have you quit the labour party yet?

not got to much of him yet, but I recall someone mentioning he can tell a good story or two

the man the phrase "tired and emotional" was invented for

i believe to explain why he was spotted literally face down in the gutter

I've just got where he is a rising star under the tutelage of Cripps who he worships a bit, and who is a very interesting commie from back in the day who much preferred eating raw vegetables much more than getting shitfaced and falling asleep in the gutter!

Two more different characters than George Brown and Stafford Cripps it would be difficult to find.

even as a kid i knew it was silly to accept a peerage then call yrself "lord george-brown"

its grim down south

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EZHADphWsAQWBNf?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

lol that's beautiful

this is specifically a london left map

haaaa

Interested in whether you think parliamentary politics in general are a dead end for the left or whether you think it is the rotteness of the labour party specifically.

pretty much yes (former but also the latter). tho I also sort of think "the left" is a dead end in most of its incarnations these days, in this country at least (not that "the right" or "the centre" are remotely preferable ofc)

I was never on the corbyn train but I get the appeal- still he did far too little to challenge the culture of the party (/britain in general- I'm aware this is an impossible demand) & the whole project was doomed from the start by its inability to separate its "social justice" goals from its (accommodation with) nationalism/racism/authoritarianism. I don't know if any social democrats have ever managed to square this circle

well the rioters are clearly the only cool ones here

so are you an-com doomer, leftcom, ???

idk

despite being au fait with jreg i have no idea which one of those i actually am. probably some unholy melange of the central four like the most of the rest of you

And it shows

top row is beautifully cursed. feel like normie momentum dropout-mind samurai-leftcom and everything between is a nice rich zone but irl primmy has its charms too

Missing: 'clueless metic'.

I am def irl primmy now

catch me reading camatte in my yurt

Is that the leader of the opposition sharing articles from the self-confessed antisemite employing Spectator? https://t.co/aPIx4Z5f6n

— Your Mum (@judeinlondon2) May 28, 2020

Starmer, the big fucking heroic-melt who always took such a strident approach to Labour antisemitism, sharing an article by an antisemitic shitrag that runs Wehrmacht apologist pieces by Taki.

Onwards..

while the corbyn project failed to push it through conference Boris Johnson and retirements have effectively instituted a policy of open selection for 40%+ of any future labour government MPs.

— bread and poses (@breadandposes) June 19, 2020

Well put.

Quite often see people on the TL talking about leaving the Labour Party & trying to build something new. A lot of the time they glumly conclude that (under the current electoral system) a splinter party would be doomed to get nowhere. But is that really true? Well, I wonder pic.twitter.com/rOmk9Ic2yj

— Edmund Griffiths (@EdmundGriffiths) June 20, 2020

If he's advocating a UKIP for the left what's the single specific issue it would be based around? There would surely have to be one.

Have been pondering the concept of BLM as an international political party tho

I'd fully support a breakaway party, even if it might attract some cranks and idiots that would need weeding out and might be a shitty experience. The Labour Party is dead & buried, something new is needed and even if it takes decades to even start making a useful impact on two party hegemony, it is better than drinking suicide-lager inside your despair-shed in the garden of absolute hopelessness.

"If he's advocating a UKIP for the left what's the single specific issue it would be based around? There would surely have to be one."

Socialism.

UKIP's never been anything but a joke as a political party, it was a hugely successful pressure group but it will never challenge tory supremacy (nor did it ever want to, really). With its objective acheived it will now gladly fade away.

xpost "socialism" hardly as concrete a demand as "we want Britain to leave the EU".

I was trying to avoid that answer as I don't see it as a single issue!

UKIP approach was 'with this one weird trick (leaving the EU) we can achieve ___'. Everyone (open to it) could understand that as a setting you untick. Socialism is a hundred different settings to recalibrate from tax bands to equal pay to defunding police to enforced quotas...

Workers rights?

Socialism.

Was wondering about that one myself.

Such a confusing word. What kind of socialism?

socialism put through the legitimate concerns mangler, so they are marginally less racist than the Labour Right dominated PLP and have better slogans on their cups: Let's have a membership vote on Controlled Migration, comrade!

if Centre-left Corbynism is getting called hard-left and Marxists by ignorant cunts in the UK then I say go hard-left, because you are going to called every name under the sun anyway.

sorry . shit-typing/shit-posting!

xpost "socialism" hardly as concrete a demand as "we want Britain to leave the EU".

― Daniel_Rf, Saturday, 20 June 2020

The last two lab manifestos were pretty concrete in terms of a set of demands. Obv a UKIP of the left wouldn't be about one issue, as it's about being a pressure group on the Lab party.

Yes but how successful would UKIP have been if it had made its message a set of demands, as opposed to one specific one? Not that I buy the "too many different ideas!" line with regards to the last election, but it's apples and oranges.

I think that if you think a pressure group on Labour could work that means you still think Labour is inherently salvageable. I'm agnostic on this but it doesn't seem to be the consensus here.

I mean, how successful is the UK’s Green Party?

Not very.

UKIP was so "succesful" it didn't know what to do with their potential influence and drowned in their own unexpected sudden found wealth (and dumb assery).

England is still a two-party country. As long as there's no proportional representation electoral system, this will not change. Apart from if Labour is salvageable at all, no third party - like the Greens - will ever have enough leverage to act as a pressure group. Any third party is too insignificant number-wise to make a meaningful dent into anything. Heck, even the rise of a more left, grassrootsy Cromryn pressure group - pressure from within the party - got washed away and Starmerized.

wait, ukip clearly succeeded (or is about to), i mean that's not seriously in question is it?

I think that if you think a pressure group on Labour could work that means you still think Labour is inherently salvageable. I'm agnostic on this but it doesn't seem to be the consensus here.

― Daniel_Rf, Saturday, 20 June 2020 bookmarkflaglink

Just following the logic of that thread. A party running on a left-wing anti racist platform could get 6-8 million votes, not get a seat and depress the Labour vote. Can totally see that scaring the shit out of Labour.

Apart from if Labour is salvageable at all, no third party - like the Greens - will ever have enough leverage to act as a pressure group.

There was a referendum, not that long ago, that could have led to the break up of the United Kingdom, thanks largely to the electoral success of a third political party - a success, which continues to this day.

... in fact, the third party in UK politics.

I’m not sure UKIP is an unqualified success insofar as much if not all of their DNA is already overwhelmingly present within the Tory Party. They just accelerated the inevitable.

Exception to the rule tbf. This is chicken or the egg stuff but UKIP seems more on par w/ how A LOT of Tories think anyway, instead of some third party throwing the wheel into a completely different direction. Tories wanted the referendum, Tories wanted out of the EU, as much as UKIP. UKIP gave Tories an excuse to show their own tough side, you could say.

xp yeah otm, that

The parliamentary Tory Party did not want out of the EU though.

the titular question of thread has been answered quite clearly by Scottish voters in the last decade, yes they have.

Sturgeon was quite openly hostile to Corbyn, any SNP leader has to tread carefully around coalition talk, but she seemed to go a bit further to distance herself from him with personalised comments like " I'm no fan of him but...". I bet she will be a bit more cordial towards Sir Melty-face.

I'm sure she doesn't care much either way, the Labour Party are completely irrelevant in Scotland.

Of course they might not be if there was PR, the saviour of minor parties the world over!