Frank Zappa: Classic or Dud?

I just asked myself the same question tbh. Clearly, I really hate doing taxes.xp

And admittedly Lennon could be p wry so the author there may have misread his tone idk.

I remember being impressed by the sheer volume of Zappa CDs in the racks in the '90s. It seemed to dwarf anything else that made it into your typical chain store in terms of an eccentric voice that bridged pop and art music. I had the impression that whole worlds were contained in all of those double- and triple-CDs, and the impression is fed by the cut-and-paste assembly of some of the Mothers albums. There was so much stuff in Uncle Meat! The fact that most of the music was instrumental did make me take seriously the claim (Zappa's, yes?) that the lyrics were a secondary concern.

I think there may be an argument for Zappa's use of vibrato on "Oh No" as a distancing effect—proclaiming "I can't be-lieeeeve in this quasi-operatic voice. Yes, Zappa was arrogant, but the music's utopianism lies in its tolerance for that arrogance, which is one of its elements rather than the whole of what it is. The tune sounds so wide-eyed, curious and aspirational! As well as vaguely orientalist (thus "naïve"). Maybe Zappa the guy with words can't just let it be that (although he does on Lumpy Gravy).

As much as anything else it was partly Zappa the guy with words that kept me from exploring those worlds on the post-1970 albums, and I'm not necessarily interested in the instrumental ones either—I do like some tunes—but I think these jarring contrasts, the sense that you were just getting these glimpses of worlds, was what made Zappa compelling. Maybe the twenty-first century doesn't have any need for those glimpses, jaundiced by Zappa's smut; maybe it needs real worlds, or failing that other ways of seeing and hearing.

Fwiw, at least one book cites Lennon as saying of "All You Need Is Love" as well as some of his solo songs: "I'm a revolutionary artist. My art is dedicated to change." And Harrison's "Within You Without You" contains the line "With our love, we could change the world if they only knew". These were p grandiose statements (and I like the songs!) and fair game to be poked at imo.

I heard it was you
Talkin' 'bout a world
Where all is free
It just couldn't be
And only a fool would say that
The man in the street
Draggin' his feet
Don't want to hear the bad news
Imagine your face
There is his place
Standing inside his brown shoes
You do his nine to five
Drag yourself home half alive
And there on the screen
A man with a dream

i think there's a difference between lennon's sentiments on "all you need is love" and harrison's on "within you and without you" and i think they do both fall short in different ways.

lennon's faith in the power of love is unfalsifiable to the point of ridiculousness. "there's nothing you can do that can't be done" - this is sheer glurge. and while paul's "hey jude" may have a more interminable coda, "all you need is love" was there first.

"within you without you", otoh, is a frankly paranoid song, openly asking "are you one of them?"

i think both these forms of "love" are quite open to critical interrogation. zappa never provided an alternative to these flawed conceptions of "love", rejected the concept of love altogether, which imo rather diminishes the lasting value of his work, but it seems a fair enough criticism to me.

The age-old conundrum of how can one be positive without being a naive sucker or a hypocrite, often simply solved by resorting to cynical snark.

I think the misanthropic angle is a tad overplayed, and that FZ was just interested in exploring topics other than personal relationships, for which he deserves credit, not scorn. I certainly don't defend everything the man wrote but I'd much rather hear a song about spaceships landing in the Andes or turkey farmers in Lancaster or huskies pissing in snow than another goddamn song about someone's sweet darling baby doll and how much they're gonna wuv them fowever

inca roads is arguably not even the best prog-rock song about spaceships landing in the andes ("tenemos roads" is a strong competitor)

I think the misanthropic angle is a tad overplayed

careful paul, if you keep sniffing your own farts all day you're going to wake up with a bad goatee and a hard drive full of erotic ayn rand fanfic

I'd much rather hear a song about spaceships landing in the Andes or turkey farmers in Lancaster or huskies pissing in snow than another goddamn song about someone's sweet darling baby doll and how much they're gonna wuv them fowever

You want to hear a song about huskies pissing in the snow? Seriously?

I don't need this in my life, but maybe you need it in yours:

Zappa Records/UMe issue The Mothers 1970, a four-CD Frank Zappa box set which features 70 unreleased tracks from the 1970 line-up of the Mothers of Invention.

