Regular Degular Redux - 2019-20 NBA Season thread 2

maybe they did some kinda trade

the excess weight for nba euros is actually a constant

thought for sure that was a shop but maybe not?

Nikola Jokic looks like he dropped a ton of weight since the season was suspended. pic.twitter.com/Gx7NizrS2z

— Legion Hoops (@LegionHoops) June 11, 2020

i have an idea for home court in the quarantine nba, let the home team control the stadium audio and pipe in whatever noises they want

we’re this close to someone missing a free throw bc of a loud distracting porno moan

needs to happen

NBA Jam sound drops

Adding to Taylor's report: I'm told today's conf call could involve up to 200 players. Also hearing that Kyrie Irving has been a driving force in organizing these calls, and in raising concerns over NBA's bubble plan. https://t.co/0voQafmveO

— Howard Beck (@HowardBeck) June 12, 2020

started with this tweet:

Yahoo Sources: Significant number of players disappointed their voice wasn’t heard in decision to restart season, and others believe black players sequestered to entertain and ease league’s economic burden amid racial tension is bad optics. https://t.co/F4BiqWD6uQ pic.twitter.com/hhw8rGdLh8

— Chris Haynes (@ChrisBHaynes) June 12, 2020

As @TaylorRooks, @HowardBeck reports, Brooklyn Nets star Kyrie Irving has organized a call tonight for players to discuss what position they should take. He’s of mindset that during racial tension, not returning to play should be considered, sources say. https://t.co/8W8VaZMxQh

— Chris Haynes (@ChrisBHaynes) June 12, 2020

I miss the hoops but support whatever they decide

others believe black players sequestered to entertain and ease league’s economic burden amid racial tension is bad optics.

100%

it isn't wrong.

but what this is showing is how badly the nbapa botched this by already holding a proxy vote that passed, when apparently close to half the league might have voted the other way! i sure would hate to see the owners weaponize this to get monetary concessions for next season beyond the salary everyone would already be losing.

given where we are, it *seems* like using the return as a platform for messaging social change and getting the league to pitch in on that front would be reasonable.

this is a good summary of where we are: https://www.masslive.com/celtics/2020/06/kyrie-irving-is-driving-force-behind-player-call-questioning-whether-nba-should-restart-during-social-unrest-reports.html

It seems like the fairest thing is just to leave it up to each individual player. If only 250 players show up so be it

yeah

amount of peer pressure gonna be wild tho, plus the possible fear of being stained by being the guy on the team that stayed home

if only 250 players show up there's no way to crown a legitimate champion for the season

Kyrie Irving told NBA players on call Friday, sources tell @TheAthleticNBA @Stadium: "I don’t support going into Orlando. I’m not with the systematic racism and the bullshit. Something smells a little fishy."

— Shams Charania (@ShamsCharania) June 13, 2020

i really am sympathetic to player concerns but would feel a lot better if the guy leading this was a) actually capable of playing in the first place and b) not kyrie irving who seems to see a conspiracy in a plan that existed prior to the beginning of the protests

yeah its kinda perfect that its kyrie lol

Kyrie hit the NBA and NBAPA with the late but effective “I just think it’s funny how...” pic.twitter.com/krEi89CD66

— Sean Campbell (@Melanism) June 13, 2020

Kyrie hasn't done himself any favors with his earlier batshittery but again, he's not wrong! But yeah, I really wish it was Lebron or somebody who had something to lose carrying the torch though.

i will never forget when i think lagoon called kyrie something like "an extremely 26 year old guy" or similar

Isn’t Kyrie done for the season anyway?

no kyrie actually is wrong. the orlando plan was developed before the protests started. so to say it's "fishy" is horseshit, this is what the nba was going to do, political unrest or not.

https://twitter.com/BobbyMarks42

sincere question--does anyone know what kyrie has been doing since protests started? has he been involved in anything on the streets?

mean to post

Players have the right to do as they choose. However, the economics on not playing are devastating:

