Erykah Badu: C /D, S&D

HIS VISION MAN

Sure they are praised by others etc, but certainly not on the same level we see here, where their limitations usually go unmentioned. So it's about not being, for instance, a mere chorus of fawning Badu fanboys. In other words: giving her records the dignity of a sober assessment and *critical* praise, and having her music evaluated in the context of other/previous/better artists. The pro-Badu league here seems to be more socially than musically oriented sometimes.

but to some extent there's always going to be a glow surrounding any talented musician currently recording, no matter how evaluative it may or may not be.

badu has never been as praised as the other two, not on ilx or in the wider world. i can only explain the love the latest erykah album gets here as a result of this, like people werent really paying attention when MG came out.

You guys, it's not very hard; ILM tends to be about pop and indie. Badu hasn't been very pop since her debut and, arguably up until this last album, she's the wrong type of indie for most posters here to really lose their minds over her.

Surmounter, ok, but with these three, particularly w/ Erykah Badu, it became some kind of almost unchallenged superstitious belief in ILM. This kind of hyperbolic overpraising does not match their overall reputation outside this board

This is the kind of sensible nonsense easily cleared up by checking the Pazz & Jopp poll results and Metacritic ratings in the last six years for M.I.A. and Elliott.

vision's posts are perplexing in many ways, all of them dumb

Alfred Sotosyn, you make no sense. That exchange was not about whether Badu or Missy Elliott are talented (they are) or whether the critics have given them enough praise (they have), but how the fans of these two artists here in ILM, instead of being objective and balanced whey they talk about both, usually just repeat a certain obsequious, shallow party line about how great they are etc etc. Next time, trying paying attention to what's being said.

o_0

Next time, dip into the (voluminous) M.I.A. threads and pay attention to the level of discourse.

so you're annoyed by the fandom.

let me tell ya, fans have been annoying for decades, it's nothin new.

There won't be a next time about M.I.A. because 1) I think she's a fraud and 2)this is not really about her.

i mean look i cringe whenever i talk about kate bush but generally people grant me a little patience in my rapture

It's official: Vision is not a fan of M.I.A.

Surmounter, I'm not annoyed. I am attentive to a certain kind of slant within this board, and I think it is worth pointing out because it has happened before.

I have no intention to make hardcore baduizts behave coolly about an artist they admire, it's ok, go ahead, be emotional, enthusiastic etc, but what the critical mass of ILM opinion about her suggests is that there is too much superficial praise given her and her latest album.

I do think she, like the others before her, was made into some kind of political figure, and I do think some people here simply bought into that, they're not really fans, they're just gullible. Artificial consensus always dumbs things down, and it certainly is a disservice to Badu's career.

BTW, I don't think I have to tell you how ILM is teeming with music critics and musicians from all parts of the world, so it's not just a common fan-oriented message board, it's a place with certain idiosyncrasies. Some of them, like this "let's uncritically praise and lionize a female non-white artist" pattern, seem to me a little contrived.

let's uncritically praise and lionize a female non-white artist" pattern, seem to me a little
contrived.

If you've read any thread about Badu, MIA, and Elliott, you'd never write this twaddle.

Well, guess what, we are in one such thread, going back some seven years, and the overall perception when reading about these three artists in ILM is consistently the same: uncritical, sheepish praise for the pc muse du jour-- until, of course, the next one arrives to take her place.

You are gay.

After the Hurricane, no I'm not. BTW, these three singers do have a certain fag-hag following, don't they? Not that there's anything wrong with that.

I really don't get the point of your rants... we're fans of these artists, so why wouldn't the threads be filled with praise? There has been criticism in this thread - I believe chaki said he's not feeling New Amerykah as much as her earlier albums - so... really whats your point? The idea that Erykah is some kind of critical "it girl" du jour is flawed because she's been getting critical praise for going on 12 years now since her debut album came out....

the overall perception when reading about these three artists in ILM is consistently the same: uncritical, sheepish praise for the pc muse du jour

Try the search function and/or step up your reading comprehension. If you don't think there's appropriately critical discourse happening in these threads (which seems crazy to me), contribute by elevating the discourse or shut the fuck up. Nobody likes a condescending whiner.

A.Hurricane and Big Hoos, my point was made higher up in the thread. RE: chaki's comments, they're part of that tiny amount of exceptions that simply confirm the rule.

EB deserves both the critical recognition and her true fans. She's certainly more than an "it girl". What happened is that she seems to have been elected "ILMate of the year", like others before her, for the sake of a certain political stance rather than just the music, and that's manipulative and patronizing.

patronizing? that's rich.

Don't you know white (or black or hispanic or asian) dudes should only like music by white dudes (no just white) or else they are being patronizing?

People who like Missy Elliott only like her because her work is highly political.

Fremme neppa vanette.

Enough.

i think when people feel the need to dismiss popular opinion in this way, it can come across as arrogant. like you know better than everyone else. it seems easy enough to let others be taken with the music in question, and offer your own critiques in contrast to the majority, if you can articulate them. this seems more constructive than criticizing the audience who, however hard it may be to stomach, may just find certain talents worthy of all the buzz.

this is maybe kind of a shut-up-you-music-journalists response, but if there's disproportionate acclaim in regards to how good the record is, it's in recognition of how exciting a record it is; i remember people on one thread talking about how they'd never be able to get their heads around it, because it's such a sprawling, ambitious thing. if she's feted beyond the achievements of new amerykah (in particular, i don't know if this addresses a long history of badu-as-ilm-darling), it's for being this vivacious, current force, for the personality of the record as well as its delivery.

exactly, i mean not everything can be compared to everything else. sometimes it's enough that it's now, and it's great, and exciting.

vision's blurred

^ on that other level

^way beyond that cloud nine

vision = diabolical sockpuppet

the beginning of this thread is classic

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/77/203554-174902-vision_super.jpg

It's official: Vision is not a fan of M.I.A. a complete idiot.

New Amerykah Part 2: Return of the Ankh was originally slated for release in July:

Return of the Ankh is set for an July 2008 released and is to be accompanied by a USB stick which Badu says will include extras ranging from footage of concerts, to commentary on the recording process and “me in the bathtub with Flavour Flav” [praying that's a joke!] - “I wanted to give away my materials…It’s about sharing, and that’s why I like this system”

I'm guessing the record company wanted to hold off 'til '09 so as to not confuse people who are now used to 2-3 years passing in between album releases.

We should've just made this the Sa-Ra thread and disposed of all this...

i read about sa-ra and get super ridic excited

i listen to sa-ra and am like 'why was i so excited'

you haven't heard the right things

what should i hear?

New York City and Beautiful Thangs are astounding.

My point, however, was they either as a unit, or as individuals, have done a fair amount of work for Badu in recent times, no?

Well, these two at least.

That Hump is produced by Om'Mas Keith and basically sounds like a Sa-Ra track:

Master Teacher is produced by Shafiq Husayn and Georgia Anne Muldrow of Sa-Ra:

Erykah Badu on Sa-Ra

yall have no idea how much this record speaks to me... I might even say it feels like its ABOUT me

im sober btw

I feel like, amazing new developments aside, this record perfectly encaptures how it feels to be black in america in 2008

and I got "My President" to hold down the other side of that, so I'm good

'Me' is definitely about me

This is the definitive album of my young adulthood.

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― The Reverend, Thursday, May 15, 2008 2:04 AM Bookmark

^^^I stand by this