…Like previous Zappa archive projects such as last year’s 50th anniversary edition of Hot Rats, this one has been produced by Ahmet Zappa and “Vaultmeister” Joe Travers to provide a look at a heralded period of creativity. The short-lived Mothers of Invention iteration heard on these discs featured Aynsley Dunbar (drums), George Duke (piano/keys/trombone), Ian Underwood (organ/ keys/guitar), Jeff Simmons (bass/vocals) and Flo and Eddie a.k.a. Howard Kaylan (vocals) and Mark Volman (vocals/percussion) of The Turtles.

In their brief time together, the group not only recorded the successful Chunga’s Revenge, but also toured across North America and Europe. (The next version of the group, with FZ, Flo and Eddie, Underwood, and Dunbar joined by The Turtles’ Jim Pons, can be heard on two acclaimed live albums, Fillmore East 1971 and Just Another Band from L.A. Bob Harris handled keyboards on the former and Don Preston, a guest on Fillmore, on the latter.) This lineup of The Mothers injected a heavily comedic, often off-color element to Zappa’s oeuvre while still retaining the impeccable musicality for which the maverick composer was known.

With over four hours of unreleased material, including sessions from London’s Trident Studios, recently unearthed songs, alternate takes of fan favorites, plus live recordings from The Netherlands, California, Spokane and beyond, this box will be a definitive look at the acclaimed Mothers of 1970 in the studio and onstage.

For the studio material, Travers and Zappa have included early versions and alternate mixes from the Trident sessions, including Roy Thomas Baker’s rough mix of “Sharleena,” “Wonderful Wino,” and newly unearthed versions of “Red Tubular Lighter,” “Giraffe,” and “Envelopes.” The producers have also dug into the vault to find original tapes of the widely circulated VRPO radio session, plus concert recordings from Santa Monica and Spokane which have been presented together to form one hybrid concert. The set also includes a disc of live recordings and candid moments from the 1970 U.S. Tour as captured by Frank Zappa on his trusted UHER recorder.

All tracks were sourced from the Zappa Vault and transferred and compiled by Travers this year. Longtime Zappa Trust member Craig Parker Adams mixed some tracks, while John Polito handled mastering.

Disc 1 – Trident Studios, London, England June 21-22, 1970
1. Red Tubular Lighter
2. Lola Steponsky
3. Trident Chatter
4. Sharleena (Roy Thomas Baker Mix)
5. Item 1
6. Wonderful Wino (FZ Vocal)
7. “Enormous Cadenza”
8. Envelopes
9. Red Tubular Lighter (Unedited Master)
10. Wonderful Wino (Basic Tracks, Alt. Take)
11. Giraffe – Take 4
12. Wonderful Wino (FZ Vocal, Alt. Solo)

Disc 2 – Live Highlights Part 1 – “Piknik” VPRO June 18, 1970 / Pepperland September 26, 1970
1. Introducing…The Mothers (Live on “Piknik” June 18, 1970)
2. Wonderful Wino (Live on “Piknik” June 18, 1970)
3. Concentration Moon (Live on “Piknik” June 18, 1970)
4. Mom & Dad (Live on “Piknik” June 18, 1970)
5. The Air (Live on “Piknik” June 18, 1970)
6. Dog Breath (Live on “Piknik” June 18, 1970)
7. Mother People (Live on “Piknik” June 18, 1970)
8. You Didn’t Try To Call Me (Live on “Piknik” June 18, 1970)
9. Agon (Live on “Piknik” June 18, 1970)
10. Call Any Vegetable (Live on “Piknik” June 18, 1970)
11. King Kong Pt. I (Live on “Piknik” June 18, 1970)
12. Igor’s Boogie (Live on “Piknik” June 18, 1970)
13. King Kong Pt. II (Live on “Piknik” June 18, 1970)
14. What Kind Of Girl Do You Think We Are? (Live at Pepperland September 26, 1970)
15. Bwana Dik (Live at Pepperland September 26, 1970)
16. Daddy, Daddy, Daddy (Live at Pepperland September 26, 1970)
17. Do You Like My New Car? (Live at Pepperland September 26, 1970)
18. Happy Together (Live at Pepperland September 26, 1970)