💰$1.2B in lost player salary (35% of total pay)
🏀NBA now having leverage to tear up the CBA and negotiate a new one.
💰$2B lost in revenue to the league

— Bobby Marks (@BobbyMarks42) June 13, 2020

throwing away the cba is not a canny move imo

it would be a disaster

Replacements it is

lol stop it

this would be a great time for adam silver to actually do something other than placating the maximum possible number of people

i will never forget when i think lagoon called kyrie something like "an extremely 26 year old guy" or similar

― Clay, Friday, June 12, 2020 10:29 PM (twelve minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

think i was quoting someone on twitter, was otm tho yes

if only 250 players show up there's no way to crown a legitimate champion for the season

who cares? the season is already fucked up beyond considerations of some ideal "legitimacy" for the championship. the point is hoops or no hoops, not fan service. coercing players into situations that compromise their health, or family life, or consciences is bad. it shouldn't happen just to add 'legitimacy' to the season.

they shd just play pickup fuck it

aimless i agree--if only 250 players want to play they should not restart the season

Stop it...... https://t.co/1pGMxN0ap3

— Donovan Mitchell (@spidadmitchell) June 13, 2020

- According to Haynes, some players believe “it’s bad optics for a league comprised predominantly of black men to be sequestered in one location for up to three months merely to entertain the masses and ease the league’s economic burden.”

this is the interesting quote to me and i wonder how widely held this view is or who makes up the "some" here. it strikes me as a bit cynical to say that the season would restart "merely" to entertain fans and to save the league money, discounting the entire competitive nature of the sport. maybe the players feel emotionally detached from the season and like playing for a championship isn't worth it anymore, and if that's the case then i understand the hesitance to sequester themselves in orlando and miss out on what's going on in the real world. but i guess i felt like an accepted subtext of these restart conversations getting so far down the line was that the players were still invested in playing for a title (the entire point of the sport). if that's not the case then there is a problem bcuz it only becomes about money.

those are good points. i think there's a few things going on.

first, it seems clear now that the initial restart discussions were directed to superstars who have power, status, and something to play for, and they all wanted to play.

second, the rest of the players were going down the path of passively accepting this before the murder of george floyd and subsequent protests.

now, a bunch of the league's middle class (along with a few stars) is questioning the restart which i'm guessing is based on both the political climate and an onset of realization about how severe the bubble environment will be.

for george hill from the bucks, who have a legit chance to win the title, to say that basketball is the last thing on his mind is not great for the restart. this is why the league needs to step in and promise a platform and political involvement. as a balance, the players need to recognize that nuking the current cba will have a decades-long (at best) negative effect on them and their successors.

ultimately i feel like the political activism aspect could get worked out... the players could come up w/ all sorts of proposals, they do have leverage! but they also have to want to play, ultimately

absolutely. their leverage exists right now and they should use it. if this season doesn't happen all the leverage shifts to the owners and that is not good.

i feel like what if during intros before the game the players each get to punch a cop

like how in soccer each player has a child they hold hands with before the game

it strikes me as a bit cynical to say that the season would restart "merely" to entertain fans and to save the league money

But that is exactly what the proposed restart boils down to at the end of the day; a last ditch desperate attempt of the white billionaire owners and the TV network conglomerates funding their league's broadcasting deals to staunch the bleeding of their financial assets and investments in a league that has been forced to shut down entirely due to a global pandemic. Any concern for legitimate "competition" was thrown out the second they decided not all 30 teams were going to be invited to play this season. And none of these owners ever truly cared about that to begin with; every NBA franchises is now valued in the billions and almost all turn enormous profits regardless of their teams competitive win/loss records (hello NY Knicks!).

