do you clap for carers?

"there's a reason Cameron made a big deal about real-terms spending increases in the NHS from the get-go"

I've heard "real-terms" used by some of the worst, bad to the bone tory liars so many times in recent years.. it's just a stand-in for "fake numbers pulled out of my arse" in my mind.

the "social media policing" element of it I can see creeping in already. I posted that Donald Macaskill interview from The Guardian last week where he basically scolded people for putting DNR notices on older people without informed consent, and said how uneasy this all makes me - key workers are still people, still fallible with bias and prejudice, and I wouldn't want to give trust in such major decisions quite so easily*. The comments I was getting were an absolute pile-on. It seems you can't be critical of the NHS and its weaknesses even if it's coming from a place of knowing that we should expect and demand better.

(*what calzino said in the other thread about doctors dealing with children with autism etc struck a nerve with me, I've seen and met so many arsehole doctors who think a job and some money puts them on a pedestal)

i do not clap for carers

I'm sorry that this is freaking you out Branwell, that sounds miserable. It's sounds like you're on a far more extreme media blackout than anyone here expected, but I'm not sure it's entirely fair for you to expect onimo to pick that up from your first post.

I do. Helps that I know we don't live in a Tory area, far from it.

I first heard about it while Skyping a mate living in Catalonia just before the UK lockdown. They have tighter lockdown measures and clap at 8pm every night.
Then at 9pm they bang pots and pans in protest (this is a protest tradition going back a long time for Catalunyans). I'm all for adopting this, so long as it doesn't bother people too much with noise.

Yes you could say there's a cynical streak running through it, and it's easy to see it as an empty gesture. But why should Boris and co be allowed to co-opt and ruin a show of solidarity? Fuck them. It's not for them.

As well as being a mark of solidarity towards key-workers, it invokes a sense of community spirit during times when people might be feeling very isolated. It's good to be reminded that other people are there, that we're all doing our best to survive together.
The clap is especially for key workers, NHS workers, shop workers, delivery drivers, midwives, and anyone else risking their own lives to help others.

But it's also a clap for community - for parents trying to home-school their kids while working their day job from their bedrooms; for elderly and vulnerable people who are cut off from the rest of society and fearing for their lives; for everyone doing their bit to help out, even if that simply means staying indoors and observing quarantine rules.

as boxedjoy says, I know of very few people working for the NHS who don't appreciate it.

FULL STEAM AHEAD: London's Woolwich Ferry performed donuts on the River Thames in support of health care workers on the front line of the COVID-19 pandemic. https://t.co/htOkkfBOgJ pic.twitter.com/2PtH5JVzr6

— ABC News (@ABC) April 17, 2020

I'm sure that NHS workers would really appreciate a ferry going down in the Thames right now.

xp to myself, but fuck anyone who voted Tory and is clapping, that goes without saying

No. It sends the dog crazy so I spend 8.00-8.15 trying to calm him down

But why should Boris and co be allowed to co-opt and ruin a show of solidarity? Fuck them. It's not for them.

#ClapForBoris

that's some bullshit 'my cool boss has a mohawk' stuff though. of course they're going to co-opt it. why should they ruin it? i didn't hear a single person clap for Boris, and I live in a pretty built-up area, but as I say it's a Labour / Green stronghold here

xp to myself, but fuck anyone who voted Tory and is clapping, that goes without saying

The suspicion is that the most enthusiastic clappers are people who voted Tory. Salving their consciences at 8pm every Thursday and getting to be all British and Keep Calm And Carry On at the same time. "I'm doing my bit to support the NHS and key workers, what are you doing?" "Er, not voting Tory for a start."

I'll tell you what has got me really angry - Tom Moore doing his laps raising £1m. Why is this being presented as a feel-good story and not a disgraceful indictment of the nick of this country?

Tom D - but i don't know where that assumption comes from. who knows who's clapping. it's fireworks and drums a go-go in our area, and very few are voting Tory. YMMV of course

boxedjoy otm - that story is so fucked

Maybe we can get the next infected nurse that pulls through to swim the channel an all

definitely seems to be big in suburban tory england. noted left twitter scold keir starmer was complaining abt clapping as an empty gesture

this is happening every night at 7 in brooklyn. i do not participate and my cat is too fixated on impending dinner to care

Why is this being presented as a feel-good story and not a disgraceful indictment of the nick of this country?