Disc 3 – Live Highlights Part 2 – Hybrid Concert: Santa Monica August 21, 1970 / Spokane September 17, 1970
1. “Welcome To El Monte Legion Stadium!” (Live)
2. Agon (Live)
3. Call Any Vegetable (Live)
4. Pound For A Brown (Live)
5. Sleeping In A Jar (Live)
6. Sharleena (Live)
7. The Air (Live)
8. Dog Breath (Live)
9. Mother People (Live)
10. You Didn’t Try To Call Me (Live)
11. King Kong Pt. I (Live)
12. Igor’s Boogie (Live)
13. King Kong Pt. II (Live)
14. “Eat It Yourself…” (Live)
15. Trouble Every Day (Live)
16. “A Series Of Musical Episodes” (Live)
17. Road Ladies (Live)
18. “The Holiday Inn Motel Chain” (Live)
19. What Will This Morning Bring Me This Evening? (Live)
20. What Kind Of Girl Do You Think We Are? (Live)

Disc 4 – Live Highlights Part 3 – FZ Tour Tape Recordings
1. “What’s The Deal, Dick?”
2. Another M.O.I. Anti-Smut Loyalty Oath (Live)
3. Paladin Routine #1 (Live)
4. Portuguese Fenders (Live)
5. The Sanzini Brothers (Live)
6. Guitar Build ’70 (Live)
7. Would You Go All The Way? (Live)
8. Easy Meat (Live)
9. “Who Did It?”
10. Turn It Down! (Live)
11. A Chance Encounter In Cincinnati
12. Pound For A Brown (Live)
13. Sleeping In A Jar (Live)
14. Beloit Sword Trick (Live)
15. Kong Solos Pt. I (Live)
16. Igor’s Boogie (Live)
17. Kong Solos Pt. II (Live)
18. Gris Gris (Live)
19. Paladin Routine #2 (Live)
20. King Kong – Outro (Live)

rejected the concept of love altogether

I don't agree that he was doing this in "Oh No" btw, which seems more like rejecting simplistic interpretations of love, nor that his life demonstrated this.

like King Crimson there seems to be an infinite number of recordings of this guy

My least favorite period of his work, so I'll give it a cursory streaming listen but nothing more than that.

Yeah, not particularly keen to explore this but, still, surprised to see Uncle Meat material show up in the live sets.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EbYLmBHXYAAnZmM?format=jpg

I know I'm in the minority but this might be my fave Zappa era, this is the last time it feels like a "band" and not Zappa with various players and I think Flo & Eddie are funny, which obv ymmv

However, do I really need another record when there are already 4 lps from the era, plus the 3 disc Carnegie Hall live box and I'm sure more I'm not thinking of? I mean...no, but I'll listen to it for sure

I like a lot of the Flo and Eddie stuff, but this seems like scraps from all already well mined era. I doubt that there's a tin of stuff left in the vault that's really new or essential. It's been picked over very thoroughly for the last 30+ years.

"Red Tubular Lighter" is so great

I'm listening to a vinyl copy of We're Only In It For the Money...I've actually never heard the original version before, I had the 90's Ryko CD. I never knew the 'censored version' meant they just clipped entire sections out. I thought the record skipped a few times but apparently that's how it actually is. I almost understand FZ's desire to re-record this now, it sounds kinda bad. whoever remastered this in the 90s did a really good job.

This guy did an outstanding job of restoring an 'uncensored version' using the best available materials. The bulk of it came from MFSL's reissue - it wasn't an ideal reissue as it uses the exact same digital master created for Rykodisc's '90s CD, but that was still a rock solid transfer of the original analog master tape and MFSL's mastering is a slight improvement that doesn't do anything wrong.

Magnolia Presents: ZAPPA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4F0rT0F6OQ

Directed by Alex Winter
Produced by Alex Winter, Glen Zipper, Ahmet Zappa, John Frizzell, Devorah DeVries, and Jade Allen
Executive Producers Robert Halmi and Jim Reeve of Great Point Media

With unfettered access to the Zappa family trust and all archival footage, ZAPPA explores the private life behind the mammoth musical career that never shied away from the political turbulence of its time. Alex Winter’s assembly features appearances by Frank’s widow Gail Zappa and several of Frank’s musical collaborators including Mike Keneally, Ian Underwood, Steve Vai, Pamela Des Barres, Bunk Gardner, David Harrington, Scott Thunes, Ruth Underwood, Ray White and others.

