Can't help but be wary of exofiction as a subgenre.
― pomenitul, Tuesday, 19 May 2020 20:16 (three years ago) link
Wait, it doesn't seem to be called that in English. What's the equivalent?
― pomenitul, Tuesday, 19 May 2020 20:17 (three years ago) link
"Before the novel gets to its fork in history, there is a lot of self-consciously steamy sex."
― TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 19 May 2020 20:21 (three years ago) link
xp: I'd go with "terrible bullshit"
― (so serious) (DJP), Tuesday, 19 May 2020 20:22 (three years ago) link
I owned republicanerotica.com for a year and could never bring myself to do things like write about Ted Cruz plunging inside Ann Coulter. Apparently this author has a stronger stomach than I do.
― Greta Van Show Feets BB (milo z), Tuesday, 19 May 2020 20:22 (three years ago) link
dude
ur welcome
― Greta Van Show Feets BB (milo z), Tuesday, 19 May 2020 20:23 (three years ago) link
I'm just imagining the papercuts
― (so serious) (DJP), Tuesday, 19 May 2020 20:25 (three years ago) link
His fingers played across her back like the palest xylophone
― Greta Van Show Feets BB (milo z), Tuesday, 19 May 2020 20:26 (three years ago) link
Pomenitul: allohistory?
― no new snail to snell (Ye Mad Puffin), Tuesday, 19 May 2020 20:52 (three years ago) link
That ones comes close. In French, the term 'exofiction' (fictionalized biography) is an explicit callback to 'autofiction' (fictionalized autobiography), which doesn't have an exact English equivalent either.
― pomenitul, Tuesday, 19 May 2020 20:55 (three years ago) link
Oh, we just say "historical fiction" for things that could have happened, but are not being presented as documented fact. Or things that are "based on a true story" but feature invented dialogue and may not have unfolded in exactly the way depicted in the text.
Alternate or alternative history is a different genre - what if Lee had attacked here instead of there, what if FDR had stayed neutral, what if Oswald had come down with a cold, what if Wellington had eaten bad oysters, what if Trump had been smothered in infancy by a deranged babysitter.... (oh wait, that last was pure fantasy)
― no new snail to snell (Ye Mad Puffin), Tuesday, 19 May 2020 21:02 (three years ago) link
Exofiction is specifically biographical, which is why I think it applies to the novel under discussion, but it doesn't necessarily play with alternative histories. Perhaps 'counterfactual exofiction' would be a more precise designation.
― pomenitul, Tuesday, 19 May 2020 21:12 (three years ago) link
the term is "real person slash"
― like, I’m eating an elephant head (katherine), Tuesday, 19 May 2020 22:18 (three years ago) link
(or I guess just RPF in the case of the book
― like, I’m eating an elephant head (katherine), Tuesday, 19 May 2020 22:19 (three years ago) link
Thanks, we're getting closer. It seems more disparaging and 'lowbrow' than what exofiction typically covers in French, though. Like, I wouldn't think of describing Jean Echenoz's Ravel as real person slash.
― pomenitul, Tuesday, 19 May 2020 22:23 (three years ago) link
Curtis Sittenfeld is quite a good writer. I'd quite like to read this. Hillary looks very nice on the cover.
― the pinefox, Thursday, 21 May 2020 09:09 (three years ago) link
plunge into the pages, pinefox
― (so serious) (DJP), Thursday, 21 May 2020 11:04 (three years ago) link
i haven't read sittenfeld but this novel and the one about laura bush seem weird
― treeship., Thursday, 21 May 2020 11:30 (three years ago) link
i'm skeptical but maybe great literature can come from this premise, who knows. hillary is an interesting kind of figure
― treeship., Thursday, 21 May 2020 11:33 (three years ago) link
Looking FWD to pinefox's report already.
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 21 May 2020 11:55 (three years ago) link
I finished the Netflix documentary the other night. I had a habit of watching it late at night, so I'd drift and rewind a lot...As befits the subject, not sure what I thought. The saddest part was post-healthcare, where she looked lost. Watching election night 2016 still feels stunning.
― clemenza, Thursday, 21 May 2020 12:15 (three years ago) link
It's fan fiction, surely. Incredibly ill advised, unaccountably published fan fiction about a real person.
― Tsar Bombadil (James Morrison), Saturday, 23 May 2020 13:02 (three years ago) link
should this book have been called “Nuvvieworld” y/n
― trapped out the barndo (crüt), Saturday, 23 May 2020 13:08 (three years ago) link
the problem isn't fan fiction, it's very bad fan fiction
― mark s, Saturday, 23 May 2020 13:52 (three years ago) link
Has anyone read the novel?