As far as "activism proposals go"... in a league where 80+% of the payers/workers are black, yet all but one franchise owners of the teams they play for are white, where the league commissioner, the overwhelming number of coaches, assistants, trainers, GMs, and front office executives are also all white... not contributing to putting a dime in the pockets of those executives and owners who have done nothing to combat such a disparity in representation from the top down by not playing in this shoddily drawn up Orlando bubble proposal is one of, if not the strongest message the players can send. And I am 100% in support of any players who have the courage to do so. Nothing is LESS important than sports in terms of the crises facing the US and the world at large at the current moment; the ire being directed towards Kyrie's thoughts and the mere idea of not playing reeks of privilege from people too insulated from and ignorant of those issues to understand that.

white players can choose to hold the cops hand instead of punching them we respect all cultures at the nba

it strikes me as a bit cynical to say that the season would restart "merely" to entertain fans and to save the league money

But that is exactly what the proposed restart boils down to at the end of the day

― Sabre of Paradise (trevor phillips), Friday, June 12, 2020 11:53 PM (seventeen seconds ago) bookmarkflaglink

idk i guess well see if the players want to play, i suspect they do as i said upthread "ballers ball", but it could also be that the other stuff is just too much, the world is kinda falling apart tbf

But that is exactly what the proposed restart boils down to at the end of the day; a last ditch desperate attempt of the white billionaire owners and the TV network conglomerates funding their league's broadcasting deals to staunch the bleeding of their financial assets and investments in a league that has been forced to shut down entirely due to a global pandemic.

this is wrong, as bobby marks has indicated, there are $1.2B in player salaries at stake this year, as well as the dissolution of the CBA and subsequent concessions players would have to make in future years.

Any concern for legitimate "competition" was thrown out the second they decided not all 30 teams were going to be invited to play this season.

most of the commentators i follow would say if anything too many teams have been invited back. like, what legitimacy is lost if no one makes the detroit pistons play any more games?

every NBA franchises is now valued in the billions and almost all turn enormous profits regardless of their teams competitive win/loss records (hello NY Knicks!).

you sure about this?

this shoddily drawn up Orlando bubble proposal

every covd-19 source i trust who has commented has said that the nba's bubble proposal is reasonable
.
the ire being directed towards Kyrie's thoughts and the mere idea of not playing reeks of privilege from people too insulated from and ignorant of those issues to understand that.

can you tell me what kyrie is doing on the ground? because i literally don't know.

the number one myth that needs to be dispelled right now is that the restart only benefits the owners. this is just wrong on its face.

a last ditch desperate attempt of the white billionaire owners and the TV network conglomerates funding their league's broadcasting deals to staunch the bleeding of their financial assets and investments in a league that has been forced to shut down entirely due to a global pandemic

ok but this isn't true, the players have a financial incentive too. there is hundreds of millions of dollars in salary that won't be paid out if the season isn't finished. and then you get into the stuff about the CBA & what could be a labor stoppage ... a worst case scenario of extreme labor strife if the players didn't come back would result in a lot of guys not getting paychecks for a year plus. if the players decided that their activism was more important that would be incredible, but i find it hard to believe that any significant number of players would get behind that beyond the guys so rich that missing out on $15 million doesn't mean anything to them. i think anyone who has been in a union would say that labor actions that extreme take a shit ton of effort, and this is a union of hundreds of members spread all over the country with hundreds of millions of dollars at stake. there is no world where the players don't lose anything by walking away.

the idea of getting creative w/ activism proposals is not some crazy idea, some players are already leaking this as a middle ground

Yahoo sources: Several players are planning to be creative and use the global attention the NBA platform provides to promote and support the Black Lives Matter movement when the league returns to play

— Vincent Goodwill (@VinceGoodwill) June 12, 2020

the players have a lot of leverage right now... they could say, we'll come back but before every game one player will read a televised statement about black lives matter and system racism. they could say, we'll come back but only if the names of george floyd and breonna taylor are visible on every court, and each franchise donates to x y z organizations. i just think there's a way to satisfy both the need to get paid and the desire to be an activist (many ppl in america have been doing this for weeks)... and i think you could argue that it would be more powerful for players to try and leverage that huge TV platform instead of not playing, which essentially does nothing to move us culturally from where we are now (no basketball players on TV)

if they don't want to go sit in a bubble for 3 months that's a problem that has far fewer solutions