotaged by reluctant corbz-hostile lab operatives and 2019 was badly run by keen lab operatives loyal to corbz
― mark s, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 13:08 (three years ago) link
Yup there is a story here to be told of Corbyn loyal ppl who left post-2017 too.
― xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 13:25 (three years ago) link
Andrew Fisher comes to mind.
― let them microwave their rice (gyac), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 13:26 (three years ago) link
There was a lot of nonsense talk about how strong Labour's ground game before the '19 disaster. In my neck of the woods Tory campaigners were like ants and there were signs on every lamppost even signs half to Leeds outside this constituency - there was definitely some kind of ground game failure that was possibly nothing to do with internal wrecking. My mp, as decent as she was, she was melt adjacent and to the point she deleted a group photo with Corbyn in London that was taken by a local Councillor who told she said something like : oh christ no, I don't want that fucker in my pic! But it was a marginal and one that you might think was the result of gerrymandering - it might have been. I haven't looked into the history of the boundary changes.
― calzino, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 19:06 (three years ago) link
Excuse grammar fail, am on my and didn't proof read it cos I wasn't sure if the fucker would even post!
― calzino, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 19:09 (three years ago) link
Phone
wb calz, hope you won't mind my new dn.
― stabbing fantaisiste, repellent imagiste (pomenitul), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 19:14 (three years ago) link
stabber calzoh stabber calzplease don't knife my melthe's got a big tent partyand forensic questioning skillsoh bad man stabber calz
― Temporary Erogenous Zone (jim in vancouver), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 19:22 (three years ago) link
Lol was just thinking about thos repellent imago-eris!
― calzino, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 19:23 (three years ago) link
u wot
― imago, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 19:24 (three years ago) link
Just goofing about no one needs to die... Yet!
― calzino, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 19:27 (three years ago) link
Careful there.
― Young Boys of Bernie (Tom D.), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 19:29 (three years ago) link
My constituency encompasses areas like Saviletown where the population is 90%+ South Asian and lots of extreme socially deprived poor areas like Chickenley, Dewsbury Moor, Ravensthorpe etc and then posh af zones like Upper/Lower Hopton etc which belong more to Hudds than here which looks like some gerrymandering went on some point. But anyway, if Labour concentrated their ground game in the Tory zones then they fucked up and effectively did in a good mp who only lost by a couple of thousand there. get brexit done needed challenging and there was fuck all prescence.
― calzino, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:17 (three years ago) link
Lol BTW I'm still actually barred but can post when I turn off WiFi on my phone. In your face melts!
― calzino, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:20 (three years ago) link
Moderators HATE him. The one weird trick to post to ILX when you're banned that might surprise you
― Temporary Erogenous Zone (jim in vancouver), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:23 (three years ago) link
Lovely to see you back calz, obviously none of us wants to see class traitors die a slow agonising death, that would be bad
― The Scampos of Young Werther (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:25 (three years ago) link
xxp You're not according to the admin log?
― Andrew Farrell, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:25 (three years ago) link
Disease schadenfreude is ok unless we're talking biological warfare. Them's the rules.
― stabbing fantaisiste, repellent imagiste (pomenitul), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:26 (three years ago) link
― sound of scampo talk to me (El Tomboto), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:31 (three years ago) link
The chatter on this thread is reprehensible and reminds me of the good old days of dom, jon and marcello. Good job class warriors
― sound of scampo talk to me (El Tomboto), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:32 (three years ago) link
Lads, please. It’s too hot for beef.
― fă-ți cercetările (gyac), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:33 (three years ago) link
― sound of scampo talk to me (El Tomboto), Tuesday, August 11, 2020 2:32 PM (twenty-three seconds ago) bookmarkflaglink
DON'T TRY IT
― Temporary Erogenous Zone (jim in vancouver), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:33 (three years ago) link
Lol oh for the good old days
― xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:34 (three years ago) link
wait why were u banned?
― plax (ico), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:34 (three years ago) link
Wait I take that back, I really just meant Marcello I think. Dom and Jon are in a different category
― sound of scampo talk to me (El Tomboto), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:34 (three years ago) link
Plax (and calz I guess) -
rolling FP number request thread
― xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:35 (three years ago) link
xp. yes, Marcello was not really all that different to some "difficult" posters we still have amongst us currently. Dom was carrying on off-board harassment campaigns and such iirc
― Temporary Erogenous Zone (jim in vancouver), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:35 (three years ago) link
You recall correctly
― xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:36 (three years ago) link
Ftr I never threatened to murder anybody, just posted that I'd rather murder him than vote for him and followed this up with I'd vote for Mair's favourite party the Greens these days. But fuck it life is too short can't be arsed going into this, just going to acquaint myself with Killfile instead.
― calzino, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:37 (three years ago) link
And go masturbate over a military installation Tombot, Marcello is worth a million of you
― calzino, Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:39 (three years ago) link
Seems we have a rogue mod on the loose.
― Young Boys of Bernie (Tom D.), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 21:50 (three years ago) link
Ffs
― The Scampos of Young Werther (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 22:02 (three years ago) link
LADS
― Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 22:12 (three years ago) link
it's all kicking off
― Temporary Erogenous Zone (jim in vancouver), Tuesday, 11 August 2020 22:14 (three years ago) link
UK politics threads are like so many demos I've been to in the past 10 years; there's this ritual.
You've got the various factions of protesters, the nice quaker/Green types with their organised signs saying 'down with this sort of thing', the Sisters Uncut who are really well prepared, and have a loudspeaker and are reading out name of the murdered or a list of the demands, and of course a few tankies in black bandanas and hoodies with anarchy symbols on them, who are milling about menacingly and occasionally shouting "ACAB!" or "Riot!!!" or whatever.
And some copper will come over, and start trying to tell people to take it easy, look, all the coppers are on overtime now and want to go home, could the demo maybe wind it up (and he will 100% say in the inquest afterwards or whatever, that he was genuinely trying to calm things down) - but one of the Sisters will kiss her teeth at him, and the hoodies will make pig noises and start oinking or whatever, and the cop will go beserk and just start telling us we're all scum. So the hoodies start throwing plastic bottles at the cops and taunting them - and BOOM! 500 cops appear out of nowhere, start pushing the crowd back, the tankies smash in the window of Foxton's, there's a million photographers snapping photos of it, and suddenly you're in a kettle and it's got *nasty*.
People will look at descriptions of that situation, and say, "no one wants to go to demos any more, the fucken tankies make it unsafe!!!" When, really, the reason people stop going to demos is because of the *cops*.
― Branwell with an N, Wednesday, 12 August 2020 11:02 (three years ago) link
Now do the US Pol threads
― xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 12 August 2020 11:15 (three years ago) link