Bob Dylan - My Rough and Rowdy Ways /2020) Anticipation and Discussion Thread

Edward Said wrote about late styles too.

The LARB essay: https://lareviewofbooks.org/article/david-lynchs-late-style/

This is for sure a looser, more casual-feeling album than the formidable Tempest (my favorite of his '90s/'00s).

That’s the book I meant Alfred, sorry I should have capitalised Said

"Key West" – WOW(!)

Truman had his White House there!

"She's still cute, and we're still friends"

I guess the chord changes of "Key West" have sort of a "Most of the Time" feel (which is partly why it's so resonant)?

"i've made up my mind to give myself to you" is amazing

― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Friday, June 19, 2020 11:50 AM (five hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

^^^
I'm making dinner and this just sort of kept going and going and I'm like, "are all the songs on this album awesome?" and then I realized it was the same song.

i find the album to be about as good as love and theft

― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Friday, 19 June 2020 16:34 (four hours ago) link

This is blasphemy to me as L&T is maybe a top 5 Dylan album for me, but we'll see.

Not ready to make any major proclamations, but maybe best since L&T? Dunno, I'm really enjoying it so far.

all the albums since love & theft are like love & theft (except the ones that are like stadows) and there is no major difference between them in terms of songwriting

Prefer Modern Times.

all the albums since love & theft are like love & theft (except the ones that are like stadows) and there is no major difference between them in terms of songwriting

Idk, I think there's a pretty noticeable difference at least in the way he writes his lyrics. The verse in l&t tends to have these very long, flexible lines, lots of words somehow fitting into a space that should be too small for them, like that one verse where he fits a whole knock-knock joke into two lines. In Modern Times and Tempest he starts leaning much more heavily on these short, sing-songy verse forms (I'm sure there's a word for them but I don't know it) - "I'm searching for phrases/to sing your praises," that sort of thing.

jeeeeeeeeeez "key west", you killed me

i can't even continue my day after that

Twelve years old, they put me in a suit
Forced me to marry a prostitute
There were gold fringes on her wedding dress
That's my story, but not where it ends
She's still cute, and we're still friends
Down on the bottom, way down in Key West
I play both sides against the middle
Trying to pick up that pirate radio signal

yes sir

i want to ask bob dylan why he's such a goddamned genius and have him chew me out at press conference

PLEASE bob, i will never ask for anything again

honestly, although i listened to a decent amount of bob dylan before his previous albums (by that i mean tempest 2012 and before. i can't stand sinatra), this is the first time that i've been heavily into him at the time of a new release, so of course i have that adrenaline rush of love for his music right now, or just his continued existence. it was post-tempest that i first heard Blood on the Tracks, which is still my go-to, and it was post-tempest that the blonde on blonde-highway 61 stuff finally clicked with me in full (before that, i really only appreciated his Freewheelin' era and style of material). and then of course i've been filling in all the gaps since then. ok, just sharing my bob dylan update, thought there would be a point in there but love the music, great job bob

Greil Marcus's thoughts on the album here:

https://lareviewofbooks.org/article/real-life-rock-top-10-june-2020-part-ii/

Listening through this album very slowly because of a migraine. "I've Made Up My Mind to Give Myself to You" is so amazing I had to stop and call my brother to talk about it.

That Greil Marcus piece is pretty good, though it’s weird that he underrates “I’ve Made Up My Mind...”; a song that everyone here seems to agree is the bomb.

Yeah, that was weird. But he's otm about the line "Do you know who I am?" being the moment where "Murder Most Foul" takes off.

i haven't read that much of greil marcus' writing, but he always frustrates me and interests me in almost equal measure (which is why i keep reading). this criticism is so pedantic, and it's not even clearly right:

The song almost dissolves before it starts with “It was a dark day in Dallas / November ’63 / A day that will live on in infamy” — again, even disregarding the Vincent Price intonation, it’s not real speech. The day entered history, and more importantly common memory, as its own day: people say, people think, “November 22, 1963,” so “November ’63” signifies less than nothing — it’d be like saying “Pearl Bay” instead of Pearl Harbor.

i'd argue the opposite. the kennedy assassination is so iconic that it doesn't even need the day. when someone says "November '63", you STILL know that's the kennedy assassination. it's actually not at all like saying "Pearl Bay" instead of Pearl Harbor. the fact that you just say the month instead of the year just adds to the symbolism and power of it

hearing this is his best album since some girls, but i won't believe it until the lex weighs in

xp I had the same reaction to the “November ‘63” thing; it’s an extended nitpick that doesn’t necessarily feel accurate.

(the same reaction as Karl, to Marcus’s critique of those lines)

And of course, following that, he has a really lovely recounting of “key west”

Yeah, I haven’t read much Marcus either, but he clearly shines when he’s writing about that old music (and drawing out the connections to Dylan).

What I got from that Greil Marcus bit about the opening lines was him trying to dissect why they feel so consciously clunky, and not quite getting it right. But I do think he's right that there's something about those opening lines that feels deliberately off, like Dylan's parodying something, and that "Wait a minute boys, do you know who I am?" is the moment when the story comes into focus.

It was the fearful night of December 8th
He was returning home from the studio late
He had perceptively known that it wouldn't be nice
Because in 1980, he paid the price

a typical Marcus mix of insight and obtuseness

lol at reading "You can bring it to St. Peter, you can bring it Jerome" as referring to Bo Diddley's maracas player instead of St. Jerome

"mother of muses" is so gorgeous and frail

forge my identity from the inside out
you know what i'm talkin' about

living in a nightmare
on ELM street

sorry i just love that

I was just reading the wiki for all along the watchtower and saw this quote from ‘68:
“I haven't fulfilled the balladeers's job. A balladeer can sit down and sing three songs for an hour and a half ... it can all unfold to you.”

I'm looking forward to someone revealing which 19th century Malaysian poet Dylan lifted most of the lyrics of this album from.

this really is lovely

possibly the only acceptable use of 'it is what it is'

also makes me want him to work with the dirty three

i used to joke that don henley is in a studio somewhere endlessly playing 'down at the sunset grill' and radio stations would just tune in and tune out when they wanted to play it

but if bobby were somewhere singing just extending 'murder most foul' forever i'd listen

Every time I listen to this album I have to stop after "I've Made Up My Mind..." and go tell someone how beautiful it is. Eventually I'm going to run out of people to tell.

Tell Greil Marcus!

"false prophet" sounds like a fuckin AC/DC song

"murder most foul" is entrancing, beautiful, strange, and laugh out loud funny at several points

on the whole i really enjoyed the record. much better than i was expecting tbh and i'll definitely be revisiting throughout the summer

This isn't really grabbing me on first listen, though it did inspire me to go back and relisten to Together Through Life for the first time in a long time, and I think I've been underrating that one.

"false prophet" sounds like a fuckin AC/DC song

haaa yes

listened to Murder Most Foul with a friend last night on my first night out in a long time, it is a moment I will remember

did you each take one headphone

grew up with Dylan but have never related to an album of his as much as this one, maybe I'm finally just old but he seems more relatable than ever

so impressed he made this album as a 79-year old

thousands were watching and no one saw a thing

So I'm finding that I have a hard time thinking of "Murder Most Foul" as part of the album. I find myself thinking of "Key West" as the closing track, and then of "Murder Most Foul" as something separate, like a companion album.

It's weird because I love "Murder Most Foul," but I don't want to listen to it after "Key West;" I want to just let "Key West" hang in the air for a while. Anyone else feel this way?