Joni Mitchell: Classic or Dud

Court and Spark boasts more judicious use of her lower register and employs full band arrangements.

Sounds more palatable indeed. Thanks!

have you heard her biggest hit "Help Me"?

people seem to be taking a lot about Don Juan's Reckless Daughter for some reason, must be the music. maybe peep that one

Stop it, Alfred!

I hadn't, no, but it sounds nice so far. I can see myself enjoying the rest of the album.

2xp

pom u gotta hear hissing, but also u gotta get yourself right with blue

I hear you, pom: I have a similar 'Joni tolerance' and I find Blue hard to cope with in places. I absolutely love Hissing of Summer Lawns though, then Court and Spark and Ladies of the Canyon in that order.

I want to say it's an issue with melisma in general but I need to think that through.

I've tried repeatedly so at this point I doubt I ever will, but I'm up for giving The Hissing of Summer Lawns a chance.

xp glad I'm not the only one. I quite like melismatic melodic lines in other contexts, I just don't think Mitchell is a capable or polished enough singer to thoroughly pull it off (on Blue, at least). I also like my would-be confessional solo records starker and less audibly self-satisfied fwiw.

I p much never revisit Blue -- partly because it's tender to the point of discomfort and partly because it was ridiculously overplayed in my college student center coffeeshop, like every damn day for years.

Starbucks sure killed "River" and "Carey" dead.

I quite like melismatic melodic lines in other contexts, I just don't think Mitchell is a capable or polished enough singer to thoroughly pull it off (on Blue, at least).

I love the early folk/singer-songwriter stuff now but I originally avoided her until I heard some of the later jazz fusion-tinged art-pop material. C&S is sort of the transition, imo. I like Hejira so much I once started a thread listing things I like about it. It's a bit more stripped down (xps and maybe starker) but like a washed-out travelogue with Jaco Pastorius on bass, Larry Carlton on electrkc guitar, and her acoustic guitar run through phaser. Shadows and Light is a great overview of that whole period, a live album where she is accompanied by Pastorius, Pat Metheny, Lyle Mays, Michael Brecker, and Don Alias. I never had a problem with her voice, though.

*electric

Not much in the way of melismatic acrobatics on Hejira.

Not at all, I love how coolly hypnotic the vocal melodies are.

holy shit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxMwGTQ1bzU

I've never seen a mediocre performance of "Amelia."

btw it is impossible to kill "carey"

ditto ‘california’

I'm late to the Joni party only having come to appreciate her in the last 10 years, but I can't see ever getting tired of Carey.

all Joni is peerless ffs

Wild Things Run Fast has ugly moments.

I have respect for Pomentiful for listing 新しい日の誕生 in the ambient poll a couple months ago...but just baffled by his suggestion that Joni's voice is not 'capable.'

Her singing on For the Roses is incredible imo

This thread makes a good case for avoiding coffee.

Yeah, don't let Starbucks ruin good music for you.

I Love (a Lot of) Music (But Not All)

You shouldn't even let Starbucks ruin coffee for you.

This thread makes a good case for avoiding coffee.

discogs has the inner sleeve art for Reckless Daughter, which I always thought made it a little more clear exactly who she was trying to piss off, and more importantly who she was inviting in.

― Milton Parker, Monday, June 15, 2020 2:04 AM (eleven hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

I looked at it but didn't know what to make of it, could you explain?

Same

I guess I can understand where people are coming from re: Blue but as for me I credit an real percentage of...like, my better qualities, I think i found "blue" at a time in my life when I might have become several different people, might have followed several different paths. "blue" connected me to the one who was desperately in need of permission to make himself known, to tamp down the less-caring, less-open, less giving ones. I did a lot of other work to bring forward the me I wanted to become, and of course I'm not all the way there yet, but "blue" was a door-opener for me in that sense, and that's before I reckon the music & the poetry & the groove.

I relate to almost everything you wrote, except in my case not connecting with Blue is what made me a better – i.e. less self-centred and histrionic and absolutist – person. (I am trolling a bit here tbh.)

Is there a name to describe the vocal technique where she drops from melodic singing into something more demotic? ("He gave me back my smile / But he kept my camera to sell".) She does it a lot and it's one of my favourite things about her style.

like there are definitely artists I am passionate about, like The Fall or US Maple for instance, where I love them but if someone doesn't get it, I understand

Blue is one of those things where I can't understand not liking it.

You can’t understand finding her voice insufferable on that one? I love poncy classical singing but I totally get why some people are allergic to it. Same with, dunno, Thom Yorke. Overwrought vocal styles are always going to elicit wildly divergent responses.

i don't think Joni's singing is overwrought at all, but there's a lot on Blue in a high register that does rub some (wrong) people the wrong way

tbf i never noticed this until i put something from Blue on the jukebox in my local on a quiet weekday afternoon and it really cuts thru

It’s especially hard to readjust your like or dislike of a given vocal signature aka the most ‘primitive’ musical component there is (I mean, who knows, really, but you get my drift).

I understand that Nazareth fans are disappointed when they hear the original "This Flight Tonight".

(It did surprise me tbh.)

Probably not as disappointed/horrified as Joni fans hearing Dan McCafferty's dulcet throat-scrape for the first time!

Nazerath's cover of Ballad of Hollis Brown is stunning, scarifying bad trip heavy psych what a fuckin band

the braggadocio on Blue, tho

Probably not as disappointed/horrified as Joni fans hearing Dan McCafferty's dulcet throat-scrape for the first time!

Oh, no doubt, and I was joking, but I did know the Nazareth version first from classic rock radio and was surprised when I first heard Blue at 19 or so.

also i think her voice is really foregrounded in the mix of Blue in a way that a lot of pop or mor-adjacent music isn't, might be a factor too. something like "California" has that sparse little intro then BOOM, bird-song

Nazerath's cover of Ballad of Hollis Brown is stunning, scarifying bad trip heavy psych what a fuckin band

Incredible take on Dylan, probably best spoken of elsewhere than a Joni thread though

>I looked at it but didn't know what to make of it, could you explain?

should reread 'Love and Theft' first! but I think those images speak for themselves. I will say I find it very interesting when fans say they never knew it was her, even though it's the inner sleeve shots that really force you to deal. that critic in the Guardian article asking 'One wonders how Joni could be friends with legends like Hancock and Mingus'... that is such a good question one can only wonder why he's saying that as if there could be no answer -- and this trial-by-GIF stuff runs a little too close to the form of questions that aren't actually looking for their very, very complicated answers

I don't know, 1977. think of how many racks full of the Saturday Night Fever soundtrack Prince age 19 probably had to walk by to buy his copy of this album. now that, is fucked up

Warner labelmates, they might've comped him one as a signing bonus?

- "Hey, Charles. Wanted to let you know a friend of mine is stopping by your place around nine, dropping off a notebook with some more lyrics to dig into. He's gonna be wearing a big hiat! Need him to get you any groceries?"

- "Same 'friend' of yours from last time?... Listen, kid, we need to talk about something...."