It's written by a writer who has written numerous quite successful novels and is often said to be quite good.
So until I read it I'll assume that it might be, in some ways, quite good.
And on a subject that I find interesting. (I started this thread in 2001 after all.)
― the pinefox, Saturday, 23 May 2020 14:06 (three years ago) link
I think people here are judging the excerpts, which are not quite good
― What fash heil is this? (wins), Saturday, 23 May 2020 14:30 (three years ago) link
plunge into the entire book wins
― mark s, Saturday, 23 May 2020 14:33 (three years ago) link
Wow, imagine looking at the life of Hillary Clinton and thinking "if only she were free of Bill she could really have made something of herself"
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Saturday, 23 May 2020 15:56 (three years ago) link
I think that. not necessarily something good, but perhaps less terrible to some extent
― no (Left), Saturday, 23 May 2020 16:06 (three years ago) link
But I don't think she'd have had a path to president.
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Saturday, 23 May 2020 16:17 (three years ago) link
She would have been a Mayor of Chicago covering up police black sites.
― Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Saturday, 23 May 2020 16:19 (three years ago) link
too believable
― no (Left), Saturday, 23 May 2020 16:45 (three years ago) link
She does have a lot of ambition. But I think "poor battered woman who made the mistake of hitching her wagon to that loser" is a very bizarre projection onto a person who very deliberately hitched her wagon to someone who was the definition of a winner and benefited greatly from it.
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Saturday, 23 May 2020 16:48 (three years ago) link
She’d be President now if she had divorced Bill after winning her Senate seat.
― santa clause four (suzy), Saturday, 23 May 2020 17:21 (three years ago) link
"winning" her senate seat
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Saturday, 23 May 2020 17:32 (three years ago) link
what did she lose the popular vote
― j., Saturday, 23 May 2020 18:19 (three years ago) link
she moved to a state that hasn't had a republican senator since the 1970s for the sole purpose of running for a senate seat where the primary was cleared for her in advance
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Saturday, 23 May 2020 18:22 (three years ago) link
actually sorry that's not true, I forgot about D'Amato
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Saturday, 23 May 2020 18:28 (three years ago) link
I like Sittenfeld’s short stories - they’re unambtious, sort of Tom Perotta, Cat Person-type stories, but usually funny and absorbing. I don’t think she’s written a single novel I’d want to pick up though - I think the last one was a modernised Pride & Prejudice.
― Chuck_Tatum, Saturday, 23 May 2020 19:09 (three years ago) link
No thanks, I have to inject some bleach at that time. pic.twitter.com/yTMsb6sER5— Doug Henwood (@DougHenwood) July 21, 2020
― brooklyn suicide cult (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 21 July 2020 20:29 (three years ago) link
great revive
― Give me a Chad Smith-type feel (map), Tuesday, 21 July 2020 20:33 (three years ago) link
when you’ve lost Doug Henwood...
― JoeStork, Tuesday, 21 July 2020 20:35 (three years ago) link
i just love how simpatico L-MM is with her in perpetrating a con, and making me equally thirst for hemlock
― brooklyn suicide cult (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 21 July 2020 20:46 (three years ago) link
:/
MLK Jr. said: “I had hoped that the white moderate would understand that law and order exist for the purpose of establishing justice, and that when they fail in this purpose they become the dangerously structured dams that block the flow of social progress." This is a subtweet.— Hillary Clinton (@HillaryClinton) January 14, 2022
― towards fungal computer (harbl), Friday, 14 January 2022 17:38 (two years ago) link
She literally wrote her thesis on how being the white moderate was the better way
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Friday, 14 January 2022 17:53 (two years ago) link
who was she subtweeting?
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Friday, 14 January 2022 17:58 (two years ago) link
Sinema
― Chappies banging dustbin lids together (President Keyes), Friday, 14 January 2022 18:09 (two years ago) link
Somehow when MLK spoke of breaking down the dams of law and order I don't think he was referring to changing senate procedure so an infrastructure bill can pass.
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Friday, 14 January 2022 18:17 (two years ago) link
I respect that she’s still doing this even though the response ranges from “oh, she’s still alive?!” to “fuck off and die.”
At least she’s not doing promoted tweets for hot sauce.
― papal hotwife (milo z), Friday, 14 January 2022 18:18 (two years ago) link