2020 Democratic presidential primary thread, pt 3: life is very long

the party that's moving left nominated what many of you believe is a right-wing rapist? how do you reconcile those two positions?

xps

lol finish the article, alfred

― k3vin k., Wednesday, April 8, 2020

I did. I posted the relevant points.

The people are moving left, but The Party Decides

this is otm too:

Like a lot of things, the truth here probably lies somewhere in between these two arguments. Sanders and Warren struggled in 2020 because of big, structural factors outside of their control, but also because of a few major missteps along the way. Anyway, does it really matter if Sanders’s likely loss was 20 percent, 50 percent or 80 percent his fault?

Yes, actually. There is already a discussion underway about what the party’s left wing should do in the future. One view, which fits with the general argument that left-wing Democrats faced structural challenges in 2020, is that time is on the side of the progressives. Younger Democrats tend to support more liberal candidates, so the party could gradually move left as the millennial and Gen Z generations become larger shares of the electorate.

are all tv chefs totally obnoxious twats?

"Time" isn't on the side of anyone, unless corona lockdown lasts for 15 years and miraculously heals the environment.

re. the chef link, ew.

enought ilx for me. good knowing you all.

Maybe hatred for trump will deliver this election to Feely Joe, I suppose we should hope so, because it won’t be campaigning, policy, personal popularity, turnout, ground organizing, or electoral college math that does it

Might also be Trump getting covid and dying, tbf.

We should be so lucky

Hatred for Trump depends entirely on5 the economy and death toll

so uh fingers crossed for Great Depression II: Electric Boogaloo I guess
too bad Joe's gonna be Hoover rather than FDR

the party that's moving left nominated what many of you believe is a right-wing rapist? how do you reconcile those two positions?

xps

― Οὖτις, Wednesday, April 8, 2020 12:21 PM (thirty seconds ago)

are you responding to me or the amalgam of all the bernie voters you've argued with on the internet? I am my own person with my own POV. I agree with you that biden is essentially an amoral weathervane, one who for obvious reasons is not the person for this moment but is better than the alternative.

you have to be nice to me or i wont vote for democrats https://t.co/VA6F3w57oP

— Garbage Ape 🗑 🦧 (@GarbageApe) April 8, 2020

still find the argument that Biden has no beliefs/ideology ridiculous, he's taken a lead on every shitty idea that he hasn't been made to answer for. He's committed to the neoliberal project/austerity/centrism/whatever you want to call it as much as anyone on Earth. He has been consistent about this for five decades, there's no flip flopping in his past.

i've said it before and i'll say it again: weighing in on the credibility of people's sexual assault survival stories should be a bannable offense

― here 1st (roxymuzak), 8. april 2020 18:08 (twenty-six minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

What the fuck do you call this:

'violently angry at being asked to vote for the lesser of two rapists

― here 1st (roxymuzak), 8. april 2020 17:45 (forty-nine minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

Ban yourself, please.

are you serious?

He's being an ally

Fred B serious question not trying to troll: can your own family even stand you?

at the end of the day I feel like Biden winning has less to do with policy and more to do with the fact that people just really, really want politics out of their lives, they will take a boring and crappy administration if it means having to not think about this for another 4 years

I got baaaaf news for them

d*

baaaaf

Sanders and Warren did not focus enough on convincing voters that they were as electable as Biden, even as polls showed Democratic voters were obsessed with picking a candidate who could beat Trump.

didn't those same shows also show sanders and warren resoundingly winning over donald trump in head to head matchups, ahead of even biden at some points?

I did. I posted the relevant points.

― TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, April 8, 2020 12:22 PM (seven minutes ago)

homie the whole point of that article is that those bullet points are reductive and only tell part of the story. fortifying those talking points instead of exploring their nuances is something that party apparatchiks (a term you introduced this board to) do to stifle discussion. when you and I posted on these politics threads a decade ago you were someone who was much more comfortable with heterodoxy

apparently the Family Feud voters don't read polls! they just stick their thumb in their ass and guess.

go to choir, fred

fred how on earth is that post helpful

Fred loves hleping

didn't those same shows also show sanders and warren resoundingly winning over donald trump in head to head matchups, ahead of even biden at some points?

