Rolling US Economy Into The Shitbin Thread

otherwise

my friend works at Ruth's Chris

do you mind if we hit my fifth third bank atm on the way

lol

fifth third bank - it's your first choice for seventh-day adventist church members.

on may 9th.

11th!!!

lol fifth third bank is the sponsor of a surprising number of midwest league ballparks

I've been to at least two

the thing is, with the PPP loans and the EIDL loans, they are intended to keep workers paid, which is why they come with terms for forgiveness if a business does keep the workers paid. However, the interest rate on the loans without the forgiveness is still pretty low compared to other forms of debt, thus, I can see (unfortunately, in a "this is why we can't have nice things" kinda way) cold-hearted corporate assholes just saying, "fuck paying the workers, we'll use the loan money as we see fit and pay the low interest rates" ...

We need a federal paycheck guarantee pronto, call your congressperson and voice your support for Pramila Jayapal’s proposal

what proposal is this?

https://www.vox.com/2020/4/10/21215611/pramila-jayapal-paycheck-guarantee-act-denmark

so basically this is the same thing as the PPP program, but going through the US Treasury as opposed to the SBA and banks. ... but without any provisions for self-employed people.

on a nuts-and-bolts level, I feel like this should be a supplement to the PPP, which needs way more funding -- because there are already tons of businesses that have already applied to it, whose applications are just in limbo, pending more funding. That program actually has provisions/ procedures for self-employed people (and partners in partnerships) to get paid. But this would be super helpful to businesses that haven't begun that application process, and/or don't have relationships with banks and "fintech" companies.

and calling it a grant is off to me -- I would think it would be closer to an advance payment of a tax credit, (if it's not going to be a forgivable loan) whereby those businesses that take the money and don't rehire workers or pay workers, have to pay it back.

the thing is, with the PPP loans and the EIDL loans, they are intended to keep workers paid, which is why they come with terms for forgiveness if a business does keep the workers paid. However, the interest rate on the loans without the forgiveness is still pretty low compared to other forms of debt, thus, I can see (unfortunately, in a "this is why we can't have nice things" kinda way) cold-hearted corporate assholes just saying, "fuck paying the workers, we'll use the loan money as we see fit and pay the low interest rates" ...

― sarahell, Sunday, April 19, 2020 11:51 AM (four hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

to some extent feature not a bug

imagine a business that has 0 income now, they can’t even keep workers on for the 25% or whatever numbers these policies use; keeping them afloat with cheap loans at least makes it possible the business survives to rehire

This is the first time I am hearing of Fifth Third Bank: Lol.

they say a good compromise is one in which neither side is happy

Wait “fifth third” isn’t a typo? What does it mean? Is it like a weird Masonic thing? Or Adventist or something?

"The name "Fifth Third" is derived from the names of the bank's two predecessor companies, Third National Bank and Fifth National Bank, which merged in 1909.

it should be third fifth! no it should be fifth third! no!

Three Fifths Bank is what I keep thinking of

in the end, i'm sure it just came down to simple math

a fifth instance of a third would be 5/3, the third fifth would only be 3/5.

5/3 > 3/5, AND F becomes before T, alphabetically. BOOM, negotiation won

fifth turd

-2 Chainz

had the same thought as silby, 3/5 bank sounds like some weird redlining neo-confederate entrprise

can i get paid by jayapal on paypal?

So the investment advisor at our company is recommending the company invest in mortgage-backed securities. I don't know shit about investing, but it seems insane to me to invest in them right now given the amount of people out of work and who will be defaulting on their mortgages in the coming months/years.

The name "Fifth Third" is derived from the names of the bank's two predecessor companies, Third National Bank and Fifth National Bank, which merged in 1909.

Should've just compromised and gone with Fourth National Bank...

to some extent feature not a bug

imagine a business that has 0 income now, they can’t even keep workers on for the 25% or whatever numbers these policies use; keeping them afloat with cheap loans at least makes it possible the business survives to rehire

― flopson, Sunday, April 19, 2020 1:12 PM (yesterday)

that is what the EIDL loans were designed for, actually. The PPP loans were a bit different. One of the problems (in defense of the poor steakhouse chain) is that the government announced there would be a separate program for "mid-size to larger employers" but that was still "in the works." Basically, there needs to be more money supplied to these programs by the government.

rolling italian economy into the shitbin

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/04/italy-workers-recession-coronavirus.html

am i reading this correctly? the U.S. benchmark for oil (West Texas Intermediate) is at $1.28 (!!) right now

https://markets.businessinsider.com/commodities/oil-price?type=wti

https://i.imgur.com/oYeCFeU.png

gonna get some for my house

a barrel of oil costs less than...pretty much anything you can buy

WTI has actually gone negative:

BREAKING: WTI crude oil futures trade at negative price for first time https://t.co/pOSyH6AVtP pic.twitter.com/XsoH1jG8WH

— Bloomberg (@business) April 20, 2020

So that's what mass margin calls on the commodity markets can look like.

all i know is i got gas for like $2.50/gallon last week and I think the last time it was that cheap was like almost 20 years ago?

$1.15 at the local Costco. Shame I've only maybe used a gallon in the past month.

probably need a pt 2 of this thread? when do we start sequels? 10k?

the WTI is currently -$18.65

hahaha everything is just bonkers this year

Basically, there needs to be more money supplied to these programs by the government.

This. The pandemic shutdown is exactly the kind of economic conflagration that calls for Bernanke's notorious 'dropping tubs of money from helicopters' kind of response.

I am very annoyed that the product I was using to short oil got liquidated at the beginning of April and I never bothered to find a replacement.

i wonder how kiev is doing.

does this mean that saudi arabia owes the rest of the world some money now?

I think it means that many owners of futures contracts for the delivery of oil at a given price were leveraged to the hilt with cheap debt and are now so desperate to dump those contracts they will pay you to take them off their hands. But, that is just a guess, because this is one of the weirder things I've ever seen a market do.

i haven't looked to see exactly what happened today but it's money/limited space to store oil and if there is no demand and countries keep pumping...

matt levine's explanation is pretty accesible (and sound afaict):

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2020-04-20/there-s-nowhere-to-put-the-oil

what if they leave it in the ground

costs too much to cap a well! not worth the bother! (this is why i live in one of the most expensive residential cities in america, and there's an active oil field 1/2 a mile away)

i would like michael bloomberg to buy all the oil while it's essentially free, and then not use it

i don't ask for much

excited for the entire middle of the country to become west virginia btw

in what sense? abruptly drained bereft of economic activity?

probably being hyperbpolic there. to the extent that happens, it's going to happen in very underpopulated/temporarily populated areas and fracking will be profitable again soon. but if this weird financial artificat propagates into real prices (which it will do to some extent) then this is going to be a pretty big economic shock to some very badly run state and local governments. state services in west texas are fucked, for example.