Because the country is irreversibly fucked and the sooner Scotland gets the fuck out of it the better?

Every night definitely feels like overkill for pretty much anything of this nature but maybe I’m a grumpy bastard. I just had a “virtual coffee break” with my team at work and it was nice to see everyone and check in with how we were all doing, but at the end of the 45 minute call they started talking about making it a regular thing - “we could do it once a week” “yeah, or maybe more often than that” - and I’m like uhhhhhhh

oh god, we have way too many of these things, including a 4pm 'virtual pub session' on Fridays, which means that I start drinking way earlier than I normally would on a weekend and am sloshed in my house by 10pm

with workmates? bad enough having to go to the actual pub w them

it's quite terrible. not improved by a lousy broadband connection which makes everyone look and sound like Max Headroom

I've been saying that if you wanted to make some cynical money, you should sell "I clapped" badges - people want to make a difference of course and to stand with others, but they are also aware that a fair health system is not what they have, and (whether they voted for it or not) they on some level want to nudge karma in case they need it.

you could argue that it's in the nature of big empty gestures to be co-opted by anybody cynical/blinkered/gormless enough.

is the feeling that people are clapping for the system rather than for the people slogging it out within that system?

it's an amorphous mob, the feeling is it can be used as a symbol by whoever wants to

I’m surprised people are saying this is a conservative thing. I have been doing it; it seems like a way to show support for nurses, doctors, paramedics and other people working in hospitals.

Sorry trees, but you're in way over your head in this current conversation.

Conservative... notice the big C?

Also there is good New York solidarity to it. A woman in my building is some kind of burlesque performer and at 7 she goes on the fire escape and sings New York, New York and it’s a whole thing. The city often feels cold and alienating so this is nice.

All the nhs people I know seem to take the position “the time to support us was December 12, fuckos”

I guess in the UK there is a different subtext to this?

you can scroll up a little if you're interested in learning more...

(xp) To say the least.

Not at first though, I thought? Now yes

All the nhs people I know seem to take the position “the time to support us was December 12, fuckos”

― Microbes oft teem (wins),Friday, 17 April 2020 12:56 (eight minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

This is kind of me

Particularly irked by people attempting to get my colleagues killed by assembling on Westminster Bridge in a fucking throng though

definitely seems to be big in suburban tory england. noted left twitter scold keir starmer was complaining abt clapping as an empty gesture

He was also out there on his doorstep clapping. As were many of the people who have actually had the power to ensure the health service was properly resourced over the last decade and did nothing, for whom it really is an empty gesture at best and actively concealing their own culpability at worst.

sure, clapping is clapping, the other stuff is what counts

Gosh that was uplifting 👏

— Kate Andrews (@KateAndrs) March 26, 2020

Lock thread.

In fairness, a full hour of clapping shows her dedication!

tbf she's now a respectable writer for a right-wing nazi apologist shit-rag rather than the face of a right-wing think-tank that is out to destroy what is left of the NHS! She's got fucking nerve though.. kudos tbf!

Coldplay turning up to Glastonbury doesn't make Glastonbury inherently bad... or something.. I dunno. Clap if you want

all those years the BBC was inviting Kate onto every panel nearly every fucking week, knowing her whole shtick was to undermine and discredit the concept of the NHS. I blame them more than her.

wow just like cis-het men to police how kate andrews feels

I'm playing for applause!

Can we deport her back to America when all this is over?

as long we deport all the news/politics dept of the bbc with her. i'm sure Fox Networks could use them.

We can deport her to the Gaelic Alliance when that takes off, she can snipe at the NHS from the comfy environs of Wrexham

That lady has so much power. Maybe she could do something about poppy shaming.

There are isolated areas of Vancouver where it still happens every night at 7. Just a smattering but still there.

https://i.imgur.com/xOBtZyp.jpg

Fucking hell how long was he clapping for?

that's outstanding

if the neighbour also had the clap that would have been a tabloid headline writers dream

How the fuck is that guy 34?! It's almost as if they're making it up.

Maybe the neighbour is a Hero.

blap for heroes

you need more than lip service to dodge the clap