A new 30 Rock thread because I can't find the old one

I also want to come back to the Lynn Swann/Black Swan joke because everyone else is processing that as "lol isn't it funny that the White woman is in blackface" and I'm processing it as "it isn't funny that these two deranged idiots are so in sync that they independently came up with this grossly inappropriate idea and are blithely following through on it as if it was normal"

Like, to me the entire thrust of the joke is that Jenna and Paul are both fucking insane, not that blackface is in and of itself funny.

totally agree w that.. but intent can excuse an awful lot in comedy, no? let's look again at Tina feys 'apology'

"As we strive to do the work and do better in regards to race in America, we believe that these episodes featuring actors in race-changing make-up are best taken out of circulation," wrote Fey.

"I understand now that 'intent' is not a free pass for white people to use these images. I apologise for pain they have caused. Going forward, no comedy-loving kid needs to stumble on these tropes and be stung by their ugliness.

what is the intent of comedy? there are a whole lot of things one can say and do with the undeniable intention of making somebody laugh, and clearly there is a line that gets set. I think of the newsworthy 'jokes'/ugly outbursts from tosh + Michael richards, etc... the intention is to use ugly shocking imagery to create laughter... if you're on stage at a comedy club there is at least some obvious establishment of your intent. those 'jokes' may have been massively unsuccessful, and/ or their context may have been stripped by encountering them from a headline rather than in the environment of a comedy club... so really, what's the difference here? we assume that someone on the writers room knows better, so it's ok?

This is wholly disingenuous.

If you legitimately can’t tell the difference between “I am using an offensive practice to showcase my character’s depravity” and “I am going to threaten to rape a heckler because they heckled me” I don’t really know what to tell you.

this has been a bizarre conversation and I don't feel compelled to give my white guy opinion apart from noting that there are plenty of black people who have brought their own experiences to bear on the topic and thought this through and have come to different conclusions than those given on this thread, and they should be respected

I think having been an extremely online person on twitter and seeing so much "Tina fey is problematic" Tina fey is the encapsulation of everything that is wrong with white liberal feminism etc." content over and over throughout the last 10 years or so it's quite odd to see virtually no-one on this thread think that having 4 blackface jokes in your sitcom in the 21st century is sus. I suppose it's a generational thing.

Netflix just needs a filter that turns actors in blackface into gun sounds

on a lighter note I rewatched some of the first couple of seasons the other day and it was v good. show holds up. best sitcom of recent times imo

I think having been an extremely online person on twitter and seeing so much "Tina fey is problematic" Tina fey is the encapsulation of everything that is wrong with white liberal feminism etc." content

lol yeah I was scrolling the thread waiting for someone to bring up Jane Krakowski playing a "Lakota" woman in Kimmy Schmidt

YES.

The synchronicity of the first season of Kimmy Schmidt with the reveal of Rachel Dolezal still amazes me

If you legitimately can’t tell the difference between “I am using an offensive practice to showcase my character’s depravity” and “I am going to threaten to rape a heckler because they heckled me” I don’t really know what to tell you.

― shout-out to his family (DJP), Monday, June 29, 2020 11:26 AM (twenty-seven minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

well no you don't know what to tell me because you elided or ignored my point about context and intent. tosh was clearly by intent not 'threatening' anyone, he was standing on stage at a comedy club performing comedy. characterizing what he said that way is more disingenuous than anything i said.

i get that in the mind of ilxors comedy clubs are places where men go to talk about how rape is sweet and lets go do some raping, but in reality they are places where people voluntarily go to hear outrageous things with the intention of being made to laugh. it's actually a very similar context to making a joke on a tv show, only there's not another character to appear on screen and recite morality to the audience - the context is more implied from the act of comeding in the first place.

so yeah, i think defending 30 rock is easy because there is constant woke messaging throughout the show, they literally say 'we are making a joke! blackface is wrong!'... where in the examples i cited they are harder to defend because that context isn't said, only implied. BUT, regardless of the success of each 'joke', it really is the same context, and i think a defense of one warrants a defense of the other.

in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors
in the mind of ilxors

esby: ilxors are woke hive-mind
nearly every ilxor on this thread: actually the blackface in 30 rock is cool
real woke people: tina fey must be killed

The context of the Tosh outburst wasn't "this statement is wrong", it was "stfu and stop interrupting my show", which is why comedians engage hecklers.

Esby is more like, "if you defend 30 rock, you must also defend my right to laugh at blackface, regardless of context."

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/tv/news/peep-show-blackface-netflix-scene-removed-dance-class-a9591021.html

Was joking about this being removed and now it is.
It's a punchline as to how batshit Nancy is as she gets Jez to 'break more and more taboos' and iirc the reveal is he's in blackface going 'Are you sure this isn’t racist?' and she says 'f*** me and pretend I'm your mother'. So obviously meant to be all kinds of wrong.

People's taste for shock humor over the years seems to come in and out like the tide... it's either all the rage or causing it.

really thought the joke was p straightforwardly 'that man meets two corporate diversity check marks and will definitely be the hire' but interesting to hear other perspectives

This is what I and my partner got originally as well - it's not that we missed the lampooning of the old boys' club but it also seemed to be making this joke at the same time. I'm not sure it did critique the idea of the 'advantages' someone gains by 'ticking these boxes', esp since it is implied that Garkel might be faking his disability (whereas the irl response of the old boys' network would probably be closer to "ah, but then we'd have to install push buttons at the doors, which goes far beyond reasonable accommodations; sorry, guess my boy Floyd is the only practical choice" than "no way Floyd can compete with that"). And I'm not sure Tina Fey would have made this joke with a middle-aged white woman as the prop, in a wheelchair or otherwise.

And I mean, Garkel got the job. I don't recall any suggestion that it was because of his qualifications - if anything, the larger joke was that merit doesn't enter into it one way or the other.

https://i.chzbgr.com/original/6991674880/hB5A468F0/fake-criterion-the-rural-juror