― let me be your friend on the other end! (Karl Malone), Wednesday, April 8, 2020

as k3vin pointed out upthread, the article's complicated, and in the end it was many things coalescing.

homie the whole point of that article is that those bullet points are reductive and only tell part of the story. fortifying those talking points instead of exploring their nuances is something that party apparatchiks (a term you introduced this board to) do to stifle discussion. when you and I posted on these politics threads a decade ago you were someone who was much more comfortable with heterodoxy

― k3vin k., Wednesday, April 8, 2020

You may be right, dude. Let's say political events particularly dangerous to my ethnic and sexual background has forced me to be starker about choices. Few people have; in some of your posts, I'd suggest you have too. So I apologize for concentrating on excerpted points.

Few people haven't become starker, I should've said.

part of the disappointment with biden is that if the establishment/DNC types were going to go with a nominee, they could have picked any number of people who would have better (much better, in some cases)

ranked:

harris
booker
klob (uuuugh)
gillibrand
biden
pete

Let me also say that I'm comfortable in this present crisis saving the heterodoxy for art, history, and choice of amaros. I'm at war with the GOP.

Karl, the DNC picked Biden?

nah, they’re donors did

their

star chamber iirc

I'm at war with the GOP.

If only Joe was!

Gonna get Corn Pop, the ghost of Strom Thurmond and McConnell in a room and we're gonna hash out some good deals.

Lol

Thank you @BernieSanders, for fighting so relentlessly for America’s working families during this campaign. Your fight for progressive ideas moved the conversation and charted a path for candidates and activists that will change the course of our country and party.

— Elizabeth Warren (@ewarren) April 8, 2020

The ratio is...not good enough so far

imagine thinking that Fox keeps gop voters in lockstep, but an endless parade of ppl on “liberal” cable news telling primary boomer voters that Bernie is the worst person alive beside drumph has zero effect

I guess she finished recovering from wrapping up the campaign/SNL appearances/etc.?

Karl, the DNC picked Biden?

no. that's why i said "the establishment/DNC types". this is the part where you point out that people of color chose biden, and overwhelmingly rejected warren and sanders. that's part of the reason (a good reason!) why the establishment was nervous about sanders and warren and threw their support behind those they thought were more "electable", like joe fucking biden. this is the part where i point out that i didn't include warren or sanders in my list above - i just included more centrist/establishment/"DNC types" candidates that would have been better than joe fucking biden

all y'all clowning on the warren tweet are clowns

🤡🤡🤡

one of his top surrogates, Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, conceded in February that a Medicare buy-in might be all that could get passed in Congress, at least in the short term

wait, what? Did AOC go squishy on M4A? iirc not being full-throated on M4A was what sank Warren's candidacy, or so I've been reliably informed.

Does that mean AOC is now going to be canceled for this craven "concession" to centrist realpolitik?

Sanders and Warren did not focus enough on convincing voters that they were as electable as Biden

How could they have done this "convincing" except by asserting this contention? Which iirc they did. People weren't convinced, as the record shows.

the only thing to do is fearlessly advocate for what you think is right and try to convince as many people of your side as possible. that is what bernie did and with good results, just not as good as we would have hoped.

who the fuck knows what is "electable" if biden is. or trump!

the only thing to do is fearlessly advocate for what you think is right and try to convince as many people of your side as possible. that is what bernie did and with good results less numerical/electoral success than in 2016

Sanders (and others) advocated for positions that have become increasingly popular/tenable within the Democratic party. Good for him, and good for the people who might eventually one day benefit slightly from a sold-out, watered-down version of those positions. I look forward to his continuing to do that for the rest of his life. Or he could retire and go do Good Deeds, like Jimmy Carter.

@realDonaldTrump
Nobody wants to say that if Elizabeth Warren gets out of the race before Super Tuesday, Crazy Bernie Sanders wins virtually every state in a blowout...NOT EVEN CLOSE! I haven’t heard one member of the Fake News Establishment even mention this irrefutable fact. FAKE NEWS!

hmm, has anyone touched on this topic upthread?