129 Minutes

Magnolia Pictures will release ZAPPA everywhere November 27th, 2020
Special one-night-only theatrical event on Monday, November 23rd, 2020

Sorry everyone, I'm gonna go see this

I kinda want to see this too. Alex Winter is a pretty good director. just worried it's gonna be too rapturous about him as I'd imagine the Zappa family trust wants it to be

Wondering if Dweezil had any input on this or if he's just out in the cold completely.

Dweezil & Moon I don't think were involved at all, Moon didn't have anything positive to say about Winter: "He wouldn’t have been my first choice. He might not have been my 100th choice.”

But I am pretty curious to see it

I'm curious about it too. If it's like $5 on Amazon Prime, or if it pops up on Netflix or Hulu, I'll probably watch.

I'd rather see a good Zappa doc than listen to anything by Zappa, tbh. He's an interesting, important figure, second almost to the Dead in how the *idea* of the music is in some ways ultimately more important than the music itself.

Thought this might be a biopic for a mad second, no such luck

Same, Josh! I'd absolutely see a biopic about one-of-my least-favourite musicians, for real

I did listen to Uncle Meat on a whim last night and... I still do love it

I listened to Apostrophe recently, which I used to love, and found it mostly grating and tiring to be honest.

Not too many artists I'll say this about, but Zappa was waaaay too sober.

i hate judging a doc by its trailer but that whole bit at the end with zappa running for prez....

dude was politically abhorrent

Zappa was waaaay too sober.

― octobeard, Wednesday, October 28, 2020 5:32 PM (four minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

yeah but hot rats sounds amazing stoned

this is well worth watching

https://m.imdb.com/title/tt5645352/

dude was politically abhorrent

Eh, would take him over a lot of Presidents.

......... fair

Looking forward to this. It was supposed to premiere at SxSW this year -- I wonder if Winter has done any late tweezing to it in the last six months.

I mean, he was pro-decriminalization, anti-censorship, anti-nuke, anti-military interventionism, anti-apartheid, pro-civil rights. Was v wrong about abolishing income tax, though.xp

So there have been many archival releases in the last 20 years that I've barely delved into. Any thoughts on which are the best ones?

Wazoo (a live album by one of his jazziest bands) was good. There's some worthwhile stuff on the big Hot Rats box, too.

Road Tapes Venue #2, Greasy Love Songs, Wazoo, Roxy Performances

Whatever your favorite era/band, there will be some road tapes; Wazoo, the Hot Rats Sessions, the Roxy Performances top my list.

Some of those archival releases also feature the original LP mixes of certain records that Zappa remixed for their original CD issues, such as Freak Out, Ruben & the Jets and Uncle Meat.

Who else but a genius of Frank’s Zappitude would concoct a modern day cowboy song about a dental floss ranch?

I just saw that the new FZ documentary will be available as one of WFMU's on-demand films starting the 27th.

Zappa's nephew, Stanley, is a jazz saxophonist. I reviewed one of his albums for Stereogum, and he follows me on Twitter.

The Alex Winter doc is really good filmmaking, y'all. It's not a complete hagiography -- Zappa's singleminded focus coming through as callous assholism is remarked on several times. Gail's unhappiness with FZ groupie indulgence is made plain, though not by Gail. Winter highlights the pathos of "Valley Girl"'s origin. He leaves out FZ's wide ranging xenophobia except for a throwaway comment by Kenneally. But he (Winter) gets Conceptual Continuity as Zappa presented it and assembles the film in the same way, with images and music cues from all eras peppered throughout, especially in the first and last 30 minutes. Really well edited, and it admirably doesn't rely too hard on talking head interviews, which makes them more effective when they are used. Ruth Underwood and Steve Vai are especially good.

Don't watch if you have any antipathy to FZ at all, but worth renting otherwise.

I dunno if I'm just dense, however, it is *fucking* me off that I can't seem to be able to rent this from the UK.